@rustybuckets so you're just a hater then? 😂😂 my god dude you're entire argument for why he's a wash gets thrown out the window the moment you look at how the nba was structured back then and how trade policies worked out. Yet you leave that huge piece of info out whole bashing him😂 1 sided AF😂. I could pick apart this whole video in 5 minutes compared to your hours you spent making this. First off as for help ,you proved 2 guys were repeating all stars, the rest were 1 offs which meant the player had a breakout season which every player does. Go look at the celtics during that era. 5-7 all stars continuously for 9 years😂. Back then Boston and LA basically could horde the best players because of loose nba regulations as it was new and a higher amount of revenue. He in fact did beat those teams when he went to LA and was playing with reoccurring all stars😂. Id love for you to name 1 single player that did everything solo, not even mj did anything before pippen and Phil. You also fail to mention that had all stats been kept back then like they are today both bill and wilt would own and still retain majority of records in the nba considering they averaged 20+ rebounds and game and several blocks😂. Anyway bad take dude try again.
Averaging 45 a game, and missing the playoffs when there's not even 10 teams in the league is MADNESS. If Wilt played in the First Take era that discourse would be absolutely despicable.
I understand that thought process, but in reality what it means is that all the talent becomes extremely top heavy on certain teams. If you thought Cleveland vs the warriors was bad, the celtics and lakers were much worse. And they made up over 22% of the league that you were guaranteed worse than. And the vast majority of wilts "all star teammates" were like 34+ in an era where people died of old age at 60.
fun fact: wilt was still considered a loser well into the seventies, because a certain player named kareem abdul-jabbar arrived and won a championship two years into his career as a basketball player. the popular narrative was “omg look how good kareem is, who even needs wilt!” also, the fact that he was considered a loser bothered him, really heavily. he haaaated it. kinda like kd tbh
@@spoodyR3facts Kd was a terrible person to use 😂 KD has a finals appearance in 2012 and multiple playoff appearances and top seeded teams before Golden state
He was considered a loser for not giving 100% when his team needed him instead he tried to never foul out, this made score 6 less points per game and for that he holds the record for never foiling out
Just a reminder that the radio broadcast for Wilt's 100 point game is on TH-cam, and there is ZERO reason for the NBA to lie for an African American in the 60s
@@MotpyrCNesia Rumors is the wrong way of phrasing this because Wilt changing his defense in foul trouble was publicly observable and written about as it was happening. The word rumors is a much better term to describe his supposed feats that all happened with a small audience and no proof
Despite the fact that he played against the second most HOF player at his position(only behind kareem and parish, which he played 7 years less than both) He PLAYED THE MOST TOTAL GAMES against another hof center….see list below lol (mind you these are their barefoot heights, in the modern NBA you would add 1-2 inches to their height, as players have been measured in their shoes only after 1977) C-Bill Russell: 6’10” HOF (143 games played in 9 seasons) C-Kareem Abdul Jabbar: 7'2" HOF(27 games played in 4 seasons) C-Willis Reed: 6,10” HOF(72 games played in 8 seasons) C-Walt Bellamy: 6'11" HOF(100 games played in 11 seasons) C-Artis Gilmore: 7'2" HOF C-Bob Lanier: 6'11" HOF(17 games played in 3 seasons) C-Nate Thurmond: 6'11" HOF(47 games played in 4 seasons) C-Bob McAdoo: 6’10” HOF (5 games played in 1 season) C-Elvin Hayes:6’9 “ HOF (22 games played in 4 seasons) (Wes Unseld is also a HOF center but he is 6’7) (26 times in 5 seasons) (Dave Cowens is also a HOF Center/Forward but he is 6”9)(17 games played in 3 seasons) (Connie Hawkins is also a HOF Forward/ center but he is 6”9)(31 games played in 4 seasons) (please note there are more HOF PF who guarded and were guarded by wilt chamberlain but the majority of them are 6’8 to 6’9) SO THATS 574 OUT OF 1045…WHICH TRANSLATES TO 54% OF WILTS GAMES BEING PLAYED AGAINST ANOTHER HOF CENTER…
@@JohnnyRodgers3what's your point? Their height are at most 1-2 inches shorter than modern centers and I feel like it is quite well-know that the 60s were a center-dominated era.
You neglect to mention the there were 25 all stars for 9 teams. Meaning Phily having 3 all stars was literally average. Meanwhile, Russell has 4 to 8 other *Hall of Famers* on his squad every season.
Russell has so many Hall of Fame teammates because they played with Russell. Sam Jones might have been a great player - but he is in the Hall of Fame because he won 10 rings alongside Russell. The *only* Celtic player who continued to be great after Russell left was John Havlicek (who is almost always under-appreciated).
@@seinfan9did you watch the video? It wasn’t about wilt being bad. It’s about his play style being bad. Which is just objectively true. 5 guys beat 1 every time
Of course Wilt had All-star teammates. There were 24 all-stars per year in a 9 team league: So half the teams should have 3 All-stars, and 4 isn't a big deal.
That’s probably why all NBA team selections are a better indicator. Fun fact Russell has only 2 all nba first team selections despite having 5 mvps. He is the only player along with Dave Cowans to win MVP as all second team. However it should be noted when Russell played it was players not journalists or analysts who voted for the mvp and there was a lot of favoritism. Russell was universally respected in the league whereas a lot of guys hated Wilt Chamberlain
Why are you assuming the all-stars would be split evenly among all nine teams? Is that how it works any other season? I think the Celtics alone had six or seven all-stars for a couple of their 13-year run of titles.
I'm only 9:40 into the video, but I have to stop the video to point out some important context: Warriors coach Frank McGuire asked Chamberlain to play pivot and focus on defense for game 7, which Chamberlain did to the tune of 15 blocks. The plan was to take advantage of some streaky shooting from his teammates to make up for the lack of scoring. Gola and Meschery shot an absurd (in those days) 50% and 53% that game on 7-14 and 10-19 shooting. Unfortunately, Arizin (returning from an injury) shot an abysmal 4-22, which undoubtedly cost them the game and the series. With the Warriors down 5 late in the game, it was Chamberlain who scored all 5 to tie it up, only for Sam Jones to bury the game winner with a little over a second left. There's more to team basketball than scoring. Even so, 22 points (on 48% shooting), 22 rebounds, 3 assists, and 15 blocks is hardly underperforming. If you want to simply say, "he scored 22 after averaging 50," then I'll point out that he averaged 29 shots per game in the regular season but attempted only 15 in game 7 (again, because he was asked to focus on defense and let his teammates do the work on offense).
Great details, thanks....still if I hear "focus on defense" it sounds like Wilt was resting on D before or at least not going all out on D which also explains why he never fouled out in his entire career. Impossible in my opinion if you play D all the time.
@@thedudeunchained7583 the rules defensively were that if you didn't initiate contact and the offense did then it was an offensive foul. So I agree there must have been times he wasn't giving 100%, but the rules prevented people from fouling out for just being in the vicinity of an offensive star a few times. It was more that he hunted for blocks and easy steals sometimes rather than trying to provide suffocating defense.
Oscar Robertson actually had the same career trajectory. Played in Cincinnati for most of his career, and even with Jerry Lucas as his teammate, had terrible coaches including Bob Cousy, who famously didn't get along with him. They reached the ECF once, every other time missed the playoffs or were out in the first round. When Oscar went to the Bucks, he got Kareem and Larry Costello as a coach and won a ring immediately. When Lucas eventually went to the Knicks, he had the originator of the "beautiful game" team, and Red Holzman as a coach. Won a ring.
In that same manner we saw Embiid underperform to what we'd expect from his insane numbers. His career is more 'Wilt-like' if you will, than Luka's. He was coached by Doc Rivers, who has been criticized heavily for many years and started to do much better with Nick Nurse on the team. There are problems with Embiid's conditioning, his health and certainly his consistancy in the playoffs, but some of his bad performances are also contributable to bad coaching in his earlier years.
@@Bøss35689 no. You can’t have your main rival have 8 more rings than you and be higher ranked. What if Bird had 7 rings? No one would say Magic is better
If you look at when Bill Russell left in 69 after winning a championship the Celtics still had 5 HOFers and a HOF coach... and they missed the playoffs, the only team to ever do so until the 99 Bulls. That should tell you everything you need to know about the value of Bill Russell, on my Mt. Rushmore
Bill Russell was not the only player who left in 1969. Sam Jones who had been the major scorer since the beginning of the Celtics dynasty also retired. It was also Tom Heinsohn first year of coaching. Not trying to argue the value of Bill, I just want to provide more context.
well there’s also a large sample size of luka’s former teammates no longer being in the league or averaging worse numbers than they did with him so i think it’s safe to say the guy averaging a near triple double on great efficiency isn’t most of the reason his team hasn’t won a championship
I mean, when you think about it, Luka and Harden ended up getting beat in the playoffs by 2 of the greatest teams ever assembled. Correlation doesn't equal causation. Even if Luka has lower usage in the finals, who is gonna pick up that offensive slack? Kyrie was having a bad series and Mavs roleplayers aren't really gonna create like that.
Honestly only re tards make that claim about Doncic. He’s in his sixth season and has been to two Western Conference finals and one NBA finals. Compare that to Jordan, James, Curry, or any number of players who were the superstar on their team and let me know how many did better. Here’s a hint…. if you take out magic and bird, none of them.
Not to mention you’re talking about a guy six years into his NBA career. Look up superstars winning championships or having multiple conference finals runs as the best player on their team and once you get past bird, magic, and Duncan, the list gets really thin really fast. Here’s a hint, Jordan, James, Durant, Curry…. none of them have two conference finals and an NBA finals on their résumé except Luka. He’s being written off by a tubby TH-camr despite the fact that he has a better winning résumé than almost anybody to come into the league in the last 40 years. But I highly doubt Rusty is going to let a little thing like facts get in the way of trying to prove his silly little theory.
Yeah i don't think Luka heliocentric basketball was the reason the Mavs lost, more, their role players were guys who could not hit above the break 3s, which is what boston was giving them. Though Luka getting worn down was a problem, i think that has more to do with minute management than playstyle. We kinda know nowadays not to waste possessions having role players try to initiate offense.
I am really happy with how these documentary essays (or whatever) are shaping out as of the last year. Good job, Rusty! And shout-out to Rudy for sticking with you and to the rest of the newer editorial additions.
Wilt played when 2 hand checking was allowed Wilt high jumped 6 feet, 6 inches, ran the 440 yards in 49.0 seconds and the 880 yards in 1:58.3, put the shot 53 feet, 4 inches, and long jumped 22 feet.His vertical, during his prime, was "46 to 48 inches, easy."He ran the 100-yard dash in 10.9 seconds, shot-putted fifty-six feet (17 m), triple jumped more than fifty feet (15 m).his physical prime, Chamberlain was able to bench press 550 pounds, 85 pounds more than the max of Shaquille O'Neal, who many regard as the most physically dominant player of the modern era.Mar 22, 2021 Here is a list of the players who played in Wilt's NBA who were 6-11 or taller... Ray Felix 6-11 65 Chuck Share 6-11 Walter Dukes 7-0 Swede Halbrook 7-3 Walt Bellamy 6-11 Nate Thurmond 6-11 Reggie Harding 7-0 Mel Counts 7-0 Walt Wesley 6-11 Hank Finkel 7-0 Craig Spitzer 7-0 Craig Raymond 6-11 Otto Moore 6-11 Rich Niemann 7-0 Tom Boerwinkle 7-0 265 Dave Newmark 7-0 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 7-2 Greg Fillmore 7-1 240 George Johnson 6-11 245 Bob Lanier 6-11 250 Elmore Smith 7-0 250 Tom Payne 7-2 240 Vic Bartolome 7-0 230 Jim McDaniels 6-11 William Smith 7-0 George Johnson 6-11 (yes another G. Johnson) LaRue Martin 6-11
Best Rusty Buckets essay... EVER! Congrats on a tour de force from someone who watched Wilt play (though, admittedly, near the end of his career -- Wilt and West were my favorite players).
@@Noifsnobutsnococonuts-rj4kkif he watched near the end of the career I would guess he is around 65-75 since that means he would be about 10-20 years old in 1969
@@MaxHutchings31 nah, Wilt himself admitted that he played for himself and his stats. Only after so many failures in the playoff that he tried to change his way of playing and as the result, he won his first chip
Wilt controlled the scoreboard, Russell controlled the court. It’s nearly impossible to see Russell’s MVP quality effect on the game in the box scores, but it’s undeniable if you sit down and watch a game.
Win shares. But yeah as a Celtics fan bill is what you get if you built a leader in a lab. Elite athlete and very skilled as a rebounder defender and passer. He is the definition of a selfless man
They way I see it is Bill was like lebron, Wilt was like Melo (player wise not stat wise) one played to make the team better the other one plays to stuff his stats(no hate towards Melo he's one of my favs)
@@kanone_69don’t you think a large reason why those guys are in the hof is because they were a part of the greatest NBA dynasty of all time, a dynasty built around and partially designed by Russell? Wilt played with all-stars, and they had the holistically worst statistical seasons of their careers while playing with him. Nearly every player, from star to journeyman, had the best seasons of their careers with Russell. Russell’s defensive skill, and otherworldly flow control built the foundation.
People criticized Wilt about his scoring and not passing more is why he lead the league in assists to shut them up. WIlt was other level of greatness. Untouchable as a Stat machine for whatever he wanted to do. The rebounds is scary to see.
imagine thinking that the way to prove you arent a stat padder was to pad a different stat. and the rebound number actually make a lot of sense when you look at the shot attempts per game and avg FG%. The # of available rebounds were off the chart and Wilt was a freak athlete and played nearly every minute.
@@kevinjohnson4498facts...all top 30 rebound averages are held by teams from the 60s. All top 10 individual rebounds leaders are players from Wilt's era. Rodman has the 11th highest rebound average and the first guy who didn't play in the 60s. Wilt's highest rebounding season was 61/62 when he grabbed 27.2 rebounds per game. The 8 NBA teams at the time averaged almost 74 rebounds a game. So Wilt grabbed 37% of available rebounds. That is crazy impressive!!! Rodman's best rebounding season was in 1991/92 when he grabbed 18.7 rebounds per game. That season the average NBA team grabbed 43.7 rebounds oer game. So Rodman grabbed 42.79 percent of available rebounds. If you put 1991 Rodman into 1961 he would also grab 42.79 percent of the available rebounds to average 31.66 rebounds a game. Thats over 4 rebounds more than Wilt got and Rodman is 6.7. That's why Rodman is the best Rebounder all time, not Wilt.
If you go back and actually watch what complete games are available of Wilt in his prime, its actually shocking how little impact he seems to be having on the moment to moment flow of the game. It sounds crazy and when you hear people talk about him who were around then or are sports experts they make him sound so dominant, but honestly in the games I've seen of him its always the most unnoticeable statistical dominance I've ever seen. I distinctly remember being confused in watching a few of his games where the announcers said his points and rebounds in like the 3rd quarter and being shocked that he had so many because I specifically was watching the game to see him dominate and never saw anything that made me think he was controlling the game at all. Thats not to say he wasn't good or valuable, but his minute by minute impact is not accurately represented by his stats or highlights.
The idea and mysticism of Wilt Chamberlain is certainly superimposed. It's not just enough to win, you need to win in every facet that's offered too you. And for what it is worth, I still believe Chamberlain being berated in the newspaper headlines day in and day out is not the best holdover for wanting to play winning basketball. And it's almost like his worries were proven right when he won that first ring, which I love how you brought up. "What's the point of choosing a path if they're both wrong?" But in the same sense that many modern NBA fans cherry pick Wilt's statistical marvels to present an almost Grecian level hero in 60s basketball, retractors will hold onto those two rings like he should never be seen in a favorable light, at all. He is a legend, that deserves the criticism, for sure, but I think for the people who do truly appreciate some level of Wilt's game, and a foundation he laid, it's like some mental gymnastics to remember, "Oh yea, Wilt kind of was a loser, in a legacy sense." But hell. Today we still talk about Wilt more than most of the past legends. You've named a Paradox about him. He still remains one of the polarizing figures within American Sports that's ever exist. And he might vaguely be remembered fondly, he's remembered, and that's worth it.
