Dwarven engineer: Ok here is the plan. I'm gonna build a flying machine. One of the biggest ever. Basically a flying fortress. It will have guns and bombs and powerful armor. And then I'm gonna ram things on the ground with it!
i just moded them to be a gyrobomber "wing" of 3 or five units, oh dear lord the sweet carnage of multiple automatic .50 cannons, or the line buster of 5 payloads in the frontline. so sweet
i remember forsaken being pretty usefull as some point in WH1. they were a great flanking unit with their surpising high speed. i think they should either get a speed buff or a new ability something like the berserk ability for berserkers. let them get progressively stronger the longer they stay in the fight or by getting more kills in general that way, sending a group of forsaken into an archer unit so they become more powerful is a legit strat
Yeah, you used to see them all the time, but that was before WH2 added a couple of high damage low armor piercing units that basically do the same thing. I mean regular Saurus have almost the same strength but are more durable.
I agree the globadiers have underwhelming damage, but I'll often get more kills with bombardiers than with ratlings or warpfire throwers because of line of fire problems with the latter
Forsaken can have niche applications in mowing down chaff like zombies+skellies, skavenslaves, peasants etc. Sure, those units are much cheaper, but they still fulfill a purpose (getting in the way) and getting rid of them asap means you get into the cookie jar that much faster. They have 58 (!) weapon strength, that is no joke. Against stuff that can't effectively fight back, they will utterly decimate them, faster than even Chosen would. I would never bring them against missile factions unless I was doing threat overload, but against Vampire Counts specifically they can be very useful. I would also consider them against the Lizardmen because they counter skinks.
Try out a haggard (tm) forsaken rush! I used to run it back in WH1 just blitzing in with Kolek and sniping out characters and hoping for the best with a forsaken frontline
you seriously bullied the casket of souls. you're not meant to use it at long range. you have it fire as close as possibly, and ideally over your frontline, decimating the infantry engaged. it's amazing. it does HUGE damage, and has a good number of shots.
I was honestly shocked that the meme tank didn't take it for the Empire until I remembered you can just run it into chaff over and over and over until the world melts under chaos.
Honestly I wouldn't have even included the the Globadiers and Bombadiers in the Skavens' initial roster and would have just given them the poison wind mortar.
Turin please, I need a skink only build. Ive never seen it. Only skinks, feral monsters or one's manned by skinks ( would that mean the monsters are skinkked by skinks lol) I just need to see these little boi's have their day :')
Can use all of them sacrifices to buff quite a bit, and red crested skink chiefs can provide alot of skinky bonuses. Skink bois can be strong, like playing old school skaven
I find it kind of hilarious that the Greenskins, as a faction roster, have arguably both the best selection of light cav and worst selection of heavy cav in the entire game xD
In my experience the Casket of Souls does far more than just “OK” damage, I often get over 200 kills with it in a battle (plus as you mentioned it has its other bonus effects). I agree with you on War Wagon Mortar, I’d rather have War Wagon Great Cannons since they would benefit far more from being able relocate with cannons being far more fussy with their targeting. Dwarf irondrakes I think are quite underrated actually.
I feel if they just lowered the price tag a little on the Casket - maybe to around 1000 - it would be worth taking even just for the magic buff, with the shooting attack as a nice bonus... As it stands, though, the only time I've truly seen it be useful is on Khatep.
@@PeteTheGrouch ye in multiplayer the cost is also a big factor on how good a unit is but in campaign the Casket is one of the best artilleries in the game... it does insane damage and pretty much rekts any unit you put it on. (aside from single entities) So i was surprised to see it on this list, i would say bone giant is the worst... it only works well on insanely large targets like mammoths but its accuracy is only decent, and very punishing... the damage is great but everytime you miss its a huge waste. The ushabti greatbows do much better job at sniping out large targets and even heroes/lords... not only do they have good AP damage their accuracy isnt tied to a single projectile either so you are less likely to completely miss all damage of single volley. Thats just my opinion, i dont play multiplayer so im not gonna claim anything on that side... im sure bone giant can be better there with its insane damage per shot.
@@motioncaptiveduck You can't really make a video like this for campaign as there are way to many factors in play like who you face and what your lord/faction abilities are. Also casket is extremely cheap and adds a bonus effect in campaign. We are talking multiplayer here.
@@motioncaptiveduck Bone giants are cool & all, but, they definitely need either a price reduction, or else a SIGNIFICANT accuracy buff... As you said, when they're missing at least 1-2 in every three shots, it's just a huge waste of resources. It wouldn't be so bad if the opponent was actually juking the shots; however, I've seen the giants whiff horribly even against STATIC targets..! It's shame, really... I don't think the Bone giant is a terrible unit, by any means - it's just damned _hard_ to make back their points cost. -_-
Irondrakes really benefitted from the explosion damage buff. Now they can wipe out unarmored units in 2-3 bouts of fire. Not top tier, but very handy on certain occasions.
Giants also got "buffed" cost efficiency wise just recently. 1 giant may suck, but you can often get two for the price of 1 large monster from other factions, and they will absolutely paste most things in 2v1, including the dread saurian.
Well... It comes down to them still being leagues ahead of the worst units for Beastmen, Norsca, Chaos and Particularily greenskins (Orc Boar Boyz are genuinely the worst unit in the entire game, they are so bad you can't even make them work in campaign)
Alexander Weaver Lol I’ve definitely thought the same... when they want to shoot forward towards an enemy the horses can just pull them in range and then turn the wagon around so it can fire, and then if chased by enemies it can fire away. Of course I think they may have decided that speed kiting artillery may have been too much.
The war wagons with mortars are so stupid. The entire thing with mortars is that they can shoot over obstacles, so whats the point in repositioning them? They would be much better with regular great cannons or even hellfire rocket batteries.
ares354 ares354 I think they could’ve done a chariot like one that doesn’t have conventional melee, maybe like instead of handguns they use blunderbusses vampire coast style? And give that variant more armor and melee defense to have them be more of a driveby unit
The ability to relocate them before the battle ends is actually good in campaign. There are more than a few maps that are just borked for arty because the deployment zone is covered in trees, and by the time it takes for normal mortars to get out of it, the fight is already over.
Hey man, thanks for the video. You said we should suggest units to use for future videos. I think it would be interesting to have a wood elf build with moslty treekin and treemen. With the idea being that you make a very tanky build. Maybe throw in some wild hunt cav for hammering the anvil and all that.
I've actually used Ithilmar chariots to very good effect in 2v2 match ups, the problem like you point out is the price. If they were priced around 900 or so they'd be situational must-picks against lightly armored factions but 1100 is too much of an investment. Have a few games where I use one of these to push through DE infantry protecting darkshards for very good effect but the stars must align.
I'm not an online player, so take this only for single player but high phys.resist units do absolute wonders for me in the campaign. I've seen quite a few online battles posted here to TH-cam and I wonder if an army with lots of these would be surprisingly good in multiplayer, as they are not used in the current meta.
