Part II: Think ECO MODE Is The Most Efficient? MORE SURPRISING Results!! Kia EV6 / Ioniq 5
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 มิ.ย. 2024
- In this video I continue the testing I had started in my previous video ( • Part I: Think I-PEDAL ... ), where I was trying to determine which is the most efficient setting, I-Pedal, Level Zero or Auto. Specifically, in this video, I test out Normal mode with Auto level zero and also Eco mode in I-Pedal, Auto level zero and Auto level three. Once again, you’ll be surprised by the results!
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This has been bothering me since the last comparison video. Using the foot brake does not automatically mean the car uses its friction brakes. The brake-by-wire system prioritises regenerative braking unless the brake pedal is slammed down.
Thank you Sir, I appreciate your detailed testing.
Thank you for all your hard work!
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That was a lot of work thank you. As others have said it would be interesting to see if Eco mode is any better than Normal mode on the hwy. And then you might have to compare auto to adaptive cruise control as well. So many tests. I have only had my EV6 Gt-line awd for a week so still learning and about to take my first 220 mile trip in the mountains of CO. I noticed on the gravel road that I live on when accelerating quickly from a slow speed in Eco mode it felt like only the rear wheels were active and the car had less control because of that. However even on the hwy it still has so much acceleration that it is hard to believe that it is just the one motor working. Looking forward to using the different regen levels in the mountains and seeing what kind of range I get.
Been following for some time and as a prospective investor just waiting for the company lease scheme to be turned on, your reviews tests and opinions are really appreciated.
Knowing my daily round trip commute is 110 miles with 90 miles on the motorway which sadly is more stop start than flowing 60-70 mph.... your test have primed my set up using best setting on different sections of my daily trip.
Brilliantly delivered content and so useful.... addicted to your channel as all my questions being covered.... well before I even get my hands on my EV6.... cant wait.
Thank you.
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Thanks for this very useful video Mahesh ! I have found more information in your video about regen modes than in all the KIA documentation. Keep it up !
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I mean there are way too many variables in city driving. 1. How many stop lights you actually stop at. 2. The speed of other cars in front of you. 3. The temperature of the day. Honestly you would need to do the same loop 5 to 10 times and average it out for each mode you do. You also need the exact same weather since colder days really hurt efficiency.
Very informative and helpful! Well done.
Glad it was helpful!
Very good informative video - thanks for producing and sharing it.
My thinking is that the most efficient way to drive the EV6 / Ioniq 5 / GV60 / eGV70 is to use Auto Regen set to a "floor" of Lvl 0 or Lvl 1 and let the system ramp up automatically to as high as Lvl 3 as you come up on slower or stopped traffic. If/when you're coming up on a stop sign or a red light light without any vehicles ahead you can use the left paddle to temporarily raise the Auto Regen "floor" to Lvl 2 or Lvl 3. In either scenario you can pull & hold the left paddle to bring the vehicle to a complete stop rather than using the brake pedal. I encourage all owners of these HMG vehicles to give these methods a try.
8 months and 12 000 km / 7 500 miles in to my EV6 GT ownership I can confirm these results. Auto regen Level 3 with Normal mode for the motors presents the best efficiency by far. I'm close to a "perfect blend" of 50/50 city and highway driving I might add. On a side note I'm well below the official WLTP consumtion, except when it's below -8°C or so.
Really good videos, with I-pedal mode in stop, start traffic conditions, do you ever use the brake at all? or does the regenerative braking do its thing and the cars sensors stop the car from being able to roll into the car in front? Thanks. Have you done any longer highway driving in Eco mode with no regen? As it disconnects the front motor and only uses the rear surely it has to be the most efficient? Thanks for the great video's, I'm about to but an EV6 GT and this has been some quality information.
Thanks!
Recently got my EV6 and this was helpful. I've been driving on Lv3 in city, and traffic, and bring it down to 1 in the highway. But I think I'll start trying Auto Regen Lv3 in the city next time to see how that feels.
Very interesting, but i would like you do a comparaison between normal and eco mode in highway driving. The front motor should be disengage in eco mode on highway.
The most efficient way is in level 0 and using pedals manualy to slow
Thanks! I appreciate all the time & effort you put into these videos!
Thank you for your support!
my understanding is that in e mode the rear motor is the only motor used to move the car but the front motor remains active only thru regen. I believe that there is a graphic representation of this on the dash available to you.
I would like you to compare your results with setting auto regen then, whilst in this mode, modify the amount of regen by using the paddles to either increase or decrease the amount of regen. I drive my Ioniq 5 this way, increasing the amount of regen going into a corner, when I feel I want to go slower than the car would like and decreasing regen coming out of it. The car indicates 'Auto' throughout but you can certainly feel the difference in the amount of regen.
I haven't had my car long enough to see if this is any more efficient than just using the paddles to vary regen without first selecting auto mode.
Great tests thank you. On my ioniq 5, I use auto 0 + left hand braking
I love driving my EV6 in Sport mode with i-Pedal … feels responsive all the time with the efficiency of full regeneration brake 👌
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You only should be aware that when using I-pedal, your consumption increases as the car is always locked into full 4 wheel drive. In all other modes it will dynamically disconnect the front motor to prevent additional power requirement
Have you looked at those trips in the Kia access app to see how much energy you regenerated versus how much energy was spent on driving/climate/etc. for both normal and/or eco modes?
