The way I've come to understand it: Armored Core 1-2AA are the same universe, even in armored core 1 there is significant space travel involved in the story, this carries on with project phantasma and master of arena talking less about the space travel themes but then once 2 came around it implies that humanity finally began seriously colonizing mars and encountering martian mecha gone feral. AC2:AA is basically immediately after 2 from earth's perspective as you encounter and fight some "top pilots" from mars as an earth raven. After 2 AA, i believe the series has it's first genuine timeline reboot where nothing before AC3 has anything to do with AC3 and onward. Armored core 3-Last raven are all obviously part of the same universe as they make references to events of the previous GEN3 games in every gen 3 game after 3. Armored core 4 is an interesting one because in the teaser trailer featuring noblesse oblige you can clearly see Noblesse obliterating a squad of grey-painted Gen3 Test-garage ACs (such as from Armored Core Last Raven only not painted orange) that have the 12-lock missile launcher from GEN 3 instead of the beginner 2 lock missile. Which is why I believe that AC4 is NOT the first game in their chronological timeline. However given that nobless oblige was fighting GEN 3 beginner ACs, this leads me to believe that Generation 3 and 4 are the same timeline and that Next ACs were the following evolutionary stage of Armored Cores, (after Nexts became more commonplace I believe that Normals began to be designed to more resemble certain next archetypes rather than continuing to make normals look and perform like GEN 3 ACs.) Another reason I believe normals ended up looking the way they did is because after the invention of nexts, the real-deal AC pilots moved on from normals to nexts and since there were no remaining skilled normal pilots with unique part combinations and lethal weapon loadouts, normals became the mass-produced grunt-soldiers and cannon fodder of GEN4. (presumably if there were any MTs left in GEN 4 they were strictly used for construction purposes as considering how poorly MTs fared against even normal ACs in the past, people probably just stopped trying to make Combat MTs as ACs, even normals, were always more suited for the job of combat.) ACFA obviously immediately follows 4 and Generation 5 [Spoilers].... ...Is basically the super-future result of the events in generation 4 as is evidenced by VDs final boss being a black redesign of FA's White glint, and having multiple maps with various stages of different spirit of motherwill arms forts stages of degredation. So long story short, IMO all armored core games were in fact released chronologically and the only genuine reboot that happened in the series was between generation two and three having Gens 1 and 2 being part of the same universe and gens 3 through 5 being part of the same separate universe.
There is actually a link between third generation and earlier. after defeating nineball in nine breaker they mention it to be a replica of an "enigma from the past". so the only lin k that is actually missing is from gen 4 to earlier.
In armored core v, you play as the Dark Raven. Verdict day seems to go forward a hundred years or so and White Glint's armored core was salvaged and was pieced back together.
yeah,but its more likely that they just reverse engineered what was left of white glint as they do not know how to nor do they have the parts to repair it.the new 'black glint' was way weaker than white glint as it was defeated by what was basically a souped up normal. We know that 'black glint' was reverse engineered from a next as it has assault armor and kojima particles,all economic war tech
@@oxide___ Oh dang, that's pretty cool. In that case, that's even more dangerous because they could essentially mass produce these things. They have the means and the resources.
As an old 1997 AC player, I can certainly say this is a very good setup for the different possible timelines. I think at one point FROM may have been trying tie in all of the games with their lore, but sadly it never really panned out, or was too vague with many plot holes for most players to care about. Thanks for making this man. You made an old grizzled Raven happy.
I believe it is localization problem, this has been a thing ever since the King's Field games even up to the recent FromSoft games, which in my opinion left a lot of details rather vague and hard to follow.
This is a fantastic theory! But it should be noted that 2 and 2AA do NOT take place at the same time. The manual even states, it was about 5-7 year's difference.
ACV and ACVD happens when the ORCA ending happened, at some point at ACVD or ACV you can see some cradles and armsforts downed on the surface and lots of stuff that were in generation 4
Hard to say since what about Kojima Particles? Did the corporations really agreed with no fingers crossing behind their back that no one would make more?
I've been pitching a similar theory for a while now, though with a different timeline split. -So for 4/FA, thought exactly the same thing... -Then 5th gen takes place, it has the cradles and Motherwill's remains around, with old technilogy being housed in towers. in 5 they turn that tech around for a revolution, but by VD someone has full control of the old machines, resulting in an ending which seems to imply that while humanity will keep fighting, the machines will keep coming in new and scarier forms, AKA the online portion of the game. -From there, people have no choice but to go underground. People end up going into hiding. In order to keep things stable, they make an AI to police itself in a way. One part controls production and keeps things running, while the other, NB, keeps any faction or individual from getting too powerful. That's why You still have to break a computer even after breaking NB in AC1. -The way I see it, the split happens at this point. In AC1-2AA, NB takes control of the Controller, using it to police the world. When he's killed off, the old discoveries come flooding in, and things go back to corporate/government squabbling, as You said. Parts and tech are slowly added and introduced. -The alternative is that the Controller wins out for AC3. It immediately allows for upgrades to existing machines based on what's available, and generally seems to keep a relative peace until it starts going corrupt and breaks. - From there, Silent Line takes place with humanity mostly just dealing with the old world weapons that are still hanging about, and fighting each other. I like to think that IBIS was a defunct old version of NB just trying to keep control of things without any true means to do so. - In Nexus, the internecine gets accidentally disturbed, and we get to see what NB was up to after he had been isolated at the start, which in this case, was studying and amassing units. With his frame destroyed in Nexus, the machines turn aggressive in defense, destroying most of the world. Meanwhile NB is still studying and assembling new frames for himself, sending test versions out into the field to collect more data. As I see it, the Final Pulverizer is just the final version that he made for himself with the tweaks that came from that last hover fight. - So, when the FP is destroyed, both AIs are dead, and NB happens during this peace time, hoping to develop a more efficient training program, as opposed to the randomly skilled pilots from before, in an effort to combat future AI incursions. - Also, the Formula Front arena becomes super popular because dang it, people want to just calm down and watch some sports after all that crap! - Bonus thing here, manufacturing processes getting lax after the relative peace of SL-NX could be a reason why we went from mass amounts of experimental weapons in SL to massive cheap downgrades in NX-LR. Cheap manufacturing for more profit at the cost of overheating ACs seems right on the money for the kind of petty stuff we see in NX. By LR they are forced to improve, with the original models basically being ignored in NX, and lost by LR. By that point they probably had the general ideas back, and were able to make some tweaks, but no longer had access to some materials that would allow for better cooling performance. As a result, they found ways to tweak the AC frame to compensate. Overthinking is fun =-D Thanks for the video!
The official scale model kits put AC1 through 3 ACs just a head shorter than NEXTs, so around 8 to 9m. The only exception is the Nineball Seraph which is quite large even for NEXTs, probably close to 13 or 14m. That makes them notably taller than the ACV ACs.
I legit appreciate your thoughts on the storyline and lore of the games. I'm going through the lore my self, partly to gather info for story writing, and came across your video first. I followed your assessment of the plot lines and they make sense in terms of logical flow. The idea of multiple endings sounds about right, considering From Soft seems to like this idea by giving the player their own story to play; the Souls games have a non-liner kind of canonical plot that can only be pieced together in a similar fashion as you have here, and even then there's open-ended aspects with no real closure. I'd say its easier to build a story that lacks closure and has multiple endings, and is more fun for a game more so than a linear story. Thanks again for the video :) I'm excited for the new AC game coming out in the next couple of years, i've really been dying for a solid mecha game.
AC2AA takes place some point shortly after AC2. my evidence? Balena and Zeo Matrix were neutered _BIG TIME_ (Balena by the earth government due to trying to game the Frightener/Klein incident to become the dominant power on Mars, and Zeo Matrix by the loss of their Mars division) and several of their mission briefings mention regaining lost power. If I had to guess, it's probably within a year or two of said incident.
Now that I think of it, you do see the ruins of the Cradles in 5 (or Verdict day, I don't exactly remember), and let's just say that by the look of it, it was more of a crash than a landing. Makes me think that the destruction ending of AcFa led to AC5.
It would make sense that AC4 is the start of the whole timeline theory. One thing you can also bring up was that AC4 takes place directly after the National Dismantlement War, leaving governments to dust and is the true beginning of corporate reign.
Hmm, this is really interesting! I never really tried to piece the timelines together myself, and always just took it at face value that the generations of games just had their own separate timelines; which is what I still am going by, when I do think about the story-lines, but your theories are fairly plausible as well, I think.
Always have this itching feeling that the orca route I pick in for answer leads into armored core 2. Giving that this a theory, I would like to keep this in my personal head canon.