There's two music tracks playing over the top of each other for much of the video making it annoying to listen to, some music you've added yourself and the ingame soundtrack I can hear behind it. Just some feedback, I found the actual information interesting
Completely disagree about Casket of Souls, have amassed huge value from these before especially against cavalry. Can be pretty risky and doesn't always accrue value but much better than the catapults, even though they are hilarious to manually fire. Overall great video and love these lists, do you think you could do a best ror's list, based on how much they improve the base unit but also the roster i.e. the Rusty Arrows as they allow for GS gunlines.
Ya but you gotta realize he's talking high level multiplayer play it's way different than campaign or lower lvl ladder matches. At the highest lvl the players can micro out of the way easily. I've seen it enough lol.
Casket has a pretty good fire rate and in order to catch out higher level players you just need to constantly switch targets. It's a risky pick but certainly not the worst unit for the TK
Casket is bad for the same reason hellstorm is bad. It gets competition in the roster. It's designed to kill infantry blobs and is useless vs large and single targets. What you typically want to eliminate on approach is elites, not blobs of chaff. Bowshabti are just always better at that, they can cripple elite infantry just as well as they do monsters and lords, not to mention they're mobile and aren't useless in melee. That's 90% a SP unit. It has merits vs missile spam, like vampirates sometimes bring, but that's it.
Not arguing bow ushabti arent better, simply that you can get value from the casket opposed to a unit like screaming skull catapult. Which is bad due to damage output.
I’m surprised you picked the casket over the screaming meme for tombkings, also no mention of the never used and likely forgotten ice wolf chariot for norsca.
I think all deck dropper units must be given an ability to drop the zombies once they run out of ammo, kinda like bolas for the Lizardmen. Optionally, the zombies can act like wannabe bloated corpses on impact - just imagine the carnage! After the drop, the bats basically become overgrown fellbats.
Yeah, Warpfire and globadiers are excellent against blobbed infantry and Minotaurs are often the only thing useful in your army as Beastmen, which do have a LOT of just poor units
units are always balanced around multiplayer so as such when talking about unit stats and capability you always "Or at least 90%" of the time talk about it from a mp perspective the answer to "what unit is the best for campaign" the answer is any unit you want landmark buffs red-line buffs tech tree buffs you name it hell i have seen buffed HE spears beat chaos warriors in campaign campaign unit balance is literally thrown out the window so it legit does not matter what unit you use in campaign as they all are viable with the correct buffs and price-point
@@thehistorians5231 Not in anything above normal, infantry just plain sucks in campaign at higher difficulties and with the AI cheats your elite troops are destroyed by goblin spearmen.
@@Lones555 not true i actually did ample tests in custom battles a good time back where i gave 1 unit of chaos warriors "standard" ALL of the cheats they get + rank 9 chevrons then i gave a unit of normal HELF spears all of the possible buffs they can get in stats "red-line techs landmarks" and they can actually just barely beat chaos warriors that is a extreme scenario that will realistically never occur since it requires a very specific set of buffs to happen but my point is a unit that costs 750 gold that is the hardest possible counter to a unit that costs 500 gold still LOSES to it with the correct buffs applied so any time somebody comes and tells me units are balanced around campaign i simply tell them about my tests
Ironically, for Wood Elves, Treemen are one of the strongest monster for the cost in the game. They just don't fit the roster very well, and being slow is an issue. Dual wield minotaurs got a massive buff last patch. They're actually pretty strong now in a lot of match ups. They can take down temple guard 1-1, and don't need much help to take down phoenix guard or black guard, and they can win those fights easily with a bit of cycle charging - shield minotaurs can't. Even DW minotaurs can't beat chosen halbs, but they do beat great weapon chosen. They melt pretty much any infantry other than the most elite halberd units (though they do trade poorly with cheap anti-large infantry, like all poorly armoured large units). They can even beat giatn slayers 1-1 without cyclecharging, though they can't beat the dragonback slayers, and the 36% slow prevents them from cyclecharging. I'd rate regular ungors as the worst unit in the beastmen roster; they're the only one I actively try to avoid using, because they lose to clanrats, despite costing 100 more funds; stalk and vanguard are valuable, but pretty much everything has vanguard for beastmen, and there are better options for hunting archers/artillery for similar cost, like warhounds, and they're not worth so much that a unit costing 100 less should beat a stalk/vanguard unit, especially with price points that low..
I honestly can't remember seeing wood elves fighting anything but Dwarfs . . . but usually you see them bringing 6 units of eternal guard to finish of everything after the archers have ran out of ammo, why not 2 treemen? In theory they should be more cost effective because you're not paying for anti large you're not using . . . (shrug)
sirgaz if it’s one thing dwarfs are good at killing it’s slow monsters with large hit boxes. also the trees do magic damage which dwarfs are resistant against
@@Thongger From most the replays I've seen the Dwarven ranged/artillery units are the first to die to the skirmishers and slayers second, usually by the time the melee starts it's just dwarf warriors vs eternal guard. I did forget they did magic damage though, that is a big downside.
Gonna have to disagree with a lot of the list I think. PWG for skaven are really nasty for how cheap they are, their biggest issue is their AA performance, but they melt large with ease. Skull Cat is imo head and shoulders worse than casket. Mortar wagon is head and shoulders better than than the normal wagon, I think post buff the mortar wagon will actually be in a solid spot, while normal wagon is probably a solid 300 gold overpriced.
I've used the ithilmar chariot with great results. It just requires quite a lot of micromanaging. But silver helms? Damn, it's impossible to do anything important with those.
Both high and dark elves were underdeveloped. High elves are priced based on a perk that lasts for about 3-4 minutes at most without a healer, dark elves are stacked around a perk that doesn't activate until the battle's almost over. It's ridiculous and serves no purpose for regular players. I like the White Lions, but they're garbage at their job and arguably worse than the Ithilmar chariot. (which i hate for being a shitty insert unit.)
@@johnburgman9135 Nah dude. Dark Elves aren't stacked around that perk at all. You don't even need Murderous mastery to smash other factions. That's just a free bonus. Im curious as to how that's underdeveloped.
Turin, can you do a build with each faction that tries its hardest to make the worst units work? Maybe a magic focused build for casket of souls, or a slower tree build for the treeman.
I can never understand the science behind the Mortar Wagon. I mean mortar have one of the best arc of fire in the game, you pretty much gets value shots without having to move them ever. Theres no point in giving them relocating ability. Its like giving a Cygor wings and make it fly. Like why???
I use poison wind globadiers to hit units in melee combat, where I can keep them off fire at will and thrown them into mobs of units that are trying to delay or swarm my units
Opinion on Forsaken: treat them like cycle charging infantry similar to the two handed sword units from Shogun 2. They get a charge bonus of 30, bringing their attack stat up to lord levels and their damage in the area of 80-90. Send them into the back of a unit, let them wail for a few seconds, pull them out with their higher than average speed and repeat. Doesn't totally justify the flaws with the unit, but I think that's the best way to use it.
