Sorry for the lack of book reviews so far this year. I am BINGING The Dandelion Dynasty for a series review which is taking some time. Should be out next week! Didn't know I'd be releasing this the day David Lynch died, but as I said in the video, Twin Peaks is incredible and well worth a watch. If you haven't watched it, please do. Keep your eye on the donut and not on the hole.
@@DanielGreeneReviews I always thought that the fact the show starts with a two-part episode titled Pilot was a play on words, being both a pilot for the show and having JJ Abrams's friend Greg Grunberg play the pilot of the airplane.
JJ Abrams even wanted the hatch to be in the pilot, but head writer Damon Lindelof insisted they know what was in it first. To their credit that was usually the show's philosophy.
And it can't be changed just because fans theorized the truth. Not sure if Lost went that route, since I barely remember this show back when it was aired. I watched an episode here and there only. But so many shows with an interesting mystery dropped the ball because the producers or something panicked when fan theories figured out the mystery(not that said fans had any way to actually confirm it), and the show felt they couldn't allow that to happen. So they changed the answer to the mystery. Which fucks it up, because now we get lots of plot holes. Almost like it became a point of pride to make sure NOBODY could see it coming. By constantly changing it. They did say that the mystery surrounding Raymond in The Blacklist was decided from the start. And that they wouldn't change it even if fans figured it out. They specifically pointed that out, because it's so prevalent in shows like this for the writers to just change the answers based on fan theories and how close they are getting to what they originally planned. Honestly not sure if they stuck to that or not. Haven't watched the final season yet. But considering the various shit that happened, covid and so on. I wouldn't be surprised if they changed shit there too.
@@kopicat2429 There's a weird desire some writers have to have a victory over the audience by coming up with an ending they didn't see coming. They need to step back and say "why?" Why is it so important to surprise people? What do you gain from it? What do they gain from it? What does the STORY gain from it? That's the problem, they want to have a twist for the sake of it.
For anyone who has like 20+ hours to spare and wants a deep dive into the story of Lost, I would recommend the series of long form deep dive videos done by Billiam. He goes into a lot of the behind the scenes of why the creators made the decisions they did and it's a pretty good watch
I highly recommend Billiam's MASSIVE retrospective series on Lost. Gave me a new appreciation for the show while explaining how its development led to some of its flaws.
LOST will always have a special place in my heart, and is to me a flawed masterpiece. There are a lot of issues with the characters and the story but the highs are so high. It also was something that I looked forward to every week, going downstairs and watching the new episode with my mom, then listening to this awesome theory podcast about the episodes. I lost my mom about 10 years ago, and LOST will always be a strong connection point to her. Charlie and Jin are the freaking best.
I was *obsessed* with LOST when it originally aired, to the point that I was on fan theory forums, listening to weekly fan podcasts, etc. About halfway through the series, I was doing some freelance work for someone connected to the show (writers’ room) & was basically told flat-out that they’re making it up as they go & had no over all plan. That really took the wind out of my sails for the last few seasons… So yeah… Definitely a ridiculous, nonsensical show when all is said and done, but it had some GREAT moments & characters, and it was a defining experience in its time. Thanks for making this great video! It’s fun to remember the LOST days. ❤
While I don't disagree with a lot of your points, LOST will always be like The Dark Tower to me in that it completely lost its way and botched the final act...but it's still one of my 5 favorite Fantasy series ever. The formula LOST created is still being copied today. Big recommend to FROM on MGM+.
Lost is one of those shows that was all about the ride. Going back years later and watching it, all of your points are totally valid. But it is still probably the most fun I've ever had watching a show. Particularly S2-S3 era, pre writers strike, where we all still had faith there WERE answers and everything was going somewhere. There was enough crazy shit happening that no theory was too outlandish and you could talk and think about it for hours. It was one of those cultural phenomena that bonded people with nothing else in common together because we all just needed SOMEBODY to hear us out, because this time we DEFINITELY knew what was going on 😂 It did not pay off its promises and is flawed in countless ways, but damn if you were there watching at the time it was such a great experience.
I loved the exploring of human psychology in the first seasons Later on a lot of times i just felt like "why tho?" A lot of things are left unanswered which really bothered me at the time but after all it´s still a blast through the whole series
I think basically any question you could reasonably ask *was* answered though. Sure, some of them the answer boil down to "the island has magical properties" but just about everything was in fact explained.
Why do you need everything answered? Its like the Sopranos cut to black. Not knowing is often good. Lost was never a show about the island but about the characters on the island.
@@robertJ14 I wouldn't call that a good comparison. The Sopranos ending leaves us with questions about what the future has in store for the characters considering the choices they've made over the series. Lost's ending leaves us with questions about the fundamental rules of the world the characters inhabit, which could be fine, but that's a hard sell when the series was mostly sold as a mystery to untangle. If you give someone a murder mystery, for example, then end the book without satisfactorily explaining who the murderer was and how the murder was committed, a sizeable portion of your audience is going to be (quite understandably) annoyed at the unanswered questions regardless of how much they love the characters in the story.
It's actually bewildering to me how he didn't even mention this. Half way through making season 4 they literally got all new writers because of it. If this never happened a lot more things most likely would've gotten explained.
Lost feels like one of those DND campaigns that end up running for years, so by the end you have a cluster of random plotlines that only sort of come together, and it sort of just becomes the DM throwing in whatever cool idea they while prepping without really think how this ties together long term.
I can answer that, although I think it's a bullshit answer. I read somewhere that the show is about a group of people who are all lost in life, hence why they all end up on the same island... A group of people lost in their personal lives end up lost together on an island...
I think the point of the characters all coming unglued is the Island just F's you up. Claire becomes Danielle Russou. Shes left by herself and lost her child. Just like Danielle. So in the later story shes just like her. Violent, untrusting, crazy obsessed with her missing child. This is exactly Danielle when they meet her.
I'll never get over Sayid going back to being the torturer he was, and then seeing a girl he had like a long weekend relationship with, and then being "Oh yeah, I'm good. I'm ready to move on. I've conquered my demons." Screw you show.
@@sandbun7348 the treatment of Sayid in that season where they go back in time (4?5?) is where I dropped the show. Did not make sense. He was my favorite character for a ton of reasons and like they gathered all of those reasons together and set them on fire.
It lost it's way because it had no over-arching plot. They ended up just making it up as they go, and so utterly screwed it up. This happens so often with good shows, and it's a shame.
Lists a dozen themes, "but that's not themes! That's vague!" Fate, destiny, human agency in an ambiguous world are the precise themes of the show and it develops and capitalizes on them through out. The show was meticulous, on a whole lot of levels, including in its ending -- and it was certainly more satisfying in its delivery than Twin Peaks prior to The Return (Or what? What? Are we all going to forget just how reviled the back half of Twin Peaks was for decades? Really? To compare it to Lost's ending favorably? Get real). This is not a good argument. I appreciate the video, but did not appreciate that comment. Also the DHARMA initiative had no need to be influenced by the Smoke Monster to be so openly unhinged. It's set in 1974-1977. This was the era when your professional scientist types would fill a house with water, bring in a dolphin, give everyone LSD, and write notes on the experience for everyone (THIS ACTUALLY HAPPENED). This was the era when the CIA would bring in psychics to do remote viewing experiments (THIS ACTUALLY HAPPENED). Not to mention, this was an isolated island in the south pacific, already remote, doubled up with the fact that it moves on top of that, and the DHARMA initiative film reels were meant to be kept in house and explicitly secret, their behavior makes perfect sense for the academics of that period. My problem with a lot of the critiques of LOST is that many viewer complaints like "vague" are just an excuse for not having everything spoonfed to them. The show sets up plenty of context for the content it shows you to make perfect sense. Is it all explicitly "explained"? No. It is a poor show that exposits itself constantly, though. You are actually supposed to think about the implications, rather than just go "oh that doesn't make sense." It does make sense. You just didn't think enough. Your critique of character behaviors is much better though. Jack is so fucking crazy lmao
This is funny to me because my favorite season of television is season 5 of LOST. Also, fun fact. Just about all TV shows are made up as they go along.
