Player Perspective - The Spy Who Dreamed Me
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.ค. 2024
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Storyteller for this game: Viva La Sam
Extension Cord Character Sheet: botc-scripts.azurewebsites.ne...
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Find out more at bloodontheclocktower.com/
Intro visuals created by Jon from Luke & Dad Productions / @vfx_jon
Intro music - Private Reflection by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0
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Night Phase music - Time Passes by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0
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Other music by Karl Casey @WhiteBatAudio
CHAPTERS
0:00:00 - Intro & Night 1
0:03:23 - Day 1
0:21:54 - Night 2
0:23:57 - Day 2
0:37:00 - Night 3
0:39:17 - Day 3
0:55:42 - Night 4
0:59:15 - Day 4
1:13:38 - Night 5
1:14:38 - Day 5
1:21:22 - Night 6
1:21:35 - Day 6 - เกม
Spy is truly the best role for Ben
He gets to be the storyteller without being the storyteller
Ben was put on a really rough spot with that barber swap tbh.
Although the puzzlemaster getting an evil with an incorrect guess was kinda oof as well
If you add that the st decided to execute duke at night when the executions are done in daytime the night that Ben had to kill malashan without letting him kill the cannibal dreamer. I don’t wanna defend beńs cause because is good to loose too but I think that it was imposible to win this game with the cards that Ben had to play with
I love the look of the evil-colour artist token, actually.
Painting with blood...
I randomly thought, hmm maybe BOTC has uploaded a new vid. and there is it
Same 😂
Thank you for turning Duke down. I was literally turning down my volume when you opened the settings and turned him down 🤣😂🤣
Role concept: “Mutant: you are muted”
Obviously hindsight, etc, but it feels like on days 5/6 it would have been worth a try to sell the world where Mullibock was a starting No Dashi. That would explain drunk monk and drunk empath up until the puzzle swap as well as "wrong" info on cannibal and genuinely wrong info on puzzlemaster. That seems like the best possible scenario for creating ambiguity between Ben, Bort, and Christine. Of course, people might wonder where the marionette is in this scenario, but sometimes the script's "intention" is a red herring. 🤷♀
I think showing Christine to the puzzlemaster was a storyteller mistake. There would have been a lot more possible worlds if they had told Bort Malashaan instead.
Ben claimed to have dreamed Malashaan as Poisoner, although that was after I outed by info so maybe Ben could have pivoted. Also, I used my guess shortly after Malashaan became sober, so Sam likely thought that Malashaan was next on the kill list after Jess. I agree that Malashaan was likely the best option on the board, but it still would have looked like a head-scratching world.
It's a very tough decision with little time to make it, especially since the Barber swap had only just happened.
@@bort9922 Indeed. These are games where there are multiple worldviews being tossed around by different sections of town, and they're constantly changing, and it can sometimes be very difficult to know how any individual player, or the town collectively, will respond to any given piece of information. From my perspective, there were worldviews being tossed around that Christine was the Demon, and I think it did about as well as it could to at least distract away from Ben for a bit.
But yeah, there may or may not have been a better decision, but it certainly wasn't a Storyteller mistake.
@@bort9922 Excellent point Bort! That makes sense. I can definitely imagine this was a tough one to call in a couple of seconds.
I feel like one thing that wasn't explored here is what if the Barber didn't cause a swap. The demon could have turned it down as a bluff. Might have opened up some more worlds.
Malashaan's suddenly good info + the obviously poisoned Jess dying immediately after the Barber swap was too strong to ignore.
It's kinda frustrating: Watching this I'm pretty certain I would have been fooled by the Evil team. I still can't understand how it became Ben over Bort.
Can't wait to watch this!
Correct me if I’m wrong but this was an imposible game to win for Ben because of the ST (bad and not legal decisions) and other players behavior.
1.- Reznora killing the barber and swapping with Ben after he decided to plant the doubt on two dreamers and double claimed with the best player on the game (congratulations Mullibok, I think you played the game perfectly) was the worst decision. I think this was a lost game from day 3 just with this decision.
2.- If you add that the ST decided to tell Bort a evil player as the false demon when evil team wasn’t winning either at that moment is a little bit unfair. It needs to be said that it being unfair doesn’t make the decision ilegal.
3.- What I really think is an ilegal decision (and was fliping amazed that nobody said anything about it) is killing the mutant at night when the character description says “may be executed”. If I’m not wrong the executions only take place on daytime ending the day without the possibility to execute another player by the town. This means that the ST decided to execute a player that Ben wasn’t gonna kill that night (I think Ben would have killed Malashan) and gave the good team this HUGE advantage not letting the demon kill anybody that night and letting the town execute another player who wasn’t the mutant. At this point it was difficult to win but after the mutant “night execution” it was IMPOSIBLE to win.
