Hello everyone! Good news for us, LS enjoyers! Harvest Moon got reworked in Title Update 5, here's what changed: th-cam.com/video/_ay6nlc37gw/w-d-xo.html
Definitely the most un-fun skill ever introduced by Sunbreak. It could very easily be tweaked to be less restrictive and this would not affect the power level of LS substantially, I wonder if Capcom will actually make meaningful changes to any of the switch skills in future updates? Because if not, then I'll mostly be sticking with my sacred sheath.
U state it wouldnt change how good the ls is but i would say LS would be the best weapon in the game if there wasnt this restriction since the dps u get from this is crazy
@@xodiac-gg7049 If Harvest Moon was less restrictive, it would just make it easier and less of a pain in the rear to use. Your max DPS output would not be substantially higher at the highest levels of play, current speedrunners can already use HM optimally. They would still have worse hunt times than all gunners, even restoring the old nerfs LS would be below those weapons that can get over 500 qDPS.
I tried to use Harvest Moon but dropped it after a couple hunts. LS mobility made it difficult to contain yourself in the ring and hunting monsters that pepper you with ranged attacks while you're sitting inside the ring was a no go. I also mostly play in a multiplayer setting with friends, it's just not feasible to use and I had a terrible time trying it out. I really do like the idea but it's too difficult to be able to use optimally with it's current restrictions.
I’ve always had trouble managing harvest moon with the space restriction, but I decided to play Sunbreak a few days ago and use sacred sheathe+ Sakura slash and it felt way better.
It's a shit skill that looks cool but actively detracts from the fun of playing LS optimally, even because it almost doubles your damage output. If it ended up buffed in some minor ways related to one of those 8 points you've made it would become way less tedious to use in actual hunts and make the weapon more fun, but as it is it's just the most unfun skill to actively use in all of Sunbreak.
I loved this video, it is the skill that has the most cons to use, in fact it is so tedious to use the circle that I have decided to abandon it completely. I actually hunt monsters faster without it
Lets be real, the move is absolutely terrible by any standard. Its the nail in coffin for LS in Rise after all its best moves got several nerfs to various aspects of the move (sheath counter and helm breaker). Meanwhile in ranged weapon land: LOL BWGN GO BRRR
@@marcusaaronliaogo9158 there's a difference between a nerf and a butchering And "it's what they deserve"? Fuck off. It's not like there are people who maimed long sword in previous games where it wasn't incredible, and are being treated like shit for continuing to use it, *oh wait.* I will agree that it was a bit too strong in base rise, but basically every other weapon besides the guns and bowcaught up by sunbreak to be on the same playing table as pre nerf ls. Speaking of guns and bow, guess what the strongest weapons in base rise and sunbreak were. In fact, try to guess what weapon has been absurdly op for an incredibly long time now! Guns are worse than ls in nearly every way. They can be so op, and yet very few people complain when clusters prevent teammates from helping, stickies turn the fight into a snoozefest where the monster is constantly ko'ed, or when other ammos and bow users outdamage everything else for relatively low cost. The only weapon in sunbreak that can hold up to gins is greatsword, simply due to how tremendously op the brain dead strong-arm stance is. So while other weapons stayed neutral or received big buffs, long swords are heavily weakened, but given back about their base strength, but under EXTREME restrictions. Instead of a fair balance we are punished for trying to play the fucking game. So please stop with the stupid 'ls op for noobs' memes. It only hurts people in the long run
@@kyogrecrown5869 guns are always op, just look at the real world and see how many main it. Also guns have a preparation aspect on ammo while rise ls you could do no armor and lai counter your way through.
Honestly the most frustrating move in the whole game to me. Using it consistently requires so much factors... I like the base idea of it but in the execution it's way too tedious and restrictive, and actually straight unfun. It makes the gameplay rigid, limit your options a lot and I have this feeling that it's hardly suitable with the natural movement of the weapon. Actually I only use it against the Kadachi.
True but this video is about Harvest Moon xD There are other points I wanted to add, like the Part and Element MVs reduced on the additional hits or the fact that your spirit bar is set to zero when the circle expires, but I just wanted to list the most problematic aspects imo
Serene Pose is far more useful for general play. If you're going for speed run records, then sure, use the circle. Beyond that, the counter is honestly an amazing skill combined with sakura slash. Soaring kick doesn't feel fast enough to break out many helm breakers so I tend to just keep sakura slash and the regular special sheathe on red scroll then soaring kick and sacred sheathe on blue. If you're good at both foresight slash and iai spirit slash, your red guage is basically limitless and you can loop the other big damage skills. If that fails, you can just use sakura slash which has enough range to be considered a global skill.
Your reasons are pretty solid, I like it, the biggest reason for me not to use Harvest Moon because I mainly play online, I still use Counter Style with ISS + Helm Breaker, but never once use Harvest Moon, yes you may agrue that I will deal least damage, but I still have 3 other players so that much doesn't bother me. Even if I play offline, maintaining the circle is pretty hard, just like you said in your video, there are multiple scenario that can make you waste 2 wirebugs for nothing, so for now HM will stay in the box.
personally, i switch between the 2 diff style when i play multiplayer. i especially use special sheath combo with helm breaker to specifically cut tails or hit certain weak spots that i want. i use sakura slash with sacred sheath combo to just hit wherever or to gain the gauge to switch back to helm breaker.
@@leeboonkang2 I do switch between two style too, I use Sacred Sheath mainly to deal big damage whenever I find the big opening for me to do so, and use Special Sheath for general play.
I remember trying it a couple of times but istantly quit the harvest moon idea and instead played sakura+sacred spam/tempered spirit blade counter spam+sacred sheath, i also really like scroll swap because it lets me still iai counter and then sacred sheath in the same combo i really feel like HM is only made for speedrunners because the amount of rng you need to make it work properly or in general simply the amount of stuff that can fuck it up is so huge that it gets so frustrating to play on a normal hunt kinda annoying because i wish we had got some other new cool animation type or skill with great mechanics but its just "revert rise counter nerf by adding 10000 layers of tomfuckery in it" and small personal detail: i dont think the weapon needs buffs at all because sacred sheath and tempered/sakura spam are absolutely insane and do huge amount of dmg, its basically easy mode, i just would have liked a cooler skill than a gimmicky mess
Personally I found using HM and sacred sheathe (the one that can instant parry, timed parry or charge up combo) works great. I don't normally play longsword, at least not since SB released and found sacred sheathe to be OP once you get the timing right. Recently used it in that annoying 4 monster arena fight, and honestly idk how I survived getting doubleteamed so much, but sacred sheathe helped immensely, and since I was inside HM, my counters did good damage. That said, yeah, HM is fairly gimmicky and only works well with the counter playstyle, which this game heavily caters to.
Not really important, but I see rng heavy things as anti speed run actually. Rng always gives me strong casual vibes, and it may also be extremely frustrating and time sinking having to restart a good run because of something which was not the speed runner's fault.
@@lucastperez well speedruns going for the best time possible more often than not have to go for strategies extremely full of rng from the monsters's patterns to other factors like sometimes even the optimal spawn point of a monster in a map. after all the best speed possible will always be behind rng and having the most optimal dps ever and hm does give the highest dps on most monsters, its just that the rng is needed to make it work and yea its extremely frustrating while casual or long time grind is about consistency speedrun is about getting that single one run in 100-1000+ runs or something where you did everything perfect the game rng responded well and you looked fucking cool
They should update it to where the skill just buffs the sword so if you EI spirit slash you can get multiple hits without losing the buff. Like the spirit gauge bar.
you need to lab the counter windows in training mode with the mechanical tetranodon's stomp. when sunbreak came out i had to relearn the longsword. it's capcom's way of ensuring we feel good about an expensive dlc purchase
base on my own experience: 1. it only works in solo hunt, multiplayer, like what the video mentioned, made it lose it effectiveness. 2. it cost 2 wirebugs, which is alot for something that may or may not provide any results. 3. limit your gameplay to mainly use special sheath only. other moves are not as effective and may break the harvest moon. 4. sheathing normally will dispel the harvest moon instantly, which you would do it to use item, drink potion and sometimes even on accident. 5. only good for people that knows what they are doing and good at countering at the right timing every time. 6. the ratio of difficulty of use to effectiveness is too bad. the value of harvest moon is really low and not worth it for most players.