Hey TBM, nice theory, but it is actually possibly that V-VD take place before AC1. It is actually hinted at, for example: On the final mission of V, Carol (an AI) talks about creating a complete program and that it would take time, and of course the final mission is numbered 09. Later on in VD, a human turned AI named The Foundation Man (or Isaac) used a very similar tactic to Nine-Ball, and killed anyone with potential. In the ending of the game, weapons of mass destruction are unleashed upon the world and will not stop until all is in ruin, and you (The Lone Mercenary) work along side Fatman (your operator) to destroy all of these weapons. Unfortunately, the Corporations decide to go to war with one-another again, leaving you on your own. It is possible whether you succeed or not determines the ending: AC1 if you succeed, or AC3 if you fail. If you succeed, Carol and Chief have enough time to create the Hustler-One program. If you fail, Carol and Chief have to take matters in their own hands, and in order to protect mankind, create the Controller. Unfortunately, it seems like someone (probably Chief) put in a program where once mankind was back on its feet, The Controller would "malfunction", and you know what happens from there. Unfortunately, I just can't find where Justice fits into this for the life of me.
Agreed, hopefully we will find an answer someday though seeing as how From Software is middle name is "Ambiguous", I doubt we will ever know. Honestly though, I just hope we get a sequel to Last Raven.
I have to agree having played since I was 5 years old from the original....if people just briefly keep an open mind and discard the meaning of Nexts this timeline can really seem plausible and it makes immense sense when you go from Lynx to Orcas to Ravens
My theory is that Chief, J, and Carol from 5 and VD respectfully are the first AIs in the timeline, they were left by the corporations to stop any potential dominants from rising up after the Raven from 4A destroyed everything, which is why the Reapers are rigging matches against the Raven in VD, first to see if he truly was a dominant, then moving on to actively trying to kill him once it becomes clear that he is indeed a dominant.
I remember hearing that white Glint is actually the mercenary you play as in AC4. That he took on the title after Joshua died. Also Dark Glint in ACVD is supposedly a clone of Joshua. On another note, AC For Answer is my favorite. It made me feel super powerful, especially after being a pint size mech in V and VD.
I heard the next Armored core game will be loosely based around dark souls. I'm thinking it will take place in the towers after ACVD. It will likely be a survival scenario against the technology of the old word, dating back to AC4 and ACFA. Doing this would explain the final boss and the broken down arms forts present in the game. The towers are said to be advanced and the autonomous arms serve as a major threat throughout the game. These strangely advanced enemies will likely be the enemies in the next game, and it would make for a good difficulty curve due to the dark aged ACs you control in the newest games. Fatman, one of the characters promises to take down the towers after the final fight, so I think it's reasonable for the story to lead there.
Yes, AC4 and AC5 is connected, because of the the main boss of Verdict Day. It is a Next with primal and assault armor and you have to defeat it with just a normal. But it's really hard to continue the story back to the previous games. I think yes, your right, humanity could make next like ACs without the particles, but the AC5 ACs can use massive weapons what only a next could use right. Well, maybe because it puts so much strain on the mech, they got rid of the idea, and made mechs for greater lifespans because of the decreasing resources. By the way, I think the destruction path is really the cannon not just a split timeline. Let's say, you're the guy who we must kill in Verdict Day, gone mad from all the killing. After Verdict day the war still waged on, but eventually everybody gave up and they went underground, and laid their lifes in AI god's hands. But I tought that Last Raven is the real ending. It even has it in it's name, so why not, at least on Earth. AC2 shows that war goes on on Mars sadly
Actually the most expansive storyline of Armored Core is the AC3 generation since it has the most games and established canon other than the original and later on the AC4 to ACV series. AC1 to AC2AA are tied. Human Plus are basically cultivators in ACVD which are cloned humans of pilots from another era (AC4). Chief was an AI apparently who oversaw humanity for ????? reasons. The real question is what is the Controller (Dove) and how does it tie to if at all Nine Ball. Here's a hint: it doesn't. The original Japanese version of Nexus' final boss was not Nine Ball. It was a battle MT discovered by Navis who were originally developing their own series of battle MTs using the technology they discovered at some unexplored region (hence why everyone was up their ass the entire game of Nexus). The boss itself had the name text of ??????. It was in the American localization is when they gave him the name Nine Ball for no other reason than to brand the pilot name for the already announced and upcoming game Nine Breaker. There's two main stories that diverge from each other. Unless AC3 actually comes first that leads to AC4 to AC5 then back to AC1 and AC2AA is the finale.
Damn I wish ps5 had armored core. 4 answer was the perfect balance of movement and speed of the game. Nexts were so fun to dash around... If they built on that with something like the frostbite engine of dice, environmental destruction would be so cool. Even if they had something like a zoids cross over. Having sniper tigers and flying mechs. This game series was my childhood
Well hope is not lost, fellow Raven. Funny story, the lead dev from all the ps2 AC series was very unhappy with the de evolution direction the series wanted to go from AC4FA into AC5 and Verdict Day. So he quit, and 3/4 of the AC dev team quit with him. Which is why the 5 era feels so lackluster. So, they all quit From Soft and made their owb company, called First Studio, and released Daemon X Machina which is the true soul successor to the AC series and an evolution from AC4FA. Now, its only for Switch and PC, but it did so well they confirmed a DxM 2 on their 2nd anniversary. So theres a chance DxM 2 could be for ps5 too.
@@lukefinley6660 I've finished DxM, but it still lack something. The gameplay is nice but I wish the lore and universe is similar to Armored core. It's too cartonish compared to serious AC series
@@lueqmanmasduki6028 Yes i agree with this, i think its mainly in part to the studio having to start from scratch, and their main publisher mostly does anime stuff in japan. Although, based on a newer series from them, Akudama Drive, they are capable of deep, dark, and gory story that would work much better than the more cartoony style they went with for DxM. Also though, the game was mainly only targeted at Japan and was way better accepted there, story too, and overall sold 5 times more copies than they expected worldwide. I really hope they take the story seriously for DxM 2, which they confirmed last year. The story is one of the things they gutted from AC and VD that i really missed.
I had the same theory that armored core 4 took place before armored core. And i even have a theory that chrome hounds is a prequel to all the armored core games 😂
So is armored core 6 a ending unification or the true begining of all the time lines? Looks like in the trailer that the ACs have every peice of technology from every armored core game. Everything from kojima tech weapons, next primal/assault armor, MTs, arm projector sheilds, V styled armored cores, mega cities, pulverizer units, etc. Plus it looks like the great destruction was a massive solar flare or kojima super weapon that went off and scorched the earth causing a nuclear winter, so it looks like we may have to worry about our ACs freezing over.
I myself don't really think that connecting all of the games into one timeline is that good of an idea. Look at the Legend of Zelda Timeline, its a garbled mess. Ever Since AC3, Armored core has always had separate timelines. The Gen 1-2 Timeline, including AC1, PP, MOA, AC2, and AC2:AA. The Gen 3 Tineline, which includes AC3, AC:SL, AC:N, AC:LR. Formula Front and Ninebreaker are standalone games, and aren't connected to the main timeline. The Gen 4 Timelin, which includes AC4, AC:FA, ACV and ACVD. Personally, trying to connect them all together is a fruitless endeavor, that just creates more drama more than anything else. Still a fun video though.
It maybe a theory, but I have to say, it was well thought out, well put together, I've played every ps2/psp/ps3 title and tho the "story" or lore of the game is just abstract to soooo many, I've found this worth 100% sorta wish it was longer, but its the AC story...there's like not really enough to go on about timeline wise o,O
I heard once that it's similar to dark souls in that the timeline is convoluted including hearing people who worked on Dark souls say it could be a connected universe which in a way I agree with your theory aside from one thing which was that I'm not sure if it was meantioned below, but there is one major hole in your theory. They test the "NEXT", primal armor generators in a mission in Silent line. Although I'd like to think something that meshes my statement and your timeline theory together in that, what if time actually keeps looping around over and over in some hellish purgatory. That would be really insane, the ever turning cogs of war burning the planet to ash.
3:16 AC1 cores where also around 10 meters tall, Not sure where that artist got his rendition from but there are several instances of you being able to compare the core to vehicles and street lights and such, Just a little nitpick outside of that i do enjoy AC theory.
Also, that ACFA/AC5/AC1 size comparison chart is wrong. Gen5 ACs are generally the shortest not only because of their size but because of their posture, AC1 ACs were slightly larger, and GEN4 ACs being the largest (but not by much because even normals in GEN 4 were the same size as your next if you took the time to stand beside them.)
The Ne'er-do-well the Gen 4 to Gen 5 comparison is right, but the Gen 1 comparison is definitely wrong. I guess that's why most results I found of that pic had the Gen 1 part cropped out.
The Normals's official height is 7m, so they are still taller than Gen 5 mechs. And while the official height of a Next is 10m, they realistically look closer to 15.
