Live React/Discuss: Urbanism YouTube's "HUGE problem"
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ก.พ. 2024
- So, several viewers, including many whose opinions and feedback a value quite a bit, have asked me to watch this video, because they think it's important. Fair warning, I've only watched about a minute of it and then decided it would be cool to do a live reaction and discussion. So I haven't vetted it to see if it's worth platforming/giving oxygen to, but given what I've heard, it's probably somewhat original and a breath of fresh air into the urbanism space.
The other thing is, I don't wanna take views from that channel, so my recommendation is, (a) go watch it BEFORE my livestream if you haven't already, and form your own opinion, and (b) if you don't, then go back and watch it later and just leave it running while you take a run through the comments on it, which I've looked at and are...kind of interesting? Alan Fisher leaves a good comment, and Chuck Marohn has some choice words.
Find the video from @NthReview here: • Urban planning TH-cam...
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Don't read the comments here, go read the comments on The Nth Review's video! Link is up in the description. Also, weekly video has been up on Nebula since Sunday morning, and the release is gonna keep getting earlier. You know what to do. go.nebula.tv/citynerd
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Went to his channel and it is tiny and given that he's riding the subscribers of the channels that he is criticizing I feel like this is a calculated TH-cam algorithm play more than anything
A lot of the comments there sound like they are from the same people that regularly send Jason death threats.
I just watched Jason's interview that "NthReview" shows a clip of on his video, and he covers every single point he raises. He clearly didn't bother watching it himself, which I think you'll agree is astonishing shifty thing to do.
Search for Conversations With Joe "Rethinking Our Cities With Jason Slaughter of Not Just Bikes" if you're interested. He praises you quite a bit. 😁
@@EternalGoldenBraid I disagree. Based on his personal life, he clearly goes the distance on urbanism, which is probably why he felt like created a complete video on the topic. It doesn't seem like it was just a thinly veiled grasp for relevance. I was impressed at the quality of his video, considered his third video back has a whole 300 views.
I blame indirect democracy as the candidate that wins always has their corporate interests first, and rarely care about people’s livelihoods.
I don’t blame people for not wanting to participate.
I genuinely think participation would be much higher if direct democracy was allowed.
As an actual municipal city planner, I really do wish urbanist or yimby ppl did show up to city Council meetings or at least contact the city in regards to about anything. We all know there's lots of ppl who want their city to be better, and they complain on Reddit, etc., but I know their commentary would go a lot further at city Hall than on Reddit. But ppl think their voice means nothing. Because nimbys and pro suburbanites and developers are definitely letting their voice heard by decision makers. Ya you don't need to be a civil expert but it would be nice to send a quick note to your Council or politicians here and there. Perhaps I'm being selfish because I have to fight with nimbys and councillors with seemingly no one in my corner but squeaky wheels are against me.
By the way, THANKS Ray for doing this reaction video!!
+
I did see a posting for a citizen advisory committee for my city that I really wanted to join but I work long hours and in the evenings so I couldn’t commit. I definitely have plans to attend a up coming information session about the reworking of our transit system to show my support.
Besides emailing your member of city government, I don't think the other options would be obvious to your average citizen. Nobody really understands how city government works, the city doesn't provide education on that, and city meetings aren't advertised to the public. You would be better off pointing out important city events and how to find city resources on social media. Another place like TH-cam and Reddit were you can curiously engaged and maybe find something that really catches your eye. To one day becoming an amateur expert.
I hear Open bars are nicemmm oohhh
As a colorado springs resident the biggest hurdle to attending city meetings is that they're during working hours on weekdays
Its impossible for those of us that work two jobs, which sadly is why the NIMBYs have such an outsize influence. They are the ones that can go, and those affected most by their decisions cannot even go to the meetings.
@@jeffc1347this is especially true for any immigrant population communities. theres no time AND english isnt spoken well if at all. makes it feel even more daunting
I appreciated his Springs references. Such a broken, broken, broken city when it comes to planning.
Send email to your city council members and/or to the hosts of the meeting. Something is much better than nothing, and your city reps may be surprisingly accessible. Mine responds to my emails!
Can we get a top 10 ways to engage civic council video?
I have time but have little experience with civic engagement. You have lots of experience and could probably provide great information.
I think it's a good idea to encourage people to get involved. This guy is a bit over critical but I think there's a genuine thread of a good idea.
You're a great TH-camr, keep on keeping on!
Also, maybe a top ten list of local advocacy groups and/or specific advocacy efforts? I definitely think video in question is a bit overly-critical, especially because appropriate activism methodology can vary heavily from city to city, but do I think some examples of success stories could encourage more folks to get involved in their own local efforts!
The calls to action are pretty much always the same, pick basically any local council meeting, show up, ask about pedestrian safety/transportation/whatever else and say it’s important. Got friends? Bring them along. Want staying power? Make a group. It’s really that easy :D
Ya name it "Top 10 ways to make your urbanist paradise a reality" That'll get some views :P
As a professional who does the hard things to make change, I think Urban Planning TH-cam is super helpful because you need public commenters who are on board when you do go to make your proposal before the Board so that they have cover to make the right decision.
Do you have a video or at least an article recommendation on how that works? Both in person and written comments? Government websites aren't super easy to navigate. They don't really advertise what they're doing. It's not something easy, like looking up what the price of an item at target is.
@@absolutelycitron1580 The best book on how to be an active citizen is "America: The Owner's Manual" by Sen. Bob Graham. For development projects, there should be a process published on a site like Municode for development review. In general, new projects first get reviewed by staff, then go to the Planning Board for recommendation, and then go to the municipal board for final approval. For transportation projects, generally there is a public meeting during concept planning or design to gather comments and then it goes to the municipal board for approval. All municipal projects over a certain amount should appear in the Capital Improvement Plan, which should be published online along with the fiscal year budget. When a project will happen, though, cannot be directly ascertained from the CIP, but you can review everything that is in the pipeline.
@@absolutelycitron1580walk to city hall, open the door, walk inside and ask anyone.
@@absolutelycitron1580 These things seem location-specific. I'm part of a group in my city that sends out announcements when important agenda items and input meetings are happening. I like to think we're starting to make a difference.
Also the politicians who actually vote and ultimately decide what happens are not planning professionals.
Nick Andert is an urbanist TH-camr who discusses and advocates for local change in LA. He constantly gives local calls to action and just did a voter guide.
its like La
Cannot get enough of his hour long transit updates
@@VinceMcLennon I live on the other side of the country and still watch them because they’re so well done.
@@colbyjd3 same experience here, left LA two years ago
Yeah he's great.
I think he makes a valid point. There is no need to give detailed instructions, but "look for local advocacy groups" is more effective message than "save enough money to move to the Netherlands or sit in a corner and cry about your live" :D
This video feelt like a mosty a NJB critique tbh
Yeah, NJB is a bit on the "the system is broken, live with it or escape it" end of the spectrum - "Oh The Urbanity!" is on the other end of that spectrum, advocating for "doing the best we can despite never being the optimal"
@@QemeH Love that channel :)
Even then, it doesn't feel like a fair critique. Jason has plenty of appearences where he directly engages with the political process, like discussion the mayoral race in Toronto. Much of the recent NJB hate seems to be based on a small number of tweets (who even uses twitter anymore), rather than the body of his work on TH-cam. The tone of his videos is sarcastic, but our cities in Canada are unaffordable and car dependent to the point they are worthy of the ridicule.
@@QemeH The Oh The Urbanity! channel has a much better attitude to it all.
@@rileynicholson2322 yeah, I agree.
I watched his videos for years and NJB has said these things many many times?
I really don't get where the hate is coming from. I was rewatching his Strong Towns playlist the other day and it ends with a Strong Towns video telling you what to do.
I mean, this guy CN is responding to got a bike and joined his planning committee because of NJB. Isn't that a successful outcome? What do these people expect from him?
Great stream! I agree that there's essentially an "urbanism advocacy pipeline" and for a lot of people, urbanist youtube is the first step in that pipeline. I just think that the second step of the pipeline should be filled by other organizations specific to where you live, and I don't expect TH-camrs to fill that role.
For example, I watched a bunch of NJB, got interested in helping with real advocacy in my city, googled "bike advocacy Seattle", and found an organization with which I now volunteer (Seattle Neighborhood Greenways). I think it's SNG's role to organize people to fight for specific goals that will make our city better (eg. adding bus lanes for the Route 40!)