I agree with all of your points, however regarding its viability in multiplayer, I think the perfect counterpart for that is the Sacred Sheathe play style. Due to the monster being focused on you as much anymore you have way more and safer opportunities to do the sheath and charge your combo. It still sucks that your are more or less forced to give up on Harvest Moon in a multiplayer setting. Everything should be fun and effective all the time.
@@teero121 you could do that but i believe majority of the time you would be just sitting there waiting in your circle while the group is hunting the monster just out of your reach. Which i feel isnt worth the wait. I would rather just go and normal attack the monster and potentially do more dps. Plus, the monster might just use range/breath attacks on you when you are too far away from it.
Literally, when Sunbreak dropped, I heard about the Longsword nerfs and assumed Harvest Moon was mandatory now to do relevant damage, and hated it so much I abandoned the weapon after treating it like my easy mode option in the base game. Then all it took for me to come back was to literally just play with Sakura Slash + Sacred Sheathe instead of playing with awful jank boring and restrictive counter-only nonsense so I could actually start having fun again. Please, please, if you're like me and you hate Harvest Moon and it's making you hate Longsword, do yourself the favor and just don't use it. It's a bigger DPS gain to just be hitting the damn monster in a reasonable, fluid and (most importantly) consistent manner instead of trying to play ball with the ridiculous counterattack-only thunderdome getting bounced around, losing time by not wirefalling, and literally being made sit and wait for the idiot Rathian to come to you instead of spitting fireballs for half an hour.
It would be so much better if you could just leave the circle freely and have it remain, so many of its issues stem from that bizarre restriction alone.
Harvest Moon never really made sense to be on Longsword. Longsword uses counters mainly to dodge attacks and to build Spirit Gauge since they deal comparatively little damage, while those that do also come with a high cooldown (Seren Pose) or tight timing (Iai).The main goal is to use Helmbreaker or Sacred Sheathe to their fullest. Now, can we think of a weapon that frequently uses counters, has to move relatively little while fighting, and had chronic problems with dealing damage? Oh, and also has some of the worst Silkbinds? It really feels like the devs just forgott at the time that Lance existed.
@@TanegiHoneydew It definitely is much better now but the Skills are still ass. Skyward Thrust is out of place and also bad, Anchor Rage is just a damage buff and these just should not exist in this form, Spiral Thrust is a nice counter with high damage but is clunky to use, and Twin Vine... I actually like it but it needs more range imo. The useful Switch Skills are boring while the flashy ones are bad.
Honestly, they should remove the ring altogether and change it into a limited timed buff like GS, Hammer and HH +damage/hit. 2 wirebug for an ability that has more cons than pros is just trash. Worse when multiplayer hunts gets taken into account, making it near impossible to use in most situation.
I first used HM on RockKingKong in citadel, and thought " wow this is Cool and Overpowered. Then I used it on anyother monster on anyother map. Mannnn This this is straight dumpster trash. Diablos alone is bigger than the circle and so many monsters jump and fly all over the map. It really stops the fluid nature of longsword gameplay. It's needs tons of adjustments.
When the monster complies Harvest Moon can feel really nice to use, but when the monster decides to camp you out (most of the time) it's absolutely miserable to use.
The Narwa longsword can pretty easily get over 115 thunder, they marginally nerfed the motion values but even on poison builds with Foray I literally don't notice it because that few hundred damage loss is negated by the several thousand we get on sacred sheathe. It's not nearly as easy as something like elemental hammer that just mashes charge attacks in valor mode but that doesn't mean LS is now GU Gunlance
It's also weird to nerf LS with this skill in the first place, they could've just buff other weapons to the level that is closing to LS in base Rise smh.
Remember when people were complaining that rise was too easy, and Ls was too strong. There’s the answer to why they didn’t buff other weapons to that level, and decided to nerf the one weapon. Also it’s several hours less work to nerf one weapon than to buff 13.
because "Iai Spirit Slash + Helm breaker" in base rise was a design failure. Check out Peppo's older vids on this topic. TBH damage-wise the base rise meta playstyle is still pretty solid in sunbreak comparing side to side with other melee weapons, its power level now matches the easiness of this playstyle.
@@hcrdfju4954 Considering Most Melee weapon have strong counter now I think the level of easiness is pretty match with LSS+Helmbreaker now so still no need to nerf damage.
tu5 updated harvest moon it don't knock you back and it has a much wider range also sheathing don't count anymore apparently according to the patch notes.
heres another if your not using it all the time and wasting your time making circles your probably just wasting your time since your dps would be lower than without it unless you consistently use it
While I agree this skill is useless, let's not pretend the other classes have useful wirebug skills. Even the infamous bow has Butcher's Bind which serves almost zero application. SNS and Lance also have a bunch of straight up useless or underwhelming ones for a "whole new skill". Lance has a backflip sheathe, sounds nice.. has its uses, but? It could've been something cooler and better that makes the weapon more viable. HH has a bunch of annoying skills with long set up and crazy recovery frames, even if you cancel it with rolls or scroll swapping. There're many inherent problems but and I wish the devs would clean them all up, but we know they won't.
@@hcrdfju4954 It only works well for a few ammo, mainly Normal and Pierce. For other ammo, it has a low magazine (high overheat build up) and long wind-up to only reach slightly higher than normal fire rate. For HBG that already has large magazine and quick fire rate, crouch shot is absolutely useless. Plus the fact that monster in Sunbreak generally have less and shorter openings for you to use such a high commitment attack, makes it as useful as HBG's melee slam.
Imagine gutting a weapon into oblivion, then releasing a new switch skill that handicaps the player in order to revert the damage nerf, and then calling it "New content". ISS wasn't broken for 99% of players. A counter- based playstyle on a game that runs at 30fps, with monsters that move at different speeds depending on their state, is incredibly difficult to be consistent at. Especially considering most players aren't grinding 1 monster, they're doing them all to progress the story and craft mixed sets. What they've done is made 99% of longsword users suffer because 1% became incredibly proficient with the ISS playstyle at the specific monsters they've memorized. Now most of us are pigeonholed into the boring spin to win Sakura slash spam. And ironically, since they didn't nerf serene pose, now harvest moon serene pose is the new top tier meta. Serene pose literally requires ZERO reaction time. Capcom completely dropped the ball with the longsword changes.
I can see how a speedrunner wouldn't like this but I think it could be a fun play style at least when playing solo. The only thing I really dislike is how expensive it is. I get that the point Harvest Moon is to be rewarded for not having to sheath your weapon to heal or run away from the monster but the two wirebug cost is a bit too much for me.
Funny thing is , you need to be close to speedruner level to use it . The more you get hit the less likely you are to keep the buff (since you have to heal) . For run of the mill common player , that thing is a waste of wirebugs
@@shadowkhan422 True but there are all these variables and random things that can happen that he mentions in his video. If Harvest Moon would just require you to have the weapon unsheathed then Peppo would have nothing bad to say about it. The fact that he and other speedrunners have to deal with the monsters position on top of getting good rng for their attack patterns and openings is what I meant. But I agree with you that you have to be very good in order to make efficient use for it. The circle is simply too restrictive, even for top level speedrunners.
Wow, and yet ppl were still salty asf when the longsword showcase trailer came out. They were acting like sacred sheath and harvest moon were op and proceeded to bash the ls just for being so good in base rise and just for receiving any new skills in sunbreak at all, anyone besides ls players just jumping in the longsword hate bandwagon... smfh.
