With the release of heavy stubbers the ogryn class is finally completely fixed and can now be ignored for months. Thank you fatshark, you saved darktide
Now that they moved Towering Presence on his skill tree, Ogryn is officially S tier and will be receiving several nerfs across the span of 3 days. Thank you Fatshark, you saved Darktide!
@@Davilen-br6gd They are super beefy but with +100% Weakpot and Surgical you can kill them with Headshots. At least better than with any other weapon. Fire Stacks would do really good but Gunlugger is unplayable in high Havocs with the Ammo shortage.
I feel like this is less of a problem with the heavy stubber and more of a problem of the right side of ogryn's talent tree being designed around the twin stubber.
Correct, this weapon is mid, but it’s also in an awkward spot where pbb and blo do nothing for it. So it’s relegated to being a backup weapon instead of a main damage dealer
@@MisterEtidedon’t make a build around this weapon - it’s not meant to be your primary weapon. Use it on your heavy hitter or feel no pain build. Put flak and maniac (o unyielding) on it, as well as surgical and the 20% dmg on first salvo blessings and you got yourself an Ogryn sniper. If you got a good Vet you shouldn’t need it often, but when you do, it’s a 1 shot 1 kill on many an enemy headshot.
@@jacobvriesema6633 Yeah, it replaces the kickback in other builds. You use it to pick off elites, it has more capacity and longer range than the kick back but it can't one shot muties and clear rooms of chaff with one shot.
@jacobvriesema6633 this is the way. I use it exactly like this and it feels like the intended purpose. I've tried to use it as the main focus and....meh. Purely as a sniper it actually feels awesome. I love the kickback but the large reticle (for me) is hard to aim though I do get lucky on far targets occasionally
The stubber isn't broken but it gives the ogryn an option it's never had before. I wouldn't bring gun lugger on it though. I think it works best with the charge so you can close the gap from the back and handle hordes better. Feel no pain is the better option so you can ignore the one or two guys that might be harrying you as you snipe specials. It allows you to actually help in an entrenched gunner situation. I like that none of the new weapons are OP and kind of just a fun or new addition to the kit. If you're good with headshots, it's good for you.
I really like this weapon as melee only ogryn because the situation that kills me more than any other is a spread out buildup of regular shooters, which the gorgonum with flak/unarmored will nullify, and i find it worth the burst damage the shotgun does by covering with my melee
@bfFAN221 or Cadian Hel Guns. The single shot lasguns are pretty lacking right now. Overall, weapon balance is so absolutely ass. It isn't even funny. I would love to use the shotguns, but I would actively put myself at a disadvantage with them.
The stubber should be used with surgical and deadly accurate. Doing so allows the ogryn to have actual competency when facing down ranged specialists (without having to relay on the rock). I used to be all about the kickback, but the nerf to it's number of pellets made engaging at greater distances a fools errand. The stubber is accurate as those wielding it and should not be underestimated. Click on heads when you need it, and then go back to doing what an ogryn does best - being a meatball in the melee
I don't know if it's just me but for a class that is so slow and carry so big weapons I kinda expected that his weapons would deal some absurd levels of damage, like eliminate fodder and some specialist enemies with a single shot/heavy attack, instead his weapons almost feel like they are made of tissue paper! Am I crazy? I feel that the class that is supposed to be as powerful as a space marine should feel like bone-crushing strong.
Slab shield feels really strong. Kickback and rumbler used to feel really good too. They got nerfed of course because we can’t have Ogryn mains having a good time
You’re not alone in this. It’s like Fatshark doesn’t understand DPS means ‘damage per second’. He’s so slow that other classes do more DPS simply by attacking faster or if you’re the psyker you can stagger easily as well. His light attacks should kill chaff in one hit.
The one thing i find better on the stubber than the Kickback is that, for some fucking reason, it feels like scab bombers have a 90% shotgun resistance. I swear to god i once shot a bomber 8 fucking times with a kickback and he just kept rolling over, rolling over, rolling over, not actually dying. The stubber can 1 tap them and thats nice.
You can blame the awful armor damage of the kickback for that one since bombers use flak armor along with the kickback's big spread and damage falloff its obvious you are gonna struggle in those situations
@@marcuso7350 bad armor pen on shotguns make sense, but when the pellets are the size of golf balls it feels a little arbitrary. But yeah, thats basically my only issue with the Kickback and since the stubbers circumvent that issue i prefer to use them instead. I still cant deny that in majority circumstance the Kickback is just generally superior though.
Everything about it is very slow. Swap speed is slow, bracing is slow, movement speed is slow, reload speed is slow, bloom recovery is slow (and buggy), and aim sensitivity is reduced.
The heavy stubber is just a real ranged option for a non Gun Lugger Ogryn. A real Gun Lugger will use the double barrel cuz the nodes actually support it.
It's not a superstar, it's not meant to be. it's a capable ranged option for a melee focused Ogryn build who needs longer range support. It's not meant to synergize.
Just go with the regular melee focused skilltree. The Achlys heavy stubber is basically a boltgun and the only ogryn weapon apart from rock that is good long range. I really like it, taking out high priority targets long range was never easier with Ogryn (in fact it was always hard). Can also do a lot of dps full auto close range. I think at this point it's probably the best ogryn ranged weapon for a melee focused build. The achlys twin stubber is still better for gun ogryn
I like Rumbler, so long as the team is decent. You can disrupt enemy groups easily and use the bounce in all sorts of ways. You can lob it from far away if you’re behind. It’s got good utility. The sticky blessing is helpful too.
@@J.B.1982Rumbler is my go to on Ogryn. Caprice and unyielding damage for perks and shattering impact and adhesive charge for blessings. So fun to use.
I feel his light version should deal like 800 damage, med dealing 1000 damage and heavy dealing 1200 damage would fix a lot of things. That way the scaling percent boosts would hit those break point nicely. Reload and Ready does work but only if you pop Point Blank Barrage as that's an auto reload on use.
Feels table scraps from Fatshark. Zealot and Psyker get super cool, powerful weapons and Ogryn gets mediocrity. It needs to be much stronger than the bolter. It’s a massive gun on an Ogryn. It needs a tighter shoot pattern as well, when firing automatic. It needs a better firing sound as well.
@@sodadrinker89 They just got the dualing swords recently and they are arguably the best/easiest class to use. I'm not about the shed a tear for the vets. Lol. I use all the classes, btw but I played Ogryn the most.
