"Be input driven, not output driven." Damn, man. That's deep. If I'm taking away one thing from this video, it's this. "Interesting!" is the second one.
I love the idea of "Be input driven, not output driven"! It is a good advice of avoiding or at least reducing burnout and having a more sustainable career
Love the highlighting of important sentences. You content is always great, but the design makes it so much easier to watch through without losing focus. Keep it up!
Being transparent with your recruiters that you are applying to multiple places is a great advice! 🎉 Recruiters will actually try to get you the best offer as the company puts time and money in interviewing you so they want to be sure they get a return on their investment!
6 out of 9 is an impressive ratio! A very valuable advices. I’ve been affected by mass layoffs 2 months ago and went on job search full-time, sending about 30 applications, initiating a talk with 10-12 companies and getting one offer only. It’s so stressful being in this situation, you’re afraid of negotiating and applying all these tactics, because you’re very much afraid that if you lose, it would be even worse for you with all the personal and family commitments many of us have.
Really valuable advice from both of you. @Pragmatic Engineer, I will say your advice at 11:26 is too optimistic about other people's situations -- not everyone has been paid well before, some have people they're taking care of, and really need the money. We aren't all just interested in the subject matter & working.
Yeah, I hear you that it’s not like this for most people. Glad to hear you pushed through and got offers in the end!! He told his story. I’d like to tell other people’s stories as well. Want to come on the channel and tell yours? I’m sure a LOT of people would relate and be thankful for a different perspective and something they can relate better to!
@@pragmaticengineerHe went to Stanford so it helps but it is important to reach out to people you know as often they can get you an in with hiring managers.
The problem this isn’t super useful. There’s only a handful of people with 4-5 FAANG offers at the same time. Those people usually stand out anyway and they get a lot more money. A real video would be about negotiating when you only have 1 FAANG offer or maybe you have 1 FAANG and 1-2 more smaller companies with clearly smaller TC. Anyone can negotiate “hey I got 6 offers and I’m literally top 0.001% in the world in SWE”. Much harder to negotiate in other situations.
Thanks for the feedback! I'm still experimenting with how to do editing and didn't want to leave unnecessary space. I'll tweak how I do it in the future and not make it as cutty.
Whenever I read or watch information about negotiating salary I get quite uncomfortable because I know that there is so much potential there, that I am not really tapping into. So, although I didn't really "enjoy" your video, I still wouldn't want to have missed it :D. Thanks for uploading this!
I wish I had seen it when was joining Amazon. I wonder, could you make a video regarding compensation negotiations when getting promoted within company, like L4=>L5, L5=>L6, etc. I've heard that some people quit and then got themselves re-hired again just to get to the bargaining stage again. It won't work for everyone, obviously, but for some it could be a viable strategy. Anyway, thanks for sharing, it's really useful video.
Thanks for this video! It validated a lot of things. I follow Patrick too! But the conversation was too edited out and came across choppy, and sounded like we missed a lot of things. I'm sure you just cut out the "umm"s and "ahhh"s, but those make the conversation feel more natural and authentic :)
Also checkout me talking on Rahul's channel about promotions to senior and staff levels at large tech companies: th-cam.com/video/9M_HTNpe0AA/w-d-xo.html
I see a lot of you should negotiate but what if it's like your first job and you have no other competing offer or the competing offer is way lower? Do you have any leverage at that point to negotiate?
As an intern, or at your first you have little to no leverage. I did not negotiate my first few job offers (and I probably would have not been able to do so). You can try, but don't hold your breath. The more experience (and options) you have, the more leverage you will have - including the option of walking away.
@@pragmaticengineer Thanks for the answer! It's about what I figured given it be first job and if there are no competing offers. Just always see people say you should always negotiate because it make you look like you care about the job and it's like but how if I have no leverage at all. Another question I want to ask is how long can you delay accepting an offer? I have a big interview with a FAANG coming out mid next week. I have interview with a small tech company this week. From what I hear from. The recruiter they seem to moving fast. He said of things go well they will make an offer that day. What the best way to deal with it? Should I tell them I like until say next Friday because I have other company I'm considering? Or can I take the offer but go back on it if I pass my interview next week? Really do need to start working so don't want to let it go if I get it and fail to get offer next week. Thanks again for the help!
The first thing a typical recruiter asks is about salary expectation! Should or should I not blurp out a figure? And when is the best time to initiate talks about remuneration?
