Best video anywhere about installing the mounts- so many didnt even mention which way up they go and your did. fantastic and thank you sop much. Brilliant tutorial.
I had silicon mounts on an Ender 3 for about 8 months and I had not problems at all but then my BL Touch mesh was not working I tried everything before I realised the gantry on the right hand side had dropped and changed the level above the BL Touch's tolerance, once that was addressed I had no further issues and the silicon mounts have been on for a total of 23 months now and never need adjusting as they hold perfect tension. I would advise any viewers that are having levelling issues to check the level of their gantry to the frame and not to the bed, there are many videos showing how to level the gantry correctly on YT This is a great video, showing the actual data for each spring is extremely informative.
@@armani007E55 You use them the same as springs, but you apply a little less tension to start with and then manual level as normal Sorry I did not reply earlier but I did not get a notification, luckily I was showing my friend this video to explain the data
@@armani007E55 You level them once. In the 6 months since I have had silicone spacers, I have not needed to relevel the bed a single time. Not even once. And I print at least 1 print a day. The gantry has needed adjustment, but that is done by turning the eccentric nut to take up the slack.
As always, thank you for taking a scientific approach to your investigations. Always helpful. I've found the yellow springs to last for years. Once set, and using BLtouch, I never have to adjust them. But if I had to do it over again and change out the factory springs, I would go with the silicon mounts.
I replaced the stock springs with the yellow springs after printing over 100 hours, hoping the leveling issues would disappear (adjusting before every print, sometimes taking up to 30 minutes!). Reduced but still had to re-level after every 3 or 4 prints (verses after each one). The amount was less but still needed to be done. Then I saw a video about putting a lock nut (with nylon inner "seal") on the screws to prevent them from turning when turning the large adjustment wheels. What?!? I did experiment and found the screws (at least mine) did spin a bit. I installed the locknuts and at the same time replaced the yellow springs with silicone spacers (mine are black, don't know if there is a color code for compression resistance). I appreciate your video as it logically and empirically showed what I suspected to be true - thank you for all the time spent reassembling your printer so I didn't have to do it again! What a pain... The Ender 3V2 has held "level" (stayed trammed?) for a month without needing adjusting (being paranoid I was checking it every day that I started a print but didn't touch the leveling knobs. Prints were ok but I like to tinker so I added a BL touch, mainly for my sons so they wouldn't need to mess with the adjustments. So far I am happy with the modifications. Next one will be adding Octoprint! Or upgrading to the Jyers firmware. Or a new controller board... {sigh} As long as it is printing well, I don't really have an excuse that satisfies my wife so this configuration will have to remain until after Christmas {grin}.
When you added the touch, am I right in assuming you still have to adjust the z offset? From what I can understand, you add the silicone spacers, tighten down to virtually tightest it will go, manual level and then do a z offset to compensate form the probe? (I've got the CR touch installed and assuming it's the same principle)
The problem with the original springs is that they can move sideways while being compressed. When adding your second weight this was clearly visible for the original springs. This sideways motion allows for extra inaccuracy and additional modes of vibration.
I have been using the silicone for about a year now and find a much more stable bed after many prints, I also installed a small m4 nuts on the screws on the bottom of the bed before installing the silicone to keep the screws from spinning loose, That way the only moving part is the adjustment wheel on the bottom. I did many test on both of my ender 3's and the nuts do make a big difference.
@@mykoluis3660M4, coarse thread (0.7 mm pitch). Be careful about the heater circuit traces. I put a nylon washer between the bed and each of the locking nuts I installed.
have just ordered silcone mounts as my 3v2 has issue with adhesion despite having the bed leveled and using a cr touch module. your video has been a great source of info
I switched to the silicone things because they are very stiff and because their rubbery surface ensures that there can’t be any bed wobble during longer prints, since that was a issue I experienced with the original springs.
at 14:26 -- the pockets in the silicone also allow for a nut to lock the countersunk bolt to the bed. If the friction of the countersink cone is less than the friction of the threads on the M4, then the head and bolt will spin rather than the leveling knob moving up or down the both..
I had issues with having to constantly relevel (presumably due to weak springs) and my solution was to print plastic spacers (about 1.5mm high) to compress the weak springs at the ideal height. Worked so far
Fully coil binding the bed springs and move the endstop switch to match (may need a new endstop mount) then level the bed, will lower the centre of gravity for the build plate and lower ringing/ghosting. Having the bed levelled at the default height allows way too much bed movement.
I found if I do that in my Aquilla X2 or ender3 what happens is the bed will crash into the Y stepper motor. I would really like to do it that way but have to make sure the bottom of the plate clears at least a couple mm before I set the stop switch.
Silicone "springs" are also good because they have a very rough surface and high viscosity - this prevents them from scrolling from vibrations (anti-slip mats are made of silicone for a reason)
Excellent video. I’m a 48 year old 3d printer rookie. I’m on my 4-5th month and just got my 3rd printer. Started with Ender 3 to Ender 3 S1 to K1C. Though a printing rookie, I’m not without mechanical experience. What I’ve come to feel is that the bed springs have almost nothing to do with bed leveling and more importantly are under the build surface to protect the tool head from excessive Z offset. There are no provisions in the control boards(that I’ve seen) to detect a current spike from a motor to trip an anti overload switch. Cheaper protection suspend the build surface on a cushion. It’s like those Rings the “Pro” “Wrestlers” use to get all sweaty with one another. When they land on someone having just left the top rope, if the mat was statically mounted there would be a lot of fatalities.
A simple solution is to use a wing nut below each levelling knob, just make sure you dont disturb the knob when you tighten it up to it, 2 nuts locked against each other are tight and not easily moved ask any mechanic
I have them (Fysetc version both black and orange)installed on my e3 pro's since Aug 2019. I love these silicone spacers and I tell everyone who will listen. No complaints at all. @300hrs of PETG at 90c and no degredation that I can tell.
Same. I installed a set of Fysetc silicone mounts in Jan of 2020 and not had any problems at all with them. My octoprint leveling graph looks the same now as it did when I installed them.
Last night I bought slicone mounts for experimenting and now youtube offer me this video, hope this will help me my z wobble on corexy machine with dual z motor edit: instantly subbed after results good job!
Hey there ! Nice explaining video !!! I believe though that the best trick is to use safety nuts because the safety nuts has some nylon lock mechanism and it is very very hard to turn the nut without any tool.
Yes, great idea. I noticed that they don't lock soo good after I use them for second time, but better than nothing. Woth to try for neat permanent leveling
To answer your question, after more than a year after switching to silicone mounts, I didn't had any issues. I don't know if they become more stiff or if they deformed because I simply installed them and never touched them since. I realized that I didn't even leveled my bed after. Using Bl Touch and a glass bed. But to be honest I never needed to force anything while removing my prints, thanks to some magigoo.