I disagree - I’ve been loving the heavy stubber as the sidearm to my slab shield build. I use the slow hard hitting version with surgical and I can one hit kill all gunners, snipers, and 2-3 hit kill enemies like reapers. I can 4 hit kill a crusher, I believe. Ogryn lacked a decent ranged weapon that can snipe ranged enemies, and now I can. If you have a good vet, you won’t need it often. But I’ve been finding it so nice to hit gunners and snipers when my team is busy. I can push enemies back, swap to ranged, snipe the sniper, and swap back to the slab shield before the enemies are back on me.
Well thats where i said that it can still be used, as a sidearm. But the weapon cant be used properly as a main damage dealer as the twinlinked and kickback can.
I was really excited to use it when it was first announced but it kinda just felt…meh? Being semi auto while braced is PAINFUL and it feels like the headshots do nothing.
The only reason I like using this weapon is because it can kill Crushers easily. I also find it easier to kill Monsters faster than with a Kickback. I can safely kill 2-3 Crushers at once but 6+ Crusher packs usually get me. With this gun I can kill like 4-5 from far away before they get to me. Only reason I use this gun over the Kickback.
Burst limiter should just have a separate stat for single round weapons(kick back and grenade launcher). So like the normal 8%(buff it tho lol) for full auto and like 20% for a single shot weapon.
Krouk is the superior mark and its intended to (finally) give ogryn a weapon to pop multiple shooters and specials from range. Its best used with melee builds. In this role it is absolutely the best weapon he has available. Trying to make the Achlys variant work with point blank barrage is just fundamentally misunderstanding the weapon.
Krourk cannot kill any elite gunner with a single shot, it takes 3 headshots to drop scab gunners. It also needs multiple shots to kill any special. If I’m gonna be using a sniper rifle, it better be dropping enemies in one
I actually don't mind the lightest heavy stubber with a blaze away + single target hit buff. 40 rounds isn't bad for blasting down dangerous elites. And its pretty good at shooting down gunners. The lighter gun is quicker to pull out and shoot. But I won't say its meta or anything. It doesn't have that kickback ability to make 2/3s of a horde disappear in one shot. It is better when the enemies start scattering out though.
I think the heavy stubber actually shines in mid range engagements against multiple targets, where the kickback just doesn't have the firing speed or accuracy to effectively take out several gunners at different elevation and directions. Sure that's when your veteran is meant to do his bloody job, but good luck with that if you play pub games. If you even have someone who is kitted out for that there's every chance he's 40 metres away stealing all the ammo after leaving a whole squad on half HP. For situations like that you just need something that is actually capable of doing the job, does enough damage to two shot gunners, and means you don't get minced or have to spend 60 bullets waiting for your twin linked stubber to actually connect. It's not meant to be build enabling, it's meant to be situational and utility, which it does well enough to get you back into melee range.
As a Veteran main, I absolutely love the Achlys heavy stubber. I never liked Ogryn beforehand because it felt slow and I couldn't do my favorite thing (snipe specials), but now I'm rewarded for hanging back a lil (with surgical and deadly accurate) and using my new high zoom, one-tap, cleaving, highly ammo efficient gun. With Indomitable, I can quickly get back to the team and rush into melee, or push through a sea of enemies to the backline so I can snipe a priority target from safety and use the increased move speed to get back in the action. I also love the Kickback, but I never felt like a true "Gun-gryn" with its small reserves; the Achlys heavy stubber gets more than twice the ammo reserves of the Kickback.
I maxed this weapon out and enjoyed it, but once I started to push the limits of the build, I had to go back to the kickback. I would love for the Ogryn and his builds get some love so that I have more than 2 ways to play him. It feels like the other classes have nearly infinite ways to create *viable* builds while the Ogryn is corned into one of two, maybe three, depending on your teammates
Flak + Unarmored + Opening Salvo on Achlys will oneshot all ranged elites on headshot without waiting for surgical stacks and still has a leftover blessing slot. You could swap Unarmored for Maniac to oneshot flamers and trappers as well in exchange for losing oneshots on dreg gunners. Killing carapace enemies with your ranged weapon seems entirely unnecessary when weapons like the pickaxe demolish them for free - save the ammo for ranged enemies and specials and take off the carapace perk. I'm not going to deny Kickback has better flexibility nor argue that the stubber is godly, but I think you're underselling it a bit with this setup.
A bit better range and ammo efficiency than the kickback was sufficient to make it my go-to weapon. But that's more about Ogryn's weapons being meeh than the heavy stubber being a god-sent.
(Xbox player POV) The Heavy Stubbers are at best mixed. I love the light variant due to the increased rate of fire to mow down hoards at range with ammo costs and deal good volumes of damage to bosses, without shields*. Handeling will make or break ranged weapons on controlers due to less precise input controls so the high damage variant may as well not exist for us. I feel it is a good mid ground option to fill out builds were it is highly melee focused so you aren't 100% relying on rocks or gernades.
Personally, the super accurate shots are a really nice thing to have, but the hipfire just feels like total dogshit. It's super inaccurate but without the volume of fire the twin stubbers have. The sound effects on the light and medium one are also just really weak sounding so they're unpleasant to use.
To me, the thing that would give these guns a worthwhile role that would also making them more fun would just be a faster swap speed. If they were quick to pull out, then they would at least be a quick special delete for a melee build.
I think the lightest version of the heavy stubber is pretty good. It's powerful enough to stand on its own on a bonebreaker, feel no pain build. Don't use surgical and deadly accurate on it because you get the most value from spamming shots on it with pinning fire + overwhelming fire + flak + maniac. Ammo is still good without gunlugger stuff. It two taps most maniacs and important enemies to get rid of and I find it actually holds up better in havoc mode than the kickback because the kickback loses its one shot capabilites on a lot of enemies in havoc.
I rarely take the heavy stubber over kickback on my taunt/charge builds when I know the vet won't be doing their job. But that's super rare. 99% of the time it's kickback.