I am from south america, and I have no degree to leverage, but I do know I am a great software architect, can I negotiate for the same values a person candidating in the united stated would? How could I proceed?
One question for you: does age matter for engineering career? If a person is 40+ years old, should he/she continue to be a software engineer, or should change to be a manager?
Glassdoor is super outdated. I wish I had watched this video before my negotiation, glassdoor misled me into negotiating lower than I would have gotten.
You have the lowest of leverages as an intern: if you say no, there are usually many people who are ready to say yes. The only way you might be able to negotiate is have multiple intern offers. FWIW, I’ve never heard anyone being able to negotiate an intern offer (feel free to add if you have).
I almost lost an internship trying to negotiate. I wouldn't try to do it usually they have set pay scales for interns and they have close to zero wiggle room.
This was really fun, let's do it again soon! Happy to answer questions if folks want to connect 💯
"Be input driven, not output driven." Damn, man. That's deep. If I'm taking away one thing from this video, it's this. "Interesting!" is the second one.
@@staffeng love it
Very useful information! Now my concern is how to get multiple big tech offers at the same time when I can't even get one
I love the idea of "Be input driven, not output driven"! It is a good advice of avoiding or at least reducing burnout and having a more sustainable career
Love the highlighting of important sentences. You content is always great, but the design makes it so much easier to watch through without losing focus. Keep it up!
Thanks a lot, Gergely, you're literally reshaping the market for software engineers in Europe with your videos
Being transparent with your recruiters that you are applying to multiple places is a great advice! 🎉 Recruiters will actually try to get you the best offer as the company puts time and money in interviewing you so they want to be sure they get a return on their investment!
6 out of 9 is an impressive ratio!
A very valuable advices.
I’ve been affected by mass layoffs 2 months ago and went on job search full-time, sending about 30 applications, initiating a talk with 10-12 companies and getting one offer only. It’s so stressful being in this situation, you’re afraid of negotiating and applying all these tactics, because you’re very much afraid that if you lose, it would be even worse for you with all the personal and family commitments many of us have.
Really valuable advice from both of you. @Pragmatic Engineer, I will say your advice at 11:26 is too optimistic about other people's situations -- not everyone has been paid well before, some have people they're taking care of, and really need the money. We aren't all just interested in the subject matter & working.
Love the advice on being input driven and not output driven. I attribute all my success to this thinking(did most of it unknowingly)
lol he applyed 9 companys to get 6 offers this is crazy - after finishing university last year it took me over 300 resumes to get 2 offers
Yeah, I hear you that it’s not like this for most people. Glad to hear you pushed through and got offers in the end!!
He told his story. I’d like to tell other people’s stories as well. Want to come on the channel and tell yours? I’m sure a LOT of people would relate and be thankful for a different perspective and something they can relate better to!
What university did you attend, I'm kinda thinking having Stanford had a little bit to do with his situation
@@pragmaticengineerHe went to Stanford so it helps but it is important to reach out to people you know as often they can get you an in with hiring managers.
The problem this isn’t super useful. There’s only a handful of people with 4-5 FAANG offers at the same time. Those people usually stand out anyway and they get a lot more money.
A real video would be about negotiating when you only have 1 FAANG offer or maybe you have 1 FAANG and 1-2 more smaller companies with clearly smaller TC.
Anyone can negotiate “hey I got 6 offers and I’m literally top 0.001% in the world in SWE”. Much harder to negotiate in other situations.
Love your channel, valuable, pragmatic content!
Appreciated your honesty, good stuff. Not easy to do from hiring managers side.
9 applications, 6 offers is pretty good. Usually it's 100 applications and 1 offer though.
yeah, looks more realistic in my case
Now I’m addicted to your videos. Thank you for the valuable information. I’ll be back when I get my first software engineering internship offer 🤞🏾
Great Video! But your editing is a little too "choppy". Throwing me off a bit. It makes the timing of the conversation very unnatural.
Thanks for the feedback! I'm still experimenting with how to do editing and didn't want to leave unnecessary space. I'll tweak how I do it in the future and not make it as cutty.
"9 companies total"
>Meanwhile most of us have to apply to HUNDREDS of companies to even get an entry level position.
It’s cuz he has big brain lmao. Dude is probably wicked smart
Whenever I read or watch information about negotiating salary I get quite uncomfortable because I know that there is so much potential there, that I am not really tapping into. So, although I didn't really "enjoy" your video, I still wouldn't want to have missed it :D. Thanks for uploading this!
It's pure gold for a newbie like me in this field, thanks a lot Gergely!