It would be cool to see more youtube videos about specific successful advocacy groups/projects since that might inspire more people to find a local group. But I don't expect TH-camrs to teach us exactly how to fix every car-centric city
Exactly this! The internet is great for spreading information and awareness, but the boots on the ground work will always have to come from local organising.
I've yet not watched the full video. But so often on the internet I see people yelling for what they want. Look at the local "establishment" and go 'we can't have that here!'
To them I yell "GRASSROOTS!" Organize yourself, or find an organization that probably already exists and join! Don't sit on your ass.
-Someone who has walked around knocking on doors canvassing opinions.
The thing you said in that last paragraph is why i was scratching my head at the guy going for Strong Towns like he was. I thought that video they made about parking minimums in that town in Arkansas was exactly that, showing a specific success of advocacy groups making substantive changes to policies in cooperation with lawmakers in a local town, that video was cool and inspiring
@@user-zr9hu3tf1y There does seem to be a concerted effort in the 'online urbanist space' to cancel both NJB (the channel that has opened millions of people's eyes to what's wrong with car-centric design) and StrongTowns (the org that helps people take the first steps to get something better). The comments on the linked video are just one example of that.
You have to wonder, who benefits from that?
This exactly. There are tiers of engagement and issue education is tier 1; that’s where urbanist TH-cam comes in. Some subset of people then go to the next tier and find local orgs to learn local issues. A further subset gets active with those groups. And finally a very few people lead groups, run for office, etc.
But youtubers can’t be responsible for every step there. You wouldn’t criticize a local bike advocate for not doing enough to educate international audiences about housing; you also can’t really criticize people doing that education for not running advocacy on a local bike lane 🤷🏻♂️
I mean, i definitely would appreciate urbanist youtube demonstrating and showing examples of the civics aspect. I also think the lack of civics knowledge amongst people (but in particular young people) is highly under estimated, which is why you would talk about civics. It's not about ego or giving the viewer the benefit of the doubt for their intelligence, but making sure the net is cast wide and far.
Anecdotally, I volunteer for a political organization but the number (non-affiliated) peers i've talked to don't have the slightest clue nor where to even begin to engage and activate.
@@andrewtran949 Yeah same, and I don't blame them. My biggest thing is climate change. I moved to my state 3 years ago and holy cow it's taken me about a year to learn all that I've needed to learn just to START thinking about the actual steps to take to address the problems. It's a lot to expect out of people who don't have faith in the system anymore. But hearing it from good storytellers like these orange pill people makes it easier to learn. They make good, digestible videos, and the people who talk about politics are dry af
The problem with that is that engagement processes are different in every province (Canadian here) due to different legislation around local government and planning. It's not like urbanist content creators don't mention things like city councils, council meetings, public hearings, and other basic concepts. I really don't see have we can expect much more detail without it being painfully dull and getting no views.
@@rileynicholson2322Yeah, I think the problem is also TH-cam and those of us who consume content. No video about a council meeting is going to go viral per the algorithm, and TH-cam has no incentive to give dry political hearings more airtime than something catchy and engaging. It's on the individual to dig into the issues, but most cities have made their processes arcane and intangible, because they can and aren't held accountable by those who want better.
It's partly why I think the federal government has to be a part of the solution, because in many ways they created this problem with the interstate highway act, and also with how they manage road standards. If the feds were to update federal highway funding, put more money into intercity, interstate, and local transit, and adopt more diverse road standards, that would go a long way towards making local and state governments behave differently.
Very well said. I know so many intelligent people my age and younger who don't understand how civics work & the impact it has on our communities. I understand the latter because of youtube, but im still trying to unravel the former
It might be a generational thing, but NJB, CityNerd, etc is doing wonders with changing hearts and minds of young Millenials and Gen Z. Recently had the last person in the world (a Jordan Peterson-stan who buys way too much into that worldview) come up to me and talk about getting rid of his car and using his bike full time after watching a lot of NJB. He might be a low-propensity voter these days but as someone who works on the political side, I now feel comfortable asking him to vote/get involved in urbanist pushes in our hometown. And it is something I never could have done myself, since he views me first as a leftist and then as an urbanist.
It’s almost like conservatives would benefit just as much if cities actually cared about basic civilian needs. 😅
@@masterdecats6418 It's crazy how conservatives are anti urbanist because of how long cars have dominated our county, yet in the grand scheme of history, cars are are pretty new progression. Shouldn't conservatives want our cities to go back to their traditional ways of relying on public transit, walking, and biking before driving?
Conservatism is about "traditional values," right? What's more traditional than walking?
@@carstarsarstenstesenn so really a lot of what are called Conservatives now are in no way conservative, they are actually radical right wingers. They have little to do with Burke esque conservatism. Those do exist, although much less commonly in America.
@@carstarsarstenstesenn in theory, sure, but reactionaries romanticize and largely want to revert to the car centric 1950s, nuclear family in the suburbs, as opposed to traditional, walkable and well planned cities.
NJB sucks. He's too angry and hateful. CityNerd is way better.
Dubuque is NOT one of the quad cities, I'm so embarrassed. Bettendorf erasure
The Lady from Dubuque is a good play by Edward Albee,
erasing bettendorf is a good thing!
thankyou.. but quad is so loose doubt my age group even noticed
Fun fact that even most people who live there don’t know: the term “quad cities” was originally used to refer to Davenport IA, Rock Island IL, Moline IL and East Moline IL. Because of its size many people mistakenly believe Bettendorf is one of the “quads” in Quad Cities. There was once an effort to change the region’s name to “quint cities” to acknowledge Bettendorf but it didn’t have the same ring to it.
@@jimmybuckets5863 I'm from the QC and coincidently my neighbors wifi is jimmybucketz. Are we neighbors?
Great response Ray!
My thoughts on this, if anyone cares:
-The skills required for video content production, are very different to the skills required for civic engagement. The number of people who are good at both, is naturally low.
-The role of youtubers is basically journalism - Journalists commentate on issues and educate the public, it's not their job to engage directly.
-Nobody can make a difference if they don't know what the problem is, and that's the role urbanist youtube is playing. As mentioned, a lot of young people watch this stuff, and they are our future voters, councilors, and planners.
-Encouraging civic engagement is actually really hard on the internet, because this stuff works really differently depending on where you are in the world - probably even for different parts of the US, but especially internationally.
-..I hope everyone is having a great day.
I care :) great comment
I think a lot of the North American urbanist doomerism comes from the idea thst European style urbanism is the only way to achieve good urbanist outcomes and the fact that most North American cities will probably never achieve that connected bulidings street wall effect that European cities have. I think it would really benefit us to highlight old small towns, street car suburbs and other good urbanism that's native to North America since that sort of thing is a much more realistic goal for how X city could look in 10 years.
I used to assume NA was all crap outside of NYC and some major town centres but it was actually CityNerd who introduced me to many underrated spots in NA 😮
The game changer will be grade-separated transport lines that cost the same as or is cheaper than gondolas to construct and operate, has capacity and quick build time similar to gondolas, but has vehicle speeds comparable to commuter rail.
And a lot of the “better” new neighbourhoods being built are modelled off of street car suburbs too
Very, very true. EVERY MAJOR EUROPEAN CITY is built around 4-7 storey mixed use dense residential. Whether it's Seville, Prague, Amsterdam or Berlin, behind the facades is the same type of building. Reality isn't Simcity where you just rezone. I'd love the us to be more like Europe, not without some kind of dictatorship anyway...
It's easy to criticize American cities for not being like European ones which were built centuries before the automobile. Self-styled urbanists have a tendency to to be a bit sanctimonious in that regard.
I'm in an Urban Planning program and one of the easiest things to do is just read your cities official plan, zoning or vision documents. If you don't even know what the city itself wants then you'll have no starting point to counter bad planning or NIMBY's.
As boring as they are, try and watch a city council meeting or two. Most are on TH-cam or your cities website. See how the process works and understand what your city council stands for and against.
Yes! NIMBYs certainly know all of that info, so we need to know it too.
@@jcomden The thing that shocked me the most about my hometown was how little some of the NIMBY's knew about the actual project. So knowing those documents can actually give you the leg up on a bad point they may hammer away at.
Good example was someone complaining about the shadows hitting the neighbourhood from a proposed tower on our waterfront. Turns out the shadows don't hit the neighbourhood at all if you read through the shadow study but the NIMBY didn't know this.
Meetings on youtube? A city website? Lol. My city has council meetings behind closed doors.
I don’t think his message was supposed to be “only get involved once you know all of how your city works” but it really feels like it. I have zero clue how my city makes money but I’ll be damned if I’m not out there voting on things I would like to see done in my city.
