Pipeline Welding / Downhand / Downhill Welding
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ย. 2024
- Gotta give credit to Gerry at GRB College of Welding and his welding courses and training me throughout the years, GRBWelding.com as well as my friend Ken Kozack. I'm just practicing with different sa200s.. 1946 Shorthood, 1956 Shorthood, 1958 Transition Model and 1961 Redface - If a guy knows what to look for, its the body positioning, dropping that shoulder (thanks ken) - the current you are welding at, its a number of things going on in this video.
Been there, done that for 6 years of my 10 year welding career.....1975 to 1985
Gave up the "rig welder" pipe welding game and moved on to other more interesting "things' in 1985.
Always wanted to be a pipe welder or pipeline welder and after actually doing it I realized I did not want to be doing this until I was 60 years old...but some guys just love it and live for welding.
When you are a young guy and just starting your welding career you figure pipe welding and having your own welding rig has to be the coolest thing ever...and the big bucks also...lol
Cheers
Only REAL ENGINE DRIVE WELDERS have flathead engines and copper winding's! As a 64 year old retired iron worker, it's easy to see you know exactly what you are doing. I remember tacking 2 and more rods together for that long, around the corner reach while using a mirror held by my helper, welding through windows cut in large diameter pipe, laying on my back, got to love it. Remembering the slag burning in my ear, hair on fire, boots on fire, I would not have had it any other way. Excellent video's, thanks for posting.
downhill : the purist form of the sport: been a pipeline welder for 4 years now never gets old
I`d wish to have just a fraction of your skill man. that`s awsome!
Pretty badass video man. The hotpass shot was an excellent demonstration of what a hotpass should do & what it should look like inside. It reminded me of a video that xazazel has from inside the pipe. Thank you.
+Jerry Minyard I remember that video! Ive always thought it was really cool and it reminded me of the time I was a welder helper in 2006 and the welder said "watch the root pass" and I had no clue what or why but now adays it is interesting to watch and see how the root repairs itself and or can damage itself. Also gives insight into speed and technique if its glowing too much or gets too hot in one spot or whatever else happens.
That's a good looking bead Travis. Stay safe brother
i can,well used to do that,by my respects for this guy.
good job buddy. its joy to eye
Just wanted to say thanks. For all the time repositioning the camera and the time editing the footage. All of us appreciate what you post and the tips you pass on. @amsn.nv on IG
maintmech1245 thankyou! =P I am still trying to pull together certain kinds of videos but I wish I had someone to operate the camera for me lol Theres still a lot I want to talk about and say but trying to figure out how I am going to present it is difficult.
+Pauline Badamo I will have a few welders out from time to time to help a little bit but I very strongly recommend the place that teaches me called GRB College of Welding. They have a course there for Downhand pipe welding which I took in 2009, it is a very good course and the weld test is included with the 40 hour course
Dude, you look smooth.
I'm working through 5G pipe now and my struggle is getting in position to see and do my bottom halves. I'm doing a different process though and requires to weld uphill. Your video did give me some ideas to try.
Thanks
Yea dude we were taught to start from bottom and work uphill shit give me a 5gpipe ill fuckin drag that bitch downhill
+John T You are doing the F3F4 process; you need to be looking underneath the welding electrode. At the bottom of the pipe you will hold the electrode a slight back hand angle and you *can* use a very minute stepping motion holding a tight arc and scratching along the land. When you step back into the keyhole to fill, pause for 1 second. (at the bottom) what the pausing and backhand angle does is it helps to get buildup. You will be holding a tight arc to the pipe. At around 4:30 and to about 2:00, you can hold a tight arc to the pipe, increase the welding current and drag the welding electrode up the pipe and you will "feel" the pipe itself and its resistance through the tip of the electrode all the way to your hand and your other hand you will be fiddling with the welding remote itself to 'fine tune' the welding current. You will watch underneath the electrode as the welding puddle follows you upwards. max distance you will want between the tip of the electrode and the leading edge as you skate up the bevels is 3/32 distance. You control the distance by controlling the arc length (tight arc to chill puddle and arc length to make puddle more lively) and by adjusting the remove via your other hand. At the top of the pipe, you will skate the electrode on the land progressing as quickly as the keyhole itself fills up; dragging the electrode upwards. The biggest thing is your bevel angles themselves if steep or wide, as well as line of sight, and amount of land & gap. If you have too much land then it acts as a heat sink and it chills out your weld puddle while it gouges open a keyhole on the leading edge and the root pass ends up very poor. Bevels too steep and or close together ends up with the electrode chewing away into the bevels.
