JSB HADES | An Alternative View ....
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ส.ค. 2024
- So here we have my views on the JSB Hades Pellet.... i'm sure i'm going to get flamed for this but my results are what the are. this is at least the third time i've filmed these tests with similar results found on all occasions.
Yes i will be revisiting these pellets in an attempt to see if the results can be improved.
as always if you have any comments or questions feel free to post them below!
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I have not tested at sub 12, but, I am running mine at 935 fps out of a Kral puncher breaker ( tuned) ... the 15.89 have been the most accurate out of that gun, and I tested the Hades against those, and my general small game favorite pellet, the H&N terminator. The jsb domes will do 1/2” at 50 yds for 5 shots in calm weather.... both the Hades and the terminator were doing 3/4”. I tested the hunting pellets in wet newspaper, and they expanded fine, with the Hades penetrating slightly farther. I also found no real expansion below 700 fps( marauder pistol- 690 fps). I believe that you will achieve expansion in your test if you change to a “wet” media... the design of the Hades relies heavily on hydraulic pressure, which, of course, relies on fluid
Nice honest review. I’ve examined squirrels I’ve shot with the hades and can confirm that your test are accurate. I now use H & N terminators which fly about the same as the Hades.
As others have commented, the .177 hades are travelling faster, and in my sub 12 ft/lbs Remington Airacobra, I'm getting sub half inch groups at 40 yards, and shooting in to full plastic milk bottles , great expansion, in fact the head expands to greater than .22 ..the medium used in your tests is too dry, expanding ammunition is designed to increase hydrostatic shock, expansion being only half of the tale, the cavity in the nose of the pellet , even without expansion causes greater hydrostatic shock than a point or dome, I would suggest repeating the expansion test with a wetter medium, I find potatoes give a good idea of shock as the temporary cavity / hydrostatic shock wave can be seen as bruising beyond the permanent cavity created. Kind regards Rob
Try a softer material like ballistic gel. As the Haydes pushes through the gel the travel distance and force around it is what helps to peel back the pellet for better expansion. While a bar of soap may seem soft it really is too dense and smashes the front of the pellet and flattens it before it has time to open up. At least that's my theory, hope it makes sense. As for accuracy it all depends on the barrel and/or gun. My NOTOS absolutely loves the Haydes, it's the most accurate pellet so far for this gun.
Great review on the Hades, I too found very little in deformation with my sub 12 rifle. The best pellet I found, that had a massive energy dump, and surprisingly good grouping was the BSA Black Star.
I was very impressed with them, they do weigh a couple grains more, but wow.
I have a .25 Crown in fac and the Hades have more knock down power than standard Jsb heavies. The heavies go through corvids even at 100 yards and they fly off across a field and die later, the Hades tends to anchor them much closer to the impact point and makes much more of a whack.
Great review James. Would be interesting to see if they expand more in 177 as they travel faster. At the end of the day its down to shot placement rather than pellets expanding. Makes no difference if the pellet passes straight through as long as you are hitting vital parts. People always want a easy option but it still comes down to placement
Thanks, as far as i know these are currently only available in .22 & .25... absolutely, i’d put shot placement over any expanding properties every single time. As for over penetration, i’d have to disagree - if a pellet has passed through its not transferred all of its kinetic punch so to speak. But like i say - shot placement, thats the key.
@@ReplicaReviews I thought they did them in 177, my apologies 😁. If you shoot something through the brain its going to kill it whether it's passed through or not. 95% of the time I shoot rabbits the pellet passes straight through but drops them on the spot. People just think they shoot stuff in the head and it should die, most time it does and others it dont. Seen many people recently shooting rats from the eye to the nose and wondering why they are running off
Couldn't of said it any better mate
The .177 Hades does some damage for sure but none of my rifles shoot them accurately
@@Wolverineverminshooting ppppp😅😅😅p
Very good review and perspective. I'm very glad to see that you explained why at sub 12ftlbs the Hades didn't expand. I was one of the first, if not the first to actually get a tin here in the US to test and found about the same results as you. I do have rifles that I can setup for lower energy and tested a lot. But they are good for showing expansion at around 16fpe and only perform better as they travel faster. But they will tear apart over 915-920fpe. Good vid, sir. Also, that quality is not what one should expect of the Hades or any other JSB pellet. I do apologize. I'll forward this vid to JSB and Predator.
A great review. I think you are right. Hollow point bullet expansion is velocity dependant and the same must apply for pellets. Sub 12 guns just won't have that velocity, and it appears that FAC guns don't either. Perhaps what is happening is that the petal head acts as a cushion on impact, reducing penetrstion and delivering more energy to the target. But in the real world I can't see this as having any appreciable advantage over a normal pellet, especially when offset against reduced accuracy.