I highly disagree with this. There is a trailer showing a human size comparison for AC3 Armored cores. It shows the pilot standing next to it's AC's head, he is about 2/3 the size of the head. Also for NEXTs and ACs not of gen 5, the cockpit is accessed by the head moving forwards. Meaning the head acts as a door for the cockpit. So in this retrospect alone the NEXTS and ACs are fairly on the same height scale. Also in game both are about 7 stories tall when you stand next to buildings. The only mech line of the series that has a truly different size are the ACs of V and VD. Those the cockpit doors open in the front of the chest(core) meaning there needs to be more room (door access) for the pilots to get in. Also when you stand next to a building in V/VD the ACs only reach a little over 3 stories. This also shows the same height in the trailers for the games. So my size theory is NEXTs tallest by a few meters, ACs(1-LR) about the size of NEXTs if not a little shorter, and the ACs from V/VD are literally half the size of both. Edit: I was wrong. I just rewatched that "ac3 trailer" and it is actually the opening to Last Raven. Also it shows the pilot is twice the size of the head.... So yeah ACs are actually quite a bit smaller than NEXTs, but still not as small as ACs fro v/vd
Listen I'm not arguing here as somebody who has played pretty much all of the games all but the portable one and has done years of research because I don't have a life…. let me tell you all what's really going on it pretty much goes in succession as you would think it is the first armored Core games are the first ones to ever happened AC technology was something developed during the Great destruction or at least directly afterwards as well as the empty unit and the cord MT as everyone knows the MT is the very first mass-produced viable mech in armored Core as far as anybody knows it's other variant is very simply a empty unit utilizing the same thing as all AS’s do simply adding in mod ability meaning that they the original concept for the armored Core was just an old MT unit that the pilots were smart enough to use other MT weapons and parts then of course came the evolution of that into the armored Core after the concept was proved with the cord MT as far as I know you never encounter acord MT but from my understanding that's how it all started in the original game from that there is the simple games that we all know and love leading all the way up from armored Core all the way Another age after that I don't really know what happens but from what I'm able to understand The technology from ac2 era was almost all but lost and some sort of another giant cataclysmic War of some sorts which is why the Earth armored Core 3 silent line is surrounded by a giant space debris field which you can clearly see and the opening of silent line now what the hell could have done that I don't know lots and lots of s*** getting blown up but in the portable versions of these games you can get armored Core 2 era parts and weapons as well as Original era they're all either described as outdated variance that are not used anymore or improved variance mostly just to justify them Reusing them But from what I can understand is that these games are in fact connected and in one of the trailers of armored Core 4 you can clearly see noblesse oblige fighting off a bunch of 3rd Generation starter AC’s I would just like to point that out now I'm not saying you didn't put a whole lot of thought into this but you are just simply incorrect because that's a fact now maybe I'm wrong about the connection between armored Core 2 and the original games and armored Core 3 but I do know for a fact that armored Core 3 is most definitely connected with the armored Core 4 and 5 games now to answer your question why they are all simple they don't have complex movements and are basically replacers for MT’s is because they didn't want to have to put that much work into having all of these different unique enemies they literally are the replacers in that game now of course MT’s are still around but only the reverse Walker versions I would just like to point that out that's basically the only reason why they're so simple is because they just didn't either have enough time resources or money or all of the above right there in order to be able to do that now I'm very unhappy with it myself and I would love to have encountered a lot of unique ;norml's; but it's just that simple the development team was like hell no way too much work considering the fact you already have to buy a bunch of unique next’s that did not think it was necessary to put that much effort into it I guess it really wouldn't have made that much of a difference But I can say for a fact it would be really awesome to be able to fight unique 3rd generation enemies... but instead they replaced them all with this basically manufactured version that is completely standard and has no uniqueness to it at all there you go
If Armored Core 4 Universe was analogized with Universal Century-era Gundam series, then we know and realize that the NEXT were like the Mobile Suits (RX-78-2, Gundam Alex) and the Normals were like the Grunt Suits (EFSF GM, Zeon Zaku). This is make sense with your explanation of AC4 Universe where the NEXT pilots were so expert, superior and dominant like a Newtype Pilot while the Normals looks so clumsy-like because their pilot which should I say...little experienced, like most pilots of Grunt Suit Units (CMIIW, Buster TBM)
a interesting theory however i don't completly agree with it. 1: AC4 and FA Normals can't be MTs since there are actual mechs called MTs in those games. The reason Normals sucking so much is just to emphatize how OP a Next actually is also you said it yourself they are the next version of ACs which could only be normals lel. 2: AC4s pilot is frequently beeing called a relic of an old age even a Raven and its very likely he is the last raven from ACLR. 3: i don't believe Disorder units are Humans creation at all there was a mission where you could see Aliens beeing in stasis or Vats so they do exist, not to mention that the design of the disorder units is too well alien to be made by humans. my personal theory would be pretty simple AC1 - AC2AA then another great destruction happened or just a simple reboot then it starts off with AC3 - ACVD in armored core 3 it was stated that MTs were created in layered which can't be true since they have existed before AC3. As for the reason why the 5th and 4th generation is connected with the 3th one is because its very likely that the player in AC4 is infact the Last surviving Raven of ACLR and the 4th generation is confirmed to be linked to the 5th one since alot of technology of AC4 can be seen:a joshua o brian clone ,black glint,kojima particles and even crashed cradles and spirit of motherwill , heavily implying that Orcas or the destruction ending is canon (however there will probably nothing left after the destruction ending lel). Also I read a crazy and amusing theory somewhere that Humans have been at war with aliens from AC2 and everytime they go to space they get nuked and go underground again.
In AC4 the title of Raven is attributed to mercenary AC (Normal) pilots after widespread use of them in battle began, which I believe may have been during the National Dismantlement War. This would likely mean that Anatolia's Mercenary previously piloted a Normal, possibly during the NDW before switching to a NEXT. This could explain why other LYNX refer to him as a relic of the past. It also seems that Anatolia's Mercenary received his NEXT after Fiona saved him, as is explained by Emil Gustav in the first cutscene of AC4.
There's an inconsistency problem, not with just this theory but with how the story of Generation 1 is presented. The ending of Armored Core has the player destroying the AI which is Hustler-1 / R, but Hustler-1 and Lana Nielsen exist together as an AI, which suggests that one of two things, either somebody knowingly re/constructs the AI, or that the events of Armored Core and Master of Arena don't take place in the same universe. This being said, it is canonical via Armored Core 2, that the player in Master of Arena is Leos Klein, as commented that Leos is known for defeating the top ranked raven on earth, aka Nineball, who is defeated in Master of Arena. So, we know that time line wise, Master of Arena leads directly to 2, but I don't know of anything that definitively ties Another Age to after 2 or during the events of two. Personally, I would posit that Master of Arena is a split in the time line, where 2 / AA are the exploits of Earthlings attempting to colonize Mars to escape damaged earth, where as 3 / Silent Line show the struggles that Earthlings faced when a new AI was constructed to replace Hustler-1, since we do have locations such as Neo Isaac City. But what about the Disorder Units from 2 / AA? Well, we do know from the mission Eliminate Unknown Organisms that Chrome had the ability to do bioengineering, so it's plausible that this could have led to the advent of Disorder Units, but do keep in grasping at straws. But I disagree with the theory starting with 4/FA, because why start with the designation of Normal and Next, and have such big impact on 4s story, referring to pilots and Lynx, but the back and forth over the fabled Raven? Personally, because of this, I would place 4/FA after Last Raven, since it was the war to end wars within its own story line. With that, I would posit that the famed Raven from 4 is the Last Raven titular character. My only comment on the designation between Normals and Nexts would be, Normals being in between MT and AC, while Nexts are based upon AC's using technology recovered from the Pulverizers. But that doesn't hold much water, given the destruction by Zinaida.
Not going to discredit anything you say here, I mentioned in the same video that my theory will clearly have some holes, but I honestly liked this theory and thought it would fit well.
Buster TBM Gameplay but this does make me wonder how things really do fit together. I know that my memory is fuzzy at points. Maybe you could do a series, looking at the events and timelines of the series in depth? Might be an interesting community project to actually piece things together. Surely FROM has left us with enough clues to place some what accurately where the games go.
Why would Normals need boosting and extra agility if they can't compete with NEXT's anyway with those upgrades. Better to just drown your enemy in Numbers.
I could never beat any of the armored core games I came across. They're simply too difficult for me to even play and I'm pretty good at difficult games. This franchise though just gave me a run for my money.
This is just my guess based on the Armored Core games that I've played (I haven't played For Answer though I just know the general gist of it which could prove to ruin my little timeline) - 4/For Answer > 5/Verdict Day > AC3 > Last Raven Ok so after finding more out about ACFA, it makes more sense for it to go AC3 > LR > 4/FA > 5/VD, but, my only problem is why is Last Raven called Last Raven if there are many mercenaries who are called ravens in 4/FA. This makes me believe it possibly goes AC3 > 4/FA > LR > 5/VD, but I'm not sure. As I previously stated, I never played 4/FA and nothing before AC3, so I don't have a full grasp on the story as a whole.
I think 1- last raven are connected because I remember the last mission in nexus the boss you had to fight said destoy nine ball and said distroy selveral mor times
That's still under question as that final boss is originally known as "???" then is officially called "Prototype Pulverizer", being called "Nineball" was only in western releases
Man, this video has not aged well. AC timeline works as Gundam's alternative universe and stories, where common ideas and themes are repeated without all them being directly connected.
