"Dylan Wouldn't Speak To Lanois Anymore!" Mark Howard Recalls Studio Tension Making Time Out of Mind
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 เม.ย. 2024
- In this episode of the LEGENDS Podcast by All Day Vinyl, host Scott Dudelson sits down with legendary producer, recordist and mixer, Mark Howard. This discussion provides an in-depth look into the triumphs and conflicts recording/mixing Bob Dylan's Time out of Mind and Oh Mercy records.
In this clip Mark details a story in the recording studio with Bob Dylan and Daniel Lanois and where the tensions from the "Oh Mercy" sessions spilled over into the 'Time out of Mind' sessions. Mark recorded and mixed the album and has unique insight and access and shares his candid reflections. A must see clip for any fan of the Time out of Mind album or Bob Dylan and his creative process.
Check out the full interview with Mark Howard for more stories about the "Oh Mercy" and "Time out of Mind" recording sessions. Please like and subscribe for more LEGENDS: Podcast by All Day Vinyl clips and full episodes. Thank you for the support, i really appreciate it!
EDITORS NOTE: Episode was recorded in Feb 2024 in Malibu, CA - บันเทิง
I love hearing these stories! thank you for posting this! Really glad I found your channel.
Thank you so much for checking it out! I actually have a whole part 2 interview with mark to post soon - it has studio stories about Neil young, Tom waits and Joni Mitchell .. thank you for subscribing and watching I appreciate it!!
“Time Out of Mind” is an incredible album. It’s sits so far into Dylan’s career that it’s almost be overlooked, despite the awards.
It's usually cited as the first album of his comeback that is still continuing to this day.
Amazing album
@@LanceEads Comeback from what? “Slow Train Coming” was masterful. “Infidels” is too. Most artists couldn’t touch either with their best work. Heck, even his Christmas album has a blend of sounds most artists can’t touch.
Dylan’s volume of excellence is so unparalleled that people in this insatiable generation expect a new album to “drop” every year.
It might be his best album. Definitely in his top 5.
One of my favorite of all time. In my top 10.
Love these fascinating “how the sausage gets made” behind the scenes studio stories.
I’ve got more clips coming soon of mark talking about making le noise with Neil young and real gone with Tom waits - more incredible stories, thank you for tuning in!
😂😂grate story!
Love hearing the inside dope behind studio releases
In 43 years of daily listening to Bob Dylan; and I can confidently say: Bob never ever plays a song, the same, twice 😅
Love that Daniel Lanois' stuff 😊
Listened to TOOM on
MANY MICS too😅
Thank you for checking this clip too!
I’m amazed at people who think Dylan’s approach was a problem. Any good musician who has been in a house band deals with this stuff every night to the point where it’s never a problem. I doubt that the musicians who were hired for this had a problem with the fluidity. Sometimes the spontaneity will produce mistakes but Dylan will have known this. He was paying for the session, so there’s nothing else to discuss.
There's more to it. I've watched other interviews and basically Dylan just had these ideas and would constantly change everything on a whim with the songs. Just listen to Not Dark Yet and though it's a great raw recording- it's kinda outta time and tune. I mean there's noises in that song that don't belong but somehow with the final mixing it turned out pretty good. Basically it was like jams that were kind of experimental and very confusing.
I love this story....
same, i'm endlessly fascinated with Dylan stories ... a man who cannot be summed up
Mark Howard's book, "Listen Up!" is fantastic!
Indeed!
There's people all around. Some on their way up, some on their way down. Bob Dylan , I can't wait.
Fascinating to hear this... because in Daniel Lanois autobiography he recalls the sessions VERY differently! Putting the two together, I'd guess Daniel's positive recollection is more saving face, even though I love his production and I bet he was right about a lot!
I will look into that, I remember an oral history of the album in rolling stone and Lanois did mention tension, def alluded to it during the oh mercy sessions
Well, as I say above, it seems strange that Dylan wanted Lanois to produce his album, but didn't want him to do what he (Lanois) does musically. Why choose a producer like that, that's what he does, sonically.
Brilliant record and one of my all time favorites. Mark that record is a benchmark for me on natural, open sounding records. I'm sad to hear you didn't like your work on it in the beginning. I ado agree Teatro is stunning as well and also one my all time favorites along with Wrecking Ball. Just brilliant work.Cheers!