Nice test, I've used the yellow ones on my bed before, but when I upgraded to a bigger bed I went with the silicone columns, albeit mine are the clear white ones. I did notice they're far stiffer than the yellow springs, but I mostly chose them because I thought they might have a better sideways stiffness based on them having a lot bigger surface area than the springs. They've been on the bed and printing for now... just a day, but let's see their durability on heat. One thing I would like to add, that you kinda saw on the tests, is that the tensile strength graph shown is valid mostly just for traction, albeit with steel the linear line should be similar, a compression graph would not show a rupture line for example, it just goes up and up and deforms more and more (since it won't ever snap, just become wider and shorter instead). A spring, if designed correctly, should never have permanent deformation under compression (which is the bed leveling springs), as it would, like you found out, bottom out way before the material itself has problems, and by then if you manage to make the material deform by compression then you're probably using some absurd alloy bolts and destroying everything in the way too. What can cause weird things when plotting a graph is if it starts crossing the coils, like would happen with the default Ender springs. The columns whoever might have permanent deformation problems, as they can't bottom out, but, as they're so much stiffer already then you're probably running into the same thing as bottoming out the metal springs and crushing them. The heat and long therm part tho is interesting, as polymers react way differently.
I posted above trying to find the correct springs. Not yet positive the yellow ones that everybody is pushing are all that great. The springs from China are terrible. The stock springs on my Ender 3 v2 look to be deformed already. The other thing I notice is metal washers on plate. If i get the God darned thing leveled and finally to printing I will find stl and print some high temp. g%&@* bloasted washers.
@@joelstolarski2244 I have 2 Ender 5+ printers and one of them I have been having real problems levelling it, the first machine came with the bad quality springs so I changed to the yellow ones, the second machine came with the yellow springs or so I thought, I stripped the bed down to find out why the damn thing would not level and I found one of the springs was snapped and they are not the same as the regular yellow springs the metal is much thinner and very very weak (probably Chineseum) so I fitted some spare springs I have and all is well although I have ordered some more sillicon ones for both machines as I have them on some Ender 3's and they are great
@@AndrewAHayes So far I'm pretty sure the yellow springs may have caused a very slight warp in the bed at bottom right quadrant of 3v2 bed. It will drive me nuts. Running Jeyers
@@joelstolarski2244 I think it is the bed clips that cause these drops on the corners, I have placed just one clip in the middle at front and back and it keeps the bed secure and stops the corner drops, give it a try it might fix your issue also Joel
I haven't experienced any issues with the silicone mounts, I already had the firmer yellow/orange springs on my printer and while I don't think I had issues with the bed due to the spring I wanted to get the silicone ones. I just wanted something with low thermal conductivity as to not cause the bed frame to work as a heatsink, the silicone mounts just made sense to me, I don't think the lack of elasticity is going to cause any issues.
I switched from silicone to stiffer springs because when squished they were interfering with the threads of a bolt making the bed not return to the same position when pushed down or up.
Thank you! @7:34, that spring flying seemed dangerous - it could put an eye out. I recommend you wear safety glasses for deformation testing (as well as other). I've only got one working eye, so it really concerned me to see that so close to your face, and moving so fast. Thank you for the information, and stay safe!
Very informative video! I'm using the stock springs for more than 1 year on my Ender 5 and thinking about replace them. Since I have BLTouch installed I'm now considering using the silicon.
@@Moonclaw196 Ho Joey, yes I did replace it just after I posted the previous comment. For my printer it worked very well. I found it's a bit difficult to make it level so I tried several rounds for the first manual leveling.
Thanks for a great comparison. The silicon posts are good for auto-leveling set ups while providing a very slight give to the bed in case the nozzle scrapes. As for manual levelling, I've never had problems with the "weak" stock springs. Tighten the wheels to fully compress all the springs. Adjust Z-stop to trigger on the highest point of the bed - move the around while turning the Z rod to find this. Perform your bed tramming routine by only loosening the wheels. This will ensure maximum spring compression while keeping the wheels tight.
@@hoffer_moment - It doesn't matter if the springs get deformed, it's not permanent, and they'll still provide an extension force. I've trammed my beds with fully compressed springs and they stay trammed until I swap in another type of print surface. Simple.
@@hoffer_moment - I didn't say fully squash the springs. There's a huge difference between that and fully compressing them - springs are designed to be fully compressed, as in no gap between the coils. In the end, people ought to use what works and what's simplest for them.
@@MyTechFun yes you need it there too. Bed is fixed but I had 0.6mm tolerance from corner to corner. Pinda will try to compensate but parts are still bend when not level. After silicone mod I made multicolor 3d printed signs with perfect first layer. Before this mod it was not possible.
I've been using the silicone spacers for about 4 months. They are fantastic. However I've seen others who have had issues with certain types of the silicone spacers that you get. Me personally I wouldn't go back to the spring.
Interesting. Sometimes your videos, while rigorous, don't draw many conclusions. However, in this one, I feel like you've definitely nailed down the fact that silicone mounts are better for auto bed-leveling systems, and strong yellow springs are better for printers utilizing the z-limit switch. This was your intuition, and you backed it up with some hard data. I feel much more informed, and if/when I buy a CR Touch or BL Touch I will consider adding silicone mounts as well. As for now, I'm using the yellow springs with a z-limit switch. Thanks!
Did just add plastic spacer under heat bed (for protections) and then a normal nut (to prevent screw to spin) and then the original spring and at the end printed new leveling wheels with lock-nuts. Has soon been 2 years since I leveled my bed. I don't use any BL Touch, print on normal glass (3mm) from local glazier.
it is not mainly about spring strength, its the compensation of the springs to the non ideal surface of heated bed and frame/table the 3d printer set on
Nice video, thanks. I have ordered the yellow springs and the BLtouch before seeing your video. I'm sure the glass on my Ender 3V2 is warped exactly like yours, concave with a hole in the center, which is the worse for leveling manually.
I upgraded my ender 3 S1 to the silicon standoff. After a few weeks they are great. I would level the bed every few days, eventually they have squashed enough where they are now stable. The springs would, under temperature controls, and vary throughout the print. I have my printer in an enclosure now so this my not be as significant
If you are just hobby printing wait until the bed cools to remove your print, once the bed cools the parts slide right off. If you're in a hurry you can spray some alcohol around the perimeter of the part to cool the bed faster and you can use the excess to clean the bed. Anything that keeps you from yanking on the bed will help reduce bed leveling. Lock nuts on the adjusting wheels will help too. If you have ABL or manual mesh you can replace the springs with a solid spacer. This can be tricky to level initially, you'll have to add and remove shims/washers to get the bed level to start, but once you get the bed level it generally doesn't move, any slight changes can be compensated by the ABL or checking your manual mesh occasionally and adjusting if necessary. Disclaimer: I have not personally tried the solid spacer method, I am currently using the upgraded yellow springs, but from what I've seen online people who have tried it like it. Most new printers that come from the factory with an ABL probe installed also come with solid spacers installed from the factory.
I have found this video now. I have used all three and I have actually found the yellow springs were the best on my Ender 5 (original model). I found the factory silver springs were way to weak, it would move too much. The silicon blocks, on the other hand, were too rigid and made it virtually impossible to level the bed as moving one corner even 0.1mm would upset all the other corners. The yellow springs are stable, don't move during prints, but flexible enough that leveling the bed is easy to complete. I print on the original Ender bed, PEI bed and glass and a BL Touch. I find the yellow springs best.