+The Welding Channel - Fieldres
Thanks for the advice. my real issue was vision; seeing what I was doing. I finally just got on my knees under the pipe and just look up and behind the rod like I was doing a 4G plate. I just weld as far as my vision and body position allows which gets me from 6 o'clock to about 4:30/7:30. Then I just get up and change my body position and finish.
I kind of use a combination of dragging and stepping depending on how things are progressing. As I come over the top I'm stepping more to keep from having too much reinforcement on the inside and or the puddle dropping out.
Thanks again.
+John T =D I've noticed if a person leaves something for a while and then comes back to it, they start to pick up on little things they've never noticed before and little things they are doing and things that are going on in the weld itself. Could always walk away for a while and return and a person could immediately pick up different things because they are more aware and paying attention.
Hey, that's exactly what I tell folks when I teach them anything! I call that the "Sleep On It" method, and it works really well if you tell someone to think critically about what they're doing, and remember the mistakes that they make, sleep on it and come back a day or two later and practice again. It really helps to reduce frustration levels and somehow most people learn some things I've not even taught them yet, LOL!
It's like magic, and tons of people won't believe it when you first tell them that it's part of the plan. I've seen it work on welding, dirt biking, snowboarding, and surfing...being that those are the things I feel confident enough to share with others. It still also works really well for my own improvements too, and so whenever I've reached the point that I'm fatigued or have "hit a wall" in my progression, I stop for the day and let my mind fix the things that I can't.
So very cool to see and hear someone else mention this technique, very cool, and thanks for the great reminder of my days welding with sa400's in the refineries and tank farms of the Hawaiian Islands. It's easier to recall them fondly when you're not sweating your ass off! :D
Sick video! Love it!
+maintmech1245 =D =D thanks!!
Haulin ass across that first joint!
poetry in motion
+יובל שגב Thankyou!!
Thank you.
Hey brother, awesome video. I've been practicing as well. It's been my dream to one day get on pipeline type welding. I'm struggling on my tie-ins. I feather my tacks really good, but do you heat up the tack you're tying into, go back to your weld, and then tie in like in an uphill 6010 root?
Secondly, I read all the comments below. Do you almost always keep a 1/16" gap and landing? I find myself keeping my tighter gap on bottom and running hotter. But I do have to adjust my amps based on the gap :( I aim for 3/32 all the way around, but it gets tighter in some spots and a little bigger in others. I try to keep the bigger gap up top. Do you do the same for bigger pipes? I'm practicing with 8" and 12" pipes
Third, when grinding the root pass, do you grind out the wagon tracks too just to make sure xray won't have a slag inclusion? Or do I just grind the centnr of the root and will I burn the slag out when running my hot pass for sure? Man, would be nice to be able to message you pics of where I'm at lol. Thanks for the video brother. I'm practicing with an electric machine for now until I feel comfortable enough with it that I'll hop on the sa200.
