I really liked Ben's discussion about Self-Expression Through Game-Play. I hadn't thought of some of those choices like he illustrated, but yeah - I get it. :) Also, James' phrasing "Moments of Jank" - I just love that!
Update on the Paizo thing: Whatever changes they made were previously put up without any heads up which caused a decent amount of backlash, to which Paizo has since walked back the changes as of 22nd August, which may have been just around the time when this video was uploaded
I think that an RPG system is analogous to a game engine such as the Unity Engine, Unreal Engine, or Infinity Engine. It provides the structure, framework, and toolbox to flesh out the game you are looking to design. If you think of it more as a game engine than a fully fleshed out game, then the players and DM of D&D take on the role not only of storyteller but also, in a way game designer, adding the elements of the tool box that they want to incorporate into their game, and I think that is the biggest benefit of playing a TTRPG over playing a video game.
TH-cam offered me the RealOnes video, but I assumed it was celebrities talking about how D&D is cool now and didn't think it would be worthwhile until you explained what made it good. Thanks for that. I may actually use that clip as an intro for my Middle School Game Club.
I'm very surprised at "most people use iOS app to pay for Patreon", is this an American thing? In Europe Android phones still account for 40-60% of the market depending on the country, and (at least in my circle) people HATE getting an app for every little thing and especially for in-app purchases. Like, why wouldn't you use a web browser, I thought Kids These Days™ hated single-function devices?
I phone have 60-70% of the market here last time i saw metrics. But that was a while ago Just googled it, it is in fact 60%. With droid only being 20%.
100% with Shawn on the having structure as support. I have been playing & running D&D for decades, but something like Fiasco I cannot really handle as it is just too freeform for me to handle. These days I'm able to handle a lot more freeform RPG's but having these rules to fall back on is important to me.
Should you have to make a check to know what you already know? Probably not! But for me, the emergence of the world and my character are some of the best parts of the game. Jon, as a player, didn’t know anything about owlbears, so there will be some discovery there regardless. Even for experienced players, making a check and succeeding or failing says something about their character and the world. If everyone in this world knows about owlbears, then it makes sense that I would too. But if I don’t, what does that say about me and my background? Jon could have made an argument for why he knows about them if he understood the game better, but would that be as fun as figuring out why you know-or don’t? And all that fun is provided by that tiny bit of randomness injected by the check.
I’m at the Event/Location based adventure section of the podcast and it sparked a thought. Is it really as simple as Event = Time, Location = Space? Time is measured by a timeline or the multiple choice version of a flowchart. Space is measured by the map, the physical location. I only spent 2 minutes on the thought, but I thought I’d throw it to the TH-cam fishies to see what they make of it.
PS - We exist and our stories exist in time and space, so both apply at all times, but how do you organize the adventure? I just heard node based part which sent me another way. But node based seems to be clue based which tends to lead to places or people (which work like nomadic places, maybe?). Interesting.
PSS - Space based: Choose a corridor or physical direction which leads to next encounter. Time based: Choose an action in time to tackle the current problems leads to the next encounter is kind of like choosing a corridor but in time rather than space. Or chooseing the line on the flowchart. Hmmm…
To me it seems to be about what question you ask the players. "What do you do?" vs "How do you respond" It's "You arrive at the city *description of shops and places*" vs "You arrive at the city, and a guard approaches and says that all adventures must report to the king immediately."
@@spikehammer3112 That division doesn’t help me, my time/event + space/room analogy helps my weird ADD brain. It may be connected to my dislike of written adventures. I can’t really use them, they’re too texty and overly complicated. I want a villain with a goal/timeline/Front, 1 page max. I want an array of villain + mooks (I’d love them on cards). I want key location maps/images where things could happen, but just with an unpopulated bullet point description like 1 page dungeons. Treasures, some NPCs that might be fun to plant info in and nothing else, also on cards. The end. I’ll make up the rest in reaction to the PCs.
I live how there are comments both saying this show os terrible for not having a go at Paizo and also complaining at the show for having too much of a go at Paizo. XD
If only patreon was creator focused like their branding says they are, as much as Dropout is customer focused. Dropout is one of the only companies that just takes that fee on the chin and chooses to have that not effect the customer- thats why dropout is 4.99 on all platforms while different apps charge more on apple than others. This is not apple to blame as much as you choose to allow their exploitive business practices to effect your business practices to become exploitive
The other part is that the Patreon guys took VC money when they probably never needed to, and that has pushed them into a MONETIZE AND PUMP SHARE VALUE mindset.
