what about those who chose to be seen as objects of desire? What about their rights? As long as a person understands what they're doing and don't hurt others, do whatever you want.
I laughed so hard at “If someone tells you it’s a sin to wear pants, then run far away, with those pants.” I agree with you. I’m not laughing at what was said it just hit funny.
"By no means are women to be allowed to uncover and exhibit any part of their bodies, lest both fall the men by being incited to look, and the women by attracting to themselves the eyes of men." - Clement of Alexandria (A.D 195), 2.246 "First, then, blessed sisters, take heed that you do not admit to your use flashy and sluttish garbs and clothing." - Tertullian (A.D 160-220), 4.22 "Let a woman wear a plain and becoming dress, but softer than what is suitable for a man. Yet, it should not be immodest or entirely steeped in luxury. And let the garments be suited to age, person, figure, natures, and pursuits." - Clement of Alexandria (A.D 195), 2.285 "Those who glory in their looks - not in their hearts - dress to please others" - Clement of Alexandria (A.D 195), 2.273 "But if any necessity arises, commanding the presence of married women, let them be well clothed - without by raiment, within by modesty." - Clement of Alexandria (A.D. 195) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.2 pg.252 "Paul proclaims in a loud and lofty voice, "But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world [Galatians 6:14-18]”. And yet a virgin in the Church glories concerning her fleshly appearance and the beauty of her body! Paul adds, and says, "For they that are Christ's have crucified their flesh, with its faults and lusts." And she who professes to have renounced the lusts and vices of the flesh, is found in the midst of those very things which she has renounced! Virgin, you are taken, you are exposed, you boast one thing and do another. You sprinkle yourself with the stains of carnal concupiscence, although you are a candidate of purity and modesty." St. Cyprian (A.D. 250) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.5 pg.431 "You call yourself wealthy and rich; but Paul meets your riches, and with his own voice prescribes for the moderating of your dress and ornament within a just limit. "Let women," said he, "adorn themselves with shamefacedness and sobriety, not with broidered hair, nor gold, nor pearls, nor costly array, but as becomes women professing chastity, with a good conversation. [1 Timothy 2:9-10] " Also Peter consents to these same precepts, and says, "Let there be in the woman not the outward adorning of array, or gold, or apparel, but the adorning of the heart. [1 Peter 3:3-4]" ... For the rest, if you dress your hair sumptuously, and walk so as to draw attention in public, and attract the eyes of youth upon you, and draw the sighs of young men after you, nourish the lust of concupiscence, and inflame the fuel of sighs, so that, although you yourself perish not, yet you cause others to perish, and offer yourself, as it were, a sword or poison to the spectators; you cannot be excused on the pretense that you are chaste and modest in mind. Your shameful dress and immodest ornament accuse you; nor can you be counted now among Christ's maidens and virgins, since you live in such a manner as to make yourselves objects of desire." St. Cyprian (A.D. 250) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.5 pg.432
Yeah, and to take this stance, we are going directly against St. Padre Pio and a decree by Pope Pius XII. I am not sure of the answer, but when people with the authority of God and the grace of God speak, I listen to them more closely. And also, as a man, I am full of joy when I see a woman taking sexuality seriously and helping me not sin. I appreciate it a great deal. If every woman walked around in long flowing skirts, my life would be much better and holier. I am not concluding I know the answer, but that is my experience.
This is soooo good!!! 💛 I am a Christian college girl and have made the decision to dress modestly, now for me it’s really about that change of heart: trying to cultivate God’s love and grace as close as possible in everything ELSE that I do.
this is so true .I never grew up knowing about modesty. Long story short, I left the church, and when I came back my conscience started telling me about modesty. Maybe it was a gift, I think now it was.
"Some days, Jacinta while in the hospital was very saddened by the worldliness of the visitors, the women dressed in fashionable clothes, often with low-cut dresses. 'What is it all for?' she asked Mother Godinho (her guardian). 'If they only knew what eternity is.'" -Blessed Jacinta Marto
Hi, I’m really curious where this quote is from? I looked up Blessed Jacinta Marto, and I’m interested in reading the rest of what you wrote, but can you please tell me the title?
I started wearing pants all the time when I began my career in childcare since they’re much easier to wear when caring for children. So pants actually enhances my feminine modesty. To each their own
@@witchf4ce310 that's kind of the problem, the more shape you show the more attention you will get. If you get married or are married you should try to save that for him as a gift of yourself to him as he would to you. I am still working on this and have a long way to go, but when people see that over and over again it takes away from your value as a beautiful creation of God and makes people ok with seeing you shapely exposed which is another way the sin progresses.
Lol run with the pants, I love that, I grew up forced to wear dresses for literally everything cz my family threatened that I would be in the state of mortal sin if I wore pants. I'm so happy to see Catholics that are actually Catholic
I know this might be super weird to ask. But my concern is from the fact that there has been story of saint Padre Pio refused to give absolution to women who wears pants and to a women who sell them unless she closes her business. It is also said that he did it because Our Lord told him to do so. I don’t know if this is true or not but since I suffered from scrupulosity, this piece of information caused anxiety very much since 90% of my wardrobe are jeans and shorts. What do you guys think about this ?
@@huyenvu851 Don't sweat about it and just wear your jeans and shorts. Just ensure the shorts is of appropriate length and decent, covering everything nicely. God bless
I loved this! I'm a member of another Christian denomination and loved how you got to the heart of modesty as an attitude and not just a dress code. Such a principle of modesty is applicable to men as much as women. Thanks for all you guys do!
Modesty doesn't change. We need to know what to wear depending where are going to be. Different dress "code" if we go to Church or go to the beach. And yes, modesty starts at the heart of each individual. If the way we dress is a cause of sin for others, then we need to do something about it.
Saint Ambrose in the 4th Century in Concerning Virgins book 3 says "Is anything SO conducive to lust as to expose in nakedness: to turn the neck, to loosen the hair was the next step an offense against God! For what modesty can there be?" Saint Augustine in the 5th Century describes the same thing "bosses of hair swelling forth is not only lacking in humility, but concerning chastity itself" meaning hair showing through the veil and the neck exposed was EXTREMELY sexual and so audacious and immodest!!! If modesty doesn't change, wear a burka and never show your hair and neck so as to be approved by your favorite Church fathers!
@@LizziesAnswers The term modest fashion or modest dressing refers to a fashion trend in women of wearing less skin-revealing clothes, specially in a way that satisfies their spiritual and stylistic requirements for reasons of faith, religion and personal preference.
This is soooo destructive. I will now go around obsessing over whether what I'm wearing is the right centimeter to please God. What are you saying quoting Our Lady with no comment? Ugh. Get a life.
@@ammcroft JMJ. No worries because Our Mother is so good! She knew what was going to happen, so essentially she had told her children to beware of the new fashions. And now it is plain for all to see all the impurity that surrounds us. I have had those same fears you have about pleasing God in dress. I have felt a TRUE peace about modesty ever since I started where below the knee skirts all the time!I know that sounds so crazy! I used to think that would be extreme, but you have to try it! You will feel better! It takes some getting used to and be prepared for skepticism from even family, but its worth it for Jesus! Also, if you want some truly awesome insight on modesty, check out Colleen Hammond!
@@NavajoLion I am happy you satisfied your scrupulous behavior. I'm sorry it took that to feel Jesus is finaly satisfied with you :/ Pope pious the 10 geuop are schismatic and not in line with God's Church. May He have mercy on your soul for causing good Catholics fear and doubt over a skirt. Sooo creepy!!!
Bongani Masango please study up before you go blasting Catholics about this. We do not worship Mary. Saying she is the mother of God is not worship. Do you believe Jesus is fully God and fully man? We do. Do you believe He is fully and completely a part of the Holy Trinity? We do. Do you believe the Holy Trinity is the ONE true God. We do. Why is it incorrect to call Mary the mother of God when she gave birth to the second person of the Blessed Trinity? We Are not saying she created Him. Obviously the Holy Spirit made it possible. Mary simply provided the physical material for Christ to be born to us. Christ is the only mediator between us and God, our forgiveness of sins by the cross, His resurrection, the unity of the Church. But if Mary had not been the means that God chose to bring Him into the world there would not be salvation (because God wanted to become fully man and thus was born into humanity). So Mary played a pivotal role in salvation history and should be honored because God CHOSE her to be so. The Holy Spirit inspired Elizabeth at the Visitation to say “blessed are you among women”. And so she is. Blessed. Not godly. Not worthy of adoration because only Christ is. But worthy of honor.
Bongani Masango do not take bible verses out of context. Go back just a little bit to Timothy 2:1. “Let supplications, prayers, intercessions*, and giving of thanks be made FOR all men”. Why would we ask anyone on earth to pray for us if we could not ask the saints in heaven to do the same? The saints do not perish once they die...they are in heaven with their immortal souls, standing before the throne of God, praying for us, but especially if we ask. We are not asking them to give us Gods grace or forgiveness or mercy, we are asking that they help us in praying that God grant it to us. Our plight to the saints in this way does not mean we stop praying for ourselves. We approach the throne of grace with confidence in asking for what we need but also asking others to make this plight for us. Think about this, the saints are forever in the presence of God in Heaven and they pray without ceasing, whereas if we try to pray for ourselves or ask an earthly friend to do so, we have lives to live and things to do so we cannot pray incessantly for ourselves as the saints can. They are there to help us. And if you read parts of revelations, the angels bring incense before God which are the prayers of Gods people. All of Gods people. Not just the living. All people. The prayers of the angels and the saints that are for us
Bongani Masango Remember, oh most gracious Virgin Mary, that never was it known, that anyone who fled to thy protection, implored thy help, or sought thy intercession was left unaided. Inspired by this confidence, we fly unto thee, o Virgin of virgins, our mother. To thee do we come, before thee we stand, sinful and sorrowful. O mother of the Word Incarnate, despise not our petitions, but in thy mercy, hear and answer me. >Basically saying, Mary, you are full of grace and you find favor with God (that’s in the Bible) so nobody has ever been known to ask for your help and prayers and be turned away because God holds you in high esteem for your titles as “blessed among women” and “mother of the Word Incarnate”. We trust that you will bring our petitions before God despite our sinful state and not turn us away< Think of it this way. Everything Mary does is like a magnifying glass. What does a magnifying glass do? It does not create anything, but rather takes what is already there and makes it bigger. Mary’s role has always been to bring glory to God in everything she does and is. Everything she does and says in the Bible points to Him. We do not go to her as God. We just trust that she will show us more of who God is by magnifying Him. After all, who knows Jesus better than her, His mother, who helped raise Him, who was there as His follower from birth to death? We ask her to show us parts of Christ that only she knows in the hopes of more fully praising Him
I see where you’re coming from but that saying puts the thought into her head that your daughter is above other girls because she dresses modestly when in fact, Jesus views all women as having equal value and beauty and we should all strive to view other women the same way and not as “trash”... just something to think about
I'm from Brazil and here they teach us that obviously we can't wear tight pants, but we can wear baggy pants or any clothes that don't make us indecent and don't make others sin, we have to ask ourselves: "would our mother Mary wear this if live in our times?" It's a great question to know what to wear.
I always ask myself one question: WOULD OUR MOTHER MARY WEAR THIS, IF SHE LIVED IN OUR TIMES?... I just can't imagine Her in tight jeans...That's why I try to wear pretty and modest dresses:) God bless you and may the Virgen Mary guide you!