Dark riders are pathetic. Low stats, low leadership. Harpies are better with high defense and damage. The shades w/ dual weapons just have trouble finding a place but dark riders w/ and w/o shields have no place.
Mac Gargan Can only speak from campaign perspective cause I don’t play multiplayer, but in campaign, the Dark Riders do a great job at hammer & anvil if you cycle charge them and can‘t afford or don’t want to field cold ones
I prefere dual weapon shades over 2h weap shades. Because I want the 1 unit of shades that goes melee mode. Tank as long as possible. While the rest of the shades keep shooting.
Turin do you have some skin mods for units, I swear your Minos have more variation than I ever get, and the norms can marauder dudes look different too. Also looked like one of the boar boars was a black roc mounted haha.
CA. Please buff the PIGGIES !!!!!!!! Easy fix though. Keep all stats the same except for charge bonus, which goes to around 60. 70 for big'uns. Also lore friendly, as the boars themselves had an extra charge bonus from their tusks in tabletop.
I think they also need some extra melee attack. Like, they have lower melee attack than Orc Arrer Boyz. Also, why is their weapon strength lower than default Orc Boyz? Sure, they have much better ap but it still doesn't make any sense that they'd hit any less hard.
Oh boy, this video didnt age well... Casket of Souls is on the list. AND STOP SAYING: "In my opinion." It just cames out like you did a shit research because stuff like this can be objectively measured. Or rename your video to The Worst Unit For Each Faction In My Opinion.
I had once back in Warhammer 1 a Durthu Doomstack with like 10, 12 Treemen and Forest Dragons and honestly it was one of the best campaigns I've ever had. I love the model, I love the sound, love the animations.. I wish CA would buff the Treeman, because right now it's such a waste of an amazing model.
But right now thay have buff them a lot, i started in warhammer 2 and i remember how treeman had almost no armor piercing damage which was nuts considering their size, they gave them more ap, defense vs all and lately plus 10 armor, i think right now thay are solid surprise unit, just like a giant, less damage but more durable
Chariots are insanely micro-heavy glass cannons. If you can spare the time and attention to repeatedly circle-charge them, every single chariot in the game can do about twice the damage and mayhem as two good shock cavalry units combined, but if they get bogged down (which tends to happen a lot), they are more or less useless and gets ganked in moments. Because of that, they are more or less the poster-boys of high-risk-high-reward tactics, which are not for everyone.
Ah okay makes sense . I just bought the game probably a month ago so I’m not really up to date on what was good and bad then and the buffs .... now would you prefer razordons or the salamanders??
Ok so I disagreed on Skaven (Skavenslaves are worse) but I have to put my foot down. War Wagon Mortals are amazing! They are basically a mortal unit with the speed and mobility of a cavalry! What is Mortals and artillery's biggest weakness? Cavalry.
Forsaken build: Any chariot to mess up an infantry units charge and immediately follow up with forsaken when they are down. Harry enemy missiles with hounds or something.
1. HE Chariot is great in some matchups. You can bring only 2 nobles, so at least 2 of this chariot units is needed. For example vs dwarfs. And archer chariot is much weaker in melee. For HE worst is ARMORED archers. Useless derp unit. 2. Weakest unit in Lizardmen roster is fuckin Nakai. He suck hard. cost ~700 more than ancient kroxigor and worse in any way. And he knocked around all the times too. If we ignore Lords - feral cold ones. They suck hard too. Even vs some archers, like quarellers - they lost 1v1. Its literally ideal target for them - archers with high armor. And they still lose it. 3. For TK its fuckin bone giant. This shit is driving me nuts. It so derp, slow and innacurate, it suck so hard - even meme casket is better. Also casket is ok on khotep sometimes (not worth, imho, but ok and dont make you angry). 4. Empire - regular wagons is worse. This guys suck too, but at least this is mortar. Regular wagons is 2 times worse than 1 unit of handgunners while cost more. 5. Orks - Grimgore still the worse LL in the game and if we dont talk about lords - night goblins archers with fanatics. Why somebody need this skill on ranged unit? At least regular boar boys can be userful with Wurrzag. 6. -"crypt horrors is quite pitiful" WHAT? This is great cost effective monster unit. With regen, ap and poison. Seriously wtf? 7. Chaos - feral manticore cuz it go nuts after few hits and die from spears. Or chaos knights with swords. Just sad pitiful unit. Forsaken at least fast and do great damage to squishy targets.
Hi Turin, In 7th edition Tabletop there was a Bretonnian Build used for tournaments (and I was the Evil WE guy) called "the Bretonnian Flying Circus": 3 basic knights in Lance formation, melee heroes on pegasus/griffin, lots flying pegususes and a grail Lance with Damsels. Despite I never played Bretonnia in such environments it was very challenging to play against and watch the matches. I think it would be awesome to make a big surprise on a match with a similar build. Keep doin' stuff ;)
While I dont disagree with what you've said turin, I believe your review of the gyrobombers is a result of a mixed up perception, I THINK (I dont know, Some games I know portray stats INCLUDING the ability damage of a unit if said unit is a 'caster' type) it is showing mainly the damage of the bombs (Which would make sense cus bombs are pretty potent), And not infact the damage of the machine gun, which I reckon is probably missile damage equivalent to most dwarven firearm infantry. Still, I am no statistics expert nor do I delve directly into the game's data so Take what I state with a grain of salt.
The new Gyrobomber really isnt bad. The main gun can ONLY target things with mass. The accuracy changes to almost perfect. It seems like using the bombs early really is a trap, so saving them for the end game is best. Finally, use a Gyrobomber in close proximity with Gyrocopters with steam guns. It adds a few more bombs and the steam + minigun combined can dissuade opponents flyers from engaging in CC. Sure you still have to have SOMETHING on the ground to help them, but you can get away with a pair of Quarrellers. Almost all Dawi online matches end with some haggard Slayers and like 2 characters, so I would think bombing those end game blobs is an obvious pick.
Ark of Sotec needs permanent-slow in a small radius around it, with a temporary increase in range via ability, so that it can fuck over cab blobs easier, maybe constant poison? Warp fire needs buff to range and dmg, with no reload. Death Globe needs insane slow, and massive melee defense/attack debug on any unit hit, lasting for minutes afterwords. Deck Droppers don’t deserve anything, fuck them bats. Casket of Souls needs homing missiles, and massive fear aura like in lore. Doesn’t need to fire fast, but missiles are somewhat self aware, and screech with the combined anguish of 100 bloated corpse mains, and the effects should reflect this in game. War wagon mortar needs added DPS/firerate, maybe even handgunners in the cart to add that little bit more damage. Gyro Bomber needs multiple guns on it, to deal with infantry, plus more bombs. (Like multiple thunderers, maybe even multiple steam guns, needs decent aim) Ork boar boys should be shit. Sorry, but they are dirty green skins on pigs, they can’t be fast, or high DPS. (Hex Wraiths should be better) Corpse Cart has abysmal regen, needs more range. Marauder Hunters should be mixed-infantry, have marauder-tier melee dmg/melee defense. Trebuchets need accuracy, or very cheap. Blessed needs bigger splash. Tree man needs to have higher armor Cow Cunts don’t deserve any buffs. Maybe higher attack speed, but tough shit. Forsaken need More attack speed, running speed, damage, etc.