Nah its great, its ogryns best tool for long range gunners, its good vs specials, its good vs dreg ragers, its just a good tool for a melee ogryn. A tier
The biggest flaw is that they do not directly make sense to run on Orgyn. Most of Orgyns' talent nodes (esp where ranged* dmg is concerned) are focused around close range to mid range dmg. Furthermore, Orgyn does not benefit from low mobilty/DMR style weapons directly unless stats otherwise. Otgyns biggest flaw is lack of mobility, which is offset by his size and having a "default" cleave with most of his melee. These are effectively braced headhunters "vigil" for Orgyn. However, orgyn has no direct talents to focus them around. So they are best used as part of a hybrid build, but I'd you're running hybrid. The kickback is a much better, more foguving option, esp for stagger utility. The only thing these weapons Excell at is rending on PBB, in which case you are basicly just a worse vet with more hp and dmg. They offer no new gameplay for Orgyn l and no new reason to pick them over the kickback or twinlinoed for burn stacks. Rending can be good, but aside from that, they do for too little dmg for their poor stability and rely on crit to even compete in any meaningful way Great for anti-gunners, but It's not really Orgyns job to be managing those threats it should be the vets. Orgyns talents make him so much better for Tanking, Melee combat, and team utility via taunting or support. Not for Ranged dmg combat unless running specific builds to mitigate Orgyns general lack of ammo even with +25% aside from a few weapons like Kickback, Twinlinked Mk 7, and Mk II ripper. But generally speaking, Gun-lugger Orgyn just gernally lacks the ammo/dmg to run in high-end difficulty without eating all the ammo to upkeep. These new weapons can mitigate that a bit. However, they just lack in the proper stability and over reliance on crit to really Excell in any meaninful manner. Orgyn is just to big and slow with current gunners to even think of running this only gun. And if running tank there are better option for versatility thst Orgyn generally needs. If they had 500-700 more dmg, they had better stability, and if Orgyn had a flat +20% to rending in addition to PBB's 30%, I'd say that sounds nice, but no we don't have that so the feel generally terrible for Orgyn to do his natural job according to his current talents. Just play ES vet with Vigil mk 7 (OS & Surg) . . . Give Orgyn a Doubble barrelled shotgun instead please, or somthing more intersting than a dmr. Luke maybe a heavy lazgun lmg kind of thing, or something the orks would use.
It can hit the broadside of a barn from more than 10m away and kill most specialists in one shot, it can even shoot through light terrain. That makes it the best Ogryn gun as far as I'm concerned. But yeah it's for a left/middle tree Ogryn. Maybe the medium version could retain enough damage per shot while making better use of PBB, but honestly I've become too attached to the heavy one's ability to cleave through walls.
Agreed on all points. The new single non-linked stubber was a bit of a letdown. It doesn't synergise with the ogryn's gunlugger talents. You can take it on a melee build if you like, but a kickback or twin-linked is likely to be more effective and will synergise if you have some spare points to spend on a couple of shooty nodes.
If Ogryn had more +Crit Chance/Damage talents, BLO got a modifier that was geared towards marksmanship (Increased chance while not shooting or after a weakspot kill?) and Point-Blank Barrage had some better synergy with Crits/High recoil weapons (Double Fire stacks on Crit/Major recoil& spread reduction as a modifier?) Then Stubbers would be in a much better place. But for now they are an average back-up gun for threats that are realistically gonna get insta-deleted by competent Veterans/Zealots using Plasma/Revolvers.
I be using it on a non-gunlugger build and it serves its purpose of killing specials decently well, imo it should be doing enough damage to oneshot a sniper and twoshot a gunner with the lightest variant though
you're right that it's ass for a gunlugger build but i think it's better than the kickback if all you want most from your gun is killing elites and specialists from range. The kickback is at long ranges is very middling at killing gunners, especially if there's cover at all and then it can struggle to kill anything in a reasonable amount of time. Plus with how gunners strafe this patch, the kickback is way less reliable at killing or suppressing multiple gunners at once. Achyls' ammo efficiency is also much better. Kickback is a versatile weapon but i find that picks and shields cover all the hording a melee ogryn could need. The achlys' full specialization in ranged target dispatching is much more of what a melee an melee ogryn needs to fill its holes. Despite Ogryn getting nerfed I've felt more consistent and well rounded with a melee build using the achlys than i felt on any kickback build last patch. Also surgical + opening salvo is the most consistent setup imo, it gives body shot crit breakpoints and non-crit headshot breakpoints, and keeps your damage good even if you don't hit the headshot or get full surgical stacks
if you use it to fill the same role as kick back, it's good but kickback was already kind of the best so it's not bringing anything new to what ogryn can achieve and it's definitly not better than the kickback
I would say the only thing this weapon does better than Kickback is to get rid of spear shooters where you can just aim and go Pop pop pop and just devastate stalkerks and gunners. But like you said building around it is more or less impossible, not only is nothing in OGryn's Tree that helps it, its ammo ecenomy is not all that great either. But I think it is a solid piece of kit to take along your usua Heavy hitgryn and Tauntgryn builds.
I think the issue is still just down to his dogwater skill tree. The heavy stubber does fine on its own without building into. Its great in pubs where no one is dealing with long ranged threats. Sure, some weapons may be better, but ogryn doesnt have them.
The worst thing about it is the weird drunkass way fatshark implemented recoil. They decided to do it differently to the way every other good shooter has ever done it, and it feels godawful.
@@berserkerpride No I mean the weird way the reticle travels while your view stays the same. It doesn't feel controllable or good in any way. It was done to be different, and not because it actually ads anything to the experience of shooting the gun. It's the same reason they tied ironsight sway to your view, making aiming damn near impossible on any weapon with iron sights. They changed that back to the way every other shooter does things, and I get the feeling they'll eventually see that reinventing the wheel to be a triangle is a pointless endeavour with this recoil thing too. These are solved issues that they're trying to make change on without understanding why it's done a certain way.