Thanks for the video. In these times of "bodycon" dressing and "why not" attitudes and "free the nipple" movements, it's good that you gave solid, grounding evidence. I wish I could find your Part2 on this...
Wow this is great! All the time I see people in Mass just not covered.. whether it be a short skirt, shirt or dress.. and sometimes shorts or low cut shirt. I get so irritated but like you said they may not 'know' and we need to have patience. ♡ thank you! I needed that!
Hello, I want to talk as a girl, a girl who hours a go had an incident, as I was walking home with my friends, a boy took advantage from me and lift up my skirt, I wasn't even wearing a tight or short skirt, but even thou I felt horrible as if my dignity was taken away, he ran away and I couldn't do anything to defend myself, I want to stan for the rights of women, women who feel abused as me like today, because we can wear normal clothes and feel happy and not abused like I felt, I want everybody to respect and love their neighbor, I hope someone can take something from my story.
It's true that modesty is a virtue, Amen! Pope Pius has recommended the faithful to think "Mary-like dressing". So thinking would our Blessed Mother wear this or that. When it comes to wearing pants the masonic temple have been the ones to infiltrate this type of dressing. It's important to know when and why this was introduced to society! The other thing to is that Padre Pio wouldn't even hear someone's confession if they weren't wearing a skirt at least 8 inches and had their head covered. Of course it's important to be prudent and discern in our time what our Lord is calling us to in terms of modesty. However, it's crucial to know the church's stance on dress code from the past. God bless you!
This video just seems to say... Modesty isn't all about clothing, But you should dress modestly, But it's a heart thing so it doesn't matter, But modesty is relative. It's okay to say some clothing is not okay for Catholics to wear. Hurt feelings < salvation of souls.
@XvX XvX you got to start somewhere. We might think is a shallow and basic, but I know a lot of people who's fist steps into the fullness of truth where through content like this.
@@peterthooft3823 that may be sad and true, but the saints had no problem proclaiming the truth without mixing in PC, they just explained it in a way that people could understand and appreciate
If you observe Jackie in her talks readily available on TH-cam and in these videos, its obvious what she thinks women should wear. Never low cut shirts, not wearing sheer items and clothes that are not super tight hugging the curves.
100% Spot on. A very big issue I see, is that this topic is always vague and unclear, I think people would appreciate transparency and direct communication rather than games to not hurt someones feelings
And a virture like modesty doesn't happen overnight. For example, it may take slowly rotating less modest pieces of a wardrobe out until you feel more confident and comfortable with your discernment of the virtue. Great explanation, Jackie!
I should take the plank out of my before saying so, but i thought it was strongly implied that modest dress was to be like Mary. Mary never appeared in any approved apparitions in dress from our times. She always dresses in a way that conceals her figure for the majority without losing feminine beauty, grace, and mystery. Pope Pius the 10th and 11th both addressed this, as well as Pope Nicholas who spoke to a certain Scandinavian tribe that all wore pants. The pants they wore however were very concealing. He said it was alright since it was a custom, HOWEVER he also stated that as members of Christ's mystical body we should acclimate to His standards and not the Church to ours
The Church allows us to believe in certain Marian apparitions, but does not require us to do so. The church does not base doctrine on apparitions. It is interesting to analyze why the Blessed Mother shows herself to us looking certain ways, though. I love how she is always recognizable as a woman or a mother, but looks like the people she is appearing to. When she lived, I’m sure she dressed modestly according to her culture.
@@clairekurdelak2913 Mary as the Mother of God and purest of all creations should still be our guide. There had never been a very strict need for standards regarding dress because it was intrinsic in all developed studious cultures. Basic catechism (which has been promoted by most popes through the ages) and the study of the fruits if The Holy Spirit and the effects of virtue vs sin are part of the doctrine of the Church through the Divine infusion of knowledge and understanding. Many Doctors of the Church and other Saints given to such deep learning (i am a long way off from that) have read the Bible and learned of God's wisdom and gifts. It is doctrine, but in such God's simple way.
“A dress cannot be called decent which is cut deeper than two fingers breadth under the pit of the throat; which does not cover the arms at least to the elbows; and scarcely reaches a bit beyond the knees. Furthermore, dresses of transparent materials are improper.” (The Cardinal Vicar of Pope Pius XI).
Mother Angelica has a great video on modesty. I'm going to quote her. "Some of you are going to get peeved at me tonight but I'd rather have you go to heaven peeved than somewhere else very happy. Nobody tells you because they're afraid to hurt your feelings. " I'm thankful for the women who have been willing to "hurt my feelings" out of concern for my soul and the souls of others. Another quote from that holy and courageous woman "We cannot be the occasions we have to repair for." I recommend watching the entire video.
The thing you have to remember is that it isn't just about you. We are called to be the light of the world. "So if the light in you is darkness, how terribly dark it will be!" We have been given wonderful gifts for which we should be thankful to God always, and modesty is one such gift. With every gift comes a commensurate responsibility, and we are called to use these gifts in an appropriate manner, serving one another in love, not abusing our liberties for the sake of personal pride or selfishness. Even though everything were allowed, not everything is good, nor helpful. If there is anything I am doing that causes a brother or sister to sin, I should avoid it at any cost, as I would rather be tied to the bottom of the ocean by an anchor around my neck than to cause even a single person to stumble in their faith. To do otherwise would be of the spirit of Cain, who when "The LORD asked Cain, 'Where is your brother Abel?' He answered, 'I don't know. Am I supposed to take care of my brother?'" Let us all act in such a way that when the Master returns, he will be able to say to each of us instead "Well done, good and faithful servant!" Matthew 18:6 “If anyone should cause one of these little ones to lose his faith in me, it would be better for that person to have a large millstone tied around his neck and be drowned in the deep sea. How terrible for the world that there are things that make people lose their faith! Such things will always happen-but how terrible for the one who causes them! Romans 14:19 So then, we must always aim at those things that bring peace and that help strengthen one another. 1 Corinthains 8:9 Be careful, however, not to let your freedom of action make those who are weak in the faith fall into sin. Suppose a person whose conscience is weak in this matter sees you, who have so-called “knowledge,” eating in the temple of an idol; will not this encourage him to eat food offered to idols? And so this weak person, your brother for whom Christ died, will perish because of your “knowledge”! And in this way you will be sinning against Christ by sinning against other Christians and wounding their weak conscience. So then, if food makes a believer sin, I will never eat meat again, so as not to make a believer fall into sin. 1 Corinthians 9:19 I am a free man, nobody's slave; but I make myself everybody's slave in order to win as many people as possible. 1 Corinthians 10:23 “We are allowed to do anything,” so they say. That is true, but not everything is good. “We are allowed to do anything”-but not everything is helpful. None of you should be looking out for your own interests, but for the interests of others. Galatians 5:13 As for you, my friends, you were called to be free. But do not let this freedom become an excuse for letting your physical desires control you. Instead, let love make you serve one another. For the whole Law is summed up in one commandment: “Love your neighbor as you love yourself.” Ephesians 5:3 Since you are God's people, it is not right that any matters of sexual immorality or indecency or greed should even be mentioned among you. Nor is it fitting for you to use language which is obscene, profane, or vulgar. Rather you should give thanks to God. You may be sure that no one who is immoral, indecent, or greedy (for greed is a form of idolatry) will ever receive a share in the Kingdom of Christ and of God. Ephesians 5:6 Do not let anyone deceive you with foolish words; it is because of these very things that God's anger will come upon those who do not obey him. So have nothing at all to do with such people. You yourselves used to be in the darkness, but since you have become the Lord's people, you are in the light. So you must live like people who belong to the light, for it is the light that brings a rich harvest of every kind of goodness, righteousness, and truth.
DuncanDeez thank you! I think you put it best: “It’s not just about you” and those bible verses illustrate that super well! It’s sad that we seem to be depending on a culture that’s barely Christian for moral guidance on modesty when God has given us the answers. The most terrifying thing I’ve heard about modesty, which is supposedly a virtue, is that it depends on the culture. That doesn’t sound logical to me.
@@amyj4283 I agree. I can't reconcile the idea apparently presented in this video that modesty is culturally relative with the words of Paul who says "Do not conform yourselves to the standards of this world, but let God transform you inwardly by a complete change of your mind" (Romans 12:2). Although the Catechism of the Catholic Church does state in 2524 that "the forms taken by modesty vary from one culture to another," it also goes on to affirm that "everywhere, however, modesty exists as an intuition of the spiritual dignity proper to man". So to my understanding, there are different expressions of the same universal intuition. To say what was heavily implied in the video, that there are some cultures or situations in which no clothing at all is a form of modesty is, at least in my opinion, a far departure from the Catechism's definition of modesty that "inspires one's choice of clothing" rather than affirming one's choice of whether to wear any clothing at all.
DuncanDeez yeah I agree. I think making modesty such a relativistic matter drains it of its moral and theological implications. I was under the impression that God is the standard regarding what is modest and not this increasingly anti Christian culture we live in today. We should definitely discern and ask god to help us dress in a way that purifies our and our neighbors souls. There are soo many differences between cultures and there always has been. But doesn’t truth exist outside and inspire of those differences? Meaning culture doesn’t dictate what is true but rather truth should dictate the culture we create? And haven’t people realized that saying “it’s (insert year)” is not a moral argument and neither is “well different cultures don’t do this and not that”? Lol Father Mike will be at my college today :)
Could you make a video about woman who feel called to not where pants. I felt called right from the begging of my conversion to stop using pants. Only recently have I found the courage to act. I don’t believe it’s sinful to where pants, since the church has never stated that. It has become a type of Marian devotion for me just like the chapel veil. It would be nice to see you have a dialogue with a woman who only uses skirts or dresses, because their are many young woman who feel called to this practice of modesty but are afraid to do so.
I love that you taught this in such a different manner than is typical. It is vastly different than a majority of Christian modesty talks in the best way possible. It never really crossed my mind that modestly is more than what we wear because that’s the only way it has ever been presented to me.
When the Catholic missionaries went to convert some African tribes that still practiced nudism, they required them to abandon this practice if the tribe wanted to accept the Catholic faith. The Catholic moral teaching does not change (is not relative), only people's perceptions of it change.
This video essentially makes the argument that when it comes to exposing the flesh, "if everyone is doing it, it's okay". This reasoning is never a justification for any aspect of the moral life, and modesty is no different -- and it's also never been (and still is not) the position of the Church. When missionary saints went to different native tribes to evangelize them, they would move on when a tribe refused to abandon its custom of public nudity.
robertjos - Not Just Rome. Pretty much all the cathedrals in Europe. At least the ones I went to. I spent a college semester in Rome and we went to the Pope’s general audience. I’m sure that I’d been told the rules about clothing before I packed, but I guess it wasn’t forefront in my mind when I was packing. I packed a below the knee length skirt and I had a top that matched it, so I packed that. A couple of days before we went to the general audience, I realized that my top had cap sleeves. It fully covered my shoulders, but not my arms. So I had to shop for another top. The only one I could find wasn’t much better than the first one, but it covered part of my arms. I wore it and they let me in, so I guess it was ok, but I was a bit self conscious.
What a joke that is.The Vatican could care less if people are wearing tank tops and yoga pants to mass all over the world but they are worried about shorts in St Peter’s!
RScott Logan - I think you can wear shorts in St. Peter’s. They probably just have to be long, like knee length. That is not the place to wear your Daisy Duke’s.