Completely agree. As i said in the video as it stands i cant see the claimed expansion patterns and there is reduced accuracy. I’ll do a part 2 video but so far i can only go with the results i have in front of me. James
A very nice and honest review of someone who's not sponsored by JSB or one of their distributors 👏 My own review of those pellets in .25 cal FAC showed very unsatisfactory results. Less accurate than the regular diabolo shaped JSBs and no expansion at 50 meters in an XL sized chicken - went through it both times and hit the wall behind it. Sorry JSB, but the hype surrounding these pellets is fueled by nothing more than business interests. Thanks for sharing.
Interesting to hear similar results! I’ll be doing a pt 2 in the near future. James
I think "soap" as a medium, is too hard. Perhaps using gel or soaked paper stacks would allow the pellet to do what it was designed to do. It could be that hard, dense material does not fill the pellets crevices, which causes the expansion. Gel or flesh will likely fill these crevices easier.
Anyhow, good video, and thank you.
Good, honest review. I've been considering the Hades purely for their expansion claims. I've tried other "expanding" pellets and got the same results you did with the Hades on this review. That's enough for me. I just don't believe these pellets at these FPS speeds and caliber will yield the expansion results they claim. Hyperbole, in my opinion. Thank you so much for this video. I'm staying with my heavy Diabolo domed pellets.
Thanks for watching! Pleased it was of interest. James
Good honest review, I think you gave them every chance to do there thing, if there not working, there not working.
Would like to see you do the same test with the new fx .22 calibre hybrid slugs thats just come out, on full power, I know slugs are ment for longer range targets but would like to see them at 40 years to show the expansion, if there is any.
I’ll see if i can get some in. At the moment they are a bit like the holy grail here in the UK! James
I shoot FX Royale 400 and Hades is my favorite now. I have shot squirrel with these at close range (15 yards) on sub 12 settings right under the ear. No passthrough and when I recovered the pellet I was shocked with deformation. They give me sub half inch group every time at 35 yards (at 870 fps) and I typically don't hunt at longer range.
In windy situation, Hades struggle a bit due to their lower BC, but again since I typically hunt in the woods wind is not a big issue.
Another point I noticed is that I get the best accuracy out of Hades at 870 fps; based on your video (29 foot-pound on your crown), you should have muzzle velocity around 910. You may want to turn down your muzzle velocity and revisit the accuracy with Hades.
brilliant review, i got hold of a job lot of .22 pellets from one of the members at the gun club, hollow points, flat head, polymag you name it. all in .22 all tested and all usable for ratting out to 20/25 yards. BUT at the end of the day i would not use any of them out past 30 yards, as the accuracy was not a patch on the dome head JSB. just my option regards paul
A perfectly sensible opinion to have paul - i completely agree! James
Try bisley long range gold
Great video mate. Please try .177 polymags. In my regal barrel, single pellet hole at short 25m range and complete expansion and double sized wound channel in a potato at 15 yards. It also sent fractures through it. Double the damage of a standard diablo at short "ratting" ranges 👍
i'll take a look!
@@ReplicaReviews yep, i've got 5 in a hole one millimetre wider than a single pellet and defo lethal... for spuds anyway 🤔
They do expand more in .177 than .22 in sub 12ftlb as the MV is so much higher for the smaller calibre the opposite applies for FAC power
Great review nice and honest. I was thinking about getting some for my sub 12 rifle but thought they might not work. Nice to see it cheers.
Thank you for an interesting review . I’m shooting FAC impact and my experience is they group worse than the domed at + 60 yards . But I also see they do expand a lot making ugly exit wounds on the pigeons leaving noth much to eat
They are rated at max 40 yards,
I personally wouldn't use them at 60,
They are a close range beast of a pellet.
H&n barracudas dome tips 21.14 gran I use them in my gamo whisper .22cal there very accurate out of my break barrel
Thanks for a honest review, no BS
No worries! James
Hi fella live the video,s but back to job in hand I notice your pellets were of a very dull gray? Now I've just got a sample of .22 and they are very shiny could this make a difference? I've tried them out to 50 meter and out to 40 there very accurately hitting target and I cand just tell there hitting harder that JSB EXACT but at 50 there all over the place . My conclusion was that at sub 12 in .22 50 is just about there limit and that is only on a perfect day any wind and you just missed your dinner lol.
Keep up the great work much knowledge learnt thanks.
