Which Faction Has the Best Infantry? With Dawi After Dark - The Old World - Warhammer Fantasy
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.พ. 2025
- Dawi After Dark: @Dawiafterdark
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You two fellas are a really great peer! A good vibes, leading off from one another’s comments instead of interrupting, making the video very clear and easy to understand and listen too. Also both having some strong comments, but being flexible and understanding makes this video way more interesting and enjoyable to listen too. Keep up the great work..
Ye 100% man, such a good unit!
1:44:45 I've just picked up 40 foot knights to run with a foot prophetess for this. the brettonian regen signature or the glittering robe both do great work, sword of the stout hearted and doppelganger is great too and the ward save already being built in does wonders. The thing about the Lore of the lady is that wrath scales better on the mounted knights, but gift is better for the infantry due to sheer number of wounds. i wish there was a way to take robe and gift, but alas, we have to make a decision before the game. i reckon they're very close in value to mounted realms, but theres so many items, banners and virtues that don't work with foot knights, and character mounts provide a lot of power for the combat characters.
37:21 I think a lot of people were confused about this with lances at the start as well. They should almost cause impact hits rather than their current bonus, because seeing a Bret lord make 5 lance attacks just seems.... weird. You couch the lance, you dont swing or stab with it. Could definitely see a lance overhaul all together, bringing them more in line with what you're saying here. Also, impact hits don't work within a certain distance iirc, so in FBIGO wars, they wouldn't trigger sometimes. might go a way to fixing that too.
Yeees Skinks! MVP of my force! Really interesting to hear the discussions on the TK infantry
Hey lads you missed Witch Elves for DE. They are amazing in mass
I am very happy that you 2 guys made this! Thank you. As a long time dark elf player that uses infantry and tries to make infantry work in TOW, please allow me to present a few thoughts on elven infantry in general and dark elf infantry in particular. In general, as you said, spear elves are good, I field a unit of 25 as bodyguard for my lvl4. I can't say the same for the elite units because they are overpriced t3 infantry. It is too costly to field a block of 20-25 of them as they die from magic and shooting. and believe me they will be the prime recipients of this. They will also die from Stomps and impact hits. Simply put, they are too costly for what they can do. Make them 13 points each and you will see a lot more elven elites on the table top. Or boost them with banners that increase their movement, their charge, that gives them fly etc, or rules like vanguard to be able to get them into combat fast. Now going to dark elves in particular, what should be mentioned a lot more is the unit of 20-25 witch elves with banner of har ganeth and joined by a hag with ogre blade and rune of khaine. for 11 points each, they have 2 attacks, frenzy, poison and horde. the hag has always strike first and a ton of attacks with hatred in the first round. It is not very funny when whatever dragon gets into challenge with the hag gets hit by 5-7 ws 7 attacks with hatred. The hag will probably die, but at the CR you get to add the wounds she did, the banner and the 3 ranks from the witches.
Glad you enjoyed the vid mate!
I've just copied and pasted this to Phil as hell find it super useful (who has played DE on the channel a bit) glad theres support for the spearmen meta!
@@BearfootMiniatures my regards to Phil. If I remembered correctly, one year ago you and him did a video dedicated to the Dark Elves :). I still have that bookmarked.
really enjoyable view thanks.
About the empire infantry, they can get inmune to psycology if the infantry is joined by an engineer and there is a warmachine on its command range, using the new nulns list. So, what about a 40 strong halberdier unit with general and engineer with 2 detachments of 10 hangunners? They could get hold the line, rallying cry and inmune to psycology
Not a bad shout for that list, not one that id considered before, good spot!
Do.not.sleep.on.Black.Guards. Led by a Dreadlord, they are tough...
Beastmen infantry are very playable. I'm running a horde army, 140 wounds or so at 2k. A brick of 20 Gor Ambushing in on a flank is a real problem. Open Order and Ambush is huge for that pivot. Harpies are fabulous. The army is balanced around being deadly on their own turn and vulnerable on the enemy turn, a glass jaw. Bestigor are underrated, a brick of 30 with heroes in is a tremendous problem. If they had move through cover I think it would make them perfect for the cost. 10 ungor with bows have the mass to take out 5 man basic knights.
glad to hear it works, ive been throwing around a list (not for super competitive games, just channel games) Ill paste it in a sec if you dont mind giving me thoughts!