@@kuhpunkt That the writers didn't know how the main story and all the side plotlines and mysteries were going to end when they came up with them. Which is most likely true since the writers didn't know how long the show was going to go for until they were informed. I think it was around season 3 or 4. The thing is, I thought the show got worse AFTER they officially announced when it was going to end. It's like not having a clear idea of where things were heading was better for them creatively.
LOST was the first fandom I went 120% percent for. I spent probably weeks of my life posting theories on the old show forum, "The Fuselage," trying to guess what explaination the writers would use to piece everything together. I was completely let down by the show's finale and the "answers" it presented. My husband likes to joke that I will die mad about how LOST ended. Goddamn right I will! 😂 Thank you for this video, Daniel. You give an excellent analysis of WHY the show was so confusing and, ultimately, dissapointing. I really enjoyed your take on LOST, and not just because you validated my hours of ranting about this show. Keep up the great work!
@@troubleondemand7703 It's still largely his fault. He set up the mystery without knowing the answer then let someone else take the blunt of the criticism.
@@BP-dn9nv I am not a JJ stan or anything but that is literally what he was hired to do by Loyd Braun who was running ABC at the time. Loyd gave JJ a script that was written by Jeffrey Lieber. He hired JJ who brough in Lindelof to help him fix it up. Neither JJ nor Lindelof thought the show was going to get picked up. JJ was going on to direct Mission Impossible and Damon was already writing on another show.
I love LOST but it was sad to see the entire series become "Bang bang Gun adventures" after a while. It felt like every problem was solved with guns. The first season was great with this, as there were a limited amount of them but it quickly came to a point where the characters looked like soldiers in a war movie
When it first aired, I did make notes. When the numbers weren't entered in time and the hieroglyphs came up, I copied them down, then tried to figure out what they meant. I loved this series--until they turned a magic wheel. And by the ending, I felt betrayed. A 10/10 show in the first two seasons became a 1/10 show.
I don't think it was how fast you view it. As someone who loved the show and has defended the ending from years. Many people just lost the thread of what was actually happening especially in the last 2 seasons.
Lost is a mess because they needed to have 20+ bloated episodes per season, while the story would have benefited from the modern standard: 8 condensed episodes per season.
Agree, although I would bump the number up to 10 or 12. There's a lot of that. L. Ron Hubbard wrote Mission Earth because he wanted a 10 book series. Something not seen in sci-fi/fantasy before. Well, okay, but there's a lot of fat in it. Mission Earth could easily have been edited down to 6 or 7 books.
I think 12/13 would have been better like the Sopranos. I dont like the modern format of 8 episodes every 2 years. Yeah its a tight concise story but leaves no room for experimentation and risk taking. Like Sopranos season 5 if on Netflix in 2023 would have been 6-8 episodes with the Test Dream cut out
Besides all the unfulfilled story lines my biggest problem with Lost has always been why does a plane flying from Sydney to LA only have one Australian passenger?
Things you said that I disagree with: - Jacks arc was problematic - Hurleys arc was problematic - Sayid's progress was ignored - The numbers have an unsatisfactory answer - The DI doesnt make sense. - The flash sideways had little to do with what was initially setup. This is actually a pretty well balanced review though. I appreciate you giving credit where credit is due. Lost isnt for everyone and its definitely a flawed show. But it gets a lot of unreasonable shit from people. Its nice to see some reasonable criticisms while setting the record straight on a lot of the unreasonable criticisms. I was afraid it was gonna be more hate spewing like Velodus did back in tbe day 😂
Damon Lindelof had a pretty illuminating interview a few years ago where he said that the network wouldn’t even let them start a conversation about when the show would end until season 3, which is why it spun its wheels and introduced SO many mysteries. I think Lost ultimately suffers from being the first show of its kind that told an overarching narrative instead of an episodic one.
I think another big reason that Kate didn’t want to “reset” everything with the bomb was because she knew if it worked, she would just be going to jail once the plane landed. That’s why she was on the plane in the first place.
I was slow to get into Lost and then fast to abandon it. I didn't vibe with the forced mystery that was dragged out; I just couldn't take it, and I didn't love any of the characters. Plus, I was watching Stargate SG-1, and man, that show was soo much better. It gave me warm and fuzzy feelings, and I couldn't stop watching and rewatching episodes.
Started rewatching the show last month because I found out my husband never saw the last three seasons (which is a crime imo). My favorite show, up there with Fringe. Amazing character study.
Lost will always have a special place in my heart, despite its flaws. For me, watching it as it came out, it was the first time I had a show to discuss with everyone the next day at work (at least in the beginning). I remember listening to a specific radio show the morning after because they would talk about it, reading online forums & everyone trying to figure out what was going on. It was so much fun. That season 2 opening will always be one of my favorites.
Watched this when it aired week-to-week, again on DVD with my wife years later, and now about halfway through streaming it with our kids. I am all-but-certain that the purgatory theory was the original plan. Somewhere around the end of S3 the producers got nervous that so many fans had caught on to the big "final reveal," and demanded the writers go back to the drawing board to come up with a new ending. For just one example: Eko's death is so poignant and satisfying if you interpret it as him "earning" his final destination in his scene with the monster when he accepts and forgives himself for his life choices. Lots more examples of how well it fits--as long as you stop before S4.
There was no "original plan". This is not a secret, the writers have freely admitted this. So no, there was no plan for it to be purgatory. There was no plan for it to be anything. What you see in the pilot is what you get, that's as much as the writers knew as well. Then they started making stuff up, and come up with the HATCH. What's in the hatch? They had no idea. Until they wrote what was in the hatch. And Eko died because the actor wanted to leave, the writers actually wanted to keep him alive.
Despite its very... prominent... problems, lost is easily one of my favorite shows ever. Maybe its living in Hawaii, where so many filming locations are places I've grown up around, but the show just captures something so special. From the characters, to the story, to the music. God, the music is special. I recently went to see the Hawaii Symphony Orchestra perform the music from lost, with the composer Michael Giaccino guest composing. There were some cast members there as well: Kate and Desmond. Such a special experience overall.
Lost is my favourite TV show, and I have no problem with saying there are legitimate flaws and problems with it. But when it's on, nearly nothing else comes close. I can't say I 100% agree with how every scene has been presented here and obviously have arrived at different enjoyment, but different taste keeps things interesting. Love the video!
I agree that LOST would be a much better show with a lot fewer episodes, and that’s exactly what the show’s creators thought too. It was a constant battle with the network who wanted to keep their cash cow alive, and the characters in particular suffered as a result because the show’s format only left room for so much relevant and interesting backstory.