Despite the fact that he played against the second most HOF player at his position(only behind kareem and parish, which he played 7 years less than both) He PLAYED THE MOST TOTAL GAMES against another hof center….see list below lol (mind you these are their barefoot heights, in the modern NBA you would add 1-2 inches to their height, as players have been measured in their shoes only after 1977) C-Bill Russell: 6’10” HOF (143 games played in 9 seasons) C-Kareem Abdul Jabbar: 7'2" HOF(27 games played in 4 seasons) C-Willis Reed: 6,10” HOF(72 games played in 8 seasons) C-Walt Bellamy: 6'11" HOF(100 games played in 11 seasons) C-Artis Gilmore: 7'2" HOF C-Bob Lanier: 6'11" HOF(17 games played in 3 seasons) C-Nate Thurmond: 6'11" HOF(47 games played in 4 seasons) C-Bob McAdoo: 6’10” HOF (5 games played in 1 season) C-Elvin Hayes:6’9 “ HOF (22 games played in 4 seasons) (Wes Unseld is also a HOF center but he is 6’7) (26 times in 5 seasons) (Dave Cowens is also a HOF Center/Forward but he is 6”9)(17 games played in 3 seasons) (Connie Hawkins is also a HOF Forward/ center but he is 6”9)(31 games played in 4 seasons) (please note there are more HOF PF who guarded and were guarded by wilt chamberlain but the majority of them are 6’8 to 6’9) SO THATS 574 OUT OF 1045…WHICH TRANSLATES TO 54% OF WILTS GAMES BEING PLAYED AGAINST ANOTHER HOF CENTER…
Damn. I remember watching Rusty when he had like 36k subscribers. Crazy bro. Haven't watched in a while. The confidence you now have in front of the camera is incredible. Night and day. Great work!
Wilt Chamberlain was an excellent talent, and had a Hall of Fame career. But if you take his raw numbers and averages at face value, you’ll likely end up overstating his impact on the basketball court. Execution aside, it could be argued that scoring as much as Wilt did is a sign of a player who had too big a role individually in his team’s offense. And conversely, the ability to succeed around other players and scorers is itself a skill that doesn’t show up a ton on a box score. That’s an ability that Wilt could have illustrated he had if he had been utilized in the most impactful way by a coach. Would’ve been interesting if he had a coach like Alex Hannum for his entire career.
@@keanewhiteirproductions9538I’m not implying Wilt wasn’t good by any stretch. Just saying that if he was used in a manner that was most conducive to winning, then his averages would’ve inevitably been lower than they were in his earlier career. He still could’ve put up great numbers on a great team though and we saw that later in his career.
@@fortynights1513imagine if he was playing in todays era where centers are smaller, he can offensive foul and there hella space....imagine 76ers wilt and Steph on the same court
After reading 2 of Wilts books bio he stated that the year that he averaged the 50pts his coach asked him to do so and Wilt didnt want to because he felt his teamates wouldnt like it.I learned a lot reading his book that you cant see from the outside.I personally feel that he was the most dominate center in history.Russell was great,but he couldnt stop Wilt.Even he atmitted this.On top of all his records he had a slight heart attack in his 2nd or 3rd year in the nba ,He had to wear a heart monitering device for a short time afterward.An amazing athelete for a man 7 feet tall! R.I.P. Wilt
You said Russell didn't have more help than Wilt.... Like, Clyde Lovellette was an all-star, MVP candidate, HoFer and Boston couldn't find a place for him in their rotation.
I gotta admit, when Kobe scored 81, it was absolutely sick to watch. But he was a better player, and the Lakers a vastly better team, when Pau joined and Kobe focused less on being the only scorer and worked better within the system. Wilt took too long to come to the same conclusion.
@@HorizonOfHope I would say Phil Jackson was just far better at game and talent management than any coach Wilt has ever had but there’s no metric really to show us Kobe was better offensively or defensively. We just favor him more.
Wilt Chamberlain’s drop in playoff scoring might be partly due to the increased defensive focus he faced. During the regular season, he averaged 30.1 points on 22.5 field goal attempts per game. But in the playoffs, his scoring dropped to 22.5 points per game, with only 17.1 attempts-around five fewer shots each game. If Wilt had managed to keep up his regular-season shot volume, his playoff numbers could have looked significantly different. With a shooting percentage of 52% in the playoffs, making just two additional shots per game would have added about four points, bringing his playoff average up to 26 points per game. Adding one extra free throw per game would have realistically lifted his average to 27 points, putting his playoff production much closer to his regular-season level. In close games against teams like the Celtics, where he often lost by only a few points, this extra scoring could have made all the difference in rewriting history. Defenses in the playoffs likely adopted a strategy similar to what we see with great players today: even if they can’t stop the star entirely, they focus on making things harder, applying extra pressure to limit their impact.
Playoff defense has been like that since the beginning of time. Facing "tougher defenses" in the playoffs is expected. It's still your job as a star to perform or capitalize off of that defensive attention. Especially when you're a once in a lifetime star with multiple all star teammates.
Wilt was the first superstar Rusty, offenses, schemes etc had to evolve, they had to figure out how to succeed with a player like that. It has never been done before.
Spectacular work, Rusty. Your best so far, no doubt. Just one thing, please don't add any fuel to this nonsensical fire. His 100-point game isn't alleged. It happened.
Despite the fact that he played against the second most HOF player at his position(only behind kareem and parish, which he played 7 years less than both) He PLAYED THE MOST TOTAL GAMES against another hof center….see list below lol (mind you these are their barefoot heights, in the modern NBA you would add 1-2 inches to their height, as players have been measured in their shoes only after 1977) C-Bill Russell: 6’10” HOF (143 games played in 9 seasons) C-Kareem Abdul Jabbar: 7'2" HOF(27 games played in 4 seasons) C-Willis Reed: 6,10” HOF(72 games played in 8 seasons) C-Walt Bellamy: 6'11" HOF(100 games played in 11 seasons) C-Artis Gilmore: 7'2" HOF C-Bob Lanier: 6'11" HOF(17 games played in 3 seasons) C-Nate Thurmond: 6'11" HOF(47 games played in 4 seasons) C-Bob McAdoo: 6’10” HOF (5 games played in 1 season) C-Elvin Hayes:6’9 “ HOF (22 games played in 4 seasons) (Wes Unseld is also a HOF center but he is 6’7) (26 times in 5 seasons) (Dave Cowens is also a HOF Center/Forward but he is 6”9)(17 games played in 3 seasons) (Connie Hawkins is also a HOF Forward/ center but he is 6”9)(31 games played in 4 seasons) (please note there are more HOF PF who guarded and were guarded by wilt chamberlain but the majority of them are 6’8 to 6’9) SO THATS 574 OUT OF 1045…WHICH TRANSLATES TO 54% OF WILTS GAMES BEING PLAYED AGAINST ANOTHER HOF CENTER…
8x Wilt ran into the best dynasty in team sports with a team that was 6+hof deep and there was a whole 6 rules changed to limit him. Russell, Jones, Hondo, Heinsohn, Cousy, etc. If not for that Wilt has a handful of rings and there is 0 question who's the goat
@@apuapustaja4444or maybe because he's not a team player, that's why he achieve a lot individually and not as a team, it's unfair to diminish Bill Russell for his team oriented playstyle that resulted in championships, he's a winner and wilt is a loser at the end of the day.
@@HAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAJA No one is diminishing Russell but can we compare Wilt playing with 2 allstars and hof to Bill playing with the best coach, organization and 5 more hof? I got all the love and respect for Bill. But do a deep dive into what Wilts teamates avg those elimination games to see if it falls on Wilt or them
@@andrewcook1246 Did you really think about this take of yours? Because if you really think about it, Bill have 5 hof *teammates* because they played alongside Bill and not Wilt because Bill is a great *team player* , they work as a team that's why they achieve many championships which resulted to their Hall of Fame careers, that's also true to the so called *best coach* as you said. Bill's teammates and coach got alot of chances to shine because of their team oriented play style, and they did, it resulted in winning basketbal, as opposed to Wilt who only thinks about individual achievements until his late career. And now y'all use the arguments of Bill being a good team against him? Don't get me wrong I still believe Wilt is better than Bill *individually* but in terms of greatness? Bill is above Wilt. He is a winner.
Your essays are always awesome. Very glad you went back to more of this than just reactionary stuff. Honestly I think a team that has a high scoring guy who just does everything but doesn’t win should make that guy watch this video.
Big were the scoring option back them up until like late 80s early 90s before you started seeing more MJ, Clyde, Dominique etc type of guys being the #1 scoring option. Even then you still had David Robinson, Karl Malone, Shaq, Hakeem etc.
I'm fully aware. But if he's not gazelle sprinting up the floor to beat the team he's not getting the first pass. He isn't bringing it up the floor. If he's scoring that much it means he's the only option. And they didn't rest like they do today. They didn't have commercial breaks sitting around. Wilt was world-class in track and field but I highly doubt he's sprinting 82 minutes and he played every minute. @@sheezy3962Bigs are still the best option the league is just desperate for another Michael Jordan.
@@sheezy3962 the point is he's not a point guard and therefore is being passed the ball because he's the best option. Was he sprinting like a gazelle for 82 minutes? I doubt it.
Wilt Chamberlain was traded like he was marchandise, a racing horse or a gladiator while he considered himself as a roc star. At contrary, Russell was considered by Auerbach almost as his equal at the point he gave him the keys of the car during two years. I beleive Russell developed some fidelity to his franchise ... mainly because he trusted Red ... at contrary, Wilt saw himself as a mercenary or an adventurer.
Not a Wilt defender by any means, but it’s interesting how we see Dirk in a much more positive light compared to Wilt. He only won once, and famously came up short several times as well. They did carry themselves drastically differently though…I bet that’s it
“The warriors had 3 all stars how could he not have won??!!?? 😮” dude do you not realize there were literally 8 teams in the league. And 24 all star spots. So his help was league average level at best
You make the HOF when you retire. You make all star appearances while you're actively playing. So, the all star appearance is the more accurate depiction.
Do Pistol Pete next. Take any elite NBA player and ask yourself "if their own father was this player's college coach, and that father had dictatorial roster decisions and recruiting, AND the father did not care at all whether the team won or lost, had no danger of losing their job for the time their kid was at the college, and based the entire game plan around their own kid putting up big stats to improve their draft stock, could they average 44.2PPG over three college years?" Pistol Pete didn't suck, but I think any top 50 guy in NBA history, if given those circumstances, could probably put up Pete Maravich numbers. It's only untouchable because no other team will sacrifice wins for one player's benefit, so that player is more attractive to professional teams. That's the thing that is NEVER talked about with his records. Press Maravich was the coach and they were a mediocre-at-best team, but the goal was the 1.9 million dollar contract the Hawks gave his son. That he set records along the way was happenstance.
I'm old enough to have vague memories of Maravich in college and certainly in the NBA, and everything you say is true and was widely understood at the time. Since then, lots of people have shouted that point down, "No, he was great, you're oversimplifying," but it's not oversimplified. Press Maravich made Pete and ruined him at the same time.
@@DavidBennett-m4r Maybe. I think the kid was gonna be weird either way. Still though, top 50 players are born, not made. So even if you could say top 50 could've done what he did with his training, he's still a top 50. Although Idk.. scoring with your head? Most soccer players wouldn't be able to do that.
@@Cannon4545 Hey, to be clear, I never said he had no talent (also she, not he). He DID have a gift. Lots of overzealous parents push their kids into sports, but there's not a million Pistol Pete or Williams sisters out there. Very few make it, and the ones that do usually do so for a reason. My argument in its entirety is this: ANY top 50 or Top 75 NBA player, including the old ones from before Maravich's time like Mikan, Pettit, Cousy and especially Paul Arizin, if you gave them the exact same circumstances as Pistol Pete, IE make their father the coach, a father who has NO CONCERN AT ALL FOR WINNING and tailors the entire team, recruiting, practice, and gameplay, towards making their son break scoring records, any of the 75 other guys in the Anniversary team could have set records in the same ball park or even higher than Maravich did. No basketball star EVER has had circumstances like Pete had when he set the record. Coaches jobs hang on the line, but LSU would never have fired Press Maravich. Pete was money for them. And that's why his records are both legit AND dubious.
Why don't you compare the All-NBA players that Russell played with compared to Wilt in the years they shared in the NBA as it is not even close? 1959 3 1st team All NBA players Russell, Cousy, and Sharman...when else has that ever happened? 1960 Cousy 1st team All NBA, Russell, Sharman 2nd team 1961 Cousy 1st team All NBA, Russell, Heinsohn 2nd team 1962 Cousy, Russell, Heinsohn 2nd team All NBA... 4 Celtics made the All-Star Team Cousy, Russell, Heinsohn, and Jones 1963 Russell 1st team All NBA, Cousy, Heinsohn 2nd team...Havlicek Rookie team 1964 Havlicek, Russell, Heinsohn All NBA 2nd team.... Sam Jones also made the All-Star team 1965 Russell 1st team, Sam Jones 2nd team 1966 Russell, Jones, Havlicek All NBA 2nd team 1967 Russell, Jones All NBA 2nd team 1968 Russell, Havlicek All NBA 2nd team 1969 Havlicek All NBA 2nd team Now if you compare that to Wilt's supporting cast for the first 6 years of his career it destroys it As Wilt had zero All NBA teammates with the Warriors from 1959 to 1965. And only one other All NBA teammate in Hal Greer from 1965 to 1968 with the 76ers.
Ur assuming making allstars is the benchmark for help. Good Role players are help as well. Wilt had solid enough role players to be good enough to nearly beat the Celtics only multiple occasions. The problem wasn’t the help clearly if they were within points of beating the celts on multiple occasions. It was the way they were used. It was the wilt show and everyone else move out the way. Easy to defend for the Celtics. Just try our best to dent some of wilts production and don’t worry about anyone else because he won’t pass to the anyway. He had some of the worst assist to scoring attempt ratios of all time in his years. Alex hannum took that same crop of talent around wilt that was so called, “no help,” and asked wilt to pass more and their offense looked SIGNIFICANTLY better immediately compared to seasons pass. Then he goes to Philly with much better talent like Cunningham Greer, etc, and they dominate Boston. Playmaking is essential for ALL great scorers. Wilt didn’t capitalize on what he had and his teams suffered.
@@TheIcemanthomasback then there were very few players in the league compared to now so all nba teams are actually better for knowing who had the best supporting cast
I respectfully disagree with your thesis, Rusty, even though I find your argument interesting. Wilt Chamberlain's lack of winning and his contrast to Russell's high winning impact isnt caused by him not bring utilized properly. I think that Is a rabbit hole that Is used as an excuse for certain players. A great example of this is Russell Westbrook (although Westbrook is a top 50 player ever and Wilt a top 12). Russell Westbrook recently stated in an interview for the Denver Nuggets that he wasn't utilized properly by other teams. We all know that his inefficient style that led to triple doubles in OKC and first round exits wasn't imposed by coaches but was active play style choice by Westbrook. I think that Wilt, although being exponentially better, was wired similarly to Westbrook in the sense that he loved breaking records and achieving statistical dominance. It took plentiful losses, a strong minded coach and a fear of having a tarnished legacy to change his approach. It seems that you are minimizing the players' agency in their playstyle throughout history and giving too much weight to a coaches' choice for a player. I think that Kareem Abdul jabber was the perfect medium between Russell and Wilt, and therefore the better player. He was team oriented and conducive to winning like Bill and retained some of his dominance like Wilt.
@@goldenbuckets23 I don’t think Kareem was better, I think he played a better game. The nba was literally in its infancy. Look at how dribbling and fouls were called during Wilts playing days and just imagine the league 5yrs before he stepped in. He’s responsible for a lot of changes but when there are changes that makes it not the same bc there are literally differences. Basketball was BECOMING entertainment and Kareem was a beneficiary of the era. The jump shot became an official thing in 48 and Bill made jumping legal to block shots while he was in college. I would never say Kenyon Martin is better than Shaq but in THIS GAME, he possibly could easily be.