That is correct, you might move the bed out of alignment by moving it manually! I just let my print cool down, it releases no problem and with zero resistance every time!
Wouldn't metal spacers be better, assuming they are safe to use and don't cause other issues. The silicone being able to deform slightly defeats the pupose a little for me, as you can crank one screw too much in one corner maybe.There's still a slight element of feeling each side to make it consistent.
Hi Igor. I recently changed my springs for the silicone mounts. I am not a mechanical engineer, so forgive me if I am not able to back up my understanding of this system with proof or data. As I understand it, if the bed is level, then you don't actually need a BLTouch to level the bed. The BLTouch does nothing to level the bed. That's why you have to level it yourself before you can use an auto bed-levelling device. The BLTouch only compensates for bed surface irregularities by adjusting the height of the nozzle, and to function properly it relies on a mesh pattern it creates then stores either on the SD card or in the EEPROM. If the printer bed is level after installing the silicone mounts, it should remain relatively level as long as the mounts do not compress too much more. The BLTouch will then help compensate for the height differences between nozzle and bed, which is affected by the deformation of the build surface. Thanks for this video. I appreciate the scientific approach. It helps me to better understand 3D printers and how these work.
Yes, that's exactly how it works. BL touch is important if ved is warped. Or for those, who commonly change the build surface (several types of PEI sheets or simar)
Good video. Your graph shows that the factory springs compressed at a higher rate above 10.6kg load. That explains why I was having such a hard time adjusting the spring in the back left corner, because it has the extra 2mm base from the cable guide and would compress greater than the other springs. A small change in the knob would result in a bigger compression change. One thing to note, you tested the compression of the springs but did not show if they retained any deformity from the compression. A properly designed spring will not deform when compressed. If you had measured the compression of the springs after multiple and prolonged compressions, you would likely find that they retained the same compression force, although I am aware we are talking about Chinesium springs and they may have cut some corners on the design. I think the silicone ones are more stable and less susceptible to vibration and heat deformation than the metal springs. I just installed the silicone spacers today and printed a 3d-benchy. It came out a little smoother than with the original Ender 3 Pro springs.
One of the stock yellow (ish) springs on my Ender 5+ didn't just deform it broke! when I took them off I could see they were very different from the yellow springs I bought for my other printers, when I bent the spring metal it bent and then clean snapped and you can see micro holes in the metal when under my cellphone camera and zoomed in
What about orizontal dilatation of the heat plate? Springs permit the holes to move a bit, silicone bushings compress too much obliging the bed to dilatate in vertical creating a dome. So the nozzle become more closed to the bed in centre and distant in corners.
Do you have pictures of the ringing before and after each of the modification of springs? I would say that with the factory springs you should see a lot of ghosting/ringing and with the silicones they should be greatly reduced. A side by side photo would be cool.
One main point of stiffer springs is to keep the bed still. No movement from the mounts. Ofc if you print slow it is okay. But at high speed it has a purpose
@@girenloland I know the fundamentals. I work as senior mechanical engineer. Just to make the movie complete an end result of the mods should be shown. Otherwise you could do that and see no benefits. So what would be all your effort for? Wasted time?
You can also try the Mriscoc FW, it has more useful features and better support. I will try with silicones spacers... I don`t have ABL yet, but just for comparison. Nice video. Keep going!
Thank you for the info. I was wondering if there may be any heat transfer from the bed to the yellow springs that may decay their elasticity. If there is a teflon or carbon fiber washer to negate that but over time being compressed it will affect them. Good thing they are cheap for now.
You need 4 metal spacers, but if they are not flexible at all, it is hard to have the bed in flat and leveled (parallel with moving path of the nozzle). You need minimal elasticity to adjust this.
I can't tell you about the silicone mounts, but after a few weeks/months I even see deformation in my Prusa MK3S which is mounted pretty rigidly. It's not a lot, but it is definitely noticeable and without the bed leveling probe it would be quite problematic..
this is a great video i purchased a biqu microprobe and ever since i had it ive had issues with printing. i use the yellow springs. your video explains the problem better than anyone tried to help me and you mention if you have a z end stop then the yellow springs are best and i agree with you i used to always use a z end stop and i had virtually no problems with printing. any problems i had were elsewhere
Excellent video. I had replaced the original springs with the yellow ones on all 3 printers at one point. I bought 3 sets of the silicone spacers awhile back, but only installed them on the Ender-3. One issue I had when installing them was my bed wasn't trammed very well to the gantry so had to really tighten down the one side to get it close enough and then have the BL Touch do the rest. I haven't had to re-level even after months. But that goes for the other 2 printers with the yellow springs as well, so I'm not sure how much of a difference the silicone spacers would really make in the long run. I'll probably still eventually install them on all 3 printers though since I have them. To take it a step further, what if the spacers were made out of steel and then had zero deformation? If your bed and gantry are trammed really well, then could see this working, but if your printer is like mine then it would be too far out of "level" for the BL Touch to compensate so I think having some play as you get with the yellow springs is probably the way to go.
Solid spacers are available, but the problem is unless they're manufactured right and very precisely, your bed is going to end up out of tram and every print will have to be compensated for. I got some and I couldn't get the bed close enough to level for my satisfaction.
@@dalem04 Not sure why you were having such problems. Things like this are done in the metal fabrication business everyday all day. Hell you could have just used stainless steel washers and stack them until they were all identical heights. It's not rocket science. Also wondering where you bought your spacers. It has to be one of the easiest things to make.
If there is a BL touch, why can't we just put metal spacers in place and double lock nut the adjustment wheels when we get a manual level? That would permanently set the level and the software could compensate? Get rid of the spring function completely because it is unecessary?
Yes, a lot of printers which have factory installed BL Touch have fixed bed. If you can fix all 4 positions to be flat (in 1 plane), then yes. But it bay be hard, especially because of back left one. The plane position is important, to avoid warping of the plate.
I see the bottom line as:- if you treat your printer bed like a workbench, buy stiffer springs and/or a bed levelling sensor. Comments suggest some ringing is more likely with more compliant springs, maybe just the frequency of ringing but my E3 is slow so if I see ringing I might consider stiffer springs.
Problem with the silicone mounts, they don’t behave precise when adjusting. You can turn turn back nothing changes turn another time, suddenly it’s too much.
Running Klipper with resonance compensation means I don't care all that much about vibration dampening. But the silicone mounts have another killer advantage - a tiny bit of extra usable Z height. Unless you're cranking the strong springs way, way down, the silicone mounts are shorter.
Try replace the springs with Hexagonal Copper Pillars. You virtually don't need manual leveling given mesh bed leveling. If you, for whatever reasons, really want to do manual leveling with springs, you need a far more rigid frame than just a plate of 1mm steel.
@@ljohnso16 I simply replaced the 4 springs with 4 10mm hex copper pillars. Nothing special about the 10mm though, I just happen to have four 10mm pillars around.
2:28 This method will save you from having to use BL Touch or silicone springs. This is the part people keep ruining is trying to pry and jack hammer the print off the build plate whilst it's on the printer...