Gotta say that is good to lose sometimes and you gotta have good attitude, I aplaude Ben for his attitude because oh boy, if that happened to me I would have just left so fucking upset. Congratulations to the good team (specially to Mullibok and Duke) and thanks for keeping us entertained while we learn more and more about this fantastic game.
Just to add a little perspective to this, or at least my perspective as a player in the game.
1. This turned out to be a bad call, but at the time it made a lot of sense. Reznora was already being cornered into worlds where they were a demon, whereas I was being accused of being the Boomdandy, making me a perfect vessel for the Demonhood, as they were never gonna execute me. At the time, it made a lot of sense.
2. I actually don't remember this one.
3. You absolutely can execute people who breaks madness at any point during the day or night. It's just that you rarely see it when experienced players do it because they're often very deliberate about how and when they do, so it often ends up being very obvious and during the day phase.
- Ben
if there was one play I would change it's the barber swap.
probably just denying the swap in general or shifting it to my marionette. tough game for evil in general because of the N1 dreamer snipe tho.
One thing I noticed and haven’t been able to explain is how mullibok got boomdandy for Ben when he wasn’t poisoned
Ben registered as the good role in the dreamer info because he was the spy
Spy can register as any good role, so if he gets shown as a good role then the storyteller can pick any evil role to oppose the good role. Effectively both spys and recluses can be shown as any 2 opposing roles to the dreamer
Ben as the spy would've registered as a good townsfolk role for the dreaming, at which point the remainder of the dream can be any sort of evil.
@@ladygeneveve3805 that makes sense, thank you
A+ madness break from Duke.
oh god, imagine malakai, malaki, malashaan AND mullibok in the same game XD that would be chaos
I think this may have been a different game if Ben had not contradicted Mullibok on day 5. It’s harder to sell false info than good info, and I think people got a bad social read off of that.
However, an outed double-claim dreamer living to the last night is suspicious in all worlds, so perhaps it wouldn’t have changed anything.
close game, rough one for evil. Mullibok is too good
Just from reading the title, I knew exactly which game this is and just..... little spoiler
About
This
Game
In
3
2
1
Go easy on me alrite xD
Nah, I think you played pretty logically given your info, there's nothing to be ashamed of. Mullibok was saying Ben had to be Boomdandy, which you knew was impossible - extrapolating that that meant Ben was the good one between the two is a fair leap, imo
Ben just played you. You did fine ❤
You were great and my favourite player for this game honestly. Your world made sense, sometimes one just gets played by good players and circumstance
Character idea: Lighthouse Keeper (Townsfolk)
1 good player (not yourself) starts knowing your role. If you’re poisoned, 1 evil player starts knowing your role instead.
Jinx - If you are made drunk by the Puzzlemaster, 1 evil player starts knowing your role.
On Night 1, the ST will choose a good player (or an evil player, if you’re poisoned) and tell them that you’re the Lighthouse Keeper. The “1 evil player starts knowing your role instead” bit only happens with poisoning. If you’re drunk on Night 1, no one will be told about your role (except in the case of Puzzlemaster-induced drunkenness).
Seems interesting, but I don't really enjoy the idea of an ability that is conditioned on your own poisoning - since, by the books, poisoning, just like drunkenness, means your ability doesn't work. It feels like an unnecessary functional divide between the two conditions for the sake of one character. Something about droisoned neighbors, like the acrobat, would probably be less clashy.
Effectively though you're relying on night one poison for the gimmick, so it would probably only really function in a heavy poison script - I can probably see it work better as a OPG ability, maybe something along the lines of:
"Once per game, choose a player; you learn their role. If they are poisoned/pd, you learn a different role"
This creates some ambiguity to whether or not you, the person you picked, or anyone is in fact poisoned, though I still dislike the drunk/poison divide this creates
@@captain_kadaver Thanks for the thoughtful feedback!
The poison condition is simply there to nerf the Lighthouse Keeper’s ability; it’s not intended as a main feature. The real usefulness comes from the fact that, assuming you’re sober and healthy, you’ll have one Good player who knows you’re legit. And if someone tells you they saw you as the LK due to your ability, unless there’s a Spy or a Widow in the script, you can probably trust them as well. That’s really powerful. The poison condition prevents that from being a sure thing: the Good player who saw you will know you’re on their team, but you won’t necessarily be able to reciprocate that trust.