The Wilt Chamberlain's role transition, from one season to another, was an intriguing story : Chamberlain made it clear he did not like to be told what to do. He complained to reporters about Hannum's strategy, and Hannum insisted to the same men that Chamberlain was going to have to change The tension built until one night... Hannum and Chamberlain got into a violent locker-room argument and avoided coming to blows only when other players interevened. Hannum, deciding a showdown was necessary, ordered the other players out, then took off his jacket. "You've been fighting me as a coach all the way," Hannum said. "Now fight me as a man." Chamberlain glared at Hannum for a long moment and then folded, saying, "Aw, I can't fight you, Alex." ...Despite grudgingly yielding to Hannum's authority, he still resented the coach, and complained about him to Guy Rodgers, one of his closest friends on the team. But Rogers thought Hannum's strategy was obviously paying off. Rogers wanted to see the Warriors win, and it vexed him that Chamberlain seemed willing to put his own pride ahead of the best interests of the team "You've got to bow down, Wilt," Rodgers told Chamberlain. "Admit it, cat, that we're a much better club with you feeding us part of the time and then getting back to protect our basket." Page 192 of John Taylor's book : The Rivalry: Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, and the Golden Age of Basketball
Watched this video, enjoyed it, thought about it the next day and came back to like it and make a comment cus the quality and subject stuck with me so well, in conclusion, I fuckin love these nba deep dives
Wilt lead the league in scoring rebounding assist and Blocks but they didn't count it back then... STOP THE LIES he did everything but Celtics had to much help and HOFs
Btw I see people say Bill’s teammates are only HoFers because of their rings but that isn’t true when looking at each guy individually Also it’s dumb the NBA inducted Russell again to the HoF as a coach when as a coach he was a below 500 record and his actual coaching gig with the Sonics and Kings was terrible
Considering that I have seen countless attempts at besmirching Wilt over the past 20+ years and it is the same nonsense narrative every single time I will just leave a few points to dispel common lies about Wilt: 1.) "Wilt was not that dominant": Yes, yes he was. He was more dominant that Kareem or Russell. People harp on about team success, but the reality is that until 1968 Wilt just like MJ did not have a team that was good enough. It is a testament to him being able to almost bring the reinging multiple time championship winning dynasty to its knees loosing four playoff series by a combined margin of 9 in a do or die final game, or basically by a single bucket and in almost every single one of them neither Wilt nor Russell were involved with the last shot taken. MJ in a similar situation against the Bird led Celtics in the 80s lost miserably in sweeps or gentlemen sweeps. Going back to Kareem, Wilt on a reconstructed knee, which he blew out so badly just 2 years prior that many doubted that he would be able to play ever again, overweight and nearing the end of career gave Kareem fits, blocking multiple sky hooks, at least once even twice in a row which can be seen on camera on TH-cam. In fact he was so dominant on the defensive end that he got standing ovations in Milwaukee. Furthermore, Kareem only won when he had the very best point guards feeding him. First Oscar Robertson who was the best point guard in his era and later Magic Johnson whom many still consider the best point guard of all time. Wilt never had a point guard that good until his final few years. 2.) "Wilt did not average 50 in the playoffs" he also did not average 50 against the Celtics. Like any top scorer he scored more on weaker competitors and less on stronger ones. His production once analysed on a per team basis showed remarkable resilience with little drop off in either production or efficiency. 3.) "Wilt would not average 50 today" for a career he did not average 50. Not even for his first 7 seasons. As to single season record, inferior players like Harden averaged 34 for a season much of which was due to foul rule abuse. So if someone like Harden can average 34 I can see Wilt going above that. 50 ppg in a season though? Maybe not. 40 ppg? A stretch maybe but possible. I cannot say that for certain but I can make the case easily but it would depend entirely on the team around him just like it did in the 60s. 4.) "Wilt was a diva". Yes, so? Shaq was a diva. So was Magic, so was MJ and many other players. An irrelevant statement. 5.) "Wilt was a statpadder". To a degree sometimes, yes. You know who also stat padded? Your beloved Michael Jordan who wanted to prove that he could get triple doubles like Magic for a season and was seen to go to the scoreboard to check his assists and rebounds. Sorry to burst your bubble that the supposed "GOAT" also did that. Lastly, since the title of the video is almost offensive to me, no the stats do not lie. Stats have to be interpreted and people often ignore context for stats, usually on a time or era basis when it comes to that era, so the interpretations can be wrong or be lied about, but raw stats do not lie. They just do not tell the whole story.
I hate how stats almost get a bad rap these days. As you said, they don't tell the whole story. But they are literally measurements of what players contributed on the court.
@@chilldoc9638 "League of 10 teams" already tells me how ignorant you are since you obviously think that with only 10 teams making it to the playoffs is easy. I could also ask how MJ averaging over 30 could not get out of the first round for 7 years in a row.
@@page8301it's only wrong when wilt does it lol if wilt isn't the goat, then Russell is the goat. But they we will never say Russell is the goat because Russel just plays defense lol the Title of the video is giving hate. Hate all players in wilt's era, because none could beat the Celtics lol except wilt lol wilt beat the Celtics while playing under a good head coach. Wilt has done many great things while on the court, and sometimes the stats doesn't tell the whole story. They say wilt use to average more than 10 blocks per game. I'm more impressed that he blocked the skyhook two times in the same play. The greatest play I've ever seen. Wilt blocked the first shot, then Kareem recovered the ball, from that moment it became a 1vs1. Kareem tried his best and was still blocked. Amazing.
I don't normally comment too often but I like to make sure I do on videos that put this much effort and love into it. Love seeing you excel Rusty you've got a good head on your shoulders and display this information in a very entertaining and thoughtful approach. Also shoutouts to the editors and everyone behind the scenes I look forward to seeing how far you can go.
Bruce Lee said it best: “It's like a finger pointing the way to the moon. Don't concentrate on the finger or you will miss all that heavenly glory” In Wilt’s case scoring was his finger!
Maybe, IF you really did a deep dive you would see that most of Wilt's team mates shot 35% from the field and HAD to rely on him scoring 45 a game, 20RPG and 5Blks per game because if they had a "regular" center scoring 10PPG and 10RPG they would never have been near the playoffs.
Thanks for this one Rusty! I'm totally taking the "Wilt's Paradox" line. And the underappreciated aspect to me is your point on "unimaginable coaching." The best coaches are able to push their best scorers to focus more on the team and provide a system/framework to do so. Bill also already had the "team-first" mentality, so it was easy to sell him on the idea, while it took more to get Wilt to buy in.
As a long time one-eyed Celtics fan, the legacy of Wilt Chamberlain is one that through my eyes should be enhanced rather than diminished. When Wilt didn't win, how could he not win? When he won...of course he did. He was judged and berated mercilessly by the socially conditionally then. 25 years since his passing, he is judged and berated mercilessly by the socially conditioned today. His first 7 years of NBA coincided with the Celtics Dynasty between 1959-1966. IT WAS A DYNASTY. Dynasties usually happen when clubs win 3 titles across a 5 year period. The Celtics won 8 in a row...EIGHT. Has anyone ever thought to consider that team chemistry orchestrated by one of the greatest coaches of all-time in Red Auerbach may have been a contributing factor? I think the magnitude of Red's impact is continually being dimished as time goes on. Yes...he had reduced individual impact against the Celtics as Russell could curtail him...but Russell couldn't do it on his own. The stats and the footage that is shown featuring Russell and Chamberlain does not lie. Russell was the bravest David and was adequately equipped to take down Goliath with the right tools and strategy. But Goliath 1 on 1 was too dominant beyond belief. Further to Wilt's individual exploits, there is greatness attached to Wilt that goes beyond the court and is only seen by those who have attracted the capacity to exist at a higher vibration and frequency through their authentic actions in life. Wilt was before his time in ALL facets. Not just in basketball but LIFE AWARENESS. He represented ego...or did he? Reality was he was anything but ego. Wilt's ego was a facade. He portrayed ego to humanity because he knew humanity was as blind back then as they are today. They would never see his true colours. Failure, suffering and pain became so attached to Wilt that Wilt realised that for him to accept and navigate through the obstacles in his path...he had to learn to love pain. As stated by Rusty Buckets, Wilt was adjudged the biggest loser due to the complex paradox attached to his individual exploits...yet for all the pain, suffering and humilation that was directed at him, Wilt never appeared triggered. There's great reason for this. Wilt was a philanthrapist. Majority of people ignore this because its not a stat...yet by ignoring this, a socially conditioned agenda is formed. Wilt was a very generous and loving person behind the scenes. People who knew him stated this but he did not seek fame, fortune or exposure for his good deeds. Furthermore he did not seek any of this in life...but clearly attracted it because of genetic factors beyond his control and abilities demonstrated. This was his path. For all of this, Wilt knew his value, his worth and the source he represented. This alone confirms he was one step ahead of the majority of people today. Portrayed ego...but his authentic actions in life not visually seen spoke much much louder. By learning to master the dark arts, he triggered an ability to activate the essence of his human being and was able to live a life of duality alternating between his human being and his spiritual being. Wilt's legacy goes far far far beyond basketball and as a result, his story is one that will only serve to become more and more iconic and mythical as time goes on.
For those of you who have had a read of this, thank you. Feel free to check out his basketball statue in Philadelphia. Read the quote above his name. Observe the statue, the symbolism it depicts and decide for yourselves. Nothing like a bit of see, think and wonder for you all to consider. From there, it's a matter of faith.
@chilldoc9638 yes...watched the whole hour plus on TV and started typing on the mobi towards the end. Regardless of whether views align or not, genuinely rate Rusty's presentations. He does an outstanding job.
that warriors rockets series is a bad example. it wasn't because of CP3 going down that they lost. game 7 they went 7-44 from 3. ariza went 0-12 in 42 minutes. they missed 23 3 pointers in a row and lost by 9. biggest choke in nba history. they shoulda beat the warriors and then swept the cavs.
Yeah because even with all the missed threes (27 in a row btw) they were leading for most of the game. If they had managed to hit even a quarter of those threes they probably would have won.
Wilt was a dominate player and to me still is the goat. Problem with things like this, is the record... team record. Wilt was good, his teammates weren't. Basketball is a team sport, and if you want success, like Championships, you have to play like a team.
Did you watch the video? The video, on multiple occasions, highlights him having multiple Allstars on his teams. Perhaps Wilt is just the greatest scorer of all time. Perhaps his lack of rings is more important to his GOAT status than his scoring. One could also say scoring 50 points a game and not winning a ring shows something is deeply wrong with his ability to make the players around him better.
@@Cannon4545 Stylistically and philosophically Rusty is closer to channels like TB, Hoopvenue and AlexHoops than he is to more casual basketball channels like JxmyHighroller or Johnny Arnett.
23:40 while we are on the subject, I would like to do a little bit of course correction. 1. Wilt Chamberlain was besties with the Republican party and Nixon! Close aides at that time have stated that Wilt pretty much knew every Republican party bigwig. Which tells us that he was not in a dark place. 2. MLK Jr.'s assassination was not CIA's work, it was the FBI's.
The biggest loser seems rough he won two titles if anything his stats were inflated sure but that era almost nobody won chips outside of the Celtics and lakers until bill retired.
Might want to check on that. Only the 76er's won during the Celtics time. The Lakers won before then and after. As for his stats being inflated why is just his inflated? No one else was putting up crazy numbers like him. I do agree with you that calling him the biggest loser is well beyond rough. Sure is funny how all these deep dive videos never seem to mention Wilt and other would bet on their games finals included according to the FBI. No clue who he put his money on but it's possible his losing was really him winning. Idk.
@@wizard1687 I knew the Hawks won in 58. But it was my mistake I just forgot Russell was on that Celtics team. As for inflated number. We already know and like you said pace of play. That equals higher numbers across the board. I asked how come only his are way higher than his peers? No one said his number stay the same if he plays in other eras. But to discredit him by saying his numbers are inflated is unfair. Is Jordan's numbers inflated? Jordan's shooting percentage is worse and he shot more than Wilt. But Wilts numbers are inflated? So what when it's Wilt we say his stats are inflated but if its jordan we say he is the goat? We called Wilt selfish then wtf was jordan who shoot more and missed more in a slower paced era? Look like people just want to discredit players for an era before their own to me.
The talent disparity between their two teams made it to where Wilt had to thoroughly outplay Russell to even have a 50/50 shot at winning. It seemed as though when Wilt thoroughly outplayed Russell was when Wilt's team won but not all the time and usually it was a close margin. Wilt dropped 24 points, 32 rebounds, 13 assists and blocked 12 shots against Russell in game 1 of the 1967 ECF. And then in game 3 he dropped 20 points 41 rebounds, 9 assists and blocked 5 shots. furthermore, in game 5 he dropped 29 points, 36 rebounds, 13 assists and blocked 7 shots. I dare anyone to find a game of Russell individually dominating Wilt to that degree in the playoffs. Furthermore When Russ played even with Wilt or outplayed Wilt, the Celtics would blow them out. One such example out of many is in Game 4 of the '64 Finals. Wilt beat Russell all the way across the board with 27 points, 38 rebounds, and shot .52.2 from the floor. While Russell had 8 points, 19 rebounds, and shot .33.3 from the floor. Yet, the Celtics still won. There's no way in hell in any game throughout the decade besides 1969 that Wilt would've been able to get away with it if those kind of numbers were flipped in Russell's favour. As the one playoff game out of the 49 they played in. In which Russell just destroyed Wilt on both sides of the ball after he injured his hand in game 2 of the 1960 ecf The Warriors were utterly blown out by over 30 points. www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/196003190BOS.html
Ur reading raw numbers and not looking at the bigger picture. Wilt shot a high percentage against most teams and put up ridiculous scoring numbers. But against the Celtics, Russell was able to significantly cut down wilts usual production just enough. That’s what good defense is. U might outplay me stat wise but I out paced u. Doesn’t matter how many points u scored. U usually average 40 I slowed u down to 27. You usually shoot 58% I slowed u down to 50. That may seem insignificant but getting a prolific score whose teams significantly depend on those high value opportunities to win games to drop just a bit is the difference between a win and a loss. All u have to do is win the game by one point. If wilts teams Average 110 ppg and my defense helped cut them to 102. All we gotta do is make sure we score 103. Russell understood this. Wilt did not until much later. The thing that people tend to forget is that no matter how many hofers y’all claim Russell had, most of those guys were scorers. And yet the Celtics offense was ABYSMAL, most years ranking as a bottom or near bottom team in offensive rating, scoring, efficiency, etc. The defense is what got them by. And they lived on the fast breaks and easy opportunities with a playmaking and defensive bigman like Russell, while most teams relied on their traditional bigs to post up and score. The defensive stats don’t exist so it will always appear that wilt outplayed Russell based on shear volume. But if u watch the games, it tells a different story. ESPECIALLY in the clutch where Russell often shined.