It's the idea of coming full circle. The end echoes the beginning. Everything we saw was purgatory and here is the truth: the beach is dead and deserted. I didn't need that last scene, I already believed, and still do, that everyone died in the crash. But it merely was another data point in that theory.
@@douglasdea637 Why would you believe that they died in the crash? That's absurd. If you seriously believe that... what about Jacob? Ben? Richard? Juliet? Penny? They weren't on the plane.
@@kuhpunkt Yes. The wreckage was too extensive for survivors. Purgatory is purgatory. God or the gods can make whatever rules they want. More people can be added at any time or for any reason.
@@kuhpunkt It’s actually meant to imply a timeline split: the bomb both did and didnt change the past. But actually ‘Dead is Dead’ and you cant change the past, therefore the bomb plot was always meant to occur as fated. And then they used that implied timeline split to sneak in the purgatory flashforwards.
Minor correction: Jacob didn't make the purgatory. As Christian says in the church at the end "this is a place that you all made together so that you could find one another".
More Daniel Greene Lost content. Please and thank you. For reals though, this was a good dive into the show, but there’s so much more than can be studied from a writing perspective. Would love to see you do more on it!
I like to think of Game of Thrones as "The 'Lost' of the 2010s". Both shows had a huge pop cultural impact, becoming household names. Both had endings that didn't quite match the expectations they set out. Similarly, actors that you'd think would have much bigger profiles thanks to their exposure from being on the show, didn't really get that bump. Actors still get work, but not the bump you'd think. For example, the highest profile of the Lost alumni would be Kate's actress who plays the Wasp in the Antman series. Weirdly, the highest profile bumps from Game of Thrones were Khal Drogo's Jason Mamoa, and Oberyn Martell's Pedro Pascal, both of which only appeared for about a season each, not even cast regulars. It's even more pronounced for people who got praised for their acting on each show and didn't get a profile bump. 5-6 years ago I'd have sworn that Jaime Lannister's Niolaj Coster-Waldau would be the lead in a big movie or at least a big TV show of his own. Maisie Williams and Peter Dinklage - all praised highly, bo big profile bump. In retrospect, Lost, as a piece of entertainment has actually aged better as a property than Game of Thrones despite it ending 15 years ago! I could see myself doing a Lost rewatch one day. I can't say that for Game of Thrones, sadly.
"The show had potential" is my entire fantasy about loving Lost. I'm a everything is a metaphor for something far beyond our scope to understand fan. The trees are real. The forest is our interpretation of many trees so that we are not overwhelmed by how each tree is its own thing. Ben is my favorite character because he should have been killed repeatedly... but he is clever and lucky enough to not be.
Lost is a show I love solely for the insightful character moments and arcs, the actual plot and lore is pretty irrelevant to me because it gets nonsensical to me
Have you heard of From? It shares some producers/writers with Lost and has a similar vibe, but it's horror fantasy and so far seems more planned and solid. Three seasons and going strong tbh.
Lifelong Lynch fan here with multiple tattoos from his works. I got the news shortly seeing this video, and my heart is absolutely broken. I knew this day would come, but god damn it sucks.
I remember sneaking out of my bedroom as a child to watch the pilot without my parents knowing, and I was so scared- I honestly thought Hurley was right, and that there really was a dinosaur on the island.
I never watched Lost, but I tried to once. Two of the writers of show Adam Horowitz and Eddie Kitsis were head writers of a show, Once Upon a Time, I enjoyed in the beginning, but it went off the rails to me later..
I watched Once because of those two writers coming from Lost. It was good for a while but I got bored somewhere in S5 i think. It didn't work for me the way Lost did
I was glued to the screen when I first started watching Lost. I forget exactly where, somewhere miday 3rd or 4th season, I *finally* realized "Oh crap,, there is no plan or actual story here, they are just throwing everything at the wall and leaving it to future writers to figure out the complete mess.". stopped watching immediately, and was very agry about the hours I had wasted on this.
As a huge fan of LOST I really appreciate this video. I 100% agree with pretty much all of your troubles with the show. On the other hand... I'm kind of like "oh well, what a fun ride!" Cant wait for season 3 of WoT. Love your channel!
IIRC the producers claimed footage of the empty beach was shown in the Finale because ABC wanted to show some unused footage over the credits as a a televised special feature but the only unused footage they had available was stock footage of the crash site
You know, Lost that is one of those modern TV experiences. I didn't watch the entire series. I stopped watching it at some point and tired to jump back and I failed to even beginning to understand what was going on. My biggest memory of the show was the fact they had those recap specials before the show would start at the premiere and mid-season premier so you wouldn't get lost while watching Lost. Viewers still got lost. I was one of many who gave up on the show and people who still watched it always understood. Lost is that prime storytelling example of adding in too much causes you to lose your vision.
I remember after a few seasons it started losing a bunch of viewers because it didn’t seem to know where it was going and just treading water. It got so bad they had to eventually reassure fans they had a plan and eventually lay out how long it would be.
The issue there was the network. In the middle of season 2 they knew they had to start working towards the endgame. They had a solid idea of where it was going to go, but the network wouldn't let them end it. From the networks perspective (ABC) they had a massive hit show, so why the heck would want to end it? No one did that. The networks historically milked a show for as long as possible and then when the numbers got really low they would either cancel it or give it a final season. The LOST showrunners wanted to end it in two more seasons (so 4 total). The network said no way. The showrunners said fine, we'll do one more season and then we quit. During the 3rd season the flashbacks started getting stupid. There were a couple of stinker episodes. Main characters were locked in cages and the story kind of ground to halt. And their viewership numbers started to dip. ABC came back to the table to negotiate an ending. Showrunners wanted one more season to end it (making it 4 total). The network said we were thinking more like 10 seasons total. They finally agreed on 6 seasons and the story started moving again.
The numbers were definitely the biggest disappointment of the show. I think there were actually fan theories that were so smart that could blow everyone's minds but the writers went for the laziest shrug-off ever.
I got you. The numbers are a sign that there is a pattern in the chaos. Life is not random and everything is part of an intentional sequence of events...it's basically the force. In Lost, the light at the heart of the Island is the source of that intention...When you see the numbers, you know the source is at work. If the source is present anywhere the numbers are present, that means that the numbers have power. Hurley unknowingly uses the numbers and unlocks the source within him making him "special". He begins bending causality around him much like the source does. This is not a curse, it is Hurley having power combined with low self- esteem. He's doing it to himself subconsciously. The creators of the Dharma Initiative understood that they had power and built the DI to study that. They tracked the power to the island, so that's why they were there. They built the radio tower that broadcasted the numbers to their HQ in Michigan. If the numbers in the broadcast ever changed, that would notify HQ that they had discovered a way to manipulate that power. Stuart Radzinsky designed the hatch and he was obsessed with the DI's sacred purpose of studying the numbers, so he put it on the hatch and the computer. Ultimately, the candidates represented the numbers because that was the source's plan... because there was always a pattern in the chaos. This makes the most sense as the writers' intentions as they always referred to it as basically being "the force" but without the midichlorians explanation.