+Ajay Mangal No, don't need to do that. When I do a tie in, I use a 3/32 disk and thin out the tie in. You do not need to grind to where you have a sharp ramp and the tip is blue, that's over grinding. just thin out the tie in is all you need. When you are welding, you will come up to the tie in and you can be very gentle where the tie in is. Vertical up you can go slightly forehand and the molten metal will spray ahead of the puddle to fill up the void, but downhand, I will hold perpendicular to the pipe, and nicely go up the ramp, and once it is tied in, I will for about 1/2" I will then use the same technique as the hotpass to step and pause, step and pause to ensure a quality tie in that the molten metal is glowing internally, then I will taper off the arc. Do not tie in then suddenly go back over, just keep progressing with the weld and taper off. Do not push and snuff the rod in on the last little bit of keyhole, that is very poor technique and unfortunately that is often shown in how to videos and even in schools. You want to ensure that your gap and land is uniform all the way around. I have the video "how to properly prep plate and pipe" which in the video on 6" pipe, I take a 7" disk and I put it on the pipe and I grind down the pipe which makes the face square. This is extremely critical. Everything in that video is critical for a high quality fit up including filing of the root face and rouding the land itself after grinding. This is to ensure that land is square and uniform all the way around. Any inconsistency in the fitup will lead to poor and difficult weldability. Within reason a faint discontinuity is corrected by manipulating the arc length and changing inclination, however when you need to drop welding current and weld a little bit and the pipe is closing up, that is poor fitting and prep of the pipe. You should be able to weld the pipe without running a grinder through the gap at all. Weld the bottom quarter, then weld down 1 side then down the other side and the only grinding is feathering the starts and stops. Use a 1/16 land and 1/16 gap as the very smallest. Don't have anything tighter or any less of land. You can run the root with 1/8 as well as 5/32 electrode on 6". In the states they say dime gap dime land, so on larger pipe I'd still run 1/16 and 1/16 to 3/32 and 3/32. There are a lot of inconsistency in the pipe. I would use 5/32 on the 8 and 12" pipe for the root. the way to square the pipe is to slam the pipe tight together and run a zip cut through. the slam it tight together and run a zip cut through and you will have a nice amount of land that you can grind and prep the pipe properly. when you fit it together, the gap will be uniform. The sa200 is the better machine than the electric, its backwards that you would use the sa200 and want to be comfortable to try a electric machine. Those sa200's are superior. For grinding of the root, you grind down the high spots and remove and spots that are cold lap. you can buff the root pass so you can get a real good look at it. You can burn the wagon tracks out using a stepping and pausing technique on the hotpass. The way to inspect the internal of the weld is to do a nick break test where you cut your pipe coupons out about 1" wide. You run a grider about 1/8 depth over the cap pass in the middle and down the sides. It will go to the heart breaker and it will snap the coupon in half. Then you look at the grain structure and look for any black specks to see if there is any slag trapped in the weld. This is the nick break test and can be done at any welding school but you want someone who knows what they're looking at to tell you that you have cold lap, slag, porosity, undercut, etc.
He is the man. Sweet job!
With no saftey classes like a fuckin boss
+979 Street Racing haha yeah! =D :P
been awhile since I seen so many ideal-arcs in one place!
what are your amp settings for your root, hot pass, and cap?
Been trying to look for that welding cap at the beginning of video forever, remember where you got it?
Great video. I'm just getting ready for year 2 at Loyalist College, the fabrication part of the course. We will be approaching pipe welding this year. my question is: are we seeing the hot pass at 4:30? that really is unique footage to youtube as far as I have seen it's really great.
+Ghost Dog Actually that part was a filler pass that was immediately following the hot, I didn't record the hot pass as I recorded it on the outside of the pipe for the body movement and such. xAzazelx13 has a video called "Pipeline Welding - Hot Pass From The Inside" that shows the hotpass; th-cam.com/video/u_EzniXp3-A/w-d-xo.html
I saw that video. cool. thanks again for educating!
How are you running the cap? Slight side to side? Circles? Whip? Been trying to slick mine out. Can't seem to figure out what works best.5/32 cap for 6 sch. 40?
Hey Travis. 'sup with the DeWalts ? I thought Makita ruled the frontier ?
where did u get that hood at? looks like an original pipeliner with a flip lens
Travis a little off topic, good video like always but...my 200 was cutting out on me today when I was testing. On closer look my fuel line from my fuel bowl to carb was empty Damon near trickling in. Under a load it would spit and sputter the idle up again. Without checking anything. You thinkn it's a clogged fuel bowl or carburetor side
Calvin Bostick It would be sediment in the fuel tank. The way I've dealt with this is unbolt the fuel tank, and try to clean it out as good as possible to remove any rust and sediment including farmer fuel which has a dye in it, including old gasoline that is gummy. I unbolt the fuel bowl itself, I clean the fuel bowl, including the metal screen and un-thread from the tank itself cleaning any sediment that will be trapped on the threading and outlet of the tank itself. Next once everything is installed as far as the fuel tank is concerned and bolted back into the machine, I blow out the metal lines, but my machines have rubber fuel lines with a clear plastic fuel filter which will noticeably fill up with fuel as well. After that, I like to remove the carburetor and blow out all the ports, and clean with a degreaser. Helpful if you have new gaskets otherwise you risk the chance of your carburetor leaking once the machine is turned off. If so, turn off the fuel at the tank itself. Blow out all the ports, remove the crud in the carburetor itself. There is a stud at the bottom of the carb on some models. If you want to see if fuel is going into the carburetor, you can unbolt that stud. If fuel runs out, then you know atleast fuel is meeting your carburetor. However, it sounds like you just have sediment. This was the exact reason why my 1958 Lincoln Transition Model was only $1200, its because the fuel tank has sediment in the bottom and the gasoline could not go to the carb. My 56' was the same way but with gummy fuel.. it gets sediment from time to time which I just went through cleaning it out just last week lol. I have a brand new fuel tank from a 70's blackface but they're too tall for the shorthoods, so my shorthood has rust inside the tank.