Martin
They are ok to 30 yard, good luck hitting anything over 40 yard with sub 12
Also use plasticine as a ballistic gel alternative cheap and very good and reusable
I use h&n hp slugs in my sub 12 they are 21gr slugs but accurate and powerful keeping nearly all their power out to my max range of 40 yard with them
They are like a hand grenade trajectory for sub 12 but it's good fun
They would work really well in your fac, they work great in standard pellet liner, you should check them out
Only issue I have with the h&n slugs they have way to much antimony so super hard and don't expand like NSA or FX slugs
Interesting video...
I have virtually no experience with airguns, but I do have over 6 decades of experience with powder weapons..... So...... It has been firmly established that bullet expansion is very much tied to velocity. A hollow point lead bullet that mushrooms nicely at 1300fps will not expand at all at anything below about 1000-11oofps.
Air rifle velocities are not high, especially in sub-12 weapons, and even with full power PCPs velocities much over 1000fps are rare. From this it seems evident the the idea of "expanding pellets" is more an advertising gimmick than anything.
We have found with handgun bullets (which are mostly sub sonic) that maximum wounding effect is from a medium-hard alloy with a flat meplat on the bullet nose, sometimes quite a large one. This is not good for velocity retention but as handguns are rarely used seriously over about 70 yards, this is not really a problem, and I would guess that for hunting, much the same criteria would apply to air rifles.
The differences are starkly illustrated by pistol calibre carbines. A .44 Magnum pistol with a 6" barrel can manage about 1100fps with a 240gr bullet, but put that exact same round in a 20" carbine barrel and velocity goes up to around 1700-1800fps and the terminal effect is hugely different. Energy rises as the square of velocity....
So I would posit that best killing effect with an air gun, rifle or pistol, is to be had with very flat nosed pellets with which a good measure of hydraulic shock is possible without actual expansion. As always, penetration has to be adequate, so such flat fronted projectiles need to be driven at a reasonable speed, and speed at impact would need to be over 800fps. That's about muzzle velocity for a sub-12 and probably retained velocity at 40 yards for a full power (FAC?) PCP rifle. For sub-12s I'd tend to go for a pointier pellet for velocity retention and all the penetration I could get. At least, that's what my knowledge and instincts tell me.
I live in New Zealand, I am 80 now but have been a life time shooter and hunter (and gun smith) and have recently come to own my first air rifle...a little BSA that is accurate enough for anything that it is capable of killing, at a range where its low power is still effective. My chronograph tells me that the 10-odd grain pellets are spat out at around 1000+fps giving about 17ftlbs. It's just a little springer, but I am surprised at the quality of build and accuracy for the modest price. It even has a passable trigger......I have not considered a PCP as I have a bunch of .22 rimfire rifles (and a revolver) for more gnarly quarry, and centre fires for further up the scale, so the large price of a good PCP is hardly justified at my time of life, although the PCPs are lovely things, even if expensive accessories are needed to run them. My powder reloading gear is not exactly cheap either. 🙂
The world of serious air guns (I discount CO2) is new to me and I look forward to learning more about them as I go.....
Hita James, my personal opinion on the subject, is that shot placement and accuracy should always come first , thanks for this great video , Cheers
absolutely, i'd argue the same - but for the purposes of these tests and the claims made i was focusing on expansion etc. but like you say, shot placement counts for far more! james
I think the sample out of the wood and the soap is a medium that's to firm and shoves the head in on itself, a fair test is the more expensive ballistic hell as it is soft enough to enable head to open up.
Interesting review. Good on you for putting it up as you saw it.
I have used these in my FAC Compatto, I don't have .22 in sub12 so can't do the same comparison unfortunately. The normal pellet used was JSB Jumbo. The Compatto is putting out about 29fpe on hi power. With the weights of the Jumbo and the Hades being the same the POI is the same as well, near as damn it due to bc variances.
The target testing I did was at 43m. There was not much in it as far as the grouping went. The Jumbo was slightly better but Hades and JSB grouped at about 1.5cm ctc. I have tried some Hades at 80m and the grouping wasn't that bad either (didn't measure but have a picture and it looks to be about 3 cm). The Hades did make a more ragged hole on paper than the Jumbo.
I have not done any deformity test as such. What I can say though is when I have used them to take out corvids they have dropped on the spot. Some times with the Jumbo I would see them lift and get a couple of wing flaps in before falling. Not very scientific but the Hades do seem to be hitting harder in my experience. I have also used oranges as a target for the Hades. They have been more destructive in my opinion than standard diablo pellets. I wonder if the soap is so hard that it is keeping the pellet from expanding at these relatively low velocities.
My tin had the foam layer on the top much as the JSB Jumbo come. On checking 5 random pellets from the tin I am not seeing the same deformities that you are seeing on the pellets. Maybe you have a bad tin?