I haven't finished the video, but in the first couple minutes I already notice a bit of a misconception in regards to "normals" If you go into training mode in AC4, you will notice that there are options to fight MTs, Normals and NEXTs. MTs are what you've shown us in the video, the guys that stand there with basic abilities. "Normals" are for the most part used like ACs in the game. They boost hover around, show up in groups of 3-4 and can deal serious damage if you're just letting yourself get hit. They might still be the first generation of ACs and I'm not trying to kill your theory, but what you referenced as having no power was in fact not a Normal, but an MT.
TBM I have to ask. Do you believe this theory? I ask because you said you had fun piecing it together and what not but I do this same kind of stuff (not like on TH-cam) just to keep my mind of things. My head cannon is that no AC game is connected unless a given or said explicitly (4 and For Answer). It's my perception, interested to hear yours.
Interesting theory, it's quite similar to my own, although each game's protagonist is a Dark Raven. The destroyer of all who oppose God's will. The destruction ending of acfa has the Dark Raven face off against four nexts, five on hard, which the Dark Raven defeats all of them.
I don't know, certain incarnations of the protagonist don't really seem to fit the Dark Raven thing. Namely, AC3 for one, But I can see some of them like MoA being one
Rue Ryuzaki the way I see it, all protagonists of the ac series are the Dark Raven of that time for each game. Each protagonist performs feats thought to be impossible, some were in fact saviors, others were destroyers.
Doesn't address any of the major mysteries, but could the wreckage in AC3's Avalon Hill (Destroy Massive MT, Eliminate the Bombers, etc) be a segment of a fallen Cradle from Destroy Cradle 03?
Oh that is a GOOD theory, looked it up and yes, it has a VERY similar shape, I assume most of it is buried or broken off in other parts of the world. I mean, who knows how many years have passed?
It's J the reaper from Verdict Day. It's all the dog ration nine ball preventing a another J to reappear. The Raven aka the player... the series is all in order if you loom deep down in the tech. Nothing was reversed engineered like you think in the video. Good theory. But no. Ravens live forever. They will never die.
TBM, if you remember Leviathan in Nexus and Last Raven, it is present in Armored Core V. the name of this giant mech in ACV is TYPE D NO. 5, but you can only find this on multiplayer. for now you can't go into that server as ACV server had been shutdown. Watch the boss fight on youtube and observe the design for that machine and compare it to Leviathan. the design is seemingly familiar. so, my opinion is that all the ancient technology that were found by corporation in AC1 and Nexus is came from AC4 to it sequel until ACVD. I want to know your opinion about this. your and I have the same theory about this timeline. i'm glad that i'm not the only one that have this theory.
Haha, lemme add to this, so the gen 3 timeline got the leviathan, the gen 4 and5 timeline has that TYPE D NO.5. But here's the kicker, the gen 1 and 2 timeline got gray cloud in another age. The same thing in three different timelines.
dear god, how i could miss that. yeah, Grey Cloud from Another Age. thanks for reminding me. but i don't remember seeing that type of machine from gen 1 though. which mission that i miss? please enlighten me.
oh, another hint for you about the Cradle. It was presence in ACVD. i put a link here so that you can add some more information for your theory. th-cam.com/video/7vutWyVlc5s/w-d-xo.html
You should really play trough AC5, I'm guessing a lot of people turns to you when it comes to AC lore, so at least a basic knowledge would be preferable
Having only played the original PSOne trilogy & most of the PS2 series of AC games, except for Nine Breaker & Formula Front, I find theory a very interesting concept. However, I'm just going to stay neutral on this subject, since the replies from those who play the PS3 & PS4 games also seem to hold merit. Overall, the idea would make sense, if the replies from those in the comments about past ACs being in the future games were false to a certain extent.
Hmmm, you know... I did not even CONSIDER Sera.... COULD be that she transfered from the controller, or that instead of the controller porting over to the internecine. Though my bets are still on the controller being transferred to the internecine, it had less of a personality than Sera did.
Buster TBM Gameplay no Sera and the controller are completely different AIs plus to support your theory in the final boss battle Sera uses a mech which looks like a NEXT or Nineball Seraph which indicates she might have access to next technology as well plus she had her own Layered which raises the question about what exactly happened there and we revisit the controller in SL perhaps the mission contains more clues more to that the internecine and its produced pulverizers have a certain emblem which i wonder if it was seen somewhere else. You've made a great leap in connecting but some mysteries aren't solved yet
Oh man, you are completely right regarding Sera, indeed, she uses somethign close to nineball serpah, and my theory was saying that Seraph's body was where NEXT technology was analyzed better than humans have, it makes a lot of sense! We need to solve more of these mysteries!
Buster TBM Gameplay indeed and we can start with this one: it was presumed in AC3 that the controller malfunctioned and started wiping out instead of governing Layered making unregistered ACs.. Just the same fashion as how the internecine makes pulverizers (we seem to wander in the controller=internecine each step) but was there actually a reason behind that in AC3? maybe a clue in Nexus or silent line
Maybe the controller, now being transferred to the Internecine realises it has to upgrade, and not take from existing tech (the parts it equiped on it's ACs) Also, Navis is the one in Nexus that FOUND the internecine, and they pretty much set off the alarm bells that completely ruined everything. Also, remember the Massive MT I called a Leviathan in Another Age? that is from another timeline, so it still fits!
The way I've come to understand it:
Armored Core 1-2AA are the same universe, even in armored core 1 there is significant space travel involved in the story, this carries on with project phantasma and master of arena talking less about the space travel themes but then once 2 came around it implies that humanity finally began seriously colonizing mars and encountering martian mecha gone feral.
AC2:AA is basically immediately after 2 from earth's perspective as you encounter and fight some "top pilots" from mars as an earth raven.
After 2 AA, i believe the series has it's first genuine timeline reboot where nothing before AC3 has anything to do with AC3 and onward.
Armored core 3-Last raven are all obviously part of the same universe as they make references to events of the previous GEN3 games in every gen 3 game after 3.
Armored core 4 is an interesting one because in the teaser trailer featuring noblesse oblige you can clearly see Noblesse obliterating a squad of grey-painted Gen3 Test-garage ACs (such as from Armored Core Last Raven only not painted orange) that have the 12-lock missile launcher from GEN 3 instead of the beginner 2 lock missile. Which is why I believe that AC4 is NOT the first game in their chronological timeline.
However given that nobless oblige was fighting GEN 3 beginner ACs, this leads me to believe that Generation 3 and 4 are the same timeline and that Next ACs were the following evolutionary stage of Armored Cores, (after Nexts became more commonplace I believe that Normals began to be designed to more resemble certain next archetypes rather than continuing to make normals look and perform like GEN 3 ACs.)
Another reason I believe normals ended up looking the way they did is because after the invention of nexts, the real-deal AC pilots moved on from normals to nexts and since there were no remaining skilled normal pilots with unique part combinations and lethal weapon loadouts, normals became the mass-produced grunt-soldiers and cannon fodder of GEN4. (presumably if there were any MTs left in GEN 4 they were strictly used for construction purposes as considering how poorly MTs fared against even normal ACs in the past, people probably just stopped trying to make Combat MTs as ACs, even normals, were always more suited for the job of combat.)
ACFA obviously immediately follows 4
and Generation 5 [Spoilers]....
...Is basically the super-future result of the events in generation 4 as is evidenced by VDs final boss being a black redesign of FA's White glint, and having multiple maps with various stages of different spirit of motherwill arms forts stages of degredation.
So long story short, IMO all armored core games were in fact released chronologically and the only genuine reboot that happened in the series was between generation two and three having Gens 1 and 2 being part of the same universe and gens 3 through 5 being part of the same separate universe.
The Ne'er-do-well What explains Last Raven's final boss using Kojima particles for it's missiles?
There is actually a link between third generation and earlier. after defeating nineball in nine breaker they mention it to be a replica of an "enigma from the past".
so the only lin k that is actually missing is from gen 4 to earlier.
Jannik Nordmeyer Ninebreaker is non-canon, so your idea is debunked.
Crimson-fox Twitch how do you now that? And even if it was, why would they make a spinoff that is inconsistant with the universe its based on?
Crimson-fox Twitch green lasers dont automatically mean kojima particles man.
In armored core v, you play as the Dark Raven. Verdict day seems to go forward a hundred years or so and White Glint's armored core was salvaged and was pieced back together.
- Minuano - Hey again!
That's freaking awesome
yeah,but its more likely that they just reverse engineered what was left of white glint as they do not know how to nor do they have the parts to repair it.the new 'black glint' was way weaker than white glint as it was defeated by what was basically a souped up normal. We know that 'black glint' was reverse engineered from a next as it has assault armor and kojima particles,all economic war tech
@@oxide___ Oh dang, that's pretty cool. In that case, that's even more dangerous because they could essentially mass produce these things. They have the means and the resources.
@@-Minuano- yeah youre right, but it comes at a cost since these psuedo nexts are way weaker
When you realize the pilot of armored core 3 was the only on to kill a NEXT in a normal.
Isn’t the final boss of verdict day also a next?
@@nataliecameron Maybe "fully operational" should be added to that "NEXT".
What who?