Beastmen Brayherds draft
Beastmen Brayherds
1,906
Wargor 101
Mangelder, heavy armour, shield
Wargor 184
Slug-skin, Horn of the First Beast, Armour of Meteoric Iron, Battle Standard Bearer, great weapon
Gorebull 145
great weapon, heavy armour, shield
Bray-Shaman 125
Hagtree Fetish, Level 2 Wizard
21 Gors 185
True-horn (great weapon), standard bearer, musician, Ambushers, additional hand weapons
5 Chaos Warhounds 30
Tuskgor Chariot 85
27 Bestigors 450
Gouge-horn, standard bearer (Banner of Outrage), musician, Stubborn, Veteran
33 Gors 248
True-horn (great weapon), standard bearer, musician, additional hand weapons
3 Minotaurs 177
Bloodkine, standard bearer, musician, 3× great weapon, 3× shield
Razorgor Chariot 120
Dragon Ogre 56
So it looks like a general pressure list where you're gonna run headlong at your opponent and hope you have the mass to crush them when you get there. I wonder if you're spreading your heroes a bit thin, a 4+ save isn't much. If you have Mangelder I usually want to put it with the Manbane Totem for a -3 leadership in combat.
Here's what I've been running. Sometimes I swap the Minos and Warhounds for 2x3 dragon ogres. Both heroes go in the bestigor brick making it -1 to be hit at all times and Magic Resist(2), 8x4 wide. Everything else operates to support the big brick, ambushing and scouting and vanguarding with a surprising amount of ranged pressure.
===
Beastmen Brayherds [1999 pts]
Warhammer: The Old World, Beastmen Brayherds
===
++ Characters [479 pts] ++
Beastlord [219 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Heavy armour
- General
- On foot
- Pelt of the Dark Young
- Enchanted Shield
- Gnarled Hide
- Pelt of Midnight
Great Bray-Shaman [260 pts]
- Braystaff
- Level 4 Wizard
- On foot
- Talisman of Protection
- Slug-skin
- Daemonology
++ Core Units [868 pts] ++
30 Bestigor Herd [440 pts]
- Heavy armour
- Stubborn
- Gouge-horn [Great weapon]
- Standard bearer
- Musician
20 Gor Herd [177 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Additional hand weapons
- Ambushers
- True-horn [Great weapon]
- Standard bearer
- Musician
10 Ungor Herd [67 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Shield
- Ambushers
- Half-horn
10 Ungor Herd [57 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Shield
- Half-horn
10 Ungor Herd [57 pts]
- Hand weapons
- Shield
- Half-horn
5 Chaos Warhounds [35 pts]
- Hand weapons (Claws and fangs)
- Vanguard
5 Chaos Warhounds [35 pts]
- Hand weapons (Claws and fangs)
- Vanguard
++ Special Units [437 pts] ++
5 Harpies [55 pts]
- Hand weapons (claws)
5 Harpies [55 pts]
- Hand weapons (claws)
3 Minotaur Herd [174 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Light armour
- 3x Great weapon
- Ambushers
- Bloodkine
- Musician
3 Minotaur Herd [153 pts]
- Hand weapon
- Light armour
- 3x Shield
- Bloodkine
++ Rare Units [215 pts] ++
Cygor [215 pts]
- Hand weapon (claws)
- Hurl attack
- Light armour (calloused hide)
---
Created with "Old World Builder"
[old-world-builder.com]
Ungors should have shortbows*
Well, I just finished painting an 80s and 90s only metal ogre army so I don't have the option of anything other than infantry. My Chaos army is mostly infantry too. I just use what I think looks cool and damn the consequences. Nice to see each of those armies don't have bad ratings though.
Mate sounds like your doing your armies in the best way anyway, taking what you want to take!
Can you really put other units in between individuals of a skirmisher unit?
The deathstar build with ogre bulls or ironguts is too underrated, even by the people who acknowledge it and like it. T4/5, A3/4 per base, triple save, M6, your choice of fantastic banners. If you put your tyrant in the unit instead of on a behemoth then you'll have no damage output problem running the cheaper bulls over ironguts.
mate 100% agree on that one: In the high elf game on the channel I ran a gut star and it was mentally good
Fun video thanks guys
Glad you enjoyed it mate!
How can Spear Men be mindblowing good? WS4, S3 no AP. T3 with a 5+ armour save. They will be absolutely molded by almost everything and do nothing for you.
its not that they will dominate, they just get shat on far too much I think, particularly the Elf ones striking so fast
If you count Gutter Runners as infantry, then Skaven can't be that low on the list. If you're jumping around out of sight with GRs and using poison-throwing weapons, they'll eat most of the units on the list for breakfast.
Did you consider teutogen guard at all in the empire infantry?