I appreciate it Travis I'm up here I'm NoDak in Watford city, long way from Texas. I thank you for the quick response. I just got done tinkering with it also my machine wouldn't idle down earlier when all this occured, maybe it was drinking too much on high idle under a load due to what you said. It appears to be fine now i have rubber neoprene fuel line. I did away with the inline filter because same stuff was happening. Wouldn't fill the filter up. I ran clear hose so I can see the fuel, dirt, color, etc. Who knows now I gotta go in tomorrow for a 6" sch. 80 6g. 6010 root, hot, and filler 7018 all the way out. I appreciate it man
+Calvin Bostick I have a large filter on mine, and it won't fill the filter up fully, it may be that the concentric design forms gas pockets, but also that the flow through the filter is equal to that of the line itself unless there is a blockage in the line and the filter fills up more. It acts on gravity from the tank to the carburator so the line needs to be as going downhill from the tank to the carb.
Another question: it looks like you are not whipping, and just using a5-15degree pull and just blowing me away. I need to whip that or I make the big hole and have to jump ahead, and go back and fill the hole later? what's going on, you make it look like I think it should go in but I'm whipping?
thanks.
+Ghost Dog You don't want to whip, whipping will open a huge crater as well, what you want is to manipulate the arc length, so holding a tight arc will chill out the voltage. Overall you want to have a very gentle pressure, all of the weight of the stinger alone on the pipe, and running at an adequate current, and using manipulation of the arc length only as an immediate fix of an arising issue like wide gap, too little land, etc where you then manipulate the arc length which then adjusts the amperage and voltage. But you want to have a perfect fitup because that is the number 1 thing in downhand welding is the fitup quality. From there, use an adequate current for the gap and land, and then comes to speed of travel that only enough heat lingers and you get going asap otherwise you will then start to feel the electrode push through into the pipe and then start to open a keyhole. So you want to travel faster down the pipe dragging the current in behind you and if you do open windows as they are called, just keep going, they will close up, and you will then get them later.
good job
+Jea Soud Thankyou!!!
good video bud! i think you thought me how to roll pipe at jv drivers shop!
+Dave ste-marie Hey thankyou! I can't remember too much from drivers actually, I was there from March 24, 2011 and left around December then came back in January or February I believe and left in august but I do know it was the very best place for learning! I really liked that place, it was a great place to work
i was in the mod yard with jody patton
+Dave ste-marie I remember that! I was in the mod yard in 2011 I believe it was, later in the year. Jody's a friend of mine. I really wonder if it was not me, if it was Tyson that may have shown you because Ty was the welding lead hand there.
no im pretty sure it was you!
+Dave ste-marie Its possible then! =P I probably wasn't very competent at it but the welds were better later on ;)
Man you crazy ^)
Do you, feel thats its better to be lower to the ground , as oposed to standing to weld pipe, because of less body movement? Love all your video's, as they do teach alot .
+Jeremy Kilo The pipeline cones depending on the size are anywhere from 19 inches to 25 inches in height. The body positioning I am using in the video is proper for that height.
Ok, Thank You.
