80/20 Training to Race Faster, with Dr. Stephen Seiler | Extramilest Show #50
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ต.ค. 2024
- Stephen Seiler PhD is a well known Exercise Physiologist, located in Norway. He studied the training habits of many world class endurance athletes and discovered the 80/20 Rule that also applies to endurance training. Meaning performing 80% of your workouts at a low intensity and 20% at a higher intensity. This polarized approach, is now widely accepted by coaches and athletes around the world.
🚨 BIG GIVEAWAY! For this 50th episode of the Extramilest Show, I’m giving away a $150 gift card from PATH projects (www.PATHprojects.com) + a lifetime membership to my Personal Best running coaching program (www.PBprogram.com). To enter, comment below: what was your favorite takeaway, lesson or quote from this episode? 2 winners will be picked at random. 🚨
Chapters
4:45 How did he get involved in exercise science?
8:30 Growth of exercise science
13:40 Alternatives to No Pain No Gain mentality
18:50 Training zone intensities
25:00 How 80/20 training can also benefit the recreational runner.
29:30 How hard to do high intensity training?
35:45 Balancing being a dad and coaching his daughter Siren Seiler
40:40 Male vs female athlete difference
45:25 Being healthy to reach max performance
48:50 His research with rats
52:10 Impact of stress on training adaptations
55:25 Balancing training and personal life
1:01:50 Breathing intensity vs heart rate intensity
1:08:30 Nasal breathing experiences
1:13:35 Entrainment, linking of breathing and movement pattern
1:18:58 Dr Seiler on ResearchGate
1:20:34 Closing thoughts
1:21:35 BIG giveaway contest, leave a comment to enter
#stephenseiler #seiler #8020training
TOOLS AND RESOURCES MENTIONED:
► Seiler’s Hierarchy of Endurance Training needs - bit.ly/33V5MxC
► The Complete Book of Running - amzn.to/3ekODiO
► Harvard Fatigue Laboratory - bit.ly/32xSpmo
► Molly Seiler Olympic performance - • Good Golly Molly! How ...
► Polar OH1 - arm heart rate strap amzn.to/3JaTHV8
► Eliud Kipchoge interview Extramilest Show - • Kipchoge's Advice to R...
► Wim Hof interview Extramilest Show - • Wim Hof, "The Iceman" ...
► Patrick McKeown interview Extramilest Show - • Patrick McKeown on Bre...
FIND DR SEILER HERE:
► Twitter: / stephenseiler
► TH-cam: / sportscientist
► Research Gate: www.researchga...
YOU CAN FIND ME, FLORIS GIERMAN HERE:
► Personal Best Program: www.pbprogram.com
► Website: extramilest.com
► Strava: / strava
► Instagram: / florisgierman
► Podcast: extramilest.co...
ABOUT THE EXTRAMILEST SHOW:
A podcast and TH-cam channel where host Floris Gierman interviews world class athletes, coaches and health experts on the topic of how to become a stronger, healthier and happier athlete.
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Training is building the cake, racing is eating it. Great thinking and my main takeaway. Thanks for another great video Floris.
I’m in trouble. I have a sweet tooth
Baking the cake takes ages
Great takeaway right there Tim! Congrats on winning our video contest, you won a $150 gift card from PATH projects (www.PATHprojects.com) + a lifetime membership to my Personal Best running coaching program (www.PBprogram.com). Please send me an email via my website, since I don't see an email address on your TH-cam bio. Cheers!
@@FlorisGierman wow, for real? I never win anything!
@@timshearn8203 today is your lucky day! yes you really did win!
I’m a (novice) blind runner & this is deep, I really appreciate the amazing advice.
“Training is about finding a sustainable pattern” is definitely my key takeaway. Thank you for an awesome interview!
Spot on! Thank you Suphachol
Thank you for the great interview. My favourite quote was from Kipchoge, when he wanted to finish his workouts still smiling. I'm going to remember that the next time I do intervals.
Exactly Edith, all about finding that fine line to put in the time and effort, but not overdo it either to show up the next day again! 👍
i think we misunderstand Kipchoge - his smile is probably very masochistic, considering the paces he is training at. some people take pleasure from suffering and marathon runners of that pace is probably as masochistic of an example as humanly possible XD
Congrats on winning our contest Edith Gruber, you won a $150 gift card from PATH projects (www.PATHprojects.com) + a lifetime membership to my Personal Best running coaching program (www.PBprogram.com). Please send me an email via my website, since I don't see an email address on your TH-cam bio. Cheers!
favorite take away: the body needs to be in a healthy state in order to absorb training. health first then train. makes so much sense when you frame it that way. overall stress management is so important
Such an important one and something I have noticed first hand in myself and other athletes around me as well. Great takeaway, well said Christopher!