I love how your graph shows how much dampening affect the silicone has compared to the springs. However, running klipper with input shaping, the resonances are going to much more offset from the bed to the nozzle than with springs, where the linear reliable movement creates desirable oscillations in my opinion for klipper specifically. What's your opinion on that?
I just got a Cr6-SE and I am having some bed levling issues. I am wondering if using these silicon springs under the 11 bed screws might help tram the bed in better. The printer is comping the errors but I am having a hard time getting a good first layer on the entire build plate. Love the channel keep it up!
CR6-SE? That's printer with Auto bed leveling I think. Leveling should not be the problem. You want to check the Z-offset, is it set correctly (distance between nozzle and bed during 3D printing, is it too far or too close)
Did you not have issues with the screws rotating in place when turning the knobs before? I had to install nylon lock nuts to the bottom of my bed so that the screws wouldn't rotate in place rather than having the knob tighten the spring...
If there is enough tension on the springs, then friction should hold the knobs in the place. That's why you need springs compressed at least several mm-s.
Hello, very interesting video. I am wondering if I place thread lock on the screws at wheel level, I will ensure the levelling doesn’t move, without needing to deal with the stiffness of the springs/columns ? Am I wrong ?
Nice testing! Your previous video about creep and different plastics makes me wonder about how this property might impact spring material. If you put all three springs under say... a 5 - 10kg load for a week, would the metal springs be more or less prone to permanent deformation than the silicone? Also under heat cycling that could be seen with bed mounting fixtures.
Hi Igor, great video. I just bought a CR-Touch so will get some silcone mounts. What version of Firmware are you using please. Please could you provide a link. I have an Ender 3 V2 with v4.2.2. board. No other mods other than the CR-Touch I want to install. Thanks for your help
Ive just got a set of 4 silicone mounts from Creality. 3 are the same size one of them is 1mm shorter than the rest... Wonderful quality control 😕 I shall order another set and see if I can make up a set that I can actually use.
My 2 cents worth on leveling an Anet8 Plus. I removed the glass top, took out the 4 bolts for the heatbed. I then bolted the Anet8 Plus on a piece of plywood. I put items under the plywood to level the 3D printer. I leveled the X gantry to the bed frame in both directions. This is where things get strange.....After doing the familiar exercise of moving the tip around the bed and homing Z axis a few times I noticed when homing the left Z motor makes a grind noise and lowers the left Z axis a bit. Disable the motors and twist the right Z axis to level it up again. I spent 5 days with this problem until I printed a new Z axis stop that mounts on the left side and then removed the left and right spiral rods ,re-set the set screws into the rods and leveled them. I replaced the springs with rubber ones. After many times homing the Z axis the level of the gantry has stayed level. I printed a test for checking the levelness...perfect, time will tell. But checking the gantry being level on all prints will be a priority for me.
Hey My Tech Fun, awesome video. This was really interesting. So, to what percentage or mm length would you compress the yellow springs to before you start calibrating each corner? I compressed them on all four corners to 15mm (25% compression) before the calibration. After the calibration they are compressed to length at around 13mm. Do you think this makes sense according to your charts?
@@MyTechFun Hey thx for the quick response :-) So 60% would be a good start setup to start leveling or would it be the max? Meaning is it the range the range for the spring to function without permanent deformation?
The corner with the harness stays up on my tray. Even if I squeeze it all the way down, it stays up. Should I try to bend the metal with my hand or pull the Z-stop up? Thanks for the pei advice I'll get the silicon and pei asap
Excellent demonstration of the three types. I had swapped out the factory springs for the stiffer yellow ones. I recently added a CR Touch to my Ender 3-V2 and definitely see the value in adding the silicon spacers. When you put the silicon spacers on, why did you switch back to the factory adjustment wheels?
I went back to springs after printing with ASA. Seems like it's to hot for the silicone. Looses it's springiness and compress. (100-110 Celsius) So when you go back to 50-60 degrees the bed is not level anymore. I use mesh leveling, not bltouch.
Mount a fan to the bottom of your printer and have a switch to turn on the fan. You can simply pull the 24v to a 24v fan and add a switch there. On Ender boards the hotend fan always spins... so yeah... all you need to do is to turn it on and your bed temp will fall really fast and then you hear a cracking and the print comes of itself :)
ive used them on a couple printers for over 2 years. i do not really notice any deformation now. i did after the first 3-4 months but it seems to have stabilized since. i am using black silicone mounts btw. i used some i had left over on and ender 5 pro and it seemed to be about the same after a few months they seemed to have deformed a bit then when re-leveled no more issues. i have not tried the orange ones. i thought of making my own molds using high temp silicone when and if these go bad. i may try that on the new printer im building
Best video anywhere about installing the mounts- so many didnt even mention which way up they go and your did. fantastic and thank you sop much. Brilliant tutorial.
I had silicon mounts on an Ender 3 for about 8 months and I had not problems at all but then my BL Touch mesh was not working I tried everything before I realised the gantry on the right hand side had dropped and changed the level above the BL Touch's tolerance, once that was addressed I had no further issues and the silicon mounts have been on for a total of 23 months now and never need adjusting as they hold perfect tension.
I would advise any viewers that are having levelling issues to check the level of their gantry to the frame and not to the bed, there are many videos showing how to level the gantry correctly on YT
This is a great video, showing the actual data for each spring is extremely informative.
question. Do you really tighten them and then level your bed or do you just tighten them a little then level?
@@armani007E55 You use them the same as springs, but you apply a little less tension to start with and then manual level as normal
Sorry I did not reply earlier but I did not get a notification, luckily I was showing my friend this video to explain the data
@Andrew Hayes no worries. Never to late! Tks mate!🤙
Out of interest, how did you fix the drooping on the right side of your gantry ?
@@armani007E55 You level them once. In the 6 months since I have had silicone spacers, I have not needed to relevel the bed a single time. Not even once. And I print at least 1 print a day. The gantry has needed adjustment, but that is done by turning the eccentric nut to take up the slack.
Use nuts/locknuts on the screws under the bed, locks them, so, no side play/wobble. That's what the counterbore/recess is for.
This video is great. I appreciate the theory, engineering perspective, observations, and testing.
Very helpful!
As always, thank you for taking a scientific approach to your investigations. Always helpful. I've found the yellow springs to last for years. Once set, and using BLtouch, I never have to adjust them. But if I had to do it over again and change out the factory springs, I would go with the silicon mounts.
I replaced the stock springs with the yellow springs after printing over 100 hours, hoping the leveling issues would disappear (adjusting before every print, sometimes taking up to 30 minutes!). Reduced but still had to re-level after every 3 or 4 prints (verses after each one). The amount was less but still needed to be done. Then I saw a video about putting a lock nut (with nylon inner "seal") on the screws to prevent them from turning when turning the large adjustment wheels. What?!? I did experiment and found the screws (at least mine) did spin a bit. I installed the locknuts and at the same time replaced the yellow springs with silicone spacers (mine are black, don't know if there is a color code for compression resistance). I appreciate your video as it logically and empirically showed what I suspected to be true - thank you for all the time spent reassembling your printer so I didn't have to do it again! What a pain...