It does come off as overly negative towards people just beginning to make efforts or who are too busy in their lives to be a full-time activist
@@luke5100 exactly! And the videos that DO go into that kind of detail very quickly becomes dry, and outdated!
Libertarians i.e. Anarchists i.e. Separatists i.e. Sovereign Citizens say: all government is the problem, all the time, everywhere, and therefore, get rid of all government. I do not believe that. I do not agree with them on that. But, as a Reductionist/PhD Mathematician, I DO care #1 about forcing people to be LOGICALLY CONSISTENT with what they say. Punishment for a "crime" should depend upon the political views of the "victim".
I do not blame anybody in this world not wanting to show up physically to government meetings: they risk getting kidnapped (i.e. "arrested") by police. It is much easier and safer to protest or make proposals online, on the internet, from the relative safety of one's home. In fact, that is one of the most important reasons the internet was created.
When I lobbied/protested for Animal Rights Vegan causes, to shut down businesses selling fur, as part of SACA (Student Action Corps for Animals) in the 1980s and early 1990s, I was so grateful and thankful the internet came along. No risk of getting kidnapped by police, by the government. I do not blame anybody not wanting to physically show up to government meetings: we don't want to HEAR BULLSHIT from the opposing side.
Idk, I think Ray focused in on this guy's complaint about one note urbanists. I watched that video first and came to this one next and didn't get that vibe.
/ Realized his complaints are not with "people who watch these videos & engage" but more with the content creators who don't express how to engage - or perhaps how not to engage and come off too high minded in a speech
I think the big issue with these meetings is that they are at times that are incredibly inconvenient so the only people that can show up to comment are old retired people that will be alive for the downsides of building a new awesome whatever but will probably be dead or almost dead by the time it's built. I tried to go to several meetings about a new sidewalk and bike path and some possible bus improvements but the timing never worked out because I have a life.
Yeah it's ridiculous, it's 2024 and these city council meetings are still in person like we don't have work or stuff to do, and we can just drop everything to sit in a boring chamber and wait around. Why can't they do this stuff online? I've seen it done! Every clerk or mayor or whoever needs to hire someone to be the zoom technician person lol
Which city? My council district has a call in remote option and we also have neighborhood councils that meet after work. That seems like a great foundation to lay if a city doesn’t have that already.
My city council (in Australia) has all its council meetings at night, usually 7:30pm Wednesday nights, and they also live stream them and take online questions. That makes it much more democratic and allows far more people to participate.
@@ficus3929Right? So many city councils will even purposely schedule their meetings after 5 o’clock when most people aren’t working. It sucks when councils aren’t flexible to the people that elect their members.
@@luke5100They would go so they can have their opinions heard. Duh.
I think the video was framed about urbanist TH-cam/ TH-camrs, but really seemed like a more general complaint of armchair activism. It's very common in the political sphere too where we have all these young people learning tons of political theory, but then most are taking no steps to enact any changes. What is the missing step to actually make it happen? Sure people could Google their local groups, they're intelligent enough to do so, but they largely don't. I don't think it is a TH-camr problem to solve, but something for all of us to think about.
@@luke5100 Yep, I just made a comment on this. If you'd like to, I highly recommend checking out this study: "Motornomativity: How Social Norms Hide a Major Public Health Hazard".
@@luke5100 I think everyone should be affiliated with Strong Towns just so ST can show large numbers of people in their group to show the city gov how popular it is. A group has a bigger impact when it is bigger.
Conversely, youtubers have positioned themselves as "people who point at problems." I think the OP was saying that youtubers in general, are not pointing at that specific part of the problem. They might say 'get together with friends and talk about what to do" but they don't mention the conversation that is "-what do we do? -I don't know, what do you think we should do? I don't know, you got any ideas?"
You're spot on. You might have millions of people engaging with content online, but when it comes time to head to that council meeting, head to the local election, or vote in a run-off/special election... that engagement is largely gone.
But that's because the video framed youtube urbanism as armchair urbanism and just plain complaining. It's not that. It's missioanry work. The problem is the audience, due to the algorithm, is the choir. We must get this quality missionary content out to the souls taken over by car-centric ideologies.
I feel like this guy forgets how much political change is driven by the media landscape which in turn drives voting decisions, and TH-cam is a really important part of the media landscape these days. Getting people aware of the ideas and arguments around urban planning - and, more importantly, enthusiastic about them - is going to inform how people think and vote, and is indirectly going to shift cultural trends in the right direction.
We have a council election coming next month where I live in Australia (Brisbane) and some of the left leaning candidates are talking very openly and specifically about concepts such as walkability, traffic calming, active transport etc. and incorporating these ideas into their policy platforms. These are ideas that I feel would not have necessarily been quite so predominant in previous election cycles. So it’s clear to me that talking about these issues more and more online spreads awareness and influences tangible policy initiatives.
I mean it’s also worth giving more credit to NJB who has done a couple of specific videos about the political history of particular infrastructural decisions in Canada. If nothing else that at least partly elucidates the political and institutional machinery that is responsible for local decision making.
I agree with the video insofar as there's a paucity of videos on the realpolitik/praxis of making urbanist policy changes. How government works mechanically, I can google.
But "Our fledgling urbanist group got ignored or shouted down at the Council meeting. Now what?" is the next level problem that lacks roadmaps (at least on YT). What are the most effective ways to overcome or convince NIMBY groups? What types of existing interest groups would/could/should be our useful allies? How should we message proposals such that we avoid scaring the car-pilled majority? (E.g. Avoid "15 minute cities", it's hopelessly tainted. Use "walkable" or "car-optional" instead.) What's the typical order-of-operations of reforms to quicken impact? (E.g. Density, Mixed-use, Bike path network). I assume there are think-tanks with documents, but lack of YT content makes them less salient.
the best way to influence policy makers and gov is to "speak their language" by showing to them the *economic benefits* of urbanism against car-dependent sprawl. they will care about economic efficiencies far more than any social or cultural benefit, because we in North America very much live in a neoliberal capitalist society. the social benefits work fine for people who value that (more likely left leaning people), but centrists and right wing people are far more likely to get on board for economic reasons. you can also get actual small-gov conservatives to get on board with things like abolishing regulations such as parking mandates and strict zoning laws. but the important thing is: know your audience, and speak to them accordingly
That's basically where you want to join StrongTowns.
well said
Part of the Bloomington Revivalists here and we're doing ALOT more than what was suggested here. Yes were bench building and painting, but we're also building organizational power.
Some people don’t understand how wholes movements get created.
It doesn’t matter that urbanist TH-cam aren’t telling people how things work exactly, and what to do exactly.
What matters is that the message is very clear, easy to understand, convincing, relatable, and that it reaches the maximum amount of people. And I think that’s exactly what’s happening with urbanist TH-cam right now, and it’s amazing.
The amount of people who will change their behavior and will become efficient activist is of course minuscule, but that’s ok. The public opinion is affected, some people develop whole careers around those issue, the media is starting to talk about things differently.
All I’m saying, is keep it on !
38 min in when writing this comment. His tone def comes across as bashing youtubers who certainly provide a lot of value but I think his underlying point is well made that a lot of people could use more direction in how to engage in the real world. Urban planning youtube hasn't greatly tapped into this potential for mobilizing enthusiasts. I'm sure many viewers are smart enough to figure it out but with extra resources and guidance it could go a lot faster!
I can confirm you do have at least one 16 year old viewer :) Recently I've been communicating with my county officials about a plan I had for some roads near where I live. I'd say that it definitely was possible for me to figure it out, it was just very time consuming and pretty confusing. It also took me a while to get started with it though, cause although I've been watching these videos for a year or so, I just recently started trying to do something about it.
I'm sure a video that was a call to action would have pushed me along and would help a lot of others in similar positions. I feel like there a few video ideas that would be cool to see like how places have actually fixed some infrastructure, or a video detailing some local groups for some large cities around the U.S. Thanks for making your videos!
Edit: You also just recently mentioned my claimed hometown of Marietta on your last video which was really cool to see! Unfortunately, I live just outside the city limits and so I'm not even serviced by any public transit which I hope to fix.
nice! Keep up the good work! It is unpaid work but it is necessary work. It's the only way anything good has ever gotten done.
Good job!
taking a year or so of learning before getting involved isn’t uncommon, or even bad really. So long as you get to work eventually! And you’re way ahead on the timeline compared to most of us old farts just getting around to it 😅
I've been to Marietta, the Marietta diner has served me 2 of my favorite breakfasts ever.
im 16 too!