@ 46:44 he refers to the Norwegian word ´overskudd´ which directly translated means to be at surplus. As you write that isn´t only being in positive balance from physical training.
Great interview Floris!
My takeaways:
“Great endurance athletes have intensity discipline.” As a recreational runner, I need to park my ego aside.
“Training is about finding a sustainable pattern of loading. Learn how to ease up on easy days and figure out what easy means.“. I realize my runs are too often in the so called no man’s land (Z3), not slow enough, not hard enough.
“Health first - so that my body is in a state that is receptive for the stress of training”. This is another area I need to pay closer attention to. Life pressures, diet and sleep are all factors that contribute to the effectiveness of my training.
And finally a couple of questions:
What is your motivation?
Are you having fun?
Are you smiling at the end of a workout?
Merry Christmas and Happy holidays!
@33:16, Seiler quoting Kipchoge “You still want to smile when finishing your training” 👍
Great conversation! Favorite quote: "It becomes an optimization problem. It's not a maximization problem." This is key for me to remember. More miles aren't better if they're chipping away at my abaility to adapt to the training.
Excellent episode! My favorite take away: “it’s not the epic workout, it’s the body of work.”
Great episode ! 🙌 I’m running just 5 years now, 41 years old and have 15 years atritis…Ran a lot of marathons and trail ultra’s… Had no sport history or knowlegde but the best progression i made is to train a lot not hard… 👌 a lot of people are always pushing to hard on training… 🙈
My favorite part was the discussion of training intensity distribution at around 20 minutes. It was about this time that I realized that Dr Seiler sounds like he should be starring in a sequel to Tombstone.
"The human will break down." I may be an example...I'm now 62 and have run since I was 15. Needless to say over that time span I've tried a lot of different training. Last year I was training for a marathon with a plan that included two fairly hard days a week along with easy runs and this worked out ot be more than 80/20. After a few months I developed some health issues. 80/20 makes a whole lot more sense.
I'm 60 and have found fixed training plans to be rather less useful as I have become an ageing athlete. Not only does recovery take longer, it's also way more uneven and unpredictable. I need a lot more flexibility and want the ability to say (for example) I feel like I could use two full rest days this week.
Great interview, thank you for building it . The light bulb moment for me was “ get healthy first then train , otherwise the best case scenario is nothing happens!”
All the best for 2022!
Bob
I think the best takeaway from this video is that no one workout is the perfect workout, there is no perfect pace or time or effort it is a culmination of all of it that gets you to the finish line.
The key phrase that resonated in me like a revelation. "What is your deep motivation?" WoW! One of your best podcast Floris.
For me, his recommendation of having a balanced optimization approach to training sums it up. Things I learned this time is that adaptation may be compromised because of higher priority adaptations occuring in the body. In retrospect, I can relate to that, whether it be because of compromised metabolism, immunity, or injury. Why run 2-3h while under the weather or power through a niggle? I have experienced a clear slow down and poorer HR efficiency when my kinetic chain was off balance and needed to back off running. I believe it pays off to listen to the physiological signals and adjust training, before, during and after running.
I'm glad he is exploring other areas of sport research. Looking forward to his findings.
Thanks for having the legendary Stephen Seiler on the Extramilest show. It's epic and well deserved. Congratulation Floris!
Very well said Eric, thank you 🙏 🙌
First off, I love to listen to Dr. Seiler speak. Something about his voice, cadence and speech pattern is nice. Thank you for hosting the interview. I find myself chasing squirrels all the time. Everybody is faster than I and my friends typically run the shorter races/sessions. I'm the dummy that gets stuck chasing them all the time. That's my fault and not theirs. I'm currently on the comeback trail yet again. Trying to build base and then will try to stick to 80/20 with lots of uphill hiking. It's hard not to chase training PBs, especially when tracking all the training data. Thanks again for the interview. Cheers.
You are surely not alone with chasing the squirrels Lumpydog! It helps to step back, Zoom out and leaving the ego at the door. Once you're aerobically further developed, it becomes easier to train at lower intensity as well. All the best on your training and racing journey!
The cadence of good professors, the ones who give away passion 😉👍
Floris. I have been working with low heart rate training for years now, thanks to one of your early videos. I have been running since the early 1970s and wish I knew then what I know now. I used to run in no mans land all the time. I would have had better times with less effort. The more research I see, the more constant the answer is. Dr. Seiler is so right. The 80/20 and polarized training is the way to go. Also, we can do what the elite runners do...just at our paces.