@@TheIcemanthomas Wilt is the GOAT. Bill is number two. One thing you're right about is that it's not all about scoring. That's 200% facts. Everything else in your comment is, unfortunately, nonsense. Let's start off with the claim that "whose team's significantly depend on those high value opportunities to win games." No, they don't. Wilt is one of the greatest scorers ever, yes, but again, scoring is such a small part of Wilt's overall game that he could dominate whether he scored 100 or scored 0. What his team depended on mostly was how well-balanced of a game he played, doing multiple major things well: FG/pts/rebs/blks/ast/etc. The obvious fact that his 40 PPG average did not dictate wins comes in the fact that his best seasons, regular-season record-wise and championship result-wise, were years where he was literally averaging 21 down to 15 but rebounding 20-25 a game, blocking 10-12 a game, and assisting 5-10 a game, etc. Next, we have the fact that Wilt increased against Russell while Russell decreased more than Wilt increased in head-to-head matchups across the majority of the major categories, which renders your comment a completely false narrative painting. Wilt vs. Bill: 30, 28.2, 3.8, 48.8% Wilt career: 30, 22.9, 4.4, 54% Bill vs. Wilt: 14.2, 23, 4.4, 37% Bill career: 15.1, 22.5, 4.3, 44% So, Wilt dropped none in PPG. Bill dropped 0.9 in PPG. Wilt INCREASED 5.3 in REBs per game. Bill INCREASED just 0.5 REBs per game. Wilt dropped 0.6 assists per game. Bill increased 0.1 assists per game. Wilt decreased just 5.2%. Bill DECREASED 7%. So, as we can see, Wilt increased more than Bill increased when against each other and decreased less than Bill decreased against each other. I gave you the evidence that maintaining scoring averages would not have guaranteed him the victory whatsoever. The evidence shows when 50 PPG led nowhere, but 24 led to the GOAT chip ever. 44 led to no playoffs, but 14 led to one of the greatest chips ever yet again. He won in '67 averaging 21 instead of the regular season 24. He won in '72 averaging 14.7 while the regular season average was 14.8. Why cap instead of just accepting the truth? And the ending of your comment is also complete nonsense. Just listen to yourself. There's a reason why you have no actual factual thing to hold onto and say, "This proves Wilt was outplayed" or "These are the moments Bill Russell had in the clutch that were greater than Wilt's." And all you could say was "just look at the games and see it tells a different story." The reality is, when you look at the games, it tells a story that Wilt dog-walked his matchup Russell even more than the numbers show it. So, you don't wanna play that game at all either, as it demolishes your false claim just as badly. The only hope you have is saying rings are the only reason why Bill was better, and we both know that's not true and why if your only claim to fame is rings. Meanwhile, I have shown you not just numbers, but I also have a long list of clutch moments Wilt Chamberlain has had in the postseason. Please list Bill Russell's clutch moments that outnumber these Wilt clutch moments listed below instead of just capping like any casual who never saw Bill play and say, "especially in the clutch where Bill shines the most." Only player in NBA history to average at least 20 points and 20 rebounds while shooting at least 60% from the field across Game 7s in the playoffs. Two G7 games where he shot at least 80% (1965 and 1969 vs. Russell), GOAT clutch FG against the GOAT defender ever. G5 1962 First Round/ECSF G5 - 56 points, 35 rebounds, and 12 blocks. Clutch performance in the game leading to a blowout. G7 1962 ECF - 22 points and 22 rebounds on 7-15 shooting. He shot 8/9 from the free throw line and scored 5 points in 35 seconds in the last minute. Clutch buckets. G7 1965 ECF vs. Boston: 30 points and 32 rebounds with 80% shooting without a healthy Luke Jackson, who ended up fouling out. Wilt scored 4 clutch points in the last minute and approximately scored the last 10-12 points of the match. Clutch buckets. 1967: Triple-Double average against Boston, two Quadruple-Doubles, 6 blocks in the fourth quarter in one of the '67 Finals games. Wilt clutch defense. Also turned Thurmond into an unreliable scorer with 34.3% shooting compared to his 55.2%. First match vs. GSW in Finals: 16 points, 33 rebounds, 10 assists, 9 blocks. Wilt blocked Thurmond's layup/hook shot in the last seconds to send the game into overtime. Clutch defense. 1971 G7 WCF: 25 points won the series with clutch playmaking, buckets, and defense without injured Baylor and West. 1972: Wilt scored 10.8 PPG vs. Kareem in NBA-Western Conference Finals but outrebounded, out-defended, and out-shot-blocked Kareem by far. And after they beat Kareem and the Bucks, 19 a game against the Knicks in the Finals, where he outrebounded, out-defended, and out-shot-blocked everyone else by far, along with crucial and clutch playmaking as always. In both series, Wilt was showered with praise. 1972 G6 WCF vs. Bucks - Wilt scored 20 points and grabbed 24 rebounds on 66.7% shooting. Rallied the Lakers to win the game and overcame a 10-point deficit in the 4th quarter, and outsprinted Kareem in fast breaks. Jerry West called it the greatest ball-busting performance he has ever seen. Clutch defending, rebounding, playmaking, and scoring all down the stretch. 1972 G6 WCF vs. Bucks - Wilt scored 20 points and grabbed 24 rebounds on 66.7% shooting. Rallied the Lakers to win the game and overcame a 10-point deficit in the 4th quarter, and outsprinted Kareem in fast breaks. Jerry West called it the greatest ball-busting performance he has ever seen. Clutch defending, rebounding, playmaking, and scoring all down the stretch. 1972 G4 Finals vs. Knicks: Two clutch blocks in OT. Played aggressive defense with 5 fouls, shattering the myth of him playing too carefully when he got 5 fouls. 1972 G5 vs. Knicks: Chamberlain with 24 points on 10-14 shooting, with 29 rebounds, 4 assists, and 9 blocks-broken hand! While West flat-out admitted that he played a terrible series, despite his 8.8 assists average. 1973 WCS Game 7 vs. Chicago Bulls: Wilt got 21 points and 28 rebounds. He also blocked a shot with 30 seconds left and threw a full-court pass to Goodrich to win the game.
This is another of those high quality documentary style videos that you guys promised to make and it certainly lives up to that standard, being not just an interesting subject, but also a very well scripted, edited and narrated piece. So, first of all I would like to thank everyone that worked on it for this very entertaining watch. Second, I would like to weigh in a little on the 'Numbers and usage rate' discussion. I don't know anything about Wilt, except for the random statistical factoid or story. I know a little bit about Kobe, how he played and how him choosing to lower his production and take less shots made his team more effective. I do know quite a bit about Luka though. I've watched basically every game outside of his rookie season, spent hours looking at stats from him and his peers and went through hours of videos and articles from NBA fans and analysts alike. The thing is, in almost every way Luka is an anomaly. He is not just an overall efficient scorer, he has the playmaking aspect of his game too, which is not just good, but generationally good. The amount of wide open looks he creates for his teammates is just ridiculous, especially if you consider that those are also open looks for Kyrie Irving, an incredible shooter and now Klay Thompson as well. Those are the last guys you want to leave open as a defense from the threepointline and somehow Luka (and the Mavs offensive gameplan) gets those open looks for them, often delivered at pinpoint accuracy and at the right exact moment. While there certainly have been instances where Luka in a lot of ways underperformed by doing too much, forcing up inefficient shots like his step-back threes from far out, there is an aspect to his usage rate and the way he plays that is a little outside of Luka's responsibility. When he gets teammates open looks and they keep bricking their shots, the scoring burden starts to fall more on him. If for some reason his own shot isn't falling as well, his playmaking suffers from it, as they will let him shoot hard 3 point shots all game and not be too worried about it. It is a compounding problem that is increased by the Mavs total reliance on his (and Kyrie's) playmaking and shotcreation. Also, what is an inefficient shot for him or Kyrie, is probably often still a much higher percentage shot than any of their teammates could take, even when there open. The issue only is that the offense stagnates, the roleplayers don't build rhythm and the defense can just fully focus on what Luka is doing and double down on him defensively. This is exactly what happened to the Mavs in the last finals game vs the Celtics. When Kyrie was basically not performing up to his level, for a large part due to the insanely good defenders on him and the roleplayers not making their open shots, the Mavs offense basically fell apart. Finally, I want to touch on the Luka and Tatum comparison. I do not agree that the only reason is Luka's usage rate and heliocentric playstyle caused them to lose. I think it was more the level of defense that the Celtics were able to resist with, as well as the average talent level, especially on the defensive end was simply higher. While Luka and Kyrie are clearly much better offensive players than anyone on the Celtics roster, neither of them are as good defensively as any of their starters, nor is anyone on the Mavs roster except maybe Lively. Defense just wins games and coupled with a great gameplan and consistant execution, that is what won them the finals, I don't think the heliocentric overreliance on Luka was the only reason here. And don't mistake me for a Celtics fanboy here, I really dislike that team and was rooting for the Mavs all the way, so it feels very wrong to come to this conclusion. They have yet to meet this season, but already it seems like the Mavs offense is more varied and has more potential than they had last season, so maybe if they meet up this time it will be way different.
@@rustybuckets Np rudy. I tend to go a little overboard on the amount of text, using way too much letters to say not so much, but it's enjoyable to interact a bit and organize my thoughts on a subject. I really appeciate these solid videos.
As someone who’s always been a huge Wilt glazer, this video actually gave me some much needed insight. Still top 10 ever but he might go from 5 on my list to like 7 or 8. The Wilt Paradox is actually essentially why I have Tim Duncan 4th all time. I have no doubt in my mind that Tim Duncan could have averaged 30 numerous times, but the fact he didn’t is what made him so good
@@goldmouthlito comparing Coach Pop to any coach Wilt had is unfair. Hakeem was better than Duncan on both ends of the court but the teammates and schemes weren’t there to make the talent succeed. Bill dominated with a defensive scheme. The man was almost kicked out of college for jumping to block shots which is something he carried to the league. Basketball was still developing and literally in its remedial state from the Mikan era. Wilt was better but Bill dominated a very bad game. From the way dribbling was allowed, fouls and offensive fouls were called and everything in between.
Despite the fact that he played against the second most HOF player at his position(only behind kareem and parish, which he played 7 years less than both) He PLAYED THE MOST TOTAL GAMES against another hof center….see list below lol (mind you these are their barefoot heights, in the modern NBA you would add 1-2 inches to their height, as players have been measured in their shoes only after 1977) C-Bill Russell: 6’10” HOF (143 games played in 9 seasons) C-Kareem Abdul Jabbar: 7'2" HOF(27 games played in 4 seasons) C-Willis Reed: 6,10” HOF(72 games played in 8 seasons) C-Walt Bellamy: 6'11" HOF(100 games played in 11 seasons) C-Artis Gilmore: 7'2" HOF C-Bob Lanier: 6'11" HOF(17 games played in 3 seasons) C-Nate Thurmond: 6'11" HOF(47 games played in 4 seasons) C-Bob McAdoo: 6’10” HOF (5 games played in 1 season) C-Elvin Hayes:6’9 “ HOF (22 games played in 4 seasons) (Wes Unseld is also a HOF center but he is 6’7) (26 times in 5 seasons) (Dave Cowens is also a HOF Center/Forward but he is 6”9)(17 games played in 3 seasons) (Connie Hawkins is also a HOF Forward/ center but he is 6”9)(31 games played in 4 seasons) (please note there are more HOF PF who guarded and were guarded by wilt chamberlain but the majority of them are 6’8 to 6’9) SO THATS 574 OUT OF 1045…WHICH TRANSLATES TO 54% OF WILTS GAMES BEING PLAYED AGAINST ANOTHER HOF CENTER…
No chance he's top 10 lol. KAJ, Jordan, James, Bird, Magic, Hakeem, Russel, Duncan, Shaq, Curry, Bryant. He's not sniffing any of those guys just off the top of my head
@@ziggle5000 why would russel be top 10. He cant even score. He's a center and had seasons shooting 43% from the field. Thats like giving ben wallace a couple rings and then put him in your top 20 list. LOL
Bill Russell is top ten. Don't be a clown. Insanity to suggest otherwise. Scoring is half the game. If a guy blocks every shot his opponent makes , he doesn't need to score. But Bill still avg 18 while being he best defender on the best dynasty in pro sports history. Stop it.
He evolved under a new coach when he moved teams, that changed his way of thinking and evolved their game. That's why his statistics got less impressive later, because he was playing more like a pass first guard.
@rustybuckets What you failed to understand is that Wilt was told to play like this by his coaches. It is wrong to criticize him for doing exactly what his coach sayed. You also seem to have no idea about various injuries to Wilt and his teammates. Wilt was injured badly in 1960 against the celtics as well as other occasions.
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love Wilt and Russell content
***********CORRECTION: MARCH 2nd! Not March 4th
What's your thoughts on OKC this season
@rustybuckets so you're just a hater then? 😂😂 my god dude you're entire argument for why he's a wash gets thrown out the window the moment you look at how the nba was structured back then and how trade policies worked out. Yet you leave that huge piece of info out whole bashing him😂 1 sided AF😂. I could pick apart this whole video in 5 minutes compared to your hours you spent making this. First off as for help ,you proved 2 guys were repeating all stars, the rest were 1 offs which meant the player had a breakout season which every player does. Go look at the celtics during that era. 5-7 all stars continuously for 9 years😂. Back then Boston and LA basically could horde the best players because of loose nba regulations as it was new and a higher amount of revenue. He in fact did beat those teams when he went to LA and was playing with reoccurring all stars😂. Id love for you to name 1 single player that did everything solo, not even mj did anything before pippen and Phil. You also fail to mention that had all stats been kept back then like they are today both bill and wilt would own and still retain majority of records in the nba considering they averaged 20+ rebounds and game and several blocks😂. Anyway bad take dude try again.
@@tyfulcher9761 actually no
Averaging 45 a game, and missing the playoffs when there's not even 10 teams in the league is MADNESS. If Wilt played in the First Take era that discourse would be absolutely despicable.
First take era of media is the worst period of sports media. But your right
What is the first take era?
@@charlie_5412007 onwards
@@EkillOrRyanthis is an awful take, LeBron would be less talked about if not for first take
I understand that thought process, but in reality what it means is that all the talent becomes extremely top heavy on certain teams. If you thought Cleveland vs the warriors was bad, the celtics and lakers were much worse. And they made up over 22% of the league that you were guaranteed worse than.
And the vast majority of wilts "all star teammates" were like 34+ in an era where people died of old age at 60.
fun fact: wilt was still considered a loser well into the seventies, because a certain player named kareem abdul-jabbar arrived and won a championship two years into his career as a basketball player. the popular narrative was “omg look how good kareem is, who even needs wilt!” also, the fact that he was considered a loser bothered him, really heavily. he haaaated it. kinda like kd tbh
KD wasn’t missing the playoffs
@@spoodyR3facts Kd was a terrible person to use 😂 KD has a finals appearance in 2012 and multiple playoff appearances and top seeded teams before Golden state
Idiots always speak. Oscar
He was considered a loser for not giving 100% when his team needed him instead he tried to never foul out, this made score 6 less points per game and for that he holds the record for never foiling out
This isn't true?
Just a reminder that the radio broadcast for Wilt's 100 point game is on TH-cam, and there is ZERO reason for the NBA to lie for an African American in the 60s
Wasting your breath, they want to paint the narrative that all stats int he past were padded.
Thank you
this so hilariously, tragically true
As well not many actually cared about the sport like that , it was baseball & football on tv , they didn’t even care to air the games .
But what if that radio broadcast was AI generated? 🤔
Fun fact : Wilt Chamberlain holds the record for never fouling out of a single game
Rumors said he purposely not playing defense to not be in foul trouble to keep stat padding whole game that is why they're losing a lot😅
@@MotpyrCNesiayou listen to rumors?
@@BlackRoyalty_ Half Wilts feats are stories or "rumors" lmao.
@@BlackRoyalty_ IRONIC🤣
@@MotpyrCNesia Rumors is the wrong way of phrasing this because Wilt changing his defense in foul trouble was publicly observable and written about as it was happening. The word rumors is a much better term to describe his supposed feats that all happened with a small audience and no proof
When there were 10 teams, it's hard not to have teammates be All-Stars.
And it's also not hard to go up against teams with hella all stars as well
Despite the fact that he played against the second most HOF player at his position(only behind kareem and parish, which he played 7 years less than both) He PLAYED THE MOST TOTAL GAMES against another hof center….see list below lol
(mind you these are their barefoot heights, in the modern NBA you would add 1-2 inches to their height, as players have been measured in their shoes only after 1977)
C-Bill Russell: 6’10” HOF (143 games played in 9 seasons)
C-Kareem Abdul Jabbar: 7'2" HOF(27 games played in 4 seasons)
C-Willis Reed: 6,10” HOF(72 games played in 8 seasons)
C-Walt Bellamy: 6'11" HOF(100 games played in 11 seasons)
C-Artis Gilmore: 7'2" HOF
C-Bob Lanier: 6'11" HOF(17 games played in 3 seasons)
C-Nate Thurmond: 6'11" HOF(47 games played in 4 seasons)
C-Bob McAdoo: 6’10” HOF (5 games played in 1 season)
C-Elvin Hayes:6’9 “ HOF (22 games played in 4 seasons)
(Wes Unseld is also a HOF center but he is 6’7) (26 times in 5 seasons)
(Dave Cowens is also a HOF Center/Forward but he is 6”9)(17 games played in 3 seasons)
(Connie Hawkins is also a HOF Forward/ center but he is 6”9)(31 games played in 4 seasons)
(please note there are more HOF PF who guarded and were guarded by wilt chamberlain but the majority of them are 6’8 to 6’9)
SO THATS 574 OUT OF 1045…WHICH TRANSLATES TO 54% OF WILTS GAMES BEING PLAYED AGAINST ANOTHER HOF CENTER…
you understand that, that also means he played a hell of a lot more all-star/hof players every game, right?
@@JohnnyRodgers3what's your point? Their height are at most 1-2 inches shorter than modern centers and I feel like it is quite well-know that the 60s were a center-dominated era.
@zsomborszigeti6797 average height for centers is the same when you account for measurements without shoes. Height narrative is debunked.