As a young man also from Georgia, it elates me to hear that at sixteen you are already making enough of an influence in your local politics as you have, and from a county larger than mine (only about 200k or so here). Me I never felt empowered enough to do anything and never had any connections, either, but the fact that you’ve actually started doing things (communications, you mentioned) is a big step in the right direction on the path few of us can take.
I haven’t really been to Cobb County all that much, but I imagine Marietta looks in many ways like the part of Gwinnett where my cousins are from, so I imagine a fairly walkable core area with shops and restaurants and other cool stuff surrounded by sprawling suburbs where most of the families live or want to live.
Good luck in your future endeavors.
I just gotta say, being in Vancouver, we're supremely fortunate to have Uytae Lee going to bat for us. Extremely involved and makes excellent urbanist content specifically "About Here."
The general message that I agree with that I got from his video was that there are a lot of people who see how things could be better, but lack supporting information that would assist them in getting their city to said better state. You don't need to know everything he mentioned (the full intricacies of the planning system, local art, where to report pot holes, the city history etc.) but knowing SOME of it, and the skills to determine how to figure out what that some should be, is lacking.
Every city IS going to be different, but that doesn't mean that call-outs on where someone might look to push to make things better are irrelevant. Yeah, I can google whatever information I need, but every callout makes that process easier on mass. (channels that ask for likes, subscribes, and notifications get proovably better interaction for similar example)
TLDR: Theres a very specific brand of problem solving, tips, tricks, etc that YOU might know, but could totally be taught more, and it would massively assist in helping others improve their cities which require a case by case approack.
I might have an unpopular opinion. I didn't like Strong Town's latest video, but for a much different reason than NthReview. The video is literally about you not having to move, yet they only showcase towns that don't have euclidean zoning. What these organizations are doing is fantastic and what they're accomplishing is amazing, but what can't be denied is how easy it is to organize in a town where majority of the homes have a Walk Score/Bike Score of 60+. They are basically saying, "Anyone can do it," but only showing the easiest battles.
To end on a good note, I still believe Strong Towns is carrying the urban movement by miles. There is no other channel that I believe is doing better in that aspect, but that doesn't mean they are immune to small critique.
OTOH, I agree with a lot of Strong Town’s priorities and such, but OTOH the guy they use as a video host just bothers me and I have pushed back on a lot of their sketchy data and I’m pretty sure all I got for my questioning them was a ton of thumbs downs if not a mute.
@@nunyabidness3075 He "bother's" you??
@@kjh23gk Yeah, he seems very dishonest and manipulative to me. He seems to be putting on an act.
@@nunyabidness3075 You might have to explain more. I don't see that at all. Also, what data in particularly is sketchy?
@@josephcarreon2341 As far as the host goes, there’s nothing I can tell you that’s definitive. It’s a feeling or impression.
As far as the data goes, it’s completely messed up. It does not say at all what they want it to say. First of all, you cannot cherry pick what budget items should count, and which ones are irrelevant. People are not Sims. It takes little time at all to do simple math and figure out that the more dense a city is (population per square mile) the higher their spending is per person).
Then, dividing areas up by zip code is a fail because property taxes are not the only taxes, but they are the only ones truly tied to zip codes. If you eliminate the type of neighborhoods your most productive people live in, you might find they leave along with the businesses that employ them or they own. And, those businesses are very likely not in the zip code they live in.
So, you go about packing people into tighter spaces by diktat, and the thing is they start having more problems. There’s physical issues that require more city services and regulation. And, there’s softer issues which require more police and social services. It’s one thing to regulate the natural growth and let developers respond to the market and to watch out for exploitation. It’s a whole other thing to tax everyone then spend the money to ensure more government growth.
Some guy in a big consulting firm came up with the basic scheme and made bank with it. It’s typical garbage from that sort of company. It’s about telling people what they want to hear and helping them justify helping their own careers while charging a big bill to induce more trickery: “Of course this is good advice, look what we paid for it,” which goes hand in hand with, “We hired the best consultants, so don’t blame me if it fails.”
The biggest problem with much of suburbia is that it is contrived and over done because of government policies. Pushing new policies is likely to also have ill effects. Get rid of all the bad policies.
Enjoyed the video, and I think he made some good points. Telling people who they should contact to get involved isn't just hand-holding, it's a reminder that there is a way to get more involved for people that already know; If someone has no clue where to even start then giving a concrete step takes it out of the realm of the unknown into practical reality. It can feel like you need to talk to the confusing esoteric municipal government entity to do something, when it's really "send an email to X". You might not want to tackle the former but the later is easy enough to google and go.
++
CN didn't take enough credit. He's definitely called out pertinent local ballot initiatives if they were upcoming on a city he was covering. The ballot box should be where we all start our advocacy. VOTE! The more local, the more important your vote is.
Agreed. But, on a personal level, it's usually better to defer on earned credit, than to take unearned credit.
Thanks for viewing, CityNerd!
Thanks for stirring up unnecessary drama that only serves to divide the community!
I hope you enjoy that ad revenue and sponsorship money!
@@isoscelestriangle weird take, but okay.
Good video and i definitely agree with the bulk of what you said. My takeaway is that it's not that you think nobody but you can figure it out, but that many more would be interested in helping if they were pointed out the basics
@@NthReviewno, this really is just drama.
The majority of people at our local Strong Towns LC came from NJB because he has promoted Strong Towns for years. We might not even exist without him.
You making a video about a bunch of debunked nonsense with screenshots of six month old Tweets harms our cause. NJB has given the context of those tweets many times (hint: they were for an individual, not blanket advice for everyone).
This is drama and it's not helpful.
@@isoscelestriangle Maybe you're the one being divisive, ever thought of that? Defensiveness is an indication that you are the one forming and taking a side.
Honestly, Search has become so SEO’d to hell lately, a video where someone picks a random town and a random problem and models how you would use Google (or others) as it exists to contact someone about it… not a bad video series, imo. Your videos have certainly opened my eyes to the sorts of publicly available data sets I don’t know were out there before.
As an anecdata point: I recently needed to figure out if I needed a permit for some yardwork, read a LOT of my townships’s watershed bylaws or whatever they’re called, and I was STILL wrong!
Urbanist TH-cam seems popular enough that a many of us audience should attend council meetings, at least as a test of our yimbyism
For me, as a 26 year old who is working full time and doing umiversity on the side, i would love for more information on how to become more engaged civically in my community. One of the biggest problems i run into is that it becomes way too hard to spend the time/energy required to navigate the process by myself with no guidance, and can quickly become daunting and overwhelming. Extra advice on where to start, or resources i can use would be very helpful to me.
It's true. And tbh the youtubers or whoever that make those videos are not good creators like orange pill community people. It's very time consuming, and boring, and so slow to get things done, it's like a second job. Technically it is, it's unpaid labor. Political labor is unpaid labor like housekeeping, childcare, cooking, but it's work that has to be done to keep the world together!
You won't find that advice on a TH-cam video, there isn't one effective method which would work in every community.
I just started emailing people. Over time i was able to get into contact with my state multimodal engineer and now have a good resource to learn about whats going on where I live.
@@spicy_mint except there are absolutely tips and guidelines that DO work in every community. And many of the basic guidelines are exactly the same in most places in the US. The problem is that lots of these creators (and I think CityNerds reaction was a great example of this) are so used to the world of municipal government that they don't realize that the vast majority of people in the US don't even know how to give comments at a city council meeting. And when are they going to take the time to learn, if they don't even know where to start? During the day when they're working? At night when they're making dinner and taking care of their kids? After their kids go to bed, when they finally have 30 minutes of free time? You think they're going to spend that time trying to figure out how they're going to attend the next city council meeting?
Thats why information like that being included in these videos would be such a great resource. It just puts these people who are interested in living in a better place 1 step closer to becoming involved in their local city.
Question: Is there a Strong Towns local conversation in your city?
Second question: What city do you live in (if you're willing to share)? It's hard to try to actually answer without that.
I live in an area with hyper involved people (Boston Metro) and it really does slow any progress. 30 years is a realistic time horizon for changing the environment in a place with this level of participation and resistance to change.
Yeah 30 years is just ridiculous. People must get more involved.
That sounds similar to here, Toronto.
Maybe We need a Council of TH-cam urbanists to release a Group video series on " How to ... " and go region by region. Maybe even get sponsored by a city or too
The thing for my city is that council meetings are always in the morning when people work. Its not easy for most people to attend. But who do they consult as stakeholders? Advocacy groups. For most people who work 9-5 the best bet for them would be to contact councilors or join an advocacy group.