I respect your theories. I disagree strongly. I am simply glad some one else even cared enough to try and link the AC timelines.
AC is basically the GTA timeline of Mechs
As an old 1997 AC player, I can certainly say this is a very good setup for the different possible timelines. I think at one point FROM may have been trying tie in all of the games with their lore, but sadly it never really panned out, or was too vague with many plot holes for most players to care about.
Thanks for making this man. You made an old grizzled Raven happy.
I believe it is localization problem, this has been a thing ever since the King's Field games even up to the recent FromSoft games, which in my opinion left a lot of details rather vague and hard to follow.
This is a fantastic theory! But it should be noted that 2 and 2AA do NOT take place at the same time. The manual even states, it was about 5-7 year's difference.
ACV and ACVD happens when the ORCA ending happened, at some point at ACVD or ACV you can see some cradles and armsforts downed on the surface and lots of stuff that were in generation 4
Really?!?
ye u might aswell find out what happened after the orca won in generation 4, im picking orca's side when I get ACFA lol
@@lethalshed2272 isn't destruction ending would result crashed Cradle?
Hard to say since what about Kojima Particles? Did the corporations really agreed with no fingers crossing behind their back that no one would make more?
@@null8036 ORCA ending results to cradles crashing in the earths surface on the ground
I've been pitching a similar theory for a while now, though with a different timeline split.
-So for 4/FA, thought exactly the same thing...
-Then 5th gen takes place, it has the cradles and Motherwill's remains around, with old technilogy being housed in towers. in 5 they turn that tech around for a revolution, but by VD someone has full control of the old machines, resulting in an ending which seems to imply that while humanity will keep fighting, the machines will keep coming in new and scarier forms, AKA the online portion of the game.
-From there, people have no choice but to go underground. People end up going into hiding. In order to keep things stable, they make an AI to police itself in a way. One part controls production and keeps things running, while the other, NB, keeps any faction or individual from getting too powerful. That's why You still have to break a computer even after breaking NB in AC1.
-The way I see it, the split happens at this point. In AC1-2AA, NB takes control of the Controller, using it to police the world. When he's killed off, the old discoveries come flooding in, and things go back to corporate/government squabbling, as You said. Parts and tech are slowly added and introduced.
-The alternative is that the Controller wins out for AC3. It immediately allows for upgrades to existing machines based on what's available, and generally seems to keep a relative peace until it starts going corrupt and breaks.
- From there, Silent Line takes place with humanity mostly just dealing with the old world weapons that are still hanging about, and fighting each other. I like to think that IBIS was a defunct old version of NB just trying to keep control of things without any true means to do so.
- In Nexus, the internecine gets accidentally disturbed, and we get to see what NB was up to after he had been isolated at the start, which in this case, was studying and amassing units. With his frame destroyed in Nexus, the machines turn aggressive in defense, destroying most of the world. Meanwhile NB is still studying and assembling new frames for himself, sending test versions out into the field to collect more data. As I see it, the Final Pulverizer is just the final version that he made for himself with the tweaks that came from that last hover fight.
- So, when the FP is destroyed, both AIs are dead, and NB happens during this peace time, hoping to develop a more efficient training program, as opposed to the randomly skilled pilots from before, in an effort to combat future AI incursions.
- Also, the Formula Front arena becomes super popular because dang it, people want to just calm down and watch some sports after all that crap!
- Bonus thing here, manufacturing processes getting lax after the relative peace of SL-NX could be a reason why we went from mass amounts of experimental weapons in SL to massive cheap downgrades in NX-LR. Cheap manufacturing for more profit at the cost of overheating ACs seems right on the money for the kind of petty stuff we see in NX. By LR they are forced to improve, with the original models basically being ignored in NX, and lost by LR. By that point they probably had the general ideas back, and were able to make some tweaks, but no longer had access to some materials that would allow for better cooling performance. As a result, they found ways to tweak the AC frame to compensate.
Overthinking is fun =-D Thanks for the video!
The Great destruction is featured in both PS1 and PS2 generations as the narrative for humans going underground.
This is absolutely amazing! I was blown away by how you tied all the timelines together to Armored Core 4.
Thank you for fulfilling my wish that the Armored Core ends with The Last Raven.
The official scale model kits put AC1 through 3 ACs just a head shorter than NEXTs, so around 8 to 9m. The only exception is the Nineball Seraph which is quite large even for NEXTs, probably close to 13 or 14m. That makes them notably taller than the ACV ACs.
I honestly like the IDEA that AMS tech was the primogenitor to H+
Hi TBM. you still here?. AC6 just came out last week.
I legit appreciate your thoughts on the storyline and lore of the games. I'm going through the lore my self, partly to gather info for story writing, and came across your video first. I followed your assessment of the plot lines and they make sense in terms of logical flow. The idea of multiple endings sounds about right, considering From Soft seems to like this idea by giving the player their own story to play; the Souls games have a non-liner kind of canonical plot that can only be pieced together in a similar fashion as you have here, and even then there's open-ended aspects with no real closure. I'd say its easier to build a story that lacks closure and has multiple endings, and is more fun for a game more so than a linear story. Thanks again for the video :) I'm excited for the new AC game coming out in the next couple of years, i've really been dying for a solid mecha game.
AC2AA takes place some point shortly after AC2.
my evidence?
Balena and Zeo Matrix were neutered _BIG TIME_ (Balena by the earth government due to trying to game the Frightener/Klein incident to become the dominant power on Mars, and Zeo Matrix by the loss of their Mars division) and several of their mission briefings mention regaining lost power. If I had to guess, it's probably within a year or two of said incident.
Now that I think of it, you do see the ruins of the Cradles in 5 (or Verdict day, I don't exactly remember), and let's just say that by the look of it, it was more of a crash than a landing. Makes me think that the destruction ending of AcFa led to AC5.
It's either that, or Old king did that, he was the one that pretty much started this whole thing
It would make sense that AC4 is the start of the whole timeline theory. One thing you can also bring up was that AC4 takes place directly after the National Dismantlement War, leaving governments to dust and is the true beginning of corporate reign.
Hmm, this is really interesting! I never really tried to piece the timelines together myself, and always just took it at face value that the generations of games just had their own separate timelines; which is what I still am going by, when I do think about the story-lines, but your theories are fairly plausible as well, I think.
Always have this itching feeling that the orca route I pick in for answer leads into armored core 2. Giving that this a theory, I would like to keep this in my personal head canon.
Hey TBM, nice theory, but it is actually possibly that V-VD take place before AC1. It is actually hinted at, for example: On the final mission of V, Carol (an AI) talks about creating a complete program and that it would take time, and of course the final mission is numbered 09. Later on in VD, a human turned AI named The Foundation Man (or Isaac) used a very similar tactic to Nine-Ball, and killed anyone with potential.
In the ending of the game, weapons of mass destruction are unleashed upon the world and will not stop until all is in ruin, and you (The Lone Mercenary) work along side Fatman (your operator) to destroy all of these weapons. Unfortunately, the Corporations decide to go to war with one-another again, leaving you on your own.
It is possible whether you succeed or not determines the ending: AC1 if you succeed, or AC3 if you fail. If you succeed, Carol and Chief have enough time to create the Hustler-One program. If you fail, Carol and Chief have to take matters in their own hands, and in order to protect mankind, create the Controller. Unfortunately, it seems like someone (probably Chief) put in a program where once mankind was back on its feet, The Controller would "malfunction", and you know what happens from there.
Unfortunately, I just can't find where Justice fits into this for the life of me.
Well to be fair, I never played gen 5, so there's my holes in my theory I spoke of, but either way, I did have fun thinking of this theory
Agreed, hopefully we will find an answer someday though seeing as how From Software is middle name is "Ambiguous", I doubt we will ever know. Honestly though, I just hope we get a sequel to Last Raven.
*reads you writing "sequel to last raven"*
d-don't... don't do this to me, my heart skipped a beat when I read that. XD
The slogan would be "This time with good music!"
You got me there XD
Last raven had baaaaad music, only a FEWWWWW tracks were nice
"The first game is AC 4"
Before watching it: Boi what kind've drugs are you on?!
After watching it: Hmm, makes sense...
Hahaha yeesssss, this was exactly the kinda reaction I was hoping to get from people!
Oh man, you are right, how COULD they remove EO?
That was such a game changer once it was introduced!
Didn't surprise me, because I know some people do think that. Was actually half-expecting that.
0:08 They are.
Also, your lack of knowledge on Gen 5 WAS your downfall, TBM. However, explaining it would be major spoilers for Verdict Day.
Buster will never play Verdict Day, it should be fine for you to discuss
I have to agree having played since I was 5 years old from the original....if people just briefly keep an open mind and discard the meaning of Nexts this timeline can really seem plausible and it makes immense sense when you go from Lynx to Orcas to Ravens
A little late but yeah that’s the case. The pilot of eggs in fa is your old character in 4.
My theory is that Chief, J, and Carol from 5 and VD respectfully are the first AIs in the timeline, they were left by the corporations to stop any potential dominants from rising up after the Raven from 4A destroyed everything, which is why the Reapers are rigging matches against the Raven in VD, first to see if he truly was a dominant, then moving on to actively trying to kill him once it becomes clear that he is indeed a dominant.