I am now using these for my pest control work in place of the Jumbo. For me they are accurate enough and hitting harder than the Jumbo.
A couple months ago I performed a similar test using a Daystate Regal XL .22, but comparing JSB Hades, H&N Baracuda Crow Magnum, and H&N Baracuda Hunter pellets , using plumber's putty as the target medium, at a range of 20 yards. The Crows and the Hunters had uniform and very clear expansions, but as you experienced, the Hades did NOT expand, but sort of imploded. In one pellet, one of 'triangles' of the pellet tore off, creating a bit of shrapnel, and causing the pellet to deviate course in the medium. I, too, was pretty disappointed. As to accuracy, the FIRST tin of Hades I bought were crazy-accurate; a second, follow-up tin was moderately accurate to miserably unsatisfactory. As I'm not a hunter (other than the occasional rat), my main criteria is accuracy. For me, no further tests are required; I'm done with the Hades.
Interesting to hear i’m not the only one with these results! James
The fault is not with the pellet. It is the ridiculous sub-12fpe that is the culprit. Varmints die from boredom, not impact.
I have had superb accuracy and expansion from the H&N Barracuda Hunter Extreme's in .117 in my Weihrauch HW110. Velocity is 980 at the muzzle. Expansion is 29 to 30 caliber and so much better than the hades in ballistic gel. My .22 on the other hand Weihrauch HW110 in 22 shoots the Hades very well at about 855 FPS.
I’ve never shot a JSB Hades so I don’t have a dog in the fight. I seriously appreciate your effort.
I have an idea that may clear a few things up. The soap you are shooting is pretty firm. The way a hollow point opens up is the trapped air in the cavity compressing and basically blowing out the walls. The JSB Hades doesn’t work exactly the same way. This is a bit graphic but they capture fluid and tissue in the voids and it compresses that behind the”pedals” to spreads the three “pedals” out. If you hit something solid that can’t enter the three cavities it will have the opposite effect, it would actually drive the pedals “into” the body of the pellet. You might want to recover them from something a little more “fluid” and see what they look like.
Thanks again for your time.
i'll be addressing this in my pt video - work in progress! james
Thank you for testing. Try wet magazines test and see if The Hydro shock would make a difference result please. I do not have the equipment that you have and you would make it better than I would in any case. Lol. You are more accurate at those yards/meters than I. Thank you and well done.
Very nice made review! Maybe for part 2, try various targets? A plastic bottle with water, block of (soft) clay and maybe add a third "hunthing" hollow point pellet? But for now, i'm staying away from the Hades and use my JSB exact. Thanks for sharing this video.
there will be a pt 2 where i'll be carrying out further tests... james
I use hades in my brococks pathfinder and ranger,they are superbly accurate and kill well 👍🤔
In my opinion... it is the caliber that matters. The wound channel is somewhat velocity dependent, it seems, so this idea of expanding pellets dumping energy... I'd really like to see some evidence of that and that the energy is any more effected by expansion, as opposed to, going straight through the animal. Does an animal die any quicker with an expanding pellet versus a pass through? So... for me, pellet design refers to my hitting something with it.
For knockdown power and Thump, I don't see how a flat head target pellet does any worse, and could do much better, than say a dome on small game as far as damage goes... and though I don't shoot flat head pellets, I've experience with flat head bullets versus round, spitzers (hollow point) and for hunting, shot placement seems to be the operative word... I've only ever had 1 (ONE) lead bullet stay in any of my game... and that was a huge pig that had a complete pass through the animal and stopped in the hide on the off side. It dropped instantly, which makes me wonder what exactly is it that "drops" an animal other than a spine shot. That was a 10 yard shot with a 530 grain minie (hollow base civil war bullet) a lot like a pellet.
Back to bullet design and caliber. I've only experience with lead, and only in velocities of less than 1600 fps with these bullets... (heavy bullets don't need speed... they need stability... spin it right and velocity can go subsonic and still deliver pass throughs of big deer at 123 lasered yards.) IN MY OPINION... the closer you hunt, the bigger the caliber and simpler the bullet. The further away, the more precision needs to be developed throughout the process... bullet design, speed, twist, and groove depth become necessary ingredient, in my opinion, and complicate the equation for absolute accuracy. IN MY OPINION... :D
You might find you need to push them a bit faster or slower try dialing off 1 on your spring tension or increasing it ½ a turn also very much depends on what reg pressure you are using too they look like they might be destabilising on exiting the barrel. The joys of having to tweak FX rifles ....
