🪴 🍋 GROW MEYER LEMON TREES FROM SEEDS🌳 Take the seeds from fresh 🍋lemons and plant them to grow 🪴 lemon trees. Step by step, it’s easy, and I share tips to get your seeds growing quickly into healthy trees you can grow in pots (or in the ground in warm climates) with extras to give as 🛍 gifts. Simple, fun project for the family. ➡ POTTED LEMON GROVE: GROW MEYER LEMON TREES FROM SEEDS chocolateboxcottage.tv/videos... ➡🕰 VIDEO OUTLINE: 0:00 Intro 1:38 Picking lemons 1:45 Nursery pot 3:04 Extracting whole seeds from lemons 4:27 Planting the seeds, label, and watering 5:39 Meyer lemon seedlings 6:02 When to expect fruit 6:13 Young potted lemon grove 6:51 Pretty pictures Considering a heavy duty stand mixer for bread dough? KITCHENAID VS BOSCH VS ANKARSRUM: BEST MIXER FOR BREAD DOUGH th-cam.com/video/aXueK7J6tp4/w-d-xo.html 🌸🏡🌸 Welcome to Chocolate Box Cottage, 🧁 the sweet spot between 🕰 old fashioned values, like gardening and cooking from scratch, and ✨ modern conveniences that make life easier. 🌼 If you’re looking to create your slice of country living with practicality and finesse, you’re in the right place! Find special recipes and simple gardening projects to make your home life more bountiful. 🌼 I’m a functional nutritional therapy practitioner, and have taught basic cooking, gardening, and homemaking skills to families for the last 20 years. Blessings, Michele ♥ FOLLOW CHOCOLATE BOX COTTAGE ON FACEBOOK! facebook.com/chocolatebox... ♥ JOIN THE CHOCOLATE BOX COTTAGE FACEBOOK GROUP! facebook.com/groups/52896... ♥ FIND ME ON MEWE! mewe.com/i/michelepryse ♥ FOLLOW CHOCOLATE BOX COTTAGE ON INSTAGRAM! instagram.com/chocolatebo... I invite you to visit my friends, over at their channels. Each one has something special to offer: 🐻Jackie at Little Country Cabin ~ th-cam.com/users/LittleCount... 🌿Donna at MissMagnoliasMoxie ~ th-cam.com/users/MissMagnoli... 🐶Mary at Mary’s Nest ~ th-cam.com/users/MarysNest ☕CeAnne at Farmhouse Teas ~ th-cam.com/users/FarmhouseTeas 🌻Josh and Carolyn at Homesteading Family ~ th-cam.com/users/Homesteadin... ⏩ COMING IN July 2022 🎥 Next Video: Berry Applesauce Fruit Leather - full tutorial Fruit Leather Troubleshooting Q & A
"Thank you. You had me at Lemon Curd. I planted some seeds and checked my process with your knowledge. I have 2 seeds that are now 6 inch tall baby trees and a new sprout that just popped. Now I've got 4 years to figure out how to make that curd while waiting for fruit." the Dude of Food
You have little lemon trees already, how fantastic! There is something uniquely satisfying about planting trees from seeds. It feels special. I have a recent video on making lemon curd. You'll want to "practice" with store-bought lemons before your lemon harvest, I am sure. I'll put the link here for you. Michele chocolateboxcottage.tv/videos/lemon-curd-ankarsrum-mixer/
Very informative! I love your gingham blouse, it was fun getting a little peek around your homestead. I bought a meyer lemon at my favorite local nursery a few months ago, it has set two fruit already! You have inspired me to up my "bunny berry" game. Currently mine are all stored in a big rolling garbage can that I drag around from one area to another ;0) I think mine needs some artwork.
What do the lemons taste like off the seed grown trees? Meyer Lemon is a cross between a citron and a tangerine so they don't grow true from seed that's why I wondered how they taste. Thanks
Hi Michelle that’s very good your lemons looks juicy enjoy your day right now we are expecting to be hit later tonight from a tropical storm to you and your family stay safe bye.
Came over from Marys Nest! I actually started a lemon tree from a Meyer Lemon that came off a friends tree! She did tell me that it might not turn out to be the same kind of Meyer lemon and I was wondering if yours have gotten big enough to produce fruit and if the fruit is different than the mother tree? New Subscriber!