I'm glad I found this video to understand everything I have armored core V and had no clue what was going on until now.
I remember hearing that white Glint is actually the mercenary you play as in AC4. That he took on the title after Joshua died. Also Dark Glint in ACVD is supposedly a clone of Joshua. On another note, AC For Answer is my favorite. It made me feel super powerful, especially after being a pint size mech in V and VD.
FromSoft creating a Dark Souls narrative for Armored Core? Who would’ve thought.
Don't you mean from?
remember, AC has already existed way before DS, even Miyazaki.
I heard the next Armored core game will be loosely based around dark souls. I'm thinking it will take place in the towers after ACVD. It will likely be a survival scenario against the technology of the old word, dating back to AC4 and ACFA. Doing this would explain the final boss and the broken down arms forts present in the game. The towers are said to be advanced and the autonomous arms serve as a major threat throughout the game. These strangely advanced enemies will likely be the enemies in the next game, and it would make for a good difficulty curve due to the dark aged ACs you control in the newest games. Fatman, one of the characters promises to take down the towers after the final fight, so I think it's reasonable for the story to lead there.
This actually changes the way I view AC
Yes, AC4 and AC5 is connected, because of the the main boss of Verdict Day. It is a Next with primal and assault armor and you have to defeat it with just a normal. But it's really hard to continue the story back to the previous games. I think yes, your right, humanity could make next like ACs without the particles, but the AC5 ACs can use massive weapons what only a next could use right. Well, maybe because it puts so much strain on the mech, they got rid of the idea, and made mechs for greater lifespans because of the decreasing resources. By the way, I think the destruction path is really the cannon not just a split timeline. Let's say, you're the guy who we must kill in Verdict Day, gone mad from all the killing. After Verdict day the war still waged on, but eventually everybody gave up and they went underground, and laid their lifes in AI god's hands. But I tought that Last Raven is the real ending. It even has it in it's name, so why not, at least on Earth. AC2 shows that war goes on on Mars sadly
Actually the most expansive storyline of Armored Core is the AC3 generation since it has the most games and established canon other than the original and later on the AC4 to ACV series. AC1 to AC2AA are tied. Human Plus are basically cultivators in ACVD which are cloned humans of pilots from another era (AC4). Chief was an AI apparently who oversaw humanity for ????? reasons. The real question is what is the Controller (Dove) and how does it tie to if at all Nine Ball.
Here's a hint: it doesn't. The original Japanese version of Nexus' final boss was not Nine Ball. It was a battle MT discovered by Navis who were originally developing their own series of battle MTs using the technology they discovered at some unexplored region (hence why everyone was up their ass the entire game of Nexus). The boss itself had the name text of ??????. It was in the American localization is when they gave him the name Nine Ball for no other reason than to brand the pilot name for the already announced and upcoming game Nine Breaker. There's two main stories that diverge from each other. Unless AC3 actually comes first that leads to AC4 to AC5 then back to AC1 and AC2AA is the finale.
Damn I wish ps5 had armored core.
4 answer was the perfect balance of movement and speed of the game.
Nexts were so fun to dash around...
If they built on that with something like the frostbite engine of dice, environmental destruction would be so cool.
Even if they had something like a zoids cross over. Having sniper tigers and flying mechs. This game series was my childhood
Well hope is not lost, fellow Raven. Funny story, the lead dev from all the ps2 AC series was very unhappy with the de evolution direction the series wanted to go from AC4FA into AC5 and Verdict Day. So he quit, and 3/4 of the AC dev team quit with him. Which is why the 5 era feels so lackluster.
So, they all quit From Soft and made their owb company, called First Studio, and released Daemon X Machina which is the true soul successor to the AC series and an evolution from AC4FA. Now, its only for Switch and PC, but it did so well they confirmed a DxM 2 on their 2nd anniversary. So theres a chance DxM 2 could be for ps5 too.
@@lukefinley6660 I've finished DxM, but it still lack something. The gameplay is nice but I wish the lore and universe is similar to Armored core. It's too cartonish compared to serious AC series
@@lueqmanmasduki6028 Yes i agree with this, i think its mainly in part to the studio having to start from scratch, and their main publisher mostly does anime stuff in japan. Although, based on a newer series from them, Akudama Drive, they are capable of deep, dark, and gory story that would work much better than the more cartoony style they went with for DxM. Also though, the game was mainly only targeted at Japan and was way better accepted there, story too, and overall sold 5 times more copies than they expected worldwide. I really hope they take the story seriously for DxM 2, which they confirmed last year. The story is one of the things they gutted from AC and VD that i really missed.
I had the same theory that armored core 4 took place before armored core. And i even have a theory that chrome hounds is a prequel to all the armored core games 😂
So is armored core 6 a ending unification or the true begining of all the time lines? Looks like in the trailer that the ACs have every peice of technology from every armored core game. Everything from kojima tech weapons, next primal/assault armor, MTs, arm projector sheilds, V styled armored cores, mega cities, pulverizer units, etc. Plus it looks like the great destruction was a massive solar flare or kojima super weapon that went off and scorched the earth causing a nuclear winter, so it looks like we may have to worry about our ACs freezing over.
Maybe VaatiVidya should start doing Armored Core videos
Ooh don't tease me...
I can definitely see gen 4 and 5 being the same time line. I can also see all the generations being separate.
Two words: Japan Gaem!
And don't even start on mind fuckery of DxM and R-Type
DxM was bit of a surprise but what a nice sneaky way to sneak it in
1-2-2AA are the same universe. Leos Klein is the Pilot from AC1.
I myself don't really think that connecting all of the games into one timeline is that good of an idea. Look at the Legend of Zelda Timeline, its a garbled mess.
Ever Since AC3, Armored core has always had separate timelines.
The Gen 1-2 Timeline, including AC1, PP, MOA, AC2, and AC2:AA.
The Gen 3 Tineline, which includes AC3, AC:SL, AC:N, AC:LR. Formula Front and Ninebreaker are standalone games, and aren't connected to the main timeline.
The Gen 4 Timelin, which includes AC4, AC:FA, ACV and ACVD.
Personally, trying to connect them all together is a fruitless endeavor, that just creates more drama more than anything else.
Still a fun video though.
Siphon Rayzar fancy seeing you here...
It maybe a theory, but I have to say, it was well thought out, well put together, I've played every ps2/psp/ps3 title and tho the "story" or lore of the game is just abstract to soooo many, I've found this worth 100% sorta wish it was longer, but its the AC story...there's like not really enough to go on about timeline wise o,O
Haha, honestly, I could have made a few more connections, but I did not wanna make the video way too long, but I am glad you enjoyed it!
I heard once that it's similar to dark souls in that the timeline is convoluted including hearing people who worked on Dark souls say it could be a connected universe which in a way I agree with your theory aside from one thing which was that I'm not sure if it was meantioned below, but there is one major hole in your theory. They test the "NEXT", primal armor generators in a mission in Silent line. Although I'd like to think something that meshes my statement and your timeline theory together in that, what if time actually keeps looping around over and over in some hellish purgatory. That would be really insane, the ever turning cogs of war burning the planet to ash.
If the rumors of this next AC game taking place on mars are true i wonder how that lends itself to past lore
3:16 AC1 cores where also around 10 meters tall, Not sure where that artist got his rendition from but there are several instances of you being able to compare the core to vehicles and street lights and such, Just a little nitpick outside of that i do enjoy AC theory.
Also, that ACFA/AC5/AC1 size comparison chart is wrong. Gen5 ACs are generally the shortest not only because of their size but because of their posture, AC1 ACs were slightly larger, and GEN4 ACs being the largest (but not by much because even normals in GEN 4 were the same size as your next if you took the time to stand beside them.)
The Ne'er-do-well the Gen 4 to Gen 5 comparison is right, but the Gen 1 comparison is definitely wrong. I guess that's why most results I found of that pic had the Gen 1 part cropped out.
The Normals's official height is 7m, so they are still taller than Gen 5 mechs. And while the official height of a Next is 10m, they realistically look closer to 15.
Otakumanu it depends off your core type espessialy reverse jointed and four legend are shorter
I highly disagree with this. There is a trailer showing a human size comparison for AC3 Armored cores. It shows the pilot standing next to it's AC's head, he is about 2/3 the size of the head. Also for NEXTs and ACs not of gen 5, the cockpit is accessed by the head moving forwards. Meaning the head acts as a door for the cockpit. So in this retrospect alone the NEXTS and ACs are fairly on the same height scale. Also in game both are about 7 stories tall when you stand next to buildings. The only mech line of the series that has a truly different size are the ACs of V and VD. Those the cockpit doors open in the front of the chest(core) meaning there needs to be more room (door access) for the pilots to get in. Also when you stand next to a building in V/VD the ACs only reach a little over 3 stories. This also shows the same height in the trailers for the games. So my size theory is NEXTs tallest by a few meters, ACs(1-LR) about the size of NEXTs if not a little shorter, and the ACs from V/VD are literally half the size of both.