Ogryn needs a full rework man. It amazes me that the tank of the game is less tanky than a crazy ass map rushing zealot who DOES have slightly less armor and HP BUT has so much damage negation and regen ability that is virtually almost twice as tanky as an ogryn tank build it's absolutely stupid. Also it yet again amazes me that canonically the strongest living being under the Emperor's servitude does less dmg with a straight up TANK SIZED pickaxe than a zealot or veteran can do with a chain axe or chain sword. . . . .where is the logic? The singular melee that makes sense the ogryn can't do much dmg with is the shield and club and one argument is balancing and second is having both a club and a shield means you can't put as much strength into each hit but these arguments don't work for everything else, no1 cares much for balancing since it's a PvE game,there should still be some but it's not a PvP so it doesn't have to be as noticeable andthe second argument is lore wise ogryns not hitting as hard with their knifes as they would with a pickaxe well that knife is still as big as half a normal human(slight exageration) so it should still one shot everything that ain't special. Anyway my point being ogryn is pointless in botht he role of a tank which the zealots can do better sometimes and he's pointless in terms of dmg aswel,the guns are artificially nerfed "cuz of balancing" despite them shooting ammo as big as most guns are by themselves so they should do anti tank lvls of dmg but barely one shot common infected and all melees suffer form the same treatment. Apparently nerfing the shit out of all the possible things the ogryn can do is FatShark's only way of "balancing" the game -_-
Think I'll let Crunch have a long lie-in in the bunks and keep exploring the other classes. Been enjoying the psyker builds you showed a few months back. Only occasionally detonating due to too much warp fuckery. And the gun-psyker build has been frenetic fun (need to try the assail version of the build).
Assail with elektro staff is pretty fun. Sometimes you still blow because off laggy server tho. ( but with good server you do atleast tripple damage then others players).
Ogryn is worse at everything than every other class. If Ogryn is gonna be this slow with all his weapons, at least make it stronger than bolter, or revolver, or infantry rifle, or recon lasgun, or anything at all.
Lets be honest unless you are ammo-maxing with Achylis surgical + 100% extra dmg with crit - there seems to be no point of using heavy stubber over twin linked hs gorgonum. Unless you are fine with having 1 accurate shot and then you either have to slow down and risk taking damage or be LESS accurate than tl hs gorgonum.
You mentioned the Kickback is pretty much universally better. Do you have a build for it? Is it similar to this build? Or does it really just accompany most builds pretty effectively?
Also sorry for asking a billion questions about builds on your videos lol. Still new to the game and I'm not great at identifying crucial points of builds.
I'm not a pro player by any means, but i found krourk with Blaze away and either overwhelming fire or pinning fire to be the best option for heavy stubber. Tears through enemies close range without aiming and still good for sniping while aiming long range...just dont stop firing. Lean towards overwhelming fire for large targets personally just dont shoot another enemy mid barrage. Also like massacre as mathematically increased strength crits should add significant dps. Cut out pacemaker and reloaded and rdy since as you stated those talents arent exactly for heavy stubber. Although pacemaker may work better than i thought given the blaze away barrage buff we are going for and it is a single attack. Higher diff's with hordes I'm betting pacemaker is still a very viable option. Eats ammo for sure though just like twin linked heavy stubber.
Additionally I love kickback but the break in toughness regen during every reload is a bummer. Not as much of a problem with krourk heavy stubber! Ogryn shreds through anything and everything during ult phase! 😊
I just use it to shoot specials and gunners on my charge ogryn. It’s definitely not great but it does the job. I really don’t see why the draw time is so bad though considering the intended use cases. Also why try to force lucky bullet when you could just use something that works more than 8% of the time?
7:37 - you do get the benefit from Reloaded and Ready on use of Point-Bland Barrage🤓 I agree with you that this weapon is not that good, its damage is not impressive, it's slow(SO DAMN SLOW) and Kickback exists to snipe, suppress and kill everything that lives
Ehhhh..... I'm not even gonna argue. Just gonna say L take and pretend like I know better than meta goblin Mr E. Gunlugger Oggy with Achlys II kicks ass.
You are right that it's terrible on a gun lugger build but it's ok if you just slap it on any build you want to reach out and touch somebody. Funnly I think the Achlys is the worst one. The Krourk is a good as an anti-gunner DMR with flack, unarmoured, opening salvo and pinning fire while the gorgon is set up how you have it is good vs elite packs and elite/special sniping. That said I tried it on all my builds and I ended up swapping back to their previous weapons. The closest one was with my Power Maul, the Krourk was good vs rooms full of shooters but I ended up going back to the gorgon twin linked because I like to move and shoot.
Feels like one class needs a mild rework every patch but Ogryn is by far the worst right now. Bad tree, poor weapon variety, little team support and synergy, and now his new weapon sucks. Poor big man :(
I still think hstubber is better than kickback considering it covers the need for accurate long range weapon. Can't exactly do long range with kekback 🥲
With the release of heavy stubbers the ogryn class is finally completely fixed and can now be ignored for months. Thank you fatshark, you saved darktide
Now that they moved Towering Presence on his skill tree, Ogryn is officially S tier and will be receiving several nerfs across the span of 3 days. Thank you Fatshark, you saved Darktide!
They really should have given ogryn some kinda bolt weapon instead
@@axt_4254or a las cannon.. or a power fist...
@@axt_4254 Screw bolt weapons, where is my shoulder mounted lascannon that works like a Halo Spartan Laser?
@@GFMarine were truly saving Darktide with this one😃
The heavy stubber is fine. Not bad. Just fine. Problem is Fine feels freaking awful in a world of Revolvers, Bolters, Flamers and Plasmaguns.
I think it was literally added as tool to kill Gunners in Havoc.
@@MrLyramion Pus hardened gunners are practicly immune to non-melee tho :(
@@Davilen-br6gd They are super beefy but with +100% Weakpot and Surgical you can kill them with Headshots. At least better than with any other weapon. Fire Stacks would do really good but Gunlugger is unplayable in high Havocs with the Ammo shortage.
I feel like this is less of a problem with the heavy stubber and more of a problem of the right side of ogryn's talent tree being designed around the twin stubber.
Correct, this weapon is mid, but it’s also in an awkward spot where pbb and blo do nothing for it. So it’s relegated to being a backup weapon instead of a main damage dealer
@@MisterEtidedon’t make a build around this weapon - it’s not meant to be your primary weapon. Use it on your heavy hitter or feel no pain build. Put flak and maniac (o unyielding) on it, as well as surgical and the 20% dmg on first salvo blessings and you got yourself an Ogryn sniper. If you got a good Vet you shouldn’t need it often, but when you do, it’s a 1 shot 1 kill on many an enemy headshot.
@@jacobvriesema6633 Yeah, it replaces the kickback in other builds. You use it to pick off elites, it has more capacity and longer range than the kick back but it can't one shot muties and clear rooms of chaff with one shot.