The Ender 3V2 has held "level" (stayed trammed?) for a month without needing adjusting (being paranoid I was checking it every day that I started a print but didn't touch the leveling knobs. Prints were ok but I like to tinker so I added a BL touch, mainly for my sons so they wouldn't need to mess with the adjustments. So far I am happy with the modifications. Next one will be adding Octoprint! Or upgrading to the Jyers firmware. Or a new controller board... {sigh} As long as it is printing well, I don't really have an excuse that satisfies my wife so this configuration will have to remain until after Christmas {grin}.
When you added the touch, am I right in assuming you still have to adjust the z offset?
From what I can understand, you add the silicone spacers, tighten down to virtually tightest it will go, manual level and then do a z offset to compensate form the probe? (I've got the CR touch installed and assuming it's the same principle)
The problem with the original springs is that they can move sideways while being compressed. When adding your second weight this was clearly visible for the original springs. This sideways motion allows for extra inaccuracy and additional modes of vibration.
I have been using the silicone for about a year now and find a much more stable bed after many prints, I also installed a small m4 nuts on the screws on the bottom of the bed before installing the silicone to keep the screws from spinning loose, That way the only moving part is the adjustment wheel on the bottom. I did many test on both of my ender 3's and the nuts do make a big difference.
What size nut?
@@mykoluis3660M4, coarse thread (0.7 mm pitch). Be careful about the heater circuit traces. I put a nylon washer between the bed and each of the locking nuts I installed.
have just ordered silcone mounts as my 3v2 has issue with adhesion despite having the bed leveled and using a cr touch module. your video has been a great source of info
I switched to the silicone things because they are very stiff and because their rubbery surface ensures that there can’t be any bed wobble during longer prints, since that was a issue I experienced with the original springs.
at 14:26 -- the pockets in the silicone also allow for a nut to lock the countersunk bolt to the bed. If the friction of the countersink cone is less than the friction of the threads on the M4, then the head and bolt will spin rather than the leveling knob moving up or down the both..
I had issues with having to constantly relevel (presumably due to weak springs) and my solution was to print plastic spacers (about 1.5mm high) to compress the weak springs at the ideal height. Worked so far
I always use washers of the appropriate size between the leveling screws and the bed mount. Stack as needed for extra compression.
i just moved my z stopper lol
@@OneShot-kt8hd moving z stoper doesn't do anything for bed leveling
Yeah I worked out it needs re-levelling if you have to be a bit aggressive taking off the last print
Do you have stl?
Fully coil binding the bed springs and move the endstop switch to match (may need a new endstop mount) then level the bed, will lower the centre of gravity for the build plate and lower ringing/ghosting. Having the bed levelled at the default height allows way too much bed movement.
Nice way of thinking! I will do that today
I found if I do that in my Aquilla X2 or ender3 what happens is the bed will crash into the Y stepper motor. I would really like to do it that way but have to make sure the bottom of the plate clears at least a couple mm before I set the stop switch.
Thank you, you completely and concisely answered my questions.
Thank you, Igor! I have recently switched to auto BL and this will help me.
Silicone "springs" are also good because they have a very rough surface and high viscosity - this prevents them from scrolling from vibrations (anti-slip mats are made of silicone for a reason)
Excellent video. I’m a 48 year old 3d printer rookie. I’m on my 4-5th month and just got my 3rd printer. Started with Ender 3 to Ender 3 S1 to K1C. Though a printing rookie, I’m not without mechanical experience.
What I’ve come to feel is that the bed springs have almost nothing to do with bed leveling and more importantly are under the build surface to protect the tool head from excessive Z offset. There are no provisions in the control boards(that I’ve seen) to detect a current spike from a motor to trip an anti overload switch. Cheaper protection suspend the build surface on a cushion.
It’s like those Rings the “Pro” “Wrestlers” use to get all sweaty with one another. When they land on someone having just left the top rope, if the mat was statically mounted there would be a lot of fatalities.
A simple solution is to use a wing nut below each levelling knob, just make sure you dont disturb the knob when you tighten it up to it, 2 nuts locked against each other are tight and not easily moved ask any mechanic
I have them (Fysetc version both black and orange)installed on my e3 pro's since Aug 2019. I love these silicone spacers and I tell everyone who will listen. No complaints at all. @300hrs of PETG at 90c and no degredation that I can tell.
Same. I installed a set of Fysetc silicone mounts in Jan of 2020 and not had any problems at all with them. My octoprint leveling graph looks the same now as it did when I installed them.
Will it still perform the same if I pud in inside a heated enclosure?
Great walkthrough of the difference between springs and silicone springs
Thanks for sharing your experience with all of us 👍😀
This is a fantastic explanation. I was struggling with this until I watched this. Perfect. Thanks very much.
Thanks for another helpful video. I added some washers under the flat springs on my new refurbished Ender 5 Pro and that helped my leveling also.
Thanks for the video. I was on the fence about using yellow or silicon. Now I now and it will be silicon for both my printers
Last night I bought slicone mounts for experimenting and now youtube offer me this video, hope this will help me my z wobble on corexy machine with dual z motor
edit: instantly subbed after results good job!
Hey there ! Nice explaining video !!! I believe though that the best trick is to use safety nuts because the safety nuts has some nylon lock mechanism and it is very very hard to turn the nut without any tool.
Yes, great idea. I noticed that they don't lock soo good after I use them for second time, but better than nothing. Woth to try for neat permanent leveling
To answer your question, after more than a year after switching to silicone mounts, I didn't had any issues. I don't know if they become more stiff or if they deformed because I simply installed them and never touched them since. I realized that I didn't even leveled my bed after. Using Bl Touch and a glass bed. But to be honest I never needed to force anything while removing my prints, thanks to some magigoo.
Nice test, I've used the yellow ones on my bed before, but when I upgraded to a bigger bed I went with the silicone columns, albeit mine are the clear white ones. I did notice they're far stiffer than the yellow springs, but I mostly chose them because I thought they might have a better sideways stiffness based on them having a lot bigger surface area than the springs. They've been on the bed and printing for now... just a day, but let's see their durability on heat.
One thing I would like to add, that you kinda saw on the tests, is that the tensile strength graph shown is valid mostly just for traction, albeit with steel the linear line should be similar, a compression graph would not show a rupture line for example, it just goes up and up and deforms more and more (since it won't ever snap, just become wider and shorter instead). A spring, if designed correctly, should never have permanent deformation under compression (which is the bed leveling springs), as it would, like you found out, bottom out way before the material itself has problems, and by then if you manage to make the material deform by compression then you're probably using some absurd alloy bolts and destroying everything in the way too. What can cause weird things when plotting a graph is if it starts crossing the coils, like would happen with the default Ender springs. The columns whoever might have permanent deformation problems, as they can't bottom out, but, as they're so much stiffer already then you're probably running into the same thing as bottoming out the metal springs and crushing them. The heat and long therm part tho is interesting, as polymers react way differently.
I posted above trying to find the correct springs. Not yet positive the yellow ones that everybody is pushing are all that great. The springs from China are terrible. The stock springs on my Ender 3 v2 look to be deformed already. The other thing I notice is metal washers on plate. If i get the God darned thing leveled and finally to printing I will find stl and print some high temp. g%&@* bloasted washers.