They did? That's so gross. Touting your thing as an independent way for creators to connect with fans while making it dependent on making non-creators happy is shady
@@hive_indicator318 I mean, they're artists, and it's easy to get hammered by capitalists if you aren't on your guard. It sucks, but frankly it's way less horrific than private equity. But yeah, enshittification is very real
The same people incapable of being manipulated against WotC are being manipulated against Paizo. And if any of the other systems are successful at all, people will come along with false (and not even articulated!) accusations against them. The state of critical thinking in the world is very sad.
RE: Roleplay and RPG: My takeaway from this is in RPGs, like in real life, we can't just say something and it automatically becomes true, or do something and an 'irrational' outcome happens. Game Rules exist to define 'realism' in the 'world' or 'campaign', be it vibes, atmosphere or similar or some other criteria.
Asking here as ai dunno where best to ask, feel free to link me to another place. What is the added value to Grim Hollow 2E for those who already got the original? Like I'd love to simply donate to yous even without any books in return, but I'm afraid that apart from time and love, my resources are extremely limited. (Tbf time is quite limited, but it's one resource I have coming in at a regular rate.)
Hey, if you haven't seen it already you can check out this video for a brief rundown about what's changing in the new Grim Hollow books: th-cam.com/video/4pl3U4euL2M/w-d-xo.html You can also follow the Kickstarter page directly, here. It doesn't cost anything and will keep you updated as we announce more news and information. www.kickstarter.com/projects/ghostfiregaming/grim-hollow
@GhostfirePodcasts ta, I'll have a look. Edit: one thing I'm not sure about (like quite a few others I think) is whether or not to move to 5.24e. To what extent does or doesn't require Grimhollow 2e to use this newest version of the base rules?
I like how no one does their own research. They read a headline, bring it up, and hope someone else did the research and could speak on it. No sources cited in video description, just misinformation or no information. Real podcast bro vibes.
Jfc, the "Does System Matter?" debate has been coming up in the community every few months for decades. At the start of the episode you guys sound like you've never seen any of it, which is surprising given the collective experience in this group...
I had the same thought. It was a pretty basic discussion of an age-old topic. You'd kina prefer to either have someone talk through the known outlines of the topic, or have a deeper conversation and explore some of the principles at work or edge cases.
Here's a crazy idea. What if you do what you want and let other people do what they want? Why do you feel a need to proselytize and persuade other people to do the same as you?
Today on the show: people who use Patreon are unable to formulate a coherent explanation on what critical services Patreon actually provides. A discussion on a license that no one has read that boils down to “its really bad guize!”…
Gees guys. The Piazo licence change was in no way like the OGL. Please get your facts straight before dragging a company. Or maybe get any facts? I don't think it is too much to ask for you to check out what the changes actually are before you make assumptions and cast aspersions.
Gees guy. Maybe if you look at what actually happened with the OGL you would discover that that was a nothingburger, too. Please get your facts straight before dragging a company. Or maybe get any facts? I don't think it is too much to ask for you to check out what the changes actually are before you make assumptions and cast aspersions. Or do we only care about intellectual integrity when it happens to the companies and games that we like? Is that how morality works?
Shawn has all the time to spread hate of WotC, but when people start pulling the same tricks and fearmongering about Paizo, he "doesn't care." Consistency would have been too much to hope for, I guess.
The discussion on structure, expression, rules and gameplay in this episode is just lovely. I need more of it.
It’s a shame that Deborah’s DnD show went down with Alpha. It had real heart ❤️
Tashas cauldron of everything has rules on checks for monster knowledge.
Can we take a moment to appreciate the hair at the center squares and how they mirrored each other? Also having some envy.
Baldie here, and your comment had me chuckling.
I really liked Ben's discussion about Self-Expression Through Game-Play. I hadn't thought of some of those choices like he illustrated, but yeah - I get it. :) Also, James' phrasing "Moments of Jank" - I just love that!
Update on the Paizo thing: Whatever changes they made were previously put up without any heads up which caused a decent amount of backlash, to which Paizo has since walked back the changes as of 22nd August, which may have been just around the time when this video was uploaded
I think that an RPG system is analogous to a game engine such as the Unity Engine, Unreal Engine, or Infinity Engine. It provides the structure, framework, and toolbox to flesh out the game you are looking to design.