Loved so much of this show when it aired, followed all the extra mythology bits online, traded theories about everything, and then hated the resolution of the sideways stuff so much… ugh. Such a roller coaster
If the man in black can mimic dead people who have died on the island, then how was able to transform into Walt? he's not dead or on the island anymore
Pretty good video, always love to see new discussions of Lost. Though I will say at 11:09 when you compare the show to Twist Peaks and how that shows focus on characters rather than answers felt justified due to its theme. Lost’s thematic idea and focus on its characters is right there in the name, the characters ARE lost. The island is the vehicle to allow these metaphorically lost people to find themselves. The writers have gone on record numerous times discussing this as the core principle of the show. I actually think Lost is very comparable to Twin Peaks in that regard. Though I will admit that Lost’s sci-fi leanings and mystery box illusions do put focus on getting real ‘answers’ far more than the mysteries of David Lynch’s own show where they were mostly ignored on purpose.
I imagine that listening to Daniel explain the ending of Lost when you have never seen an episode of Lost, is similar to doing m-th (insert an e or an a at your own leisure, both work)
Thanks for watching this. I always avoided Lost and similar "cliffhanger" shows because it gets frustrating ending each episode more *lost* then you started.
Having never seen Lost but having seen Once Upon a Time (same writers), I can see a lot of the same DNA from several things you discussed here. Another show that has a lot of potential to be genuinely good but kind of gets "lost" in itself. Messy yet compelling
26:47 oh the irony that these folks also made Once Upon A Time, took Claire with them, and then gave her a baby storyline there too… 😅and that show is also crazy convoluted too lol
34:44 - A much shorter series was what the creators wanted. The executives saw the success of the show and insisted on extending the series. This accounts for a lot of what you criticize - originally, the show neve was supposed to run as long as it did. For me, I forgive a lot, because, all the way through, individual episodes would play out some compelling and empathetic stories: "Ab Aeterno" (sp), a late episode for Richard is a standout. The tragedy that is Locke's character, ultimately one of the most complete victims of his own fallacies and longings, hits hard for me. But of course you cannot, cannot lose an actor of O'Quinn's character, so the writers "cheat". I understand: Any scene with Ben and Locke going at each other is worth the price of admission: O'Quinn and Emerson are both the sorts of actors who feed energy to their scene partners, who get better simply by acting with them. When you get two powerhouses exchanging between them, it's just heaven to watch. I think Fox became a better actor because his character spent so much time with O'Quinn. O'Quinn is a major asset, and you need him. So while it makes sense to lose Locke when we do, it makes practical sense that we don't lose him.
i personally think the numbers, while a representation of each of jacobs potential replacements(cause of flight seat numbers apparently) and also a curse. That they more so represent fate in a way? jacob knows which seats his candidates will be on,so he uses those numbers to make things happen as the way they should. hurley hears the numbers, uses them, gets rich and flys on the plane that crashes. Plus the bunker explodes sending people back in time because no one entered the numbers. Bad things sure, but things that are meant to happen.
I’ve never watched Lost in my life, but I just wanted to say I absolutely love the way you censor curse words with the Dune Sardaukar throat singing 😂😂😂
Just "Let It Go" Jack. Season 1 "NO!" Season 2 "NOO!" Season 3 "NOOO!" Season 4 "NOOOO!" Season 5 NOOOOO!" Season 6 NOOOOO... Oh, there you are dad. Ok, I'll finally sing that Frozen song." On a separate note, LOST does have arguably the best TV soundtrack ever made.
Science fiction, my ass! They pretended to be a sci-fi show for 5 seasons and then genre hopped, the bastards! “Psych! We’re fantasy!” I thought they were taking Desmond down the path of Neal Stephenson’s Anathem. *insert frustrated growls here.
Sorry for the lack of book reviews so far this year. I am BINGING The Dandelion Dynasty for a series review which is taking some time. Should be out next week!
Didn't know I'd be releasing this the day David Lynch died, but as I said in the video, Twin Peaks is incredible and well worth a watch. If you haven't watched it, please do. Keep your eye on the donut and not on the hole.
@@DanielGreeneReviews ummm daniel why is this video mostly about you not understanding mysteries? And from that also the themes ?
how's the arm? I must have missed something.
@@leostarrs-cunningham8576 (fractured, falling down the stairs) And it's healing nicely!!
No, no. This was great. I had a blast with this video. Loved the deep dive, and mixed emotions.
Started Twin Peaks literally the night before he died. Crazy. I'm loving it though. RIP to a great one.
The show about a plane crash having the best pilot. The irony
Didn't even realize that 😂
The fact I missed this 10/10 joke will haunt me forever.
@@DanielGreeneReviewsthe irony was Lost on you
@@gezab2611 how is the first time I’ve heard of this?
@@DanielGreeneReviews I always thought that the fact the show starts with a two-part episode titled Pilot was a play on words, being both a pilot for the show and having JJ Abrams's friend Greg Grunberg play the pilot of the airplane.
I just want to say. I've never watched Lost, I don't know a single thing about Lost or the characters. I REALLY enjoyed this video, Daniel! Great Job!
Watch it tek!
I actually highly recommend atleast the first season
Yooooo I remember watching your bleach stuff in high school lol glad your still around gonna check your channel after this
Ayoo Tekking In here
First 3 seasons Solid 9/10 Last 3 seasons 3.5 - 10. they failed to execute and ended up stuck is kind of how it felt.
The thing with mystery boxes is that the author NEEDS to know what's inside if the box becomes a focal point.
JJ Abrams even wanted the hatch to be in the pilot, but head writer Damon Lindelof insisted they know what was in it first. To their credit that was usually the show's philosophy.
@YoyMcFroy yeah they're more or less had everything figured out before season 2. And it's all connected to the hatch
And it can't be changed just because fans theorized the truth. Not sure if Lost went that route, since I barely remember this show back when it was aired. I watched an episode here and there only. But so many shows with an interesting mystery dropped the ball because the producers or something panicked when fan theories figured out the mystery(not that said fans had any way to actually confirm it), and the show felt they couldn't allow that to happen. So they changed the answer to the mystery. Which fucks it up, because now we get lots of plot holes. Almost like it became a point of pride to make sure NOBODY could see it coming. By constantly changing it.
They did say that the mystery surrounding Raymond in The Blacklist was decided from the start. And that they wouldn't change it even if fans figured it out. They specifically pointed that out, because it's so prevalent in shows like this for the writers to just change the answers based on fan theories and how close they are getting to what they originally planned. Honestly not sure if they stuck to that or not. Haven't watched the final season yet. But considering the various shit that happened, covid and so on. I wouldn't be surprised if they changed shit there too.
@@kopicat2429 There's a weird desire some writers have to have a victory over the audience by coming up with an ending they didn't see coming. They need to step back and say "why?" Why is it so important to surprise people? What do you gain from it? What do they gain from it? What does the STORY gain from it? That's the problem, they want to have a twist for the sake of it.
@@kopicat2429 Lost didn't go that route. People just constantly accuse them of that.
Lost does what it says on the tin, it leaves you feeling more lost than the characters are.
I thought that too, and that was hilarious! A joke on us, right up-front! LOST! Perfect!
For anyone who has like 20+ hours to spare and wants a deep dive into the story of Lost, I would recommend the series of long form deep dive videos done by Billiam. He goes into a lot of the behind the scenes of why the creators made the decisions they did and it's a pretty good watch
Agreed. I also recommend Choekaas. He is constantly pumping out excellent LOST content. The level of detail he gets to is pretty nuts.