Deck droppers being nerfed and now ending up on this list is why I say CA needs to be more careful about nerfing things because of MP. I don't mind buffs necessarily, but CA should stop nerfing units and making them useless (or almost useless for campaign.) Let players develop strategies for dealing with them, HAVE A LITTLE FAITH and stop making fun units lame.
Really - Cascet of Souls is worse then Screaming Catapults? :D Maybe in multiplayer. But I would not pick Screaming Catapult if I had a choice. It's hillariously inaccurate, low dmg and if it hits only thing it does is lower morale. Also try them when enemy line it crushing into yours and everyone it close to each other. They can't properly shoot unless you do it yourself by taking control. Cascet of Souls does not have those problems at all. And when it does hit blobed infantry units it MELTS them. Screw Screaming Catapult fans! :P
Disrespecting the razordon hunting back! I mean, yeah, initially they're not as good as their fire breathing cousins, primarily due to their fire rate... but in Nakai's campaign where you can just SPAWN those suckers behind armored targets in a fight, where they're entrenched against your line? They shred. I think yes, they can use a buff, a bit too much micro for MP to generate real value... maybe more missile resistance? But over all, they do have a niche! Ark of Sotek doesn't... it's just bad.
I'd say Shades Dual Weapons are a bit niche, but nice. Sure basic Shades or Greatswords are a bit better, but Dual weapons is the unit you take when you want your archers to counter doggos and chaff coming at them. Gyrobombers… oh, come on. They were good already, but after the last patch they are now extremely deadly. Their bombs decimate infantry, their cannons snipe single models. I'd say they are even OP, although you need to learn how to use them. Field Breb… specific, sure, but it could do very well in certain situations. For WE I'd Say Eagle is the worst unit(the basic one, not mounts, mounts are great). Treeman at least get used from time to time, but Eagles are picked much more rarely.
![CAMPปลิ้น | EP.82[1/2] แก๊ง 3 สาวเพื่อนซี้บุก CAMPปลิ้นครั้งนี้ห้ามเสียอาการ](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/_6WUjXHe1TM/mqdefault.jpg)
Community: "Gyrobombers are bad"
CA: "ok how about this.... +1 melee attack"
LMAO
*Innovation*
Dwarven engineer: Ok here is the plan. I'm gonna build a flying machine. One of the biggest ever. Basically a flying fortress. It will have guns and bombs and powerful armor. And then I'm gonna ram things on the ground with it!
i just moded them to be a gyrobomber "wing" of 3 or five units, oh dear lord the sweet carnage of multiple automatic .50 cannons, or the line buster of 5 payloads in the frontline. so sweet
@@pridefulobserver3807 Your mod better includes 4 seconds of Wagner's "Ride of the Valkyries" which plays whenever they charge.
i remember forsaken being pretty usefull as some point in WH1. they were a great flanking unit with their surpising high speed.
i think they should either get a speed buff or a new ability something like the berserk ability for berserkers. let them get progressively stronger the longer they stay in the fight or by getting more kills in general
that way, sending a group of forsaken into an archer unit so they become more powerful is a legit strat
Yeah, you used to see them all the time, but that was before WH2 added a couple of high damage low armor piercing units that basically do the same thing. I mean regular Saurus have almost the same strength but are more durable.
I agree the globadiers have underwhelming damage, but I'll often get more kills with bombardiers than with ratlings or warpfire throwers because of line of fire problems with the latter
3:01 Malus darkblade before that demon got in his mind
Forsaken can have niche applications in mowing down chaff like zombies+skellies, skavenslaves, peasants etc. Sure, those units are much cheaper, but they still fulfill a purpose (getting in the way) and getting rid of them asap means you get into the cookie jar that much faster. They have 58 (!) weapon strength, that is no joke. Against stuff that can't effectively fight back, they will utterly decimate them, faster than even Chosen would.
I would never bring them against missile factions unless I was doing threat overload, but against Vampire Counts specifically they can be very useful. I would also consider them against the Lizardmen because they counter skinks.
Try out a haggard (tm) forsaken rush! I used to run it back in WH1 just blitzing in with Kolek and sniping out characters and hoping for the best with a forsaken frontline
you seriously bullied the casket of souls. you're not meant to use it at long range. you have it fire as close as possibly, and ideally over your frontline, decimating the infantry engaged. it's amazing. it does HUGE damage, and has a good number of shots.
I was honestly shocked that the meme tank didn't take it for the Empire until I remembered you can just run it into chaff over and over and over until the world melts under chaos.
Its quite good in some match-ups!
Bring back Forsaken flanking tactics for old times sake 😁
Did he forget about Bloated Corpses or whatever those suicide bombers are for Vampire Coast?
Bloaty boy is better in MP I think, sadly. haha
Casket of Souls? U Mad? Thats one of the most useful unit with Tomb Kings.
It is now! This is outdated
Mortar war wagons are good for breaking up light massed infantry.
This is why i play SFO. all the units are kinda useful and distinct
The Most Haggard Unit For Each Faction | Total War Warhammer 2 List
Normal minos are pretty decent now with BvI. Great vs dawi.
really when i have a casket of souls most of my tatics are based in the kill's it makes
Its good now, this list is outdated
every unit is the worst unit when i use them...
I feel you bro
You speak the truth, LoreMaster of NoobMaster69
Uninstall then
@@bufan7177 no u
@@bufan7177 You can still have fun when you're bad.
0:23 - High Elves
1:18 - Lizardmen
2:22 - Dark Elves
3:27 - Skaven
4:56 - Vampire Coast
6:06 - Tomb Kings
7:12 - Empire
8:30 - Dwarfs
9:54 - BOOOOOOOIIIIIIIIIIZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
10:52 - Vampire Counts
12:09 - Norsca
13:22 - Bretonnia
14:01 - Wood Elves
15:04 - Beastmen
16:15 - Chaos Warriors
Thank you!
Do you think you'll get the word "haggard" tattoo'd on you at some point?
Yes!
@@turinRTS You getting it as a tramp stamp? ^^
@@Anastarion YES
I'm imagining a naked turin laying down with the HAGGARD tramp stamp like paint me like your french girls
Right biceps: STEEL, left biceps: CHAIR
While talking about the dark elves Turin called them both High elves and beastmen and did not call them dark elves
Because he speaks way too fast so has not enough time to think.
Really need to mute existing music before overlaying custom music to a video. Two different tracks playing in unison is extremely hard to listen to.
It was strange
Aye, editor must have missed this, my apologies
13:34 have you considered that they can launch 90 kg projectiles over 300 meters?
Yes, but Its obviously better if the 90kg projectile is blessed by the lady.