Ray my generation came up with TV's that BLAST US WITH EXPLOSIONS AND MUSIC OH MY GOD, and then drop to a whisper for dialogue. I hate captions too but they save me from having to constantly juggle the volume lol
“I’m sure there are a bunch of cool conservatives who care about this stuff… that’s what I’ve heard” 😂 the sass lmaooooo
mfw 😮💨😫
i was gonna superchat this, but i forgot my YT password 😂. i feel like citynerd "move to this state/city" is distinct from the doomer attitude NJB gets criticized for sometimes because it shows some nuance to places. It's not just North America bad! it's here are good and bad places *within* US states and cities, and it shows americans that this stuff can be less foreign and unimaginable than we sometimes think, cause after all, it's right in our backyard
i said something very similar in the post comments, i agree entirely. it’s why i like ray’s channel
Honestly, while I acknowledge that up and moving is not something a lot of people can do, I don't blame NJB for his doomerism. I live in a fairly good area as far as US urbanism goes, but it is extremely disheartening to watch the process unfold. You vote for a light rail expansion, but it'll take 20 years and the first 8 of those are just people trying to ruin the plan you voted for. You want dense TOD but the people who have lived in your town for 30 want to keep it from ever changing. It's exhausting. The "plant a tree you'll never sit under" phrase is nice and all, but if I'm someone with a family like NJB, I'll vote for planting the tree, but I also need to think about how to give my family shade right now.
@@inubert i just dont get why you hear the "how to give my family shade" argument in defense of NJB so often. no one (i dont think) criticizes him for moving to the netherlands. the energy in the first line in that controversial tweet typifies his doomerism that isnt "i give up on north america" it's "everyone should give up on north america" which steps further than his personal choice and makes it this souring on the concept of optimism or activism that he has at times
@@user-zr9hu3tf1y NJB has never said that everyone should move, he's just promoted it as an option. Most of the members of our local Strong Towns LC came from NJB because he promotes Strong Towns all the time.
Have you even watched his content or are you basing everything off of one screenshot of a tweet?
@@barkhauseneffect yo where did i say he said everyone should move? have you even read my comments or are you basing everything off of something you imagined i wrote?
Probably the kindest interpretation of the whole "I figured this out, but you all need your hands held" is that he's probably trying to say something more like "I had to google this stuff but I WISH someone had told me ahead of time." He just didn't frame it very well.
yeah, I interpreted it as 'I had to learn this and I didn't realise when I started out just how much I had to learn'
That was my takeaway too, I for one would appreciate a video made about urbanism on the civic side.
That's how i interpreted it too. I feel it's unfair to assume he thinks everybody but him is stupid
This was my second time through the NthReview video and my reaction crystallized this time.
To me, he's upset that the various urbanist TH-camrs don't provide enough of the nuts and bolts of how to change things. But: (1) He's a TH-camr; (2) He's a confirmed urbanist; (3) He's already active in his community and government, which makes him chest-deep with the nuts and bolts. These things make him uniquely positioned to fix the very problem he has identified. So rather than complaining, why not pivot the NthReview channel to a full-time urbanist nuts and bolts channel?
Of course, the obvious answer is that not very many people would watch it.
His video had its good points, but on balance it came across as sour grapes mixed with the irony of committing the same fault he's identified.
I think it's because his channel is more on what he likes outside work? And his work is just doing what he said in the video?
Not everyone has to do urban planning videos, and I guess the guy has already a community established and is how he expresses himself or something like that. I think it's very fair to come out of the tone of his channel and speak his mind and then keep doing what he likes.
I'm 100% sure that if he pivots the channel to urban planning he would have a lot more audience. The video is already on par of his most viewed videos and it will only increase in number, so I don't think he just have to pivot for art's or urbanity's sake.
He's just someone doing the work and signaling that you have to get your hands dirty and get up from your chair instead of consuming the videos that you agree on.
He's allowed to care about two things at once (one of them being a more leisure activity). He can care about civic engagement AND having a game review youtube channel. He doesn't need to combine those interests just because he made this one off video.
For the record he just recently pinned a comment saying he's making a second channel which WILL be about Urban Planning.
I think he sensationalizes the TH-camrers for views a bit but I agree with his main points. Making clubs and getting knowledge is great but I have no idea how to actually go about giving my voice or where to find possible town projects.
I think his point is that the orange pill channels repeat the concepts and what the issues are without giving a call to action or possible routes to action. There could be more calls to action and more advice on what to do.
I haven’t seen anyone else really go into the details like he has and I did enjoy that.
I would have titled his video “Yes, you are all orange pilled, now show up to my council meetings so we can get stuff done.”
That's not the role channels like NJB want, though. From his very first video he clearly states that he made the channel to show people why he and his wife chose Amsterdam as a place to raise their kids. He does that by using first-hand examples of good urban design and bad urban design. He's gone into a little more depth with his Strong Towns series, but he's largely kept to his initial plan.
He uses his Urbanist Agenda channel for discussing urbanism in more depth (with people like Ray, RMTransit, Adam Something, Alan Fisher, City Beautiful, etc.). I think he's also talked about his time advocating for changes in Toronto on that channel too.
As far as advice on what to do is concerned, he's always recommending Strong Towns as a first step.
Not Just Bikes doesn't need a call to action, but they gave one, and it was "leave your dumpy home for greener pastures"
Lol legit title change
@@tommy8372 that feels like the opposite lol, like literally a call to the most inaction possible, "leave this place and literally make it impossible for anything you do to ever improve it because you dont live there anymore"
But what exactly should NJB make content about? How it works exactly in his city in the Netherlands? He has an international audience from all around the world. Should be make videos for every single country, and all the weird quirks different municipalities and towns have on how things like this are decided? Should he make videos about how its done in every state in the US? Not to mention that NJB frequently makes calls to action - just check his community feed on YT.
I mostly agree with the video. TH-camrs don't need to give super detailed videos about this stuff, but they should at least mention regularly (not necessarily in every video) that "hey, if you want to get involved in your local city, here are some books you should read or here is where you can probably go and find out how to get involved." You can give general directions based on how you personally got involved, and what you can do to improve your advocacy. In that sense I think this video is just what urbanist TH-cam needs. As a TH-cam viewer, I'm always interested in learning about what route people took to get interested and get involved in their local community, and what they can do to improve. There needs to be a lot more of that.
Short-Circuiting Policy is a good book to start with. and No is Not Enough by Naomi Klein
Since this video is more of a NJB criticism than anyone else, I think it's important to point out that Jason sends people to Strong Towns in many of his videos and other appearances. He's already doing what's being asked for, which is why these critiques don't land very well.
For starters its already pretty bad that cities and local governments are relying on rando youtubers to introduce their voters to get them engaged. The responsibility of education should be on those in their respective councils instead, but youtubers should definitely provide resources for getting politically engaged as well
At several points you took the position "Urbanist TH-cam creators don't need to address these subjects because our viewers are smart enough to go learn about them on their own", but by this logic Urbanist TH-cam never needed to exist in the first place. Insofar as these channels do activate and inform people, I think it's perfectly fair to point out that the educating voices are missing some angles that could enhance the effectiveness of the overall movement.
That's a fair read of that comment, but I took it as moreso, "if a viewer wants to take that next step, then it's on them to figure out how to do it."
That might seem harsh, but creating a video on how to engage in your local planning process is just not going to be a good or fun video.
But I'm curious if Ray will try his hand at one of these videos, since he seems to enjoy a challenge.
@@jamalgibson8139 I think there's opportunity to plant some seeds here without necessarily going into excruciating detail; Even just showing people examples of why pro-urbanism efforts succeeded or failed can drive home the importance of getting you and your like-minded neighbors to turn out for votes or submit comments when someone else has already done the work to get a proposal up for consideration.
having the ability to figure all these things out is different than having the time/energy to. i have 2 chronic health conditions which leave me exhausted at the end of a normal day. If there was some resource with general guidelines of how to get involved, it would be a lot of help (more than just "go talk to your rep")
i wrote a paper letter to a local rep (
“It did not take Amsterdam generations to reverse some of this stuff”.
Yes, but Amsterdam also did not spend generations building out car-only infrastructure.
First levittown was in 1947
Stop the child murder protests came less than a generation later in the early 1970s.
Whereas a city like, say, Auckland, spend an additional TWO generations going all in on cars. Almost the entirety of Auckland has been built to be accessible only by car, a situation that never arose in Amsterdam.