If you think of it more as a game engine than a fully fleshed out game, then the players and DM of D&D take on the role not only of storyteller but also, in a way game designer, adding the elements of the tool box that they want to incorporate into their game, and I think that is the biggest benefit of playing a TTRPG over playing a video game.
TH-cam offered me the RealOnes video, but I assumed it was celebrities talking about how D&D is cool now and didn't think it would be worthwhile until you explained what made it good. Thanks for that. I may actually use that clip as an intro for my Middle School Game Club.
That pre-order bonus thing is the most elegant and inspired pre-order incentive I've ever seen
Couldn’t have wished for a better answer to my question :) thank you 🤘
Shoutout to Dante!
I'm very surprised at "most people use iOS app to pay for Patreon", is this an American thing? In Europe Android phones still account for 40-60% of the market depending on the country, and (at least in my circle) people HATE getting an app for every little thing and especially for in-app purchases. Like, why wouldn't you use a web browser, I thought Kids These Days™ hated single-function devices?
It's more of an iPhone thing. They've got a closed ecosystem and people inside it forget about other OS.
I phone have 60-70% of the market here last time i saw metrics. But that was a while ago
Just googled it, it is in fact 60%. With droid only being 20%.
I LOVE ALL Ghostfire Podcasts videos!
100% with Shawn on the having structure as support. I have been playing & running D&D for decades, but something like Fiasco I cannot really handle as it is just too freeform for me to handle. These days I'm able to handle a lot more freeform RPG's but having these rules to fall back on is important to me.
25:10 * Ben brags about how good he is in Among Us
* No popups from Dante
Imma call sus on that, chief.
Wow, last time I was this early I was on Aussie Time. Hoo-ray!
Should you have to make a check to know what you already know? Probably not! But for me, the emergence of the world and my character are some of the best parts of the game. Jon, as a player, didn’t know anything about owlbears, so there will be some discovery there regardless. Even for experienced players, making a check and succeeding or failing says something about their character and the world. If everyone in this world knows about owlbears, then it makes sense that I would too. But if I don’t, what does that say about me and my background? Jon could have made an argument for why he knows about them if he understood the game better, but would that be as fun as figuring out why you know-or don’t? And all that fun is provided by that tiny bit of randomness injected by the check.
1:35 you nailed it!
I’m at the Event/Location based adventure section of the podcast and it sparked a thought. Is it really as simple as Event = Time, Location = Space? Time is measured by a timeline or the multiple choice version of a flowchart. Space is measured by the map, the physical location. I only spent 2 minutes on the thought, but I thought I’d throw it to the TH-cam fishies to see what they make of it.
PS - We exist and our stories exist in time and space, so both apply at all times, but how do you organize the adventure? I just heard node based part which sent me another way. But node based seems to be clue based which tends to lead to places or people (which work like nomadic places, maybe?). Interesting.
PSS - Space based: Choose a corridor or physical direction which leads to next encounter. Time based: Choose an action in time to tackle the current problems leads to the next encounter is kind of like choosing a corridor but in time rather than space. Or chooseing the line on the flowchart. Hmmm…
To me it seems to be about what question you ask the players.
"What do you do?" vs "How do you respond"
It's "You arrive at the city *description of shops and places*" vs "You arrive at the city, and a guard approaches and says that all adventures must report to the king immediately."
@@spikehammer3112 That division doesn’t help me, my time/event + space/room analogy helps my weird ADD brain. It may be connected to my dislike of written adventures. I can’t really use them, they’re too texty and overly complicated. I want a villain with a goal/timeline/Front, 1 page max. I want an array of villain + mooks (I’d love them on cards). I want key location maps/images where things could happen, but just with an unpopulated bullet point description like 1 page dungeons. Treasures, some NPCs that might be fun to plant info in and nothing else, also on cards. The end. I’ll make up the rest in reaction to the PCs.
I live how there are comments both saying this show os terrible for not having a go at Paizo and also complaining at the show for having too much of a go at Paizo. XD
If only patreon was creator focused like their branding says they are, as much as Dropout is customer focused. Dropout is one of the only companies that just takes that fee on the chin and chooses to have that not effect the customer- thats why dropout is 4.99 on all platforms while different apps charge more on apple than others. This is not apple to blame as much as you choose to allow their exploitive business practices to effect your business practices to become exploitive
The other part is that the Patreon guys took VC money when they probably never needed to, and that has pushed them into a MONETIZE AND PUMP SHARE VALUE mindset.