@jacobvriesema6633 this is the way. I use it exactly like this and it feels like the intended purpose. I've tried to use it as the main focus and....meh. Purely as a sniper it actually feels awesome. I love the kickback but the large reticle (for me) is hard to aim though I do get lucky on far targets occasionally
The stubber isn't broken but it gives the ogryn an option it's never had before. I wouldn't bring gun lugger on it though. I think it works best with the charge so you can close the gap from the back and handle hordes better. Feel no pain is the better option so you can ignore the one or two guys that might be harrying you as you snipe specials. It allows you to actually help in an entrenched gunner situation. I like that none of the new weapons are OP and kind of just a fun or new addition to the kit. If you're good with headshots, it's good for you.
I really like this weapon as melee only ogryn because the situation that kills me more than any other is a spread out buildup of regular shooters, which the gorgonum with flak/unarmored will nullify, and i find it worth the burst damage the shotgun does by covering with my melee
feels like a bolter but worse
Without the meaty and eardrum splitting gunfire sound.
Which is a shame bc it looks like a 20mm auto cannon, looks sick.
@Hrrrrrrrrrreng I hope that the vet can get something like an MG3 and have it not be outclassed by bolter or plasma rifle.
@@Manslayer-eo1nhCalling it - Vet needs an *actual* Kasrkin Hotshot Lasgun 🤝
@bfFAN221 or Cadian Hel Guns.
The single shot lasguns are pretty lacking right now.
Overall, weapon balance is so absolutely ass. It isn't even funny.
I would love to use the shotguns, but I would actively put myself at a disadvantage with them.
The stubber should be used with surgical and deadly accurate. Doing so allows the ogryn to have actual competency when facing down ranged specialists (without having to relay on the rock).
I used to be all about the kickback, but the nerf to it's number of pellets made engaging at greater distances a fools errand.
The stubber is accurate as those wielding it and should not be underestimated. Click on heads when you need it, and then go back to doing what an ogryn does best - being a meatball in the melee
I don't know if it's just me but for a class that is so slow and carry so big weapons I kinda expected that his weapons would deal some absurd levels of damage, like eliminate fodder and some specialist enemies with a single shot/heavy attack, instead his weapons almost feel like they are made of tissue paper! Am I crazy? I feel that the class that is supposed to be as powerful as a space marine should feel like bone-crushing strong.
Slab shield feels really strong.
Kickback and rumbler used to feel really good too.
They got nerfed of course because we can’t have Ogryn mains having a good time
You’re not alone in this.
It’s like Fatshark doesn’t understand DPS means ‘damage per second’. He’s so slow that other classes do more DPS simply by attacking faster or if you’re the psyker you can stagger easily as well.
His light attacks should kill chaff in one hit.
Ogryn can rip Space Marines limb from limb, but can't slice basic fodder in half with ease... Make it make sense Fatshark
The one thing i find better on the stubber than the Kickback is that, for some fucking reason, it feels like scab bombers have a 90% shotgun resistance. I swear to god i once shot a bomber 8 fucking times with a kickback and he just kept rolling over, rolling over, rolling over, not actually dying. The stubber can 1 tap them and thats nice.
You can blame the awful armor damage of the kickback for that one since bombers use flak armor along with the kickback's big spread and damage falloff its obvious you are gonna struggle in those situations
@@marcuso7350 bad armor pen on shotguns make sense, but when the pellets are the size of golf balls it feels a little arbitrary. But yeah, thats basically my only issue with the Kickback and since the stubbers circumvent that issue i prefer to use them instead. I still cant deny that in majority circumstance the Kickback is just generally superior though.
it fills a much needed gap for ogryn so i like it.
Everything about it is very slow. Swap speed is slow, bracing is slow, movement speed is slow, reload speed is slow, bloom recovery is slow (and buggy), and aim sensitivity is reduced.
Yep
That's why I still prefer the kickback. It comes out so quickly, like a revolver, and reloads fast, even if only 1 shot. Stunner takes forever.
The heavy stubber is just a real ranged option for a non Gun Lugger Ogryn. A real Gun Lugger will use the double barrel cuz the nodes actually support it.
people said "i wish ogryn was better at range" and a finger on the monkeys paw curled
If Tanner played Ogryn, I imagine we would be hearing his wrath about this weapon by now lol
calmest tanner darktide video
Tanner on his way to call Mister E a silly billy for 40 minutes straight
@@Axisoflords Still a better love story than Twighlight
It's not a superstar, it's not meant to be. it's a capable ranged option for a melee focused Ogryn build who needs longer range support. It's not meant to synergize.
Agreed. I feel like people are expecting too much here. Or maybe I'm huffing copium
The Kourk (or however tf you spell it) is pretty good on gun ogyrn.
I like heavy stubber on melee Ogyrn when I am not using rocks.
Just go with the regular melee focused skilltree.
The Achlys heavy stubber is basically a boltgun and the only ogryn weapon apart from rock that is good long range.
I really like it, taking out high priority targets long range was never easier with Ogryn (in fact it was always hard).
Can also do a lot of dps full auto close range.
I think at this point it's probably the best ogryn ranged weapon for a melee focused build. The achlys twin stubber is still better for gun ogryn
I like Rumbler, so long as the team is decent. You can disrupt enemy groups easily and use the bounce in all sorts of ways. You can lob it from far away if you’re behind. It’s got good utility. The sticky blessing is helpful too.
@@J.B.1982Rumbler is my go to on Ogryn. Caprice and unyielding damage for perks and shattering impact and adhesive charge for blessings. So fun to use.
@@MetalGeek464 That's the ticket. It's a good time.
I feel his light version should deal like 800 damage, med dealing 1000 damage and heavy dealing 1200 damage would fix a lot of things. That way the scaling percent boosts would hit those break point nicely.
Reload and Ready does work but only if you pop Point Blank Barrage as that's an auto reload on use.
In practice It's a stub revolver with more ammo, but way slower swap speed
Feels table scraps from Fatshark.
Zealot and Psyker get super cool, powerful weapons and Ogryn gets mediocrity. It needs to be much stronger than the bolter. It’s a massive gun on an Ogryn. It needs a tighter shoot pattern as well, when firing automatic. It needs a better firing sound as well.
While Veterans get nothing.
@@sodadrinker89 They just got the dualing swords recently and they are arguably the best/easiest class to use. I'm not about the shed a tear for the vets. Lol. I use all the classes, btw but I played Ogryn the most.