Yeah billiams reviews for lost are awesome
I highly recommend Billiam's MASSIVE retrospective series on Lost. Gave me a new appreciation for the show while explaining how its development led to some of its flaws.
LOST will always have a special place in my heart, and is to me a flawed masterpiece. There are a lot of issues with the characters and the story but the highs are so high. It also was something that I looked forward to every week, going downstairs and watching the new episode with my mom, then listening to this awesome theory podcast about the episodes. I lost my mom about 10 years ago, and LOST will always be a strong connection point to her. Charlie and Jin are the freaking best.
That sums it up right there! It's to me the most memorable show of all time along with Buffy and Angel
@@SS-rr7byBuffy and Lost are my earliest tv obsessions. Both have flaws, but I'll always remember the incredible highs
Yes! This! It brought us together in a way that doesn't exist anymore.
I was *obsessed* with LOST when it originally aired, to the point that I was on fan theory forums, listening to weekly fan podcasts, etc. About halfway through the series, I was doing some freelance work for someone connected to the show (writers’ room) & was basically told flat-out that they’re making it up as they go & had no over all plan. That really took the wind out of my sails for the last few seasons… So yeah… Definitely a ridiculous, nonsensical show when all is said and done, but it had some GREAT moments & characters, and it was a defining experience in its time. Thanks for making this great video! It’s fun to remember the LOST days. ❤
But that's not really true... and even if it were, why would that be relevant?
While I don't disagree with a lot of your points, LOST will always be like The Dark Tower to me in that it completely lost its way and botched the final act...but it's still one of my 5 favorite Fantasy series ever. The formula LOST created is still being copied today. Big recommend to FROM on MGM+.
Published author Daniel B Greene: titles his TH-cam video “Lost is AN mess”
Beat me to it😂
Thankfully editing and revision exists to catch and correct typos and simple mistakes.
Top gear’s Jeramy Clarkson has conditioned me to read this mistake as normal
"Think about this, whats the most exciting thing that can happen on TV, movies, or in real life. Somebody has a gun." Michael Scott
Lol, I thought about this quote as soon as he brought it up too!
Lost is one of those shows that was all about the ride. Going back years later and watching it, all of your points are totally valid. But it is still probably the most fun I've ever had watching a show. Particularly S2-S3 era, pre writers strike, where we all still had faith there WERE answers and everything was going somewhere. There was enough crazy shit happening that no theory was too outlandish and you could talk and think about it for hours. It was one of those cultural phenomena that bonded people with nothing else in common together because we all just needed SOMEBODY to hear us out, because this time we DEFINITELY knew what was going on 😂 It did not pay off its promises and is flawed in countless ways, but damn if you were there watching at the time it was such a great experience.
WE HAVE TO GO BACK, KATE!
s tier plot reveal. I remember watching that the first time and being utterly gobsmacked
One of the most memorable tv moments in my life.
Yeah it even made up for that terrible fake beard
I loved the exploring of human psychology in the first seasons
Later on a lot of times i just felt like "why tho?"
A lot of things are left unanswered which really bothered me at the time but after all it´s still a blast through the whole series
I think basically any question you could reasonably ask *was* answered though. Sure, some of them the answer boil down to "the island has magical properties" but just about everything was in fact explained.
Why do you need everything answered? Its like the Sopranos cut to black. Not knowing is often good. Lost was never a show about the island but about the characters on the island.
Why tho?
Because it's fun!
@@robertJ14 I wouldn't call that a good comparison. The Sopranos ending leaves us with questions about what the future has in store for the characters considering the choices they've made over the series. Lost's ending leaves us with questions about the fundamental rules of the world the characters inhabit, which could be fine, but that's a hard sell when the series was mostly sold as a mystery to untangle.
If you give someone a murder mystery, for example, then end the book without satisfactorily explaining who the murderer was and how the murder was committed, a sizeable portion of your audience is going to be (quite understandably) annoyed at the unanswered questions regardless of how much they love the characters in the story.
Who else heard the words "fled across the desert" after every mention of the man in black? Just me? 😂
The writer's strike in like 06-07 was super impactful to the show too. I still love the show, flaws and all.
Came here to say this that strike blasted the plot of this show haha
That strike ruined Heroes. At least we got one good season.
It's actually bewildering to me how he didn't even mention this. Half way through making season 4 they literally got all new writers because of it. If this never happened a lot more things most likely would've gotten explained.
@@evan7221 They didn't get new writers because of it. Why do people keep saying that?
The strike didn't have much of an impact on the show.
Lost feels like one of those DND campaigns that end up running for years, so by the end you have a cluster of random plotlines that only sort of come together, and it sort of just becomes the DM throwing in whatever cool idea they while prepping without really think how this ties together long term.
As soon as the old guy could walk I knew it wasn't Sci-Fi and was a giant metaphor.
For what? Good question!
I can answer that, although I think it's a bullshit answer.
I read somewhere that the show is about a group of people who are all lost in life, hence why they all end up on the same island...
A group of people lost in their personal lives end up lost together on an island...
It's a great binge, it starts well. Absolutely amazing review. Embracing the inaccuracy is part of the enjoyment.
I think the point of the characters all coming unglued is the Island just F's you up. Claire becomes Danielle Russou. Shes left by herself and lost her child. Just like Danielle. So in the later story shes just like her. Violent, untrusting, crazy obsessed with her missing child. This is exactly Danielle when they meet her.
I'll never get over Sayid going back to being the torturer he was, and then seeing a girl he had like a long weekend relationship with, and then being "Oh yeah, I'm good. I'm ready to move on. I've conquered my demons." Screw you show.
@@sandbun7348 the treatment of Sayid in that season where they go back in time (4?5?) is where I dropped the show. Did not make sense. He was my favorite character for a ton of reasons and like they gathered all of those reasons together and set them on fire.
The true evidence of the bizarre brilliance of LOST, like Twin Peaks, is that we still talk about it after all this time.
Honestly, great counter point. It’s certainly not forgettable and what they do manage to land is impressive.
People still talk about Hitler.
It lost it's way because it had no over-arching plot. They ended up just making it up as they go, and so utterly screwed it up. This happens so often with good shows, and it's a shame.
Lists a dozen themes, "but that's not themes! That's vague!" Fate, destiny, human agency in an ambiguous world are the precise themes of the show and it develops and capitalizes on them through out. The show was meticulous, on a whole lot of levels, including in its ending -- and it was certainly more satisfying in its delivery than Twin Peaks prior to The Return (Or what? What? Are we all going to forget just how reviled the back half of Twin Peaks was for decades? Really? To compare it to Lost's ending favorably? Get real). This is not a good argument.
I appreciate the video, but did not appreciate that comment.
Also the DHARMA initiative had no need to be influenced by the Smoke Monster to be so openly unhinged. It's set in 1974-1977. This was the era when your professional scientist types would fill a house with water, bring in a dolphin, give everyone LSD, and write notes on the experience for everyone (THIS ACTUALLY HAPPENED). This was the era when the CIA would bring in psychics to do remote viewing experiments (THIS ACTUALLY HAPPENED). Not to mention, this was an isolated island in the south pacific, already remote, doubled up with the fact that it moves on top of that, and the DHARMA initiative film reels were meant to be kept in house and explicitly secret, their behavior makes perfect sense for the academics of that period.