I agree with your view they kind of seem like JS b's version of the crossman purhana which expanded basically the same way nothing... Even out of my Air Force condor SS Which shoots out a maximum of around 74 FPE. Doesn't quite get these things to do what they're supposed to do and if they hit bone they seem to just mangle and gnarl into a compressed ball and not expand out like my JSB predator poly mags in 25 will expand out to 9 mm. Even tuned town to 46fpe
Hi James, i have the FX Crown FAC. Try dropping the power to no4 as the pellet isn’t heaven enough for full power. I’ve gone through all power levels and found this to be the best accuracy for this pellet and normal domed JSB. I’ve yet to try it on full power with a heavy pellet but loving this FX Crown so far. Take care.
I’ll give that a try, they are however 15.89gr which is what my Jumbo pellets are - and they are like lasers! I’ll give it a try though. James
Great video!
great video James ive just bought a impact mk2 sub 12 ftlbs and was looking at buying the JSB HADES now not so sure is it worth looking at FX SLUGS .22 CAL or am I just being to optimistic
Very convincing,
good, nay great review.
Thanks!
@@ReplicaReviews I don't even bother looking at shows from the UK or anywhere where they don't believe in gun rights for the public and it's a damned shame that they even go after airguns!
A good video, these are now my first choice for pest control from my AA regulated S510s in both FAC and sub 12, single hole groups from both and typically one shot kills ! Maybe they just like Lothar Walther barrels ? I’ve never shot soap with them.
Thanks for the video James. Interesting test. I may have missed it, but what was the velocity out of your Crown at the target?
Around 910 fps. He mentioned 29 foot pound, with a JSB 22 cal, you need 910 velocity to get that energy at the muzzle.
Love to see the same test on polymags please
I’ll try and pick up a tin!
@@ReplicaReviews Thanks would be interesting
I bought a couple of tins of Hades in .22 just before Christmas and did some intial testing. I found the hip bone of a sheep and was intersted in testing the expansion on something from a real animal. No I wasn’t hoping to shoot sheep but if it did damage on a sheep bone then rabbits should be in trouble! I was using My Walther Maximathor @ 41 ft pounds for the test. I shot the bone from about 10’ away with a H&N Barracuda, the pellet I had been using for some time. Entry hole looked to be about .22 and exit was similar with a small loss of bone on the exit side.
I put a JSB Hades .22 through the same bone and noticed that the entrance hole was bigger, I guess about .30. Turning the bone over I was amazed at the damage done on the exit side! Approximately 2 1/2” of bone had evaporated from around where the pellet exited! It was like a crater! I’m impressed!
Unfortuanately the building with my guns and 2 tins of JSB pellets was lost in bushfires here in Eastern Australia so further tests are in abeyance. I’m interested in seeing if the pellet stays within the bunny and not expend it’s energy outside of the animal.
that sucks!
Hopefully you had insurance mate.
James is there anyway at all of measuring how much energy they retained when hitting the soap? My guess is that they retained a fair bit as the inploded rather than expanded. Fantastic video by the way and thanks for doing it for us. Penetraton wise they are good for not goi g right though your intended target so may be good in confined spaces where overpenertration would be a problem
I’m sure there will be a way; its something i’d have to look into and do a bit of research on. They’re 100% hitting hard, but like you say and as i’ve shown they don’t seem to expand in the way i’d expected. I’ll be doing more research into the Hades pellets and will do a pt2 video when i’ve got more results to work with. James
Just went and shot a new bar of soap. The hades fully opened up, Like three big claws.
Weihrauch 97k .22 18lbs
Hi, is it possible the soup is harder than the typical ballistic gelatin or molding clay used for expansion tests. I have seen reviews firing hollowpoint bullets through sheet rock and into ballistic gelatin. The sheet rock forced the hollow point closed and bullet didn't expand at all in the gelatin. Same bullet expanded extremely well when fired directly into the gelatin.
possibly, i've seen tests done with these into soap, and other pellets - and its not been an issue. i think the issue here for me is the quality of the pellets, they differ dramatically to the ones i've seen some of the leading reviewers using. i'm planning. apt 2 test video where i'll take all the excuses / target suggestions into account and retest this tin further. james
You should try shooting into fluids
Why, you hunting water creatures?
@@bloodstriper3649 cuz who actually drinks fuilds ballistics tests are far more enjoyable haha
Watched entire video and your interpretation of the results shown are right on. I also would have expected at least SOME OUTWARD Expansion from the shape and cuts of them. What was FPS of the gun on FULL POWER that you were using. an Old Yank
I'm sure I heard him say it was 29 ft/lbs
Only get the controlled expansion with the fac, 12fpe not travelling fast enough, but stick to standard dome in sub 12.
i tried both sub 12 and fac..... disappointing results with both.