@@joelstolarski2244 I have 2 Ender 5+ printers and one of them I have been having real problems levelling it, the first machine came with the bad quality springs so I changed to the yellow ones, the second machine came with the yellow springs or so I thought, I stripped the bed down to find out why the damn thing would not level and I found one of the springs was snapped and they are not the same as the regular yellow springs the metal is much thinner and very very weak (probably Chineseum) so I fitted some spare springs I have and all is well although I have ordered some more sillicon ones for both machines as I have them on some Ender 3's and they are great
@@AndrewAHayes So far I'm pretty sure the yellow springs may have caused a very slight warp in the bed at bottom right quadrant of 3v2 bed. It will drive me nuts. Running Jeyers
@@joelstolarski2244 I think it is the bed clips that cause these drops on the corners, I have placed just one clip in the middle at front and back and it keeps the bed secure and stops the corner drops, give it a try it might fix your issue also Joel
I haven't experienced any issues with the silicone mounts, I already had the firmer yellow/orange springs on my printer and while I don't think I had issues with the bed due to the spring I wanted to get the silicone ones. I just wanted something with low thermal conductivity as to not cause the bed frame to work as a heatsink, the silicone mounts just made sense to me, I don't think the lack of elasticity is going to cause any issues.
Thank you I ordered silicone, and the yellow came with my metal extruder so I was just about to look into this
thank you so much ! I was debating this on a Discord server a few weeks ago, but had no arguments. Now i am ready !!😈
I switched from silicone to stiffer springs because when squished they were interfering with the threads of a bolt making the bed not return to the same position when pushed down or up.
Thank you! @7:34, that spring flying seemed dangerous - it could put an eye out. I recommend you wear safety glasses for deformation testing (as well as other). I've only got one working eye, so it really concerned me to see that so close to your face, and moving so fast. Thank you for the information, and stay safe!
Very informative video! I'm using the stock springs for more than 1 year on my Ender 5 and thinking about replace them. Since I have BLTouch installed I'm now considering using the silicon.
I replaced my springs recently and now can't even get the bed to stay level... debating silicone instead... have you made the switch?
@@Moonclaw196 Ho Joey, yes I did replace it just after I posted the previous comment. For my printer it worked very well. I found it's a bit difficult to make it level so I tried several rounds for the first manual leveling.
Thanks for a great comparison. The silicon posts are good for auto-leveling set ups while providing a very slight give to the bed in case the nozzle scrapes. As for manual levelling, I've never had problems with the "weak" stock springs. Tighten the wheels to fully compress all the springs. Adjust Z-stop to trigger on the highest point of the bed - move the around while turning the Z rod to find this. Perform your bed tramming routine by only loosening the wheels. This will ensure maximum spring compression while keeping the wheels tight.
@@hoffer_moment - It doesn't matter if the springs get deformed, it's not permanent, and they'll still provide an extension force. I've trammed my beds with fully compressed springs and they stay trammed until I swap in another type of print surface. Simple.
@@hoffer_moment - I didn't say fully squash the springs. There's a huge difference between that and fully compressing them - springs are designed to be fully compressed, as in no gap between the coils. In the end, people ought to use what works and what's simplest for them.
Thanks. I feel like a got a bit of education on springs as well!
Almost two years since I installed the silicone mod on my Prusa MK3 - perfect results like on first day. I used a silicone tube from automotive parts.
On MK3? But that bed is fixed, no need for silicone mounts.
@@MyTechFun yes you need it there too. Bed is fixed but I had 0.6mm tolerance from corner to corner. Pinda will try to compensate but parts are still bend when not level. After silicone mod I made multicolor 3d printed signs with perfect first layer. Before this mod it was not possible.
I've been using the silicone spacers for about 4 months. They are fantastic. However I've seen others who have had issues with certain types of the silicone spacers that you get. Me personally I wouldn't go back to the spring.
Interesting. Sometimes your videos, while rigorous, don't draw many conclusions. However, in this one, I feel like you've definitely nailed down the fact that silicone mounts are better for auto bed-leveling systems, and strong yellow springs are better for printers utilizing the z-limit switch. This was your intuition, and you backed it up with some hard data. I feel much more informed, and if/when I buy a CR Touch or BL Touch I will consider adding silicone mounts as well. As for now, I'm using the yellow springs with a z-limit switch. Thanks!
Did just add plastic spacer under heat bed (for protections) and then a normal nut (to prevent screw to spin) and then the original spring and at the end printed new leveling wheels with lock-nuts. Has soon been 2 years since I leveled my bed.
I don't use any BL Touch, print on normal glass (3mm) from local glazier.
On thing to consider is do they give in if there is a blob or something that the printhead collides with. Springs do give in.
it is not mainly about spring strength, its the compensation of the springs to the non ideal surface of heated bed and frame/table the 3d printer set on
Can you explain in more detail? They can all be adjusted adequately for bed level in the 4 corners the silicone ones can just do it under higher load.
Nice video, thanks. I have ordered the yellow springs and the BLtouch before seeing your video.
I'm sure the glass on my Ender 3V2 is warped exactly like yours, concave with a hole in the center, which is the worse for leveling manually.
if you're using silicone, make sure the gantry is parallel enough to the bed (doesn't need to be perfect)
I upgraded my ender 3 S1 to the silicon standoff. After a few weeks they are great. I would level the bed every few days, eventually they have squashed enough where they are now stable. The springs would, under temperature controls, and vary throughout the print. I have my printer in an enclosure now so this my not be as significant
If you are just hobby printing wait until the bed cools to remove your print, once the bed cools the parts slide right off. If you're in a hurry you can spray some alcohol around the perimeter of the part to cool the bed faster and you can use the excess to clean the bed. Anything that keeps you from yanking on the bed will help reduce bed leveling. Lock nuts on the adjusting wheels will help too. If you have ABL or manual mesh you can replace the springs with a solid spacer. This can be tricky to level initially, you'll have to add and remove shims/washers to get the bed level to start, but once you get the bed level it generally doesn't move, any slight changes can be compensated by the ABL or checking your manual mesh occasionally and adjusting if necessary. Disclaimer: I have not personally tried the solid spacer method, I am currently using the upgraded yellow springs, but from what I've seen online people who have tried it like it. Most new printers that come from the factory with an ABL probe installed also come with solid spacers installed from the factory.
I have found this video now. I have used all three and I have actually found the yellow springs were the best on my Ender 5 (original model).
I found the factory silver springs were way to weak, it would move too much. The silicon blocks, on the other hand, were too rigid and made it virtually impossible to level the bed as moving one corner even 0.1mm would upset all the other corners. The yellow springs are stable, don't move during prints, but flexible enough that leveling the bed is easy to complete. I print on the original Ender bed, PEI bed and glass and a BL Touch. I find the yellow springs best.
That is correct, you might move the bed out of alignment by moving it manually!
I just let my print cool down, it releases no problem and with zero resistance every time!
Also, if the bed is tweaked a bit... It should level out eventually, unless you really whacked it.
Wouldn't metal spacers be better, assuming they are safe to use and don't cause other issues. The silicone being able to deform slightly defeats the pupose a little for me, as you can crank one screw too much in one corner maybe.There's still a slight element of feeling each side to make it consistent.
