Bill Belichick called “average without Brady” by former Patriots DB Asante Samuel | NFL | SPEAK
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ต.ค. 2022
- Former New England Patriots DB Asante Samuel tweeted that current Pats head coach Bill Belichick was "average without Brady". The tweet prompted Emmanuel Acho, Joy Taylor, LeSean McCoy and David Helman to discuss if Belichick is average without Tom Brady.
#Speak #NFL #BillBelichick
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Bill Belichick called “average without Brady” by former Patriots DB Asante Samuel | NFL | SPEAK
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👑Joy
Jason Taylor’s sister
How about no?
Brady did NOT have a "fantastic" offensive line in New England. He made them look passable. For instance, he covered up his OL's pass blocking deficiencies with quick decision-making - which made people think his OLs are good. The year that Brady missed, Cassel led the league in sacks. When Brady came back, he had the fewest sacks among those QBs who played the full season. Again, the same team, the same OL, the same offensive personnel.
He had Dante scarnecia and a franchise left tackle his entire career
@@UpChuckTheBoogieit doesn't seems like you read the comment, try reading it again
Great point that’s why he’s the GOAT
He had some good o lines always had a left tackle and a good center great o line coach.Dillion ran it for 1600 yards I'd say the line was pretty good
@@UpChuckTheBoogie The Patriots have had mediocre personnel at OL throughout Belichick's tenure. Probably the only noteworthy players are Matt Light and Logan Mankins. What I said about Brady making the OL look better (far better) applies to Light, too. He was never one of the best LTs in the league talent-wise and largely got the credit he did because he was a long-time blindside protection of Brady. As for Mankins, he was a run-blocking guard, and pass-blocking wasn't his forte - especially toward the end of his career. And Nate Solder a "franchise left tackle"? LOL. Look at how elite he looked for the Giants. If you think Solder was a franchise left tackle, then I really do not know what to say, as we are watching a different game. He was a pylon for most of his career. Above all, you ignore my fundamental point that pass-blocking efficiency is often primarily the function of the QB; that's why it's a commonplace to say now that sacks are a QB stat. If you have a QB who can diagnoses blitzes and then get rid of the ball quickly like Brady, then the OL grading can be unreasonably inflated. The same thing works the reverse, too. Some guys who get sacked a lot - most "dual threat" QBs - cannot read a basic defense and also hold onto the ball forever either because they cannot throw with anticipation or trust their legs too much. Those guys make otherwise fine OLs look awful. Again, can you answer my Cassel example? If the Patriots had such a great OL, then how come they gave up the most sacks in the NFL the year Brady didn't play? Finally, you are missing the frame of the discussion: The idiot in the video said that Brady had a "fantastic" OL. If he said, "decent" or even "good" then my objection wouldn't have been so harsh. Words matter. But then you claim that Nate Solder was a "franchise left tackle," so perhaps you do not use words in a meaningful way.
Without Brady, Belichick had to spend over $10 mil/yr on 3 separate players who never made Pro Bowls.
He paid Agholor $11 mil/yr and Hunter Henry and Jonnu Smith, who were mid-tier TE's $12 mil/year each.
Players wanted to play with Brady. Belichick doesn't take care of offensive skill players unless he absolutely has to...and he waits until everyone else leaves.
Lol Belichick literally felt and was on record for saying he could have won with any QB in the league. The before and after records cannot be ignored because he himself thought it was all him and he said that sort of nonsense. Exposed
Joy was preaching about the Pats O line coach, he was mad underrated
He was good at working with what he was given but now people are exaggerating his greatness. Tom Brady and Drew Bledsoe are two of the most sacked QBs in the history of the league.
As a dolphins fan I know Dante scarnecchia is a gangsta
@@Shua321 facts
You could see the difference when Dante Scarnechhia first retired and the Pats got clapped in 2015 by the Broncos and then unretired and then they went on to win 2 more superbowls.
He was good. The Patriots offense for so long utilized quick slot receivers & screen passes for success on offense that it would be very difficult for me to give him too much credit. Just being honest 💯🤷.
Don't forget about Joe Gibbs! 3 Superbowls with 3 different QBs is impressive!
Cecil Musick Tom Flores won two Super Bowls with Jim Plunkett. Not a bad job.
That's a good point
She didn’t say coaches couldn’t win Super Bowls with average QB’s. She said great coaches aren’t great coaches without great QB’s.
@@knight7se7en Your statement makes no sense. You're statement is double talk, She asked what head coach has won over a 10 yr period without a great QB. And the answer is Joe Gibbs who won 3 Super Bowls with not "great" QB's.
@@sportsretrospective6759 j pm
K9
This wouldn't even have been an issue of it wasn't for the fact that he booted Brady out the door. Man took his gift horse and sold it for a magic bean.