Remember that they were basically dripfeeding the community info at the time. We didn't know the exact specifics of how it would work until we got our hands on the full game.
Its a shame- I love the idea of the harvest moon, but ya- The execution is pretty lackluster. Some ideas to make it actually usable: Increase the size of the circle. Have the circle grant an effect similar to the diversion jewel (to assist in multiplayer games) Get rid of the knockback at the edge. Maybe dont have the ring despawn when you leave the zone- and only when you put your weapon away. Reduce either the cooldown, or cost of harvest moon. its way, WAY to easy to have harvest moon wasted from the getgo. Maybe reduce the animation/cast time of harvest moon, or allow the hunter to continue to reposition while casting it. If youre going to keep it phenomenally restricted: Maybe buff the core mechanics of special sheath further since it focuses so much on special sheath. While in the circle have it expand the counter window similar to what it was in rise, maybe let you stay in the special sheath stance longer, maybe augment the initial draw attacks from special sheath Or anything. Its such a cool ability- but its impractical to use in a lot of situations.
Meanwhile CB users just counter and deal 600 dmg per phial. Not hating on CB but mannn we always live in a world where LS suffers after a major update haha. RIP LS. And no, ISS in base rise isnt broken, now almost everyweapon in sunbreak is broken except the longsword.
Good How does that feel on not being favorite child of mh dev anymore? Know lance and Gunlance players have to endure undeserving nerf from the start I glad they nerfed LS and I hope they nerf LS more in upcoming Update
Since I only play LS I wonder if the Harvest Moon equivalent moves exists for other weapons as well, I really hope they will get rid of these unnatural and anti-fun to use moves in MH6
No these types of moves don't exist on other weapons,Harvest Moon came into existence because the MH community complained incessantly about LS being the best weapon in the game (even though it wasn't) so Capcom did this to nerf the most fun/optimal LS play style in order to appease all the people that cried about the LS before sunbreak
@@izanagiorochi5145 Uh no. 1. it was the strongest weapon bar none, and 2. it wasn’t the most fun playstyle, it was the most optimal though. I understand that you are a salty LS main, everyone can see that, but you have to understand, having the single most generous counter, that had the highest damage was a bit much. Harvest moon doesn’t even just help undo the nerf btw. It has other effects, that no one acknowledges, like its unhinged spirit effect. Counter LS has overstayed its welcome, deal with it, cry about it, and move on. Edit: Before you complain further, here’s a list (in base rise) of harder (non-silkbind counters) counters to activate, that did leagues less damage than Lai slash counter: Guard Slash(SnS), Dodgebolt(Bow), Insta-Block(Lance), water strike(hammer), forsight slash(Long sword), Advancing Roundslash(Insect glaive), and lastly, while I’m not to keen on calling these “counters,” Guard Points(charge blade). Just so you know, Guard slash, Water strike, and advancing roundslash, became harder to active in sunbreak, in guard slash’s case, literally unusable against EVERYTHING that isn’t a light projectile. Cry how your over-tuned attack got balanced, seethe and weep.
@@thelostician maybe he is salty LS main. Or probably you are salty LS hater. I'm sure you baffled that LS player dare to discuss deserved nerfs. IMO ranged weapons a just hilariously strong - but I'm glad they having fun. No need to write an essay how it's unfair. LS was and is fun with counter playstyle, numbers is the proof
Honestly I'm not bothered by this ls Nerf much since we got sacred sheath, though I felt the Nerf was deserved, I felt that reducing the weapon damage to half it's original damage was a little too much. Nevertheless, since we got sacred sheath I'm happy with the Nerf since I got to try a new playstyle and make use of Sakura slash as well and I'm having way more fun than Iss +helmbreaker playstyle.
This is quite painful since I really loved the ISS+HB loop playstyle from base Rise. In Sunbreak you can be better off just using boring old foresight slash since it's easier to aim for the good hitzones and get guaranteed damage. I still go for ISS+HB though because it's so much fun even with the massive nerf.
@@zentember I find sakura slash super boring unfortunately. I don't really like playing with sacred sheathe, but it might be cool coupled with tempered spirit blade. Maybe I'll try that eventually.
@@jstar2235 I used to feel exactly like you until they gave us two skill scrolls for sunbreak. Sakura keeps us on the ground and it's a decent positioning tool used in conjunction with HB. Soaring kick on two skill scrolls seems like less diversity for various situations that call for ground movement and repositioning that Sakura lets us do
@@zentember It just didn't work out for me. Sakura slash feels like the most boring and safe way to build meter. Combining sakura slash and sacred sheathe made me wanna drop the weapon entirely, so I just went back to ISS+HB. Tempered spirit blade coupled with serene pose seems to have some potential though.
@@jstar2235 the insane thing about sacred sheathe is i've dropped quick sheathe 3 because capcom is trying to punish us for keeping old strats. ISS + HB is great though and still good bread and butter. I didn't consider sakura until ISS HB got nerfed and now their cooldown is an identical 32 seconds without wirebug whisperer 3.
I kind of like and hate harvest moon at the same time. I like that they somehow nerfed ISS just to give it back it's old power by using harvest moon, but with additional difficulties like the smaller movement radius and not being allowed to get hit too often, because ISS in base Rise was just broken af. On the other hand it's really frustrating and annoying how rng based and unforgiving harvest moon is. Especially in multi-player it can be completely useless. However, I like using blood rite, so when the monster is damaged I don't have to heal, making it possible to get hit and still keep harvest moon, what allows for a aggressive but risky play style. Also, provoker helps to get the attention from the monster more often, what makes it a bit less of a pain sometimes. Nonetheless I find myself often enough just switching back to Sakura spam and sacred sheath playstyle, because HM is just so frustrating. Since this playstyle can be very boring, I still prefer HM with ISS tho, there's nothing better than getting those juicy numbers when it works perfectly
should we try to equip aggro drawing skills and stink mink whenever we use it for multiplayer? it would guarantee better monster lock on. is the damage it provides us 2x? whether we use it or not should be a number based analysis. Maybe we should think of staying inside the ring as a spacing challenge
Unfortunately the aggro mechanics in this game are trash and even a Diversion Twin Vines Lance can't keep a monster's attention for most of a 4-player hunt. And the stinkmink only lasts for like 20 seconds if you don't use it to lure a monster to a different area. Either aggro skills need a significant buff, or some moves need to depend on aggro way less
Not worth it bro just use sacred sheath + Sakura slash, way more flexible plus the damage numbers of sacred sheath feel way more satisfying once you land it
They fucked up balancing this weapon in base rise and this is the price they pay. Thankfully they'll work out a better solution in the next gen so harvest moon will never appear in any other MH game.
I'd understand it being really trashy if at least it recharged fast, but... erh... you're better off just focusing on combos and keeping wirebugs for Tempered Counter.
I sometime use Harvest Moon but, the time is quite varied. I understand TA originally depends on Monster's action but, Harvest Moon is too much. I think it is not suitable for game system of MH.
I don’t main Long sword but the few times that I mess with it. Harvest moon I usually use when the monster is down or in a trap. And I think that’s the reason for it. But I don’t know. But yeah they really do need to adjust or fix it.
You cleary don't know how Havest Moon work, HM add dmg attack bonus for counter attack not you normal attack or strong charge attack, so if monster down or in a trap is useless.
Harvest moon encourages you to use spam the counter by making it do dmg like in base rise but severly restricting your movement which is imo not very fun. I think they should have buffed the dmg of the normal attack, spirit combos and or red guage while leaving the helmet breaker dmg (maybe buffing it a little) but nerfing the cooldown more so there are more fun ways to play instead of a clear optimal way in which u spam counter and helmet breaker. The arguement about ls was that it did too much dmg for how (easy) it is so making you do dmg more actively should make it harder. (Also gs with its counter is arguably more busted than base rise ls)
Greatsword is honestly stupidly good this game. Helm breaker is fine as is. I find myself relying more on sacred sheath combo or serene pose more for convenience because guage levels are basically free. Especially for those juicy 2k damage sacred sheath wakeups...if they can still wake up after.