I’m going to be releasing a part 2 where mark talks about tom waits, Neil young and Joni Mitchell. Some awesome stories. Thank you for watching!
Listen to Hard Rain Gonna Fall and count the bars. It's totally haphazard. I can't imagine the frustration of anyone trying to play with Dylan
Never plays anything the same way twice! Gotta follow him quick or be left behind
@@alldayvinyl I worked for a long time as a musician, violin my main instrument (a lot of country music, which I didn't care for much). There was one guy, guitar/singer, like that who drove me crazy. I'd be part way through a phrase in 4/4, and suddenly it's 3/4., or 5/4, or an extra bar, or whatever. It was impossible. And guys with capos - man I hated those. They're playing in what for them is G, and for me is B-flat. No open strings at all.
Well, Time Out of Mind is a damn great album, whatever the process!
Amen!
I’m a jazz player. We always spontaneously changed keys till we found which the singer liked: not us. Imo- no right to complain if you are backing Bob. Very unusual complaint.
Bob doesn't just change keys- he tends to change the whole arrangement sometimes. It's funny to hear those stories from that played on sessions or backed him live.
Yes, exactly why the bootleg series albums are so essential
I’ve never heard a Bob story that had anything good to say about him.
“Pablo Picasso was never called an asshole,at least not around here” J. Richman
I used to do repair work in a music store and talked to a rather famous guitar player who did session work with Dylan. I asked, " what was Dylan like"?....all he said was " weird."
I always thought it couldve sounded much better. And indeed, the outtakes on the bootleg album do. More direct, less shimmer, phasey, delay. It cleared it up. I get the feeling Lanois did not capture what Dylan had in mind which admittedly was very vague. Lanois was also clearly aiming for the sound in HIS head. Dylan corrected that on the next album, Love and Theft.
Lanois clearly is the guy to go to make money. He knew how to make 'hits'. He's the last guy who should have been doing a Bob Dylan album.
I like Time Out of Mind better than I like Love and Theft but that's me.
Same I think time out of mind is fantastic; I take it over love and theft but I do love that one too
It's like when I hear the New York Sessions, precursor demo of Blood on the Tracks. I think every single song on there sounds perfect, and then he changed them all and released them instead.
He and his process are endlessly fascinating
Dylan has always ben a pain in the ass. His music flows out of his edginess. It's his art. It comes out in his lyrics and music. With Dylan you don't get nice, you get real.
Truth
How biased does Mark sound? Sorry, Lanois is a genius and TOOM is the iconic fantastic record because of him.
Lanois is a genius and mark I know agrees with that
I don't think he sounds biased at all.
The childish behavior is amazing
I never heard the album, but it shows how someone (I imagine Dylan) wasn't thinking straight if they asked Daniel Lanois to produce their album, and then get mad with Lanois for doing what he does.
The album is awesome and def has the Lanois signature sound. The conflict churned out great art, Highly recommended!
Pretty much get the idea that Dylan is pretty much of a diva.
He burns his own trail
That's what I get from other interviews as well. Definitely by the late 60s he changed.
I’m not so sure the musicians on the floor had a problem with this. We’re all used to the singer changing the key. It’s our job to be able to play in any key or change of vibe & still do it. That’s what happens with a mercurial singer. We’re used to doing everything on the fly. I find it hard to believe that Dylan wouldn’t be working with musicians who could modulate at the drop of a hat.
He had some of the best studio musicians in the world, he mentions Jim Keltner who is probably one of the most recorded drummers of all time. Sometimes stuff doesn’t jive it’s likely a combo of things but I wouldn’t lay blame at the musicians feet or Dylan’s feet. It just didn’t work for the collective.. obviously they found the sound
People who are used to work w Dylan know the deal. Dylan goes w whatever comes in his mind and the musicians just adapt. Things might not work out but that's part of the process. I think Lanois has a big enough ego to try and control things. Bringing in 'his people' probably didnt help.
However he writes them and wants to record them... I'd say it seems to be working for him. Everyone involved in the recording is getting paid, AND they were recording. Dylan used to do this kind of thing when playing with The Band while they were onstage! Robbie Robertson said they never knew what song he was going to play next. Bob would start playing and they'd have to just jump in.
Hahaha totally, par for the course!