My problem with a lot of the critiques of LOST is that many viewer complaints like "vague" are just an excuse for not having everything spoonfed to them. The show sets up plenty of context for the content it shows you to make perfect sense. Is it all explicitly "explained"? No. It is a poor show that exposits itself constantly, though. You are actually supposed to think about the implications, rather than just go "oh that doesn't make sense." It does make sense. You just didn't think enough.
Your critique of character behaviors is much better though. Jack is so fucking crazy lmao
Its worth nothing that The Constant, on its own, is one of the best episodes of TV ever.
This always gave me the impression they were making it up as they went along. It held together to about season 4 then completely fell apart.
This is funny to me because my favorite season of television is season 5 of LOST.
Also, fun fact. Just about all TV shows are made up as they go along.
"This always gave me the impression they were making it up as they went along."
What is that supposed to mean?
@@kuhpunkt That the writers didn't know how the main story and all the side plotlines and mysteries were going to end when they came up with them. Which is most likely true since the writers didn't know how long the show was going to go for until they were informed. I think it was around season 3 or 4.
The thing is, I thought the show got worse AFTER they officially announced when it was going to end. It's like not having a clear idea of where things were heading was better for them creatively.
@@Tatertot01 But how did they give that impression? This constant focus on "making it up as you go along" is so absurd and weird.
LOST was the first fandom I went 120% percent for. I spent probably weeks of my life posting theories on the old show forum, "The Fuselage," trying to guess what explaination the writers would use to piece everything together. I was completely let down by the show's finale and the "answers" it presented. My husband likes to joke that I will die mad about how LOST ended. Goddamn right I will! 😂
Thank you for this video, Daniel. You give an excellent analysis of WHY the show was so confusing and, ultimately, dissapointing. I really enjoyed your take on LOST, and not just because you validated my hours of ranting about this show. Keep up the great work!
A JJ Abrams project with weird writing and a "bad" ending? i'm shocked.
JJ was only involved with the pilot episode. After that he was off to direct Mission Impossible.
@@troubleondemand7703 It's still largely his fault. He set up the mystery without knowing the answer then let someone else take the blunt of the criticism.
@@BP-dn9nv I am not a JJ stan or anything but that is literally what he was hired to do by Loyd Braun who was running ABC at the time. Loyd gave JJ a script that was written by Jeffrey Lieber. He hired JJ who brough in Lindelof to help him fix it up.
Neither JJ nor Lindelof thought the show was going to get picked up. JJ was going on to direct Mission Impossible and Damon was already writing on another show.
@@BP-dn9nv What mystery did he set up then?
@BP-dn9nv can't say I agree, most of the shows mythology was built out AFTER the pilot
I'm always really impressed with your larger television and movie reviews. You make some great points.
I love LOST but it was sad to see the entire series become "Bang bang Gun adventures" after a while. It felt like every problem was solved with guns. The first season was great with this, as there were a limited amount of them but it quickly came to a point where the characters looked like soldiers in a war movie
I had to rewind the entire video because I was thinking aboout how blue Daniel's eyes are that I wasn't even paying attention
"Let's get into the magic pool" Daniel Greene sums up the 1985 Cocoon while attempting to sum up Lost.
During the baby montage I was half expecting a cut to Rich Evans’ “I’m giving it to The Baby.”
When it first aired, I did make notes. When the numbers weren't entered in time and the hieroglyphs came up, I copied them down, then tried to figure out what they meant. I loved this series--until they turned a magic wheel. And by the ending, I felt betrayed. A 10/10 show in the first two seasons became a 1/10 show.
I don't think it was how fast you view it. As someone who loved the show and has defended the ending from years. Many people just lost the thread of what was actually happening especially in the last 2 seasons.
Now I just want to watch this again with my eyes to bring back the original joy I had
Lost is a mess because they needed to have 20+ bloated episodes per season, while the story would have benefited from the modern standard: 8 condensed episodes per season.
Agree, although I would bump the number up to 10 or 12. There's a lot of that. L. Ron Hubbard wrote Mission Earth because he wanted a 10 book series. Something not seen in sci-fi/fantasy before. Well, okay, but there's a lot of fat in it. Mission Earth could easily have been edited down to 6 or 7 books.
I think 12/13 would have been better like the Sopranos. I dont like the modern format of 8 episodes every 2 years. Yeah its a tight concise story but leaves no room for experimentation and risk taking. Like Sopranos season 5 if on Netflix in 2023 would have been 6-8 episodes with the Test Dream cut out
Besides all the unfulfilled story lines my biggest problem with Lost has always been why does a plane flying from Sydney to LA only have one Australian passenger?
Most self respecting aussies want nothing to do with LA
About 240 people died in the crash. Bunch of them could have been Australian.
It was water cooler talk every week for the first few seasons, but it's continuous mystery boxes began to fall apart and not make sense.
Lost felt like a show where they wrote every episode after checking twitter reviews for the last episode.
Things you said that I disagree with:
- Jacks arc was problematic
- Hurleys arc was problematic
- Sayid's progress was ignored
- The numbers have an unsatisfactory answer
- The DI doesnt make sense.
- The flash sideways had little to do with what was initially setup.
This is actually a pretty well balanced review though. I appreciate you giving credit where credit is due. Lost isnt for everyone and its definitely a flawed show. But it gets a lot of unreasonable shit from people. Its nice to see some reasonable criticisms while setting the record straight on a lot of the unreasonable criticisms. I was afraid it was gonna be more hate spewing like Velodus did back in tbe day 😂
Damon Lindelof had a pretty illuminating interview a few years ago where he said that the network wouldn’t even let them start a conversation about when the show would end until season 3, which is why it spun its wheels and introduced SO many mysteries. I think Lost ultimately suffers from being the first show of its kind that told an overarching narrative instead of an episodic one.
It's not the first though. Go watch Babylon 5.
I think another big reason that Kate didn’t want to “reset” everything with the bomb was because she knew if it worked, she would just be going to jail once the plane landed. That’s why she was on the plane in the first place.
The problem with Lost is you can’t write a mystery show where the writers have no idea who the killer is.
I was slow to get into Lost and then fast to abandon it. I didn't vibe with the forced mystery that was dragged out; I just couldn't take it, and I didn't love any of the characters. Plus, I was watching Stargate SG-1, and man, that show was soo much better. It gave me warm and fuzzy feelings, and I couldn't stop watching and rewatching episodes.
Started rewatching the show last month because I found out my husband never saw the last three seasons (which is a crime imo). My favorite show, up there with Fringe. Amazing character study.
Lost will always have a special place in my heart, despite its flaws. For me, watching it as it came out, it was the first time I had a show to discuss with everyone the next day at work (at least in the beginning). I remember listening to a specific radio show the morning after because they would talk about it, reading online forums & everyone trying to figure out what was going on. It was so much fun. That season 2 opening will always be one of my favorites.
I watched lost when it was still airing. That was over a decade ago, and i'm still not over it. Its a life-changing show
Watched this when it aired week-to-week, again on DVD with my wife years later, and now about halfway through streaming it with our kids. I am all-but-certain that the purgatory theory was the original plan. Somewhere around the end of S3 the producers got nervous that so many fans had caught on to the big "final reveal," and demanded the writers go back to the drawing board to come up with a new ending. For just one example: Eko's death is so poignant and satisfying if you interpret it as him "earning" his final destination in his scene with the monster when he accepts and forgives himself for his life choices. Lots more examples of how well it fits--as long as you stop before S4.