I disagree - I’ve been loving the heavy stubber as the sidearm to my slab shield build. I use the slow hard hitting version with surgical and I can one hit kill all gunners, snipers, and 2-3 hit kill enemies like reapers. I can 4 hit kill a crusher, I believe. Ogryn lacked a decent ranged weapon that can snipe ranged enemies, and now I can. If you have a good vet, you won’t need it often. But I’ve been finding it so nice to hit gunners and snipers when my team is busy. I can push enemies back, swap to ranged, snipe the sniper, and swap back to the slab shield before the enemies are back on me.
Well thats where i said that it can still be used, as a sidearm. But the weapon cant be used properly as a main damage dealer as the twinlinked and kickback can.
I don't understand how a vehicle mounted machine gun is worse than a revolver.
I was really excited to use it when it was first announced but it kinda just felt…meh? Being semi auto while braced is PAINFUL and it feels like the headshots do nothing.
The only reason I like using this weapon is because it can kill Crushers easily. I also find it easier to kill Monsters faster than with a Kickback. I can safely kill 2-3 Crushers at once but 6+ Crusher packs usually get me. With this gun I can kill like 4-5 from far away before they get to me. Only reason I use this gun over the Kickback.
Burst limiter should just have a separate stat for single round weapons(kick back and grenade launcher). So like the normal 8%(buff it tho lol) for full auto and like 20% for a single shot weapon.
Krouk is the superior mark and its intended to (finally) give ogryn a weapon to pop multiple shooters and specials from range. Its best used with melee builds. In this role it is absolutely the best weapon he has available.
Trying to make the Achlys variant work with point blank barrage is just fundamentally misunderstanding the weapon.
Krourk cannot kill any elite gunner with a single shot, it takes 3 headshots to drop scab gunners. It also needs multiple shots to kill any special. If I’m gonna be using a sniper rifle, it better be dropping enemies in one
I actually don't mind the lightest heavy stubber with a blaze away + single target hit buff. 40 rounds isn't bad for blasting down dangerous elites. And its pretty good at shooting down gunners. The lighter gun is quicker to pull out and shoot.
But I won't say its meta or anything. It doesn't have that kickback ability to make 2/3s of a horde disappear in one shot. It is better when the enemies start scattering out though.
I think the heavy stubber actually shines in mid range engagements against multiple targets, where the kickback just doesn't have the firing speed or accuracy to effectively take out several gunners at different elevation and directions. Sure that's when your veteran is meant to do his bloody job, but good luck with that if you play pub games. If you even have someone who is kitted out for that there's every chance he's 40 metres away stealing all the ammo after leaving a whole squad on half HP. For situations like that you just need something that is actually capable of doing the job, does enough damage to two shot gunners, and means you don't get minced or have to spend 60 bullets waiting for your twin linked stubber to actually connect. It's not meant to be build enabling, it's meant to be situational and utility, which it does well enough to get you back into melee range.
In conclusion, BUFF THE OGRYN !
As a Veteran main, I absolutely love the Achlys heavy stubber. I never liked Ogryn beforehand because it felt slow and I couldn't do my favorite thing (snipe specials), but now I'm rewarded for hanging back a lil (with surgical and deadly accurate) and using my new high zoom, one-tap, cleaving, highly ammo efficient gun. With Indomitable, I can quickly get back to the team and rush into melee, or push through a sea of enemies to the backline so I can snipe a priority target from safety and use the increased move speed to get back in the action. I also love the Kickback, but I never felt like a true "Gun-gryn" with its small reserves; the Achlys heavy stubber gets more than twice the ammo reserves of the Kickback.
I maxed this weapon out and enjoyed it, but once I started to push the limits of the build, I had to go back to the kickback. I would love for the Ogryn and his builds get some love so that I have more than 2 ways to play him. It feels like the other classes have nearly infinite ways to create *viable* builds while the Ogryn is corned into one of two, maybe three, depending on your teammates
Flak + Unarmored + Opening Salvo on Achlys will oneshot all ranged elites on headshot without waiting for surgical stacks and still has a leftover blessing slot. You could swap Unarmored for Maniac to oneshot flamers and trappers as well in exchange for losing oneshots on dreg gunners. Killing carapace enemies with your ranged weapon seems entirely unnecessary when weapons like the pickaxe demolish them for free - save the ammo for ranged enemies and specials and take off the carapace perk. I'm not going to deny Kickback has better flexibility nor argue that the stubber is godly, but I think you're underselling it a bit with this setup.
6:47 There is also a very short window where you have to hit those 5 enemies, so they have to be very bunched up otherwise it won't trigger
A bit better range and ammo efficiency than the kickback was sufficient to make it my go-to weapon.
But that's more about Ogryn's weapons being meeh than the heavy stubber being a god-sent.
(Xbox player POV)
The Heavy Stubbers are at best mixed. I love the light variant due to the increased rate of fire to mow down hoards at range with ammo costs and deal good volumes of damage to bosses, without shields*.
Handeling will make or break ranged weapons on controlers due to less precise input controls so the high damage variant may as well not exist for us.
I feel it is a good mid ground option to fill out builds were it is highly melee focused so you aren't 100% relying on rocks or gernades.
Personally, the super accurate shots are a really nice thing to have, but the hipfire just feels like total dogshit. It's super inaccurate but without the volume of fire the twin stubbers have. The sound effects on the light and medium one are also just really weak sounding so they're unpleasant to use.
a human sized revolver should clearly be waaaay more powerful than a ogre sized cannon... :)
To me, the thing that would give these guns a worthwhile role that would also making them more fun would just be a faster swap speed. If they were quick to pull out, then they would at least be a quick special delete for a melee build.
I think the lightest version of the heavy stubber is pretty good. It's powerful enough to stand on its own on a bonebreaker, feel no pain build. Don't use surgical and deadly accurate on it because you get the most value from spamming shots on it with pinning fire + overwhelming fire + flak + maniac. Ammo is still good without gunlugger stuff. It two taps most maniacs and important enemies to get rid of and I find it actually holds up better in havoc mode than the kickback because the kickback loses its one shot capabilites on a lot of enemies in havoc.
I rarely take the heavy stubber over kickback on my taunt/charge builds when I know the vet won't be doing their job. But that's super rare. 99% of the time it's kickback.
hope u get 10k subs this year!
Nah its great, its ogryns best tool for long range gunners, its good vs specials, its good vs dreg ragers, its just a good tool for a melee ogryn. A tier
bait used to be believable
The biggest flaw is that they do not directly make sense to run on Orgyn.