Edit: I was wrong. I just rewatched that "ac3 trailer" and it is actually the opening to Last Raven. Also it shows the pilot is twice the size of the head.... So yeah ACs are actually quite a bit smaller than NEXTs, but still not as small as ACs fro v/vd
Listen I'm not arguing here as somebody who has played pretty much all of the games all but the portable one and has done years of research because I don't have a life…. let me tell you all what's really going on it pretty much goes in succession as you would think it is the first armored Core games are the first ones to ever happened AC technology was something developed during the Great destruction or at least directly afterwards as well as the empty unit and the cord MT as everyone knows the MT is the very first mass-produced viable mech in armored Core as far as anybody knows it's other variant is very simply a empty unit utilizing the same thing as all AS’s do simply adding in mod ability meaning that they the original concept for the armored Core was just an old MT unit that the pilots were smart enough to use other MT weapons and parts then of course came the evolution of that into the armored Core after the concept was proved with the cord MT as far as I know you never encounter acord MT but from my understanding that's how it all started in the original game from that there is the simple games that we all know and love leading all the way up from armored Core all the way Another age after that I don't really know what happens but from what I'm able to understand The technology from ac2 era was almost all but lost and some sort of another giant cataclysmic War of some sorts which is why the Earth armored Core 3 silent line is surrounded by a giant space debris field which you can clearly see and the opening of silent line now what the hell could have done that I don't know lots and lots of s*** getting blown up but in the portable versions of these games you can get armored Core 2 era parts and weapons as well as Original era they're all either described as outdated variance that are not used anymore or improved variance mostly just to justify them Reusing them But from what I can understand is that these games are in fact connected and in one of the trailers of armored Core 4 you can clearly see noblesse oblige fighting off a bunch of 3rd Generation starter AC’s I would just like to point that out now I'm not saying you didn't put a whole lot of thought into this but you are just simply incorrect because that's a fact now maybe I'm wrong about the connection between armored Core 2 and the original games and armored Core 3 but I do know for a fact that armored Core 3 is most definitely connected with the armored Core 4 and 5 games now to answer your question why they are all simple they don't have complex movements and are basically replacers for MT’s is because they didn't want to have to put that much work into having all of these different unique enemies they literally are the replacers in that game now of course MT’s are still around but only the reverse Walker versions I would just like to point that out that's basically the only reason why they're so simple is because they just didn't either have enough time resources or money or all of the above right there in order to be able to do that now I'm very unhappy with it myself and I would love to have encountered a lot of unique ;norml's; but it's just that simple the development team was like hell no way too much work considering the fact you already have to buy a bunch of unique next’s that did not think it was necessary to put that much effort into it I guess it really wouldn't have made that much of a difference But I can say for a fact it would be really awesome to be able to fight unique 3rd generation enemies... but instead they replaced them all with this basically manufactured version that is completely standard and has no uniqueness to it at all there you go
If Armored Core 4 Universe was analogized with Universal Century-era Gundam series, then we know and realize that the NEXT were like the Mobile Suits (RX-78-2, Gundam Alex) and the Normals were like the Grunt Suits (EFSF GM, Zeon Zaku). This is make sense with your explanation of AC4 Universe where the NEXT pilots were so expert, superior and dominant like a Newtype Pilot while the Normals looks so clumsy-like because their pilot which should I say...little experienced, like most pilots of Grunt Suit Units (CMIIW, Buster TBM)
You should take this theory to the AC experts they might approve it...
英語は苦手だが、acが好きっていうのは言葉が通じなくてもすごく伝わる。
we all love ac
Yay theories!
I don't really like the topic, but the first step matters!
It's something!
I gotta play a little more of AC (i only played AC 1 , 2 and 3)...to get the grasp of this theory
Very interesting theories. Thank you for sharing them with us.
Kojima and his research and development team didi it again
Would love to see how AC6 would fit into this
It seems to be set on another planet. Unless Earth in the AC timeline as a whole is utterly fucked,
I think the ending were u give humanity a chance to the stars is canon cuz ac6 is on rubicon 3
a interesting theory however i don't completly agree with it.
1: AC4 and FA Normals can't be MTs since there are actual mechs called MTs in those games. The reason Normals sucking so much is just to emphatize how OP a Next actually is also you said it yourself they are the next version of ACs which could only be normals lel.
2: AC4s pilot is frequently beeing called a relic of an old age even a Raven and its very likely he is the last raven from ACLR.
3: i don't believe Disorder units are Humans creation at all there was a mission where you could see Aliens beeing in stasis or Vats so they do exist, not to mention that the design of the disorder units is too well alien to be made by humans.
my personal theory would be pretty simple AC1 - AC2AA then another great destruction happened or just a simple reboot
then it starts off with AC3 - ACVD in armored core 3 it was stated that MTs were created in layered which can't be true since they have existed before AC3. As for the reason why the 5th and 4th generation is connected with the 3th one is because its very likely that the player in AC4 is infact the Last surviving Raven of ACLR and the 4th generation is confirmed to be linked to the 5th one since alot of technology of AC4 can be seen:a joshua o brian clone ,black glint,kojima particles and even crashed cradles and spirit of motherwill , heavily implying that Orcas or the destruction ending is canon (however there will probably nothing left after the destruction ending lel).
Also I read a crazy and amusing theory somewhere that Humans have been at war with aliens from AC2 and everytime they go to space they get nuked and go underground again.
In AC4 the title of Raven is attributed to mercenary AC (Normal) pilots after widespread use of them in battle began, which I believe may have been during the National Dismantlement War. This would likely mean that Anatolia's Mercenary previously piloted a Normal, possibly during the NDW before switching to a NEXT. This could explain why other LYNX refer to him as a relic of the past. It also seems that Anatolia's Mercenary received his NEXT after Fiona saved him, as is explained by Emil Gustav in the first cutscene of AC4.
So the Disorder Units are the Anti-Spirals? Cool! When do we get galaxy-sized ACs?
I would've thought Nine-Ball would be an Anti-Spiral considering It want's to control everything.
Alex:
It's implied that before the NDW there were already normals piloted by ravens. The catalyst for the NDW was the development of Next's.
V and Verdict Day both had a LOT to do with AI
while at the 2-min mark, i was thinking in MOA why Nineball Seraph is the first NEXT in the game and as the final boss?
But after all this is just a theory
A GAME THEORY!!!!....................im sorry
I should have seen comments like this coming
Buster TBM Gameplay yup you shouldve
I have an idea...let's ask the creator of all Armored Core games to tell us the truth of the storyline. hehe
FromSoft would never do that my man
This is REALLY interesting
Well there's a armored core 6 now u have more to work with (haven't checked if u already have just yet)
There's an inconsistency problem, not with just this theory but with how the story of Generation 1 is presented.
The ending of Armored Core has the player destroying the AI which is Hustler-1 / R, but Hustler-1 and Lana Nielsen exist together as an AI, which suggests that one of two things, either somebody knowingly re/constructs the AI, or that the events of Armored Core and Master of Arena don't take place in the same universe.
This being said, it is canonical via Armored Core 2, that the player in Master of Arena is Leos Klein, as commented that Leos is known for defeating the top ranked raven on earth, aka Nineball, who is defeated in Master of Arena.
So, we know that time line wise, Master of Arena leads directly to 2, but I don't know of anything that definitively ties Another Age to after 2 or during the events of two.
Personally, I would posit that Master of Arena is a split in the time line, where 2 / AA are the exploits of Earthlings attempting to colonize Mars to escape damaged earth, where as 3 / Silent Line show the struggles that Earthlings faced when a new AI was constructed to replace Hustler-1, since we do have locations such as Neo Isaac City.
But what about the Disorder Units from 2 / AA? Well, we do know from the mission Eliminate Unknown Organisms that Chrome had the ability to do bioengineering, so it's plausible that this could have led to the advent of Disorder Units, but do keep in grasping at straws.
But I disagree with the theory starting with 4/FA, because why start with the designation of Normal and Next, and have such big impact on 4s story, referring to pilots and Lynx, but the back and forth over the fabled Raven?
Personally, because of this, I would place 4/FA after Last Raven, since it was the war to end wars within its own story line. With that, I would posit that the famed Raven from 4 is the Last Raven titular character. My only comment on the designation between Normals and Nexts would be, Normals being in between MT and AC, while Nexts are based upon AC's using technology recovered from the Pulverizers. But that doesn't hold much water, given the destruction by Zinaida.
Not going to discredit anything you say here, I mentioned in the same video that my theory will clearly have some holes, but I honestly liked this theory and thought it would fit well.
Buster TBM Gameplay At least we're not having to deal with the Zelda time line.
Buster TBM Gameplay but this does make me wonder how things really do fit together. I know that my memory is fuzzy at points.
Maybe you could do a series, looking at the events and timelines of the series in depth? Might be an interesting community project to actually piece things together. Surely FROM has left us with enough clues to place some what accurately where the games go.
As an old raven myself i think your timeline sounds pretty good.