Except Harvest moon literally doesn’t encourage counter spam, otherwise it wouldn’t give the unhinged spirit effect of infinite spirit gauge. I bet you didn’t even know it did that, did you?
@@thelostician Relax i did know that but having the infinite gauge in this case is just a convenience. If you wanna use it fully you will have to hope that the monster you are fighting is in range of the circle, doesnt attack and gives you an opening long enough to use the complete spirit combos when you could simply go use sacred/special sheath to do most likely more damage while leveling your gauge. Gaining and maintaining meter is also not very difficult in this game. Having to use a few drawn double slashes for meter but being able to move freely, use wirefall and so on is way more comfy and consistent than using harvest moon. (If you are not using counters)
2:00 how is this an actual point tho… Like, it’s the case for literally EVERY move in the game except for a few with hyper armor. Imagine if gs player complained about TCS being stoppable, just play the game normally and use an opening like everyone else… Aside from that, I think they could’ve find a better way to nerf counter playstyle. It obviously needed a nerf but this is a bit excessive i must admit. I personally enjoy sacred sheath way more so maybe I don’t quite get how significant it is.
It is not an attack tho. Your point doesn't make sense because you are comparing it with an actual attack that deal damage in the exact moment you use that attack. To make it fair you should compare it to the Rising's Sun of HBG for example. Imagine using that silkbind and if you get hit once you lose the ring immediately, that doesn't make sense, especially because of the cost and the 23 seconds of CD.
@@PeppoLS Yeah but it’s a buff so it still represent a direct increase in DPS. And it’s not a small buff so I think it should demand quite a heavy commitment (I don’t even find it that bad honestly). And I’m not hating on longsword at all I just felt that complaining about losing a buff when interrupted was weird in a game like monster hunter… (Sorry if I sounded aggressive I just don’t speak English that well)
@@petrychores6354 tbh i will say that until you try it you might go nah im sure ill be fine but me personally after trying it i never wanna see that damned circle again probably one of those things that doesnt sound as bad until you try it and especially since you have to do it repeatedly either because you reflexively wirefall you want to heal and dont have radial menu for potions or you accidentally clicked the use item button or you just get hit by an attack and sent flying just really annoying
genuinely baffled at how terrible harvest moon is. i was so excited for it in the reveal for sunbreak skills. desperately tried to make it work, but it is just way too restrictive. i think if it didnt go away from sheathing it would be a lot more viable.
Hello everyone! Good news for us, LS enjoyers!
Harvest Moon got reworked in Title Update 5, here's what changed: th-cam.com/video/_ay6nlc37gw/w-d-xo.html
円月は
・出入りは自由で、納刀しても消えないようにする(効果は範囲内のみ)
・攻撃が当たった空間ではなく、当たった箇所に追撃が発生するように調整
・蟲消費を1にする
これぐらいの調整がきてもぶっ壊れにはならないはず…というかきてくれないとマジでただのTA関連のストレス要素にしかならんぞ…
ぶっ壊れるて
虫は減らしちゃアカンやろ
太刀使いとしてとても共感出来た
居合抜刀気刃斬りをメインで使ってると火力が足りないから円月を使わざるを得ないんだけど、動画で紹介しているようなあまりにも酷い欠点があるから使いたく無くなる。使っててストレスが溜まる鉄蟲糸技は円月だけだよ。
Definitely the most un-fun skill ever introduced by Sunbreak. It could very easily be tweaked to be less restrictive and this would not affect the power level of LS substantially, I wonder if Capcom will actually make meaningful changes to any of the switch skills in future updates? Because if not, then I'll mostly be sticking with my sacred sheath.
U state it wouldnt change how good the ls is but i would say LS would be the best weapon in the game if there wasnt this restriction since the dps u get from this is crazy
@@xodiac-gg7049 If Harvest Moon was less restrictive, it would just make it easier and less of a pain in the rear to use. Your max DPS output would not be substantially higher at the highest levels of play, current speedrunners can already use HM optimally. They would still have worse hunt times than all gunners, even restoring the old nerfs LS would be below those weapons that can get over 500 qDPS.
How is that tu5 lookin.
@@KazuYuuu yeah that’s all true but it’s just so fucking COOL
I'd rather have Tempered Spirit Blade but it's in the first slot.
Oh I wish!
Harvest moon is truly a piece of trash. Nice video, I didn't know why exactly we lost extra hits.
now LS red dps matches the other weapons, lol
Cool content, now I'm going to continue using it.
Same, it's fun.
ご自由に
I tried to use Harvest Moon but dropped it after a couple hunts. LS mobility made it difficult to contain yourself in the ring and hunting monsters that pepper you with ranged attacks while you're sitting inside the ring was a no go. I also mostly play in a multiplayer setting with friends, it's just not feasible to use and I had a terrible time trying it out. I really do like the idea but it's too difficult to be able to use optimally with it's current restrictions.
I’ve always had trouble managing harvest moon with the space restriction, but I decided to play Sunbreak a few days ago and use sacred sheathe+ Sakura slash and it felt way better.
Best combo. Just repeat
I'm now glad that I never bothered to include Harvest Moon in my movement repertoire and just left serene pose in that slot on both scrolls.
i stopped using harvest moon when i realized even after faster hunts i was just frustrated
円月、苦手意識が高くて使ってなかったからモンスターが動くと追撃が減ったり、二度吹っ飛ばされると円が消えるのを初めて知った
ますます円月から離れてしまいますねこれは…
It's a shit skill that looks cool but actively detracts from the fun of playing LS optimally, even because it almost doubles your damage output.
If it ended up buffed in some minor ways related to one of those 8 points you've made it would become way less tedious to use in actual hunts and make the weapon more fun, but as it is it's just the most unfun skill to actively use in all of Sunbreak.
一人だけ縛りプレイ強いられてんのに火力もそこまで強いわけではないってのが一番終わってる
ロマンにすらなれない
本当にそれ。ライズのときも同じだったけど武器調整の仕方が下手すぎる。
I loved this video, it is the skill that has the most cons to use, in fact it is so tedious to use the circle that I have decided to abandon it completely. I actually hunt monsters faster without it
円狭いし、蟲２つ使う上に隙だらけだから、円月の追撃もっとダメージあっていいと思う。
The Black Ops 2 Multiplayer music really threw me back! Great arguments against Harvest Moon
Lets be real, the move is absolutely terrible by any standard.
Its the nail in coffin for LS in Rise after all its best moves got several nerfs to various aspects of the move (sheath counter and helm breaker).
Meanwhile in ranged weapon land: LOL BWGN GO BRRR
Well deserved nerf
@@marcusaaronliaogo9158 while bowguns get more buffs. The nerf was deserved but c'mon they should've made harvest moon more comfy.
@@marcusaaronliaogo9158 there's a difference between a nerf and a butchering
And "it's what they deserve"? Fuck off. It's not like there are people who maimed long sword in previous games where it wasn't incredible, and are being treated like shit for continuing to use it, *oh wait.* I will agree that it was a bit too strong in base rise, but basically every other weapon besides the guns and bowcaught up by sunbreak to be on the same playing table as pre nerf ls.
Speaking of guns and bow, guess what the strongest weapons in base rise and sunbreak were. In fact, try to guess what weapon has been absurdly op for an incredibly long time now! Guns are worse than ls in nearly every way. They can be so op, and yet very few people complain when clusters prevent teammates from helping, stickies turn the fight into a snoozefest where the monster is constantly ko'ed, or when other ammos and bow users outdamage everything else for relatively low cost. The only weapon in sunbreak that can hold up to gins is greatsword, simply due to how tremendously op the brain dead strong-arm stance is.