You neglect to mention the there were 25 all stars for 9 teams. Meaning Phily having 3 all stars was literally average. Meanwhile, Russell has 4 to 8 other *Hall of Famers* on his squad every season.
Hey. The guy needs to spin a narrative that Wilt was actually just bad. Pipe down.
Russell has so many Hall of Fame teammates because they played with Russell. Sam Jones might have been a great player - but he is in the Hall of Fame because he won 10 rings alongside Russell. The *only* Celtic player who continued to be great after Russell left was John Havlicek (who is almost always under-appreciated).
@@seinfan9did you watch the video? It wasn’t about wilt being bad. It’s about his play style being bad. Which is just objectively true. 5 guys beat 1 every time
@@seinfan9yep 💯
Is this a joke? You're obv going to get a ton of HoF teammates if you can win 11 rings.
Of course Wilt had All-star teammates. There were 24 all-stars per year in a 9 team league: So half the teams should have 3 All-stars, and 4 isn't a big deal.
That’s probably why all NBA team selections are a better indicator.
Fun fact Russell has only 2 all nba first team selections despite having 5 mvps. He is the only player along with Dave Cowans to win MVP as all second team. However it should be noted when Russell played it was players not journalists or analysts who voted for the mvp and there was a lot of favoritism. Russell was universally respected in the league whereas a lot of guys hated Wilt Chamberlain
Why are you assuming the all-stars would be split evenly among all nine teams? Is that how it works any other season? I think the Celtics alone had six or seven all-stars for a couple of their 13-year run of titles.
Avg, 3 guys per team get in all star game. Regardless of how they usually pick all stars. He should have had at least 1 guy every year, at worst
I'm only 9:40 into the video, but I have to stop the video to point out some important context: Warriors coach Frank McGuire asked Chamberlain to play pivot and focus on defense for game 7, which Chamberlain did to the tune of 15 blocks. The plan was to take advantage of some streaky shooting from his teammates to make up for the lack of scoring. Gola and Meschery shot an absurd (in those days) 50% and 53% that game on 7-14 and 10-19 shooting. Unfortunately, Arizin (returning from an injury) shot an abysmal 4-22, which undoubtedly cost them the game and the series. With the Warriors down 5 late in the game, it was Chamberlain who scored all 5 to tie it up, only for Sam Jones to bury the game winner with a little over a second left.
There's more to team basketball than scoring. Even so, 22 points (on 48% shooting), 22 rebounds, 3 assists, and 15 blocks is hardly underperforming. If you want to simply say, "he scored 22 after averaging 50," then I'll point out that he averaged 29 shots per game in the regular season but attempted only 15 in game 7 (again, because he was asked to focus on defense and let his teammates do the work on offense).
They don't talk down on Jerry West like that lol selective hate
Great details, thanks....still if I hear "focus on defense" it sounds like Wilt was resting on D before or at least not going all out on D which also explains why he never fouled out in his entire career. Impossible in my opinion if you play D all the time.
@@thedudeunchained7583 the rules defensively were that if you didn't initiate contact and the offense did then it was an offensive foul. So I agree there must have been times he wasn't giving 100%, but the rules prevented people from fouling out for just being in the vicinity of an offensive star a few times. It was more that he hunted for blocks and easy steals sometimes rather than trying to provide suffocating defense.
@@davidanderson3652 makes sense the way I feel his character was judging by interviews..a bit of a show boat typa dude
Oscar Robertson actually had the same career trajectory. Played in Cincinnati for most of his career, and even with Jerry Lucas as his teammate, had terrible coaches including Bob Cousy, who famously didn't get along with him. They reached the ECF once, every other time missed the playoffs or were out in the first round. When Oscar went to the Bucks, he got Kareem and Larry Costello as a coach and won a ring immediately. When Lucas eventually went to the Knicks, he had the originator of the "beautiful game" team, and Red Holzman as a coach. Won a ring.
Originator of the beautiful game team".....huh?
In that same manner we saw Embiid underperform to what we'd expect from his insane numbers. His career is more 'Wilt-like' if you will, than Luka's. He was coached by Doc Rivers, who has been criticized heavily for many years and started to do much better with Nick Nurse on the team.
There are problems with Embiid's conditioning, his health and certainly his consistancy in the playoffs, but some of his bad performances are also contributable to bad coaching in his earlier years.
Well if you get two coaches, one a great center, then you will surely get into the finals
don from deep 3 crying tears of joy rn😂
“HE WON 10 RINGS ON YOUR WATCH!”
Costco Robert Horry running around his room jumping for joy
@@oscarhess1376wilt still greater all time. Actually he’s 5 or 6 spots higher all time.
@@Bøss35689 sure he is buddy
@@Bøss35689 no. You can’t have your main rival have 8 more rings than you and be higher ranked. What if Bird had 7 rings? No one would say Magic is better
So I guess the real Prime Wilt Chamberlain was the friends we made along the way
the friends we made along the way can hopefully avg that many points
@ hope so
If you look at when Bill Russell left in 69 after winning a championship the Celtics still had 5 HOFers and a HOF coach... and they missed the playoffs, the only team to ever do so until the 99 Bulls. That should tell you everything you need to know about the value of Bill Russell, on my Mt. Rushmore
Then they got Cowens, and won 3 more rings with him as leader.
@@codyssmith73 Cowens does not have 3 rings, and one of the rings he does have was against the 42-40 Suns led by Paul Westphal
@@dakotasmith9878 My bad. I always forget it was 2 rings before Bird, not 3 (likely would’ve been 3 if Hondo doesn’t get hurt in 73 tho).
I thought Bill was the coach in 69?
Bill Russell was not the only player who left in 1969. Sam Jones who had been the major scorer since the beginning of the Celtics dynasty also retired. It was also Tom Heinsohn first year of coaching. Not trying to argue the value of Bill, I just want to provide more context.
well there’s also a large sample size of luka’s former teammates no longer being in the league or averaging worse numbers than they did with him so i think it’s safe to say the guy averaging a near triple double on great efficiency isn’t most of the reason his team hasn’t won a championship
I mean, when you think about it, Luka and Harden ended up getting beat in the playoffs by 2 of the greatest teams ever assembled. Correlation doesn't equal causation. Even if Luka has lower usage in the finals, who is gonna pick up that offensive slack? Kyrie was having a bad series and Mavs roleplayers aren't really gonna create like that.
Honestly only re tards make that claim about Doncic. He’s in his sixth season and has been to two Western Conference finals and one NBA finals. Compare that to Jordan, James, Curry, or any number of players who were the superstar on their team and let me know how many did better. Here’s a hint…. if you take out magic and bird, none of them.
Not to mention you’re talking about a guy six years into his NBA career. Look up superstars winning championships or having multiple conference finals runs as the best player on their team and once you get past bird, magic, and Duncan, the list gets really thin really fast. Here’s a hint, Jordan, James, Durant, Curry…. none of them have two conference finals and an NBA finals on their résumé except Luka.
He’s being written off by a tubby TH-camr despite the fact that he has a better winning résumé than almost anybody to come into the league in the last 40 years. But I highly doubt Rusty is going to let a little thing like facts get in the way of trying to prove his silly little theory.
Like porzingas and brunsen?
Yeah i don't think Luka heliocentric basketball was the reason the Mavs lost, more, their role players were guys who could not hit above the break 3s, which is what boston was giving them. Though Luka getting worn down was a problem, i think that has more to do with minute management than playstyle.
We kinda know nowadays not to waste possessions having role players try to initiate offense.
I am really happy with how these documentary essays (or whatever) are shaping out as of the last year. Good job, Rusty! And shout-out to Rudy for sticking with you and to the rest of the newer editorial additions.
Wilt played when 2 hand checking was allowed
Wilt high jumped 6 feet, 6 inches, ran the 440 yards in 49.0 seconds and the 880 yards in 1:58.3, put the shot 53 feet, 4 inches, and long jumped 22 feet.His vertical, during his prime, was "46 to 48 inches, easy."He ran the 100-yard dash in 10.9 seconds, shot-putted fifty-six feet (17 m), triple jumped more than fifty feet (15 m).his physical prime, Chamberlain was able to bench press 550 pounds, 85 pounds more than the max of Shaquille O'Neal, who many regard as the most physically dominant player of the modern era.Mar 22, 2021
Here is a list of the players who played in Wilt's NBA who were 6-11 or taller...
Ray Felix 6-11 65
Chuck Share 6-11
Walter Dukes 7-0
Swede Halbrook 7-3
Walt Bellamy 6-11
Nate Thurmond 6-11
Reggie Harding 7-0
Mel Counts 7-0
Walt Wesley 6-11
Hank Finkel 7-0
Craig Spitzer 7-0
Craig Raymond 6-11
Otto Moore 6-11
Rich Niemann 7-0
Tom Boerwinkle 7-0 265
Dave Newmark 7-0
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 7-2
Greg Fillmore 7-1 240
George Johnson 6-11 245
Bob Lanier 6-11 250
Elmore Smith 7-0 250
Tom Payne 7-2 240
Vic Bartolome 7-0 230
Jim McDaniels 6-11
William Smith 7-0
George Johnson 6-11 (yes another G. Johnson)
LaRue Martin 6-11
Best Rusty Buckets essay... EVER! Congrats on a tour de force from someone who watched Wilt play (though, admittedly, near the end of his career -- Wilt and West were my favorite players).
Damn how old are you
@@Noifsnobutsnococonuts-rj4kkif he watched near the end of the career I would guess he is around 65-75 since that means he would be about 10-20 years old in 1969
It is wild that if Wilt Chamberlain was a little more selfless in his career the history of the NBA would be completely different.
Wilt's coach told him to play that way. It would've been selfish to not listen to his coach.
@MaxHutchings31 That is irrelevant to my statement.
@@Colin995it's not
@@MaxHutchings31 nah, Wilt himself admitted that he played for himself and his stats. Only after so many failures in the playoff that he tried to change his way of playing and as the result, he won his first chip
@@Colin995and if LeBron was less selfless rather than a pass first player he would have 2 100 point games 🤦♂️
Wilt controlled the scoreboard, Russell controlled the court. It’s nearly impossible to see Russell’s MVP quality effect on the game in the box scores, but it’s undeniable if you sit down and watch a game.
Win shares. But yeah as a Celtics fan bill is what you get if you built a leader in a lab. Elite athlete and very skilled as a rebounder defender and passer. He is the definition of a selfless man
They way I see it is Bill was like lebron, Wilt was like Melo (player wise not stat wise) one played to make the team better the other one plays to stuff his stats(no hate towards Melo he's one of my favs)
Bill also played with a full starting 5 of hall of famers, wilt never had that anything close to that luxury in his prime.
@@kanone_69don’t you think a large reason why those guys are in the hof is because they were a part of the greatest NBA dynasty of all time, a dynasty built around and partially designed by Russell? Wilt played with all-stars, and they had the holistically worst statistical seasons of their careers while playing with him. Nearly every player, from star to journeyman, had the best seasons of their careers with Russell. Russell’s defensive skill, and otherworldly flow control built the foundation.
@@i_fuze_hostages6 you’re right about win shares, but most casual fans won’t take that into account. Crazy highlights and ppg are most essential
People criticized Wilt about his scoring and not passing more is why he lead the league in assists to shut them up. WIlt was other level of greatness. Untouchable as a Stat machine for whatever he wanted to do. The rebounds is scary to see.
imagine thinking that the way to prove you arent a stat padder was to pad a different stat.
and the rebound number actually make a lot of sense when you look at the shot attempts per game and avg FG%. The # of available rebounds were off the chart and Wilt was a freak athlete and played nearly every minute.
Jordan shut them up through winning and stats were just some icing on the cake
@@kevinjohnson4498facts...all top 30 rebound averages are held by teams from the 60s. All top 10 individual rebounds leaders are players from Wilt's era. Rodman has the 11th highest rebound average and the first guy who didn't play in the 60s.
Wilt's highest rebounding season was 61/62 when he grabbed 27.2 rebounds per game. The 8 NBA teams at the time averaged almost 74 rebounds a game. So Wilt grabbed 37% of available rebounds. That is crazy impressive!!!
Rodman's best rebounding season was in 1991/92 when he grabbed 18.7 rebounds per game. That season the average NBA team grabbed 43.7 rebounds oer game.
So Rodman grabbed 42.79 percent of available rebounds.
If you put 1991 Rodman into 1961 he would also grab 42.79 percent of the available rebounds to average 31.66 rebounds a game. Thats over 4 rebounds more than Wilt got and Rodman is 6.7.
That's why Rodman is the best Rebounder all time, not Wilt.
If you go back and actually watch what complete games are available of Wilt in his prime, its actually shocking how little impact he seems to be having on the moment to moment flow of the game. It sounds crazy and when you hear people talk about him who were around then or are sports experts they make him sound so dominant, but honestly in the games I've seen of him its always the most unnoticeable statistical dominance I've ever seen. I distinctly remember being confused in watching a few of his games where the announcers said his points and rebounds in like the 3rd quarter and being shocked that he had so many because I specifically was watching the game to see him dominate and never saw anything that made me think he was controlling the game at all. Thats not to say he wasn't good or valuable, but his minute by minute impact is not accurately represented by his stats or highlights.
The idea and mysticism of Wilt Chamberlain is certainly superimposed. It's not just enough to win, you need to win in every facet that's offered too you. And for what it is worth, I still believe Chamberlain being berated in the newspaper headlines day in and day out is not the best holdover for wanting to play winning basketball. And it's almost like his worries were proven right when he won that first ring, which I love how you brought up. "What's the point of choosing a path if they're both wrong?" But in the same sense that many modern NBA fans cherry pick Wilt's statistical marvels to present an almost Grecian level hero in 60s basketball, retractors will hold onto those two rings like he should never be seen in a favorable light, at all. He is a legend, that deserves the criticism, for sure, but I think for the people who do truly appreciate some level of Wilt's game, and a foundation he laid, it's like some mental gymnastics to remember, "Oh yea, Wilt kind of was a loser, in a legacy sense."
But hell. Today we still talk about Wilt more than most of the past legends. You've named a Paradox about him. He still remains one of the polarizing figures within American Sports that's ever exist. And he might vaguely be remembered fondly, he's remembered, and that's worth it.
Despite the fact that he played against the second most HOF player at his position(only behind kareem and parish, which he played 7 years less than both) He PLAYED THE MOST TOTAL GAMES against another hof center….see list below lol
(mind you these are their barefoot heights, in the modern NBA you would add 1-2 inches to their height, as players have been measured in their shoes only after 1977)
C-Bill Russell: 6’10” HOF (143 games played in 9 seasons)
C-Kareem Abdul Jabbar: 7'2" HOF(27 games played in 4 seasons)
C-Willis Reed: 6,10” HOF(72 games played in 8 seasons)
C-Walt Bellamy: 6'11" HOF(100 games played in 11 seasons)
C-Artis Gilmore: 7'2" HOF
C-Bob Lanier: 6'11" HOF(17 games played in 3 seasons)
C-Nate Thurmond: 6'11" HOF(47 games played in 4 seasons)
C-Bob McAdoo: 6’10” HOF (5 games played in 1 season)
C-Elvin Hayes:6’9 “ HOF (22 games played in 4 seasons)
(Wes Unseld is also a HOF center but he is 6’7) (26 times in 5 seasons)
(Dave Cowens is also a HOF Center/Forward but he is 6”9)(17 games played in 3 seasons)
(Connie Hawkins is also a HOF Forward/ center but he is 6”9)(31 games played in 4 seasons)
(please note there are more HOF PF who guarded and were guarded by wilt chamberlain but the majority of them are 6’8 to 6’9)
SO THATS 574 OUT OF 1045…WHICH TRANSLATES TO 54% OF WILTS GAMES BEING PLAYED AGAINST ANOTHER HOF CENTER…
Damn. I remember watching Rusty when he had like 36k subscribers. Crazy bro. Haven't watched in a while. The confidence you now have in front of the camera is incredible. Night and day. Great work!
I remember before. Also Rusty buckets was created lol
Wilt Chamberlain was an excellent talent, and had a Hall of Fame career.
But if you take his raw numbers and averages at face value, you’ll likely end up overstating his impact on the basketball court. Execution aside, it could be argued that scoring as much as Wilt did is a sign of a player who had too big a role individually in his team’s offense.