There was no "original plan". This is not a secret, the writers have freely admitted this. So no, there was no plan for it to be purgatory. There was no plan for it to be anything. What you see in the pilot is what you get, that's as much as the writers knew as well. Then they started making stuff up, and come up with the HATCH. What's in the hatch? They had no idea. Until they wrote what was in the hatch. And Eko died because the actor wanted to leave, the writers actually wanted to keep him alive.
Despite its very... prominent... problems, lost is easily one of my favorite shows ever. Maybe its living in Hawaii, where so many filming locations are places I've grown up around, but the show just captures something so special. From the characters, to the story, to the music. God, the music is special. I recently went to see the Hawaii Symphony Orchestra perform the music from lost, with the composer Michael Giaccino guest composing. There were some cast members there as well: Kate and Desmond. Such a special experience overall.
Lost is my favourite TV show, and I have no problem with saying there are legitimate flaws and problems with it. But when it's on, nearly nothing else comes close. I can't say I 100% agree with how every scene has been presented here and obviously have arrived at different enjoyment, but different taste keeps things interesting. Love the video!
12:38 I could ask the same question about the Wheel of Time.
I agree that LOST would be a much better show with a lot fewer episodes, and that’s exactly what the show’s creators thought too. It was a constant battle with the network who wanted to keep their cash cow alive, and the characters in particular suffered as a result because the show’s format only left room for so much relevant and interesting backstory.
Loved this video man!
Just curious how the footage of the wreck during the credits implies that they were dead the whole time.
It's the idea of coming full circle. The end echoes the beginning. Everything we saw was purgatory and here is the truth: the beach is dead and deserted.
I didn't need that last scene, I already believed, and still do, that everyone died in the crash. But it merely was another data point in that theory.
@@douglasdea637 Why would you believe that they died in the crash? That's absurd.
If you seriously believe that... what about Jacob? Ben? Richard? Juliet? Penny? They weren't on the plane.
@@kuhpunkt
Yes. The wreckage was too extensive for survivors.
Purgatory is purgatory. God or the gods can make whatever rules they want. More people can be added at any time or for any reason.
@@douglasdea637 So how did Ben die? How did Richard die? How did Penny die? She was never even on the island.
@@kuhpunkt It’s actually meant to imply a timeline split: the bomb both did and didnt change the past. But actually ‘Dead is Dead’ and you cant change the past, therefore the bomb plot was always meant to occur as fated. And then they used that implied timeline split to sneak in the purgatory flashforwards.
Minor correction: Jacob didn't make the purgatory. As Christian says in the church at the end "this is a place that you all made together so that you could find one another".
More Daniel Greene Lost content. Please and thank you.
For reals though, this was a good dive into the show, but there’s so much more than can be studied from a writing perspective. Would love to see you do more on it!
I like to think of Game of Thrones as "The 'Lost' of the 2010s". Both shows had a huge pop cultural impact, becoming household names. Both had endings that didn't quite match the expectations they set out. Similarly, actors that you'd think would have much bigger profiles thanks to their exposure from being on the show, didn't really get that bump. Actors still get work, but not the bump you'd think. For example, the highest profile of the Lost alumni would be Kate's actress who plays the Wasp in the Antman series. Weirdly, the highest profile bumps from Game of Thrones were Khal Drogo's Jason Mamoa, and Oberyn Martell's Pedro Pascal, both of which only appeared for about a season each, not even cast regulars. It's even more pronounced for people who got praised for their acting on each show and didn't get a profile bump. 5-6 years ago I'd have sworn that Jaime Lannister's Niolaj Coster-Waldau would be the lead in a big movie or at least a big TV show of his own. Maisie Williams and Peter Dinklage - all praised highly, bo big profile bump. In retrospect, Lost, as a piece of entertainment has actually aged better as a property than Game of Thrones despite it ending 15 years ago! I could see myself doing a Lost rewatch one day. I can't say that for Game of Thrones, sadly.
"The show had potential" is my entire fantasy about loving Lost. I'm a everything is a metaphor for something far beyond our scope to understand fan. The trees are real. The forest is our interpretation of many trees so that we are not overwhelmed by how each tree is its own thing. Ben is my favorite character because he should have been killed repeatedly... but he is clever and lucky enough to not be.
Lost is a show I love solely for the insightful character moments and arcs, the actual plot and lore is pretty irrelevant to me because it gets nonsensical to me
This is a really good analysis of Lost. I still like Lost but now I'm going to save this analysis and rewatch this after I binge Lost again
Why no "Remembrance of Earth's Past"?
TH-camrs rambling about series/books/ movies I vaguely know is my favourite type of content
Lost is just how you feel after watching it.
Have you heard of From? It shares some producers/writers with Lost and has a similar vibe, but it's horror fantasy and so far seems more planned and solid.
Three seasons and going strong tbh.
Brilliant show. I almost got off after the near cannibal craving thing, but that ending was something.😅😢
10:55 literally just got the notification that David Lynch passed as I watched this video. Spoopy.
Lifelong Lynch fan here with multiple tattoos from his works. I got the news shortly seeing this video, and my heart is absolutely broken. I knew this day would come, but god damn it sucks.
you missed the point of the show. It's about characters who are LOST within themselves. The questions aren't relevant
I remember sneaking out of my bedroom as a child to watch the pilot without my parents knowing, and I was so scared- I honestly thought Hurley was right, and that there really was a dinosaur on the island.
I never watched Lost, but I tried to once. Two of the writers of show Adam Horowitz and Eddie Kitsis were head writers of a show, Once Upon a Time, I enjoyed in the beginning, but it went off the rails to me later..
I watched Once because of those two writers coming from Lost. It was good for a while but I got bored somewhere in S5 i think. It didn't work for me the way Lost did
I was glued to the screen when I first started watching Lost. I forget exactly where, somewhere miday 3rd or 4th season, I *finally* realized "Oh crap,, there is no plan or actual story here, they are just throwing everything at the wall and leaving it to future writers to figure out the complete mess.". stopped watching immediately, and was very agry about the hours I had wasted on this.
How did you realize that? Because they had a plan and there was a story and they didn't leave it to future writers.
As a huge fan of LOST I really appreciate this video. I 100% agree with pretty much all of your troubles with the show. On the other hand... I'm kind of like "oh well, what a fun ride!"
Cant wait for season 3 of WoT. Love your channel!
I have had to explain this too many times. You did a great job. Cool video.
IIRC the producers claimed footage of the empty beach was shown in the Finale because ABC wanted to show some unused footage over the credits as a a televised special feature but the only unused footage they had available was stock footage of the crash site
You know, Lost that is one of those modern TV experiences. I didn't watch the entire series. I stopped watching it at some point and tired to jump back and I failed to even beginning to understand what was going on. My biggest memory of the show was the fact they had those recap specials before the show would start at the premiere and mid-season premier so you wouldn't get lost while watching Lost. Viewers still got lost. I was one of many who gave up on the show and people who still watched it always understood.