RScott Logan the Church has upheld many traditions in that part of the world, including covering oneself as much as possible in Mass. The Western Hemisphere has, whether for the worse, I don’t know, deviated from that and has a different culture of dress in Mass. But the Church leaves it to ones culture and choice what to wear. Of course it would not be condoned necessarily to wear yoga pants to Mass but the reason that is is because what is the purpose of wearing them out in public? If it is to get the attention of others, that is a form of vanity. So that’s a no. The flip side to that would be yoga pants that are covered in some way so as not to draw attention of others in public or away from the Eucharist in Mass. Just like the video was saying, there is an element of culture that Mass attire is left to
I respect this video, but I do have to say that imho, it’s an idealized notion of modesty as it applies to our times, but isn’t really applicable because a lot of Catholics lack modesty, in dress, heart and action. Modesty does start in the heart and works outward. Having said that, I do think there should be guidelines for men and women when it pertains to dressing for worship at mass. I am sick and tired of seeing pants so tight I can see all sorts of nooks and crannies in the ahem... crotch area and behind area of women at mass, in tired of bare shoulders, bare chest, bare back. Im tired of skin tight shirts and bare stomachs, I’m tired of people having the nerve to wear pajamas and uggs to mass- and this goes for men as well, not just women. We are human, we will be distracted if we see something that calls our eyes attention (good or bad). If we are at mass to worship the Most High at the Sacrifice of the Holy Mass, why do so many think it’s okay to detract from it In their dress? We should make an effort to remove all attention from us and focus on why we are at worship, and that should apply to dress. I was convicted to veil and wear dresses, because I wanted to detract from me while I glorify the Most High King.
A dress code like the one you describe is classist. Not everyone has the resources to be able to dress that way for Mass and those that do not have every right to still make it to Mass. And respectfully, you are at Mass to worship and glorify God, not judge outfits. You have no idea what another person is going through. Perhaps they haven’t been to Mass in decades, or they are struggling with mental illness, or they’re a student and have been studying all night, or they are struggling with their faith and find it hard to even step foot in the church, or any of the other million of reasons that they are unable to dress up to your standards. Be kind to your brothers and sisters.
Jackie, thank you. Modesty is a beautiful virtue and yet its meaning is getting distorted by some fanatical voices. When my sister and I started a dress company, Paris Bloom, we set out to design classy dresses women can wear to church, work and everywhere in between. Even though we follow the guidelines for modesty as illustrated outside St. Peter's Basilica we've still received a deluge of messages saying our dresses are immodest because they don't alll cover the elbows and you could see some knees and collarbones in our pictures. Provocative clothing sexualizes women, but so does a prudish/gnostic approach. God made the female form and it's beautiful. We shouldn't exploit our bodies but we also shouldn't be ashamed of them. Thank you for the reminder - virtue is in the middle!
Amen 🙏 like she said the church does not have that rule because we are catholic and have to consider other cultural background. I love celebrating our femininity because it is from God .
What are you talking about? There have always been dress codes for mass at a bare minimum. You are also conflating the virtue of modesty with purity of heart. Two different things.
But mass is a very specific "time and place". You could argue a very specific culture. So of course, while wearing a modest bathing suit to the beach is appropriate for that setting, you would never wear a bathing suit to mass. Hope this makes sense, and sorry for replying to a year old comment!
The New Mass or Novus Ordo is another Protestant Sect. ~ “A dress cannot be called decent which is cut deeper than two fingers breadth under the pit of the throat; which does not cover the arms at least to the elbows; and scarcely reaches a bit beyond the knees. Furthermore, dresses of transparent materials are improper.” (The Cardinal Vicar of Pope Pius XI).
I have seen and read all types of different kinds of "modesty" from the Marian Modesty Movement to people who think modesty is solely cultural so you can do whatever you want. My opinion (which you can take with a grain salt) is that there should be something kind of guidelines (not rules with sins attached) on how to dress modestly maybe they could made by each country's bishops and cardinals. This way we would at the very least have guidelines on what and is not modest. But of course there would be exceptions if you could not afford to change your entire wardrobe overnight. As a few other people said here some people have very, and I mean very tight budgets that don't allow for new clothes to be purchased. Another thing which I don't know if anyone has heard or read but I thought there was a study done which found that men thought about sex more when women wore skirts because of the swaying motion of skirts and dresses? If anyone has anyone info on this please pass it along. One last thing, this is sort of from an article I read on Catholic Answers website. It said that women are supposed to imitate Mary and her virtues. We are not called to mimic her. Which a lot of people seem to mix up beucase if we are all called to mimic Jesus and Mary then we should be living like they did in 1st century Palestine, we shouldn't even have technology! Thanks for reading if you made it this far! I hope to hear from you in the reply section! God bless ~ Rockfeather
I think the guidelines set by men in each country would be a little too much, because it's very subjective. My parish just tells us to wear smart casual and most people generally get the hint. As for your skirt comments, I do remember reading about how men think about sex more because of the 'easy access'. How disgusting!
@@hitthefries I was just thinking that maybe we haven't lost modesty so much as we have lost the sense to dress for occasion, like only you best clothes at Mass, workout stuff to the gym, and pjs for bed. About skirts yes that is disgusting but I thinking more how people seem to think that skirts are more modest then pants. But if skirts cause men to have more bad thoughts then pants do, shouldn't women wear pants? ~ Rockfeather
This topic is very important because a lot of ppl don't think that what you wear talks alot about you. It can contradict the msg you're trying to convey. Women can be the cause of sin to men, I feel sorry for them because here they are trying to meet with God at church and instead they end up meeting the devil. Dressing appropriately at all times is key, lets stop idealizing celebrities and start idealizing our true holy heroes.
Wearing yoga pants is absolutely immodest! The church has always tought that we have a responsibility to not lead our fellow man into temptation. Also, Jesus says in the Matthews gospel "Temptations to sin will inevitably occur but woe to those through whom they occur"
Oh the way of God amazes me it was just today that I asked myself what modestiy really means to me and to the catholic church. I guess thanks Jackie, for following Gods will so His timing can be on point :D
If modesty varies from culture to culture then why did Adam and Eve cover themselves when they realized they were naked? Aren’t they the parents of humanity and therefore all culture?
They recognized from their first sin that they were now prone to a variety of others. God teaches them how to make clothes later since He could see in the future that that would easily become z dilemma
Yes, I agree. Those people my be ignorant of their sin and I believe the blood would cover that *because it's sin.* Modernity (in relation to the fall) has normalized immodesty and disguises it as cultural and subjective. Walking around naked is presuming an innocence that the Bible says doesn't exist. Everytime naked is used in the Bible it is in a negative sense.
@@Raminakai Before the fall there was nothing wrong with being naked. The church fathers even say they were clothed by glory. After the fall naked is always negative.
@@Raminakai You got me. Obviously I meant you can't take a shower right? We're obviously speaking in the context of public nudity. Luke 8:27 Nudity is seen as living like a wild animal. mostly spoken of in a negative light. Rev 3:17 Nakedness was used as a criticism. Rev 16:15 Just like God clothes our spirits in righteousness, we should also clothe our bodies. 1 Corinthians 11:15 Women have an natural veil.
Maybe thats because immodest fashion also targets women much more than men. Just look at how men dressed 100 years ago... not that much different from today. Of course there's some cases, but I believe not for the most part. Whereas the way many women dress today would be absolutely scandalous 100 years ago.
Gabriela Using your same argument, I disagree completely. Men walk around shirtless all the time. Go to any beach and there are plenty of men dressing what would be considered scandalous 100 years ago.
Modesty is never just directed at women in my experience. My parents always taught me the same standards of modesty as my sister. Whenever I see a guy dressed in little clothing, I tell him to cover up. The main problem (I think) is the highly sexualized and Liberal culture that we live in today. Men are shirtless in movies and the majority of women LOVE that. Women are scantily-clad in movies and the majority of men LOVE that. Sex sells and our society is more about promoting sexual liberty than it is about virtue. We have lost our way. I hate to generalize, but I guarantee you that the majority of women are more ok with a man being shirtless in public than another woman being shirtless in public when several decades ago, both would have been unacceptable.
As a young unmarried Christian woman, I'm still trying to figure out the appropriate context for things like warm weather out with friends or at the beach - what do you think about crop tops in certain contexts/bikinis out with the girls? From a heart posture of I'm dressing to express not attracting people on purpose or looking for anything from them regarding my fashion. Also, what about bellybutton peircings? Obviously, you won't wear a crop top in every context or bikini, but it's seems like it's appropriate to the situation and context at times. Any thoughts?
Hey Jackie, thank you so much for making a video on this topic! Can you please clarify something with me...when you brought up the point how modesty varies depending on the culture it confused me. Can you please clarify in that statement wether or not you mean that if our modern culture here in North America considers it fine to wearing things like crop tops, see through shirts with no bras or lingerie as a top that is okay as long as us as a society finds it acceptable? Can you please clarify this? My understanding of modesty in addition to the virtue is also in service and out of love for our brothers in Christ and protecting the dignity of the person so it is hard for me to imagine & wrap my head around what you’re saying about how modesty needs to be discerned? I may be way off base here but I don’t think you meant to imply that we should “only reveal what you want & are comfortable with” because that is already what our society does. Please let me know what you think, I would love some clarification! Thank you!
Ashely Quinn great comment! I don’t have an answer because my question is similar to yours. I also get very confused when I hear that modesty isn’t necessarily objective and that it depends on the culture. The problem I see with this view is 1) the culture is always changing, and 2) another reason modesty is so important is so that we don’t lead one another to sin; (like you said out of love for our brothers and sisters); if that is an objective standard, modesty must be also. I’m admittedly not a very modest person myself but I’ve grown more aware of how I dress and more guilty of how I dress, but I usually hear a lot of “it depends on the culture” (and how I dress is culturally appropriate) and less “dress in a way that won’t lead another to sin” so that they don’t constantly have to “pluck their eyes out” to avoid looking at you in a sinful nature (obviously that’s hard to measure but I wonder if it’s a better direction than saying it’s cultural because at some point we will have to be countercultural ok this issue).