They worked fine for me, I see quite a lot of variation in people’s experience with them, but the majority seem to do well with them, I certainly do.
I think if you brought target to 30 yards where the 12pound gun still has most of its power I think you would have more damage to your soap but I could be wrong
👍👍👍😜🏴🦄🎣😁✌️
I watched Matt Duber do same kind o test I wonder if outside temp makes a big difference
Thanks for your honest rewiev
Just as well there accurate ... Me daughter's bought me a tin for crimbo ...
Best hint to the family that you’ll need a rifle to fire them through too, seeing as its xmas 😉
@@ReplicaReviews
Strangely enough , I'm going too treat myself to a new rifle , the HFT500 .. don't think I will be able too squeeze the Hades into it .. lol
friday batch?
For sub 12 i like the H&N Hornet’s. Better penetration and a little bit of expantion but not much but the biggest thing is that penetration.
The accuracy is a concern. The lack of expansion may be a product of cold soap that does not give enough for expansion versus warm flesh.
Soap has been used in several online tests by reviewers using pellets supplied by JSB with much different results: so whilst i appreciate the point, i don’t think this is the real issue here....
Does soap even give enough hydrostatic shock to expand any rounds? That may be why they didn’t expand, I’ve shot them into water and they expanded good. Not my favorite by a long shot but they get the job done.
think you need to try 50+ ftlbs most of the usa hades reviews are full high power impacts etc, but as we sub 12 guys expected . are you planning on testing any fx hybrid slugs id be interested if you can get any good groups from them sub 12 but velocity would be very low and loopy , hope they do a .177 soon in hybrid slug may get flatter trajectory with very high bc and if it expands bonus
My honest opinion is with a sub 12; slugs just wont work. They really are something that will be meant for the fac powered rifles. Sub 12 i’d place accurately placed shots over expansion / weights any day.... as for the FAC powered side of things, even with the power i was running i’d expected more. If there’s a minimum ftlb required you’d expect that to be made clear...
Great review mate, can’t wait for part 2 atb 👍
thanks!
I think your use of soap as an impact medium was a mistake. It may be less expensive than gel, but really has no correlation to flesh which is after all the intended target medium for an expanding pellet. I have seen a video using gel and the Hades pellets expanded outward until it approximated a propeller and did the damage and left the wound channel you would expect from a rapidly spinning propeller. Thanks for the effort. It was still quite informative.
i've seen other reviews where soap was used, not just for the hades but pellets in general. the pellet quality of the ones i tested was completely different to that of the ones seen by some of the leading reviewers / shooters, this i believe to be the main issue. i'm planning a pt 2 where i'll address all the excuses i've been given and will retest with things such as gel etc. james
I wonder how the .177 variant would do on a sub 12. Since I believe it's velocity that mainly contributes to expansion
There’s only one way to find out.... i’ll try and find a tin.
I have the Benjamin Prowler 22 CAL pellet Rifle
Thanks for testing :)
Not a problem!
Just by chance Wisc AirGunners channel has put up "part two" of his Hades .25 test today.
ps, I forgot below, Thanks James.
I’ll take a look!
Great Review James , very interesting. Looking forward to your next review. Cheers Simon 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧
Thanks!
That's what I need for my Rifle
Not sure soap is close to meat. Put like 6 whole chickens in a row and repeat the test. Not wasting good food is smart currently though. But think that would be a better representation of the pellets capabilities.
The grief i got for shooting eggs several years ago put me off using food.... especially in the current climate
Sub 12 is not powerful enough for hades. You need minimum 20ft/lb for it to open up and do what it was designed for
Gr8t review 🐴❤🤠 Texas
Thanks!
The same as you. I got a tin took them out and targeted with them. I'm not sure the worked that well. Using a 40flb Daystate air ranger 25 to 30 yards they did expand also quite accurate. But is it all hype??
there's been far too much hype. the amount of excuses i've had from hades fans has been unreal!
I push the Hades at 935...have done quite a bit of small game hunting with them. I will say, on body shots , they drop squirrels and rabbits with more authority that my 25 cal Airforce talon ss...that gun pushes JSB exact king heavies 33.95 grn at 875 fps for 58 ftlbs. Accuracy for the Hades is 3/4” at 50 yds for 5 shots....... no, not a gimmick, in my opinion.