Seeing this vídeo is funny beacuse I have a similar theory even knowing they're in different universes
And there some big holes there, where did silent line go?
Oh i actually guessed right that you'll make a timeline theory... Then again it's likely expected >.>
Awww, was is that predictable? XD
well thought out theory
Why would Normals need boosting and extra agility if they can't compete with NEXT's anyway with those upgrades. Better to just drown your enemy in Numbers.
Realy nice well thought out theory i like it :)
Nine all was badass
I could never beat any of the armored core games I came across. They're simply too difficult for me to even play and I'm pretty good at difficult games. This franchise though just gave me a run for my money.
Soo the controller afterall was the internecine?
This is just my guess based on the Armored Core games that I've played (I haven't played For Answer though I just know the general gist of it which could prove to ruin my little timeline) - 4/For Answer > 5/Verdict Day > AC3 > Last Raven
Ok so after finding more out about ACFA, it makes more sense for it to go AC3 > LR > 4/FA > 5/VD, but, my only problem is why is Last Raven called Last Raven if there are many mercenaries who are called ravens in 4/FA. This makes me believe it possibly goes
AC3 > 4/FA > LR > 5/VD, but I'm not sure. As I previously stated, I never played 4/FA and nothing before AC3, so I don't have a full grasp on the story as a whole.
I think 1- last raven are connected because I remember the last mission in nexus the boss you had to fight said destoy nine ball and said distroy selveral mor times
That's still under question as that final boss is originally known as "???" then is officially called "Prototype Pulverizer", being called "Nineball" was only in western releases
Nine breaker kìnd of confirmed this but its cannonicity is questionable.
very educational
A big hole with this is the destruction ending of ac4 is (edit"official") cannon
Well, if we are following this theory, it still is canon but for going into gen 3 ^^;
Buster TBM Gameplay i know bit the point of it was that officially the destruction ending is cannon not to come off like an ass
I honestly only care about armored core 3 to last raven. Best games.
I think Gen 1 and 2 are best in terms story and plot in my opinion, but the others are better in terms of gameplay/controls
Man, this video has not aged well. AC timeline works as Gundam's alternative universe and stories, where common ideas and themes are repeated without all them being directly connected.
I haven't finished the video, but in the first couple minutes I already notice a bit of a misconception in regards to "normals"
If you go into training mode in AC4, you will notice that there are options to fight MTs, Normals and NEXTs. MTs are what you've shown us in the video, the guys that stand there with basic abilities. "Normals" are for the most part used like ACs in the game. They boost hover around, show up in groups of 3-4 and can deal serious damage if you're just letting yourself get hit. They might still be the first generation of ACs and I'm not trying to kill your theory, but what you referenced as having no power was in fact not a Normal, but an MT.
But that's just a theory, a GAME THEORY!
Sorry. But if one thing is sure, it's that: Mute + Featureless + Nameless pilot = Run.
In that case...I have an idea...let's ask the creator of all Armored Core games to tell us the truth of the storyline. hehe
Cool theory, good vid
silent line had the best story imo
TBM I have to ask. Do you believe this theory? I ask because you said you had fun piecing it together and what not but I do this same kind of stuff (not like on TH-cam) just to keep my mind of things. My head cannon is that no AC game is connected unless a given or said explicitly (4 and For Answer). It's my perception, interested to hear yours.
Ac
Stryder
Agh there’s so much big correct here…… ac2 and ac2 aa do not take place at same time.
Interesting theory, it's quite similar to my own, although each game's protagonist is a Dark Raven. The destroyer of all who oppose God's will. The destruction ending of acfa has the Dark Raven face off against four nexts, five on hard, which the Dark Raven defeats all of them.
I don't know, certain incarnations of the protagonist don't really seem to fit the Dark Raven thing.
Namely, AC3 for one, But I can see some of them like MoA being one
Buster TBM Gameplay some say the Dark Raven is a savior, others say that the Dark Raven is a destroyer.
Hmm, interesting, then I guess it does fit yeah
The Dark Raven is the Protagonist of Armored Core V, and the "God" talked about in the speech Maggy made, was in fact the AIs from V as well.
Rue Ryuzaki the way I see it, all protagonists of the ac series are the Dark Raven of that time for each game. Each protagonist performs feats thought to be impossible, some were in fact saviors, others were destroyers.
Doesn't address any of the major mysteries, but could the wreckage in AC3's Avalon Hill (Destroy Massive MT, Eliminate the Bombers, etc) be a segment of a fallen Cradle from Destroy Cradle 03?
Oh that is a GOOD theory, looked it up and yes, it has a VERY similar shape, I assume most of it is buried or broken off in other parts of the world.
I mean, who knows how many years have passed?
This theory is so good. I do have a question though. Are the pilots for the Normals in AC 4 and For Answer referred to as Ravens?
I don't think they are, but I could be completely wrong with that
I love it
Unrelated to everything but I absolutely despise the western for answer box art
It's J the reaper from Verdict Day. It's all the dog ration nine ball preventing a another J to reappear. The Raven aka the player... the series is all in order if you loom deep down in the tech. Nothing was reversed engineered like you think in the video. Good theory. But no. Ravens live forever. They will never die.
Also, is Nineball a good guy for some reason why that AI fought against Leos Klein? What about that Nineball from Ninebreaker?
Do you have the names of the songs used?...love gaming music...
TBM, if you remember Leviathan in Nexus and Last Raven, it is present in Armored Core V. the name of this giant mech in ACV is TYPE D NO. 5, but you can only find this on multiplayer. for now you can't go into that server as ACV server had been shutdown. Watch the boss fight on youtube and observe the design for that machine and compare it to Leviathan. the design is seemingly familiar. so, my opinion is that all the ancient technology that were found by corporation in AC1 and Nexus is came from AC4 to it sequel until ACVD. I want to know your opinion about this. your and I have the same theory about this timeline. i'm glad that i'm not the only one that have this theory.
Haha, lemme add to this, so the gen 3 timeline got the leviathan, the gen 4 and5 timeline has that TYPE D NO.5.
But here's the kicker, the gen 1 and 2 timeline got gray cloud in another age.
The same thing in three different timelines.
dear god, how i could miss that. yeah, Grey Cloud from Another Age. thanks for reminding me. but i don't remember seeing that type of machine from gen 1 though. which mission that i miss? please enlighten me.
oh, another hint for you about the Cradle. It was presence in ACVD. i put a link here so that you can add some more information for your theory. th-cam.com/video/7vutWyVlc5s/w-d-xo.html
What about armored core nine breaker
But which year takes actually place?
Between 2050s and 2100s or am i wrong?
You should really play trough AC5, I'm guessing a lot of people turns to you when it comes to AC lore, so at least a basic knowledge would be preferable
Which is the name of music theme used in the video?
1:01 armored core 4 - panther
3:01 armored vore verdict day - mechanized memories
4:17 armored core master of arena - nineball theme
5:56 arored core 3 - artifical sky 2
@@feryan4378 A bit late but thanks you anyways
@@MarK0-D4c no problem
FA is bae
Having only played the original PSOne trilogy & most of the PS2 series of AC games, except for Nine Breaker & Formula Front, I find theory a very interesting concept. However, I'm just going to stay neutral on this subject, since the replies from those who play the PS3 & PS4 games also seem to hold merit.
Overall, the idea would make sense, if the replies from those in the comments about past ACs being in the future games were false to a certain extent.
However i have a question, what of Sera from silent line?
Hmmm, you know... I did not even CONSIDER Sera.... COULD be that she transfered from the controller, or that instead of the controller porting over to the internecine.
Though my bets are still on the controller being transferred to the internecine, it had less of a personality than Sera did.
Buster TBM Gameplay no Sera and the controller are completely different AIs plus to support your theory in the final boss battle Sera uses a mech which looks like a NEXT or Nineball Seraph which indicates she might have access to next technology as well plus she had her own Layered which raises the question about what exactly happened there and we revisit the controller in SL perhaps the mission contains more clues more to that the internecine and its produced pulverizers have a certain emblem which i wonder if it was seen somewhere else. You've made a great leap in connecting but some mysteries aren't solved yet
Oh man, you are completely right regarding Sera, indeed, she uses somethign close to nineball serpah, and my theory was saying that Seraph's body was where NEXT technology was analyzed better than humans have, it makes a lot of sense!
We need to solve more of these mysteries!
Buster TBM Gameplay indeed and we can start with this one: it was presumed in AC3 that the controller malfunctioned and started wiping out instead of governing Layered making unregistered ACs.. Just the same fashion as how the internecine makes pulverizers (we seem to wander in the controller=internecine each step) but was there actually a reason behind that in AC3? maybe a clue in Nexus or silent line
Maybe the controller, now being transferred to the Internecine realises it has to upgrade, and not take from existing tech (the parts it equiped on it's ACs)
Also, Navis is the one in Nexus that FOUND the internecine, and they pretty much set off the alarm bells that completely ruined everything.
Also, remember the Massive MT I called a Leviathan in Another Age? that is from another timeline, so it still fits!