So that makes Amsterdam a bad example - good things were possible back then because many people alive still remembered things before we went all-in on cars in the 1960s.
It is true though that this stuff can change much more quickly than “generations”. A better example is perhaps the bike lane networks of Seville and Paris, these did come seemingly out of nowhere.
Sometimes people alive just choose to ignore what happened. In my city an entire neighbourhood was destroyed in the late 50's/60's to build a large highway which ran right through downtown. Plenty of those people were alive or in charge during the massive sprawl that ensued in the following decades further cementing dependency on cars.
The real question is why did Amsterdam stop car centric growth and Auckland didnt. Why were the people in Amsterdam outraged at car fatalities, but Auchland didn't?
@@loubob21 I don’t know, it could be down to luck / happenstance: there just happened to be also an oil crisis when the protests against traffic deaths happened.
The real interesting observation is that this shift in direction also did not happen in other neighbouring European countries.
Wild. I went to my city council member's office hours last week! I would never have done that if not for getting orange pilled.
As someone who isn't in the US, I think that critique misses the point that not every place has the same way of government and public policy/decision making.
I live in Brazil, and our cities don't have a "city council" that anyone could go and talk. The politics (specially partidarism) is much more complex. Some transit/mobility projects need to undergo a public hearing, but it's mostly just an obligatory phase that doesn't change how the project develop.
So the there's a really need of a change of the public/academic opinion, so the officials can feel the need to do changes. And that's were "urbanist youtube" comes. It shows alternatives and break the hollywood/media propaganda that favours car centric culture for decades.
So, although it's important to talk about "how" you can change things, the "reality" is that outside the US, this is just too complex.
But at the same time a 10-20 minute video comparing BRT and LRT, is most of time more easy to gain knowledge from, and for people to base their opinions on better resources.
Im ignorant, so Im not claiming to know better than you about brazil, but are you sure those meetings dont change how the project develops? I would have assumed that the meetings in the US dont change how projects develop either, but hearing Ray/CityNerd say that public feedback does change things makes me wonder how true or not true it is in my area. I just need to find out more and make fewer assumptions with no knowledge.
@@user-zr9hu3tf1yit doesn't. Because it always depend on the political will. There are projects that had these hearings and didn't even became reality.
Because they are just an obligatory step to follow.
There's "master urban plan" that need to be approved by the city legislative called "plano diretor", but it usually takes time, and the government isn't really obligated to follow either. So it's complex, and probably totally different from country to country.
I played a disproportionate role in setting telecom regulatory policy in Washington state once simply because I was just about the only regular citizen (i.e. non paid industry lobbyist) who thought it worth his time to travel to Olympia and show up in person at the public comment session for the proposed rulemaking.
I have no other context for this comment, and already that’s a book I’d want to read.
I appreciate what you do, and went to community planning groups to observe how they occured in my community. During the first one i went to, I didn't speak because i wanted to try to understand how the process works before a topic i wanted to have discussed appeared. A good understanding of how the process works and exists would help people be effective when trying to change the system. This is something that I've learned from other more political centered videos from creators like Beau of the fifth column.
Thanks for the rec! We can all benefit from putting on our explorer hat and going to these things
Hello fellow internet person!
To reiterate & expand my comments from the chat:
1) I'd love it if when you do a city visit or a deep dive on an individual city that you take a brief moment to talk about specific opportunities for citizen activism in that one specific city, at that specific snapshot in time. If you spent 30-45 sec of a 15min video on that I doubt it would drag or lose viewer engagement and it would likely spark some viewers to discover the analogs that are applicable in their city.
2) I think you had a different reading of the NthReview's points about why path to advocacy should be spelled out in urbanist YT content. I read it not as "I could figure this out but I don't think other people can" but rather as "If YT videos raise knowledge about these paths to engagement in the same way they raise understanding of topics like 'induced demand' it would be even easier for other people to figure out how to get involved than it was for me."
My $0.02.
Agreed on both points!
You nailed it!
i didn't know i needed live advertisement reaccs from CN, but now I need more
Give the people what they want!
@@michaelmrcool
I actually don't mind the background music of the video, but I'm a sucker for bad game show music so take that for what you will
I love a quality game show soundtrack
It’s the same music as the end of Ryan George’s videos where he talks to himself.
Way too loud though, for sure.
As a civil engineer who works in transit capital construction and design, urbanist TH-cam has genuinely helped me be a better designer. This is exactly the type of stuff you don't learn in college. You learn how to design for cars, not people. Finding a community like this has been immensely helpful for me. Also I did join my city transportation commission bc I found it all by mysekf so jokes on this dude.
I think he's correctly identifying gaps between people who want to do more and their ability to do more but he's lumping too many tings in together.
For example Jason is always saying in videos and especially on live streams that his channel is not there to tech you urbanism, it's just a collection of 'things I found cool'. Sometimes rewatching videos like his continuous sidewalks or smart traffic lights it can seem really simple becuase we forget that, at one point, this was all new to us. Like, if you see him as the Big Boss of Urbanism then that's you putting that on him, you've lifted him onto the pedistal, because he's not here for that.
If anything what he's done is identified a "gap in the market" in urbanist TH-cam for someone to talk about things like How to talk in meetings, how to respond to consipiritorial rhetoric, how to not get burned out. But to this I would say, so go do it? Why not make that content yourself? Go for it!
To be clear, not saying you cant critisise issues if you're not able to make the content yourself.
I just think the thing he's looking for he's expecting to see in the wrong place and also he's clearly figured it out for himself so maybe there's an opportunity there
I think it is necessary to know who the people are in charge and where the funding streams come from so you can know best how to respond to the no's you will inevitably be met with, at least at first.
@1:02:06 it really bugs me he says "Scandanavian Paradise"; the Netherlands is 100% not Scandinavian. He made a video criticizing that people don't know certain things, yet doesn't know basic geography himself??
You're telling me that Americans know nothing about other countries?! I am shocked!
@@isoscelestriangleThe one video on the original commenter’s channel suggests they’re possibly from the US, so that might not check out as strongly.
Even then I often get annoyed when some of my countrymen don’t know geography because our country’s so big and isolated and encompasses almost all climates the Earth has to offer (especially when Alaska and Hawaii are included).
On one hand, I'm annoyed at the geography mistake. On the other hand, if he means "wealthy social democracies that left-of-center Americans simp over", The Netherlands might as well be Scandinavian.
I grew up working on the evil side of city planning.... My father was a developer. I have sat through more than enough planning, zoning, board, commission, council meetings to know... This shouldn't be a TH-cam topic. Every city is going to be different, every official is going to be different, every community is going to be different, and the people who are already influencers in the city are going to be different.
My father was fantastic at navigating this. I was okay when i worked in the industry early in my career. But for most people, just showing up and learning what's going on is enough to know to get started.
This SHOULD be a TH-cam topic. While every city is different, they aren't THAT different. The same ideas, techniques, and standards can be adapted and applied to advocacy in most cities. When something good is proposed to a board or commission, a community is essential for voicing support.
Dude every city still follows the federal design handbook.
@@ross4 They aren't similar enough to justify time on a popular urbanist channel. They are all different enough that lay people are better off just figuring out their specific local situation, rather than watching generic videos on the subject. The only people who would benefit from "mostly similar" ideas are planning professionals or advocacy groups that operate across a wide area, but those groups already have that knowledge internally, so there's not really a market for such videos.
@CityNerd how about doing an episode on walkable cities that are or are near dark sky sites (e.g. Flagstaff or Fountain Hills)? I think it would be an interesting (spreadsheet heavy) list about a topic not talked much, plus you'd get to talk about cities other than Pittsburgh (probably?)
yes, this and old growth forests =)
seconding this. AZ has some great dark sky muni areas.
Pittsburgh's a "short" 3 hour drive from the Cherry Springs State Park dark site and should totally also make that list! /s
Yes!
I'll put a vote in for Laramie Wyoming. Only 30k people so definitely walkable and almost no other people outside town for 40 or 50 miles, so, yeah, dark sky. In our neighborhood we could make out the milky way almost every night, maybe not possible right in the center of town. Then, you've got tons of grassland and mountains all around so plenty of places to go to get serious dark. The air is dry and very little pollution and Laramie is at 7200 feet (2200 meters), really good conditions! Head on up to The Snowy Range, Libby Flats Observation Area is at 10k feet, so even clearer. Of course you do have to drive to get to the Snowies. Laramie could put in more bike lanes and get better at actually clearing the snow out of them, instead of using what bike lanes there are as a place to dump snow.
