Same thing happened back in the early 90s on a test run over Gresford Bank. I was a member of the support crew at the time. We took the rod off and knocked the bearing out to use a spacer. Put the rod in the rear of the support coach, and ran from Shrewsbury to Crew on one cylinder. The big end bearing when to the SVR was re metalled , machined overnight, refitted the following morning. Running the Britannia phoenix later in the day without a hitch. Happy memories
I saw Cromwell at Lostock Hall on 11th August 1968. The inference then was that it just happened to be the lucky last Britannia in service. This was just the same scenario as most of the other preserved ex BR locomotives. There was no difference between Britannia and all the other 54 Britannia in BR days. Good maintenance and attention to detail keeps the problems to a minimum.
Yes, a big shame especially since it had only recently been repaired from its previous failure last year, it is being rescued on Monday and taken back to Crewe for repair, thanks for the comment!
@@TRAlNVlDEOS Something must have failed that should have been replaced during the repairs. It is very easy to miss items that look good on the outside, but hot steam pressure will find the smallest of defects.
Call it a 47 if you like. As far as I'm concerned it's a Brush Type 4, one of the first classes where the BR design panel was involved which is why it looks so good. Unfortunately they then went all corporate, sloshed blue and yellow paint everywhere and all but ruined its looks, along with so much else on BR.
Just look at and listen to that Spoon! They were the Big Brushes that Swept Clean! They had their problems but, even after de-rating, they still ruled the rails for many, many years.
TBH, they were BETTER after de-rating. But those fire trap bogies and an engine that would throw a fit if you even LOOKED at the engine settings.... Yeah. It was usually very good, but when a Brush was bad, it was horrible!😅
I don't know how many classes used the idea, but Bullied pacifics used to have garlic capsules in the middle big-end bearing, later changed for aniseed, which would pop and get whiffy if everything was too hot. If it was a hot bearing on Britannia, how did they become aware?
@@nounoufriend1442 That's the signature sound of "Riddles' Rubbish" lol. I once said that to Charlie Pyne when 75027 had it's first outing on the Bluebell. Little did I or anyone else know at the time that he was the anonymous donor - no wonder he looked crestfallen. Sorry Charlie :-(
Shame about Britannia but you can always rely on Class 47 Brush 4 to get out of jail. It's the best diesel the British rail system ever had ! Thanks for including the alternative 47805 serial number
Britannia's preservation history shows why Cromwell was chosen over her for the national collection. But, for the train itself, isn't a Brush 4 impressive 'historic traction'.
I recall 70000 being rejected as a result of severe front end damage,later fixed by the SVR. 70013 was automatically pencilled in for the National Collection as it was the last steam locomotive overhauled at Crewe Works.
@alantunbridge8919 exactly. Just worked on, and in best condition. But don't forget britannia's boiler and other problems in preservation. That said total kudos for every person and organisation caring for 70000 over the years. But, at the end of the day, being the FIRST BR standard was surely a stronger reason for preservation than being the last loco repaired at Crewe. Preserve the last loco repaired at Derby, Swindon, Gorton, even Melton Constable works etc etc etc???
@@alantunbridge8919 I always was told 70013 was picked over 70000 because the latter being being the prototype had several differences to the standard class 7 that followed, and 70013 was not only a totally standard class 7, she was also the last of her class in service.
Curious that Oliver Cromwell has gone down in British history as one of the most hated Rulers of all time (a title that he probably doesn't deserve), and yet of all of the Britannias that could have been chosen, this one, with that name, was picked to be the last Pacific ever to be overhauled by British Railways. Just saying.
@@user-cw9qn1nb2n A title I think he did deserve. A title I don't think he deserves is the father of the democratic parliment, after all, when parliament went against him, he dissolved parliament and ruled as a dictator, who wanted his else surviving son to succeed him as Dictator of Commonwealth of Great Britain. The Democratic parliment we know today wasn't formulated until the 19th century. When you look at what he did to the Irish, and to the Catholics (and anyone else who refused the puritanical method of religion), you could be forgiven for feeling he was a bloodthirsty butcher. Probably named because the committee who named the loco only understood the watered down fictional history from schoolbooks, after all, my generation was always taught that Cromwell got rid of a tyrant king, and introduced democracy to the UK, which is actually all rubbish. His disagreed with the King, and who was far from reliable or working for the interests of his people, but Cromwell was only interested in what he could gain, and not interested in the greater good, and cared little for democracy when it went against his wishes.
I agree with you except a lot of these wouldn’t have been possible with a tripod and it is annoying to carry around to be honest, thanks for the comment! 👍
At least it's mechanical - not electronic - so it shouldn't be too difficult to repair! That's the great thing about mechanical machines, whether it's a steam engine or a Stirling engine. As long as you have a few screwdrivers and spanners (wrenches) then you're in business as far as repairs go!
