@Billy Sanborn, The reason we specifically don't do that is that until you climb the ladder and get a view inside, you won't know if the room can be compartmentalized or not. If there is no door sealing this room from the rest of the house, you've just created an uncontrolled ventilation point and will cause massive fire spread.
You are absolutely right. This video was just focusing on the immediate task. Realistically (in my perfect world), there should be no rig on the fireground left with a ladder still on it. In other words, laddering the hell out of the building should be a very high priority.
Agreed, IF all rooms along the roofline are targeted. Remember, this is a targeted search. If "my baby, my baby!" is in a known room, I'm going straight for that one and throwing the ladder as close as I can to it.
Assuming the bathroom is attached to the bedroom, just be sure you got a thourogh search on the bathroom, I wouldn't worry about closing the door. The exception is if it is a shared bathroom (i.e. another bedroom on the otherside), then be sure to compartmentalize as well as possible. Remember when you're searching the bathroom that kids love to hide from fire and firefighters. Check bathtubs, cabinets, etc. Also remember the TIC wil NOT see through glass such as a glass shower door.
That's one of those things that is situation dependant. In general I would say no, VES is a targeted search, and the bathroom would be a separate target. That being said, the portion of the video where we explained that you must peer down the hall way to assess conditions and look for victims applies here as well. If you peer into the hall and see a pair of feet sticking out of the bathroom door, by all means grab them. Just don't wander deep. Remember, you can always VES multiple locations
As am I. This is why I say DON'T be above the sill like you say to be. This will put you indirect path of the fire. I appreciate you looking out for the brothers
Great point Squad! I was thinking the same thing, with a bit of a twist. We have several of such houses in our first due. I would recommend throwing 2 ladders (1 on each opposing corner). Great video!
The first time you see a flashover, you will understand. Also remember that heat rises. With the ladder at the top of the frame, you will be in the direct path of the flame. With the tip below the sill, you will be below the heat level and quite safe. With the tip below, you will also be in position to enter the room and begin your search. With the ladder to the side or above the sill, you will need to take the time to reposition.
Awesome video, I plan on using it next week at the academy. However, the only thing I noticed that I would have probably done different was when performing VES off a porch roof I teach recruits to start at the window furthest from your ladder or egress point. This is because if fire or smoke conditions drastically change in the few minutes it takes you to search the other rooms further from the ladder, your egress could be cut off. All in all it was a great video. Thanks!
First it is important to understand that solids and liquids don't burn, only gasses. When solids and liquids reach a certain temperature (depending on the material), they will off-gas, and those gasses will ignite in the presence of heat and an oxidizer. Flashover is the point at which everything in the room (furniture, carpet, etc.) reaches pyrolysis (off-gassing temperature), and ignites all at once. The rate of rise in compartment temperature is unsurvivable.
We're both wearing Fire Innovations Colorado ladder belts. My Axe is in a Fire Axe scabbard, But I'm sure you're referring to my partners belt. His axe is held with the optional axe strap that is part of the Fire Innovations belt system. Pretty nice set up.
Great video...can you tell me what kind of keper you were using for your flat head axe? Love the tip on pushing the halligan into the wall to sight where your search left off....good stuff!
Awesome Video !!! That's how you winning a subscriber. In regards where tip of the ladder needs to be positioned - you doing it right. If ladder is positioned on next to the window at the top of the frame, that will be a pure firefight, no entry. That will defeat any purpose to enter the structure for extracting potential victims. "Papa Tiger, reposition the ladder below the window, I'm coming with Papa Smurf, Over" - Never !!! Also, you will decrease your chances for "emergency bailout". You cannot evacuate anyone if ladder is not bellow and running out when situation deteriorates. Definitely ladder next to the window is a BIG NO,NO. Flashover is temperature driven event. Keep your thermal cameras tight.
Excellent video. Just a question. Say there is a small bathroom next to the bedroom you are searching. You can't fit through the bathroom window. Should you do VES on the bedroom, search the bedroom, then, enter the bathroom and do a quick search and leave, closing the door behind you? Thanks
hello friends, I ask permission to translate your video and upload in my channel to share their knowledge with the rest of our fellow firefighters in Latin America. I can do it?
The direction of wind does not play a role. In a targeted search, you search the room with the victim or likely victim. All things being equal, it would be best to take the leeward windows so that you do not cause a wind-driven fire scenario.
Personally, I prefer taking it with the tip of the ladder if it is unknown whether or not the room has flashed, will flash, or a backdraft is possible. This way if any of these occur, I'm not right up next to it.