Light, aluminum columns is worth to try, if you can make all 4 corner in one plane, leveled, because you need minimal elasticity for this adjustment.
Hi Igor. I recently changed my springs for the silicone mounts. I am not a mechanical engineer, so forgive me if I am not able to back up my understanding of this system with proof or data. As I understand it, if the bed is level, then you don't actually need a BLTouch to level the bed. The BLTouch does nothing to level the bed. That's why you have to level it yourself before you can use an auto bed-levelling device. The BLTouch only compensates for bed surface irregularities by adjusting the height of the nozzle, and to function properly it relies on a mesh pattern it creates then stores either on the SD card or in the EEPROM. If the printer bed is level after installing the silicone mounts, it should remain relatively level as long as the mounts do not compress too much more. The BLTouch will then help compensate for the height differences between nozzle and bed, which is affected by the deformation of the build surface. Thanks for this video. I appreciate the scientific approach. It helps me to better understand 3D printers and how these work.
Yes, that's exactly how it works. BL touch is important if ved is warped. Or for those, who commonly change the build surface (several types of PEI sheets or simar)
i hollowed out the silicone ones to fit the good springs . combo
Thanks 4 this helpful and good video! Grat work! I'll buy a silicon version for my sidewinder x2
Good video. Your graph shows that the factory springs compressed at a higher rate above 10.6kg load. That explains why I was having such a hard time adjusting the spring in the back left corner, because it has the extra 2mm base from the cable guide and would compress greater than the other springs. A small change in the knob would result in a bigger compression change. One thing to note, you tested the compression of the springs but did not show if they retained any deformity from the compression. A properly designed spring will not deform when compressed. If you had measured the compression of the springs after multiple and prolonged compressions, you would likely find that they retained the same compression force, although I am aware we are talking about Chinesium springs and they may have cut some corners on the design. I think the silicone ones are more stable and less susceptible to vibration and heat deformation than the metal springs. I just installed the silicone spacers today and printed a 3d-benchy. It came out a little smoother than with the original Ender 3 Pro springs.
One of the stock yellow (ish) springs on my Ender 5+ didn't just deform it broke! when I took them off I could see they were very different from the yellow springs I bought for my other printers, when I bent the spring metal it bent and then clean snapped and you can see micro holes in the metal when under my cellphone camera and zoomed in
What about orizontal dilatation of the heat plate?
Springs permit the holes to move a bit, silicone bushings compress too much obliging the bed to dilatate in vertical creating a dome. So the nozzle become more closed to the bed in centre and distant in corners.
Do you have pictures of the ringing before and after each of the modification of springs? I would say that with the factory springs you should see a lot of ghosting/ringing and with the silicones they should be greatly reduced. A side by side photo would be cool.
One main point of stiffer springs is to keep the bed still. No movement from the mounts. Ofc if you print slow it is okay. But at high speed it has a purpose
@@girenloland I know the fundamentals. I work as senior mechanical engineer. Just to make the movie complete an end result of the mods should be shown. Otherwise you could do that and see no benefits. So what would be all your effort for? Wasted time?
With Jyers FW you can do manual bed leveling without a paper, using bltouch.
Good to know. Thx
You can also try the Mriscoc FW, it has more useful features and better support. I will try with silicones spacers... I don`t have ABL yet, but just for comparison. Nice video. Keep going!
@@JoseArevalo-Fester I try, no way. Not open source project.
Thank you for the info. I was wondering if there may be any heat transfer from the bed to the yellow springs that may decay their elasticity. If there is a teflon or carbon fiber washer to negate that but over time being compressed it will affect them. Good thing they are cheap for now.
Great video. Why not just use metal spacers and nuts it you have the CR touch? This would leave the bed fixed, no flex and secure. ?
You need 4 metal spacers, but if they are not flexible at all, it is hard to have the bed in flat and leveled (parallel with moving path of the nozzle). You need minimal elasticity to adjust this.
I can't tell you about the silicone mounts, but after a few weeks/months I even see deformation in my Prusa MK3S which is mounted pretty rigidly. It's not a lot, but it is definitely noticeable and without the bed leveling probe it would be quite problematic..
this is a great video i purchased a biqu microprobe and ever since i had it ive had issues with printing. i use the yellow springs. your video explains the problem better than anyone tried to help me and you mention if you have a z end stop then the yellow springs are best and i agree with you i used to always use a z end stop and i had virtually no problems with printing. any problems i had were elsewhere
Excellent video. I had replaced the original springs with the yellow ones on all 3 printers at one point. I bought 3 sets of the silicone spacers awhile back, but only installed them on the Ender-3. One issue I had when installing them was my bed wasn't trammed very well to the gantry so had to really tighten down the one side to get it close enough and then have the BL Touch do the rest. I haven't had to re-level even after months. But that goes for the other 2 printers with the yellow springs as well, so I'm not sure how much of a difference the silicone spacers would really make in the long run. I'll probably still eventually install them on all 3 printers though since I have them.
To take it a step further, what if the spacers were made out of steel and then had zero deformation? If your bed and gantry are trammed really well, then could see this working, but if your printer is like mine then it would be too far out of "level" for the BL Touch to compensate so I think having some play as you get with the yellow springs is probably the way to go.
Solid spacers are available, but the problem is unless they're manufactured right and very precisely, your bed is going to end up out of tram and every print will have to be compensated for. I got some and I couldn't get the bed close enough to level for my satisfaction.
If you can make it flat, use steel (or better lighter alu) colons. Maybe adding teflon washer above to get minimal elasticity for permanent leveling.
@@dalem04 Not sure why you were having such problems. Things like this are done in the metal fabrication business everyday all day. Hell you could have just used stainless steel washers and stack them until they were all identical heights. It's not rocket science.
Also wondering where you bought your spacers. It has to be one of the easiest things to make.
I use solid aluminum mounts with a BL-Touch.
excellent video sir; quite possibly one of the best ive seen about these mods on youtube or any platform. thank you.
I’m using The silicone. That realy stable and strong. Test result is corrected my idea.
If there is a BL touch, why can't we just put metal spacers in place and double lock nut the adjustment wheels when we get a manual level? That would permanently set the level and the software could compensate? Get rid of the spring function completely because it is unecessary?
Yes, a lot of printers which have factory installed BL Touch have fixed bed. If you can fix all 4 positions to be flat (in 1 plane), then yes. But it bay be hard, especially because of back left one. The plane position is important, to avoid warping of the plate.
I see the bottom line as:- if you treat your printer bed like a workbench, buy stiffer springs and/or a bed levelling sensor.
Comments suggest some ringing is more likely with more compliant springs, maybe just the frequency of ringing but my E3 is slow so if I see ringing I might consider stiffer springs.
Problem with the silicone mounts, they don’t behave precise when adjusting. You can turn turn back nothing changes turn another time, suddenly it’s too much.
I hope i am not the only one...
I use... both :)
Silicone and on top springs. Had many issue before, none now.