Hi Mary, thanks for hopping over from Mary's Nest! The lemon tree in the teal pot is my oldest seedling. It is possible it won't be exactly the same as the parent tree, but it will be citrus so it will be usable. 🌸 Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage There is no way to know and likely VERY and wildly different fruits. Why don't you just root cuttings rather than giving away mystery citrus? Better yet if you like rooting citrus, root rootstock and graft to it.
How many years before they start producing? Do they eventually need to go into the ground at a certain height? If now what is the perm size pot u eventually want them in? Whiskey barrel?
Hi Karen, lemon trees can start producing fruit in 5 to 7 years. They do well in pots if your climate isn't right for planting in the ground. Growing in a pot slows them down and they will stay smaller that way. For comparison, I have a lemon tree that is about 10 years old and it has been in a 20-gallon pot for the last 4 years. ~Michele
New sub here! I'm not great at planting things and adhd makes it hard to remember things that require extensive planning and attention. Do you have tips on how to remember the timing and stages of what you're growing when everything has their own seasons to start?
Hi Lexi, if you're thinking of vegetable gardening, you might want to get Clyde's Garden Planner. It's a cardboard sleeve that slides to hone in on your particular climate zone and tells you when to plant what. So helpful! Let me grab a link for that. One side is for spring; flip it over for fall planting dates. 👩🏼🌾 Michele Here you go: www.rareseeds.com/clyde-s-garden-planner
I paid a lot for a tree and got a few lemons. Scale insects killed it, no matter what I did to try to stop it. I didn't know you can get a true Meyer lemon tree from seed!
I'm sorry to hear that. Scale insects are a challenge to get rid of. From what I understand, Meyer lemons are a stabilized cross that produces true from seeds. Blessings, Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage both the Meyer and the Ponderosa. Most lemons are either marginially polyembryonic or are monoembryonic (except several of the italian lemons, as well as the Eureka and Lisbon, which are polyembryonic.) So no, they will not produce true from seeds
Welcome! Good question. As ixchelkali said, they are self-pollinating. If you have two or more trees it will increase the number of pollinated blooms and you will get even more fruit. Blessings, Michele
I've seen some soak the seeds a few days, then take off the shell and just plant the inner seed can you just put the whole seed in instead as you did? Thanks
I don't if you'll find them in garden centers, but you may see bunny berries listed in local ads on Craigslist. They're usually quite reasonable. 🌸🪴 Michele
if i keep triming the tree will i be able to control that it doesnt grow to big? Thank you for this video , im really excited to plant meyer lemon and im also going to try plant the other acidic lemon i forgot the name.
Fruit trees grown in containers don't achieve full size. You can determine how large you want to to grow by limiting the pot size and by pruning as needed. They also grow more slowly in a pot. Best wishes on your lemon adventure! 🌸 Michele
I did this with a Texas sweet grapefruit and was delightfully surprised to have the seeds actually come up and I still have one. I gave the others away. I am concerned if it will get to be to keep in my house. Ive gotten kind of attached to it. Wondering also if its in a small pot, if it will ever actually produce fruit. Its 2 years old now.
If you don't see Meyer lemons in the grocery store, you can do this with regular lemons, limes, oranges, grapefruit. Just buy the fruit and take the seeds out. Plant them directly without drying first. I'm trying some blood oranges right now. 🍊🍋Michele
If you live in an area where citrus fruit is commercially grown and if you get the lemon from a backyard tree, you should make sure it was planted after 1975 to ensure that it's an Improved Meyer Lemon. Older Meyer trees can carry a virus, Citrus tristeza virus, which can spread to commercially grown citrus and wipe it out.
What cactus soil brand do you recommend? I too am not a fan of Miracle Grow, but that is all that is available in my area. Thank you for your tutorial.
Hi Jill, I don't have any potted cacti, so have never bought cactus soil. I would be hesitant to trust Miracle Gro for... well, anything. If you occasionally make a trip to another town for supplies maybe a stop at a plant nursery would yield something more suitable. Happy Easter weekend to you. Love, Michele
Okay curious why you say don't use miracle grow? I've always had really good luck with it in fact last year I went to the nursery and bought some fancy organic stuff and it was a 100% failure. Please enlighten me your thoughts on the miracle grow.