I wish I had seen it when was joining Amazon. I wonder, could you make a video regarding compensation negotiations when getting promoted within company, like L4=>L5, L5=>L6, etc. I've heard that some people quit and then got themselves re-hired again just to get to the bargaining stage again. It won't work for everyone, obviously, but for some it could be a viable strategy.
Anyway, thanks for sharing, it's really useful video.
very down to earth discussion.
Thanks for sharing this!
Great interview! Please more of that caliber.
The best message I take is Information Assymetry from these Portals and hence its important to be more analytical before making a call.
I wish he did not interrupt the guess too many times. He made a lot of good points.
absolutely amazing convo
Thanks for this video! It validated a lot of things. I follow Patrick too! But the conversation was too edited out and came across choppy, and sounded like we missed a lot of things. I'm sure you just cut out the "umm"s and "ahhh"s, but those make the conversation feel more natural and authentic :)
Thanks for The feedback! Yep, might have gone overboard on the editing for this one in cutting out the fillers. I’ll do less of this in the future!
excellent content, thanks a lot
Very informative video!
Also checkout me talking on Rahul's channel about promotions to senior and staff levels at large tech companies: th-cam.com/video/9M_HTNpe0AA/w-d-xo.html
Thx for the video! Very informative! The constant cuts made a bit difficult to follow, tho.
Thanks! I’ll tweak for smoother editing for the next videos.
I see a lot of you should negotiate but what if it's like your first job and you have no other competing offer or the competing offer is way lower? Do you have any leverage at that point to negotiate?
As an intern, or at your first you have little to no leverage. I did not negotiate my first few job offers (and I probably would have not been able to do so). You can try, but don't hold your breath.
The more experience (and options) you have, the more leverage you will have - including the option of walking away.
@@pragmaticengineer Thanks for the answer! It's about what I figured given it be first job and if there are no competing offers. Just always see people say you should always negotiate because it make you look like you care about the job and it's like but how if I have no leverage at all.
Another question I want to ask is how long can you delay accepting an offer? I have a big interview with a FAANG coming out mid next week. I have interview with a small tech company this week. From what I hear from. The recruiter they seem to moving fast. He said of things go well they will make an offer that day.
What the best way to deal with it? Should I tell them I like until say next Friday because I have other company I'm considering? Or can I take the offer but go back on it if I pass my interview next week? Really do need to start working so don't want to let it go if I get it and fail to get offer next week. Thanks again for the help!
Great content! As feedback, the choppy cutting made listening somewhat stressy.
The first thing a typical recruiter asks is about salary expectation! Should or should I not blurp out a figure? And when is the best time to initiate talks about remuneration?
I am from south america, and I have no degree to leverage, but I do know I am a great software architect, can I negotiate for the same values a person candidating in the united stated would? How could I proceed?
One question for you: does age matter for engineering career? If a person is 40+ years old, should he/she continue to be a software engineer, or should change to be a manager?
Ran I'm absolutely not an expert to answer this. But I would say these choices depend on your health and work ethic.
Glassdoor is super outdated. I wish I had watched this video before my negotiation, glassdoor misled me into negotiating lower than I would have gotten.
is glassdoor truly not a reliable source? If not, what are other reliable sources?
Great Video, have a question - Meta recruiter asking for job title, how to best handle it?
What is the song in the intro around 0:16?
Is it reasonable to try to negotiate a Intern offer?
You have the lowest of leverages as an intern: if you say no, there are usually many people who are ready to say yes.
The only way you might be able to negotiate is have multiple intern offers. FWIW, I’ve never heard anyone being able to negotiate an intern offer (feel free to add if you have).
I almost lost an internship trying to negotiate. I wouldn't try to do it usually they have set pay scales for interns and they have close to zero wiggle room.
great video, less jump cuts
💯
Does getting paid more make you more susceptible to getting laid off? Is that a possible drawback to negotiating something above the normal
I feel like Rahul’s explanation and reasoning kept getting interrupted. Next time would it be impossible to wait for them to finish before joining in?
7:20 10:00
Meh. 9 apps 6 offers with prestigious college and experience. Not relatable at all.
50 hours a week? bye... (European here 😅)
Pay is worth it though
@@prateeksingh-hp4qd meh...38-40h maximum per week in Western European country.
@@shinkobayashi5915 i must have been talking about the american companies in Usa. Ofcourse European devs get paid peanuts compared to american ones
@@prateeksingh-hp4qd Yes, you are right!