🫘??? 😳 …….🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
oh I wouldn't say that
They wouldn’t have won another SB with Tom…the team wasn’t solid like it had been.
@@deciuswtasby It's not about winning another SB with Tom. It's more like wrapping their success together and there wouldn't even be an opportunity for Brady to prove himself. Since he let the genie out of the bottle and Brady won a SB without him his 1st year, it proves that Belichick was riding on Brady's coattail all this time.
@@JohnSmith-nj4zq if you believe that you clearly didn’t watch them over the last 20 years like they rest of us lol. Tom doesn’t catch his own passes, block, kick, or play defense….so if it’s “ALL” about Tom why did they lose to a back up QB and get punked by the giants twice?
This lady has more common sense that I've seen in comparison with many other anchors. I've seen her in Shannon Sharpe show but I never knew how deeply knowledgeable she is. Kudos.
Dr. Joy Taylor don’t play, she’s one of the best minds in sports talk
She’s been in the business for a while. And her brother is a hall of famer (I think)
@@neo1343 Correct. HOFer Jason Taylor
@@kristianzambrana7301 if by best minds you mean worst minds then i agree
Man she’s talking that talking been saying this for years with the debate coaching and GM’n mattered for Brady
The show is still pretty good and Joy was an excellent addition. The chick actually knows what she’s talking about. But maaan… I miss Marcellus. Can you guys get him on once in awhile?
Addition*
@@peacewilliam-west2249 I don't think that was a mistake lol
Acho is very irritating, trying to sound smart rather than making valid points.
Keep Joy get rid of Shady and bring back Marcellus
@@peacewilliam-west2249 ?
Bill Belichick's defenses were not great at all (aside from a couple of years)... most of the time. That's why Brady had to score 30+ points per game for them to win throughout their seasons (decade after decade), and in many of the biggest games, and why he had all those passing records to begin with. Brady had to score 30+ points in THREE of their Super Bowl wins. And for an even more glaring example, Belichick's "defense" gave up 41 points in the Super Bowl against the Eagles when they had a backup QB playing!!! --- That's not good, in fact it's EMBARASSINGLY BAD -- and it was in part because Belichick refused to play his Team's best CB (Malcolm Butler), and decided to bench him. That's just BAD COACHING plain and simple. Brady threw for 500 yards in that same game, and Brady deserved to win his 8th Super Bowl ring (but Belichick did not deserve a ring at all -- for having made such a bad coaching decision and sabotaging his own Team).
The numbers say what your are. And Bill Belichick is a BELOW .500 Coach, and with ZERO CHAMPIONSHIPS on his own -- without Tom Brady. Those are just the facts. Tom Brady, on the other hand, had a 20 - 5 record in College at Michigan, and won The Orange Bowl before he ever had met Belichick, and then went on to win a SUPER BOWL (for Tampa -- a losing Franchise) on his own without Belichick anywhere near him. That TELLS YOU where the real "magic" came from. Brady was where all the success had come from.
Belichick never won before Brady, or after Brady. Brady won BOTH -- before Belichick (Orange Bowl), and also again after Bill Belichick (Super Bowl - Tampa).
Joy gave a sermon in the beginning. They should all be saying Amen!!
😂😂
Forgot to mention that Tom was willing TO TAKE A PAY CUT TO KEEP A TALENTED ROSTER. What other quarterbacks you know is willing to take a pay cut
No other QBs
Giselle was bring home more bread than Brady. What other QB’s wife could say that??
@@TreWimsical he did that before Giselle too
@diantewimes9465 Brady was rich bro. You acting like Giselle was paying his bills.
@@TreWimsicalTom Brady didn't get married to giselle until 2010 Tom Brady is already in the league for 12 years before he got married
Joy, I definitely miss you on The Herd. Your viewpoint is so refreshing to hear.
wasnt she on S&S:undisputed?
Joy was a good ying to Colin's yang.
I’m glad there were people who appreciated her on there when Colin was the only one getting all of the credit . She’s a force in this industry
I hate when people talk about the AFC East, as if it had been a cakewalk, or as if Brady didn't have to go through others divisions and conferences to win Super Bowls - then switched conferences and did the same thing!
NE division was garbage and Tampa Bay Division is cheeks but they had a great team that needed a change at QB. These guys are smoking something illegal to think its all Brady. This arguement is dumb
@@cagedragnarok1781 It obviously is Brady or else those things would not have been done. The NFL helped a little too...
I also hate when people talk about the AFC East like Brady wasn't consistently beating them into the ground. Brady didn't take advantage of the AFC East being bad, Brady MADE the AFC East bad.
@@knight7se7en this is a terrible point . If that’s so true, the NFC East with all of their subpar QB’s shouldn’t have the records they have; including the Commanders
Wtf our division was trash ....r you dumb I'm a NYJets fan
Joy and the brother to her left “sorry I don’t know his name” debate with common sense in the world where everybody wants ratings. I’m glad they have a voice of reason.