WE SHALL RETAKE JERUSALEM.
Trebuchets are the most superior
@@Valivali94 And is filled with holy water from ZE LAKE
I understood that reference =)
Globadiers and Bombadiers aught to have a lingering poison cloud effect.
That would only make sense
@Jordan Winders many times bombadiers have better line of sight
Sfo 2 is the answer
Honestly I wouldn't have even included the the Globadiers and Bombadiers in the Skavens' initial roster and would have just given them the poison wind mortar.
@@JohnDoe-xv9du Don't forget unfriendly fire.
Turin please, I need a skink only build. Ive never seen it. Only skinks, feral monsters or one's manned by skinks ( would that mean the monsters are skinkked by skinks lol) I just need to see these little boi's have their day :')
cult of sotek subfaction is very skink focused. may be worth a look
It’s not enough though. Cult of sotek is cool but late game the skinks still just aren’t good enough.
Cause they are tier 1 units lmao
Can use all of them sacrifices to buff quite a bit, and red crested skink chiefs can provide alot of skinky bonuses. Skink bois can be strong, like playing old school skaven
4 skink cohorts with javs, 2 normal, 2 red crests 1 ror, 2 chameleons, 2 rippers, 2 cold one spears and Tehenuin on a ripper.
When you realise you have been using these the entire time
Thats me with forsaken
@@nanoacido5174 Forsaken used to be good, but yeah these days they're just too squishy.
The balance changes so much every patch. Some of these used to be staples of their race.
Aggressive Tubesock exaclty
@Aggressive Tubesock if you ever used one of these, you should just go ahead and uninstall the game
So sad that even goblin wolf riders are better and more useful than boar boyz, even the BB ROR sucks
I find it kind of hilarious that the Greenskins, as a faction roster, have arguably both the best selection of light cav and worst selection of heavy cav in the entire game xD
@@JimRFF it makes more sense lore wise
What about Savage ones?
Garrett H No lore wise best light cab is dark elves and best heavy is ogres or Vampire counts
Big uns are cheap anti large
In my experience the Casket of Souls does far more than just “OK” damage, I often get over 200 kills with it in a battle (plus as you mentioned it has its other bonus effects).
I agree with you on War Wagon Mortar, I’d rather have War Wagon Great Cannons since they would benefit far more from being able relocate with cannons being far more fussy with their targeting.
Dwarf irondrakes I think are quite underrated actually.
I feel if they just lowered the price tag a little on the Casket - maybe to around 1000 - it would be worth taking even just for the magic buff, with the shooting attack as a nice bonus... As it stands, though, the only time I've truly seen it be useful is on Khatep.
@@PeteTheGrouch ye in multiplayer the cost is also a big factor on how good a unit is but in campaign the Casket is one of the best artilleries in the game... it does insane damage and pretty much rekts any unit you put it on. (aside from single entities)
So i was surprised to see it on this list, i would say bone giant is the worst... it only works well on insanely large targets like mammoths but its accuracy is only decent, and very punishing... the damage is great but everytime you miss its a huge waste.
The ushabti greatbows do much better job at sniping out large targets and even heroes/lords... not only do they have good AP damage their accuracy isnt tied to a single projectile either so you are less likely to completely miss all damage of single volley.
Thats just my opinion, i dont play multiplayer so im not gonna claim anything on that side... im sure bone giant can be better there with its insane damage per shot.
@@motioncaptiveduck You can't really make a video like this for campaign as there are way to many factors in play like who you face and what your lord/faction abilities are. Also casket is extremely cheap and adds a bonus effect in campaign.
We are talking multiplayer here.
@@motioncaptiveduck Bone giants are cool & all, but, they definitely need either a price reduction, or else a SIGNIFICANT accuracy buff... As you said, when they're missing at least 1-2 in every three shots, it's just a huge waste of resources.
It wouldn't be so bad if the opponent was actually juking the shots; however, I've seen the giants whiff horribly even against STATIC targets..!
It's shame, really... I don't think the Bone giant is a terrible unit, by any means - it's just damned _hard_ to make back their points cost. -_-
Irondrakes really benefitted from the explosion damage buff.
Now they can wipe out unarmored units in 2-3 bouts of fire. Not top tier, but very handy on certain occasions.
youve heard of deck droppers w bombers
but
terrorgheists w bloated corpses???
AyeAyeRon That sounds... Deadly.
AyeAyeRon I’d buy that.
RIP to any and all infantry that fails to get out of the way.
Im amazed every faction with giants didnt have them listed as the worst unit
Razzpen1 giants can do okay against factions with little or no range.
@@misterpig7739 Yep, they are alright against VC and freinds, i have even seen them work against the Lizards.
Would be a real boring video
Giants also got "buffed" cost efficiency wise just recently. 1 giant may suck, but you can often get two for the price of 1 large monster from other factions, and they will absolutely paste most things in 2v1, including the dread saurian.
Well... It comes down to them still being leagues ahead of the worst units for Beastmen, Norsca, Chaos and Particularily greenskins (Orc Boar Boyz are genuinely the worst unit in the entire game, they are so bad you can't even make them work in campaign)
But i have to say, campaign armies with like 5 mortar wagons against skaven is really fun.
Mortar wagons are great in campaign to augment weaker armies.
Especially since you basically get them for free.
An Empire Engineer needs to get the horses to pull the wagon the other way so the mortar and hellblaster can fire at pursuing targets.
Alexander Weaver Lol I’ve definitely thought the same... when they want to shoot forward towards an enemy the horses can just pull them in range and then turn the wagon around so it can fire, and then if chased by enemies it can fire away. Of course I think they may have decided that speed kiting artillery may have been too much.
The war wagons with mortars are so stupid. The entire thing with mortars is that they can shoot over obstacles, so whats the point in repositioning them? They would be much better with regular great cannons or even hellfire rocket batteries.
Its just a unit make no sense i have seen dahvplays use it one's thats pretty much it.
Nah, CA should have gone with idea of 3 War Wagons, one with repeater handguns, one with hellblaster and last as melee variant with halberds.
@@MsAres355 yeah or a cannons on war wagons would be better but takes away steam tanks niche.
ares354 ares354 I think they could’ve done a chariot like one that doesn’t have conventional melee, maybe like instead of handguns they use blunderbusses vampire coast style? And give that variant more armor and melee defense to have them be more of a driveby unit
The ability to relocate them before the battle ends is actually good in campaign. There are more than a few maps that are just borked for arty because the deployment zone is covered in trees, and by the time it takes for normal mortars to get out of it, the fight is already over.
Hey all! This video is HEAVILY outdated now after some updates! New one soon!
Hey man, thanks for the video.
You said we should suggest units to use for future videos. I think it would be interesting to have a wood elf build with moslty treekin and treemen. With the idea being that you make a very tanky build. Maybe throw in some wild hunt cav for hammering the anvil and all that.