The Britannia-crew should have adjusted the lights on the frontside before steaming back into the station. Now she steamed back with red lights on the frontside!
True but it was on a mainline and it would have needed it get out of the way as quickly as possible because they can be fined a lot for stopping on it (I have heard £150 per minute quoted by people before), thanks for the comment! 👍
It didn't break down anywhere as such. It was stopped because the problem with the bearing that they had identified, meant that if allowed to continue, it almost certainly would have done somewhere (probably very inconvenient, and causing delays to following services)) on the return trip........
@@21C192 Yes we know, this was noted in replies some days ago. You have to be quick with responces on this channel, photons replicate faster than the speed of light.😁
even more so after Bill Harvey adjusted the valve timing to get more power out of them. Several were worked up to Doncaster for attention, who replaced the way the wheels were fixed to the axles with that of a LNER pattern.
@@jameswright3798 Yes, I didn’t include it in this video much because I thought it was getting a bit long so I added it to my previous video just incase you wanted to see more of it 👍
Yes, these old bearings need oil refills every trip.. Many a steamer has failed due to overheating.. Wonder if the same happened when all rail travel was by steam..?
I'm assuming that was part of the job of the fire raiser. Getting a steamer started takes several hours, much of it waiting for the fire to really get going, so this would be a logical time for minor service. As slowly as possible is the answer in terms of stress on the metal; If you have 24 hours to raise a fire, great; eight will do; shorter than that might be rather stressful as I understand. One relatively harmless way of shortening the startup time is to charge the boiler with pre-heated water. The North Shore Scenic Railroad, a preserved railway covering the roughly 25 miles from Duluth to Two Harbors, Minnesota in the US, has the benefit of a city council-run steam plant right next to the Duluth train station -- the early 1930s plant which was recently converted from coal to biomass and from open-ended steam heat to hot water on a closed recirculating loop provides hot water and heat to around 160 buildings around the city centre ranging from city hall and county hall to hospitals and high-rise offices, and also the NSSR's steam engines.
Same thing happened back in the early 90s on a test run over Gresford Bank. I was a member of the support crew at the time. We took the rod off and knocked the bearing out to use a spacer. Put the rod in the rear of the support coach, and ran from Shrewsbury to Crew on one cylinder. The big end bearing when to the SVR was re metalled , machined overnight, refitted the following morning. Running the Britannia phoenix later in the day without a hitch. Happy memories
I saw Cromwell at Lostock Hall on 11th August 1968. The inference then was that it just happened to be the lucky last Britannia in service. This was just the same scenario as most of the other preserved ex BR locomotives. There was no difference between Britannia and all the other 54 Britannia in BR days. Good maintenance and attention to detail keeps the problems to a minimum.
What a shame.lets hope Britannia is ruling the rails again soon.
Thanks for keeping us informed.
Hope you are keeping safe and well.
Yes, a big shame especially since it had only recently been repaired from its previous failure last year, it is being rescued on Monday and taken back to Crewe for repair, thanks for the comment!
@@TRAlNVlDEOS Something must have failed that should have been replaced during the repairs.
It is very easy to miss items that look good on the outside, but hot steam pressure will find the smallest of defects.
'We'll fix it with some newspaper and a leather bootlace'
That was James the Red Engine!
TBH Class 47 in two-tone green with small yellow panels looks just as good IMHO
I agree! 👍
The 47 sounds and lööks far better
It would be if they'd bothered to get the colours right.
47 was a design icon and still is...60 years later.❤❤
Call it a 47 if you like. As far as I'm concerned it's a Brush Type 4, one of the first classes where the BR design panel was involved which is why it looks so good. Unfortunately they then went all corporate, sloshed blue and yellow paint everywhere and all but ruined its looks, along with so much else on BR.
Just look at and listen to that Spoon! They were the Big Brushes that Swept Clean! They had their problems but, even after de-rating, they still ruled the rails for many, many years.
TBH, they were BETTER after de-rating. But those fire trap bogies and an engine that would throw a fit if you even LOOKED at the engine settings.... Yeah. It was usually very good, but when a Brush was bad, it was horrible!😅
We all have aching joints somedays. Hoping she bounces back, she's a beautiful engine with a full rack of MK1 coaches.
She’s being taken back to Crewe on Monday by a diesel to be repaired, hopefully she will be back out again soon! 👍
All bar the last vehicle, which appears to be a Mk2D
Just found your channel very good info will start watch back catalogue👍
Thank you, I’m glad you enjoy them!