Most of Orgyns' talent nodes (esp where ranged* dmg is concerned) are focused around close range to mid range dmg.
Furthermore, Orgyn does not benefit from low mobilty/DMR style weapons directly unless stats otherwise.
Otgyns biggest flaw is lack of mobility, which is offset by his size and having a "default" cleave with most of his melee.
These are effectively braced headhunters "vigil" for Orgyn.
However, orgyn has no direct talents to focus them around. So they are best used as part of a hybrid build, but I'd you're running hybrid. The kickback is a much better, more foguving option, esp for stagger utility.
The only thing these weapons Excell at is rending on PBB, in which case you are basicly just a worse vet with more hp and dmg.
They offer no new gameplay for Orgyn l and no new reason to pick them over the kickback or twinlinoed for burn stacks.
Rending can be good, but aside from that, they do for too little dmg for their poor stability and rely on crit to even compete in any meaningful way
Great for anti-gunners, but
It's not really Orgyns job to be managing those threats it should be the vets.
Orgyns talents make him so much better for Tanking, Melee combat, and team utility via taunting or support.
Not for Ranged dmg combat unless running specific builds to mitigate Orgyns general lack of ammo even with +25% aside from a few weapons like Kickback, Twinlinked Mk 7, and Mk II ripper.
But generally speaking, Gun-lugger Orgyn just gernally lacks the ammo/dmg to run in high-end difficulty without eating all the ammo to upkeep.
These new weapons can mitigate that a bit. However, they just lack in the proper stability and over reliance on crit to really Excell in any meaninful manner.
Orgyn is just to big and slow with current gunners to even think of running this only gun.
And if running tank there are better option for versatility thst Orgyn generally needs.
If they had 500-700 more dmg, they had better stability, and if Orgyn had a flat +20% to rending in addition to PBB's 30%, I'd say that sounds nice, but no we don't have that so the feel generally terrible for Orgyn to do his natural job according to his current talents.
Just play ES vet with Vigil mk 7 (OS & Surg) . . .
Give Orgyn a Doubble barrelled shotgun instead please, or somthing more intersting than a dmr.
Luke maybe a heavy lazgun lmg kind of thing, or something the orks would use.
It can hit the broadside of a barn from more than 10m away and kill most specialists in one shot, it can even shoot through light terrain. That makes it the best Ogryn gun as far as I'm concerned. But yeah it's for a left/middle tree Ogryn. Maybe the medium version could retain enough damage per shot while making better use of PBB, but honestly I've become too attached to the heavy one's ability to cleave through walls.
It's very whelming.
Agreed on all points. The new single non-linked stubber was a bit of a letdown. It doesn't synergise with the ogryn's gunlugger talents. You can take it on a melee build if you like, but a kickback or twin-linked is likely to be more effective and will synergise if you have some spare points to spend on a couple of shooty nodes.
If Ogryn had more +Crit Chance/Damage talents, BLO got a modifier that was geared towards marksmanship (Increased chance while not shooting or after a weakspot kill?) and Point-Blank Barrage had some better synergy with Crits/High recoil weapons (Double Fire stacks on Crit/Major recoil& spread reduction as a modifier?) Then Stubbers would be in a much better place.
But for now they are an average back-up gun for threats that are realistically gonna get insta-deleted by competent Veterans/Zealots using Plasma/Revolvers.
I be using it on a non-gunlugger build and it serves its purpose of killing specials decently well, imo it should be doing enough damage to oneshot a sniper and twoshot a gunner with the lightest variant though
you're right that it's ass for a gunlugger build but i think it's better than the kickback if all you want most from your gun is killing elites and specialists from range. The kickback is at long ranges is very middling at killing gunners, especially if there's cover at all and then it can struggle to kill anything in a reasonable amount of time. Plus with how gunners strafe this patch, the kickback is way less reliable at killing or suppressing multiple gunners at once. Achyls' ammo efficiency is also much better.
Kickback is a versatile weapon but i find that picks and shields cover all the hording a melee ogryn could need. The achlys' full specialization in ranged target dispatching is much more of what a melee an melee ogryn needs to fill its holes. Despite Ogryn getting nerfed I've felt more consistent and well rounded with a melee build using the achlys than i felt on any kickback build last patch.
Also surgical + opening salvo is the most consistent setup imo, it gives body shot crit breakpoints and non-crit headshot breakpoints, and keeps your damage good even if you don't hit the headshot or get full surgical stacks
It doesn't suck enough!
Nerf ammo capacity, like you did with Ripper guns!
I keep saying the ogryn needs a big ass crossbow or maybe a spear gun
if you use it to fill the same role as kick back, it's good but kickback was already kind of the best so it's not bringing anything new to what ogryn can achieve and it's definitly not better than the kickback
I would say the only thing this weapon does better than Kickback is to get rid of spear shooters where you can just aim and go Pop pop pop and just devastate stalkerks and gunners. But like you said building around it is more or less impossible, not only is nothing in OGryn's Tree that helps it, its ammo ecenomy is not all that great either. But I think it is a solid piece of kit to take along your usua Heavy hitgryn and Tauntgryn builds.
lmao i didn't even notice this weapon had different marks
Stubbers are like efficient, accuate kickbacks... But i can't aim so i like kickback more. 😅
The hip fire really needs to shoot a lot faster.
I think the issue is still just down to his dogwater skill tree. The heavy stubber does fine on its own without building into. Its great in pubs where no one is dealing with long ranged threats. Sure, some weapons may be better, but ogryn doesnt have them.
It should have been an auto cannon
Yea imagine if it was similar to the bolter pistol but with more significant splash damage. Now that would be an Ogryn gun.
Krourk heavy stubber is great on my gunlugger build, melts bosses, kills crushers, all around a great gun
What sucks is I personally really like playing with the heavy stubber :( I wish it made more sense for use.
The worst thing about it is the weird drunkass way fatshark implemented recoil. They decided to do it differently to the way every other good shooter has ever done it, and it feels godawful.
You mean random bloom instead of an actual recoil pattern.
@@berserkerpride No I mean the weird way the reticle travels while your view stays the same. It doesn't feel controllable or good in any way. It was done to be different, and not because it actually ads anything to the experience of shooting the gun. It's the same reason they tied ironsight sway to your view, making aiming damn near impossible on any weapon with iron sights. They changed that back to the way every other shooter does things, and I get the feeling they'll eventually see that reinventing the wheel to be a triangle is a pointless endeavour with this recoil thing too. These are solved issues that they're trying to make change on without understanding why it's done a certain way.