So while other weapons stayed neutral or received big buffs, long swords are heavily weakened, but given back about their base strength, but under EXTREME restrictions. Instead of a fair balance we are punished for trying to play the fucking game.
So please stop with the stupid 'ls op for noobs' memes. It only hurts people in the long run
@@kyogrecrown5869 guns are always op, just look at the real world and see how many main it. Also guns have a preparation aspect on ammo while rise ls you could do no armor and lai counter your way through.
@@marcusaaronliaogo9158 That might be the dumbest argument for the bowguns I've ever heard.
いくらライズで暴れたからってこんなゴミみたいな虫技押し付けられたのは不憫だな
カウンター限定じゃなくて範囲内にいるだけで攻撃力1.3倍くらいあっても許される
それでも行動範囲制限のせいで弱いけど
Honestly the most frustrating move in the whole game to me. Using it consistently requires so much factors...
I like the base idea of it but in the execution it's way too tedious and restrictive, and actually straight unfun. It makes the gameplay rigid, limit your options a lot and I have this feeling that it's hardly suitable with the natural movement of the weapon.
Actually I only use it against the Kadachi.
Reason 9: Serene Pose is "really good" in sunbreak, because unlike Iai Spirit Slash it remains un-nerfed.
True but this video is about Harvest Moon xD There are other points I wanted to add, like the Part and Element MVs reduced on the additional hits or the fact that your spirit bar is set to zero when the circle expires, but I just wanted to list the most problematic aspects imo
Shhhh...
The other weapon mains are gonna hear you.
Serene Pose is far more useful for general play. If you're going for speed run records, then sure, use the circle. Beyond that, the counter is honestly an amazing skill combined with sakura slash. Soaring kick doesn't feel fast enough to break out many helm breakers so I tend to just keep sakura slash and the regular special sheathe on red scroll then soaring kick and sacred sheathe on blue. If you're good at both foresight slash and iai spirit slash, your red guage is basically limitless and you can loop the other big damage skills. If that fails, you can just use sakura slash which has enough range to be considered a global skill.
Your reasons are pretty solid, I like it, the biggest reason for me not to use Harvest Moon because I mainly play online, I still use Counter Style with ISS + Helm Breaker, but never once use Harvest Moon, yes you may agrue that I will deal least damage, but I still have 3 other players so that much doesn't bother me. Even if I play offline, maintaining the circle is pretty hard, just like you said in your video, there are multiple scenario that can make you waste 2 wirebugs for nothing, so for now HM will stay in the box.
personally, i switch between the 2 diff style when i play multiplayer. i especially use special sheath combo with helm breaker to specifically cut tails or hit certain weak spots that i want. i use sakura slash with sacred sheath combo to just hit wherever or to gain the gauge to switch back to helm breaker.
@@leeboonkang2 I do switch between two style too, I use Sacred Sheath mainly to deal big damage whenever I find the big opening for me to do so, and use Special Sheath for general play.
何でこんな不便な仕様で実装したのか理解に苦しむ
少なくともカプコンはこな仕様で十分強い、あるいは楽しいと思ったってことでいいんだよね？
I remember trying it a couple of times but istantly quit the harvest moon idea and instead played sakura+sacred spam/tempered spirit blade counter spam+sacred sheath, i also really like scroll swap because it lets me still iai counter and then sacred sheath in the same combo
i really feel like HM is only made for speedrunners because the amount of rng you need to make it work properly or in general simply the amount of stuff that can fuck it up is so huge that it gets so frustrating to play on a normal hunt kinda annoying because i wish we had got some other new cool animation type or skill with great mechanics but its just "revert rise counter nerf by adding 10000 layers of tomfuckery in it"
and small personal detail: i dont think the weapon needs buffs at all because sacred sheath and tempered/sakura spam are absolutely insane and do huge amount of dmg, its basically easy mode, i just would have liked a cooler skill than a gimmicky mess
Personally I found using HM and sacred sheathe (the one that can instant parry, timed parry or charge up combo) works great. I don't normally play longsword, at least not since SB released and found sacred sheathe to be OP once you get the timing right. Recently used it in that annoying 4 monster arena fight, and honestly idk how I survived getting doubleteamed so much, but sacred sheathe helped immensely, and since I was inside HM, my counters did good damage. That said, yeah, HM is fairly gimmicky and only works well with the counter playstyle, which this game heavily caters to.
Not really important, but I see rng heavy things as anti speed run actually. Rng always gives me strong casual vibes, and it may also be extremely frustrating and time sinking having to restart a good run because of something which was not the speed runner's fault.
@@lucastperez well speedruns going for the best time possible more often than not have to go for strategies extremely full of rng from the monsters's patterns to other factors like sometimes even the optimal spawn point of a monster in a map.
after all the best speed possible will always be behind rng and having the most optimal dps ever
and hm does give the highest dps on most monsters, its just that the rng is needed to make it work and yea its extremely frustrating
while casual or long time grind is about consistency speedrun is about getting that single one run in 100-1000+ runs or something where you did everything perfect the game rng responded well and you looked fucking cool
@@doteianima6370 Yeah definitely. I was thinking more generally, like games that are RNG heavy give me a casual feel, but you are absolutely correct.
円月はほんまに調整ミスレベルでクソや、他の武器のバフ蟲技が自分に付与する系なのに太刀だけ場所(しかも狭い)にバフするのマジでどのモンスターにも噛み合わん。
ライズで太刀強すぎたからってちょっと弱くしすぎなんよ。
They should update it to where the skill just buffs the sword so if you EI spirit slash you can get multiple hits without losing the buff. Like the spirit gauge bar.
Honestly wasn't expecting a vid like this after watching some of your speed runs lol
reason 1 : cannot counter
reason 2 : cannot counter confidently
reason 3 : i am countered by the monster instead of countering it 😂😂
you need to lab the counter windows in training mode with the mechanical tetranodon's stomp. when sunbreak came out i had to relearn the longsword. it's capcom's way of ensuring we feel good about an expensive dlc purchase
base on my own experience:
1. it only works in solo hunt, multiplayer, like what the video mentioned, made it lose it effectiveness.
2. it cost 2 wirebugs, which is alot for something that may or may not provide any results.
3. limit your gameplay to mainly use special sheath only. other moves are not as effective and may break the harvest moon.
4. sheathing normally will dispel the harvest moon instantly, which you would do it to use item, drink potion and sometimes even on accident.
5. only good for people that knows what they are doing and good at countering at the right timing every time.
6. the ratio of difficulty of use to effectiveness is too bad. the value of harvest moon is really low and not worth it for most players.
I agree with all of your points, however regarding its viability in multiplayer, I think the perfect counterpart for that is the Sacred Sheathe play style. Due to the monster being focused on you as much anymore you have way more and safer opportunities to do the sheath and charge your combo. It still sucks that your are more or less forced to give up on Harvest Moon in a multiplayer setting. Everything should be fun and effective all the time.
@@teero121 you could do that but i believe majority of the time you would be just sitting there waiting in your circle while the group is hunting the monster just out of your reach. Which i feel isnt worth the wait. I would rather just go and normal attack the monster and potentially do more dps. Plus, the monster might just use range/breath attacks on you when you are too far away from it.
兜の威力は妥当、クールタイム長すぎ、円月は言わずもがなゴミ。sb太刀調整したやつまじで終わってます
Literally, when Sunbreak dropped, I heard about the Longsword nerfs and assumed Harvest Moon was mandatory now to do relevant damage, and hated it so much I abandoned the weapon after treating it like my easy mode option in the base game. Then all it took for me to come back was to literally just play with Sakura Slash + Sacred Sheathe instead of playing with awful jank boring and restrictive counter-only nonsense so I could actually start having fun again.