I used to work at a Grange Co-Op in the plant nursery. People would bring in dead and dying plants for my to diagnose and the first question I would ask is did you use Miracle Gro? Nine times out of 10 they did. You probably just used the potting soil. Most people think doubling up is even better so they use Miracle Gro potting soil and then add Miracle Gro fertilizer and 😵poof - dead plant. 🪴
Hi Janaki, I use a brand called Happy Frog with really good results. If you can find that, it would be good. But any organic potting soil will work. I would avoid Miracle Gro. ~Michele
Good question, Victoria. You will notice in the video I planted the seeds directly from the fruit, without letting them dry. You will get much better germination this way. No need to nick or scar the seeds. Blessings, Michele
I planted a few seeds about seven years ago and although the plant is beautiful I have never had and lemons. I put mine outside in the summer and take it inside in winter. I live in Winnipeg Manitoba Canada. Is there something I need to do to get it to flower?
Does it bloom? Meyer lemon trees can bloom anytime of the year, but their two main flowering seasons are spring and fall. Does it need to be repotted or fertilized, perhaps? 🍋 Michele
Sounds like you may have planted GMO seeds. I have a citrus tree that is 3 years old, sprouted from random store fruit and it tries to flower but then they dry up and fall off. Frustrating for sure. Thanks Monsanto which is now Bayer. 'the Dude of Food'
I used to work at a garden center. People would bring in dead and dying plants for diagnosis. Nine times out of ten they used Miracle Gro products. Miracle Gro is like meth for plants, it creates a dependency and when the "need" isn't met immediately, the plant dies. Michele
Those look like regular lemons, not Meyer lemons! Meyer lemons are a cross between a lemon and a tangerine, so they are smaller and orange, not yellow like a normal lemon, i think you have them mixed up! this is a helpful video on how to grow normal lemon trees though.
Some types of citrus may take longer than others, but I have not heard of any that take that long. Everything I have read says about 4 years. I have baby trees that are 2 and 3 years old so we'll see. The 3-year-old tree is a nice size, I wouldn't be surprised if it flowered in a year or so. 🍋Michele
it is considered a stable hybrid, meaning it has settled into predicable uniformity. I have stabilized quite a few vegetable varieties that were originally F1 hybrids, so I know it can be done. Besides, it's free and it's fun! ~ Michele
🪴 🍋 GROW MEYER LEMON TREES FROM SEEDS🌳
Take the seeds from fresh 🍋lemons and plant them to grow 🪴 lemon trees. Step by step, it’s easy, and I share tips to get your seeds growing quickly into healthy trees you can grow in pots (or in the ground in warm climates) with extras to give as 🛍 gifts. Simple, fun project for the family.
➡ POTTED LEMON GROVE: GROW MEYER LEMON TREES FROM SEEDS
chocolateboxcottage.tv/videos...
➡🕰 VIDEO OUTLINE:
0:00 Intro
1:38 Picking lemons
1:45 Nursery pot
3:04 Extracting whole seeds from lemons
4:27 Planting the seeds, label, and watering
5:39 Meyer lemon seedlings
6:02 When to expect fruit
6:13 Young potted lemon grove
6:51 Pretty pictures
Considering a heavy duty stand mixer for bread dough?
KITCHENAID VS BOSCH VS ANKARSRUM: BEST MIXER FOR BREAD DOUGH
th-cam.com/video/aXueK7J6tp4/w-d-xo.html
🌸🏡🌸 Welcome to Chocolate Box Cottage, 🧁 the sweet spot between 🕰 old fashioned values, like gardening and cooking from scratch, and ✨ modern conveniences that make life easier.
🌼 If you’re looking to create your slice of country living with practicality and finesse, you’re in the right place! Find special recipes and simple gardening projects to make your home life more bountiful.
🌼 I’m a functional nutritional therapy practitioner, and have taught basic cooking, gardening, and homemaking skills to families for the last 20 years.
Blessings,
Michele
♥ FOLLOW CHOCOLATE BOX COTTAGE ON FACEBOOK!
facebook.com/chocolatebox...
♥ JOIN THE CHOCOLATE BOX COTTAGE FACEBOOK GROUP! facebook.com/groups/52896...