Good point girl!...you mention Scarnecchia....great
Joe Gibbs won 3 Superbowls with Mark Rypien Doug Williams Joe Theisman and none those guys were great quarterbacks. Bill Parcells won two Superbowls with Phil Simms Jeff Hosteller and went to one more with Drew Bledsoe.
Theismann was a league MVP and Rypien was a very good QB at one point. Even Doug Williams had success on the Bucs when they were a dumpster fire. I'll give Gibbs his credit because winning with three different QBs is hard regardless of talent.
@@the757general2 Gibbs was a great coach innovative offensive mind.
All the arguments they cite for why BB is a great coach, only really applied when TB12 was there. It would be like me citing my great wins at poker to support my contention that I'm a great poker player, but all those wins were when I had a flush or better.
Jesus Christ, Joy was dropping knowledge all segment. Poor Lesean McCoy still remembers how Belichick use to abuse him and can't let it go😥
he was right though
@@stephanea5364 no he wasn’t lol
@@deciuswtasby bill isnt even a HOF coach without Brady
@@matthewdaniels709 yeah and maybe he goes (and he was close to it) undrafted by some third rate coach on a fourth rate team who wouldn't give him a chance. Belichick not only picked him but kept him as a 4th quarterback on a team with the number one pick overall as the starter, then elevated him past everyone else and kept him during the Superbowl when conventional wisdom was to start Bledsoe.... yeah maybe Brady would have survived either way, but Belichick saw a diamond in the rough and gave him a shot
@@matthewdaniels709 Brady isn’t in the league of bill doesn’t draft him. See how that works? What ifs are for losers…..what we “know” is as a unit they were a dynasty
Joy is phenomenal on this show
Bill wasn’t ever the offensive play caller or ever controlled the offense.
His defense still plays at a high level like it always has
Doesn’t change the fact that his teams have been mediocre since Brady left. Before Brady left, everyone though the main person responsible for the Super Bowls was Bill. It is now evident that Brady was the one responsible. Bill isn’t average, but he isn’t amazing either. He was below 500 before Brady. And he is below 500 after Brady. How is that a great coach?
@@jsilva7005 exactly
@@jsilva7005 Asante Samuel literally cost the patriots a Super Bowl by dropping the easiest interception in the history of the playbook offs….dude has always hated belicheck ever since he let him walk
@@AdamWatt00 What does that have to do with the fact the Bill is under .500 without Brady?
@@jsilva7005 lol…. Bill had 20 seasons with Brady and 3 without…..listening to ESPN much lol
Andy Reed had Donavan McNabb who went to 4 NFC championships. That's why he is 600 without Mahomes.
Exactly!!! 👊👊✊✊👏👏👏
And probably the most creative and best offensive mind since Bill Walsh. I don't need to tell you how high of a compliment that is.
@@cityhawk You miss my point
*5 NFC championships
Joy was great in this segment.
In most segments.
How does Tom Brady have to do nothing with the o line being good when the qb and o line positions are so interconnected where them being out of sync can make either position group look bad and a bunch of Tom Brady’s o lineman have said how he made them better by either telling them how he wanted them to be, giving them tips, or getting extra reps in after practice
The New Orlean Saint's went 7-9 without Sean Payton as their head coach one season. Even though Drew Brees was probably that team's best quarterback, probably so far. I think it comes down to the relationship & respect between coach and quarterback.
Thank you Joy. Also they had 10 years of no Super Bowl wins and Bill remained as coach. Would that happen in another team. He’s a great coach. Brady may not have been as successful without someone like Bill and the culture of accountability that he built. It’s part of what made him the player he is today.
I agree with you... Asante Samuel is just salt 🧂 because Bill didn't give him the contract he wanted.... There's no great coach without great qb vice-versa... Asante please tell us how many ring 💍 Aaron Roger have?? Is he a great qb?? How about Payton Manning; his last super bowl 🏈, was there a great defense? How about the Steelers looking now with their coach who's known for defense without Big Ben??? Lastly out of those 6 💍... which one Tom Brady won solely on his own... even his 7th rings...Did the Bucs defense had anything to do with it... Was the o-line any good? Oh how about the receivers.... Asante that's why you ain't a hall of famer... You a hater who was just an opportunistic player...jump route for interception...but he beat everytime... Marvin Harrison lived in ur head.... You are not going to the hall of fame and Bill and Tom are...so go sit down and respect greatness 👏.... The patriots will get better once these young cats develop...
@@Henry18845 lol 😂
I’ve made the same argument over and over.
Brady was a great student that morphed into a great player. I don't think his view and knowledge of the game would be what it is without Bill's system. Once he mastered it, he's been able to carry it
@@phredwithanf6834 exactly
But the narrative was always that TB12 was a product of the BB system. Where is that system now?