The armchair engineers are really out in force today with their comments…
To be fair some of it is based off what the Crew told people when in Carlisle station
@@TRAlNVlDEOSThe Crewe?
@@t20turnaround49 The Crew from Crewe? lol
@@t20turnaround49 I meant crew, for some reason it autocorrects to Crewe for me 😂
hi, great video, i wonder whats wrong with the confounded thing, love the cl 47 in green, thats what i remember back in the day.
Thank you, I’m glad you enjoyed the video!
What an eventful day at the Station. Great shots at Upperby junction. 😊
Thanks!
@@TRAlNVlDEOS, I know where we will be going to film in the morning 😊
@@juliephillips7374 😂 yes, it is is due to be rescued on Monday night.
Probably just a bearing running hot. Probably just purely precautionary
I don't know how many classes used the idea, but Bullied pacifics used to have garlic capsules in the middle big-end bearing, later changed for aniseed, which would pop and get whiffy if everything was too hot. If it was a hot bearing on Britannia, how did they become aware?
I’m not sure but they knew about it in the station because they kept looking at it while it was sat there.
Reckon it had a bit of a knock when coming back onto platform at 4:04 on video
@@nounoufriend1442 That's the signature sound of "Riddles' Rubbish" lol. I once said that to Charlie Pyne when 75027 had it's first outing on the Bluebell. Little did I or anyone else know at the time that he was the anonymous donor - no wonder he looked crestfallen. Sorry Charlie :-(
The capsules were started by Gresley on the A4s - mostly due to the ultra high-speed running down Stoke.
Did they ever use sulphur in bearings? Same sorta thing when they ran hot.
Two tone green brush does the business I loved the brits Hereward the wake was my favourite spent most of 67 at kingmoor depot! Halcyon days indeed
Shame about Britannia but you can always rely on Class 47 Brush 4 to get out of jail. It's the best diesel the British rail system ever had ! Thanks for including the alternative 47805 serial number
Yes it is a shame about Britannia, but glad you enjoyed the video! 👍
Great video, well done!
Thank you!
the signaller mustve been sick of dealing with that in and out by the time it was over
Haha yes! 😂
He must be the same guy who sent to a position that wasn't even empty for it - not exactly on the ball
What with the Standard 7 with breaking down?
Things will go wrong now and then. 😊
Britannia's preservation history shows why Cromwell was chosen over her for the national collection. But, for the train itself, isn't a Brush 4 impressive 'historic traction'.
I recall 70000 being rejected as a result of severe front end damage,later fixed by the SVR. 70013 was automatically pencilled in for the National Collection as it was the last steam locomotive overhauled at Crewe Works.
@alantunbridge8919 exactly. Just worked on, and in best condition. But don't forget britannia's boiler and other problems in preservation. That said total kudos for every person and organisation caring for 70000 over the years. But, at the end of the day, being the FIRST BR standard was surely a stronger reason for preservation than being the last loco repaired at Crewe. Preserve the last loco repaired at Derby, Swindon, Gorton, even Melton Constable works etc etc etc???
@@alantunbridge8919 I always was told 70013 was picked over 70000 because the latter being being the prototype had several differences to the standard class 7 that followed, and 70013 was not only a totally standard class 7, she was also the last of her class in service.
Curious that Oliver Cromwell has gone down in British history as one of the most hated Rulers of all time (a title that he probably doesn't deserve), and yet of all of the Britannias that could have been chosen, this one, with that name, was picked to be the last Pacific ever to be overhauled by British Railways. Just saying.
@@user-cw9qn1nb2n A title I think he did deserve. A title I don't think he deserves is the father of the democratic parliment, after all, when parliament went against him, he dissolved parliament and ruled as a dictator, who wanted his else surviving son to succeed him as Dictator of Commonwealth of Great Britain. The Democratic parliment we know today wasn't formulated until the 19th century. When you look at what he did to the Irish, and to the Catholics (and anyone else who refused the puritanical method of religion), you could be forgiven for feeling he was a bloodthirsty butcher.
Probably named because the committee who named the loco only understood the watered down fictional history from schoolbooks, after all, my generation was always taught that Cromwell got rid of a tyrant king, and introduced democracy to the UK, which is actually all rubbish. His disagreed with the King, and who was far from reliable or working for the interests of his people, but Cromwell was only interested in what he could gain, and not interested in the greater good, and cared little for democracy when it went against his wishes.
Love the 47...looks great..poor old kettle...😅😅
Wow look at the black smoke from 47805 as it sets off.
Yeah! 👌
Here we go again
I notice they have removed the RH motion.
The last time it failed at Hellifield, the RH side cross-head had cracked.