Crop tops etc are common, but it doesn't mean it's modest in the US. For example, these women wouldn't wear it in court, or workplaces. When she said it's dependent on the culture, she was most likely referring to their expectations of modesty, not what's common attire. There is a difference. For example, it's immodest to show your calves in the middle East. Over here it's fine.
leal i don’t think that’s what she wants to imply about modesty. Is immodesty objective? Does it even exist? If it does, is it only because it’s not acceptable?This seems like a ridiculous standard and there’s no moral objectives to it. Can we draw a definitive line between modesty and immodesty? Does the nature of the man changes as culture changes (ONLY if that is the case is modesty dependent on culture). Will there be a point where we can all dress like Rihanna (showing most of our bodies) and be modest? If modesty is dependent on culture, the answer should be yes. Will there be time when showing most of our bodies will not lead men to sin? I don’t believe so, but I’m open to having my mind changed. What is rapidly becoming acceptable is women showing as much of their chest as possible. Like I said, at some point and it may be too late, we will have to start becoming countercultural.
leal you gave the example that it is immodest to show your calves in the Middle East but it’s not here. My problem with accepting this world view is that this is a very relativistic way of looking at the argument. You want to look at the biggest argument against Christianity? There it is. It may be true that it is CONSIDERED immodest to not cover your knees in the Middle East. But is it? Just like in some places it is acceptable to kill or even rape and it’s not considered acceptable here. That has no implications on the morality of rape or murder. It just means it’s acceptable some places and not others. But it’s still wrong to kill and rape. My point using this example to show illustrate that we have to go beyond “it’s acceptable here and not there” mentality to determine what’s good and bad. But if modesty IS relative and cultural, then what use do I have for it?
leal @H_owar123 I think what the point of the “cultural” standard is here is that in different cultures men will look at women differently because of what is normal. (Or women to men, either way) If a woman in the Middle East shows more of her body than is normal, that will be the focus of ones “judgement” or “perception” of her. This is immodest because, unless she does not know what was supposed to be culturally appropriate, she is drawing the attention of others to something about her other than her character. In the US, it seems like it’s culturally okay to wear crop tops and short shorts, but whats the objective behind it? Usually it is to get people to look at your body (again, unless someone doesn’t realize that is what it does). So in most contexts, girls wear these types of things to get the attention of another, but it is drawing another’s focus off of who she is meant to portray which is Christ, so it is considered scandalous in a way because it is leading others away from God. I agree that relativism, the “this is right for me” mentality, is a huge problem. But the Catholic Church is universal on this base level, that man and woman should dress so as to not bring focus away from God and to not lead others to dishonor or disrespect his or her body, and in turn dishonoring the soul, which is, in a way, the “divine” part that God has given us.
I've been catcalled and whistled at while wearing t-shirts and jeans without an inkling of skin outside of my hands and face. I'm all for Modesty as my God calls it, but its advocates-especially within the Catholic Church-have to stop using the excuse that it'll divert unwanted sexual attention. It won't.
@@rosaryforfamily3984 Aren't we willing to ignore bad reasons for promoting modesty. In case you haven't watched, she did a fantastic job with explaining modesty and its necessity today, and I am still striving for modesty myself, but not for the lie that I listed above that is still unfortunately promoted in some religious cultures and unfortunately in this comment section too. Have a good day.
Modesty is supposed to help, but you can't keep others from choosing to sin. The main goal in your case is to keep up your side, and leave the rest to God. Some people are like that, and desperately need prayers. Not everyone is on the same plain of understanding or personal growth. I hope in God's intervention and saving grace.
Turn the other cheek doesn’t mean abuse tolerance, whether it’s from family, significant other, friend etc. hate the sin not the sinner but you’re also able to distance from the sin. I think this applies to those “thinking it’s anti Christian to cut off toxic people”
"The body isn't bad, it is sooo good". This is exactly what Satan says to start every lustful temptation. He quotes truths to lead us to evil. If only women today had the humility to listen to men instead of creating their own reality of the male mind.
Bordering on relativism. Careful. Also, when a Pope decree guidelines, especially for the western world, in obedience we are to adhere to them. Following Jackie’s logic could be very dangerous to souls. Also, yes, even though modesty begins in the heart, given prudence, temperance, culture considerations, and the fact that there is objective truth, there are rules we could deduce both generally and for our particular culture.
Lol the church borders on relativism working in a coherence theory of truth. I’m sure non believers also believe in objective truth that doesn’t align with yours. Your comment was almost intelligent.
I grew up as an Independent Baptist. The greatest irony in that movement was its criticism of legalistic religion coupled with the intensely strict modesty codes placed on women
Hey if someone can please answer me this question. I’m a Zumba instructor/dancer, if I’m only wearing a sports bra or a crop top during those times , is that wrong ?
I think that we should chase modesty in all environments, if it’s possible you could just wear a tank top over or something. You also have to take a look at what your intentions are in what you’re wearing.
I get sooo scrupulous about this. Like, "I shouldn't go to confession if I am wearing jeans" or something. Im not talking about skin tight jeans and I usually try to wear a shirt that covers the NOT skin tight bottom. Ugh. Comments on here seem not good for a scrupulous mom of 4 who loves Jesus. I am married cetainly don't have a desire to have men think immodestly about me...This helps but I think I will always be paranoid about whether I should be only wearing skirts to the ground every where. I always wear a skirt to the ground or at least below the knee to Mass. I do think the tight pencil skirts that have a slit up the back are pushing it for Mass.
Lack of modesty is still sinful for non-Christians, because it reflects the state of the heart, mind, and soul. But some are just unaware without being vain or malicious.
@Jackie, I like the way you said that:” you fell in love with Jesus and started realizing what you were doing wrong…” this reminds me of a couple who were told that by eating a fruit they would become gods but this actually showed them their nakedness . they tried to hide it in vain… Although they were banned, God himself clothed them and therefore become the first custom tailor: “The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them” (Genesis 3:21). If am not wrong, it’s Fr Mike. S who said that “stopping to sin will not probably get you closer to God but getting closer to God will surely stop you from sinning.” The Holy Spirit being a wise and lovely teacher will keep teaching each and everyone at one’s own pace. That scene with your former teacher was a key point for you but it shows that much emphasis is put on women, we need more efforts to help raise real Christian gentlemen who will not deny their weaknesses nor hide them but offer them to Christ who will send His spirit to rule over their bodies. As Jesus said: it’s not what goes into…
The tribal woman is not modest in her own way. She is ignorant of what modesty is. Also just because something is a discipline and can change doesn't always mean it should. The Church in her wisdom, through the popes of the past, instructed the faithful in the way they did for a reason. Before we discount the discipline, we should understand why it existed in the first place. To disregard these words of the popes as "old news" is a very modernist approach. The truth is unchanging and the value of our bodies does not change according to time or place or culture. I don't disagree with some of the ideas here but overall there is a lot of doublethink and relativism in this video.
I'm a lab technician, I can't wear dresses, skirts, low high heels, open shoes etc for safety reasons, just pants, non-slippery shoes, lab coat and tied up hair. And still I'm modest at my work place and at home when I'm wearing my dresses, low high heels and lose hair.
hi, Jackie! in your next video can you perhaps give us advice as to how to dress modestly in a modern way? I think I know how, but it might be of help to others. thank you 😘😘
@@athena6653 actually, everything she explained was based on PC doctrine, Protestant/Catholic if you please. She was saying to walk in the middle. She did not explain that we are already on one side of the extremes. I am not the best at modesty, i am still working on it, but the fact is that if there aren't any "set rules" then why would modesty be a problem in the first place?
Another question. If modesty lies in the culture, say I, being Western, visit this African tribe where topless is modest. Should they then conform to my standards because, modesty? If this is the case, we have to conform to the most extreme forms of modesty because there are more extreme forms.
Super Mariocraft Gaming that’s a great comment! If modesty does in fact lie in the culture I would assume it would be immodest for you to dress too contrary to how they dress. Or at least it would be immodest if they believe it is. Now, I’m completely confused on what modesty even is and why it’s even a church teaching when it’s the culture that sets the standards and not God.
For African tribes it isn't modesty, it's necessity. It's not the same thing. The circumstances they are in forces them to dress like that. You don't have that sort of pressure exerted on you, even if you were to visit them.
@@amyj4283 Because normally culture would be based on the objective standards of religion. It's only until recently that this has changed, in late 19th century. When Europe killed God, as Nietzsche would say. Before that culture was synonymous with religion, but after abandoning God man made his own culture, based upon his own "objective" standards.
It occurs to me that the people fuming about women wearing trousers have never had the experience of parenthood. The mother of a toddler should not have to chase after children in a skirt, it just slows her down and leaves her exhausted. I know, times gone by, warra warra... women no longer need big skirts to hide bulky sanitary wear, they should be able to wear what's helpful. South Asian cultures had women wearing trousers (under skirts) for centuries, and they were obsessed with modesty.
The same with European dress, it wasn't all skirts and legs. However both cultures still survived and ran after their kids in dresses. As easy as it is to have kids wear the easiest outfit, it isn't often conducive to a modest character, if you don't teach them from the start what then?
@@Loreman72 i understand, and Pope Nicolas even wrote to a scandinaviantribe who all wore pants that it wasn't a problem. However, he also said as members of Christ's church we should try to conform with His standards. Trousers in and of themselves aren't always immodest, but the problem with todays society vs that tribe is that our usage of trousers is part of rebellious fashion, that is to say the 'equality fashion'. Men and women wear pants in the name of equality and pride and it distorts the lines between the sexes. They have their uses, but in todays society its a dangerous game
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This is authentic feminism: when you choose to stop being an object, and become a person with dignity.
AMEN!!!
Yes!!!
Couldn't have said it better! 💪🏻💜
what about those who chose to be seen as objects of desire? What about their rights? As long as a person understands what they're doing and don't hurt others, do whatever you want.
Definitely authentic femininity 👸 Let your lights shine!
I laughed so hard at “If someone tells you it’s a sin to wear pants, then run far away, with those pants.” I agree with you. I’m not laughing at what was said it just hit funny.
"By no means are women to be allowed to uncover and exhibit any part of their bodies, lest both fall the men by being incited to look, and the women by attracting to themselves the eyes of men." - Clement of Alexandria (A.D 195), 2.246
"First, then, blessed sisters, take heed that you do not admit to your use flashy and sluttish garbs and clothing." - Tertullian (A.D 160-220), 4.22
"Let a woman wear a plain and becoming dress, but softer than what is suitable for a man. Yet, it should not be immodest or entirely steeped in luxury. And let the garments be suited to age, person, figure, natures, and pursuits." - Clement of Alexandria (A.D 195), 2.285
"Those who glory in their looks - not in their hearts - dress to please others" - Clement of Alexandria (A.D 195), 2.273
"But if any necessity arises, commanding the presence of married women, let them be well clothed - without by raiment, within by modesty." -
Clement of Alexandria (A.D. 195) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.2 pg.252
"Paul proclaims in a loud and lofty voice, "But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world [Galatians 6:14-18]”. And yet a virgin in the Church glories concerning her fleshly appearance and the beauty of her body! Paul adds, and says, "For they that are Christ's have crucified their flesh, with its faults and lusts." And she who professes to have renounced the lusts and vices of the flesh, is found in the midst of those very things which she has renounced! Virgin, you are taken, you are exposed, you boast one thing and do another. You sprinkle yourself with the stains of carnal concupiscence, although you are a candidate of purity and modesty." St. Cyprian (A.D. 250) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.5 pg.431
"You call yourself wealthy and rich; but Paul meets your riches, and with his own voice prescribes for the moderating of your dress and ornament within a just limit. "Let women," said he, "adorn themselves with shamefacedness and sobriety, not with broidered hair, nor gold, nor pearls, nor costly array, but as becomes women professing chastity, with a good conversation. [1 Timothy 2:9-10] " Also Peter consents to these same precepts, and says, "Let there be in the woman not the outward adorning of array, or gold, or apparel, but the adorning of the heart. [1 Peter 3:3-4]" ... For the rest, if you dress your hair sumptuously, and walk so as to draw attention in public, and attract the eyes of youth upon you, and draw the sighs of young men after you, nourish the lust of concupiscence, and inflame the fuel of sighs, so that, although you yourself perish not, yet you cause others to perish, and offer yourself, as it were, a sword or poison to the spectators; you cannot be excused on the pretense that you are chaste and modest in mind. Your shameful dress and immodest ornament accuse you; nor can you be counted now among Christ's maidens and virgins, since you live in such a manner as to make yourselves objects of desire." St. Cyprian (A.D. 250) Ante-Nicene Fathers vol.5 pg.432
Yeah, and to take this stance, we are going directly against St. Padre Pio and a decree by Pope Pius XII. I am not sure of the answer, but when people with the authority of God and the grace of God speak, I listen to them more closely. And also, as a man, I am full of joy when I see a woman taking sexuality seriously and helping me not sin. I appreciate it a great deal. If every woman walked around in long flowing skirts, my life would be much better and holier. I am not concluding I know the answer, but that is my experience.