Also, barring edge cases, there’s no good reason for a Good player who saw you to not come out with that info at some point. So if no one tells you they saw you, you can be pretty sure your ability didn’t work, and that could be disastrous in a Lleech or No Dashii game. The poison condition prevents this by allowing an Evil player to say they saw you as the LK.
@@ryoryo9936 I just feel like no ability should include the clause "if you are poisoned, x happens instead" because as stated, this breaks a foundation of a game, being that droisoned character abilities malfunction - which brings some hilarious caveats (see the poisoned poppygrower dying) but in general prevents roles that aren't info roles from having an effect on the game. A Lighthouse Keeper might provide info, but they do so via their acting ability, which would be intercepted by droisoning.
If the confirmation is your core idea, I'd suggest maybe ignoring droison changes altogether;
"Two players start knowing who you are, one of which is good, and one of which is evil"
This could of course create a sort-of evil twin situation, with both players trying to convince the LK, but leaves the room open for scheming possibilities; confirming the LK basically also sends a target on your back, since you are in what basically amounts to a reverse noble ping.
There is already the night watchman, though. I don't think this is distinct enough, and its ability doesn't quite fit the theme of how poisoning works.
Specifically being drunk/poisoned means your ability should have no effect on the board state or other players, and this would be an exception to that
Shade should have fought harder with that Ravenkeeper role :/
Pretty rough game but well played. Some very interesting plays. Cross speak in this one was a little unbearable for me though. I know it's difficult to gauge online sometimes but experienced veterans of this caliber shouldn't be speaking over each other to this degree.
New Role: The Doctor. Each night you name a player other than yourself. If they are poisoned or drunk you remove that status and the player will get correct info that night. Neither the doctor or the other player get to know if it worked or not. The Drunk is immune and will stay drunk. If it's a permanent poisoning or drunkedness they return to that state at the start of the next night. Once someone has been picked, you are not allowed to pick them again.
I like this role idea, though I say let the drunk be sober for a day. If you can only choose a player once per game, what harm does it do? Great idea for a role.
@@mrgrym Honestly though what happens if the drunk isn't drunk? They only *believe* they are a different role, so you can't let them use that ability correctly right? I think drunk exception for doctor makes sense mechanically. But maybe instead reword another part: "If you pick the same player you healed the previous night the ability may fail" this way they can play the risk against the storyteller's best instinct
@@emdivine That's fair, I just like the idea of a Drunk getting sober info for a day just to cause chaos. I see it as a kind of way to benefit evil in the same way the red herring does. . I like your rewording though. Giving it a might work the following night is helpful for the ST.
I feel like this big block of text can be summarized a lot into
Doctor: Each night, pick a player, they cannot be drunk until dusk.
And then jinx it with the drunk.
Or even "their ability cannot malfunction" to already include the drunk, because a drunk getting incorrect info is their outsider role working correctly
@@haichie1341 But my suggestion was for both drunk and poisioning. So no, it couldn't be summarized that way. Especially since you ommitted that they aren't allowed to pick the same player again. To prevent permacuring someone.
They also go after everyone that can poision or make someone drunk in the turnorder, which mean they temporarily cure people, not prevent things.
I ommitted the drunk, because they are so drunk they have forgotten their role and can't therefore be cured. So if the doctor chooses the drunk nothing happens. It doesn't even cure a poisoned drunk.
I have a question for tryhards. If you are playing to win, why not in the first round, right before everyone splits up into groups, good players would just hard claim their roles? Wouldn't that be the best strategy for winning? Like yeah, the demon gets his bluffs, but over the course of the game it would be easier to catch him on his lies when he has to wing it from the first second of the game and without talking to his minions. Also you can catch minions without their bluffs too.
Well, in this game, utter pointless. The 2 minions start with with bluffs (Spy know what is afe, Marionette has one) and the demon then knows who to kill first
without knowing a spy is in play, players have plenty of reason to lie or keep quiet about their own role to throw off the evil team. as evil, figuring out who to kill or poison and when is very important for keeping good information to a minimum and good players will try to hide their importance to counter this
and as said, if a spy is in play then this won't catch them or the demon who has bluffs out anyway
@@Moleoflands Right in the spy game demons knows who to kill first because people will tell him not because of the spy.
And if you actually read my comment the point was not to catch them on the round one, but make it harder for demon to lie since he has to wing it from the start and it would be easier to find contradiction later in the game when you get more info.
Off topic: But is Christines avatar a sex doll in a chair? Or is it CGI? Couldn't figure it out throughout the video.
It's CGI. I think a sex doll in a chair would require a lot of hardware to rig it to move around like that, haha. - Ben
Second.
The dude playing a cannibal looks like he could be a real life cannibal.