Great video but i would like to say one thing about the window break... you never have your ladder under the window while breaking the glass. you want to be on the side of the window with the wind at your back, that way glass wont fall on you and if it does flash over you are not in going to be hit by the fire and smoke. Other then that good job on the video.
simpsonfan2100 I know that's what they teach in academy, but breaking the sill from below is not a problem, been doing it for years. This is especially important with VES, you simply don't have time to climb down the ladder and reposition it before entry. Position for entry, take the window, and go.
wow dude i hope u have a good life insurance policy because all u need is that room to flash and life is over, quick tip put the ladder next to the window at the top of the frame like a gentleman and if it flashes u wont b in the way...ur welcome
The first time you see a flashover, you will understand. Also remember that heat rises. With the ladder at the top of the frame, you will be in the direct path of the flame. With the tip below the sill, you will be below the heat level and quite safe. With the tip below, you will also be in position to enter the room and begin your search. With the ladder to the side or above the sill, you will need to take the time to reposition.
First it is important to understand that solids and liquids don't burn, only gasses. When solids and liquids reach a certain temperature (depending on the material), they will off-gas, and those gasses will ignite in the presence of heat and an oxidizer. Flashover is the point at which everything in the room (furniture, carpet, etc.) reaches pyrolysis (off-gassing temperature), and ignites all at once. The rate of rise in compartment temperature is unsurvivable.
@Billy Sanborn,
The reason we specifically don't do that is that until you climb the ladder and get a view inside, you won't know if the room can be compartmentalized or not. If there is no door sealing this room from the rest of the house, you've just created an uncontrolled ventilation point and will cause massive fire spread.
My first search back in the day scared shitless i was handing onto my partners pant leg the whole time.. Such an embarrassment =(
Well done lads. Probably the best video I have seen yet on VEIS. It is one of my favorites in my training library.
You are absolutely right. This video was just focusing on the immediate task. Realistically (in my perfect world), there should be no rig on the fireground left with a ladder still on it. In other words, laddering the hell out of the building should be a very high priority.
Agreed, IF all rooms along the roofline are targeted. Remember, this is a targeted search. If "my baby, my baby!" is in a known room, I'm going straight for that one and throwing the ladder as close as I can to it.
Great video. Thanks for putting in the time to make it.
Assuming the bathroom is attached to the bedroom, just be sure you got a thourogh search on the bathroom, I wouldn't worry about closing the door. The exception is if it is a shared bathroom (i.e. another bedroom on the otherside), then be sure to compartmentalize as well as possible. Remember when you're searching the bathroom that kids love to hide from fire and firefighters. Check bathtubs, cabinets, etc. Also remember the TIC wil NOT see through glass such as a glass shower door.
That's one of those things that is situation dependant. In general I would say no, VES is a targeted search, and the bathroom would be a separate target. That being said, the portion of the video where we explained that you must peer down the hall way to assess conditions and look for victims applies here as well. If you peer into the hall and see a pair of feet sticking out of the bathroom door, by all means grab them. Just don't wander deep. Remember, you can always VES multiple locations
I read about this technique a few weeks ago, but it's always better to see it done, or do it yourself. Great video! Stay safe brother!
As am I. This is why I say DON'T be above the sill like you say to be. This will put you indirect path of the fire. I appreciate you looking out for the brothers
Great point Squad! I was thinking the same thing, with a bit of a twist. We have several of such houses in our first due. I would recommend throwing 2 ladders (1 on each opposing corner). Great video!
Great video. Keep them coming.
The first time you see a flashover, you will understand. Also remember that heat rises. With the ladder at the top of the frame, you will be in the direct path of the flame. With the tip below the sill, you will be below the heat level and quite safe. With the tip below, you will also be in position to enter the room and begin your search. With the ladder to the side or above the sill, you will need to take the time to reposition.
Thanks for your response. My question was more as to whether you would enter the hallway to reach the bathroom door.
Great job crew!!! And, today's (03/05/2013 A-Shift) company drill: Vent, Enter, Search. My guys will love you for this.
Hey. The bed was up against the baseboard heater. LOL Great vid. Forwarded this to our training officer.
Great Video, taught me what I need to know before my Fire Explorer Drill
Awesome video, I plan on using it next week at the academy. However, the only thing I noticed that I would have probably done different was when performing VES off a porch roof I teach recruits to start at the window furthest from your ladder or egress point. This is because if fire or smoke conditions drastically change in the few minutes it takes you to search the other rooms further from the ladder, your egress could be cut off. All in all it was a great video. Thanks!
nice job! I love the effects.
Your videos are awesome brother. Hoping to see more.
love this video
Real quality video brothers, really well made.
Great video fellas. Thanks.
Great Video!
First it is important to understand that solids and liquids don't burn, only gasses. When solids and liquids reach a certain temperature (depending on the material), they will off-gas, and those gasses will ignite in the presence of heat and an oxidizer. Flashover is the point at which everything in the room (furniture, carpet, etc.) reaches pyrolysis (off-gassing temperature), and ignites all at once. The rate of rise in compartment temperature is unsurvivable.