@servornon I recommend you get into the theology of the body.
@@filomenagabriel7954 Already read it 15 years ago. What points would you like to bring revisit?
Also modesty is what the modern world needs spiritually and physically, not modesty for the modern age. Modesty is timeless and classy
This is soooo good!!! 💛 I am a Christian college girl and have made the decision to dress modestly, now for me it’s really about that change of heart: trying to cultivate God’s love and grace as close as possible in everything ELSE that I do.
this is so true .I never grew up knowing about modesty. Long story short, I left the church, and when I came back my conscience started telling me about modesty. Maybe it was a gift, I think now it was.
Same here
"Some days, Jacinta while in the hospital was very saddened by the worldliness of the visitors, the women dressed in fashionable clothes, often with low-cut dresses. 'What is it all for?' she asked Mother Godinho (her guardian). 'If they only knew what eternity is.'" -Blessed Jacinta Marto
Hi, I’m really curious where this quote is from? I looked up Blessed Jacinta Marto, and I’m interested in reading the rest of what you wrote, but can you please tell me the title?
This channel is very beneficial for the Church and the world.
I agree it is so important to be talking about these kind of things especially in this generation
I’ve actually stopped wearing trousers for the most part in my quest for feminine modesty. I love being a woman. But not everyone has to.
A woman certainly looks nice in a dress and they tend to receive more respect.
I started wearing pants all the time when I began my career in childcare since they’re much easier to wear when caring for children. So pants actually enhances my feminine modesty. To each their own
Justine Brown's Bookshelf I don’t get why pants aren’t feminine. Pants show my womanly legs for example.
@@witchf4ce310 that's kind of the problem, the more shape you show the more attention you will get. If you get married or are married you should try to save that for him as a gift of yourself to him as he would to you. I am still working on this and have a long way to go, but when people see that over and over again it takes away from your value as a beautiful creation of God and makes people ok with seeing you shapely exposed which is another way the sin progresses.
@Revoque Chegmester nope. I'm sorry you were duped.
Lol run with the pants, I love that, I grew up forced to wear dresses for literally everything cz my family threatened that I would be in the state of mortal sin if I wore pants. I'm so happy to see Catholics that are actually Catholic
So sorry you had to go through that love.
God bless you
I know this might be super weird to ask. But my concern is from the fact that there has been story of saint Padre Pio refused to give absolution to women who wears pants and to a women who sell them unless she closes her business. It is also said that he did it because Our Lord told him to do so. I don’t know if this is true or not but since I suffered from scrupulosity, this piece of information caused anxiety very much since 90% of my wardrobe are jeans and shorts.
What do you guys think about this ?
@@huyenvu851 The sound of silence.
@@huyenvu851 Don't sweat about it and just wear your jeans and shorts. Just ensure the shorts is of appropriate length and decent, covering everything nicely. God bless
I grew up in a holiness pentecostal church. forced to wear dresses all the time. first opportunity, I RAN. with my pants...
I loved this! I'm a member of another Christian denomination and loved how you got to the heart of modesty as an attitude and not just a dress code. Such a principle of modesty is applicable to men as much as women. Thanks for all you guys do!
This was so powerfully put. Thank you so much for this Jackie.
Modesty doesn't change. We need to know what to wear depending where are going to be. Different dress "code" if we go to Church or go to the beach.
And yes, modesty starts at the heart of each individual. If the way we dress is a cause of sin for others, then we need to do something about it.
Saint Ambrose in the 4th Century in Concerning Virgins book 3 says "Is anything SO conducive to lust as to expose in nakedness: to turn the neck, to loosen the hair was the next step an offense against God! For what modesty can there be?" Saint Augustine in the 5th Century describes the same thing "bosses of hair swelling forth is not only lacking in humility, but concerning chastity itself" meaning hair showing through the veil and the neck exposed was EXTREMELY sexual and so audacious and immodest!!! If modesty doesn't change, wear a burka and never show your hair and neck so as to be approved by your favorite Church fathers!
@@LizziesAnswers The term modest fashion or modest dressing refers to a fashion trend in women of wearing less skin-revealing clothes, specially in a way that satisfies their spiritual and stylistic requirements for reasons of faith, religion and personal preference.
JMJ. “Certain fashions will be introduced that will offend Our
Lord very much.” ~ Our Lady of Fatima, Ora Pro Nobis!
I wish Our Lady had been more specific....
This is soooo destructive. I will now go around obsessing over whether what I'm wearing is the right centimeter to please God. What are you saying quoting Our Lady with no comment? Ugh. Get a life.
@@ammcroft JMJ. No worries because Our Mother is so good! She knew what was going to happen, so essentially she had told her children to beware of the new fashions. And now it is plain for all to see all the impurity that surrounds us. I have had those same fears you have about pleasing God in dress. I have felt a TRUE peace about modesty ever since I started where below the knee skirts all the time!I know that sounds so crazy! I used to think that would be extreme, but you have to try it! You will feel better! It takes some getting used to and be prepared for skepticism from even family, but its worth it for Jesus! Also, if you want some truly awesome insight on modesty, check out Colleen Hammond!
@@NavajoLion I am happy you satisfied your scrupulous behavior. I'm sorry it took that to feel Jesus is finaly satisfied with you :/ Pope pious the 10 geuop are schismatic and not in line with God's Church. May He have mercy on your soul for causing good Catholics fear and doubt over a skirt. Sooo creepy!!!
@@NavajoLion I always try below the knee skirts, but your rant is not from a good place. It is sooo creepy and I hope you get help. YIKES!
I dress with Marian Modesty. It's a cool movement, I think it helps my soul, but I agree that it can be different for others.
I always taught my daughter from a very young age regarding modesty,CLASS BEFORE TRASH!!👍👍👍
Guys that are worth it want a classy girl
Bongani Masango please study up before you go blasting Catholics about this. We do not worship Mary. Saying she is the mother of God is not worship. Do you believe Jesus is fully God and fully man? We do. Do you believe He is fully and completely a part of the Holy Trinity? We do. Do you believe the Holy Trinity is the ONE true God. We do. Why is it incorrect to call Mary the mother of God when she gave birth to the second person of the Blessed Trinity? We Are not saying she created Him. Obviously the Holy Spirit made it possible. Mary simply provided the physical material for Christ to be born to us. Christ is the only mediator between us and God, our forgiveness of sins by the cross, His resurrection, the unity of the Church. But if Mary had not been the means that God chose to bring Him into the world there would not be salvation (because God wanted to become fully man and thus was born into humanity). So Mary played a pivotal role in salvation history and should be honored because God CHOSE her to be so. The Holy Spirit inspired Elizabeth at the Visitation to say “blessed are you among women”. And so she is. Blessed. Not godly. Not worthy of adoration because only Christ is. But worthy of honor.
Bongani Masango do not take bible verses out of context. Go back just a little bit to Timothy 2:1. “Let supplications, prayers, intercessions*, and giving of thanks be made FOR all men”. Why would we ask anyone on earth to pray for us if we could not ask the saints in heaven to do the same? The saints do not perish once they die...they are in heaven with their immortal souls, standing before the throne of God, praying for us, but especially if we ask. We are not asking them to give us Gods grace or forgiveness or mercy, we are asking that they help us in praying that God grant it to us. Our plight to the saints in this way does not mean we stop praying for ourselves. We approach the throne of grace with confidence in asking for what we need but also asking others to make this plight for us. Think about this, the saints are forever in the presence of God in Heaven and they pray without ceasing, whereas if we try to pray for ourselves or ask an earthly friend to do so, we have lives to live and things to do so we cannot pray incessantly for ourselves as the saints can. They are there to help us. And if you read parts of revelations, the angels bring incense before God which are the prayers of Gods people. All of Gods people. Not just the living. All people. The prayers of the angels and the saints that are for us
Bongani Masango
Remember, oh most gracious Virgin Mary, that never was it known, that anyone who fled to thy protection, implored thy help, or sought thy intercession was left unaided. Inspired by this confidence, we fly unto thee, o Virgin of virgins, our mother. To thee do we come, before thee we stand, sinful and sorrowful. O mother of the Word Incarnate, despise not our petitions, but in thy mercy, hear and answer me.
>Basically saying, Mary, you are full of grace and you find favor with God (that’s in the Bible) so nobody has ever been known to ask for your help and prayers and be turned away because God holds you in high esteem for your titles as “blessed among women” and “mother of the Word Incarnate”. We trust that you will bring our petitions before God despite our sinful state and not turn us away<
Think of it this way. Everything Mary does is like a magnifying glass. What does a magnifying glass do? It does not create anything, but rather takes what is already there and makes it bigger. Mary’s role has always been to bring glory to God in everything she does and is. Everything she does and says in the Bible points to Him. We do not go to her as God. We just trust that she will show us more of who God is by magnifying Him. After all, who knows Jesus better than her, His mother, who helped raise Him, who was there as His follower from birth to death? We ask her to show us parts of Christ that only she knows in the hopes of more fully praising Him
I see where you’re coming from but that saying puts the thought into her head that your daughter is above other girls because she dresses modestly when in fact, Jesus views all women as having equal value and beauty and we should all strive to view other women the same way and not as “trash”... just something to think about
I'm from Brazil and here they teach us that obviously we can't wear tight pants, but we can wear baggy pants or any clothes that don't make us indecent and don't make others sin, we have to ask ourselves: "would our mother Mary wear this if live in our times?" It's a great question to know what to wear.
I always ask myself one question: WOULD OUR MOTHER MARY WEAR THIS, IF SHE LIVED IN OUR TIMES?... I just can't imagine Her in tight jeans...That's why I try to wear pretty and modest dresses:) God bless you and may the Virgen Mary guide you!
Yes also, Jesus is literally on the altar. Right in front of you. Knowing that, what do you think is appropriate?
🙌🙌🙌
Dresses > pants
Agnieszka Beszlej AMEN!!!!!!!
@Revoque Chegmester lies
Thanks for the video. In these times of "bodycon" dressing and "why not" attitudes and "free the nipple" movements, it's good that you gave solid, grounding evidence. I wish I could find your Part2 on this...
Can someone point me to part 2?
Wow this is great! All the time I see people in Mass just not covered.. whether it be a short skirt, shirt or dress.. and sometimes shorts or low cut shirt. I get so irritated but like you said they may not 'know' and we need to have patience. ♡ thank you! I needed that!
"Love swallows up shame" what a beautiful picture.
The more I learn about the Catholic Church the more I love it !!
Hello, I want to talk as a girl, a girl who hours a go had an incident, as I was walking home with my friends, a boy took advantage from me and lift up my skirt, I wasn't even wearing a tight or short skirt, but even thou I felt horrible as if my dignity was taken away, he ran away and I couldn't do anything to defend myself, I want to stan for the rights of women, women who feel abused as me like today, because we can wear normal clothes and feel happy and not abused like I felt, I want everybody to respect and love their neighbor, I hope someone can take something from my story.
I really appreciated this talk because I better understand what's under that "umbrella" of modesty.
Thank you so much!