I've actually used Ithilmar chariots to very good effect in 2v2 match ups, the problem like you point out is the price. If they were priced around 900 or so they'd be situational must-picks against lightly armored factions but 1100 is too much of an investment. Have a few games where I use one of these to push through DE infantry protecting darkshards for very good effect but the stars must align.
I'm not an online player, so take this only for single player but high phys.resist units do absolute wonders for me in the campaign.
I've seen quite a few online battles posted here to TH-cam and I wonder if an army with lots of these would be surprisingly good in multiplayer, as they are not used in the current meta.
I have yet to find a good use for Ellyrian Reavers.
@@HolyMith trolling right? Ellyrian reavers are one of the best light cav units in the game.
Take a shot every time he says "Glorious" and you'll have Alcohol Poisoning by the end of the video.
Mr. Bones What about Haggared?
Now we need videos of Turin winning a game with each and everyone of these units. Especially the Gyrobomber.
Turin, I need that quad gyrobomber build. Do it for the memes
There's two music tracks playing over the top of each other for much of the video making it annoying to listen to, some music you've added yourself and the ingame soundtrack I can hear behind it.
Just some feedback, I found the actual information interesting
Aye, was a mistake
Completely disagree about Casket of Souls, have amassed huge value from these before especially against cavalry. Can be pretty risky and doesn't always accrue value but much better than the catapults, even though they are hilarious to manually fire. Overall great video and love these lists, do you think you could do a best ror's list, based on how much they improve the base unit but also the roster i.e. the Rusty Arrows as they allow for GS gunlines.
Casket won me many battles, it is a must for me in a army when playing tomb kings.
Ya but you gotta realize he's talking high level multiplayer play it's way different than campaign or lower lvl ladder matches. At the highest lvl the players can micro out of the way easily. I've seen it enough lol.
Casket has a pretty good fire rate and in order to catch out higher level players you just need to constantly switch targets. It's a risky pick but certainly not the worst unit for the TK
Casket is bad for the same reason hellstorm is bad. It gets competition in the roster. It's designed to kill infantry blobs and is useless vs large and single targets. What you typically want to eliminate on approach is elites, not blobs of chaff. Bowshabti are just always better at that, they can cripple elite infantry just as well as they do monsters and lords, not to mention they're mobile and aren't useless in melee. That's 90% a SP unit. It has merits vs missile spam, like vampirates sometimes bring, but that's it.
Not arguing bow ushabti arent better, simply that you can get value from the casket opposed to a unit like screaming skull catapult. Which is bad due to damage output.
I’m surprised you picked the casket over the screaming meme for tombkings, also no mention of the never used and likely forgotten ice wolf chariot for norsca.
Kenny Horn Because it’s actually useful
Warriors of Chaos but you can only take Forsaken as front line infantry.
I think all deck dropper units must be given an ability to drop the zombies once they run out of ammo, kinda like bolas for the Lizardmen. Optionally, the zombies can act like wannabe bloated corpses on impact - just imagine the carnage! After the drop, the bats basically become overgrown fellbats.
this video needs "for pvp" in the title as it is total bs for campaign
Yeah, Warpfire and globadiers are excellent against blobbed infantry and Minotaurs are often the only thing useful in your army as Beastmen, which do have a LOT of just poor units
units are always balanced around multiplayer so as such when talking about unit stats and capability you always "Or at least 90%" of the time talk about it from a mp perspective
the answer to "what unit is the best for campaign" the answer is any unit you want
landmark buffs red-line buffs tech tree buffs you name it
hell i have seen buffed HE spears beat chaos warriors in campaign
campaign unit balance is literally thrown out the window so it legit does not matter what unit you use in campaign as they all are viable with the correct buffs and price-point
@@thehistorians5231 Not in anything above normal, infantry just plain sucks in campaign at higher difficulties and with the AI cheats your elite troops are destroyed by goblin spearmen.
@@Lones555 not true i actually did ample tests in custom battles a good time back where i gave 1 unit of chaos warriors "standard" ALL of the cheats they get + rank 9 chevrons
then i gave a unit of normal HELF spears all of the possible buffs they can get in stats "red-line techs landmarks" and they can actually just barely beat chaos warriors
that is a extreme scenario that will realistically never occur since it requires a very specific set of buffs to happen but my point is a unit that costs 750 gold that is the hardest possible counter to a unit that costs 500 gold still LOSES to it with the correct buffs applied so any time somebody comes and tells me units are balanced around campaign i simply tell them about my tests
@@thehistorians5231 "hardest possible counter" is perhaps a bit of a stretch
Ironically, for Wood Elves, Treemen are one of the strongest monster for the cost in the game. They just don't fit the roster very well, and being slow is an issue.
Dual wield minotaurs got a massive buff last patch. They're actually pretty strong now in a lot of match ups. They can take down temple guard 1-1, and don't need much help to take down phoenix guard or black guard, and they can win those fights easily with a bit of cycle charging - shield minotaurs can't. Even DW minotaurs can't beat chosen halbs, but they do beat great weapon chosen. They melt pretty much any infantry other than the most elite halberd units (though they do trade poorly with cheap anti-large infantry, like all poorly armoured large units). They can even beat giatn slayers 1-1 without cyclecharging, though they can't beat the dragonback slayers, and the 36% slow prevents them from cyclecharging.
I'd rate regular ungors as the worst unit in the beastmen roster; they're the only one I actively try to avoid using, because they lose to clanrats, despite costing 100 more funds; stalk and vanguard are valuable, but pretty much everything has vanguard for beastmen, and there are better options for hunting archers/artillery for similar cost, like warhounds, and they're not worth so much that a unit costing 100 less should beat a stalk/vanguard unit, especially with price points that low..
I honestly can't remember seeing wood elves fighting anything but Dwarfs . . . but usually you see them bringing 6 units of eternal guard to finish of everything after the archers have ran out of ammo, why not 2 treemen? In theory they should be more cost effective because you're not paying for anti large you're not using . . . (shrug)
sirgaz if it’s one thing dwarfs are good at killing it’s slow monsters with large hit boxes. also the trees do magic damage which dwarfs are resistant against
@@Thongger From most the replays I've seen the Dwarven ranged/artillery units are the first to die to the skirmishers and slayers second, usually by the time the melee starts it's just dwarf warriors vs eternal guard. I did forget they did magic damage though, that is a big downside.
The way I see it, all the units mentioned cannot be alone and need support. Otherwise they're all a waste of points.
Gonna have to disagree with a lot of the list I think. PWG for skaven are really nasty for how cheap they are, their biggest issue is their AA performance, but they melt large with ease. Skull Cat is imo head and shoulders worse than casket. Mortar wagon is head and shoulders better than than the normal wagon, I think post buff the mortar wagon will actually be in a solid spot, while normal wagon is probably a solid 300 gold overpriced.
I've used the ithilmar chariot with great results. It just requires quite a lot of micromanaging. But silver helms? Damn, it's impossible to do anything important with those.