Lost is that prime storytelling example of adding in too much causes you to lose your vision.
I remember after a few seasons it started losing a bunch of viewers because it didn’t seem to know where it was going and just treading water.
It got so bad they had to eventually reassure fans they had a plan and eventually lay out how long it would be.
The issue there was the network. In the middle of season 2 they knew they had to start working towards the endgame. They had a solid idea of where it was going to go, but the network wouldn't let them end it. From the networks perspective (ABC) they had a massive hit show, so why the heck would want to end it? No one did that. The networks historically milked a show for as long as possible and then when the numbers got really low they would either cancel it or give it a final season.
The LOST showrunners wanted to end it in two more seasons (so 4 total). The network said no way. The showrunners said fine, we'll do one more season and then we quit. During the 3rd season the flashbacks started getting stupid. There were a couple of stinker episodes. Main characters were locked in cages and the story kind of ground to halt. And their viewership numbers started to dip.
ABC came back to the table to negotiate an ending. Showrunners wanted one more season to end it (making it 4 total). The network said we were thinking more like 10 seasons total. They finally agreed on 6 seasons and the story started moving again.
I love the quote of them saying that after they jumped the shark the first time it became a running joke of how many times they could do it for fun.
The numbers were definitely the biggest disappointment of the show. I think there were actually fan theories that were so smart that could blow everyone's minds but the writers went for the laziest shrug-off ever.
I got you.
The numbers are a sign that there is a pattern in the chaos. Life is not random and everything is part of an intentional sequence of events...it's basically the force. In Lost, the light at the heart of the Island is the source of that intention...When you see the numbers, you know the source is at work.
If the source is present anywhere the numbers are present, that means that the numbers have power. Hurley unknowingly uses the numbers and unlocks the source within him making him "special". He begins bending causality around him much like the source does. This is not a curse, it is Hurley having power combined with low self- esteem. He's doing it to himself subconsciously.
The creators of the Dharma Initiative understood that they had power and built the DI to study that. They tracked the power to the island, so that's why they were there. They built the radio tower that broadcasted the numbers to their HQ in Michigan. If the numbers in the broadcast ever changed, that would notify HQ that they had discovered a way to manipulate that power. Stuart Radzinsky designed the hatch and he was obsessed with the DI's sacred purpose of studying the numbers, so he put it on the hatch and the computer.
Ultimately, the candidates represented the numbers because that was the source's plan... because there was always a pattern in the chaos.
This makes the most sense as the writers' intentions as they always referred to it as basically being "the force" but without the midichlorians explanation.
Loved so much of this show when it aired, followed all the extra mythology bits online, traded theories about everything, and then hated the resolution of the sideways stuff so much… ugh. Such a roller coaster
If the man in black can mimic dead people who have died on the island, then how was able to transform into Walt? he's not dead or on the island anymore
Man in Black was never Walt. Walt had special powers and could always do weird stuff.
Oh man, the drop of that title screen just took me back.
Pretty good video, always love to see new discussions of Lost.
Though I will say at 11:09 when you compare the show to Twist Peaks and how that shows focus on characters rather than answers felt justified due to its theme. Lost’s thematic idea and focus on its characters is right there in the name, the characters ARE lost. The island is the vehicle to allow these metaphorically lost people to find themselves.
The writers have gone on record numerous times discussing this as the core principle of the show. I actually think Lost is very comparable to Twin Peaks in that regard.
Though I will admit that Lost’s sci-fi leanings and mystery box illusions do put focus on getting real ‘answers’ far more than the mysteries of David Lynch’s own show where they were mostly ignored on purpose.
As a person who has never seen Lost:
What
It's just Langoliers with different characters. Showrunners lied to the public to maintain hype.
nah its yhe best show ever made and ill.die on that hill. It's an experience. @SusanYeske701
I imagine that listening to Daniel explain the ending of Lost when you have never seen an episode of Lost, is similar to doing m-th (insert an e or an a at your own leisure, both work)
Thanks for watching this. I always avoided Lost and similar "cliffhanger" shows because it gets frustrating ending each episode more *lost* then you started.
Any idea on where I can find that wooden fidget toy he always has?
Having never seen Lost but having seen Once Upon a Time (same writers), I can see a lot of the same DNA from several things you discussed here. Another show that has a lot of potential to be genuinely good but kind of gets "lost" in itself. Messy yet compelling
I lost interest in Once...Lost is amazing though imo
26:47 oh the irony that these folks also made Once Upon A Time, took Claire with them, and then gave her a baby storyline there too… 😅and that show is also crazy convoluted too lol
I'm convinced we live in one of the timeliness where Jack is a crazy preacher named Steven Anderson. You can't convince me that's a different person.
34:44 - A much shorter series was what the creators wanted. The executives saw the success of the show and insisted on extending the series. This accounts for a lot of what you criticize - originally, the show neve was supposed to run as long as it did.
For me, I forgive a lot, because, all the way through, individual episodes would play out some compelling and empathetic stories: "Ab Aeterno" (sp), a late episode for Richard is a standout. The tragedy that is Locke's character, ultimately one of the most complete victims of his own fallacies and longings, hits hard for me. But of course you cannot, cannot lose an actor of O'Quinn's character, so the writers "cheat". I understand:
Any scene with Ben and Locke going at each other is worth the price of admission: O'Quinn and Emerson are both the sorts of actors who feed energy to their scene partners, who get better simply by acting with them. When you get two powerhouses exchanging between them, it's just heaven to watch. I think Fox became a better actor because his character spent so much time with O'Quinn. O'Quinn is a major asset, and you need him. So while it makes sense to lose Locke when we do, it makes practical sense that we don't lose him.
i personally think the numbers, while a representation of each of jacobs potential replacements(cause of flight seat numbers apparently) and also a curse. That they more so represent fate in a way? jacob knows which seats his candidates will be on,so he uses those numbers to make things happen as the way they should. hurley hears the numbers, uses them, gets rich and flys on the plane that crashes. Plus the bunker explodes sending people back in time because no one entered the numbers. Bad things sure, but things that are meant to happen.
The twist wasn't that they were dead the whole time. It was that we the viewer was dead the whole time.
I'm such a psycho that I only ever watched the series finale of LOST because I knew my high school would be talking about it.
I’ve never watched Lost in my life, but I just wanted to say I absolutely love the way you censor curse words with the Dune Sardaukar throat singing 😂😂😂
Babylon 5 is the one who had the best time travel mystery plot.
I'm literally watching this and you said david lynch and i got the notification that he died
Just "Let It Go" Jack.
Season 1
"NO!"
Season 2
"NOO!"
Season 3
"NOOO!"
Season 4
"NOOOO!"
Season 5
NOOOOO!"
Season 6
NOOOOO... Oh, there you are dad. Ok, I'll finally sing that Frozen song."
On a separate note, LOST does have arguably the best TV soundtrack ever made.
Lost should have been an anthology show and the 6 seasons we got should have just been the first season.
I still need to watch Twin Peaks. I was watching your video when the announcement of David Lynch's passing came through. RIP, good sir.
Loved this show for so long. Great review.
Science fiction, my ass! They pretended to be a sci-fi show for 5 seasons and then genre hopped, the bastards! “Psych! We’re fantasy!” I thought they were taking Desmond down the path of Neal Stephenson’s Anathem. *insert frustrated growls here.