What an intro running with your pants 😁😁😄😂🏃🏃🏃🏃
It's true that modesty is a virtue, Amen! Pope Pius has recommended the faithful to think "Mary-like dressing". So thinking would our Blessed Mother wear this or that. When it comes to wearing pants the masonic temple have been the ones to infiltrate this type of dressing. It's important to know when and why this was introduced to society! The other thing to is that Padre Pio wouldn't even hear someone's confession if they weren't wearing a skirt at least 8 inches and had their head covered.
Of course it's important to be prudent and discern in our time what our Lord is calling us to in terms of modesty. However, it's crucial to know the church's stance on dress code from the past. God bless you!
This video just seems to say...
Modesty isn't all about clothing,
But you should dress modestly,
But it's a heart thing so it doesn't matter,
But modesty is relative.
It's okay to say some clothing is not okay for Catholics to wear.
Hurt feelings < salvation of souls.
@XvX XvX you got to start somewhere. We might think is a shallow and basic, but I know a lot of people who's fist steps into the fullness of truth where through content like this.
@@peterthooft3823 that may be sad and true, but the saints had no problem proclaiming the truth without mixing in PC, they just explained it in a way that people could understand and appreciate
If you observe Jackie in her talks readily available on TH-cam and in these videos, its obvious what she thinks women should wear. Never low cut shirts, not wearing sheer items and clothes that are not super tight hugging the curves.
@@claymcdermott6945 Exactly!! I'm excited to see part 2.
100% Spot on. A very big issue I see, is that this topic is always vague and unclear, I think people would appreciate transparency and direct communication rather than games to not hurt someones feelings
And a virture like modesty doesn't happen overnight. For example, it may take slowly rotating less modest pieces of a wardrobe out until you feel more confident and comfortable with your discernment of the virtue. Great explanation, Jackie!
Can’t wait for part 2, especially what to wear to church!
I should take the plank out of my before saying so, but i thought it was strongly implied that modest dress was to be like Mary. Mary never appeared in any approved apparitions in dress from our times. She always dresses in a way that conceals her figure for the majority without losing feminine beauty, grace, and mystery. Pope Pius the 10th and 11th both addressed this, as well as Pope Nicholas who spoke to a certain Scandinavian tribe that all wore pants. The pants they wore however were very concealing. He said it was alright since it was a custom, HOWEVER he also stated that as members of Christ's mystical body we should acclimate to His standards and not the Church to ours
The Church is all about tradition, C.S Lewis was never catholic, the Church is universal because it is applicable everywhere
Its great that you are convert, God Bless you, i hope your travel is smooth and steadily rising
The Church allows us to believe in certain Marian apparitions, but does not require us to do so. The church does not base doctrine on apparitions. It is interesting to analyze why the Blessed Mother shows herself to us looking certain ways, though. I love how she is always recognizable as a woman or a mother, but looks like the people she is appearing to. When she lived, I’m sure she dressed modestly according to her culture.
@@clairekurdelak2913 Mary as the Mother of God and purest of all creations should still be our guide. There had never been a very strict need for standards regarding dress because it was intrinsic in all developed studious cultures. Basic catechism (which has been promoted by most popes through the ages) and the study of the fruits if The Holy Spirit and the effects of virtue vs sin are part of the doctrine of the Church through the Divine infusion of knowledge and understanding. Many Doctors of the Church and other Saints given to such deep learning (i am a long way off from that) have read the Bible and learned of God's wisdom and gifts. It is doctrine, but in such God's simple way.
Shouldn't men dress like Jesus then as well since he's the perfect model of modesty for them?
“A dress cannot be called decent which is cut deeper than two fingers breadth under the pit of the throat; which does not cover the arms at least to the elbows; and scarcely reaches a bit beyond the knees. Furthermore, dresses of transparent materials are improper.” (The Cardinal Vicar of Pope Pius XI).
Our Blessed mother is the best example!
This was so well expressed. Thank you for talking about this!
You have the best explanation on this that I have ever heard
Mother Angelica has a great video on modesty. I'm going to quote her. "Some of you are going to get peeved at me tonight but I'd rather have you go to heaven peeved than somewhere else very happy. Nobody tells you because they're afraid to hurt your feelings. " I'm thankful for the women who have been willing to "hurt my feelings" out of concern for my soul and the souls of others. Another quote from that holy and courageous woman "We cannot be the occasions we have to repair for." I recommend watching the entire video.
The thing you have to remember is that it isn't just about you. We are called to be the light of the world. "So if the light in you is darkness, how terribly dark it will be!" We have been given wonderful gifts for which we should be thankful to God always, and modesty is one such gift. With every gift comes a commensurate responsibility, and we are called to use these gifts in an appropriate manner, serving one another in love, not abusing our liberties for the sake of personal pride or selfishness. Even though everything were allowed, not everything is good, nor helpful. If there is anything I am doing that causes a brother or sister to sin, I should avoid it at any cost, as I would rather be tied to the bottom of the ocean by an anchor around my neck than to cause even a single person to stumble in their faith. To do otherwise would be of the spirit of Cain, who when "The LORD asked Cain, 'Where is your brother Abel?' He answered, 'I don't know. Am I supposed to take care of my brother?'" Let us all act in such a way that when the Master returns, he will be able to say to each of us instead "Well done, good and faithful servant!"
Matthew 18:6 “If anyone should cause one of these little ones to lose his faith in me, it would be better for that person to have a large millstone tied around his neck and be drowned in the deep sea. How terrible for the world that there are things that make people lose their faith! Such things will always happen-but how terrible for the one who causes them!
Romans 14:19 So then, we must always aim at those things that bring peace and that help strengthen one another.
1 Corinthains 8:9 Be careful, however, not to let your freedom of action make those who are weak in the faith fall into sin. Suppose a person whose conscience is weak in this matter sees you, who have so-called “knowledge,” eating in the temple of an idol; will not this encourage him to eat food offered to idols? And so this weak person, your brother for whom Christ died, will perish because of your “knowledge”! And in this way you will be sinning against Christ by sinning against other Christians and wounding their weak conscience. So then, if food makes a believer sin, I will never eat meat again, so as not to make a believer fall into sin.
1 Corinthians 9:19 I am a free man, nobody's slave; but I make myself everybody's slave in order to win as many people as possible.
1 Corinthians 10:23 “We are allowed to do anything,” so they say. That is true, but not everything is good. “We are allowed to do anything”-but not everything is helpful. None of you should be looking out for your own interests, but for the interests of others.
Galatians 5:13 As for you, my friends, you were called to be free. But do not let this freedom become an excuse for letting your physical desires control you. Instead, let love make you serve one another. For the whole Law is summed up in one commandment: “Love your neighbor as you love yourself.”
Ephesians 5:3 Since you are God's people, it is not right that any matters of sexual immorality or indecency or greed should even be mentioned among you. Nor is it fitting for you to use language which is obscene, profane, or vulgar. Rather you should give thanks to God. You may be sure that no one who is immoral, indecent, or greedy (for greed is a form of idolatry) will ever receive a share in the Kingdom of Christ and of God.
Ephesians 5:6 Do not let anyone deceive you with foolish words; it is because of these very things that God's anger will come upon those who do not obey him. So have nothing at all to do with such people. You yourselves used to be in the darkness, but since you have become the Lord's people, you are in the light. So you must live like people who belong to the light, for it is the light that brings a rich harvest of every kind of goodness, righteousness, and truth.
DuncanDeez thank you! I think you put it best: “It’s not just about you” and those bible verses illustrate that super well!
It’s sad that we seem to be depending on a culture that’s barely Christian for moral guidance on modesty when God has given us the answers. The most terrifying thing I’ve heard about modesty, which is supposedly a virtue, is that it depends on the culture. That doesn’t sound logical to me.
@@amyj4283 I agree. I can't reconcile the idea apparently presented in this video that modesty is culturally relative with the words of Paul who says "Do not conform yourselves to the standards of this world, but let God transform you inwardly by a complete change of your mind" (Romans 12:2). Although the Catechism of the Catholic Church does state in 2524 that "the forms taken by modesty vary from one culture to another," it also goes on to affirm that "everywhere, however, modesty exists as an intuition of the spiritual dignity proper to man". So to my understanding, there are different expressions of the same universal intuition. To say what was heavily implied in the video, that there are some cultures or situations in which no clothing at all is a form of modesty is, at least in my opinion, a far departure from the Catechism's definition of modesty that "inspires one's choice of clothing" rather than affirming one's choice of whether to wear any clothing at all.
DuncanDeez yeah I agree. I think making modesty such a relativistic matter drains it of its moral and theological implications. I was under the impression that God is the standard regarding what is modest and not this increasingly anti Christian culture we live in today.
We should definitely discern and ask god to help us dress in a way that purifies our and our neighbors souls.
There are soo many differences between cultures and there always has been. But doesn’t truth exist outside and inspire of those differences? Meaning culture doesn’t dictate what is true but rather truth should dictate the culture we create?
And haven’t people realized that saying “it’s (insert year)” is not a moral argument and neither is “well different cultures don’t do this and not that”?
Lol Father Mike will be at my college today :)
Love swallows up shame! And relating that to marriage. So sweet.
Could you make a video about woman who feel called to not where pants. I felt called right from the begging of my conversion to stop using pants. Only recently have I found the courage to act. I don’t believe it’s sinful to where pants, since the church has never stated that. It has become a type of Marian devotion for me just like the chapel veil. It would be nice to see you have a dialogue with a woman who only uses skirts or dresses, because their are many young woman who feel called to this practice of modesty but are afraid to do so.
First! And I loved that beginning! 🤣 🏃
I love that you taught this in such a different manner than is typical. It is vastly different than a majority of Christian modesty talks in the best way possible. It never really crossed my mind that modestly is more than what we wear because that’s the only way it has ever been presented to me.
Modesty in dress is a physical attribute of modesty of the mind, they go hand in hand not one or the other.
Absolutely brilliant presentation on a topic many are afraid to approach. Thank you.
Thank you! I think I’ve been seriously struggling with scruples in modesty and it’s been making me feel crazy and distracted.
I recommend reading the pamphlet from The Fatima Center titled, "Our Lady of Fatima Stressed...Modesty in Dress"
In a Vatican approved apparition in Brazil the Virgin Mary told a man that women should dress in long skirts or dresses to mass...
When the Catholic missionaries went to convert some African tribes that still practiced nudism, they required them to abandon this practice if the tribe wanted to accept the Catholic faith. The Catholic moral teaching does not change (is not relative), only people's perceptions of it change.
Every woman in heaven will be dressed as their Queen. So, better start now. :)
Our bodies don’t go to heaven??
This video essentially makes the argument that when it comes to exposing the flesh, "if everyone is doing it, it's okay". This reasoning is never a justification for any aspect of the moral life, and modesty is no different -- and it's also never been (and still is not) the position of the Church. When missionary saints went to different native tribes to evangelize them, they would move on when a tribe refused to abandon its custom of public nudity.
There is in fact a dress code in Rome.
U bet there is! Try getting into St Peters with bare arms even!
robertjos - Not Just Rome. Pretty much all the cathedrals in Europe. At least the ones I went to.
I spent a college semester in Rome and we went to the Pope’s general audience. I’m sure that I’d been told the rules about clothing before I packed, but I guess it wasn’t forefront in my mind when I was packing. I packed a below the knee length skirt and I had a top that matched it, so I packed that. A couple of days before we went to the general audience, I realized that my top had cap sleeves. It fully covered my shoulders, but not my arms. So I had to shop for another top. The only one I could find wasn’t much better than the first one, but it covered part of my arms. I wore it and they let me in, so I guess it was ok, but I was a bit self conscious.