Dark Elves in general are just the worst.
you tell him Mr. Prince
Both high and dark elves were underdeveloped. High elves are priced based on a perk that lasts for about 3-4 minutes at most without a healer, dark elves are stacked around a perk that doesn't activate until the battle's almost over. It's ridiculous and serves no purpose for regular players.
I like the White Lions, but they're garbage at their job and arguably worse than the Ithilmar chariot. (which i hate for being a shitty insert unit.)
@@johnburgman9135 Nah dude. Dark Elves aren't stacked around that perk at all. You don't even need Murderous mastery to smash other factions. That's just a free bonus. Im curious as to how that's underdeveloped.
Alex look at the name
Dark elves are bonkers lol
Turin, can you do a build with each faction that tries its hardest to make the worst units work? Maybe a magic focused build for casket of souls, or a slower tree build for the treeman.
LM whould auto-lose. No that they are a vad faction, the ark of sotek might just be the worst unit in the game.
I remember forsaken used to be great in warhammer 1. Sucks that they really have no place now.
Similar to Crypt Horrors I guess, nerfs and new units made them obsolete/underpowered.
I can never understand the science behind the Mortar Wagon. I mean mortar have one of the best arc of fire in the game, you pretty much gets value shots without having to move them ever. Theres no point in giving them relocating ability. Its like giving a Cygor wings and make it fly. Like why???
I'm amazed you could pick a bretonnian unit. So far I'm only impressed with the lord and paladins.
Caskets of souls worst TK unit.. what a joke man. For the other factions agree but damn you're completly wrong about caskets.
yes, carrions are the most useless units in the tomb king roster imo
It always hurt me to see how bad treemen are.
I’m sorry Treebeard!
The difference is that Treebeard can hurl massive boulders several hundred meters
I use poison wind globadiers to hit units in melee combat, where I can keep them off fire at will and thrown them into mobs of units that are trying to delay or swarm my units
Opinion on Forsaken: treat them like cycle charging infantry similar to the two handed sword units from Shogun 2. They get a charge bonus of 30, bringing their attack stat up to lord levels and their damage in the area of 80-90. Send them into the back of a unit, let them wail for a few seconds, pull them out with their higher than average speed and repeat. Doesn't totally justify the flaws with the unit, but I think that's the best way to use it.
Why does every TW youtube guy say "glorious" so much? It's such a noticeable verbal tic i see only in TW youtube and nowhere else
Oh there are so many other people who use it more than often, although I definitely agree that big TW youtubers tend to say it quite a bit
Genuinely checked my video to see if it had been sped up, you talk so fast :D
Dark riders are pathetic. Low stats, low leadership. Harpies are better with high defense and damage. The shades w/ dual weapons just have trouble finding a place but dark riders w/ and w/o shields have no place.
Mac Gargan Can only speak from campaign perspective cause I don’t play multiplayer, but in campaign, the Dark Riders do a great job at hammer & anvil if you cycle charge them and can‘t afford or don’t want to field cold ones
You talk so fast I had to stop watching the video
Poison Wind globadiers are AMAZING! put m on a wall and they do great. I really hate ratling guns. They have such a hard time in siege battles.
Here I am downloading the game, and checking videos while thinking "I can't wait to have my WAAAAGH! of boar boyz"
*DUH*
So many uses of glorious, haggard and premium.. Hoo boy.
Can you add to the description of the video any of the more obvious buffs/nerfs since you published this video? Like casket of souls.
I prefere dual weapon shades over 2h weap shades. Because I want the 1 unit of shades that goes melee mode. Tank as long as possible. While the rest of the shades keep shooting.
Turin do you have some skin mods for units, I swear your Minos have more variation than I ever get, and the norms can marauder dudes look different too. Also looked like one of the boar boars was a black roc mounted haha.
CA. Please buff the PIGGIES !!!!!!!!
Easy fix though. Keep all stats the same except for charge bonus, which goes to around 60. 70 for big'uns. Also lore friendly, as the boars themselves had an extra charge bonus from their tusks in tabletop.
I think they also need some extra melee attack. Like, they have lower melee attack than Orc Arrer Boyz. Also, why is their weapon strength lower than default Orc Boyz? Sure, they have much better ap but it still doesn't make any sense that they'd hit any less hard.
Minotaurs have anti infantry bonus now)
take a shot eveyrtime he says "this bad boy"
your liver will be most thankfull
Turin I think you missed that Minotaurs just got a Massive bonus vs inf buff. They can beat slayers 1v1 now. They are incredibly good now.
I saw this video again by accident and found that most of the worst units are now really good :D
I'm loving that Halberdier charging in at 13:08 with a throwing axe sticking out of him. haha
10:46 Is that Crimson Killerz on boar?? What...
Casket of souls is great . Nekahara warriors are the worst unit for them
Oh boy, this video didnt age well... Casket of Souls is on the list.
AND STOP SAYING: "In my opinion." It just cames out like you did a shit research because stuff like this can be objectively measured.
Or rename your video to The Worst Unit For Each Faction In My Opinion.
You say "haggard" far too much. Otherwise, nice vid!
I agree, I AM SORRY
>Shades with dual weapon
>casket of souls
Legend of total war laughing in the background.
For campaigns legend is right, but for multiplayer there are better options
I had once back in Warhammer 1 a Durthu Doomstack with like 10, 12 Treemen and Forest Dragons and honestly it was one of the best campaigns I've ever had. I love the model, I love the sound, love the animations.. I wish CA would buff the Treeman, because right now it's such a waste of an amazing model.
But right now thay have buff them a lot, i started in warhammer 2 and i remember how treeman had almost no armor piercing damage which was nuts considering their size, they gave them more ap, defense vs all and lately plus 10 armor, i think right now thay are solid surprise unit, just like a giant, less damage but more durable
Are you gonna do a best unit in each faction video too?
Even though it's shit for the reasons you said, I like the Gyrocopter for the theme
*Welcome to Vietstalia intensifies*
This is quite outdated actually, its decent now!
I would love to see some Treemen, kite builds are overrated and dull to watch.
This guy talks so fast i watch at 0.75 playback lol
Lol
I thought the Forsaken's squishyness was just me. I could never seem to get good use out of them.
I've never been particularly impressed by most chariot units for any faction, really.
Chariots are insanely micro-heavy glass cannons. If you can spare the time and attention to repeatedly circle-charge them, every single chariot in the game can do about twice the damage and mayhem as two good shock cavalry units combined, but if they get bogged down (which tends to happen a lot), they are more or less useless and gets ganked in moments. Because of that, they are more or less the poster-boys of high-risk-high-reward tactics, which are not for everyone.
The gyro bomber bombs need to wreck house. Might be op but requires pretty good micro and nearly any other air unit can take it out of the sky
hey man, nice vid, but i had to watch it at .75 speed to understand what you're saying.
Are hippogryph knights good now? Since you don't mention them as contenders.
I’ve never really done multiplayer but when I play the lizardmen and the razordons are pretty good in my opinion but idk about mp so who knows
This is a bit outdated now!