They did? That's so gross. Touting your thing as an independent way for creators to connect with fans while making it dependent on making non-creators happy is shady
@@hive_indicator318 I mean, they're artists, and it's easy to get hammered by capitalists if you aren't on your guard. It sucks, but frankly it's way less horrific than private equity. But yeah, enshittification is very real
Big fan of Transparency
WOTC and Paizo making me more and more happy to be switching to DC20.
good to see some DC20 love hell yeah
same, but Daggerheart over here
Same, but Nimble and Draw Steel over here. :)
The same people incapable of being manipulated against WotC are being manipulated against Paizo. And if any of the other systems are successful at all, people will come along with false (and not even articulated!) accusations against them. The state of critical thinking in the world is very sad.
@@hawkname1234 None of the accusations against Paizo have been false.
RE: Roleplay and RPG: My takeaway from this is in RPGs, like in real life, we can't just say something and it automatically becomes true, or do something and an 'irrational' outcome happens. Game Rules exist to define 'realism' in the 'world' or 'campaign', be it vibes, atmosphere or similar or some other criteria.
Asking here as ai dunno where best to ask, feel free to link me to another place.
What is the added value to Grim Hollow 2E for those who already got the original? Like I'd love to simply donate to yous even without any books in return, but I'm afraid that apart from time and love, my resources are extremely limited. (Tbf time is quite limited, but it's one resource I have coming in at a regular rate.)
Hey, if you haven't seen it already you can check out this video for a brief rundown about what's changing in the new Grim Hollow books: th-cam.com/video/4pl3U4euL2M/w-d-xo.html
You can also follow the Kickstarter page directly, here. It doesn't cost anything and will keep you updated as we announce more news and information. www.kickstarter.com/projects/ghostfiregaming/grim-hollow
@GhostfirePodcasts ta, I'll have a look.
Edit: one thing I'm not sure about (like quite a few others I think) is whether or not to move to 5.24e. To what extent does or doesn't require Grimhollow 2e to use this newest version of the base rules?
Where’s the link to Deborah’s video?
I like how no one does their own research. They read a headline, bring it up, and hope someone else did the research and could speak on it. No sources cited in video description, just misinformation or no information. Real podcast bro vibes.
This podcast has had that specific problem, in a big way, for a long time. Huge vibe of . Might as well be Barstool Sports.
As ususal, F Apple. No idea why anyone uses their products.
iPhone users should never subscribe for anything through their phone. They are charged more than folks who purchase through browser or android
Jfc, the "Does System Matter?" debate has been coming up in the community every few months for decades. At the start of the episode you guys sound like you've never seen any of it, which is surprising given the collective experience in this group...
I had the same thought. It was a pretty basic discussion of an age-old topic. You'd kina prefer to either have someone talk through the known outlines of the topic, or have a deeper conversation and explore some of the principles at work or edge cases.
Let's not preorder, at the end all you get are D&D books, which I recently discovered, after an offer, that I don't want even free.
Here's a crazy idea. What if you do what you want and let other people do what they want? Why do you feel a need to proselytize and persuade other people to do the same as you?
Of course that guy is like um actually.
Today on the show: people who use Patreon are unable to formulate a coherent explanation on what critical services Patreon actually provides. A discussion on a license that no one has read that boils down to “its really bad guize!”…
Gees guys. The Piazo licence change was in no way like the OGL. Please get your facts straight before dragging a company. Or maybe get any facts? I don't think it is too much to ask for you to check out what the changes actually are before you make assumptions and cast aspersions.
Gees guy. Maybe if you look at what actually happened with the OGL you would discover that that was a nothingburger, too. Please get your facts straight before dragging a company. Or maybe get any facts? I don't think it is too much to ask for you to check out what the changes actually are before you make assumptions and cast aspersions.
Or do we only care about intellectual integrity when it happens to the companies and games that we like? Is that how morality works?
This is actually far worse than the OGL because everyone just let this slide without any pushback.
Shawn has all the time to spread hate of WotC, but when people start pulling the same tricks and fearmongering about Paizo, he "doesn't care." Consistency would have been too much to hope for, I guess.