♥ FIND ME ON MEWE!
mewe.com/i/michelepryse
♥ FOLLOW CHOCOLATE BOX COTTAGE ON INSTAGRAM!
instagram.com/chocolatebo...
I invite you to visit my friends, over at their channels. Each one has something special to offer:
🐻Jackie at Little Country Cabin ~ th-cam.com/users/LittleCount...
🌿Donna at MissMagnoliasMoxie ~ th-cam.com/users/MissMagnoli...
🐶Mary at Mary’s Nest ~ th-cam.com/users/MarysNest
☕CeAnne at Farmhouse Teas ~ th-cam.com/users/FarmhouseTeas
🌻Josh and Carolyn at Homesteading Family ~ th-cam.com/users/Homesteadin...
⏩ COMING IN July 2022
🎥 Next Video:
Berry Applesauce Fruit Leather - full tutorial
Fruit Leather Troubleshooting Q & A
"Thank you. You had me at Lemon Curd. I planted some seeds and checked my process with your knowledge. I have 2 seeds that are now 6 inch tall baby trees and a new sprout that just popped. Now I've got 4 years to figure out how to make that curd while waiting for fruit." the Dude of Food
You have little lemon trees already, how fantastic! There is something uniquely satisfying about planting trees from seeds. It feels special. I have a recent video on making lemon curd. You'll want to "practice" with store-bought lemons before your lemon harvest, I am sure. I'll put the link here for you. Michele chocolateboxcottage.tv/videos/lemon-curd-ankarsrum-mixer/
@@ChocolateBoxCottage Thank you Michele
Very informative! I love your gingham blouse, it was fun getting a little peek around your homestead. I bought a meyer lemon at my favorite local nursery a few months ago, it has set two fruit already! You have inspired me to up my "bunny berry" game. Currently mine are all stored in a big rolling garbage can that I drag around from one area to another ;0) I think mine needs some artwork.
8b here also so was excited to find you!
Yay! Welcome, Susan! 🌸🍋Michele
Love this video 🤣😄 Omgoodness, here I come 🍋🍋🍋💐🙏
🍓Have fun with it! Blessings, Michele
Here from Mary’s Nest. Subbed & psyched! Thank you!!
Welcome! So glad Mary sent you over. She's a sweetheart. Thank you for visiting and subscribing. Blessings, Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage
#SacredBlessings to you; it’s my pleasure to be here!
Thank you for your sharing your knowledge. I’m going to start planting some asap since it takes about 4 years to harvest them.
Wish I had a place to bring one inside here. Someday!!
I used to bring my bigger one inside over winter. Do you just not have the space? I can tell you they do alright in a house without a wood stove.
What do the lemons taste like off the seed grown trees? Meyer Lemon is a cross between a citron and a tangerine so they don't grow true from seed that's why I wondered how they taste. Thanks
I've often wanted a lemon tree in my bathtub,because we do not take baths so it really us a waste,we like showers, so I just may do this. Thanks
Now that's creative! 🍋
If you do, make sure to plan for lighting. Lemon Trees appreciate a lot of light.
Thank you for this wonderful information. Im going to start some right now. I loooooove lemons! God bless.
Wonderful! Have fun starting your potted lemon grove. 🍋Michele
Hi Michelle that’s very good your lemons looks juicy enjoy your day right now we are expecting to be hit later tonight from a tropical storm to you and your family stay safe bye.
Can I ask where you live? I pray you stay safe. ❤🙏🏼❤Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage Hi I’m from Trinidad 🇹🇹.
@@sandramahadeo4910 thank you - sending prayers to Trinidad. 🤗
@@ChocolateBoxCottage Thank you very much.
Wonderful tutorial!
Thank you! Blessings, Michele
So informative! Thank you!
You are so welcome! Thanks for stopping by, Laura. 🌷 Michele
Came over from Marys Nest! I actually started a lemon tree from a Meyer Lemon that came off a friends tree! She did tell me that it might not turn out to be the same kind of Meyer lemon and I was wondering if yours have gotten big enough to produce fruit and if the fruit is different than the mother tree? New Subscriber!