Saul Alinski’s Rules for Radicals was a guide for sixties political organizers. Maybe this guy should write the book on organizing for better cities.
I've watched the Nth video before your reaction and, I'll be honest, I think my biggest issue is he doesn't seem to understand that that middle stage he is complaining about is pretty... well not just pretty, it is super local. Alan Fisher goes into some of that middle stage and his videos that do don't tend to do well because they're only of interest to a small segment of his viewerbase that is local to the area he happens to be talking about. If you are building a viewership for youtube, and trying to reach the widest possible base, you kind of have to keep things on a broad brush.
Talking about city advocacy strategies in US cities is great, but it won't get European viewers for example. So it's trying to balance building a viewership and urban advocacy.
I feel like the Nth guy is about to learn first hand how hard it is to make engaging videos about the "middle step" that's actually specific to a given region (especially ones that achieve any reach) ... and why nobody's doing it.
He’s not wrong that these are important things to talk about. Rhetorically, the framing feels off. If there are things he wishes people would say more about and he has a channel, then he can make those videos he thinks are needed. But callouts are great for clicks and engagement, so he made the right choice for that!
I wish he did give more credit for the proactive work that is being shown on TH-cam. Your videos have covered the advising you give to real city planners across the country. Strong Towns has a whole network of active, local groups. I’m sure he knows this! The video’s so focused on their guerrilla crosswalks that he doesn’t acknowledge their wider impacts.
I also think that Oh The Urbanity basically deserves a pass on all these types of critiques. They are one of the few channels providing high quality content for a Canadian audience and their videos basically read like the speeches you should be giving at your local council meetings and public hearings. Due to teh housing crisis, most Canadians watching urbanist TH-cam are already well aware of the civic engagement/political problem, but having ready to go rebuttals to common NIMBY or anti-bike talking points is extremely useful as an advocacy tool in itself. The battle is for hearts and minds and it's more about long term votes than any particular council meeting. They also regularly call out local politicians who are making bad arguments against urbanism in the Ottawa/Montreal area.
At a certain point, these broad critiques feel like they come from people who didn't actually watch the videos they are critiqueing.
@@rileynicholson2322 yes! I’m in south Florida and Ray’s visit to Miami was on my mind with my comment. OTU just made an excellent companion Miami video. Between the two of them, we’ve got a concrete and well-supported argument for exactly what Miami is doing right and what is still not working.
I don't know if you will read the comments on this livestream, but I want to give my thoughts as someone who became a Planner after being "orange pilled", as I guess we're calling it now. As a background, I was a transportation engineer that became disillusioned with the field, and the disconnect between research into transportation, and what we were taught/made to implement (cars are water, just one more lane bro, let's use this ITE table with two data points to plan parking for our entire city). There are a few things I wish I knew before making the transition, and that I feel that I might have gotten the wrong idea about from the TH-cam space (although I fully admit much of it was the fault of my own idealism):
a) The role of a planner is extremely limited with what you will actually be able to do. Once you're a planner you aren't suddenly going to be able to change your city. There is a ton of momentum behind city policy, you might be able to nudge it in the right direction but you'll never be able to steer.
b) Politics is far more important to positive planning outcomes than actual planning staff (imo) You can have the best and most progressive staff on the planet, but it doesn't matter if you don't have the political support. Politicians can also direct staff to do things that they dont support and go against best practices. I strongly agree with the original video on this point. The importance of politics/engagement might be something we can figure out on our own as you point out, but I think it's easy for someone who hasn't yet become involved to not realise just how important the engagement/political piece is. The lack of attention does make it easy to assume it's a equally small peice of the pie.
c)Sometimes you can enact change from wherever you want in life. I thought I needed to become a planner to enact change. Now, I enjoy my job, but arguably I could have had much more of an impact staying in the transportation profession. Transportation engineers have a lot more power in most places, and being able to slowly influence that field from the inside would be far more impactful than being one of 100 planners that already agree with me. This ties back to the lack of information/emphasis in the sphere on what power planners actually have (and again is still largely my own fault for not researching enough probably, but most resources I found were vague on what planners actually do).
Just some of my thoughts on the steam. Great vids, keep up the great work!!
Yes, his is a great thumbnail because it does encapsulate a mild frustration overall for "enthusiasts." It doesn’t take very long to understand why urbanism = good. We watch urbanism videos because we know our suburban lives are not fulfilled due to the structure, so the videos are a constant feed to remind us of what could be better. That's both good and bad.
I did watch the ST video he references … what struck me about that example is that ST did in fact interview officials in a different video he didn’t mention … oh well.
I think he makes valid points, but I also think that a lot of cities larger than Colorado Springs have made some really good transit changes over the last few years. It doesn’t take generations to build new transit lol. Living in a city/town where these changes aren’t happening, doesn’t negate all of the other transit projects that have popped up in other cities over the last few years… in the last 5 years i have seen more bike lanes, better bus routes, new rail/light rail projects in my city. In my experience, I have seen more progress in a relatively short amount of time, and ofc it’s not the perfect urbanist dream utopia, but I think those improvements should still be recognized. Maybe instead the question should be why aren’t those changes being made across cities/states…
Just because folks are educated doesn't mean they know how to advocate or organize effectively. The whole "they can just figure it out, they're smart!" argument doesn't make sense. If it were true, then why would they need to be educated on urbanism at all? They would just figure it out.
I have never given one thought to the background music in your videos, so I guess you nailed it with “subconscious” music 😂
Thank you SO much for reacting to this. I really wanted to hear your response.
I would argue that there's value in encouraging people to move to a city that already won the urbanism battles. If people actually do it, then it shows that urbanism sells and is a value multiplier for the cities that adopt it. Losing real people and money is the only way to truly disempower the laggard nimbyists, and moving / voting with your feet is way easier than fighting those entrenched interests where they are most powerful. Arguably, it's a trend that has already been happening for decades in the US.
It's ESPECIALLY effective if it's not moving to Amsterdam, but moving to nearby cities where your collective vote allows them to continue to make rapid progress. Imagine if all the urbanists in your state moved to one city and suddenly everyone could see and experience those results.
Related note: If you live in Ontario, Toronto could use your voice. Lol
Thats not how this works at all. If you have the wealth and privilege and lack of community investment to up and move somewhere “better,” you’re leaving behind all the people who can’t leave or care too much about their city to want to leave. That’s what happened in San Francisco: all the wealthy white collar transplant workers moved away from the problems, which only exacerbated them as the city’s main source of tax funding and support industry jobs disappeared overnight.
And if you concentrate all the urbanists and their wealth in one city that already has the resources to be an urbanist oasis, that just compounds the problem.
@@k80_Exactly. These comments have basically been describing how Republicans think schools work.
i will note that i’m not finished watching the stream yet so if this gets addressed later then okay. i did watch the full nth video though and i do think there is a gap when it comes to the urbanist youtubers talking about where they actually live and how they’re involved. there is lots of room to make content about projects happening on a local scale, how you’re involved in helping with it, and encouraging others to get involved in their own community. as we have all noted, urbanist youtube is the gateway to learning about what’s wrong with where you are and showing how it could be better by looking at places where they’ve already done it. but not many are showing how to get it done and seeing others do things on youtube is a really really big inspiration and motivator for others. and @ mr city nerd you even said you didn’t think that would make for good content but you have experience and could give some sort of general advice in a regular video. even just appending your normal videos with a little reminder to get involved locally and saying there’s links in the description to help you could do so much. i think after watching this video you have a perfect opportunity to piggyback off the video you’re reacting to and say okay here’s an overview of how you can get involved, this is what i’m involved in currently, this is what i’ve helped with in the past and how it got done. youtube is the perfect place to put this stuff because it can serve as inspiration for others even if you’re just talking about your local issues. lots of people are detached from their local govt and don’t watch or read local news. they have no idea what’s going on and just giving them the push to get involved could do a lot. also before anyone comments smth saying road guy rob does some aspect of this- yes and i think he’s an exception. okay good talk 👍
Idk this all just feels so gatekeepy.
Maybe I don't actually have the time or energy to get involved? Is that so bad? What if torturing myself with urbanist videos is my sick idea of entertainment?
I think we all have time and energy to do something, even if it's a small contribution
If you don't want to get involved in any capacity, big or small, then you don't get to complain when your city makes bad urban planning choices
The positive flip side of low civic engagement is that it doesn’t necessarily take a massive group of dedicated individuals to flip the tide at the local level.
Double-edged sword.