And conversely, the ability to succeed around other players and scorers is itself a skill that doesn’t show up a ton on a box score. That’s an ability that Wilt could have illustrated he had if he had been utilized in the most impactful way by a coach.
Would’ve been interesting if he had a coach like Alex Hannum for his entire career.
Lebron > you whole bloodline
@@HeatbridgeAmazing career on his part
This is insane, “actually the guy who averaged 50 and 20 is not good” like cmon man
@@keanewhiteirproductions9538I’m not implying Wilt wasn’t good by any stretch.
Just saying that if he was used in a manner that was most conducive to winning, then his averages would’ve inevitably been lower than they were in his earlier career.
He still could’ve put up great numbers on a great team though and we saw that later in his career.
@@fortynights1513imagine if he was playing in todays era where centers are smaller, he can offensive foul and there hella space....imagine 76ers wilt and Steph on the same court
After reading 2 of Wilts books bio he stated that the year that he averaged the 50pts his coach asked him to do so and Wilt didnt want to because he felt his teamates wouldnt like it.I learned a lot reading his book that you cant see from the outside.I personally feel that he was the most dominate center in history.Russell was great,but he couldnt stop Wilt.Even he atmitted this.On top of all his records he had a slight heart attack in his 2nd or 3rd year in the nba ,He had to wear a heart monitering device for a short time afterward.An amazing athelete for a man 7 feet tall! R.I.P. Wilt
You said Russell didn't have more help than Wilt.... Like, Clyde Lovellette was an all-star, MVP candidate, HoFer and Boston couldn't find a place for him in their rotation.
Wilt is the GOAT 🐐
Of plumbers 😂
@uaushaiaosao9308 - you obviously don't know basketball....🤣
@@ThePrayinmantiz You obviously didn't watch the video. He was playing against midgets and was only stat padding
you’re both daft lol
I gotta admit, when Kobe scored 81, it was absolutely sick to watch. But he was a better player, and the Lakers a vastly better team, when Pau joined and Kobe focused less on being the only scorer and worked better within the system. Wilt took too long to come to the same conclusion.
@@HorizonOfHope I would say Phil Jackson was just far better at game and talent management than any coach Wilt has ever had but there’s no metric really to show us Kobe was better offensively or defensively. We just favor him more.
Kobe specifically warned Luka about not having this much of a heliocentric playstyle and he in turn was warned by MJ about this himself.
That shouldn't be a hard thing to "admit" lol.
@@apuapustaja4444 The admission is that he was a better player when he toned down his scoring.
Coaching lol wilt played with 5 different coaches throughout his career. But that's not important
Proof that coaches and their system can drastically use their talent for what it is or make them worse than they actually are.
Wilt Chamberlain’s drop in playoff scoring might be partly due to the increased defensive focus he faced. During the regular season, he averaged 30.1 points on 22.5 field goal attempts per game. But in the playoffs, his scoring dropped to 22.5 points per game, with only 17.1 attempts-around five fewer shots each game.
If Wilt had managed to keep up his regular-season shot volume, his playoff numbers could have looked significantly different. With a shooting percentage of 52% in the playoffs, making just two additional shots per game would have added about four points, bringing his playoff average up to 26 points per game. Adding one extra free throw per game would have realistically lifted his average to 27 points, putting his playoff production much closer to his regular-season level. In close games against teams like the Celtics, where he often lost by only a few points, this extra scoring could have made all the difference in rewriting history.
Defenses in the playoffs likely adopted a strategy similar to what we see with great players today: even if they can’t stop the star entirely, they focus on making things harder, applying extra pressure to limit their impact.
Playoff defense has been like that since the beginning of time. Facing "tougher defenses" in the playoffs is expected. It's still your job as a star to perform or capitalize off of that defensive attention. Especially when you're a once in a lifetime star with multiple all star teammates.
Wilt was the first superstar Rusty, offenses, schemes etc had to evolve, they had to figure out how to succeed with a player like that. It has never been done before.
Spectacular work, Rusty. Your best so far, no doubt.
Just one thing, please don't add any fuel to this nonsensical fire. His 100-point game isn't alleged. It happened.
Despite the fact that he played against the second most HOF player at his position(only behind kareem and parish, which he played 7 years less than both) He PLAYED THE MOST TOTAL GAMES against another hof center….see list below lol
(mind you these are their barefoot heights, in the modern NBA you would add 1-2 inches to their height, as players have been measured in their shoes only after 1977)
C-Bill Russell: 6’10” HOF (143 games played in 9 seasons)
C-Kareem Abdul Jabbar: 7'2" HOF(27 games played in 4 seasons)
C-Willis Reed: 6,10” HOF(72 games played in 8 seasons)
C-Walt Bellamy: 6'11" HOF(100 games played in 11 seasons)
C-Artis Gilmore: 7'2" HOF
C-Bob Lanier: 6'11" HOF(17 games played in 3 seasons)
C-Nate Thurmond: 6'11" HOF(47 games played in 4 seasons)
C-Bob McAdoo: 6’10” HOF (5 games played in 1 season)
C-Elvin Hayes:6’9 “ HOF (22 games played in 4 seasons)
(Wes Unseld is also a HOF center but he is 6’7) (26 times in 5 seasons)
(Dave Cowens is also a HOF Center/Forward but he is 6”9)(17 games played in 3 seasons)
(Connie Hawkins is also a HOF Forward/ center but he is 6”9)(31 games played in 4 seasons)
(please note there are more HOF PF who guarded and were guarded by wilt chamberlain but the majority of them are 6’8 to 6’9)
SO THATS 574 OUT OF 1045…WHICH TRANSLATES TO 54% OF WILTS GAMES BEING PLAYED AGAINST ANOTHER HOF CENTER…
8x Wilt ran into the best dynasty in team sports with a team that was 6+hof deep and there was a whole 6 rules changed to limit him. Russell, Jones, Hondo, Heinsohn, Cousy, etc. If not for that Wilt has a handful of rings and there is 0 question who's the goat
Yeah this video is a joke. And trying to compare Wilt's early career supporting cast to Bill Russell's is a joke.
@@apuapustaja4444or maybe because he's not a team player, that's why he achieve a lot individually and not as a team, it's unfair to diminish Bill Russell for his team oriented playstyle that resulted in championships, he's a winner and wilt is a loser at the end of the day.
@@HAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAJA Nobody's diminishing Bill Russell, but you're trying to diminish Wilt, which is crazy.
@@HAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAJA No one is diminishing Russell but can we compare Wilt playing with 2 allstars and hof to Bill playing with the best coach, organization and 5 more hof?
I got all the love and respect for Bill. But do a deep dive into what Wilts teamates avg those elimination games to see if it falls on Wilt or them
@@andrewcook1246 Did you really think about this take of yours? Because if you really think about it, Bill have 5 hof *teammates* because they played alongside Bill and not Wilt because Bill is a great *team player* , they work as a team that's why they achieve many championships which resulted to their Hall of Fame careers, that's also true to the so called *best coach* as you said. Bill's teammates and coach got alot of chances to shine because of their team oriented play style, and they did, it resulted in winning basketbal, as opposed to Wilt who only thinks about individual achievements until his late career. And now y'all use the arguments of Bill being a good team against him?
Don't get me wrong I still believe Wilt is better than Bill *individually* but in terms of greatness? Bill is above Wilt. He is a winner.
Your essays are always awesome. Very glad you went back to more of this than just reactionary stuff.
Honestly I think a team that has a high scoring guy who just does everything but doesn’t win should make that guy watch this video.
Why would you think Wilt scoring 100 means he had a good team? It means the opposite. He wasn't a point guard.
Big were the scoring option back them up until like late 80s early 90s before you started seeing more MJ, Clyde, Dominique etc type of guys being the #1 scoring option. Even then you still had David Robinson, Karl Malone, Shaq, Hakeem etc.
I'm fully aware. But if he's not gazelle sprinting up the floor to beat the team he's not getting the first pass. He isn't bringing it up the floor. If he's scoring that much it means he's the only option. And they didn't rest like they do today. They didn't have commercial breaks sitting around. Wilt was world-class in track and field but I highly doubt he's sprinting 82 minutes and he played every minute. @@sheezy3962Bigs are still the best option the league is just desperate for another Michael Jordan.
@@sheezy3962 yeah I know
@@sheezy3962 the point is he's not a point guard and therefore is being passed the ball because he's the best option. Was he sprinting like a gazelle for 82 minutes? I doubt it.
Man, this was so good! Insight, context, and a bit of revisionist history. Subscribed!
My thoughts are with you man. I know it's tough for the kids but divorces affect the parents too. I'm here if you need some support. STAY STRONG
This might be your best video to date.
Nice work.
before the twothree video 💀
😭😭😂😂😂
I’m lost😊
Me too @@thecoolrich
Did he steal it?
Not gonna lie they all watch each others videos and try to mix it up a bit but they all drop the same topics around the same day(not just these 2)
Wilt Chamberlain was traded like he was marchandise, a racing horse or a gladiator while he considered himself as a roc star. At contrary, Russell was considered by Auerbach almost as his equal at the point he gave him the keys of the car during two years. I beleive Russell developed some fidelity to his franchise ... mainly because he trusted Red ... at contrary, Wilt saw himself as a mercenary or an adventurer.
Wilt was a Ronin
Not a Wilt defender by any means, but it’s interesting how we see Dirk in a much more positive light compared to Wilt. He only won once, and famously came up short several times as well. They did carry themselves drastically differently though…I bet that’s it
Great work Rusty! Very insightful video.
“The warriors had 3 all stars how could he not have won??!!?? 😮” dude do you not realize there were literally 8 teams in the league. And 24 all star spots. So his help was league average level at best
This was very well documented
Just to mention that Jordan's numbers constantly went up in the playoffs, making an unique goat argument for him
the 24:35 pun might be one of my favourites of all time. I’ve been smiling for 5 minutes
that made me rewind and see if anyone else felt that way. it was a bar.
This is an amazing video, one of the best I’ve in a while! Great stuff!
All Stars are not Hall of Famers....
You make the HOF when you retire. You make all star appearances while you're actively playing. So, the all star appearance is the more accurate depiction.
@x-man9473 They are all retired. Wilt played with some All-stars ; Russell played with Hall of Famers....
Lol ; Ipso Facto, Russell won by being surrounded by Hall of Famers...
@@hennebux Right, or... they became HOFers because they played with Bill.
@Cannon4545 Again, Wilt was surrounded by nobodies Russell was surrounded by a team.
sweet deep dive rusty, greatly increased my knowledge and even apreciation of mr. chamberlain.
Do Pistol Pete next. Take any elite NBA player and ask yourself "if their own father was this player's college coach, and that father had dictatorial roster decisions and recruiting, AND the father did not care at all whether the team won or lost, had no danger of losing their job for the time their kid was at the college, and based the entire game plan around their own kid putting up big stats to improve their draft stock, could they average 44.2PPG over three college years?" Pistol Pete didn't suck, but I think any top 50 guy in NBA history, if given those circumstances, could probably put up Pete Maravich numbers. It's only untouchable because no other team will sacrifice wins for one player's benefit, so that player is more attractive to professional teams. That's the thing that is NEVER talked about with his records. Press Maravich was the coach and they were a mediocre-at-best team, but the goal was the 1.9 million dollar contract the Hawks gave his son. That he set records along the way was happenstance.
I didn’t know about that thought he was just that nice but he was only playing for stats
@@spoodyR3 It isn't really true, which is why you didn't know about it. There's some truth to it, but he's way overstating it.
I'm old enough to have vague memories of Maravich in college and certainly in the NBA, and everything you say is true and was widely understood at the time. Since then, lots of people have shouted that point down, "No, he was great, you're oversimplifying," but it's not oversimplified. Press Maravich made Pete and ruined him at the same time.
@@DavidBennett-m4r Maybe. I think the kid was gonna be weird either way.
Still though, top 50 players are born, not made. So even if you could say top 50 could've done what he did with his training, he's still a top 50.
Although Idk.. scoring with your head? Most soccer players wouldn't be able to do that.
@@Cannon4545 Hey, to be clear, I never said he had no talent (also she, not he). He DID have a gift. Lots of overzealous parents push their kids into sports, but there's not a million Pistol Pete or Williams sisters out there. Very few make it, and the ones that do usually do so for a reason. My argument in its entirety is this: ANY top 50 or Top 75 NBA player, including the old ones from before Maravich's time like Mikan, Pettit, Cousy and especially Paul Arizin, if you gave them the exact same circumstances as Pistol Pete, IE make their father the coach, a father who has NO CONCERN AT ALL FOR WINNING and tailors the entire team, recruiting, practice, and gameplay, towards making their son break scoring records, any of the 75 other guys in the Anniversary team could have set records in the same ball park or even higher than Maravich did. No basketball star EVER has had circumstances like Pete had when he set the record. Coaches jobs hang on the line, but LSU would never have fired Press Maravich. Pete was money for them. And that's why his records are both legit AND dubious.
Thoughtful and persuasive as always. Nice one!
Why don't you compare the All-NBA players that Russell played with compared to Wilt in the years they shared in the NBA as it is not even close?
1959 3 1st team All NBA players Russell, Cousy, and Sharman...when else has that ever happened?
1960 Cousy 1st team All NBA, Russell, Sharman 2nd team
1961 Cousy 1st team All NBA, Russell, Heinsohn 2nd team
1962 Cousy, Russell, Heinsohn 2nd team All NBA...
4 Celtics made the All-Star Team Cousy, Russell, Heinsohn, and Jones
1963 Russell 1st team All NBA, Cousy, Heinsohn 2nd team...Havlicek Rookie team
1964 Havlicek, Russell, Heinsohn All NBA 2nd team.... Sam Jones also made the All-Star team
1965 Russell 1st team, Sam Jones 2nd team
1966 Russell, Jones, Havlicek All NBA 2nd team
1967 Russell, Jones All NBA 2nd team
1968 Russell, Havlicek All NBA 2nd team
1969 Havlicek All NBA 2nd team
Now if you compare that to Wilt's supporting cast for the first 6 years of his career it destroys it
As Wilt had zero All NBA teammates with the Warriors from 1959 to 1965.
And only one other All NBA teammate in Hal Greer from 1965 to 1968 with the 76ers.
Ur assuming making allstars is the benchmark for help. Good Role players are help as well. Wilt had solid enough role players to be good enough to nearly beat the Celtics only multiple occasions. The problem wasn’t the help clearly if they were within points of beating the celts on multiple occasions. It was the way they were used. It was the wilt show and everyone else move out the way. Easy to defend for the Celtics. Just try our best to dent some of wilts production and don’t worry about anyone else because he won’t pass to the anyway. He had some of the worst assist to scoring attempt ratios of all time in his years. Alex hannum took that same crop of talent around wilt that was so called, “no help,” and asked wilt to pass more and their offense looked SIGNIFICANTLY better immediately compared to seasons pass. Then he goes to Philly with much better talent like Cunningham Greer, etc, and they dominate Boston. Playmaking is essential for ALL great scorers. Wilt didn’t capitalize on what he had and his teams suffered.
@@TheIcemanthomasback then there were very few players in the league compared to now so all nba teams are actually better for knowing who had the best supporting cast
Celtics had HOF players lol but downplay it . Celtics had HOF players coming off the bench lol downplay it some more.
This was a tremendous video, thank you
I respectfully disagree with your thesis, Rusty, even though I find your argument interesting.
Wilt Chamberlain's lack of winning and his contrast to Russell's high winning impact isnt caused by him not bring utilized properly.
I think that Is a rabbit hole that Is used as an excuse for certain players. A great example of this is Russell Westbrook (although Westbrook is a top 50 player ever and Wilt a top 12).
Russell Westbrook recently stated in an interview for the Denver Nuggets that he wasn't utilized properly by other teams.
We all know that his inefficient style that led to triple doubles in OKC and first round exits wasn't imposed by coaches but was active play style choice by Westbrook. I think that Wilt, although being exponentially better, was wired similarly to Westbrook in the sense that he loved breaking records and achieving statistical dominance. It took plentiful losses, a strong minded coach and a fear of having a tarnished legacy to change his approach.
It seems that you are minimizing the players' agency in their playstyle throughout history and giving too much weight to a coaches' choice for a player.