Running Klipper with resonance compensation means I don't care all that much about vibration dampening. But the silicone mounts have another killer advantage - a tiny bit of extra usable Z height. Unless you're cranking the strong springs way, way down, the silicone mounts are shorter.
Try replace the springs with Hexagonal Copper Pillars. You virtually don't need manual leveling given mesh bed leveling.
If you, for whatever reasons, really want to do manual leveling with springs, you need a far more rigid frame than just a plate of 1mm steel.
do you have a recommended height for the ender 3?
@@ljohnso16 I simply replaced the 4 springs with 4 10mm hex copper pillars. Nothing special about the 10mm though, I just happen to have four 10mm pillars around.
2:28 This method will save you from having to use BL Touch or silicone springs. This is the part people keep ruining is trying to pry and jack hammer the print off the build plate whilst it's on the printer...
Amazing tests!!! Thanks for the video!
Great content! Thank you for the great video.
I love how your graph shows how much dampening affect the silicone has compared to the springs. However, running klipper with input shaping, the resonances are going to much more offset from the bed to the nozzle than with springs, where the linear reliable movement creates desirable oscillations in my opinion for klipper specifically. What's your opinion on that?
I always thought the enlarged holes were for the springs to be reinstalled with the mounts.
I just got a Cr6-SE and I am having some bed levling issues. I am wondering if using these silicon springs under the 11 bed screws might help tram the bed in better. The printer is comping the errors but I am having a hard time getting a good first layer on the entire build plate. Love the channel keep it up!
CR6-SE? That's printer with Auto bed leveling I think. Leveling should not be the problem. You want to check the Z-offset, is it set correctly (distance between nozzle and bed during 3D printing, is it too far or too close)
Did you not have issues with the screws rotating in place when turning the knobs before? I had to install nylon lock nuts to the bottom of my bed so that the screws wouldn't rotate in place rather than having the knob tighten the spring...
If there is enough tension on the springs, then friction should hold the knobs in the place. That's why you need springs compressed at least several mm-s.
Answered all of my questions. Thanks.
Hello, very interesting video. I am wondering if I place thread lock on the screws at wheel level, I will ensure the levelling doesn’t move, without needing to deal with the stiffness of the springs/columns ? Am I wrong ?
You could be right, but I didn't tested it. There are non-permanent lockers, that could be a solution too
Nice testing! Your previous video about creep and different plastics makes me wonder about how this property might impact spring material. If you put all three springs under say... a 5 - 10kg load for a week, would the metal springs be more or less prone to permanent deformation than the silicone?
Also under heat cycling that could be seen with bed mounting fixtures.
That's why I asked for experience from others. Also, if 100-110C of bed is a problem, a teflon washers can be added above silicone.
It is best not to use any kind of spring and put 4 nuts. And use auto-leveling.
Hi Igor, great video. I just bought a CR-Touch so will get some silcone mounts. What version of Firmware are you using please. Please could you provide a link. I have an Ender 3 V2 with v4.2.2. board. No other mods other than the CR-Touch I want to install.
Thanks for your help
I used Jyers firmware, but a custom one, since I modified the max temperature limit (since I have all metal hotend)
Any update on the silicone mounts? Mine have been in successful service for nearly one year now.
They work fine since I installed them.
@@MyTechFun Thank you for answering. 2 out of 2 in service -> so it seems that they are a durable alternative
Ive just got a set of 4 silicone mounts from Creality.
3 are the same size one of them is 1mm shorter than the rest...
Wonderful quality control 😕
I shall order another set and see if I can make up a set that I can actually use.
that is expected... the shorter one is for back left portion of the bed where the cable mount is
@@santiagomoneta my bed doesnt have the cable mount there. I needed 4 the same length
My 2 cents worth on leveling an Anet8 Plus. I removed the glass top, took out the 4 bolts for the heatbed. I then bolted the Anet8 Plus on a piece of plywood. I put items under the plywood to level the 3D printer. I leveled the X gantry to the bed frame in both directions. This is where things get strange.....After doing the familiar exercise of moving the tip around the bed and homing Z axis a few times I noticed when homing the left Z motor makes a grind noise and lowers the left Z axis a bit. Disable the motors and twist the right Z axis to level it up again. I spent 5 days with this problem until I printed a new Z axis stop that mounts on the left side and then removed the left and right spiral rods ,re-set the set screws into the rods and leveled them. I replaced the springs with rubber ones. After many times homing the Z axis the level of the gantry has stayed level. I printed a test for checking the levelness...perfect, time will tell. But checking the gantry being level on all prints will be a priority for me.
Hey My Tech Fun, awesome video. This was really interesting. So, to what percentage or mm length would you compress the yellow springs to before you start calibrating each corner? I compressed them on all four corners to 15mm (25% compression) before the calibration. After the calibration they are compressed to length at around 13mm. Do you think this makes sense according to your charts?
25-60% is fine
@@MyTechFun Hey thx for the quick response :-) So 60% would be a good start setup to start leveling or would it be the max? Meaning is it the range the range for the spring to function without permanent deformation?
The corner with the harness stays up on my tray. Even if I squeeze it all the way down, it stays up. Should I try to bend the metal with my hand or pull the Z-stop up? Thanks for the pei advice I'll get the silicon and pei asap
Excellent demonstration of the three types.
I had swapped out the factory springs for the stiffer yellow ones.
I recently added a CR Touch to my Ender 3-V2 and definitely see the value in adding the silicon spacers.
When you put the silicon spacers on, why did you switch back to the factory adjustment wheels?
They are smaller, I want to add heatsink to y stepper
you need to update the affiliate links,
add aliexpress as well,
thanks!
thank you for your sharing!
Use a contra nut on the adjustment knob and be done with it.
Good job Ivor 👍🏻
cant we use a locking nut instead? maybe i am wrong but i would like to try it
Thank very much
I went back to springs after printing with ASA. Seems like it's to hot for the silicone. Looses it's springiness and compress. (100-110 Celsius) So when you go back to 50-60 degrees the bed is not level anymore. I use mesh leveling, not bltouch.
Try adding a teflon washers above silicone to protect them from bed temperature
what if you add a counter butterfly nut to stop rotating knob ?
I already tried that. When I tight it, knob moves a little bit. Maybe only using one with self locking nut yes.
Mount a fan to the bottom of your printer and have a switch to turn on the fan. You can simply pull the 24v to a 24v fan and add a switch there. On Ender boards the hotend fan always spins... so yeah... all you need to do is to turn it on and your bed temp will fall really fast and then you hear a cracking and the print comes of itself :)
I have received ender 3 3d printer. In bed spring There 4 springs in that one smaller then all? It's good or not…
Smaller goes to back-left position.
What software are you running on your printer?
I would like to have mesh view like that to!
Jyers firmware (UBL)
hi, do you need change the position of the "end-of-course" from z axis?
ive used them on a couple printers for over 2 years. i do not really notice any deformation now. i did after the first 3-4 months but it seems to have stabilized since. i am using black silicone mounts btw. i used some i had left over on and ender 5 pro and it seemed to be about the same after a few months they seemed to have deformed a bit then when re-leveled no more issues. i have not tried the orange ones. i thought of making my own molds using high temp silicone when and if these go bad. i may try that on the new printer im building