Ogryn needs a full rework man. It amazes me that the tank of the game is less tanky than a crazy ass map rushing zealot who DOES have slightly less armor and HP BUT has so much damage negation and regen ability that is virtually almost twice as tanky as an ogryn tank build it's absolutely stupid.
Also it yet again amazes me that canonically the strongest living being under the Emperor's servitude does less dmg with a straight up TANK SIZED pickaxe than a zealot or veteran can do with a chain axe or chain sword. . . . .where is the logic? The singular melee that makes sense the ogryn can't do much dmg with is the shield and club and one argument is balancing and second is having both a club and a shield means you can't put as much strength into each hit but these arguments don't work for everything else, no1 cares much for balancing since it's a PvE game,there should still be some but it's not a PvP so it doesn't have to be as noticeable andthe second argument is lore wise ogryns not hitting as hard with their knifes as they would with a pickaxe well that knife is still as big as half a normal human(slight exageration) so it should still one shot everything that ain't special.
Anyway my point being ogryn is pointless in botht he role of a tank which the zealots can do better sometimes and he's pointless in terms of dmg aswel,the guns are artificially nerfed "cuz of balancing" despite them shooting ammo as big as most guns are by themselves so they should do anti tank lvls of dmg but barely one shot common infected and all melees suffer form the same treatment. Apparently nerfing the shit out of all the possible things the ogryn can do is FatShark's only way of "balancing" the game -_-
I didn't know Mr.E was my fathers TH-cam channel
The most underwhelming weapon on the weakest class in Darktide is more effective than Astartes in Space Marine 2. My pain is unending.
Could you share a link for you kickback build? Mayhaps with the club and shield
Yes i have a video on it already, look for the thumbnail that says kickback kicks butt
@MisterEtide 👀
Just give them normal sized bolters!!!
Finally i can write into my CV that i made MR E depressed.
I got the job at the card game youtuber BTW. Ggs.
3:25 nice 25% rizz?
Think I'll let Crunch have a long lie-in in the bunks and keep exploring the other classes.
Been enjoying the psyker builds you showed a few months back.
Only occasionally detonating due to too much warp fuckery. And the gun-psyker build has been frenetic fun (need to try the assail version of the build).
Assail with elektro staff is pretty fun. Sometimes you still blow because off laggy server tho. ( but with good server you do atleast tripple damage then others players).
Ogryn is worse at everything than every other class.
If Ogryn is gonna be this slow with all his weapons, at least make it stronger than bolter, or revolver, or infantry rifle, or recon lasgun, or anything at all.
Lets be honest unless you are ammo-maxing with Achylis surgical + 100% extra dmg with crit - there seems to be no point of using heavy stubber over twin linked hs gorgonum. Unless you are fine with having 1 accurate shot and then you either have to slow down and risk taking damage or be LESS accurate than tl hs gorgonum.
You mentioned the Kickback is pretty much universally better. Do you have a build for it? Is it similar to this build? Or does it really just accompany most builds pretty effectively?
Also sorry for asking a billion questions about builds on your videos lol. Still new to the game and I'm not great at identifying crucial points of builds.
I have a kickback centric build on my channel and also all my other ogryn builds use it as the ranged weapon
@@MisterEtide Got it, I'll check that out! Thanks, man!
I'm not a pro player by any means, but i found krourk with Blaze away and either overwhelming fire or pinning fire to be the best option for heavy stubber. Tears through enemies close range without aiming and still good for sniping while aiming long range...just dont stop firing. Lean towards overwhelming fire for large targets personally just dont shoot another enemy mid barrage. Also like massacre as mathematically increased strength crits should add significant dps. Cut out pacemaker and reloaded and rdy since as you stated those talents arent exactly for heavy stubber. Although pacemaker may work better than i thought given the blaze away barrage buff we are going for and it is a single attack. Higher diff's with hordes I'm betting pacemaker is still a very viable option. Eats ammo for sure though just like twin linked heavy stubber.
Additionally I love kickback but the break in toughness regen during every reload is a bummer. Not as much of a problem with krourk heavy stubber! Ogryn shreds through anything and everything during ult phase! 😊
I just use it to shoot specials and gunners on my charge ogryn. It’s definitely not great but it does the job. I really don’t see why the draw time is so bad though considering the intended use cases.
Also why try to force lucky bullet when you could just use something that works more than 8% of the time?
Why he has to charge the bolt every time he pulls it out is behind me.
I hate the krourk too. One youtuber says it can one shot body shot shooters without any perks and it never does for me.
Probably does on malice difficulty!
7:37 - you do get the benefit from Reloaded and Ready on use of Point-Bland Barrage🤓
I agree with you that this weapon is not that good, its damage is not impressive, it's slow(SO DAMN SLOW) and Kickback exists to snipe, suppress and kill everything that lives
With every video you release i am getting sure, that you are just trolling and this is not memt to be informative content, but just comedy
Ehhhh..... I'm not even gonna argue. Just gonna say L take and pretend like I know better than meta goblin Mr E.
Gunlugger Oggy with Achlys II kicks ass.
Thaaaaaaaaank you 😂
Counterpoint:
I love it when i receive Mr E's heavy stubber 🥰
He should get an autocannon or a lascannon weapon. High damage, high accuracy, high armor penetration but low ammo.
You are right that it's terrible on a gun lugger build but it's ok if you just slap it on any build you want to reach out and touch somebody.
Funnly I think the Achlys is the worst one. The Krourk is a good as an anti-gunner DMR with flack, unarmoured, opening salvo and pinning fire while the gorgon is set up how you have it is good vs elite packs and elite/special sniping.
That said I tried it on all my builds and I ended up swapping back to their previous weapons. The closest one was with my Power Maul, the Krourk was good vs rooms full of shooters but I ended up going back to the gorgon twin linked because I like to move and shoot.
I agree.
Finally someone realizing the stubber isn’t great.
Feels like one class needs a mild rework every patch but Ogryn is by far the worst right now. Bad tree, poor weapon variety, little team support and synergy, and now his new weapon sucks. Poor big man :(
I still think hstubber is better than kickback considering it covers the need for accurate long range weapon. Can't exactly do long range with kekback 🥲