I think that Kareem Abdul jabber was the perfect medium between Russell and Wilt, and therefore the better player. He was team oriented and conducive to winning like Bill and retained some of his dominance like Wilt.
@@goldenbuckets23 I don’t think Kareem was better, I think he played a better game. The nba was literally in its infancy. Look at how dribbling and fouls were called during Wilts playing days and just imagine the league 5yrs before he stepped in. He’s responsible for a lot of changes but when there are changes that makes it not the same bc there are literally differences. Basketball was BECOMING entertainment and Kareem was a beneficiary of the era. The jump shot became an official thing in 48 and Bill made jumping legal to block shots while he was in college. I would never say Kenyon Martin is better than Shaq but in THIS GAME, he possibly could easily be.
The Wilt Chamberlain's role transition, from one season to another, was an intriguing story :
Chamberlain made it clear he did not like to be told what to do. He complained to reporters about Hannum's strategy, and Hannum insisted to the same men that Chamberlain was going to have to change
The tension built until one night... Hannum and Chamberlain got into a violent locker-room argument and avoided coming to blows only when other players interevened. Hannum, deciding a showdown was necessary, ordered the other players out, then took off his jacket.
"You've been fighting me as a coach all the way," Hannum said. "Now fight me as a man."
Chamberlain glared at Hannum for a long moment and then folded, saying, "Aw, I can't fight you, Alex."
...Despite grudgingly yielding to Hannum's authority, he still resented the coach, and complained about him to Guy Rodgers, one of his closest friends on the team. But Rogers thought Hannum's strategy was obviously paying off. Rogers wanted to see the Warriors win, and it vexed him that Chamberlain seemed willing to put his own pride ahead of the best interests of the team
"You've got to bow down, Wilt," Rodgers told Chamberlain. "Admit it, cat, that we're a much better club with you feeding us part of the time and then getting back to protect our basket."
Page 192 of John Taylor's book :
The Rivalry: Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, and the Golden Age of Basketball
Anyone else need rusty to fall asleep very mellow calming voice dude could be an same person
Hour long wilt vid? I love you Mr. Buckets
Watched this video, enjoyed it, thought about it the next day and came back to like it and make a comment cus the quality and subject stuck with me so well, in conclusion, I fuckin love these nba deep dives
34:19 who is the guy complaining ab a three-second call?? dud was ahead of his time😂😂
😂😂
I really appreciate how much you thank your team for making things possible
Wilt lead the league in scoring rebounding assist and Blocks but they didn't count it back then... STOP THE LIES he did everything but Celtics had to much help and HOFs
This video is absurd
Btw I see people say Bill’s teammates are only HoFers because of their rings but that isn’t true when looking at each guy individually
Also it’s dumb the NBA inducted Russell again to the HoF as a coach when as a coach he was a below 500 record and his actual coaching gig with the Sonics and Kings was terrible
This is undoubtedly the best presentation of this argument ever. Subscribed.
Considering that I have seen countless attempts at besmirching Wilt over the past 20+ years and it is the same nonsense narrative every single time I will just leave a few points to dispel common lies about Wilt:
1.) "Wilt was not that dominant": Yes, yes he was. He was more dominant that Kareem or Russell. People harp on about team success, but the reality is that until 1968 Wilt just like MJ did not have a team that was good enough. It is a testament to him being able to almost bring the reinging multiple time championship winning dynasty to its knees loosing four playoff series by a combined margin of 9 in a do or die final game, or basically by a single bucket and in almost every single one of them neither Wilt nor Russell were involved with the last shot taken. MJ in a similar situation against the Bird led Celtics in the 80s lost miserably in sweeps or gentlemen sweeps. Going back to Kareem, Wilt on a reconstructed knee, which he blew out so badly just 2 years prior that many doubted that he would be able to play ever again, overweight and nearing the end of career gave Kareem fits, blocking multiple sky hooks, at least once even twice in a row which can be seen on camera on TH-cam. In fact he was so dominant on the defensive end that he got standing ovations in Milwaukee. Furthermore, Kareem only won when he had the very best point guards feeding him. First Oscar Robertson who was the best point guard in his era and later Magic Johnson whom many still consider the best point guard of all time. Wilt never had a point guard that good until his final few years.
2.) "Wilt did not average 50 in the playoffs" he also did not average 50 against the Celtics. Like any top scorer he scored more on weaker competitors and less on stronger ones. His production once analysed on a per team basis showed remarkable resilience with little drop off in either production or efficiency.
3.) "Wilt would not average 50 today" for a career he did not average 50. Not even for his first 7 seasons. As to single season record, inferior players like Harden averaged 34 for a season much of which was due to foul rule abuse. So if someone like Harden can average 34 I can see Wilt going above that. 50 ppg in a season though? Maybe not. 40 ppg? A stretch maybe but possible. I cannot say that for certain but I can make the case easily but it would depend entirely on the team around him just like it did in the 60s.
4.) "Wilt was a diva". Yes, so? Shaq was a diva. So was Magic, so was MJ and many other players. An irrelevant statement.
5.) "Wilt was a statpadder". To a degree sometimes, yes. You know who also stat padded? Your beloved Michael Jordan who wanted to prove that he could get triple doubles like Magic for a season and was seen to go to the scoreboard to check his assists and rebounds. Sorry to burst your bubble that the supposed "GOAT" also did that.
Lastly, since the title of the video is almost offensive to me, no the stats do not lie. Stats have to be interpreted and people often ignore context for stats, usually on a time or era basis when it comes to that era, so the interpretations can be wrong or be lied about, but raw stats do not lie. They just do not tell the whole story.
did you watch the video? this is not trying to push any of those narratives
I hate how stats almost get a bad rap these days. As you said, they don't tell the whole story. But they are literally measurements of what players contributed on the court.
@@page8301 again did you watch the video? How do you, in a league of 10 teams, average 45 and miss the playoffs?
@@chilldoc9638 "League of 10 teams" already tells me how ignorant you are since you obviously think that with only 10 teams making it to the playoffs is easy. I could also ask how MJ averaging over 30 could not get out of the first round for 7 years in a row.
@@page8301it's only wrong when wilt does it lol if wilt isn't the goat, then Russell is the goat. But they we will never say Russell is the goat because Russel just plays defense lol the Title of the video is giving hate. Hate all players in wilt's era, because none could beat the Celtics lol except wilt lol wilt beat the Celtics while playing under a good head coach. Wilt has done many great things while on the court, and sometimes the stats doesn't tell the whole story. They say wilt use to average more than 10 blocks per game. I'm more impressed that he blocked the skyhook two times in the same play. The greatest play I've ever seen. Wilt blocked the first shot, then Kareem recovered the ball, from that moment it became a 1vs1. Kareem tried his best and was still blocked. Amazing.
I don't normally comment too often but I like to make sure I do on videos that put this much effort and love into it. Love seeing you excel Rusty you've got a good head on your shoulders and display this information in a very entertaining and thoughtful approach. Also shoutouts to the editors and everyone behind the scenes I look forward to seeing how far you can go.
Damn Rusty Buckets made a wilt video before twothree lmao
I’m a big Wilt fan and I appreciated this video preemptively rebutting most of my arguments for his Greatness.
If you want a real evaluation, look at Thinking Basketball's take on him. This one is... kind of garbage and intellectually dishonest.
@@Cannon4545no
@@stolensentience Um, k.
@@Cannon4545 nothing garbage or intellectually dishonest about this video. thinking basketball can just as well be called the same
@@stolensentience I mean.. no, it can't. It's purely analytical with absolutely zero emotional appeal or bs narratives.
Bruce Lee said it best: “It's like a finger pointing the way to the moon. Don't concentrate on the finger or you will miss all that heavenly glory”
In Wilt’s case scoring was his finger!
He was the GOAT, but the problem was one person isn't supposed to score all the points and they didnt know that back then
Maybe, IF you really did a deep dive you would see that most of Wilt's team mates shot 35% from the field and HAD to rely on him scoring 45 a game, 20RPG and 5Blks per game because if they had a "regular" center scoring 10PPG and 10RPG they would never have been near the playoffs.
Great lighting on this one, best yet!
for wilt it was always a new challenge. he said that he could just run to the basket and dunk and score 100 every game but that wouldnt be fun
Well maybe he shoulda dunked every time to win
I've heard people say it was actually 98 or 102. But he did stop when they said he reached 100. It was definitely around 100.
Thanks for this one Rusty! I'm totally taking the "Wilt's Paradox" line. And the underappreciated aspect to me is your point on "unimaginable coaching." The best coaches are able to push their best scorers to focus more on the team and provide a system/framework to do so. Bill also already had the "team-first" mentality, so it was easy to sell him on the idea, while it took more to get Wilt to buy in.
Your vids are good NyQuil ngl I be taking good naps 😂
As a long time one-eyed Celtics fan, the legacy of Wilt Chamberlain is one that through my eyes should be enhanced rather than diminished.
When Wilt didn't win, how could he not win? When he won...of course he did.
He was judged and berated mercilessly by the socially conditionally then. 25 years since his passing, he is judged and berated mercilessly by the socially conditioned today.
His first 7 years of NBA coincided with the Celtics Dynasty between 1959-1966.
IT WAS A DYNASTY. Dynasties usually happen when clubs win 3 titles across a 5 year period.
The Celtics won 8 in a row...EIGHT.
Has anyone ever thought to consider that team chemistry orchestrated by one of the greatest coaches of all-time in Red Auerbach may have been a contributing factor? I think the magnitude of Red's impact is continually being dimished as time goes on. Yes...he had reduced individual impact against the Celtics as Russell could curtail him...but Russell couldn't do it on his own.
The stats and the footage that is shown featuring Russell and Chamberlain does not lie. Russell was the bravest David and was adequately equipped to take down Goliath with the right tools and strategy. But Goliath 1 on 1 was too dominant beyond belief.
Further to Wilt's individual exploits, there is greatness attached to Wilt that goes beyond the court and is only seen by those who have attracted the capacity to exist at a higher vibration and frequency through their authentic actions in life.
Wilt was before his time in ALL facets. Not just in basketball but LIFE AWARENESS.
He represented ego...or did he?
Reality was he was anything but ego. Wilt's ego was a facade. He portrayed ego to humanity because he knew humanity was as blind back then as they are today. They would never see his true colours.
Failure, suffering and pain became so attached to Wilt that Wilt realised that for him to accept and navigate through the obstacles in his path...he had to learn to love pain.
As stated by Rusty Buckets, Wilt was adjudged the biggest loser due to the complex paradox attached to his individual exploits...yet for all the pain, suffering and humilation that was directed at him, Wilt never appeared triggered.
There's great reason for this.
Wilt was a philanthrapist. Majority of people ignore this because its not a stat...yet by ignoring this, a socially conditioned agenda is formed.
Wilt was a very generous and loving person behind the scenes. People who knew him stated this but he did not seek fame, fortune or exposure for his good deeds.
Furthermore he did not seek any of this in life...but clearly attracted it because of genetic factors beyond his control and abilities demonstrated. This was his path.
For all of this, Wilt knew his value, his worth and the source he represented.
This alone confirms he was one step ahead of the majority of people today.
Portrayed ego...but his authentic actions in life not visually seen spoke much much louder.
By learning to master the dark arts, he triggered an ability to activate the essence of his human being and was able to live a life of duality alternating between his human being and his spiritual being.
Wilt's legacy goes far far far beyond basketball and as a result, his story is one that will only serve to become more and more iconic and mythical as time goes on.
For those of you who have had a read of this, thank you.
Feel free to check out his basketball statue in Philadelphia.
Read the quote above his name.
Observe the statue, the symbolism it depicts and decide for yourselves.
Nothing like a bit of see, think and wonder for you all to consider.
From there, it's a matter of faith.
Very well written and well stated.
@ genuinely asking, did you watch the whole video?
@chilldoc9638 yes...watched the whole hour plus on TV and started typing on the mobi towards the end.
Regardless of whether views align or not, genuinely rate Rusty's presentations. He does an outstanding job.
So you’re saying wilt was better than he was because it makes your Celtics look even greater than they actually were
One of you best videos so far
that warriors rockets series is a bad example. it wasn't because of CP3 going down that they lost. game 7 they went 7-44 from 3. ariza went 0-12 in 42 minutes. they missed 23 3 pointers in a row and lost by 9. biggest choke in nba history. they shoulda beat the warriors and then swept the cavs.
Sometimes Vegas makes the rules
Yeah because even with all the missed threes (27 in a row btw) they were leading for most of the game. If they had managed to hit even a quarter of those threes they probably would have won.
@@akeme25 that is my point. it wasn't the harden system that failed. any system where everyone shot awful can't win.
@@uoislame I know I’m agreeing with you. I’m just adding to your point lol
This is a great breakdown of a famous player and basketball history. Well done!
This is gonna bang
We be loving the high quality videos for the main channel 🙌
Wilt was a dominate player and to me still is the goat. Problem with things like this, is the record... team record.
Wilt was good, his teammates weren't.
Basketball is a team sport, and if you want success, like Championships, you have to play like a team.
Did you watch the video? The video, on multiple occasions, highlights him having multiple Allstars on his teams. Perhaps Wilt is just the greatest scorer of all time. Perhaps his lack of rings is more important to his GOAT status than his scoring. One could also say scoring 50 points a game and not winning a ring shows something is deeply wrong with his ability to make the players around him better.
Just delusional
Great video rustaniel, keep it up
This video is sssoooo Clayton Crowley coded. I need the collab ASAP.
It’s even more Thinking Basketball coded. I would not be surprised if during his evolution as a basketball fan he read Ben Taylor’s book.
@@rickharrison1737 Not close to TB level. This guy isn't nearly as smart or analytical.
@@Cannon4545 Stylistically and philosophically Rusty is closer to channels like TB, Hoopvenue and AlexHoops than he is to more casual basketball channels like JxmyHighroller or Johnny Arnett.
@@rickharrison1737 I agree, but that doesn't mean the analysis is on par.
thanks, seen so many videos about him and never got nearly as much insight
"BILL Russell won 8 rings on your watch" - Aristotle
Ahhhh TD3
Banger video guys. Thank you.
23:40 while we are on the subject, I would like to do a little bit of course correction.
1. Wilt Chamberlain was besties with the Republican party and Nixon! Close aides at that time have stated that Wilt pretty much knew every Republican party bigwig. Which tells us that he was not in a dark place.
2. MLK Jr.'s assassination was not CIA's work, it was the FBI's.
There's no darker place than swimming with worms inside the belly of the beast
@@willywonka7812 Remember during Wilt's life up to that point, the democrats were the party of segregation.
I don't even watch basketball but I watched the whole video and found it very interesting. Very nice work.
Wilt could’ve done what Bill did but Bill couldn’t have done what Wilt did.
Put wilt on Boston, they don't win 11 chips. No way. Maybe 6, maybe. Wilt couldn't win like Bill. No chance
could've
Really well done video. I thought I knew Wilt’s story pretty well but learned a lot more from this video. Thanks!
We really cant say that Bill Russell didn't have more help. The biggest help was Red Aurbach.
Deep dive videos are great! Great job to the whole team involved!
The biggest loser seems rough he won two titles if anything his stats were inflated sure but that era almost nobody won chips outside of the Celtics and lakers until bill retired.
Might want to check on that. Only the 76er's won during the Celtics time. The Lakers won before then and after. As for his stats being inflated why is just his inflated? No one else was putting up crazy numbers like him. I do agree with you that calling him the biggest loser is well beyond rough. Sure is funny how all these deep dive videos never seem to mention Wilt and other would bet on their games finals included according to the FBI. No clue who he put his money on but it's possible his losing was really him winning. Idk.
Hawks won in '58 against the Celtics. Pace of play and lower FG % inflated rebounding by a large degree, and scoring by a modest degree
@@wizard1687 I knew the Hawks won in 58. But it was my mistake I just forgot Russell was on that Celtics team.
As for inflated number. We already know and like you said pace of play. That equals higher numbers across the board. I asked how come only his are way higher than his peers? No one said his number stay the same if he plays in other eras. But to discredit him by saying his numbers are inflated is unfair. Is Jordan's numbers inflated? Jordan's shooting percentage is worse and he shot more than Wilt. But Wilts numbers are inflated? So what when it's Wilt we say his stats are inflated but if its jordan we say he is the goat? We called Wilt selfish then wtf was jordan who shoot more and missed more in a slower paced era? Look like people just want to discredit players for an era before their own to me.