In the end you have to go w the paymaster. That goes f musicians and studio technicians. Artists like Dylan hear things in their head and go with flow. A controlling ego like lanois will cause issues. Maybe he though he could do another Oh, Mercy which sounds like a Lanois album. He clearly couldnt.
Ask Al Kooper why he was half a step behind on Fourth Street and Rolling Stone.
i gotta look up some kooper interviews, would love to hear him talk about this!
@@alldayvinyl I’ve heard him tell the stories.
Tom Petty mentioned that playing live with Dylan could be a pisser at times. The band had a set list and would commence the intro, when Dylan would then start playing another song altogether. Love all his work, but ignoring people and making aside's like "Did somebody speak?", is both childish and petulant.
so your saying "Its Really Bad"
Created amazing album tho
Bob hasnt sung in Any key for at least 30 years
Wouldn’t want it any other way…
😂😂
HAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAA😂
I'm so glad the Dylan team had this one remixed. I've NEVER liked the Lanois mix.
Totally agree. The new version sounds so much better. Closer to Love and Theft which i really like. But i think Lanois was also not happy. It kinda fell in between everything. Too much of the phasey, delay, odd harmonics stuff on the original. The new one is much clearer..
Still, i do wonder how lanois version wouldve sounded if he had his way like on Oh Mercy. He was in control then..
Really?
not a big fan of lanois' production with dylan. his work with emmy lou harris and willie nelson is passable as emmy lou and willie weren't as eccentric as bob.i am really glad the bootleg series of time out of mind came out.
I liked the time out of mind and also the fragments box set. His process is just endlessly fascinating
@@alldayvinyl lanois thought he was equal to bob....ummm well we all know who is in charge!
1. "Changing keys is like relearning the song"? Sorry, man, not for a good musician. 2. Trying to tell Bob Dylan which version of a song to pursue is a chump move. That is all!
Overrated hacks.
What goes on in the studio should stay in the studio.This is B.S.........
I mean, Dylan documented his conflict with Lanois in his book and various pieces have been recounted by Dylan and Lanois in interviews… I do not think many artists have a what goes on in studio, stays in studio mentality. Alot of art creation has conflict
If you can't play comfortably in every key, you're not a studio musician.
....or sing
It wasn't just the keys, he would change the whole structure of the songs too. I mean having 2 pedal steel players and 2 drummers, 2 bass players on the same song playing random parts live. That's just the tip of the pain. It's was a very crazy atmosphere like a free for all with limited structure and constant change. At least that's what I've seen from other interviews. Lanois did his best to keep it together.
It’s not the different keys but transcribing the chord progressions instantly which most people can’t do
There’s been far too much worship of Bob Dylan, the man, over the past 60 years. Enjoy his music and his impact, but don’t make apologies for his being an abrasive curmudgeon, right from the start.
This is just a dumb comment😂 Sounds like lanois was getting in the way of the process and dylan was tired of it
I don’t think it’s a dumb comment at all. It points to the fact that Dylan is more than one thing. He’s both a total original AND an occasional plagiarist - both/and. People’s need to deify him says more about us than it does him.
@@edwardmeradith2419 It is dumb, now you’re saying he’s a plagiarist? Lol! Pretty sure more people have copied bob than the other way around. And no one is deifying him, you just sound like a hater and incredibly jealous.
@@jimreplicant you’re so wrong- at least, about me being a hater. I LOVE Bob - I love him because rather than in spite of some of things - I don’t need him to be perfect.
He rode the folksong wave - where, by nature of what ‘folk’ means, melodies are borrowed and reused -
It was the established practice. Bob used a lot of public domain melodies as well as more recent. His ‘Song to Woody’ off his first album, one of just two originals on that album, were Bob’s words with music actually lifted from an old Woody Guthrie tune.
Joni Mitchell called him a plagiarist (there are sections of songs from recent albums that are incrementally changed, allegedly, from Civil War era author - I really don’t care -)
I lLOVE and 100% respect Dylan - I love his humanity. And like the man said on Rough and Rowdy Ways, “I Contain Multitudes”
(which imho is a brilliant song, but the title phrase and concept were from Walt Whitman.)
@@edwardmeradith2419 who cares what joni mitchell thinks, she’s awful anyway. You started with dylan being a “curmudgeon” and then morphed into this plagiarism garbage lol just stop already you know nothing