Tom Brady nd Belichik we’re a match made heaven…… they both benefited from each other in New England …. Idk what percentage I’d give either credit wise , but the margin is much smaller than people would admit ….
Well said
Dude, don't tell me it was all Josh McDaniel when he is stumbling again outside NNE
He didn’t say it was all Josh lol…he said they had competent and consistent coaches. Some people are just better coordinators than head coaches
Joy is the truth!!!
I can think of a few coaches who won without having hall of fame type quarterbacks - Bill Parcels, Joe Gibbs and Tom Landry. They all had good quarterbacks and Landry had Staubach who was great. But all three of these coaches won with different quarterbacks and not all of them were great, decent yes, but not great. So it's definitely possible to do it.
tom flores
this is one of the best segments, shoulda been 20 minutes longer
Joy can't sound smart for that long
@@Atlas365247 says the dude in the comment section who has no show lol
BB has 10 seasons as head coach w/o tom brady. He has 1 playoff win in those 10 seasons. He's not an average coach, he's a bad coach.
I disagree with Acho. So he’s saying that Brady would have reached his peak no matter who he played with? That’s very flawed and biased logic. Joy is the smartest of the bunch here. Belichik’s defense won at least 3 of Brady’s championships in the SB if one’s fair.
They actually fired Marcellus Wiley and kept Acho? Bill Walsh is the greatest coach ever. Chuck Noll is number 2, and Bill B is third.
Acho is an African which they think can replace blak Americans! Plus, he is younger. All he is doing is trying his best to act blak, but he can only go but so far to imitate blak Americans.
All of this jawjacking, after they leave. Nobody said, Jack Scratch. When they were winning Superbowls. I would say Joe Gibbs. He won 3 Super Bowls. With 3 different Qb’s. Joe Theismann, Doug Williams, and Mark Rypien.
I was talking when they were winning.
Joe Gibbs was a great coach, but the GOAT is Don Shula.. has the highest winning percentage, the only perfect season and hast the most wins all time.
@@marcuswillis5185 Shula was up there, but winning titles is what is more important to me, as to who is the GOAT. You can win a lot of games, but the games that count most are the ones that win titles.
@@HardCold-Alquan he won 2 Super Bowls including the only undefeated season. With 2 different quarterbacks at that.. 1st with Earl Moral the undefeated season and 2nd with bob griese..and most importantly the man never cheated or video taped the other team like bellicheat did..
@@marcuswillis5185 Yeah, but given how long he coached, he did more winning games than winning titles.
Look back to his past coaching history before Tom Brady
I can appreciate bill now because they're not killing my Jets
You need the basics: A quarterback that can make all the throws, take a hit, and protect the football; a defense with a solid secondary and an excellent pass-rush; an offensive line that can protect the quarterback; and a special teams that can create turnovers and get you excellent or solid field position... the entire defense and special teams has to be able to get you the football so you can have a chance to win. These are basic things every football team needs in order to win no matter what the names of the players or coaches are; without these elements you will NEVER win consistently. Where coaching comes in is when it comes down to game-planning, strategy, and putting your team in a position to out-think and out-maneuver an opponent and to manipulate the actual game towards your advantage through decision-making which will put the opponent in a losing situation and your team in a position where you do not defeat yourself.
Joy is the only reasonable person on this entire show. In fact her contributions are way above this BS click bait. It was better when Marcellus was there, but it was still lots of unreasoned speculation and BS. I hope a better stage for Joy.
The way The seahawks are playing right now kind of elevates pete, especially when wilson struggling in denver.
So true...
Joy is everything ❤
Never seen a Patriots team with Brady dominated Shady? What about that Patriots vs Chiefs game back in 2014 I believe or when they faced Lamar the season he won the MVP. Shady I love you man but stop. Your takes are terrible on this.
Brady chose to go to the Raiders and they didnt want him, HE DIDNT CHOOSE the Bucs. People act like he could choose anywhere he wanted to go. Niners didnt want him either, Bucs were his third choose.
The difference in these coaches literally is Tom Brady. Maybe none of them win as much wit Brady. But Tomlin Sean Payton and Andy Reid wins more than one championship wit Brady. Literally Belicheick wasn’t a great coach before Brady see Cleveland and the first year and a few games into the second year in New England. And now after Brady too. U need that guy under center
Joy killin em💯
Well she needs to get her own show then.
JC Jackson got paid because he was in Belicheks defense looool McCoy is just a salty clown that Bill kept him out
Bringing up hypotheticals is not an argument. You can suppose anything you want. You can say that if the atmosphere was composed mostly sulfur, we would all be dead........guess wha through? The atmosphere isn't composed of mostly sulfur, and opining on how Brady would have won tons of Super Bowls with other head coaches isn't a legitimate defense of an argument against Belichick. It simply lends credence to a shoddy narrative. Joy made the most sense on this panel and David Helman came in second.