What a joke that is.The Vatican could care less if people are wearing tank tops and yoga pants to mass all over the world but they are worried about shorts in St Peter’s!
RScott Logan - I think you can wear shorts in St. Peter’s. They probably just have to be long, like knee length. That is not the place to wear your Daisy Duke’s.
RScott Logan the Church has upheld many traditions in that part of the world, including covering oneself as much as possible in Mass. The Western Hemisphere has, whether for the worse, I don’t know, deviated from that and has a different culture of dress in Mass. But the Church leaves it to ones culture and choice what to wear. Of course it would not be condoned necessarily to wear yoga pants to Mass but the reason that is is because what is the purpose of wearing them out in public? If it is to get the attention of others, that is a form of vanity. So that’s a no. The flip side to that would be yoga pants that are covered in some way so as not to draw attention of others in public or away from the Eucharist in Mass. Just like the video was saying, there is an element of culture that Mass attire is left to
I love how you always refer to the Catechism of the Catholic Church.
Looking forward to modesty part 2! Love this video! Thanks!
I respect this video, but I do have to say that imho, it’s an idealized notion of modesty as it applies to our times, but isn’t really applicable because a lot of Catholics lack modesty, in dress, heart and action. Modesty does start in the heart and works outward. Having said that, I do think there should be guidelines for men and women when it pertains to dressing for worship at mass. I am sick and tired of seeing pants so tight I can see all sorts of nooks and crannies in the ahem... crotch area and behind area of women at mass, in tired of bare shoulders, bare chest, bare back. Im tired of skin tight shirts and bare stomachs, I’m tired of people having the nerve to wear pajamas and uggs to mass- and this goes for men as well, not just women. We are human, we will be distracted if we see something that calls our eyes attention (good or bad). If we are at mass to worship the Most High at the Sacrifice of the Holy Mass, why do so many think it’s okay to detract from it In their dress? We should make an effort to remove all attention from us and focus on why we are at worship, and that should apply to dress. I was convicted to veil and wear dresses, because I wanted to detract from me while I glorify the Most High King.
A dress code like the one you describe is classist. Not everyone has the resources to be able to dress that way for Mass and those that do not have every right to still make it to Mass. And respectfully, you are at Mass to worship and glorify God, not judge outfits. You have no idea what another person is going through. Perhaps they haven’t been to Mass in decades, or they are struggling with mental illness, or they’re a student and have been studying all night, or they are struggling with their faith and find it hard to even step foot in the church, or any of the other million of reasons that they are unable to dress up to your standards. Be kind to your brothers and sisters.
Thank you Jackie.
Jackie, thank you. Modesty is a beautiful virtue and yet its meaning is getting distorted by some fanatical voices. When my sister and I started a dress company, Paris Bloom, we set out to design classy dresses women can wear to church, work and everywhere in between. Even though we follow the guidelines for modesty as illustrated outside St. Peter's Basilica we've still received a deluge of messages saying our dresses are immodest because they don't alll cover the elbows and you could see some knees and collarbones in our pictures. Provocative clothing sexualizes women, but so does a prudish/gnostic approach. God made the female form and it's beautiful. We shouldn't exploit our bodies but we also shouldn't be ashamed of them. Thank you for the reminder - virtue is in the middle!
Wow, couldn't agree more. The two sides of the extreme purport the same message, in my view.
Amen 🙏 like she said the church does not have that rule because we are catholic and have to consider other cultural background. I love celebrating our femininity because it is from God .
love it! finally some common sense on this subject
That was helpfull. This video changed my view of modesty. Thank you so much! God bless you!
What are you talking about? There have always been dress codes for mass at a bare minimum. You are also conflating the virtue of modesty with purity of heart. Two different things.
But mass is a very specific "time and place". You could argue a very specific culture. So of course, while wearing a modest bathing suit to the beach is appropriate for that setting, you would never wear a bathing suit to mass. Hope this makes sense, and sorry for replying to a year old comment!
Love that cold open
"Run... far away... with those pants"
Absolutely love this
The New Mass or Novus Ordo is another Protestant Sect. ~ “A dress cannot be called decent which is cut deeper than two fingers breadth under the pit of the throat; which does not cover the arms at least to the elbows; and scarcely reaches a bit beyond the knees. Furthermore, dresses of transparent materials are improper.” (The Cardinal Vicar of Pope Pius XI).
I have seen and read all types of different kinds of "modesty" from the Marian Modesty Movement to people who think modesty is solely cultural so you can do whatever you want. My opinion (which you can take with a grain salt) is that there should be something kind of guidelines (not rules with sins attached) on how to dress modestly maybe they could made by each country's bishops and cardinals. This way we would at the very least have guidelines on what and is not modest. But of course there would be exceptions if you could not afford to change your entire wardrobe overnight. As a few other people said here some people have very, and I mean very tight budgets that don't allow for new clothes to be purchased.
Another thing which I don't know if anyone has heard or read but I thought there was a study done which found that men thought about sex more when women wore skirts because of the swaying motion of skirts and dresses? If anyone has anyone info on this please pass it along.
One last thing, this is sort of from an article I read on Catholic Answers website. It said that women are supposed to imitate Mary and her virtues. We are not called to mimic her. Which a lot of people seem to mix up beucase if we are all called to mimic Jesus and Mary then we should be living like they did in 1st century Palestine, we shouldn't even have technology!
Thanks for reading if you made it this far! I hope to hear from you in the reply section! God bless ~ Rockfeather
I think the guidelines set by men in each country would be a little too much, because it's very subjective. My parish just tells us to wear smart casual and most people generally get the hint. As for your skirt comments, I do remember reading about how men think about sex more because of the 'easy access'. How disgusting!
@@hitthefries I was just thinking that maybe we haven't lost modesty so much as we have lost the sense to dress for occasion, like only you best clothes at Mass, workout stuff to the gym, and pjs for bed.
About skirts yes that is disgusting but I thinking more how people seem to think that skirts are more modest then pants. But if skirts cause men to have more bad thoughts then pants do, shouldn't women wear pants? ~ Rockfeather
This topic is very important because a lot of ppl don't think that what you wear talks alot about you. It can contradict the msg you're trying to convey. Women can be the cause of sin to men, I feel sorry for them because here they are trying to meet with God at church and instead they end up meeting the devil. Dressing appropriately at all times is key, lets stop idealizing celebrities and start idealizing our true holy heroes.
Wearing yoga pants is absolutely immodest! The church has always tought that we have a responsibility to not lead our fellow man into temptation. Also, Jesus says in the Matthews gospel "Temptations to sin will inevitably occur but woe to those through whom they occur"
Oh the way of God amazes me it was just today that I asked myself what modestiy really means to me and to the catholic church. I guess thanks Jackie, for following Gods will so His timing can be on point :D
So good, and helpful! Thank you!
As a wise old woman once said(to her granddaughters)If you don't want people to touch your "Animals" don't leave your "barn doors" open.
I've just been thinking about this! This was very helpful, thank you!
If modesty varies from culture to culture then why did Adam and Eve cover themselves when they realized they were naked? Aren’t they the parents of humanity and therefore all culture?
They recognized from their first sin that they were now prone to a variety of others. God teaches them how to make clothes later since He could see in the future that that would easily become z dilemma
There's a bare minimum, lol
Yes, I agree. Those people my be ignorant of their sin and I believe the blood would cover that *because it's sin.* Modernity (in relation to the fall) has normalized immodesty and disguises it as cultural and subjective.
Walking around naked is presuming an innocence that the Bible says doesn't exist. Everytime naked is used in the Bible it is in a negative sense.
@@Raminakai Before the fall there was nothing wrong with being naked. The church fathers even say they were clothed by glory. After the fall naked is always negative.
@@Raminakai You got me. Obviously I meant you can't take a shower right? We're obviously speaking in the context of public nudity.
Luke 8:27 Nudity is seen as living like a wild animal. mostly spoken of in a negative light.
Rev 3:17 Nakedness was used as a criticism.
Rev 16:15 Just like God clothes our spirits in righteousness, we should also clothe our bodies.
1 Corinthians 11:15 Women have an natural veil.
I hate how modesty is always targeted at women. It is not a virtue solely for women. Can you please talk about men and modesty too?
Maybe thats because immodest fashion also targets women much more than men. Just look at how men dressed 100 years ago... not that much different from today. Of course there's some cases, but I believe not for the most part. Whereas the way many women dress today would be absolutely scandalous 100 years ago.
Gabriela Using your same argument, I disagree completely. Men walk around shirtless all the time. Go to any beach and there are plenty of men dressing what would be considered scandalous 100 years ago.
Modesty is never just directed at women in my experience. My parents always taught me the same standards of modesty as my sister. Whenever I see a guy dressed in little clothing, I tell him to cover up.
The main problem (I think) is the highly sexualized and Liberal culture that we live in today. Men are shirtless in movies and the majority of women LOVE that. Women are scantily-clad in movies and the majority of men LOVE that. Sex sells and our society is more about promoting sexual liberty than it is about virtue. We have lost our way.
I hate to generalize, but I guarantee you that the majority of women are more ok with a man being shirtless in public than another woman being shirtless in public when several decades ago, both would have been unacceptable.
@@athena6653 The feminism is still running in your blood
@@Battlefield1918 It must be so challenging living with such few brain cells.
As a young unmarried Christian woman, I'm still trying to figure out the appropriate context for things like warm weather out with friends or at the beach - what do you think about crop tops in certain contexts/bikinis out with the girls? From a heart posture of I'm dressing to express not attracting people on purpose or looking for anything from them regarding my fashion.
Also, what about bellybutton peircings?
Obviously, you won't wear a crop top in every context or bikini, but it's seems like it's appropriate to the situation and context at times.
Any thoughts?
When you truly grow in virtue and in connection with the Lord do what is pleasing to him .
Thanks for your video! It was Good when God created it. The matter is spiritual thing rather than appearances. Fr Paul
Until we sinned, and then we covered ourselves in our shame and God taught us to make clothes for ourselves
Modesty in conduct, the way you speak.... I 🥰
Love your videos, Jackie! You're truly awesome!
I'm really looking forward to the next video!
This was such an informative video! 🤗
Hey Jackie, thank you so much for making a video on this topic! Can you please clarify something with me...when you brought up the point how modesty varies depending on the culture it confused me. Can you please clarify in that statement wether or not you mean that if our modern culture here in North America considers it fine to wearing things like crop tops, see through shirts with no bras or lingerie as a top that is okay as long as us as a society finds it acceptable? Can you please clarify this? My understanding of modesty in addition to the virtue is also in service and out of love for our brothers in Christ and protecting the dignity of the person so it is hard for me to imagine & wrap my head around what you’re saying about how modesty needs to be discerned? I may be way off base here but I don’t think you meant to imply that we should “only reveal what you want & are comfortable with” because that is already what our society does. Please let me know what you think, I would love some clarification! Thank you!