You may best the NIMBYs at one council meeting or election but they’ll be back, *and in greater numbers.*
I feel like there's a nuance being missed here, in that big changes need to have people engaged at many levels in order to happen. Yes we need people to show up to city council meetings, but if people have families and don't have the time or energy to do that, learning about urbanism and voting for it still helps! It's not a zero sum game. Honestly I feel a lot of holier-than-thou energy from this. There are definitely ways to encourage activism without being condescending about it.
One great thing about doing top 10s or showing Amsterdam is to highlight what cities have done to improve their towns... some people might not even realize how their city could be more usable. Before I started watching these videos I had a sense that some parts of my town were better than others, but couldn't quite put my finger on it, and watching urbanist videos has put words to my feelings and helped me better understand the issues and the history. But, he is also absolutely correct in saying nothing will change by merely watching videos or a show on tv or reading a book. People need to vote, people need to show up at city planning meetings, people need to email their elected officials and people need to run for office to effect real change. So, learn from urbanist shows, get inspired, then hit the pavement to put that knowledge into action and make your town better. Don't let the NIMBYs win!
I appreciate you for pointing out that it's valid to care more for some aspects of city life and pursue them with more vigour than other aspects. Our cities would all be better if more people engaged in their city planning procedures.
Following up on my other comment. I think the key question here is about how to get more people from interested to engaged, and the answer (or point of the video) is that this could be done by getting TH-camrs that generate interest in the topic to spend more time helping people getting engaged.
I agree with your take that if you want to get engaged you can just do it by yourself. You don't need hand holding. But the point is that it is very hard, or at least perceived to be hard to get engaged. If more TH-camrs, or people of influence, explained how to get engaged, say by spending 1 video a year on the topic, then the cost of getting engaged would be lower and the impact of the channels would be much much higher.
On the top of my head (no knowledge on the topic) topics could be: (i) how to get an education/degree in city planning, (ii) how to attend a local meeting and not get bored by it, (iii) how to run for city office and which positions actually make a difference, (iv) local groups that you should know about if you want to get engaged, etc...
I think it’s a testament to Urbanist TH-cam’s newly found relevance that we’ve now had not 1, but 2 rounds of internal “discourse” 😅
17:37 I think the big difference is where the academic meets the political, urban design and highways authority (who are not urban planners) side. It's a complex Web with it's own language and individual challenges.
My question; does he have more than one shirt? If so, is that blue plaid thingy for special occasions? It the a Colorado Springs tuxedo?
Wait, you put background music in your videos? I've literally never noticed, so I guess that means it's the perfect volume, lol
Music that adds but never distracts.
@@tristanridley1601adds in such a way you never notice it…
_…but your brain does._
Concerning whether people are smart enough to figure out the next steps themselves, I’m sure they could (some obviously do) but the first steps can be frustrating and pretty boring, so anything that can help people over the initial hump is worth considering.
Concerning how much you need to know, I agree most people don’t need to know everything, but what can be super important is to know where the money to do stuff does come from or could come from. That can be surprising and could have a major effect on what’s you do and how successful you will be.
I sometimes have wet dreams about if Cincinnati actually got to build its subways
There’s still some tunnels.
Shouldn’t be too late.
Other things to dream about:
If an underground subway to Staten Island was actually built (plans existed from the 1920s)
If the PRR had electrified to Pittsburgh (they were going to if not for having to continue to pay the dividend through the Depression)
If GDOT here had actually followed through on its passenger rail plans that look old enough that a Democratic governor could have made them.
I like your channel because it's interesting and entertaining, and sometimes I learn something.
I think you underestimate how much skill there is in engaging effectively. I was involved in bike advocacy in the San Francisco Bay area in the early 1990s, and we spent years putting a lot of energy into doing things ineffectively, for example asking BART staff for better bike accommodations, and getting nowhere. Then we all attended a weekend training on effective advocacy, and learned better strategies, like talking to the BART board instead of the staff. The board immediately saw the value in our suggestions and when they said the same thing to the staff that we've been saying for years, the improvements were rapid.
It might not be your channel's thing, but a how-to on civic engagement and effective advocacy would be great.
I like the suggestions in comments of using the platform to boost the visibility of local groups doing the work across the country. I see some of that but more is always good!
Maybe just at the end of the videos asking like “if you know a group active in a city I mentioned, leave it in comments and I’ll highlight them in the next video” or something? Idk
There's a long story of all the trials advocates go through in getting cities to implement protected bike lanes, lots of info out there for what people should do, and then a city could vote in some conservative mayor that rips the protected bike lanes up over night.
Conversely, you could elect Anne Hidalgo...
I watched the original video and then this follow-up reaction video. Your usual dry humor is refreshing, Ray, especially the random "Whatever!" comments! The overarching premise, which you conveyed correctly, is that activism/advocacy takes on MANY FORMS--it's not just showing up to a bunch of stuffy city/town hall meetings and listening to a bunch of Boomers/Gen-Xers drone on and on and on for what may be 15 minutes of what you actually care about, such as putting in a new sidewalk or cycle-track. It's VOTING for Progressive elected officials in the first place. It's WRITING IN and/or CALLING IN to elected officials. It's coffee shop sessions and Touch-a-Truck events where you get to speak intimately with elected officials and planners/engineers. This guy's whole schtick is getting his urban planning accolades (congrats!) and showing up to meetings as his form of civic engagement--but again, there are many forms of civic engagement.
I'm in Japan, and stumbled in just now. What's a time zone?
時間帯
@@AMPProf !! 余計なお世話😉
I'm glad to see you at least contemplating a lot of what he's saying, but I wanted to comment on what I think Nth is trying to say about the importance of understanding other issues your town or city or whatever is dealing with. I don't think you need to know all those things, but I think it's valuable to be familiar with as much of that as possible so you can work your own ideas into those to make them more contextually relevant to what your area is trying to work toward.
Yes, CityNerd and City Beautiful met! Lol, I totally asked if you got to meet in the comments on your SLO video. Great to hear that the two best city planning/urbanist YT channels met together! I would love to see a collab!
At then end of the day, folks watch a particular channel because they like the way the presenter presents the information.
The first step is educating people, which is what you’re doing. It’s like the New Jersey city that “temporarily” put in roundabouts, and let the public get used to them and when they took them out, the public demanded them back. We still have people rollcoaling bicyclists.
I definitely understand the critiques of NJB, but I personally appreciate the examples of how things are in other countries. Because why can't we look at small examples of things being better and try to learn from them? If we don't like what we have currently, let's find other ideas from other places that we haven't tried before. Since what we've got doesn't always work.
I'm so glad I watched this video with you (actually with y'all, 'cause I had chat replay up) instead of on it's own. I'd be yelling at the screen too much. Yes, more specific/technical info needs to exist. No, it's not the responsibility of the current batch of urbanism youtubers. If someone wants to make more technical/specific videos I'd probably watch that, just to get to see the different ways people do things. ...Idea (for someone who's inclined to be on video, i.e. not me): compare/contrast the different ways that various local government functions, um, function. Including some of the places that levers might be found, depending on the organization. In the US, we haven't had good pre-college Social Studies/PolySci education for a while, so I think that there's an audience for people who are interested in the workings of government but have no idea where to start.
I'm legitimately surprised it was worth your time to react to this video, but it ended up being super insightful. Thanks a lot.
You make a really good point about how these videos are important for teenagers and emerging adults. Even if they don't do anything with information about proper urban planning now, we have a future voter base who is more inclined to help these issues positively.
“I don’t know” and “whatever” seem to be your favorite words. I still like your channel.
I've perused my city and county government websites and found them overwhelming. Some kind of overview would be helpful. A lot of what it takes to change urban fabric is local but there should be a good amount of information that is universal and that we can all make use of.
I would define a generation is 20 years. So 40 years to completely change the whole of a city seems fair change is gradual and takes time.
Wanted to let you know that this video and your commentary inspired me to speak at a public hearing in NY in favor of congestion pricing. Contrary to The Nth Review, there were plenty of young urbanists at the hearing speaking in support of the plan.
Urbanist youtube has led me to join a local YIMBY group, sell my car, submit testimony for bills, and begin attending neighborhood board meetings. Never did this prior to my urbanism obsession. One great way I have connected with people is by finding local organizations on social media (mainly instagram) that focus on either YIMBY, bike advocacy, ped access, sustainable transportation, etc. Basically as soon as I found one org that resonated with me, I could find other groups because these kinds of organizations are constantly collaborating with each other. They post often about events and bills which helps me get involved. There are so many great local groups out there that are networking with each other like crazy.