Great take Joy!!!
The Evidence is there. Hes had a bunch of seasons without Tom n been average but ya Joy is right most Top coaches get called that because they had HOF QBs etc Same in the NBA really Phil Jackson got lucky he had MJ n Pippen then Shaq n Kobe
They asked Phil to coach NY and he was like “nah. I’ll get exposed”. 😅
@@Samurai31631 I dont know about exposed, but ya he might lose some of that god like shi. He's obv still a good coach other coaches had Superstars n didnt get that many rings but hes not much better then other top coaches who didnt get as lucky with the rosters
@G O He got super lucky also from Robinson to Tim n a great GM who found great guys later in the draft. Alot of good coaches could win big in the NBA with Superstars like Ty Lue whose already had Bron n Kawhi n PG etc n gets overrated
Joy is crushing it!
meh
Shady should talk about why Buccaneers was not in the Super bowl 56? Bruce Arians threw away the opportunity by being a hot headed coach letting AB go without talking to Tom Brady and working things out with AB, totally ignored the injury situation of the team. I truly believe if they kept AB around for the rest of the season, they would have a shot in the Super bowl.
And Godwin got injured, so then they needed to replace Wr2 and Wr3
@@LIL23FRED Brady still almost beat a superior team in the LA Rams. Its crazy thinking about how good he was.
Tom Brady is a coach. The Pat's had 2 coach. One was outside. The other was playing. That is why they were great.
Do they have Acho and Shady on the show to make inane arguments and sound like fools. Every comment Shady makes sounds like hating, and Acho isn't really debating he's just trying to sound smart instead of making cogent comments.
It may be that the chemistry between Belichick/Brady. That chemistry was the difference a perfect storm that may never happen again. Both Good/Great at what they do.
I never agree with shady but today he's speaking facts.
Joy is 100! Shula #1 without question. He had great teams with multiple QBs. And don't forget he went undefeated with a backup (Erroll Morrall). Just let that sink in for a minute. The dolphins were 5-0 when Grease went down. The backup played out the rest of the season. And if not for the "Sea Of Hands" game would have three-peated. And then the WFL broke up the dynasty by stealing three of their best players, and he still only lost 4 games. Yeah, Belichick is a great coach; the eye test makes it undeniable. But Shula was on a level only matched by perhaps Lombardi and Bill Walsh.
I thought Grease went down in '78. Travolta & ONJ were great in that. Nice football history lesson. Awesome run by the Fish. Shula is definitely on the Mt. Rushmore of coaches. The 70s was probably the coolest decade for football. Those cool nicknames for games, moments, teams & players. Might be the only decade with an undefeated team and a winless team. Not sure though. Oh by the way, if Shula is on the level matched by only Lombardi and Walsh then add Belichek to that level. Did everything Shula did except total wins and finishing an undefeated season.
Both are great. How many coaches has Bill helped get his coaches jobs elsewhere…and a large majority fail without him. Tom has won Super Bowls, the D has won Super Bowls and so has Vinateiri. They’re all great.
First off I'd like to say shout out for remembering the kickers. Ravens would have a lot fewer wins without JT the foot god. There is no second part
The team built by Belidiot wouldn't have won a single SB with any other QB, because no other QB would be able to score 24+ in back to back playoff games.
The Pats between 2001 and 2006 would be even worse than 2020 and 2021 Pats.
Yeah, I feel like hes definitely getting ragged on here a little bit unnecessarily. I think of the SB win over the Rams. That was Belichick and his defense alllllllllllllllllllllllll the way.
Vinateiri did not win Super Bowls, he kicked balls after Brady got them into position.
@@HardCold-Alquan morons think Brady was supposed to save the team from own 3 yard line and put offense in FG range with Troy Brown as #1 receiver.
I guess they think Peyton, Rodgers, Mahomes are all dumbfooks.
How'd that "great" defensive mind workout for the Patriots in the Eagles Super Bowl? 🤔
Same way the QB with a record setting offense got punked twice by the giants lol. So we gonna keep pointing fingers or are we just gonna admit they lost as a “team” lol
@@deciuswtasby Tom Brady has already won a Super Bowl without Belichick. If Brady played his entire career on another team, he would have been just as successful, if not more successful.
Bill Belichick will never win a Super Bowl without Brady. If Belichick didn't have Brady, he would have 0 career Super Bowls wins. He would have been fired 20 years ago and pushed out of the NFL
@@WoJackHorseman so Brady was going to win SBs despite the other coaches, defenses, and teams elsewhere huh 🤣🤣🤣🤣. He would have been a good player but doubtful he would have done what he did in NE. Guess we will never know but what we do know is with Bill….they had a dynasty that will stand the rest of time 🤷🏾♂️
@@deciuswtasby Brady won the Super Bowl in his first season with a new team, that was a below average before he got there. He also did this at age 43. If Brady had an actual good head coach like Andy Reid, he has at least 10 chips. Belichick held Brady back
@@WoJackHorseman 😂😂😂😂 I can’t even take you serious bro lol
You left one of our main ingredients out for the Patriots Rob Gronkowski the human cheat code. That factored into a lot of those championships.
over tom brady's entire tenure in new england, the patriots defense averages out to be about 16th in that span of 20 years. DEAD middle of the pack. mediocrity personified.