Hi John, glad that you, me and many others in the endurance community are now more aware of a lower intensity training approach / polarized training / 80-20. I feel most athletes first have to experience several challenges in their training, before looking into alternative approaches to optimize their training, racing and health in the long term.
Great episode as always Floris. My takeaway was around how being healthy is a foundation for better adaptation during the training cycle - with his example of the Norwegian training camps and being turned away at any hint of an illness/poor immune system.
Keep up the good work 🤙
Those examples he shared were eye opening for me as well. The way he put it makes total sense that our body will prioritize health over training progress. Thanks Ed!
Great interview, my cool takeaway was that horses follow 80/20 training too! In the most controlled environment, with big money on the line, and every incentive to push the animal to it's literal limits, we must still respect the underlying physiology
Being able to be happy and smiling during training and racing, and at same time being able to conquer new personal bests are the two sides of the same coin. This was a true eye opener to me! Thanks!
Spot on VRGM 👌
"No health, no performance" - Seiler. Thanks again Floris
Favorite takeaway was Dr. Seiler’s very clear explanation of how mid-range training intensity is a recipe for performance stagnation. This is a fundamental tenet of low-HR training approaches, and Dr. Seiler explained it in a simple but compelling way.
Spot on Nathanael, that's something most athletes are not aware of in the early stages of their endurance training. Such a great point to focus on.
Hi Floris....hope you are doing well. This is a great interview! When I was listening to Dr. Seiler talk how about all the emails he received from people who finally realized how to make their easy days easy, it rang so true for me. When I was I was training for my last marathon, I was making my easy days, "medium hard" as Dr. Seiler puts it. I had a good race but didn't get the results I was looking for. I have since got a coach and he taught me how to slow down...and really am enjoying it! My easy run consists of running at a high cadence but running at 5:20 to 5:40 a kilometer, which is very relaxed for me. It is good to know that world class athletes are taking this approach....easy days easy ...and hard days hard.
Hi Allen, the medium hard days are indeed so common! I've been there in the past as well. So happy that more coaches and athletes are aware of the benefits of training mostly at low intensity, with some high intensity integrated strategically. All the best on your running journey!
Did the opposite, 20/80 for 20 years. Safe to say I have paid the price with chronic fatigue. No way back it seems. Thanks for the vid
Thank you Floris.
Amazing interview like always.
Best lesson I really think are:
stay happy,
enjoy in process,
push 100% only at race !
My takeaway is that one doesn't need to be elite athlete to train with 80/20 approach and see results and aim for sport longevity.
Absolutely!
My favorite takeaway from this episode was the emphasis on balancing high and low intensity training. I recently completed my first half (October 2021) and full marathon (December 2021) this year and had no idea how to balance my training. I ran every run at the same hard pace, and ended up injuring my leg during peak week for the marathon. I then biked and swam the remaining 3 weeks to recover, but was able to complete my first race in a little over 4 hours. Floris has gotten me interested in maffetone training and Dr. Seiler's wisdom about going easier for longevity and enjoying running will stick with me for my next marathon. Thanks for the episode!
I have followed this for the last 2 years; I have never been faster! Train slower! Thank you SS!
Great discussion! Taking this in I'm realizing that the times when I just intuitively run more consistently at a moderate effort have been the most sustainable periods in my athletic life and when I have become more goal oriented and pursued more higher intensity beyond that 20% or so are when I've been overtrained and/or injured. Part of my equation is I was recently diagnosed with Ankylosing Spondylitis at age 67. A lot of what I had thought were injuries and wear and tear I now know is the effect of this degenerative spine disease and associated peripheral joint enthesitis. Interestingly, my rheumatologist says that my active lifestyle is why my spine has not fused and I am not disabled despite evidence in my MRIs indicates having this disease for more than four decades. I am a backcountry skier so I do need a bit more intensity sometimes to be able to move quickly through avalanche terrain. and climb steep slopes efficiently. Skiing is the only thing I love even more than running.
This summer I am slowing down and trying to rebuild my fitness by being more mindful about what I am doing. I have always breathed four and four on my longer runs and have been a mouth breather almost exclusively since getting my nose broken in a fight over who had next game of pickup basketball when I was in college. Despite a badly deviated septum, I am trying to be conscious about nose breathing. It doesn't always work but it is definitely getting better. Recently on slow runs I find that nose breathing I can maintain a cadence of in for eight and out for eight strides for as long as I want to go, which right now is about 12 km. I have to keep a regulator on myself because I love to run fast and I love to run long. For now, I am not going longer than that and I am limiting my intervals to one day in five and only doing them uphill to protect my knees and my Achilles insertions that tend to get inflamed.