Ah okay makes sense . I just bought the game probably a month ago so I’m not really up to date on what was good and bad then and the buffs .... now would you prefer razordons or the salamanders??
What. War wagons are awesome 😶 its like arty/handgunners coupled with cav/chariot with ward save. If you use them right, they dominate.
Ok so I disagreed on Skaven (Skavenslaves are worse) but I have to put my foot down.
War Wagon Mortals are amazing! They are basically a mortal unit with the speed and mobility of a cavalry! What is Mortals and artillery's biggest weakness? Cavalry.
Forsaken build:
Any chariot to mess up an infantry units charge and immediately follow up with forsaken when they are down. Harry enemy missiles with hounds or something.
1. HE Chariot is great in some matchups. You can bring only 2 nobles, so at least 2 of this chariot units is needed. For example vs dwarfs. And archer chariot is much weaker in melee. For HE worst is ARMORED archers. Useless derp unit.
2. Weakest unit in Lizardmen roster is fuckin Nakai. He suck hard. cost ~700 more than ancient kroxigor and worse in any way. And he knocked around all the times too. If we ignore Lords - feral cold ones. They suck hard too. Even vs some archers, like quarellers - they lost 1v1. Its literally ideal target for them - archers with high armor. And they still lose it.
3. For TK its fuckin bone giant. This shit is driving me nuts. It so derp, slow and innacurate, it suck so hard - even meme casket is better. Also casket is ok on khotep sometimes (not worth, imho, but ok and dont make you angry).
4. Empire - regular wagons is worse. This guys suck too, but at least this is mortar. Regular wagons is 2 times worse than 1 unit of handgunners while cost more.
5. Orks - Grimgore still the worse LL in the game and if we dont talk about lords - night goblins archers with fanatics. Why somebody need this skill on ranged unit? At least regular boar boys can be userful with Wurrzag.
6. -"crypt horrors is quite pitiful" WHAT? This is great cost effective monster unit. With regen, ap and poison. Seriously wtf?
7. Chaos - feral manticore cuz it go nuts after few hits and die from spears. Or chaos knights with swords. Just sad pitiful unit. Forsaken at least fast and do great damage to squishy targets.
Hi Turin,
In 7th edition Tabletop there was a Bretonnian Build used for tournaments (and I was the Evil WE guy) called "the Bretonnian Flying Circus": 3 basic knights in Lance formation, melee heroes on pegasus/griffin, lots flying pegususes and a grail Lance with Damsels. Despite I never played Bretonnia in such environments it was very challenging to play against and watch the matches.
I think it would be awesome to make a big surprise on a match with a similar build.
Keep doin' stuff ;)
While I dont disagree with what you've said turin, I believe your review of the gyrobombers is a result of a mixed up perception, I THINK (I dont know, Some games I know portray stats INCLUDING the ability damage of a unit if said unit is a 'caster' type) it is showing mainly the damage of the bombs (Which would make sense cus bombs are pretty potent), And not infact the damage of the machine gun, which I reckon is probably missile damage equivalent to most dwarven firearm infantry. Still, I am no statistics expert nor do I delve directly into the game's data so Take what I state with a grain of salt.
The new Gyrobomber really isnt bad. The main gun can ONLY target things with mass. The accuracy changes to almost perfect. It seems like using the bombs early really is a trap, so saving them for the end game is best. Finally, use a Gyrobomber in close proximity with Gyrocopters with steam guns. It adds a few more bombs and the steam + minigun combined can dissuade opponents flyers from engaging in CC. Sure you still have to have SOMETHING on the ground to help them, but you can get away with a pair of Quarrellers. Almost all Dawi online matches end with some haggard Slayers and like 2 characters, so I would think bombing those end game blobs is an obvious pick.
Ark of Sotec needs permanent-slow in a small radius around it, with a temporary increase in range via ability, so that it can fuck over cab blobs easier, maybe constant poison?
Warp fire needs buff to range and dmg, with no reload. Death Globe needs insane slow, and massive melee defense/attack debug on any unit hit, lasting for minutes afterwords.
Deck Droppers don’t deserve anything, fuck them bats.
Casket of Souls needs homing missiles, and massive fear aura like in lore. Doesn’t need to fire fast, but missiles are somewhat self aware, and screech with the combined anguish of 100 bloated corpse mains, and the effects should reflect this in game.
War wagon mortar needs added DPS/firerate, maybe even handgunners in the cart to add that little bit more damage.
Gyro Bomber needs multiple guns on it, to deal with infantry, plus more bombs. (Like multiple thunderers, maybe even multiple steam guns, needs decent aim)
Ork boar boys should be shit. Sorry, but they are dirty green skins on pigs, they can’t be fast, or high DPS.
(Hex Wraiths should be better) Corpse Cart has abysmal regen, needs more range.
Marauder Hunters should be mixed-infantry, have marauder-tier melee dmg/melee defense.
Trebuchets need accuracy, or very cheap. Blessed needs bigger splash.
Tree man needs to have higher armor
Cow Cunts don’t deserve any buffs. Maybe higher attack speed, but tough shit.
Forsaken need More attack speed, running speed, damage, etc.
Deck droppers being nerfed and now ending up on this list is why I say CA needs to be more careful about nerfing things because of MP. I don't mind buffs necessarily, but CA should stop nerfing units and making them useless (or almost useless for campaign.) Let players develop strategies for dealing with them, HAVE A LITTLE FAITH and stop making fun units lame.
You could almost say that the forsaken have been... You know where I'm, going with this
Really - Cascet of Souls is worse then Screaming Catapults? :D Maybe in multiplayer. But I would not pick Screaming Catapult if I had a choice. It's hillariously inaccurate, low dmg and if it hits only thing it does is lower morale. Also try them when enemy line it crushing into yours and everyone it close to each other. They can't properly shoot unless you do it yourself by taking control. Cascet of Souls does not have those problems at all. And when it does hit blobed infantry units it MELTS them. Screw Screaming Catapult fans! :P
Disrespecting the razordon hunting back!
I mean, yeah, initially they're not as good as their fire breathing cousins, primarily due to their fire rate... but in Nakai's campaign where you can just SPAWN those suckers behind armored targets in a fight, where they're entrenched against your line? They shred. I think yes, they can use a buff, a bit too much micro for MP to generate real value... maybe more missile resistance? But over all, they do have a niche!
Ark of Sotek doesn't... it's just bad.
I'd say Shades Dual Weapons are a bit niche, but nice. Sure basic Shades or Greatswords are a bit better, but Dual weapons is the unit you take when you want your archers to counter doggos and chaff coming at them.
Gyrobombers… oh, come on. They were good already, but after the last patch they are now extremely deadly. Their bombs decimate infantry, their cannons snipe single models. I'd say they are even OP, although you need to learn how to use them.
Field Breb… specific, sure, but it could do very well in certain situations.
For WE I'd Say Eagle is the worst unit(the basic one, not mounts, mounts are great). Treeman at least get used from time to time, but Eagles are picked much more rarely.