@@jasonnelson6624they are building a false narrative around the game. Wilt and Russell are the goats.
been waiting for this rusty
The talent disparity between their two teams made it to where Wilt had to thoroughly outplay Russell to even have a 50/50 shot at winning.
It seemed as though when Wilt thoroughly outplayed Russell was when Wilt's team won but not all the time and usually it was a close margin.
Wilt dropped 24 points, 32 rebounds, 13 assists and blocked 12 shots against Russell in game 1 of the 1967 ECF.
And then in game 3 he dropped 20 points 41 rebounds, 9 assists and blocked 5 shots.
furthermore, in game 5 he dropped 29 points, 36 rebounds, 13 assists and blocked 7 shots.
I dare anyone to find a game of Russell individually dominating Wilt to that degree in the playoffs.
Furthermore
When Russ played even with Wilt or outplayed Wilt, the Celtics would blow them out.
One such example out of many is in Game 4 of the '64 Finals.
Wilt beat Russell all the way across the board with 27 points, 38 rebounds, and shot .52.2 from the floor.
While Russell had 8 points, 19 rebounds, and shot .33.3 from the floor.
Yet, the Celtics still won.
There's no way in hell in any game throughout the decade besides 1969 that Wilt would've been able to get away with it if those kind of numbers were flipped in Russell's favour.
As the one playoff game out of the 49 they played in.
In which Russell just destroyed Wilt on both sides of the ball after he injured his hand in game 2 of the 1960 ecf
The Warriors were utterly blown out by over 30 points.
www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/196003190BOS.html
🗣️
You just summed up 2016-2018 Lebrons issues through the lens of another player lol
Ur reading raw numbers and not looking at the bigger picture. Wilt shot a high percentage against most teams and put up ridiculous scoring numbers. But against the Celtics, Russell was able to significantly cut down wilts usual production just enough. That’s what good defense is. U might outplay me stat wise but I out paced u. Doesn’t matter how many points u scored. U usually average 40 I slowed u down to 27. You usually shoot 58% I slowed u down to 50. That may seem insignificant but getting a prolific score whose teams significantly depend on those high value opportunities to win games to drop just a bit is the difference between a win and a loss. All u have to do is win the game by one point. If wilts teams Average 110 ppg and my defense helped cut them to 102. All we gotta do is make sure we score 103. Russell understood this. Wilt did not until much later. The thing that people tend to forget is that no matter how many hofers y’all claim Russell had, most of those guys were scorers. And yet the Celtics offense was ABYSMAL, most years ranking as a bottom or near bottom team in offensive rating, scoring, efficiency, etc. The defense is what got them by. And they lived on the fast breaks and easy opportunities with a playmaking and defensive bigman like Russell, while most teams relied on their traditional bigs to post up and score. The defensive stats don’t exist so it will always appear that wilt outplayed Russell based on shear volume. But if u watch the games, it tells a different story. ESPECIALLY in the clutch where Russell often shined.
@@jonathand.t.5051exactly why u say wilt was literally just lebron in the 60s. Lol
@@TheIcemanthomas Wilt is the GOAT. Bill is number two.
One thing you're right about is that it's not all about scoring. That's 200% facts. Everything else in your comment is, unfortunately, nonsense.
Let's start off with the claim that "whose team's significantly depend on those high value opportunities to win games." No, they don't. Wilt is one of the greatest scorers ever, yes, but again, scoring is such a small part of Wilt's overall game that he could dominate whether he scored 100 or scored 0.
What his team depended on mostly was how well-balanced of a game he played, doing multiple major things well: FG/pts/rebs/blks/ast/etc.
The obvious fact that his 40 PPG average did not dictate wins comes in the fact that his best seasons, regular-season record-wise and championship result-wise, were years where he was literally averaging 21 down to 15 but rebounding 20-25 a game, blocking 10-12 a game, and assisting 5-10 a game, etc.
Next, we have the fact that Wilt increased against Russell while Russell decreased more than Wilt increased in head-to-head matchups across the majority of the major categories, which renders your comment a completely false narrative painting.
Wilt vs. Bill: 30, 28.2, 3.8, 48.8%
Wilt career: 30, 22.9, 4.4, 54%
Bill vs. Wilt: 14.2, 23, 4.4, 37%
Bill career: 15.1, 22.5, 4.3, 44%
So, Wilt dropped none in PPG.
Bill dropped 0.9 in PPG.
Wilt INCREASED 5.3 in REBs per game.
Bill INCREASED just 0.5 REBs per game.
Wilt dropped 0.6 assists per game.
Bill increased 0.1 assists per game.
Wilt decreased just 5.2%.
Bill DECREASED 7%.
So, as we can see, Wilt increased more than Bill increased when against each other and decreased less than Bill decreased against each other.
I gave you the evidence that maintaining scoring averages would not have guaranteed him the victory whatsoever. The evidence shows when 50 PPG led nowhere, but 24 led to the GOAT chip ever. 44 led to no playoffs, but 14 led to one of the greatest chips ever yet again.
He won in '67 averaging 21 instead of the regular season 24.
He won in '72 averaging 14.7 while the regular season average was 14.8.
Why cap instead of just accepting the truth?
And the ending of your comment is also complete nonsense. Just listen to yourself. There's a reason why you have no actual factual thing to hold onto and say, "This proves Wilt was outplayed" or "These are the moments Bill Russell had in the clutch that were greater than Wilt's."
And all you could say was "just look at the games and see it tells a different story." The reality is, when you look at the games, it tells a story that Wilt dog-walked his matchup Russell even more than the numbers show it. So, you don't wanna play that game at all either, as it demolishes your false claim just as badly. The only hope you have is saying rings are the only reason why Bill was better, and we both know that's not true and why if your only claim to fame is rings.
Meanwhile, I have shown you not just numbers, but I also have a long list of clutch moments Wilt Chamberlain has had in the postseason. Please list Bill Russell's clutch moments that outnumber these Wilt clutch moments listed below instead of just capping like any casual who never saw Bill play and say, "especially in the clutch where Bill shines the most."
Only player in NBA history to average at least 20 points and 20 rebounds while shooting at least 60% from the field across Game 7s in the playoffs.
Two G7 games where he shot at least 80% (1965 and 1969 vs. Russell), GOAT clutch FG against the GOAT defender ever.
G5 1962 First Round/ECSF G5 - 56 points, 35 rebounds, and 12 blocks. Clutch performance in the game leading to a blowout.
G7 1962 ECF - 22 points and 22 rebounds on 7-15 shooting.
He shot 8/9 from the free throw line and scored 5 points in 35 seconds in the last minute.
Clutch buckets.
G7 1965 ECF vs. Boston: 30 points and 32 rebounds with 80% shooting without a healthy Luke Jackson, who ended up fouling out.
Wilt scored 4 clutch points in the last minute and approximately scored the last 10-12 points of the match. Clutch buckets.
1967: Triple-Double average against Boston, two Quadruple-Doubles, 6 blocks in the fourth quarter in one of the '67 Finals games.
Wilt clutch defense. Also turned Thurmond into an unreliable scorer with 34.3% shooting compared to his 55.2%.
First match vs. GSW in Finals: 16 points, 33 rebounds, 10 assists, 9 blocks.
Wilt blocked Thurmond's layup/hook shot in the last seconds to send the game into overtime. Clutch defense.
1971 G7 WCF: 25 points won the series with clutch playmaking, buckets, and defense without injured Baylor and West.
1972: Wilt scored 10.8 PPG vs. Kareem in NBA-Western Conference Finals but outrebounded, out-defended, and out-shot-blocked Kareem by far. And after they beat Kareem and the Bucks,
19 a game against the Knicks in the Finals, where he outrebounded, out-defended, and out-shot-blocked everyone else by far, along with crucial and clutch playmaking as always. In both series, Wilt was showered with praise.
1972 G6 WCF vs. Bucks - Wilt scored 20 points and grabbed 24 rebounds on 66.7% shooting.
Rallied the Lakers to win the game and overcame a 10-point deficit in the 4th quarter, and outsprinted Kareem in fast breaks. Jerry West called it the greatest ball-busting performance he has ever seen. Clutch defending, rebounding, playmaking, and scoring all down the stretch.
1972 G6 WCF vs. Bucks - Wilt scored 20 points and grabbed 24 rebounds on 66.7% shooting.
Rallied the Lakers to win the game and overcame a 10-point deficit in the 4th quarter, and outsprinted Kareem in fast breaks. Jerry West called it the greatest ball-busting performance he has ever seen. Clutch defending, rebounding, playmaking, and scoring all down the stretch.
1972 G4 Finals vs. Knicks: Two clutch blocks in OT. Played aggressive defense with 5 fouls, shattering the myth of him playing too carefully when he got 5 fouls.
1972 G5 vs. Knicks: Chamberlain with 24 points on 10-14 shooting, with 29 rebounds, 4 assists, and 9 blocks-broken hand! While West flat-out admitted that he played a terrible series, despite his 8.8 assists average.
1973 WCS Game 7 vs. Chicago Bulls: Wilt got 21 points and 28 rebounds. He also blocked a shot with 30 seconds left and threw a full-court pass to Goodrich to win the game.
This is another of those high quality documentary style videos that you guys promised to make and it certainly lives up to that standard, being not just an interesting subject, but also a very well scripted, edited and narrated piece. So, first of all I would like to thank everyone that worked on it for this very entertaining watch.
Second, I would like to weigh in a little on the 'Numbers and usage rate' discussion. I don't know anything about Wilt, except for the random statistical factoid or story. I know a little bit about Kobe, how he played and how him choosing to lower his production and take less shots made his team more effective.
I do know quite a bit about Luka though. I've watched basically every game outside of his rookie season, spent hours looking at stats from him and his peers and went through hours of videos and articles from NBA fans and analysts alike.
The thing is, in almost every way Luka is an anomaly. He is not just an overall efficient scorer, he has the playmaking aspect of his game too, which is not just good, but generationally good. The amount of wide open looks he creates for his teammates is just ridiculous, especially if you consider that those are also open looks for Kyrie Irving, an incredible shooter and now Klay Thompson as well.
Those are the last guys you want to leave open as a defense from the threepointline and somehow Luka (and the Mavs offensive gameplan) gets those open looks for them, often delivered at pinpoint accuracy and at the right exact moment.
While there certainly have been instances where Luka in a lot of ways underperformed by doing too much, forcing up inefficient shots like his step-back threes from far out, there is an aspect to his usage rate and the way he plays that is a little outside of Luka's responsibility. When he gets teammates open looks and they keep bricking their shots, the scoring burden starts to fall more on him.
If for some reason his own shot isn't falling as well, his playmaking suffers from it, as they will let him shoot hard 3 point shots all game and not be too worried about it. It is a compounding problem that is increased by the Mavs total reliance on his (and Kyrie's) playmaking and shotcreation.
Also, what is an inefficient shot for him or Kyrie, is probably often still a much higher percentage shot than any of their teammates could take, even when there open. The issue only is that the offense stagnates, the roleplayers don't build rhythm and the defense can just fully focus on what Luka is doing and double down on him defensively.
This is exactly what happened to the Mavs in the last finals game vs the Celtics. When Kyrie was basically not performing up to his level, for a large part due to the insanely good defenders on him and the roleplayers not making their open shots, the Mavs offense basically fell apart.
Finally, I want to touch on the Luka and Tatum comparison. I do not agree that the only reason is Luka's usage rate and heliocentric playstyle caused them to lose. I think it was more the level of defense that the Celtics were able to resist with, as well as the average talent level, especially on the defensive end was simply higher.
While Luka and Kyrie are clearly much better offensive players than anyone on the Celtics roster, neither of them are as good defensively as any of their starters, nor is anyone on the Mavs roster except maybe Lively. Defense just wins games and coupled with a great gameplan and consistant execution, that is what won them the finals, I don't think the heliocentric overreliance on Luka was the only reason here.
And don't mistake me for a Celtics fanboy here, I really dislike that team and was rooting for the Mavs all the way, so it feels very wrong to come to this conclusion. They have yet to meet this season, but already it seems like the Mavs offense is more varied and has more potential than they had last season, so maybe if they meet up this time it will be way different.
pino you always go so hard in the comments. i appreciate you! -rudy
@@rustybuckets Np rudy. I tend to go a little overboard on the amount of text, using way too much letters to say not so much, but it's enjoyable to interact a bit and organize my thoughts on a subject. I really appeciate these solid videos.
@@rustybucketsyou've no idea what are you talking about
As someone who’s always been a huge Wilt glazer, this video actually gave me some much needed insight. Still top 10 ever but he might go from 5 on my list to like 7 or 8. The Wilt Paradox is actually essentially why I have Tim Duncan 4th all time. I have no doubt in my mind that Tim Duncan could have averaged 30 numerous times, but the fact he didn’t is what made him so good
@@goldmouthlito comparing Coach Pop to any coach Wilt had is unfair. Hakeem was better than Duncan on both ends of the court but the teammates and schemes weren’t there to make the talent succeed. Bill dominated with a defensive scheme. The man was almost kicked out of college for jumping to block shots which is something he carried to the league. Basketball was still developing and literally in its remedial state from the Mikan era. Wilt was better but Bill dominated a very bad game. From the way dribbling was allowed, fouls and offensive fouls were called and everything in between.
Despite the fact that he played against the second most HOF player at his position(only behind kareem and parish, which he played 7 years less than both) He PLAYED THE MOST TOTAL GAMES against another hof center….see list below lol
(mind you these are their barefoot heights, in the modern NBA you would add 1-2 inches to their height, as players have been measured in their shoes only after 1977)
C-Bill Russell: 6’10” HOF (143 games played in 9 seasons)
C-Kareem Abdul Jabbar: 7'2" HOF(27 games played in 4 seasons)
C-Willis Reed: 6,10” HOF(72 games played in 8 seasons)
C-Walt Bellamy: 6'11" HOF(100 games played in 11 seasons)
C-Artis Gilmore: 7'2" HOF
C-Bob Lanier: 6'11" HOF(17 games played in 3 seasons)
C-Nate Thurmond: 6'11" HOF(47 games played in 4 seasons)
C-Bob McAdoo: 6’10” HOF (5 games played in 1 season)
C-Elvin Hayes:6’9 “ HOF (22 games played in 4 seasons)
(Wes Unseld is also a HOF center but he is 6’7) (26 times in 5 seasons)
(Dave Cowens is also a HOF Center/Forward but he is 6”9)(17 games played in 3 seasons)
(Connie Hawkins is also a HOF Forward/ center but he is 6”9)(31 games played in 4 seasons)
(please note there are more HOF PF who guarded and were guarded by wilt chamberlain but the majority of them are 6’8 to 6’9)
SO THATS 574 OUT OF 1045…WHICH TRANSLATES TO 54% OF WILTS GAMES BEING PLAYED AGAINST ANOTHER HOF CENTER…
No chance he's top 10 lol. KAJ, Jordan, James, Bird, Magic, Hakeem, Russel, Duncan, Shaq, Curry, Bryant. He's not sniffing any of those guys just off the top of my head
@@ziggle5000 why would russel be top 10. He cant even score. He's a center and had seasons shooting 43% from the field. Thats like giving ben wallace a couple rings and then put him in your top 20 list. LOL
Bill Russell is top ten. Don't be a clown. Insanity to suggest otherwise. Scoring is half the game. If a guy blocks every shot his opponent makes , he doesn't need to score. But Bill still avg 18 while being he best defender on the best dynasty in pro sports history. Stop it.
He evolved under a new coach when he moved teams, that changed his way of thinking and evolved their game. That's why his statistics got less impressive later, because he was playing more like a pass first guard.
@rustybuckets What you failed to understand is that Wilt was told to play like this by his coaches. It is wrong to criticize him for doing exactly what his coach sayed. You also seem to have no idea about various injuries to Wilt and his teammates. Wilt was injured badly in 1960 against the celtics as well as other occasions.
First thing you mention is literally in the video a lot, and injuries are mentioned in chapter 3 just not in that context.
-rudy
@@rustybucketsdon’t get mad when someone corrects you on your ill informed and ignorant video!
Incredible video 🔥
You finally understabd nba basketball man. Congrats.
Thats right winning is all that matters and how you won it. Numbers doesnt mean sh**