I'm not satisfied with my fitness right now but I can already feel that I am heading in the right direction. This stuff really does work and I have a lifetime of evidence of that if only I would look at it and make it part of my mindset. Thank you for this great talk! I'm going to look up Stephen Seiler right now and learn more.
Absolutely loved and intrigued by the observation of an athlete's inflammatory status and decision to not train at intensity!
In studying Sports and Exercise Science I absolutely resonate with this quote from Dr. Seiler:
“My thesis has always been that developments in the sports, in training, have not emerged from scientists, with very few exceptions. They have emerged from the laboratory of the forest, and the roads, and the water, where people are training, and coaches are watching.”
The benefit of science is that it’s robust and well researched, the drawback though is that takes time! If we want to be on the cutting edge of best practices, most of the time it’s best to look at the elites and learn from their experience in the trenches 🙏
Breathing is a truth teller.
I had to learn these lessons the hard way. I drove myself to the ground for years thinking it would make me stronger. Needless to say, I wore me down to underperforming against the folks I used to crush. So glad I’ve crossed over to the other side. The last challenge I have is not over doing it on rest days and training while sick or with symptoms. I’m such a bonehead!
No pain no gain. Was such a flawed statement. SO sorry. I was doing the same thing. No progress. MAF and low low intensity easy days.
I repeatedly tell my running clients to smile and enjoy the process, so naturally I loved the reference to Kipchoge...finish every run with a smile!
I grew up with the "no pain-- no gain" mantra and have continued to try to push myself over the years but never getting faster nor more reliable. Dr Seiler's comment of learning a better way by watching people train and how that knowledge trickles down to the average athlete over time has been happening for years. Well, it was last year -- 40 years after my first marathon training effort, that I learned to slow down to get a better result. I am grateful to those who watched and learned .. I plan on running in the easy talking phase till I pass. Thanks for the podcast Stephen.
Amazing! Dr. Seiner was just talking to me! Every time I see a teenager passing by, I want to catch up to his/her pace! What an ego at 58 years old! 😂
As i am a mother of 2kids, trying to train for my first marathon, also being an example for my kids, i sometimes forget about my motivation for running. My favorite quote: “Hey, are you having FUN?!” ☺️ it sounds so simple, but, it is very important to always remember why i run and always KEEP smiling😁🙏🏻I also loved the part of daily grind and sustain it🙂i love this episode and i am a fan of your show, i just discovered run slow, as i would run most of my runs, in a faster pace, but somehow nothing changed. I will use this type of training for my run and i am sure, results will come. Thank you for all the great guests, topics that you share with us.👏🏻
Great to hear from you Anca! Glad this episode resonated well for you. FUN in your workouts is indeed such an important one, to be able to train in a sustainable healthy way. Exciting times ahead for your first marathon, you will always remember your first marathon haha. Wishing you all the best in your training and on race day! Let me know how it goes. Cheers
Great show as usual Floris. I like hearing the thoughts and views of your guests who use a broad base of information and resources to inform their own opinions and views on training. My takeaway is - don't chase the squirrels on easy days and keep on smiling
Really helpful. I love your podcasts with the scientists. No matter how much we learn these experts not only have lots more to teach but via the podcasts they communicate it so well. Always helps me.
Take home point for me… “there’s no such thing as the steady state…. First hour is not the same as the second hour”.
I’m coming back from an injury and this has helped me reflect more intelligently on how I got injured and how to interpret my HR/effort better on the long runs. Thanks
Thank you for a great episode with Stephen Seller. My takeaway: The best results are not about maximization, but optimization of our efforts. “Great endurance athletes have intensity discipline.” It's about leaving the ego at home!
Thanks for such an educative and informative podcast. My takeaway:
"Intensity has no meaning if there is no period attached to it."
This is so true! Intensity can be measured only when it is for a particular interval and we are able to give our best shot when its for a given interval. If we are asked to perform our best indefinitely...its absurd. Unfortunately many of us have such unrealistic expectations from ourselves. There is no such thing as "steady pace". Rightly said by Dr Stephen Seiler.
1:03:52. Thank you for Dr. Seiler. This hits home. Often enough the most overlooked Vital Sign when it comes to everyone's preoccupation in meeting their PRs.
Another great podcast Floris. Thank you. So many good take aways but I really like "the epic workout is not what leads to individual performance gains its the sum of the all the workouts. Its the process and sustainable of the process."