Damn you make it look so easy are you whipping it the whole way or only in the beginning
+saint 85 No, what actually is going on is the pipe itself for the most part is a good fit up of 1/16 land, 1/16 gap, very uniform. The welding current, say for example I will throw out a number - welding current is 100 amps. Well this current on the pipe would be good for the whole way around, I could use gentle pressure on the pipe manipulating the arc length a little bit to adjust the immediate amperage and voltage to control the weld puddle. However, the current would have been say 105 amps, where it was a little bit hotter at the top of the pipe. So to compensate rather than holding a tight arc and pushing into the pipe to drop the voltage and chill out the weld puddle, I had opted to whip the top portion of the pipe, but also incorporate a tight arc and slight drag then whip, then tight arc and slight drag until about 1 oclock, for which the welding current was adequate for the sides, and I could just get away with holding a tight arc and maybe using a slight drag angle if needed. But this would be the reason why for the odd pipe why I had whipped the top portion of the pipe.
what kind of motion are you doing downhill?
What kinda diameter rods are you using you seem to be burning em up quite quickly :D
+The OutCaster Throughout the video I am using 3/32, 1/8, 5/32 and 3/16
Are you using 6010. or 5p or 7p or 8p+. for root. and hotpass.
+Javier Garcia 6010 for the root pass, and I am using either 7010 or 8010 for the hot to fill passes. I'm using the last of my electrodes. Probably most of the hot passes were done with 7010.
just curious...what percent or all pipe welds are tested in the field? ut, xray, or it all depends?
+John Demkovich Depends on the code and line spec including service going through the line. Maybe a b31.3 normal code requires only 5 or 10 percent. Maybe a sour service code requires 100% and this line is more strict than this other line. Maybe plastic pellets flow through this line and it is accepted to be visually inspected instead of xray. Even Hydrowelds are slapped together and welded with no visual or testing.
+The Welding Channel - Fieldres Thanks for the info. I just got into a bridge fabrication shop and literally everything is tested, even the small redundancy welds. 3 different parties of inspectors making sure youre using your temp sticks. Just wondered how strict it was when it comes to pipe
+John Demkovich It can be very strict depending on the company and the codes. Some companies are like "go weld, have fun!" while other companies are like "you get me my inches yet?? I expect 100 inches outta you by 2:45, get!" while other companies it is the clients that can be very particular about temp sticks and following correct weld procedure and everything. A lot of companies here, either the QC is insane and hes right by the book or he just doesn't care and lets things that he "doesn't see" slide.
Smooooooooooooooth. Do you have or will you upload some uphill pipe welding with SMAW?
DocdADeaD I used to have a number of Vertical up F3F4 videos, however I have removed all of them over time. The closest video is: th-cam.com/video/KdIldLn9ryY/w-d-xo.html I could always film the welding I am doing at work, I am welding 60" and 66" Pipe, all Vertical uphill. I just haven't filmed anything yet since its a hassle to move the camera around and the sun in the way is terrible lol.. I'm still working on doing more vertical up videos.
Awesome, Ill check out the video. Looking forward to hopefully seeing some Vertical up vids. Keep doing what you do. I really enjoy your videos. Just watching what you do and how you do it really shows your skill set. Not very many people can do what you do.
+DocdADeaD thankyou! I have a video upcoming that is vertical up f3f4 progression. Its only the root pass however, the camera died shortly after lol but it should be up soon
what welding book do you recommend using? +Fieldres - RigWelders
Chris Cole cc
Chris Cole the book is called experience 👍
What rod are you using going downhill? 7018 is supposed to go uphill I have heard.
+John LaManna I am using 60,70,8010. I don't remember using or mentioning I was using 7018.
That is some serious pushing of rod.. great video.......is that 3/32 6010? Thanks for vid.
Kenny A I am using both 3/32 size and 1/8th size. When I am using 3/32, that is when I am doing the bottom section, one side, then the other. When it is with 1/8th electrode, I am doing one side to the bottom, then the other side to the tie-in. My Friend Ken explained it to me with the 3/32., it keeps everything "small" including the bevels closer together.
got an sa200 fuel tank thats not full of old gas tar that you'd sell?
+shaun hoblitzell I have a whole machine but not just a fuel tank though
I'm in watford
fuckin awesome video travis
+badass98kx250 =) Thankyou!
Very good, that the use of electrodes?
What Rod.
***** I am using 3/32, 1/8, 5/32 and 3/16 6010, 7010 and 8010 throughout the video. Basically just using up the last of my electrodes
What are u running at
kenneth kerry I don't know the exact welding currents. I am jumping from machine to machine and the welding currents themselves vary. However for all of them I would have tested the heat out on a scrap piece of metal before using it to weld