Cool video! I'm now a Internet Certified Fire Fighter! How do I print out my certificate?
We're both wearing Fire Innovations Colorado ladder belts. My Axe is in a Fire Axe scabbard, But I'm sure you're referring to my partners belt. His axe is held with the optional axe strap that is part of the Fire Innovations belt system. Pretty nice set up.
Great video...can you tell me what kind of keper you were using for your flat head axe? Love the tip on pushing the halligan into the wall to sight where your search left off....good stuff!
Realy good Video. Thank you guys! Which camera did you use for it?
Of course! Please feel free to use the video any way you'd like. If you translate it, please send me the link.
Thanks,
Very good video.
Where are the special features? I'd love to see an outtakes clip!
Good video guys. Thanks.
Awesome Video !!! That's how you winning a subscriber. In regards where tip of the ladder needs to be positioned - you doing it right. If ladder is positioned on next to the window at the top of the frame, that will be a pure firefight, no entry. That will defeat any purpose to enter the structure for extracting potential victims. "Papa Tiger, reposition the ladder below the window, I'm coming with Papa Smurf, Over" - Never !!! Also, you will decrease your chances for "emergency bailout". You cannot evacuate anyone if ladder is not bellow and running out when situation deteriorates. Definitely ladder next to the window is a BIG NO,NO. Flashover is temperature driven event. Keep your thermal cameras tight.
@Hawkfighter666
Thanks, it was a simple shoot. We just used a simple Canon HG20
Wow, thats one useful and nice video! Thanks! also how did you added smoke and flames effects? in which program?
Thanks, I use After Effects for the smoke and flames.
Excellent video. Just a question. Say there is a small bathroom next to the bedroom you are searching. You can't fit through the bathroom window. Should you do VES on the bedroom, search the bedroom, then, enter the bathroom and do a quick search and leave, closing the door behind you? Thanks
From México great vídeo bro im a firefighter
que tal saludos desde México, una pregunta como podríamos conseguir esta información tan valiosa en español?
What program did you use for the effects?
hello friends, I ask permission to translate your video and upload in my channel to share their knowledge with the rest of our fellow firefighters in Latin America. I can do it?
Camarada si lo traduces me pasas el enlace? Gracias.
@Bryan Martin I know it. Thank U very much Bryan and sure I will link it
What is a flashover?
my dad is a firefighter good video
dont take it the wrong way i would NEVER want another brother to get caught in s flash over just preaching safety
Umm, because we're outside.
shouldn't you hit the windows on windward side if you doing a search? if not can you explain to me why and why not?
It's probably bc it would let in more oxygen and the fire would spread quicker
The direction of wind does not play a role. In a targeted search, you search the room with the victim or likely victim. All things being equal, it would be best to take the leeward windows so that you do not cause a wind-driven fire scenario.
I used Adobe After Effects
i will learn about mayday training at the academy & I will do it with my fire coordinator Stacey Fleming & my fire chief Amy Biggs.
Hi friends.
Personally, I prefer taking it with the tip of the ladder if it is unknown whether or not the room has flashed, will flash, or a backdraft is possible. This way if any of these occur, I'm not right up next to it.
muy interesante video pero seria bueno que tambien tengan algo en español latino pera los bomberos de habla hispana, saludos
Great video but i would like to say one thing about the window break... you never have your ladder under the window while breaking the glass. you want to be on the side of the window with the wind at your back, that way glass wont fall on you and if it does flash over you are not in going to be hit by the fire and smoke. Other then that good job on the video.
simpsonfan2100
I know that's what they teach in academy, but breaking the sill from below is not a problem, been doing it for years. This is especially important with VES, you simply don't have time to climb down the ladder and reposition it before entry. Position for entry, take the window, and go.
uhhh y are u venting the window where the ladder is placed on the sill thats terrible god forbid it flashes
wow dude i hope u have a good life insurance policy because all u need is that room to flash and life is over, quick tip put the ladder next to the window at the top of the frame like a gentleman and if it flashes u wont b in the way...ur welcome
The first time you see a flashover, you will understand. Also remember that heat rises. With the ladder at the top of the frame, you will be in the direct path of the flame. With the tip below the sill, you will be below the heat level and quite safe. With the tip below, you will also be in position to enter the room and begin your search. With the ladder to the side or above the sill, you will need to take the time to reposition.
First it is important to understand that solids and liquids don't burn, only gasses. When solids and liquids reach a certain temperature (depending on the material), they will off-gas, and those gasses will ignite in the presence of heat and an oxidizer. Flashover is the point at which everything in the room (furniture, carpet, etc.) reaches pyrolysis (off-gassing temperature), and ignites all at once. The rate of rise in compartment temperature is unsurvivable.