Thanks Floris, a great podcast once again ! My favourite quote is the one talking about honesty between an athlete (his daughter) and a coach. If you are not honest with yourself, it will impair your training in next days. Thus, the key is the optimization of your training, not maximization. Not to be too strict about a training program, but listen to our physical condition...
Great lessons. I’m 75, very competitive in 5 k in my age group,but I’m going to spend more time at easy pace training. Thanks for this information. I don’t have a heart rate monitor. I listen to my body and mind.
needed this, hitting a massive rut in my marathon training. thank you
For me it's 'training is an optimization between stress and recovery, not maximization, but optimization. Finding a flow and making sure it's sustainable over time and most of all fun!' Some great insights on running, which also could be applied on life in general. Really enjoyed the interview, thanks a lot Floris 👌
Optimization over maximization. I can handle going slow but on hard days I was burying myself which greatly made the following workouts suffer
Great episode gentleman! The section where you talk about training while sick or compromised really hit home. I contracted Covid 19 last December and was very sick for about 3 weeks. I was determined to not let it set me back but it was apparent that my heart rate was running at a higher level. Over the year of '21 I completed 6 marathons and 2 half marathons. My first marathon back was a 3:30 (at a much higher heart rate than I was expecting) and my final marathon CIM was a PB of 3:13. I definitely could not have done this without the MAF method and pure determination. My next goal is to break the 3 hour barrier. This is all thanks to finding this channel 3.5 years ago. Thanks Floris!
Key Word , “ Sustainability “ I’ve spent 15 months trying to hone in on MAF ( low HR ) and seeing results on Hard sessions now that I’m training for a 5K. Having to learn not to redline as my tendency is to keep going faster and faster then find myself gassing out. Learning to find what I can realistically sustain which definitely is in 90-92 % MHR (199 and I’m 44 ) great Video could not have come at a better time for me as I’m looking to hit a PR in 5K in Feb 2022
Good to hear from you Roman. Well done on adjusting your low HR and high HR workout intensities. Have a good one hitting that 5K PR in February!
Hi Floris, thanks for a great interview here. It's definitely one to watch again to catch all the nuggets of gold. The Kipchoge reference about finishing a run smiling really hit home, but the reaffirmation to run 80% of the time at conversational pace was very timely. I have FINALLY managed to slow down my 'easy' runs so they are a minute slower than my tempo/half marathon pace runs - previously, there was only about a 30 second difference. All my runs fell into the grey area. I have finally found a way out and now looking to see what the improvements will be.
Hi Andy, glad you have found a way to lower the intensity of your easy runs. Looking forward to hearing how things will improve for you in 2022 and beyond!
Thank you for bringing one of my heroes on your podcast! My favourite quote of his is "you don't have to be a world-class athlete to help people find the balance in their training"
I love the point he makes about being able to smile at the end of your workouts and also making a PR
Balance training not to maximize but to optimize training was my favorite quote. Thank you for the great interview, Floris.
Well said Tony, it's all about finding that right balance for optimal training and racing performance. Now my question to you, since I know you like tech gadgets. Have you used any tools yet to measure your breathing rates during workouts?
@@FlorisGierman Not gadget during the workout but part of the training I’m trying Aerofit pro, which measures and give breathing exercises.
@@FlorisGierman Some newer Garmin watch with heart rate band is able to detect breathing rate during a workout and throughout the day.
Thanks for this great interview. What I found especially helpful was Seiler's emphasis on keeping it simple and focusing on what really matters -- all the tech is helpful, to a point, but we must never lose sight of the simple basics. I find that I sometimes can get caught up in "doing it exactly right" but the way Seiler reminded us that it's the "body of work" that matters far more than each individual workout done exactly right. Run with a smile and finish with one, too!
Thank you for the very informative discussion, loved this episode! My favourite quote would have to be 'Humans can't train hard everyday, the human will break down'.
I started running at the start of the pandemic to keep fit and have had quite a few injuries. I think I've found the reason why lol
What a great father. He listens to his daughters problems and try to figure it out from that point.
I've started this method two weeks ago, but in cycling ! I could ride my bike now almost every day! 30/15, 40/20 and 4x4 are my HIT Intervals. Two times a week and 5 Times I ride easy at 70% of my HR !
This was a great interview. I have recently been learning more about 80/20 training and knew about running easy most of the time and that I should feel good, but also that hard intervals and days don’t need to be super hard and making it brutal. I liked the analogy of building the cake and eating the cake.
Glad you enjoyed it Angi. That cake analogy was indeed spot on!