Please, please, if you're like me and you hate Harvest Moon and it's making you hate Longsword, do yourself the favor and just don't use it. It's a bigger DPS gain to just be hitting the damn monster in a reasonable, fluid and (most importantly) consistent manner instead of trying to play ball with the ridiculous counterattack-only thunderdome getting bounced around, losing time by not wirefalling, and literally being made sit and wait for the idiot Rathian to come to you instead of spitting fireballs for half an hour.
It would be so much better if you could just leave the circle freely and have it remain, so many of its issues stem from that bizarre restriction alone.
Harvest Moon never really made sense to be on Longsword. Longsword uses counters mainly to dodge attacks and to build Spirit Gauge since they deal comparatively little damage, while those that do also come with a high cooldown (Seren Pose) or tight timing (Iai).The main goal is to use Helmbreaker or Sacred Sheathe to their fullest.
Now, can we think of a weapon that frequently uses counters, has to move relatively little while fighting, and had chronic problems with dealing damage? Oh, and also has some of the worst Silkbinds? It really feels like the devs just forgott at the time that Lance existed.
Lance got buffed in sunbreak tho, insta guard does a lot of damage.
Lance got a massive buff in Sunbreak, it's much nicer now than base Rise.
But yeah I agree with you, Devs really put Harvest Moon on the wrong weapon.
@@TanegiHoneydew It definitely is much better now but the Skills are still ass. Skyward Thrust is out of place and also bad, Anchor Rage is just a damage buff and these just should not exist in this form, Spiral Thrust is a nice counter with high damage but is clunky to use, and Twin Vine... I actually like it but it needs more range imo. The useful Switch Skills are boring while the flashy ones are bad.
harvest moob total cooldown is like 30 secs while strongarm is like 10 secs
@@Godslayer96 anchor rage is based on a mhgu hunter art.
海外勢からも円月は不評ばっかりだな…
もっと使いやすくしていいのでは？
太刀ばっかり弱体化してるけど、結局DPSがあるのは太刀ではなくて弓とボウガンだからね…😅
つまり、欠陥、と。
カプコン公式、どうにかしてくれないかな…
円月が弱いだけならここまで不満は出なかったかもしれないけど兜割や居合抜刀が弱体化されたところに追加されたのがこれっていうのが太刀使い馬鹿にしてるとしか思えなくてイライラした
Honestly, they should remove the ring altogether and change it into a limited timed buff like GS, Hammer and HH +damage/hit. 2 wirebug for an ability that has more cons than pros is just trash. Worse when multiplayer hunts gets taken into account, making it near impossible to use in most situation.
I first used HM on RockKingKong in citadel, and thought " wow this is Cool and Overpowered. Then I used it on anyother monster on anyother map. Mannnn This this is straight dumpster trash. Diablos alone is bigger than the circle and so many monsters jump and fly all over the map. It really stops the fluid nature of longsword gameplay. It's needs tons of adjustments.
When the monster complies Harvest Moon can feel really nice to use, but when the monster decides to camp you out (most of the time) it's absolutely miserable to use.
Rarely used HM but in the end I never use it at all and switched back to Serene Pose.
Portable Devs really nerfing LS down to earth on Damage.
The Narwa longsword can pretty easily get over 115 thunder, they marginally nerfed the motion values but even on poison builds with Foray I literally don't notice it because that few hundred damage loss is negated by the several thousand we get on sacred sheathe. It's not nearly as easy as something like elemental hammer that just mashes charge attacks in valor mode but that doesn't mean LS is now GU Gunlance
いつもあなたの動画を視聴、参考にしています！
これほどの人が声を挙げているのを見て少し安心しました。
今更ながら特にテスカトルta動画（team darkside）はいつも私のモチベーションになっています。
It's also weird to nerf LS with this skill in the first place, they could've just buff other weapons to the level that is closing to LS in base Rise smh.
Remember when people were complaining that rise was too easy, and Ls was too strong.
There’s the answer to why they didn’t buff other weapons to that level, and decided to nerf the one weapon.
Also it’s several hours less work to nerf one weapon than to buff 13.
They actually buffed a lot of weapons and their attacks. Playing Hammer in Sunbreak makes a huge difference to playing it in base Rise...
because "Iai Spirit Slash + Helm breaker" in base rise was a design failure. Check out Peppo's older vids on this topic. TBH damage-wise the base rise meta playstyle is still pretty solid in sunbreak comparing side to side with other melee weapons, its power level now matches the easiness of this playstyle.
@@hcrdfju4954 Considering Most Melee weapon have strong counter now I think the level of easiness is pretty match with LSS+Helmbreaker now so still no need to nerf damage.
円月を薦める唯一の理由:かっこいいから
Heh, the sacred sheath feels way more cooler, atleast that's what I feel. Harvest moon just feels silly for most part.
The thing I hate the most is the wire fall action removes it. That's just frustrating.
日本語訳ありがとうございます
短くて凄く分かりやすかった
太刀の円月に憧れて使おうとしてたけど、諦めます笑
とてもかっこいいのに
改めてダメなところ羅列されると開発は薬キメながら作ったんじゃないかと思うレベルでゴミやな
If the alternative is brainless sakura slash spam into sacred sheathe id rather be ineffective than not having fun
Our lord peppo doing the right thing and leading people to play sacred sheat
tu5 updated harvest moon it don't knock you back and it has a much wider range also sheathing don't count anymore apparently according to the patch notes.
bo2のBGMやんけ！
神過ぎる…最近steam版買って久々遊んでるけど
あれを超えるFPSに未だにあったことがない…
単純に他武器みたいな武器自体にかけるバフでいいのになんでこんなくそ使用にしたのか理解に苦しむ
When it was leaked, everyone was raging over how it would broke the longsword even more. And now it’s just a broken move.
heres another if your not using it all the time and wasting your time making circles your probably just wasting your time since your dps would be lower than without it unless you consistently use it
While I agree this skill is useless, let's not pretend the other classes have useful wirebug skills. Even the infamous bow has Butcher's Bind which serves almost zero application. SNS and Lance also have a bunch of straight up useless or underwhelming ones for a "whole new skill". Lance has a backflip sheathe, sounds nice.. has its uses, but? It could've been something cooler and better that makes the weapon more viable. HH has a bunch of annoying skills with long set up and crazy recovery frames, even if you cancel it with rolls or scroll swapping. There're many inherent problems but and I wish the devs would clean them all up, but we know they won't.
It's basically the crouch shot of HBG. They added a switch skill move just for the sake of adding it without thinking of its actual usefulness
Whats wrong with crouch shot? It works as great as its previous counterparts in sunbreak.
@@hcrdfju4954 It only works well for a few ammo, mainly Normal and Pierce. For other ammo, it has a low magazine (high overheat build up) and long wind-up to only reach slightly higher than normal fire rate. For HBG that already has large magazine and quick fire rate, crouch shot is absolutely useless. Plus the fact that monster in Sunbreak generally have less and shorter openings for you to use such a high commitment attack, makes it as useful as HBG's melee slam.
Imagine gutting a weapon into oblivion, then releasing a new switch skill that handicaps the player in order to revert the damage nerf, and then calling it "New content".
ISS wasn't broken for 99% of players. A counter- based playstyle on a game that runs at 30fps, with monsters that move at different speeds depending on their state, is incredibly difficult to be consistent at. Especially considering most players aren't grinding 1 monster, they're doing them all to progress the story and craft mixed sets. What they've done is made 99% of longsword users suffer because 1% became incredibly proficient with the ISS playstyle at the specific monsters they've memorized.
Now most of us are pigeonholed into the boring spin to win Sakura slash spam. And ironically, since they didn't nerf serene pose, now harvest moon serene pose is the new top tier meta. Serene pose literally requires ZERO reaction time. Capcom completely dropped the ball with the longsword changes.
Just lie to your friends and tell them its a damage buff for the whole party and your friends will stay in the circle
I can see how a speedrunner wouldn't like this but I think it could be a fun play style at least when playing solo. The only thing I really dislike is how expensive it is. I get that the point Harvest Moon is to be rewarded for not having to sheath your weapon to heal or run away from the monster but the two wirebug cost is a bit too much for me.