Hi Mary, thanks for hopping over from Mary's Nest! The lemon tree in the teal pot is my oldest seedling. It is possible it won't be exactly the same as the parent tree, but it will be citrus so it will be usable. 🌸 Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage There is no way to know and likely VERY and wildly different fruits. Why don't you just root cuttings rather than giving away mystery citrus? Better yet if you like rooting citrus, root rootstock and graft to it.
I have seeds from year, will I need to sit them in water before I plant. Thanks for the video.
Great help!
Glad to hear it! 🍋🌳
How many years before they start producing? Do they eventually need to go into the ground at a certain height? If now what is the perm size pot u eventually want them in? Whiskey barrel?
Hi Karen, lemon trees can start producing fruit in 5 to 7 years. They do well in pots if your climate isn't right for planting in the ground. Growing in a pot slows them down and they will stay smaller that way. For comparison, I have a lemon tree that is about 10 years old and it has been in a 20-gallon pot for the last 4 years. ~Michele
New sub here! I'm not great at planting things and adhd makes it hard to remember things that require extensive planning and attention. Do you have tips on how to remember the timing and stages of what you're growing when everything has their own seasons to start?
Hi Lexi, if you're thinking of vegetable gardening, you might want to get Clyde's Garden Planner. It's a cardboard sleeve that slides to hone in on your particular climate zone and tells you when to plant what. So helpful! Let me grab a link for that. One side is for spring; flip it over for fall planting dates. 👩🏼🌾 Michele
Here you go: www.rareseeds.com/clyde-s-garden-planner
@@ChocolateBoxCottage thank you! I'll definitely give it a go! 😁
I paid a lot for a tree and got a few lemons. Scale insects killed it, no matter what I did to try to stop it. I didn't know you can get a true Meyer lemon tree from seed!
I'm sorry to hear that. Scale insects are a challenge to get rid of. From what I understand, Meyer lemons are a stabilized cross that produces true from seeds. Blessings, Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage both the Meyer and the Ponderosa. Most lemons are either marginially polyembryonic or are monoembryonic (except several of the italian lemons, as well as the Eureka and Lisbon, which are polyembryonic.) So no, they will not produce true from seeds
New to your community - "sent" by Mary's Nest. Informative video; do these lemon trees need to cross pollinate?
No, Meyer lemons are self-pollinating.
Welcome! Good question. As ixchelkali said, they are self-pollinating. If you have two or more trees it will increase the number of pollinated blooms and you will get even more fruit. Blessings, Michele
I've seen some soak the seeds a few days, then take off the shell and just plant the inner seed can you just put the whole seed in instead as you did? Thanks
I have never peeled the seeds and they germinate and grow fine for me. 🍀🍋 Michele
Can you buy bunny berries, it sounds good to use? Thanks
I don't if you'll find them in garden centers, but you may see bunny berries listed in local ads on Craigslist. They're usually quite reasonable. 🌸🪴 Michele
Thank you for your reply, most don't I appreciate your time so much!
if i keep triming the tree will i be able to control that it doesnt grow to big? Thank you for this video , im really excited to plant meyer lemon and im also going to try plant the other acidic lemon i forgot the name.
Fruit trees grown in containers don't achieve full size. You can determine how large you want to to grow by limiting the pot size and by pruning as needed. They also grow more slowly in a pot. Best wishes on your lemon adventure! 🌸 Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage thank you so much i didnt know that, im really excited to try this out
How long do you keep them in the 4" pot?
I did this with a Texas sweet grapefruit and was delightfully surprised to have the seeds actually come up and I still have one. I gave the others away. I am concerned if it will get to be to keep in my house. Ive gotten kind of attached to it. Wondering also if its in a small pot, if it will ever actually produce fruit. Its 2 years old now.
Hi Sherry, the pot will limit its growth. Be sure to up-pot your grapefruit tree as needed.
@@ChocolateBoxCottage thankyou.
Where is the best place to get the Meyer seeds from?
If you don't see Meyer lemons in the grocery store, you can do this with regular lemons, limes, oranges, grapefruit. Just buy the fruit and take the seeds out. Plant them directly without drying first. I'm trying some blood oranges right now. 🍊🍋Michele
If you live in an area where citrus fruit is commercially grown and if you get the lemon from a backyard tree, you should make sure it was planted after 1975 to ensure that it's an Improved Meyer Lemon. Older Meyer trees can carry a virus, Citrus tristeza virus, which can spread to commercially grown citrus and wipe it out.