I loved his phrase “you are building the cake but racing is eating the cake.” That is such a good reminder, especially in base building. Part of training is making a great cake!
This was a very interesting episode and the humility of Dr Seiler stood out. Thank you for finding amazing guest speakers!
"your muscles cells aren't that sophisticated...get some high intensity work in... approximations end up being close enough often" - the absolute sports science GOAT - love it
His quote about optimization instead of maximization really struck a cord with me. Makes me really think about my training and the direction I need to be going!
Thanks for the interview! It was amazing to hear Stephen Seiler and my favourite part was the one as the 80/20 approach works even better for elite athletes. And the comparison to formula one racing, and that the technology used in formula one cars scales down to normal cars some years later. If you measure high performance athletes and understand how they improve slightly , then you can transpose that to regular athletes and have big improvements.
"Most of their training is below that first lactate turnpoint. You don't have to go full speed to get that adaptation" This comment really stood out for me from Stephen Seiler as I have been doing MAF for in the majority of my runs with the occasional Tempo or interval session and have made big improvements Floris
Great takeaway Samson and glad you have found a training approach that's working well for you!
As someone who is new to long distance running; I needed to hear ALL of this.
My favorite advice was "Optimizing over Maximizing" and thinking of it in terms of even horses and other animals need to rest. If a cheetah hunted at their top speed for hours a day every day, it wouldn't survive. So they use skill instead of raw speed. Great great great info! Glad I found this channel.
Floris I listen to you and Dr Seiler all the time esp. when I mow the lawn or do things around the house. I liked your interview with Dr S and I most enjoyed you talking about training and having fun with your kids. I twins that are 10 and an 8 yr old and we jog to the park and play tag and basketball for our fitness. I make them run about 100 yards or so away so they build some endurance. I like the cake reference Dr S brought up. Stay healthy was a key point as well. I tried your low heart rate training for a while however I don't have that much time. Please keep up the great content.
Great interview, few golden nuggets dropped however for me the two outstanding things were:
1. Finish workout with a smile
2. Don’t be so fixed on numbers because our body is not so sophisticated
😎
The concept of OPTIMIZE over MAXIMIZE in training was really powerful. A mind set key takeaway for me. When we are young we learn “ rock-paper scissors”…. But forget why water wins over rock…..consistency over intensity, a focussed drip-drip-drip will have water shape granite over time, is the concept that i take away….Along with the mechanics of balance and physiology. Great, great show, will be sharing with my running group here in Dallas.
Floris’s lack of ego makes him so much better at interviewing than many of the narcissists out there (no channels mentioned!) 🙏
🙏🙌❤️🚀🥳
“It’s our ego’s that get us in trouble”, love it (beside all other comments below: they all resonate…). Thank you so much!
YES!!!!!!! Another voice with such great explanation. Shared this to my group that I coach because I routinely have trouble getting athletes to wrap their heads around my frequent mantra, "let your fast be really fast and your slow be slow." Sustainability and Optimization.
This is just what we to hear, I'm gonna stop eating the cake and start building it, yes smile at end of a session to enjoy and train the next day. Rhythm and sustainability feel the flow. These are all brilliant. Not the epic workout but the body at work. Top video thank you has given me great insights and inspiration for my next year's running.
Happy to hear that Jon, several solid takeaways right there. Good reminders for 2022 and beyond!
My take away from this episode: Difference between Optimization vs Maximization. Focusing on the optimization to find “a rhythm of signal recovery adaptation”. I have heard many times that “listen to your body” but there is not enough information on what to do with that signal. Great episode.
I had so many takeaways but one that stood out was that general life stresses can have a real tangible impact on training impact and that we, as lifestyle runners, need to take this in to account. Smile at the end of these workouts. 😁😁😁
Thank you Floris - new to running and will be signing up with your pb program
Interested in the quote ‘you can go from untrained to trained without a problem but then things start to go wrong. This is my problem with injuries. Very interesting interview. Will def be following this advice
My take away is "Are you having fun? what's your motivation to train?" which is exactly same as what I tell my runners.. since we do forget why we started running... Great interview again. Thanks Floris!
Hi Floris! Finish the intervals wihout being exhausted. That's a good one. Also, the "body of work" is what matters most.
Low intensity has given me more time with the kids. To play hard and not say oh im tired. IT IS FANTASTIC
YES THIS! Having plenty of energy left for daily life makes a huge difference.