Bill is a great coach
Joy always has the best takes hands down 💯
It’s weird that Bill is this insane defensive mind, but the 3 Super Bowl loses, the defense let up. Also yeh, Bill should focus on his defensive guys, let someone else draft the offense, cuz he really shouldn’t be
Eagles yes….giants? Brady should be able to put up more than 17 points 2 times which they did not
@@deciuswtasby The Patriots still had the lead in those games in the 4th Quarter. So his point still has merit.
Joy and Shady were spittin
It's a whole NEW TEAM , NEW DOSTER NOME OF THE PLAYERS BRADY PLAYED WITH ARE THERE THERE ALLL GONE , YALL DONT UNDERSTAND HOW LONG IT TAKES TO REMODIFY A WHOLE TEAM, NOT JUST 1 POSITION
Facts
When the Pat's were the Pat's, Matt Castle won 13 games when Tom Brady went down. This team was looking bad the off-season Brady left. They were losing regardless..... Bill deserves his credit. Those Defenses are legendary
Cassell won 11 games and missed the playoffs with the team that the previous year went undefeated in the regular season, went to the Super Bowl, and was the second best offense in NFL history. (At that point the greatest ever.)
matt won 10 games ,because Brady started first game. that year was a total failure 18 and 1 team went 10 and 5 with Cassell,who next year made the pro bowl and won 11 gamjes as kc starter
Success and football is determined more than just by the coach and the quarterback. That’s disrespectful to every other person on that team.
Who chose a 6th round QB over a first overall pick QB? How many coaches would have got rid of Bledsoe for Brady? There is no Brady without Belichick. There is no Patriot success without Brady.
Fair point
For someone who played at a high level of football, Shady has the dumbest arguments about football on this show
He’s like the opposite of Shannon Sharpe lol
He’s a great example that just because you played the sport. You could be as clueless as someone who hasn’t
Robert Kraft admitted Patriots used to laugh at teams that spent big in free agency.
Belichick's free agency splurge in 2021 (the way he used to believe stupid) proved that *the reason Belichick could build the team in a way that other coaches couldn't was because he had Tom Brady. Without Tom Brady, he has to build the team just like how every other coach does.* In other word, Belichick proved that the system that won Pats 6 SB was Brady's system, not his.
@@williamli6200 you aren’t wrong about anything you said
@@williamli6200 It's a combo man...BB literally put those teams together and provided Tom with amazing defense...it's as much BB's system as it is Brady's
Bellichick is the reason Brady’s in the league. All passed on him for 5 rounds. Bellichick had the foresight to replace Bledsoe and allowed Tom to game manage for a few years until he became legit. No other team would’ve been successful with Brady because he never would’ve cracked their lineup. Gotta give Bill props.
Bill didn’t draft him. He had no control of drafting back then. Stop it.
If Bill truly knew that tom was that good he’d have never waited that long to take him.
@@Logan-id5pk Why would he though? If you know you can get a guy in 6th round, your not going to draft him in the first.
Yes he drafted a back up OL & DL ahead of Brady… everyone pass 5 times was he waiting for 7th round.
you still have to produce
Shula, Gibbs and Parcells. That's the list!
Gruden,Billick,Hrbaugh and many others
Joe Gibbs won 3 Super Bowls with 3 different starting QB's and 3 different starting running backs
it was like 5 years between super bowls
Thank-you so very much, Joy, for bringing the Facts about the Teams he played for. So many Hall of Famers that Tom Brady played for. As the Comments say, she messed up with the Andy Reid point. Shady, that's Cap. How many Hall of Famers did he develop for one?
UnexpectedWonder When you say "So many Hall of Famers that Tom Brady played for". For me, "so many" means a lot. So how many Hall of Famers played with Brady? And how many on offense?
@@sportsretrospective6759 they didn’t win a lot of the early SBs on offense. Ty Law, Richard Seymour, Willie McGinnist, oh yeah and the season he had Moss….they got punked by the giants. Brady is the goat, but giving him all the credit is foolishness at its finest
Ya sound stupid and ridiculous. Football a TEAMSPORT
@@deciuswtasby I know all that. And I'm not talking about who's the more important. I was asking how many Hall of Famers, because the guy before me is talking about "so many". The way I see it, he didn't play with "so many".