Ashely Quinn great comment! I don’t have an answer because my question is similar to yours. I also get very confused when I hear that modesty isn’t necessarily objective and that it depends on the culture. The problem I see with this view is 1) the culture is always changing, and 2) another reason modesty is so important is so that we don’t lead one another to sin; (like you said out of love for our brothers and sisters); if that is an objective standard, modesty must be also. I’m admittedly not a very modest person myself but I’ve grown more aware of how I dress and more guilty of how I dress, but I usually hear a lot of “it depends on the culture” (and how I dress is culturally appropriate) and less “dress in a way that won’t lead another to sin” so that they don’t constantly have to “pluck their eyes out” to avoid looking at you in a sinful nature (obviously that’s hard to measure but I wonder if it’s a better direction than saying it’s cultural because at some point we will have to be countercultural ok this issue).
Crop tops etc are common, but it doesn't mean it's modest in the US. For example, these women wouldn't wear it in court, or workplaces. When she said it's dependent on the culture, she was most likely referring to their expectations of modesty, not what's common attire. There is a difference. For example, it's immodest to show your calves in the middle East. Over here it's fine.
leal i don’t think that’s what she wants to imply about modesty. Is immodesty objective? Does it even exist? If it does, is it only because it’s not acceptable?This seems like a ridiculous standard and there’s no moral objectives to it. Can we draw a definitive line between modesty and immodesty? Does the nature of the man changes as culture changes (ONLY if that is the case is modesty dependent on culture). Will there be a point where we can all dress like Rihanna (showing most of our bodies) and be modest? If modesty is dependent on culture, the answer should be yes. Will there be time when showing most of our bodies will not lead men to sin? I don’t believe so, but I’m open to having my mind changed.
What is rapidly becoming acceptable is women showing as much of their chest as possible. Like I said, at some point and it may be too late, we will have to start becoming countercultural.
leal you gave the example that it is immodest to show your calves in the Middle East but it’s not here.
My problem with accepting this world view is that this is a very relativistic way of looking at the argument. You want to look at the biggest argument against Christianity? There it is.
It may be true that it is CONSIDERED immodest to not cover your knees in the Middle East. But is it? Just like in some places it is acceptable to kill or even rape and it’s not considered acceptable here. That has no implications on the morality of rape or murder. It just means it’s acceptable some places and not others. But it’s still wrong to kill and rape. My point using this example to show illustrate that we have to go beyond “it’s acceptable here and not there” mentality to determine what’s good and bad.
But if modesty IS relative and cultural, then what use do I have for it?
leal @H_owar123 I think what the point of the “cultural” standard is here is that in different cultures men will look at women differently because of what is normal. (Or women to men, either way)
If a woman in the Middle East shows more of her body than is normal, that will be the focus of ones “judgement” or “perception” of her. This is immodest because, unless she does not know what was supposed to be culturally appropriate, she is drawing the attention of others to something about her other than her character.
In the US, it seems like it’s culturally okay to wear crop tops and short shorts, but whats the objective behind it? Usually it is to get people to look at your body (again, unless someone doesn’t realize that is what it does). So in most contexts, girls wear these types of things to get the attention of another, but it is drawing another’s focus off of who she is meant to portray which is Christ, so it is considered scandalous in a way because it is leading others away from God.
I agree that relativism, the “this is right for me” mentality, is a huge problem. But the Catholic Church is universal on this base level, that man and woman should dress so as to not bring focus away from God and to not lead others to dishonor or disrespect his or her body, and in turn dishonoring the soul, which is, in a way, the “divine” part that God has given us.
Maxi dresses are beautiful, in style and modest. I wear them often to church. Just a suggestion
I've been catcalled and whistled at while wearing t-shirts and jeans without an inkling of skin outside of my hands and face. I'm all for Modesty as my God calls it, but its advocates-especially within the Catholic Church-have to stop using the excuse that it'll divert unwanted sexual attention. It won't.
Wow! Arent we looking for an excuse to do as we please!
@@rosaryforfamily3984 Aren't we willing to ignore bad reasons for promoting modesty. In case you haven't watched, she did a fantastic job with explaining modesty and its necessity today, and I am still striving for modesty myself, but not for the lie that I listed above that is still unfortunately promoted in some religious cultures and unfortunately in this comment section too. Have a good day.
Modesty is supposed to help, but you can't keep others from choosing to sin. The main goal in your case is to keep up your side, and leave the rest to God. Some people are like that, and desperately need prayers. Not everyone is on the same plain of understanding or personal growth. I hope in God's intervention and saving grace.
Turn the other cheek doesn’t mean abuse tolerance, whether it’s from family, significant other, friend etc. hate the sin not the sinner but you’re also able to distance from the sin. I think this applies to those “thinking it’s anti Christian to cut off toxic people”
"The body isn't bad, it is sooo good". This is exactly what Satan says to start every lustful temptation. He quotes truths to lead us to evil. If only women today had the humility to listen to men instead of creating their own reality of the male mind.
Thank you for your clarification!
terrific youtube vid. filled with the Spirit
Great information Jackie thank you! I saw you at steubenville years back! Love the Michael Jackson dance moves haha. God bless!
Can you make a video on which clothes are appropriate?
Bordering on relativism. Careful. Also, when a Pope decree guidelines, especially for the western world, in obedience we are to adhere to them. Following Jackie’s logic could be very dangerous to souls. Also, yes, even though modesty begins in the heart, given prudence, temperance, culture considerations, and the fact that there is objective truth, there are rules we could deduce both generally and for our particular culture.
Lol the church borders on relativism working in a coherence theory of truth. I’m sure non believers also believe in objective truth that doesn’t align with yours. Your comment was almost intelligent.
I grew up as an Independent Baptist. The greatest irony in that movement was its criticism of legalistic religion coupled with the intensely strict modesty codes placed on women
Hey if someone can please answer me this question. I’m a Zumba instructor/dancer, if I’m only wearing a sports bra or a crop top during those times , is that wrong ?
I think that we should chase modesty in all environments, if it’s possible you could just wear a tank top over or something.
You also have to take a look at what your intentions are in what you’re wearing.
I get sooo scrupulous about this. Like, "I shouldn't go to confession if I am wearing jeans" or something. Im not talking about skin tight jeans and I usually try to wear a shirt that covers the NOT skin tight bottom. Ugh. Comments on here seem not good for a scrupulous mom of 4 who loves Jesus. I am married cetainly don't have a desire to have men think immodestly about me...This helps but I think I will always be paranoid about whether I should be only wearing skirts to the ground every where. I always wear a skirt to the ground or at least below the knee to Mass. I do think the tight pencil skirts that have a slit up the back are pushing it for Mass.
Instead of checking out the latest celebrities secular trends, please see the royalty fashion and manners. You will get inspired much better. 🙃✨
Yes!
Lack of modesty is still sinful for non-Christians, because it reflects the state of the heart, mind, and soul. But some are just unaware without being vain or malicious.
It’s interesting how they don’t mention the decree from Pope Pius XI written less than 100 years ago.
Pants? I think you mean knee scrunching leg prisons. Soooooo overrated... unless you're on a ladder.
@Jackie, I like the way you said that:” you fell in love with Jesus and started realizing what you were doing wrong…” this reminds me of a couple who were told that by eating a fruit they would become gods but this actually showed them their nakedness . they tried to hide it in vain…
Although they were banned, God himself clothed them and therefore become the first custom tailor: “The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them” (Genesis 3:21).
If am not wrong, it’s Fr Mike. S who said that “stopping to sin will not probably get you closer to God but getting closer to God will surely stop you from sinning.” The Holy Spirit being a wise and lovely teacher will keep teaching each and everyone at one’s own pace.
That scene with your former teacher was a key point for you but it shows that much emphasis is put on women, we need more efforts to help raise real Christian gentlemen who will not deny their weaknesses nor hide them but offer them to Christ who will send His spirit to rule over their bodies. As Jesus said: it’s not what goes into…
I HATE THIS. Honestly there are sooooooo many conflicting opinions on modesty and this video just makes it more confusing
The tribal woman is not modest in her own way. She is ignorant of what modesty is. Also just because something is a discipline and can change doesn't always mean it should. The Church in her wisdom, through the popes of the past, instructed the faithful in the way they did for a reason. Before we discount the discipline, we should understand why it existed in the first place. To disregard these words of the popes as "old news" is a very modernist approach. The truth is unchanging and the value of our bodies does not change according to time or place or culture. I don't disagree with some of the ideas here but overall there is a lot of doublethink and relativism in this video.
Very well said Renee!
I'm a lab technician, I can't wear dresses, skirts, low high heels, open shoes etc for safety reasons, just pants, non-slippery shoes, lab coat and tied up hair. And still I'm modest at my work place and at home when I'm wearing my dresses, low high heels and lose hair.
hi, Jackie! in your next video can you perhaps give us advice as to how to dress modestly in a modern way? I think I know how, but it might be of help to others. thank you 😘😘
Slightly Modernistic... Modesty is whatever you think it is based on the culture. Depends on you as a person. WRONG!
robertjos Everything she explained is supported by Church teaching. Are you Catholic?
@@athena6653 actually, everything she explained was based on PC doctrine, Protestant/Catholic if you please. She was saying to walk in the middle. She did not explain that we are already on one side of the extremes. I am not the best at modesty, i am still working on it, but the fact is that if there aren't any "set rules" then why would modesty be a problem in the first place?
Another question.
If modesty lies in the culture, say I, being Western, visit this African tribe where topless is modest. Should they then conform to my standards because, modesty? If this is the case, we have to conform to the most extreme forms of modesty because there are more extreme forms.
Super Mariocraft Gaming that’s a great comment! If modesty does in fact lie in the culture I would assume it would be immodest for you to dress too contrary to how they dress. Or at least it would be immodest if they believe it is.
Now, I’m completely confused on what modesty even is and why it’s even a church teaching when it’s the culture that sets the standards and not God.
For African tribes it isn't modesty, it's necessity. It's not the same thing. The circumstances they are in forces them to dress like that. You don't have that sort of pressure exerted on you, even if you were to visit them.
@@amyj4283 Because normally culture would be based on the objective standards of religion. It's only until recently that this has changed, in late 19th century. When Europe killed God, as Nietzsche would say. Before that culture was synonymous with religion, but after abandoning God man made his own culture, based upon his own "objective" standards.
Ayoub Khalil yeah good point. Of the culture is not religious and is opposed to it the we have to base our moral standards outside of said culture.
My friend said, the first thing she did when she became a Christian was . . . put on more clothing.
It occurs to me that the people fuming about women wearing trousers have never had the experience of parenthood. The mother of a toddler should not have to chase after children in a skirt, it just slows her down and leaves her exhausted. I know, times gone by, warra warra... women no longer need big skirts to hide bulky sanitary wear, they should be able to wear what's helpful. South Asian cultures had women wearing trousers (under skirts) for centuries, and they were obsessed with modesty.
The same with European dress, it wasn't all skirts and legs. However both cultures still survived and ran after their kids in dresses. As easy as it is to have kids wear the easiest outfit, it isn't often conducive to a modest character, if you don't teach them from the start what then?
@@jademarie156 I simply don't agree that women in trousers are necessarily immodest.
@@Loreman72 i understand, and Pope Nicolas even wrote to a scandinaviantribe who all wore pants that it wasn't a problem. However, he also said as members of Christ's church we should try to conform with His standards. Trousers in and of themselves aren't always immodest, but the problem with todays society vs that tribe is that our usage of trousers is part of rebellious fashion, that is to say the 'equality fashion'. Men and women wear pants in the name of equality and pride and it distorts the lines between the sexes. They have their uses, but in todays society its a dangerous game