I really fall in love with slow run, after 2 years not running at all, last month I tried some interval speedwork, and I got plantar fasicitis, and I felt sorry to myself. Right now my feet is better, but still uncomfortable, but I wanna test it for run next week. Lesson I can learn is I wanna truly be myself, run slowly, run longer, and only use stride and tempo as my faster workout. It makes me run happy. Thanks for the motivation, hope my feet is fix perfectly 😁
Low intensity running is one thing, another is to add plenty of strength and mobility training, to build a strong foundation to be able to handle higher intensity training when your body is ready. All the best
Great interview, really enjoyed that
Loved the "Eating the cake" analogy, makes a lot of sense as you don't want to waste your race in a training session.
There were so many great quotes and fundamental concepts from this conversation that It is hard to pick one...but I will. For
me, as we end a tough year and get ready to welcome 2022 where I have several ultras on my calendar, the concept of ‘having fun’ every day that I get out there summarizes what we all should strive to do. In New England it is the tough time of the year and there are days that weather becomes a huge challenge. Thinking that I am going out to ‘play’ already makes me smile and knowing that I can still do this, makes me thankful. This was one of the best episodes so far and one that I will listen to again in my run this morning. Very enriching. Thanks for inviting people like dr Seiler. Happy Holidays everyone
Excellent. I'm training this way and it's being amazing. Thank you for this episode
Am I late to the game? I wanted to leave a comment and enter the drawing for the lifetime subscription if it is not too late....
For me the best take away is connection! It is how we, running humans, and all athletes, through this podcast, can connect with each other in a deep level. For example , when Dr. Seiler talks about his daughter having to pass her max, to have that knowledge so she can dial it down, I connected, because I have felt it without giving it a name until now. So those words are more than words, they are knowledge about your own-self, therefore a connection with yourself, with Dr. Seiler, his daughter and you Floris, a whole community.
Throughout the podcast there were connections made like that,. Another example, when Dr. Seiler commented on Kipchoge smile, I felt my smile and again, I connected to the whole community. Thank you Floris.
Thank you Floris for yet another informative Extramilest episode with Dr Seiler, so much insight in this interview I would have to transcribe the entire episode 🤓. The main takeaway 🔑 from this interview for me is “Intensity Discipline “ where the great endurance athletes have ego resilience 🏃🏻♂️ 🧠 👍
My favorite quote was "intensity has no meaning without duration". This rings true with looking at the whole picture of training.
The big one on this for me is understanding your "why." That was something I took a long hard look at as I turned 50 earlier this year - something about a birthday that ends with a 0 tends to make me feel more philosophical 😀.
My initial answers to "why am I endurance training" were answers like "to run a 3 hour marathon" or to "get under 40 minutes on the 10k" but those are really just surface answers. As I dug a little deeper yet, the realization is those times are just ways to keep me motivated but they are not the "why". For me, the "why do I endurance train" is because I have become more focused on "health, happiness, and longevity" and I believe that endurance training done right forwards all three of those goals.
That said, while being sedentary doesn't achieve "health, happiness, and longevity," going too far out the other side of the scale and burning all of our matches David Goggins style probably isn't aligning very well against those tenets either. It is absolutely about finding that healthy balance for sure. I'm competitive and I like to get better as much as the rest of us - but I've spent a good part of 2021 learning to harness that competitive energy for good to stay on the right side of healthy progression. I wouldn't say I'm expert at it yet but I'm getting better at it, not worse, because I am working at staying focused on my "why" and guiding my training accordingly. Driving yourself into the ground to achieve a race time doesn't make much sense if your why is health, happiness, and longevity.
As an example of this, I had started to increase my running to 5 and 6 days a week as I prepare for my first marathon in February - but, even making sure that 4 or 5 of those weekly runs were zone 2 / easy, my left knee and right ankle were pretty consistently chirping at me - not full out injury but achy. So, for the past month I've been mixing in alternating days of cycling and running and my body's response has been extremely positive. I find that I can do morning cardio 6 days a week and finish both my runs and my cycling feeling better at the end than when I started them. IT band pains and Achilles aches have evaporated. A running purist could argue I am not training with enough specificity for the marathon but my 50 year old joints and tendons would counter that with "yes, but now we don't hurt every day."
Sustainability and consistency are key . . . and the best way I've found to achieve those is to make sure that I am able to approach the things I do for health with an "I get to . . ." attitude rather than an "I have to . . ." attitude. Feeling good at the end of my runs and cycling definitely leaves me with an "I get to do a trail run today" feeling, not an "Ugh, I have to . . ." It doesn't hurt that I also now "get" to have fun riding virtual mountains in Zwift as a bonus. Will this strategy net me the fastest marathon time I'm capable of in February . . . I don't know. I do know that I'm enjoying the journey a lot more, my body feels much healthier, and that's kind of the point.