Funny thing is , you need to be close to speedruner level to use it . The more you get hit the less likely you are to keep the buff (since you have to heal) . For run of the mill common player , that thing is a waste of wirebugs
@@shadowkhan422 Was gonna say, a lot of speedruns involve stunlocking the monster in place.
Seems kinda perfect for that.
@@shadowkhan422 True but there are all these variables and random things that can happen that he mentions in his video. If Harvest Moon would just require you to have the weapon unsheathed then Peppo would have nothing bad to say about it. The fact that he and other speedrunners have to deal with the monsters position on top of getting good rng for their attack patterns and openings is what I meant.
But I agree with you that you have to be very good in order to make efficient use for it. The circle is simply too restrictive, even for top level speedrunners.
Tbh not even close to fun playstyle even while playing solo. Sacred sheath looks way more meaty and fun than harvest moon.
Wow, and yet ppl were still salty asf when the longsword showcase trailer came out. They were acting like sacred sheath and harvest moon were op and proceeded to bash the ls just for being so good in base rise and just for receiving any new skills in sunbreak at all, anyone besides ls players just jumping in the longsword hate bandwagon... smfh.
Remember that they were basically dripfeeding the community info at the time. We didn't know the exact specifics of how it would work until we got our hands on the full game.
HM is the reason I stopped playing LS and went to IG and SA instead 😢
カプコンさん、見てますか？
まじでこの動画見て反省して欲しいわ
Its a shame- I love the idea of the harvest moon, but ya- The execution is pretty lackluster.
Some ideas to make it actually usable: Increase the size of the circle.
Have the circle grant an effect similar to the diversion jewel (to assist in multiplayer games)
Get rid of the knockback at the edge.
Maybe dont have the ring despawn when you leave the zone- and only when you put your weapon away.
Reduce either the cooldown, or cost of harvest moon. its way, WAY to easy to have harvest moon wasted from the getgo.
Maybe reduce the animation/cast time of harvest moon, or allow the hunter to continue to reposition while casting it.
If youre going to keep it phenomenally restricted: Maybe buff the core mechanics of special sheath further since it focuses so much on special sheath. While in the circle have it expand the counter window similar to what it was in rise, maybe let you stay in the special sheath stance longer, maybe augment the initial draw attacks from special sheath
Or anything. Its such a cool ability- but its impractical to use in a lot of situations.
Being able to reposition it at no cost while it's still active sounds good.
Harvest moon as 1 good use if the monster is down use it to have endless spirit slashes (only time I use in multiplayer)
剛気刃斬りといい円月といい太刀の新鉄蟲糸技はどうしてここまで不遇なんだろうか…。
円月前提の調整はいいとしても、せめてサークル内で納刀ぐらいはさせて欲しい。
翔蟲のクールタイムも翔蟲使いを入れても遅すぎるせいで、咄嗟の受け身狩りに何も手出しが出来ないままやられる姿はとても悲しい。
Feels like Capcom always deals the extra hits so badly.
They should just remove the circle and make it like spirit art in GU
Meanwhile CB users just counter and deal 600 dmg per phial. Not hating on CB but mannn we always live in a world where LS suffers after a major update haha. RIP LS. And no, ISS in base rise isnt broken, now almost everyweapon in sunbreak is broken except the longsword.
Good How does that feel on not being favorite child of mh dev anymore? Know lance and Gunlance players have to endure undeserving nerf from the start I glad they nerfed LS
and I hope they nerf LS more in upcoming Update
@@bruhtoad cope😹. That's why ur weapons are still worse than ours.
Since I only play LS I wonder if the Harvest Moon equivalent moves exists for other weapons as well, I really hope they will get rid of these unnatural and anti-fun to use moves in MH6
No these types of moves don't exist on other weapons,Harvest Moon came into existence because the MH community complained incessantly about LS being the best weapon in the game (even though it wasn't) so Capcom did this to nerf the most fun/optimal LS play style in order to appease all the people that cried about the LS before sunbreak
@@izanagiorochi5145 Uh no.
1. it was the strongest weapon bar none, and 2. it wasn’t the most fun playstyle, it was the most optimal though. I understand that you are a salty LS main, everyone can see that, but you have to understand, having the single most generous counter, that had the highest damage was a bit much.
Harvest moon doesn’t even just help undo the nerf btw. It has other effects, that no one acknowledges, like its unhinged spirit effect. Counter LS has overstayed its welcome, deal with it, cry about it, and move on.
Edit: Before you complain further, here’s a list (in base rise) of harder (non-silkbind counters) counters to activate, that did leagues less damage than Lai slash counter:
Guard Slash(SnS), Dodgebolt(Bow), Insta-Block(Lance), water strike(hammer), forsight slash(Long sword), Advancing Roundslash(Insect glaive), and lastly, while I’m not to keen on calling these “counters,” Guard Points(charge blade).
Just so you know, Guard slash, Water strike, and advancing roundslash, became harder to active in sunbreak, in guard slash’s case, literally unusable against EVERYTHING that isn’t a light projectile.
Cry how your over-tuned attack got balanced, seethe and weep.
@@thelostician maybe he is salty LS main. Or probably you are salty LS hater. I'm sure you baffled that LS player dare to discuss deserved nerfs. IMO ranged weapons a just hilariously strong - but I'm glad they having fun. No need to write an essay how it's unfair. LS was and is fun with counter playstyle, numbers is the proof
Honestly I'm not bothered by this ls Nerf much since we got sacred sheath, though I felt the Nerf was deserved, I felt that reducing the weapon damage to half it's original damage was a little too much. Nevertheless, since we got sacred sheath I'm happy with the Nerf since I got to try a new playstyle and make use of Sakura slash as well and I'm having way more fun than Iss +helmbreaker playstyle.
This is quite painful since I really loved the ISS+HB loop playstyle from base Rise. In Sunbreak you can be better off just using boring old foresight slash since it's easier to aim for the good hitzones and get guaranteed damage. I still go for ISS+HB though because it's so much fun even with the massive nerf.
silkbind sakura skill swap into HB is super satisfying i highly recommend it
@@zentember I find sakura slash super boring unfortunately. I don't really like playing with sacred sheathe, but it might be cool coupled with tempered spirit blade. Maybe I'll try that eventually.
@@jstar2235 I used to feel exactly like you until they gave us two skill scrolls for sunbreak. Sakura keeps us on the ground and it's a decent positioning tool used in conjunction with HB. Soaring kick on two skill scrolls seems like less diversity for various situations that call for ground movement and repositioning that Sakura lets us do
@@zentember It just didn't work out for me. Sakura slash feels like the most boring and safe way to build meter. Combining sakura slash and sacred sheathe made me wanna drop the weapon entirely, so I just went back to ISS+HB. Tempered spirit blade coupled with serene pose seems to have some potential though.
@@jstar2235 the insane thing about sacred sheathe is i've dropped quick sheathe 3 because capcom is trying to punish us for keeping old strats. ISS + HB is great though and still good bread and butter. I didn't consider sakura until ISS HB got nerfed and now their cooldown is an identical 32 seconds without wirebug whisperer 3.
I kind of like and hate harvest moon at the same time.
I like that they somehow nerfed ISS just to give it back it's old power by using harvest moon, but with additional difficulties like the smaller movement radius and not being allowed to get hit too often, because ISS in base Rise was just broken af. On the other hand it's really frustrating and annoying how rng based and unforgiving harvest moon is. Especially in multi-player it can be completely useless. However, I like using blood rite, so when the monster is damaged I don't have to heal, making it possible to get hit and still keep harvest moon, what allows for a aggressive but risky play style. Also, provoker helps to get the attention from the monster more often, what makes it a bit less of a pain sometimes.