@@sportsretrospective6759 yeah I get that and see your premise. Honestly it’s almost impossible to have a plethora of hall of fame players on one squad for 10+ years because they would a have to be paid. Some of the most crapped on players people don’t discuss are the NE WR crew. Sure they weren’t big names but they didn’t drop passes, run blocked, and had no ego doing what Tom asked.
Joy is one of the smartest analysts on TV
I look at Bills interactions with his players.. there isn't any
They could get rid of the guys and just have Joy there... She's really good/knowledgeable/interesting.
If he's such a defensive "genius," explain Super Bowl LII. Benching Malcom Butler cost the Patriots a place in history . . . all because he had a bruised ego!
And you can look at the amazing defenses he built and coached to get Tom his first couple Superbowls. How many times has Brady had a top 10 defense?
@@brianlemmon3938 Dumbfook, don't claim defense won the SB when Pats needed offense to get first round bye, couple of winning drives in SB and scored 24+ in back to back playoff games, especially with the squad given by BeliCHEAP. That would imply Peyton, Rodgers and Mahomes are all dumbfook like you, get it?
🥴🥴 Malcolm butler has literally done nothing in the league. The highlight of his career is the pick in the Super Bowl
Don't be ignorant...he's considered by players analysts and fans as one of the best defensive minds in the game...the stats back it up but no one bats 1000%
@@maverick33guy95 How about now?
The stats? do you know *his defense was worse than packers defense on total yards allowed?*
Explain the abnormality before using the stats.
Giving Brady all the credit when he wins and give him all the excuses when he loses Shady is Brady fan on national television
Literally below average, statistically.
Belichik : 1 - 2 In the Playoffs without Brady . 30 - 11 with Brady . That Means Brady is responsible for 97 percent of Belichick's Playoff Head Coaching Record .
Was Tom playing “alone” or….was it the “teams” with Tom that got him those wins. Marinate on that
@@deciuswtasby Belichik is 14 - 32 with 3 Number One Overall Pick QBs All Time Testaverde , Bledsoe , Newton . Belichik still has a Losing Regular Season Record as a Head Coach All Time without Brady . Marinate on that clown hahaha
alright now yall going crazy with it, “Belichick is not a great head-coach” 😂
That must make Shady an average RB if Bill is an average QB
All decade team. Get out ur feelings brother
@@dabulltrick4913 BB isn't all decade...he's all time...If BB is average at what he does then Shady aint much
@@maverick33guy95 Robert Kraft admitted Patriots used to laugh at teams that spent big in free agency.
Belichick's free agency splurge in 2021 (the way he used to believe stupid) proved that the reason Belichick could build the team in a way that other coaches couldn't was because he had Tom Brady. Without Tom Brady, he has to build the team just like how every other coach does. In other word, Belichick proved that the system that won Pats 6 SB was Brady's system, not his.
@@williamli6200 I already wrecked that argument...no need to copy and paste
@@maverick33guy95 No, you didn't. Because you dont' even know what greatness means.
Again, why could Belidiot build the team in way no other coaches and GM could?
Joy's observations are dead on, but kind...lady is not a mean person
Patriots are nothing without tom brady 😂😂😂😂
Asante Samuel literally blew a Super Bowl and a perfect season
The offense that was scoring at will for most of the season only scoring 14 points lost them the superbowl
@@royals080 facts
He also helped them win one in 04 so…
Eli is a gangster you can’t put that on Asante
@@royals080 facts let’s not forget that defense Brady won a super bowl scoring 13 against the rams
Joy the best on this show
The reason that Tom had those players around was he took less and restructure his contract constantly to keep a team around him. Less be honest Bill didn't do him no favors when it came to drafting offensive weapons like his counterparts had.
Joy is phenomenal
Joy is the wisess of this group.
Andy Reid got that winning percentage because of Donovan McNabb, Joy dropped the ball in her argument
I'd say Mcnabb won because of Andy Reid
McNabb was not that great of a QB. If Reid had a better QB, he would have won those SBs.
Andy Reid did good with Alex Smith. He's the ultimate offensive guru. Once he started Mahomes he was a perennial Super Bowl contender.
@@KTF0 The Chiefs and Mahomes were going to become the next Dynasty. Until Brady showed up and ruined their party twice. Once in the AFC conference game and again with the Bucs in the SB. Now Mahomes is without Hill and gotta face a loaded Bills team that might be blocking him from another SB for many more years.