Never understood all the hype around "hunting" pellets. It's not like any varmin type animal is going be any "less dead" from taking a 12 fpe flat nose target pellet to the head/vitals then they would with these so-called special hunting pellets. The only thing that really matters is accuracy and on-target energy. Here is a test id be curious to see the result of:
Instead of measuring fps at the muzzle, how about you attempt to measure fps ~40 yards out to see what kind of energy is actually left at the target. Very interested to see if all these hunter pellets actually hold speed as well as the normal jsb.
I’ll look into it. But like you; for me shot placement is key. James
5:50 yeah but now you are up to 30 pence. I use the Baracuda Extreme Hunter pellets.
last time i checked we don't have a 30p
I have never used bars of soap as a test material for testing pellet expansion. I used simple Playdoh clay that children play with. Here in the USA I go to a Dollar store and buy about 5 pounds of the Playdoh for 5 dollars, mix it all together at room temp and shoot it from 20 yards out with the Hades pellets. I shot them a 900-925 FPS into the Playdoh and they do expand to the point of 3 pedals and a central core. Yes they do work as advertised if shot into a more flexable material. Soap is not flexable, nor is wood, and I'm pretty sure that is why your tests didn't support JSBs expansion claims. Personally I don't use the Hades pellets for shots on pests or game at a distance of 50 yards or less and use the Daisy Hollow Points that are made now in Spain. $7 for 500 pellets a tin is hard to beat plus the expansion is insain compaired to the Hades at the same distance used. The Daisy however is a 50 yard pellet max distance due to its lower BC than the Hades and makes it perfect for pest control, maximum shock energy transfer with very low chance of pass throughs. Fortunatly the Hades in my guns has the same POI as the Daisy .22 15.4 grain HP and by just simply swapping magazines to a mag full of Hades, I can shoot out to 80 yards or better. The Hades expand as designed but I do think in a sub 12 FP gun that the Daisy's would be a far better choice by far for expansion and energy dumps on game.
Daisy and Gamo are under the same roof and the quality of the pellet now is very good. I have been using them in all of my .22 cal PCPs and Multi-pumps since April 2019, 26 tins ago to be percise, and was just looking for a cheaper pellet to share with the grandkids. Man am I glad I gave them a chance. 1" groups and less at 50 yards and in a FAC rifle at 900 FPS just explosive expansion due to the soft lead and v shaped deep hollow point. They have become my number one pellet in all my guns including the LCS SK-19 which really eats them up and tack drives them. English Sparrows literally explode when hit and it really does rain meat, feathers, and body parts when shot at 30 yards or less. Very loud impacts ...very loud! If you want to have more fun and even shoot a little farther with them, fill the tip with RTV silicone gasket maker and the hydraulic expansion becomes over the top crazy. I have a video on my youtube channel that shows a little of what I'm talking about if your curious. Super easy to make and fun with the kids. You are shooting a pellet that slows down very very fast, which is why I call it a 50 yard pellet. Take care bud. Thanks for the info and the video. I hope my comment will helps you with a better hunting pellet that is more humane and effective at closer distances. Take care and be safe.
Think you might have a tin that was in a batch that got dropped have had that in the past where out of the blue a tin wouldn't shoot
Good review 🤙
thanks!
Plumber's mait makes a good target medium. Cheaper than Plasticene, but sticky.
i'll look into it, thanks!
Temperature of the pellets and the soap?
Test the expansion in water, normally shows better results.
This is on the list of thing to aim at for the pt2 video i’ve now started planning. Along with a few other things. James
Where can I get them in CT here in the US
Isn’t it kind of unreasonable to expect a sub 12 ft-lb gun to shoot any pellets fast enough for any real useful expansion? Where I live we don’t have those restrictions so I’m not really familiar with such underpowered guns. Also, this is bizarre I’ve gotten way more expansion from the hades with slightly less power then he’s using with his higher power rifle. Strange.
No i’d say it was perfectly reasonable.... sub 12: regular hollow points still expand, dome heads expand, pellets like the h&n hornet still expand.... see where i’m going here? My tests even at higher powers proved disappointing and didn’t live up to the hype or what was claimed. The results were what they were, i tested them in much the same way as any other pellet and let the results speak for themselves. I’ve got a second tin, so we’ll see what happens with them.
ReplicaReviews okay I didn’t know those other pellets would actually expand at sub 12 ft/lb velocities. I didn’t mean to imply your review was not good more that you maybe got some wonky pellets sorry if that wasn’t clear. Hope you’re well
These are 22 CAL right
man all I can say is you must have got a bad batch of pellets cuz I've got the Hades pallets and they open up good and they're very accurate out of every gun I've got in 22 caliber I've got a daystate huntsman Regal I've got a wildcat Mark II I've got a Benjamin Marauder I've got a dream line classic and they fly grayed out of every gun I've got in a really accurate maybe you should give her another can of try
i think the quality of the pellets certainly is part the issue here... i'll be putting a pt 2 video together soon so will try and get a second tin to compare. james
what happends now if the EU ban lead shot ????