Nonetheless I find myself often enough just switching back to Sakura spam and sacred sheath playstyle, because HM is just so frustrating. Since this playstyle can be very boring, I still prefer HM with ISS tho, there's nothing better than getting those juicy numbers when it works perfectly
Idea for your next video "What change can make Harvest Moon better"
deleting it
@@WhirlwindHeatAndFlash If delete then you better hope they buff damage.
5に関してはそもそもマルチで使うのは向かないって誰でもわかる。
6はモンスターの動きを見てないのが悪い。プレイスキルの問題。
他は全部同意できる。というか追撃発生しないバグは早急に直すべき案件なのに第1弾アプデで治らなかったのはもう見放されたからか。
あまりにも制約が多いというか，カウンター主体の武器だからこその技ではあるけど，円に触れると弾かれるのは邪魔なのでやめてほしい。外に出られないだけならまだ使える。
this is why i dont purchase sunbreak, the moment i tested demo i knew, harvest moon only for youtuber to use, not average LS players
重撃の刃薬「どっちか先に出世するか勝負しようぜ⚔」
No no you should totally use HM don't let haters convince you otherwise. Now, stay still while I prep my lazors.
-Valstrax probably
its been updated now
1 Reason you should not play bow. Because the melee attack suck. we force to play ranged
should we try to equip aggro drawing skills and stink mink whenever we use it for multiplayer? it would guarantee better monster lock on. is the damage it provides us 2x? whether we use it or not should be a number based analysis. Maybe we should think of staying inside the ring as a spacing challenge
Unfortunately the aggro mechanics in this game are trash and even a Diversion Twin Vines Lance can't keep a monster's attention for most of a 4-player hunt. And the stinkmink only lasts for like 20 seconds if you don't use it to lure a monster to a different area. Either aggro skills need a significant buff, or some moves need to depend on aggro way less
Not worth it bro just use sacred sheath + Sakura slash, way more flexible plus the damage numbers of sacred sheath feel way more satisfying once you land it
@@KVN278 I use that already I'm debating to keep serene pose because I barely use it but I realize it stops enemy attacks
to be fair LG didn't need any buffs so doesn't matter that it isn't broken...
ライズで優遇されすぎた…
楽しかったよ特殊納刀兜割
it's pretty hilarious that the mh community literally flipped saying shit like "OMG LS AGAIN??? SRSLY CAPCOM?" when capcom revealed this move lmao
So Story of Seasons is the better Silkbind to use then?
They fucked up balancing this weapon in base rise and this is the price they pay. Thankfully they'll work out a better solution in the next gen so harvest moon will never appear in any other MH game.
I'd understand it being really trashy if at least it recharged fast, but... erh... you're better off just focusing on combos and keeping wirebugs for Tempered Counter.
でた、円月とかっていう縛りしかない産廃蟲技 ドヤ顔TA勢しかつかわないgm
If you only know monster move set harvest moon gonna be extra op
Capcom realizes that alot of players like to bitch about the long sword and Capcom needs those guy's money, hence the nerf to long sword.
I sometime use Harvest Moon but,
the time is quite varied.
I understand TA originally depends on Monster's action but, Harvest Moon is too much.
I think it is not suitable for game system of MH.
I don’t main Long sword but the few times that I mess with it. Harvest moon I usually use when the monster is down or in a trap. And I think that’s the reason for it. But I don’t know. But yeah they really do need to adjust or fix it.
That not how harvest moon work
@@Entea13 Then how?
You cleary don't know how Havest Moon work, HM add dmg attack bonus for counter attack not you normal attack or strong charge attack, so if monster down or in a trap is useless.
@@Max-fn8yh Oh ok. Now I definitely won't be using it
MRのモンスターは手数が多いから抜刀気刃決められれば相対的に火力高くなるんじゃね（適当
I think the same thing too, this skill is totally a trash!
Harvest moon encourages you to use spam the counter by making it do dmg like in base rise but severly restricting your movement which is imo not very fun. I think they should have buffed the dmg of the normal attack, spirit combos and or red guage while leaving the helmet breaker dmg (maybe buffing it a little) but nerfing the cooldown more so there are more fun ways to play instead of a clear optimal way in which u spam counter and helmet breaker. The arguement about ls was that it did too much dmg for how (easy) it is so making you do dmg more actively should make it harder. (Also gs with its counter is arguably more busted than base rise ls)
Greatsword is honestly stupidly good this game.
Helm breaker is fine as is. I find myself relying more on sacred sheath combo or serene pose more for convenience because guage levels are basically free. Especially for those juicy 2k damage sacred sheath wakeups...if they can still wake up after.
Except Harvest moon literally doesn’t encourage counter spam, otherwise it wouldn’t give the unhinged spirit effect of infinite spirit gauge. I bet you didn’t even know it did that, did you?
@@thelostician Relax i did know that but having the infinite gauge in this case is just a convenience. If you wanna use it fully you will have to hope that the monster you are fighting is in range of the circle, doesnt attack and gives you an opening long enough to use the complete spirit combos when you could simply go use sacred/special sheath to do most likely more damage while leveling your gauge. Gaining and maintaining meter is also not very difficult in this game. Having to use a few drawn double slashes for meter but being able to move freely, use wirefall and so on is way more comfy and consistent than using harvest moon. (If you are not using counters)
So I wasn't going crazy. Harvest Moon multihits are literally as janky as Helmbreaker.
Maaan.
2:00 how is this an actual point tho…
Like, it’s the case for literally EVERY move in the game except for a few with hyper armor.
Imagine if gs player complained about TCS being stoppable, just play the game normally and use an opening like everyone else…
Aside from that, I think they could’ve find a better way to nerf counter playstyle.
It obviously needed a nerf but this is a bit excessive i must admit.
I personally enjoy sacred sheath way more so maybe I don’t quite get how significant it is.
Ls users when each new move isn't the most op shit ever created in the history of mh be like
It is not an attack tho. Your point doesn't make sense because you are comparing it with an actual attack that deal damage in the exact moment you use that attack. To make it fair you should compare it to the Rising's Sun of HBG for example. Imagine using that silkbind and if you get hit once you lose the ring immediately, that doesn't make sense, especially because of the cost and the 23 seconds of CD.
@@f3fnir ls users when it gets nerfed for good (oh no they nerfed it to the ground!!!)
@@PeppoLS
Yeah but it’s a buff so it still represent a direct increase in DPS. And it’s not a small buff so I think it should demand quite a heavy commitment (I don’t even find it that bad honestly).
And I’m not hating on longsword at all I just felt that complaining about losing a buff when interrupted was weird in a game like monster hunter…
(Sorry if I sounded aggressive I just don’t speak English that well)
@@petrychores6354 tbh i will say that until you try it you might go nah im sure ill be fine but me personally after trying it i never wanna see that damned circle again probably one of those things that doesnt sound as bad until you try it and especially since you have to do it repeatedly either because you reflexively wirefall you want to heal and dont have radial menu for potions or you accidentally clicked the use item button or you just get hit by an attack and sent flying just really annoying
I never know that Long Sword has Wirebug 2 skill , Cuz I never bother with those 😆😆😆😆
I just use a mod to remove the nerfs to LS post sunbreak and play like I did in base Rise. I've never used HM and probably never will.
This should have been on guns and it just needs to be larger
genuinely baffled at how terrible harvest moon is. i was so excited for it in the reveal for sunbreak skills. desperately tried to make it work, but it is just way too restrictive. i think if it didnt go away from sheathing it would be a lot more viable.
It's really funny that everyone was like : look how dumb lance looks and how much love longsword gets again. How the turntables...
@@andreynordron1302 lance is so cool, especially with skyward thrust idk why ppl hate on it so much
@@YonaMcBona trailer was not so flasy, plus it was at the same day with ls. Lance is really fun now
they keep nerfin it and adding monster with harder parts and more hp hope they give us a lil more boost coz we ain’t getting stronger