@@JohnSmith-nj4zq - Maybe but Andy Reid never had a season with a bad QB. His QBs were McNabb, Vick, Jeff Garcia, Alex Smith and Patrick Mahomes. The only relatively long stretch he had with the kind of QBs New England is dealing with post-Brady is when he had to start a gentleman by the name of Mike McMahon when McNabb got hurt. He went 1-5 or something like that. Just like Belichick can take average defensive players and put together a pretty solid defense, Andy Reid can take decent QBs and put together solid offenses. But you need a good QB to get your to where you wanna go. Where Shady and Acho are wrong is, Brady and Belichick were on the opposite sides of the ball. So, New England had 2 incredibly smart, dedicated men on either side of the ball. They propped each other up. When the defense wasn’t playing great, Brady kept them in the game, when Brady wasn’t having a great day, the defense kept them alive. Thats how they dominated the league for 20 years. Compare that to Reid or Sean Payton who’s best player was/is on the same side of the ball with them. They have no chance of replicating New England’s success.
Well, Coach has always said his success is due to great players. Maybe a great coach is great at bringing out the best in great players. Is Phil Jackson a great coach? He had some great players.
I think it’s a combo of both
The Quarterback and the coach were in lock-step and that is the key. Mom and dad have to be together and on point or it's chaos.
I've been saying that Brady made the Patriots. Belichick is the average to above average coach.
Without Brady, Belichick is the same as Matt Rhule.
Yikes
The fact that Tom bsrdy went to a new team and won a super bowl says it all. New England has done nothing since
It says nothing except that team was a great/HOF QB away from winning…..
@@poiziegaming5262 look at Tampa as a team on defense and offense for the year they won the super bowl. The numbers are identical almost for stars “except” Tom didn’t turn the ball over 35+ times. That team was 7-9 with a QB throwing them out of games. Could “any” QB have gone there? No….and I’m not up for conjecture or assuming. Brady did what he did but the defense was literally lights out destroying Rodgers, Brees, and Mahomes…..if the defense was bad or average they don’t win. Tom did what Tom does. So he gets his credit but he doesn’t get “all” the credit that’s foolish
@@deciuswtasby they are the only team to score more than 30 in every single playoff game. brady threw a nearly perfect 1st half in green bay. a good offense allows the D to rest those long drives hes known for. sorry but brady was the main Key. no brady, then you dont get founette, gronk, or AB. not to mention we all saw the offense completely changed after the bye week to bradys offense. no other QB is winning that year with them in a covid no offseason. not a chance.
this is a bad take the bucs were loaded when he won that year n he faced drew brees (last year) taylor hickey aaron rodgers choked but good win n then a injured chiefs team in the super bowl like most qbs couldve done that couldve beat those teams
@@blakmagic3097 Don't think Rodgers would be able to score 30+ in 3 straight playoff games, hence no SB.
not much of a defensive cooordinator without LT
Turned LT loose. Used him in an untraditional way that they weren't using linebackers back then. Also he was the defensive game planner for those NE Superbowls. Helluva defensive mind.
Most playoff wins 31
Most divisional championship as a head coach 17
6 superbowls with patriots
2 superbowls with giants as defensive co-ordinatior
9 Super Bowl appearance
Regular.season 0.666
Post season. 0.750
Career 0.690
He is the greatest and still is he needs to get his QB right again
He is below average without Brady. Rex Ryan got a better record than Belichick without Brady.
He needs to draft better
We need play makers not Football guys
@@bezbthatdude4558 football players do make plays….the difference is when you have a HOF talent at QB it helps a lot more lol.
all but 1 win with Brady. bringing giants rings is like saying matt patricia has superbowl rings or mcdaniels{these don't count}
What I don’t understand is why would anyone think Tom Brady would be the Tom Brady he is today without going to the patriots. More than likely Brady would’ve been out the nfl if he went to any of those other teams. He prob would never got a chance to start or even become who he is now.
Exactly. Bill had Drew Bledsoe and was winning before Brady too. Bledsoe got hurt and Brady showed his worth. I like the come up, but everybody worshipping Brady as if he wasn't in a horrible division and didn't have a great Machine behind him is stupid. You Tampa now. Team is weak and they are not excelling at all
He's been that way since college lol.
@@MrSamoannn that’s a lie…..he played decent for a “season” lol. He was average the prior year. If he was doing what you say while at “Michigan” he wouldn’t have fallen to the 6th round.
@@cagedragnarok1781 You say "Bill had Drew Bledsoe and was winning before Brady too". You should check the stats. Belicheck wasn't winning with Bledsoe before Brady. Belicheck was 5-11 with Bledsoe before Brady.
I wonder why we never made the same exercice with Lombardi-Starr, Shula-Griese, Grant-Tarkenton, Landry-Staubach, Noll-Bradshaw, Shanahan-Elway, Dungy-Manning, Walsh-Montana, etc. It's only with Belichick-Brady. Interesting.
It was Belichick who kept him as a 4th string QB his rookie year when he was taking a roster spot. Brady was a game manager when he started. The Pats were loaded defensively. Belichick implements the best defensive playoff strategies in NFL history even when he was a coordinator with the Giants.
Didn't Shula have johnny U??
The amount of disrespect and nonsense in this clip is outstanding...