Ummmm - pass. Best hope brexit happens before we have to adopt it...
Only one way to test is on live quarry! With at least 20fpe then look for pellets?hard soap ridiculous!!!
Having simular experience.
Interesting to see there’s others out there.
Pointy things go quicker than blunts . You don't need to be an over- intelligent person to understand this. If you can chuck a blunt at high enough velocity, the blunt will do more damage. So the great airgun pellet debate seems rather pointless, if you pardon the pun.
Just like Baracuda Hunter Extremes, a gimmick imo, although the very first batch of 177 hunter extremes were incredible, both accurate to long range and made excellent power, now...poor.
i've not used those for years but i do remember my daystate loved them. used to work a treat! james
yes I agree, had some early Hunter extremes 177 awesome, but then the appearance changed slightly and accuracy was crap complained to H&N, received 6 replacement tins, a cap, tee shirt, brochure and an apology, however the new replacement pellets were also wildly inconsistent running 80 to 150 fps different from the original batch which varied 3 to 4 fps in my tuned 97, asked them what they changed, sent photos etc, never found out, so sold the whole lot and won't buy them again.
PG
Nelson
New Zealand
Any of my guns grouped like that and I would be selling them sharpish.
maybe soap is to soft try dead pigeon or chicken head or other light bone
For hades to work you need to shoot through bone,
And at close range targets.
Sorry but i think factually there you are incorrect.... hitting flesh will have a much better result than bone. We aimed at wood as shown which would have a similar result as its a lot harder than the soap - same results.
@@ReplicaReviews any chance of showing the pellet after going through wood,
Ah don't worry I'll bang some through my s510 sub and see for my self,
Did the Hades have plastic tape over the dome acting to seal the hollow point?
No?
Just
Gimmick IMO.
Good review....tried them all and it is what it is,normal domes,jsb,air arms Diablo,etc can’t be beaten in hunting.only other comment is must be a northern thing,no one ever wants a 177 to hunt,there useless....seen all those silly tests to...22 and up,the rest are paper punchers as the ft guys will tell you.plus the 177 takes no skill to master..learn with a springer and get a 22...now I’ve been controversial I’m off🤣🤣...wait for the flood gates of nuts who shoot rabbits at 80 yards with a 177🤣🤣🤣
Anytime I hear a British accent in any airgun video I just skip it. Anything under 12 fucking foot pounds isn't gonna do much in performance. Do yourselves a favor get a license to shoot high power or stick to bb guns.
The irony that it more than likely took you longer to type that comment than it did for me to explain that i’ll be doing a sub 12 test and a full power test - i’ll give you a hint, it was exactly 1 min..... “do yourself a favour” learn to actually watch more than 60 seconds of something and you comment. Then you might just be able to come up with a valued input....
Lmfaoo those groupings are trash my hw44 PISTOL HAS 6/8TH groupings at 40 yards. Zero excuse for an impact to have anything less than hole on hole. Especially at 40 yards I don't care of it's 8 foot pounds
I look forward to seeing you compete in the next olympics.
Thanks for the support I get sub Moa at 100 yards with my red Ryder bb rifle that has 2 foot pounds. So look out for the guy with the red Ryder
A shooting range for BB guns? Why? Can’t you just shoot it in your backyard or any vacant lot? To an American, this is weird.
Firstly its not a BB gun.... land to shoot over here is hard to find, so for some ranges like this offer them a route into the sport where they can then get to know people. Some have no interest in going out and are quite happy just using a small range / club. For me personally, despite having a large amount of land where i can shoot and hunt with my airguns / firearms - its much easier for me to film at ranges. There’s less wind to worry about filming wise, the tests are repeatable, and i can park the car right next to the range so less gear to shift around. My backyard is too small for me to do anything worth filming there, but if i want to get the pistols out or just plink out to say 10m then there’s nothing stopping me...
Counterfeit Hades
ha! i can assure you - these were genuine Hades pellets and all results shown were as they were.
Need to be chronographed at the same time or you are wasting your time
Very poor test two
different guns different power different conditions weather prone shooting bench shooting cold weather on soap makes it harder results will be so vastly different you won't be able to evaluate anything
out of a sub 12 lb air rifle.........yea right!!! thats not enuf energy to knock the fleas off of a gundar!!!!
Try watching past 1 min.... 🙄
Great vid'. I think hades are not good. Sub 12 AA s410.