The fault could be related.
Well well well
Sounds like like a knock/clunk from motion when it came on to platform at 4:04 on the video , hopefully just needs re metaling and cranks ok
The crew must have lost their bearings
It's the wrong Way Round ! Britannia is Supposed to tow the Broken Down Diesel !
Always better pix when a tripod is used . . .
I agree with you except a lot of these wouldn’t have been possible with a tripod and it is annoying to carry around to be honest, thanks for the comment! 👍
@@TRAlNVlDEOSHave you considered using a monopod. Lighter and much less bulky but would certainly help with stability.
@@rodhewson Il look into it 👍
At least it's mechanical - not electronic - so it shouldn't be too difficult to repair!
That's the great thing about mechanical machines, whether it's a steam engine or a Stirling engine.
As long as you have a few screwdrivers and spanners (wrenches) then you're in business as far as repairs go!
Not again!
The Britannia-crew should have adjusted the lights on the frontside before steaming back into the station. Now she steamed back with red lights on the frontside!
True but it was on a mainline and it would have needed it get out of the way as quickly as possible because they can be fined a lot for stopping on it (I have heard £150 per minute quoted by people before), thanks for the comment! 👍
Can underrstand why they have diesel on back in these circumstances
Yes it also helps a lot with shunting and heating the coaches! 👍
Not the first time they've had to take her rods off in mainline service...
I wonder if they are not machining it properly?
@@abloogywoogywoo Beats me...
😢 where did it break down
In Carlisle Upperby it is being rescued on Monday, thanks for the comment! 👍
@@TRAlNVlDEOS Appeared to be a hot bearing on the right side coupling rods according to where the attention was.
@@stevie8763 Thanks for the info! 👍
It didn't break down anywhere as such. It was stopped because the problem with the bearing that they had identified, meant that if allowed to continue, it almost certainly would have done somewhere (probably very inconvenient, and causing delays to following services)) on the return trip........
@@21C192 Yes we know, this was noted in replies some days ago. You have to be quick with responces on this channel, photons replicate faster than the speed of light.😁
Brittanias had a lot of problems when new, the wheels were going around faster than the axles 😬
even more so after Bill Harvey adjusted the valve timing to get more power out of them. Several were worked up to Doncaster for attention, who replaced the way the wheels were fixed to the axles with that of a LNER pattern.
Reminds me of 46203 in 1997 but she never steamed again after that
Thats a shame, hopefully the outcome is more positive for Britannia! 👍🤞
I can’t believe it’s broken down again
Yes it’s a shame, hopefully it will be back out again soon! 👍
Classic Britannia!
Westcountry there as well. nice
Yes! 👍
Battle of britian, it's tangmere named after an raf base
@@jameswright3798 Yes, I didn’t include it in this video much because I thought it was getting a bit long so I added it to my previous video just incase you wanted to see more of it 👍
Tangmere is a Battle of Britain class locomotive ,Tangmere was one of the main RAF Stations covering the London and Kent Areas .
kind of symbolic of the real Brittania
Britannia Strikes Again!
47 needs headlcodes restored
❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Thanks! 👍
Why they normaly tow. Diesel
Hi, sorry I’m not quite sure what you mean?
My dream train, such power and presence. Do hope it is a minor fix.
Yes hopefully! 🤞
its just one of those things it happen now and then
Yes it is sadly 👍
wonder why she broke down maybe she was running hot?
Yea that is a possibility 👍
Yes, these old bearings need oil refills every trip..
Many a steamer has failed due to overheating..
Wonder if the same happened when all rail travel was by steam..?
I'm assuming that was part of the job of the fire raiser. Getting a steamer started takes several hours, much of it waiting for the fire to really get going, so this would be a logical time for minor service. As slowly as possible is the answer in terms of stress on the metal; If you have 24 hours to raise a fire, great; eight will do; shorter than that might be rather stressful as I understand. One relatively harmless way of shortening the startup time is to charge the boiler with pre-heated water. The North Shore Scenic Railroad, a preserved railway covering the roughly 25 miles from Duluth to Two Harbors, Minnesota in the US, has the benefit of a city council-run steam plant right next to the Duluth train station -- the early 1930s plant which was recently converted from coal to biomass and from open-ended steam heat to hot water on a closed recirculating loop provides hot water and heat to around 160 buildings around the city centre ranging from city hall and county hall to hospitals and high-rise offices, and also the NSSR's steam engines.
Didn't actually break down!! Was failed as a precautionary measure to avoid total failure and damage. JG.
Okay sorry my mistake! 👍
Itd be bad enough being on a kettle tour but unbelievably rancid to be rescued by a spoon😂
😂
🤥