Also, 7 months ago, when I was primarily strength training for health, running even five consecutive miles was beyond my immediate horizon - so whether I am able to run 26.2 miles below 3 hours and 30 minutes or I can only achieve sub 3 hours and 40 minutes in February 2022, I'm still leaps and bounds ahead of where I was in February 2021. Endurance training is something I enjoy very much but it is the means not the end. The real benefit I get to take away from these 12 months is not a marathon time. It's that I'm eating better, I'm sleeping better, my resting heart rate has come down markedly, I weigh 30 pounds less. Those are the real markers of success on the "health and longevity" scale. And, as the means to effect those changes, I get to spend time running in the forest or riding on a virtual mountain each day while letting life's stresses slip away for an hour or two and that rates pretty highly on the "happiness" scale.
That's probably enough rambling - I feel as if I just wrote War & Peace in a TH-cam comment 😀 Thanks for the great content with Dr. Seiler and hopefully the holidays and the new year treat you well.
So many wonderful nuggets of information in this one. The takeaway that resonated with me was that nasal breathing is not an indication of performance during activity. You can adapt to become a nasal breather under more high intensity loads.
Definitely one of your most informative guests. I will have to listen to the podcast again in a week to process all the information. Optimization vs Maximization is a concept that should be intuitive but is harder to achieve in practice.
Glad you enjoyed it. Yes while editing I listened to it several times and each times found different nuggets again. Optimization vs Maximization is indeed a good one to focus on.
I really learned something here! I have always known about 80/20-but as a triathlete we tend to not understand the slow/easy workouts😓🙈
But after listening to this episode and after doing my 5th ultra two weeks ago(and not understanding why my body is still not recovering as it used too here two weeks later)I just realized that Im still recovering and did a 2 hour slow run today-and it felt amazing❤🎉
Awesome episode! Thanks! My favorite quote: "I want to still be smiling when i finish the workout so that i can wakeup and train the next day". This is so true! Personally i enjoy this feeling! :-)
Thanks, Floris! This is a great interview! My favorite takeaway is at 58:10 where he says it’s not about the epic workout, but about the sum of it all. It’s about having the health to sustain the daily grind. The one consistent theme I find in your channel is to be consistent in training! 🤣 Fantastic content!!
It's an optimization process. It's a rhythm of signal, recovery, and adaptation. This is so important given how most of us are prone to running too hard, too often (always going medium/hard every day). I've really strived to embrace true easy/recovery the past year and a half for the majority of the time. Intensity discipline (saying no to running hard on easy days). Stay safe, train smart, and keep running...
I like this episode because I have been plateau for much longer than I wanted because I train in the middle ground for too long. I have been listening to you shows regular since I found your channel.
Thank you for the interview. There were many good takeaways, and as I read the comment section here and on your FB group after watching the video they come back to mind.
I want to quote a couple from a segment -
“Easy is easy, hard is even harder, miisrepresents reality” and how he goes into saying “Work hard but not so hard it’s not manageable” and him using Eliud’s quote “want to be still smiling when I wake up the next day and be able to go for a run. It’s not the epic workout but the body of work that counts” drove the point well about intensity of hard workouts.
As a relatively new runner (2 full years) that is conscious about keeping it easy thanks to extramilest, I am still ending my year with an injury (again, like last year) after (likely) pushing it hard on track intervals. The 90% rule that Stephen brought up has sunk in already.
Thank you for posting this interview it has been extremely useful and thought provoking. I no longer run but now cycle after medical issues but I still need to train. I had an organ transplant 12 years ago (Im now 62 YO) and it took me the best part of 4 years to get my medication stable and therefore a physiological platform to allow me to train with some normality. The wider points you highlight with Dr Seiler suggest that if I had the insight to utilise these metrics I could have adapted to my new normal quicker and therefore produced more beneficial training results. As my family would no doubt contest I was my own worst enemy after my operations as I made my self ill on more than one occasion. I believe that is also attributed to my age and old training mantra 'No Pain, No gain' as you eluded to. It would make a good medical/sports science paper if it already hasn't 🤔
One of my favourite videos of yours. Well done Floris.
Thanks for the video, which has broadened my perspective of running and exercise in general. For me, my favorite takeaway is the importance of breathing and how it can be used along cadence to measure when somebody is reaching the threshold, which can help athletes make the right decision during their performance.
Great endurance athletes have “intensity discipline.” So true!! ❤️
Such a great takeaway Amelia, I love that part about intensity discipline vs ego, such an important one in line with long term thinking vs short term.👍