Ive used them a couple of times (literally 2), atm I find them definitely better than other empire infantry, but not combatting of the problems that empire infantry has (getting FBIGO rolled, which seems to be my new catch phrase when talking empire atm...)
mate im even painting up flagellants frantically to see if I can make a "classic" empire army work (state troops holding the line and rifles and arty support)
I have a slaanesh only army and forsaken are indeed brilliant
monogod: the connoisseurs choice! They completely slipped my mind (despite using them most chaos games I play)... maybe ive not played Chaos in too long!
Fanatics can't be targeted?
ow you tell me. My boy got skewered by Dark elf bolts last night. I thought he could be shot.
Dawi likes footknights over cavalry who saw that coming 😅
I know, the sky is falling and I think I feel the ground getting cold as hell freezes over
Foot knights are so cool. But the army is definitely not designed to support them. So many items, virtues or banners require the model to be mounted, it makes sense, but it's a blow against the foot knights.
High elf infantry A tier? LOL. Sisters are great, easy S tier. Swordmasters ok but more like B tier. Could work with walk between worlds, but they cannot cast it AND charge. White lions are 14p for a t3 elf, 5+ save ASL, yeah they are never hitting back. D tier. Phoenix guard could make a decent defensive formation, but they lack output to threaten high T/high armour stuff. Prob B-tier .Shadow warriors, a s3 bowshot, no ap for 14p each, dwarf rangers just better unit for 11p each, C tier. The spearmen is.. just not good at all. They die like flies vs shooting, they die even worse in hth, more like a free points donation for the enemy. They dont offer much more than a goblin for 3x the cost. D tier. All in all High Elf maybe B if you are generous. Richy since you clearly are a great player, play a high elf infantry list and prove that they belong in A tier ;D
dont tempt him! though I do want to see a high elf infantry army rocking about.... infact ye ill tell him he needs to!
Unfortunately everything you say is true. From a high elf player. ASF was nice and made them a tad better. Plenty of friends said it was game breaking but once they played a few games they figured out it was really not that great.
The fact that dark dark dark shards and any basic wood elf are better than high elf archers. Sea Guards are okay, but not really worthwhile for the price you pay.
It's sad that cavalry have been added to made their core worth it .. which makes them just a copy of Empire knights.
Look at the tier list again, high elves are bottom of A tier, look at the armies above them, and the armies below them. Rather than saying HE are worse than goblins and therefore D tier? Look at a D tier army and actually see if they belong there … they’re definitely above lizardmen and dark elves, who are in B and C. Being worse than S tier infantry doesn’t make you D tier. I understand that there are lots of bad choices in your infantry roster, but we don’t drop brettonian cavalry a tier because they have errants and questing knights in their roster.
On the one hand, yes, how could one call high elf infantry A tier!?
On the other hand, no one can win many games running mostly infantry and we are only comparing infantry to other infantry. I would place high elf infantry in the middle of the pack...
So, I think it's ok to call high elves an a tier infantry army but still not be able to win games with high elf infantry.... i would place them top of B, which is kind of the same spot...
@@buchnejf i agree, i don't think there's an army outside the undead armies, dwarves and goblins that can win with just infantry focus, the difference between S and A is very big.
Obviously elves
does anyone else think that skin wolves sounds sexual? Or I'm just perverted
Now you say it…
Ogre Bulls are fine.
In any other list they'd be a solid choice.
ye I agree really: a comparitive points ogre units does well against most other infantry
I was thinking specifically 3 ogre units (100pts about) being expected to run over 200+ point infantry units
Who has the best war beasts!
Ooooh not a bad idea for an under-explored topic!
💔 🐀
Mate: I feel for the verminhosts, theyre such a key army in WHFB (the MOST unique WHFB army i think) and theyve just lost out I think in this edition, im fingers and tail crossed for them to get updated
@BearfootMiniatures 100% and it's a damn shame love my little rat lads. Managed a few decent performances with them this year but it really took everything in the play book and a dose of luck to get there. If GW doesn't step up I have hope the wider community will implement something, ToW without Skaven just wouldn't be the same.
Still watching after 12 minutes button 👉
love it mate! glad you enjoyed it!
i think is imposible compare dwarf infantry to swordmasters or even bretonian men at arms and say that dwarfs are better. same points of swordmasters or men of arms win vs same amount of points of any dwarf unit allways
All infantry are equally terrible
Skeletons are great. Skeleton archers are fantastic
Noooo: some lists have loads of infantry in! EMPIRE infantry is terrible
@@scottmills4164 Skeletons are great if your opponent charges them
@@gemmell761 that's what the archers are for. Force them to fight
being terrible at an appropriate cost is a great quality to have.
High Elves are best at everything. Period.