What cactus soil brand do you recommend? I too am not a fan of Miracle Grow, but that is all that is available in my area.
Thank you for your tutorial.
Hi Jill, I don't have any potted cacti, so have never bought cactus soil. I would be hesitant to trust Miracle Gro for... well, anything. If you occasionally make a trip to another town for supplies maybe a stop at a plant nursery would yield something more suitable. Happy Easter weekend to you. Love, Michele
Okay curious why you say don't use miracle grow? I've always had really good luck with it in fact last year I went to the nursery and bought some fancy organic stuff and it was a 100% failure. Please enlighten me your thoughts on the miracle grow.
I used to work at a Grange Co-Op in the plant nursery. People would bring in dead and dying plants for my to diagnose and the first question I would ask is did you use Miracle Gro? Nine times out of 10 they did. You probably just used the potting soil. Most people think doubling up is even better so they use Miracle Gro potting soil and then add Miracle Gro fertilizer and 😵poof - dead plant. 🪴
@@ChocolateBoxCottage over fertilizing them obviously because the instructions State very clearly that it's already got fertilizer in it.
@@susanturner1171 yes, you'd be surprised how few people read the directions.
Thank you for sharing. I am an aspirational gardener. Could you recommend a good quality potting soil?
Hi Janaki, I use a brand called Happy Frog with really good results. If you can find that, it would be good. But any organic potting soil will work. I would avoid Miracle Gro. ~Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage thank you for the tip!
Do you treat the seed before planting? It has a very hard shell. Scarification?
Good question, Victoria. You will notice in the video I planted the seeds directly from the fruit, without letting them dry. You will get much better germination this way. No need to nick or scar the seeds. Blessings, Michele
I planted a few seeds about seven years ago and although the plant is beautiful I have never had and lemons. I put mine outside in the summer and take it inside in winter. I live in Winnipeg Manitoba Canada. Is there something I need to do to get it to flower?
Does it bloom? Meyer lemon trees can bloom anytime of the year, but their two main flowering seasons are spring and fall.
Does it need to be repotted or fertilized, perhaps?
🍋 Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage It has never bloomed and I have repotted it maybe I've been using the wrong type of fertilizer.
Sounds like you may have planted GMO seeds. I have a citrus tree that is 3 years old, sprouted from random store fruit and it tries to flower but then they dry up and fall off. Frustrating for sure. Thanks Monsanto which is now Bayer. 'the Dude of Food'
Will non Meyer lemons work as well?
Yes! You can plant seeds from regular lemons, oranges, grapefruit, and limes too. 🙂Michele
I read n heard u cannot propagate Meyer lemon thru seeds cuz they're Hybrid.
Hi Jody, Meyer lemons are a stabilized hybrid so they do produce offspring pretty close to the parent plant. Try it and see! 🙂 Michele
Why not use Miracle Gro?
I used to work at a garden center. People would bring in dead and dying plants for diagnosis. Nine times out of ten they used Miracle Gro products. Miracle Gro is like meth for plants, it creates a dependency and when the "need" isn't met immediately, the plant dies. Michele
What’s in it that causes this depenency?
i just eat them like an orange and spit the seeds out lol
Those look like regular lemons, not Meyer lemons! Meyer lemons are a cross between a lemon and a tangerine, so they are smaller and orange, not yellow like a normal lemon, i think you have them mixed up! this is a helpful video on how to grow normal lemon trees though.
I thought it takes 10years from lemon seeds to fruit …
Some types of citrus may take longer than others, but I have not heard of any that take that long. Everything I have read says about 4 years. I have baby trees that are 2 and 3 years old so we'll see. The 3-year-old tree is a nice size, I wouldn't be surprised if it flowered in a year or so. 🍋Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage 🙏
Being that a meyer lemon is a hybrid you cannot really grow it from seed true to type.
it is considered a stable hybrid, meaning it has settled into predicable uniformity. I have stabilized quite a few vegetable varieties that were originally F1 hybrids, so I know it can be done. Besides, it's free and it's fun! ~ Michele
@@ChocolateBoxCottage i agree it’s fun. I grow from seed when I can but if you want a true meyer lemon seed is not the way to go.