Yes, I have looked at the numbers in the 'Trips' section of the Kia app, but I'm struggling to make sense of them...Whichever way I crunch the numbers, it doesn't result in the mi/kwh efficiency I see on the car's instrument cluster - baffling!
I would think that long term study would be more accurate. Example: 5 full charge cycles (limited to city street driving only) at normal mode, level 2 regen. Average the 5 cycles for result. Then move on to each possible combination of mode and regen.
Time consuming- but much better than one random sample. I’ve actually started my sampling on freeway. So far, eco/auto 2 is showing best results (in LA, where “freeway” includes stop and go). This might change in less congested environs.
A couple of things I noticed.
1) Not sure your reasoning for not doing the eco mode highway. It is quite possible for eco mode to deliver better results on the highway vs the other modes. (Just because normal and sport didn’t differ on the highway doesn’t say anything about eco on the highway).
2) You mentioned the brake pedal not providing regen. While I think that this may be true for some EVs - I think the brake pedal on the EV6 engages regen first before actually engaging the brake pedals - or at least blends them.
I've heard the same, the foot break does provide regen at level 1 and above.
I believe level 0 brake provides no regen but level 0 auto does provide regen when using the pedal.
Brake disc cleaning is enabled when using manual regen level 0.. this does not happen with auto regen level 0 so it has a tiny regen. After 10 brakes (so the manual tells, but its hard to verify) it should also provide tiny regen at manual level 0.. and yes the brake is blending in regen before friction braking unless its in brake disc cleaning mode
I would love to see the highway test in Eco mode with any other Regen setting except i-pedal which keeps the front motor engaged. I would expect that the results would be better than in Normal mode since Eco mode tries to disconnect the front motor more of the time, or all of the time? Out of spec reviews ran their EV6 GT 70mph range test in this setting and beat the EPA range estimate. Would be nice to know if it’s actually a more efficient way to run on the highway. Thanks for the other tests!
Hello @THEDRIVERDOWNLOAD
i would like to point out a possible factor to your test. It seems like you used I-Pedal first in nearly all tests and thereby gave the rucuperation the hardest time because as we all know the battery will accept power more eagerly when less full.
The tiny arrow on the left of level 3 sometimes turns to blue during stopping. Do you know what this is for?
Can you test Auto Regen 1 and Auto Regen 2 to see if it's better than 3?
Wow, this is impressive. I had no idea the Kia and Hyundai had this kind of flexibility. I am going to be looking closely at the upcoming Ioniq 6 to see if it has the same sort of options.
It does. It's very similar tot he Ioniq 5.
There is a variable that you missed! Outside temperature/ climate control! In your Part I video outside temp was 62/63 degrees. Here, in your Eco Mode test it was 55, and warmer for the other two tests. Presumably when you did the Eco mode test, you had the climate control working harder than the other two tests (i.e., having to provide more heating compared to the outside temp.) - and seeing as Eco mode is all about moderating the climate control, that's perhaps an unfair comparison. :-). Might explain why Eco mode did less well than the other modes on that day. Just a thought!
You should really connect with the channel "Your Auto Advocate" by Ray and Zach, they have a general car info/buying channel and you're the kind of smart buyer/driver/reviewer that they love to hear from/work with probably.
Thank you for letting me know!
I find it interesting that you appear to have a grab handle on your driver's side. In the UK my EV6 has no grab handle on my RHD car on my side. Perhaps I should take this up with Kia as I would find a grab handle useful on my RHD Kia.
My wife says she has issues with my grab handles. But she does not drive my Ioniq5 very often, and she has her own car.
whats the driving difference between regen and auto regen ? different regens at different speeds ?
iirc, Eco Mode has two main effects. It fiddles with the accelerator pedal feedback in a way that encourages the driver to accelerate more smoothly and slowly, thus driving in a more efficient manner, and it dampens down the Air Conditioning and Heating Response, saving additional battery energy there. If you're an experienced driver with good foot control and you're already trying to drive efficiently, you'll basically be already doing in Normal Mode what Eco Mode tries to do there, and if you're testing on a day where you are only running the AC on low or not at all, Eco Mode won't provide any additional benefit on that point either.
So essentially a good driver can replicate most of Eco Mode's efficiency gaining effects in other modes and achieve similar efficiency results.
Also I would take ipedal with less efficiency just so I don’t have to wear the disc brakes out faster
In all but “the first 20 minutes of regen 0,” the car employs blended braking. Pressing the brake pedal applies braking force with the motors (NOT the pads) until you need more braking power than the motors can safely sink.
Unless you do only around-town driving in regen 0, you may never wear out these pads or rotors.
you didn't use auto levels 1 and 2, just level3??
You mentioned both motors working in ECO mode, and I agree with you, that is counter-intuitive. I wonder if this has anything to do with the fact that your car is the GT model,. Since it's designed for performance it may always use both motors. Maybe someone with a Wind AWD can chime in.
I belive he has a GT-line AWD... and yes ECO uses AWD when starting the car from a standstill, but it seems to disengage above 25 khm/15mph. iPedal mode force AWD at all times. And its well known that AWD is not as efficient at RWD, so the consumption will be higher when using AWD. The test here is city, I assume more stopping and starting that engages AWD when in ECO. If the test was highway there likely would be little AWD need in ECO mode.
@@MartinNyholmJelle that is a good explanation of the presented results in the video. Thx!
One question if I may : When you use the left paddle to bring the car to a stop, do the brake lights come on ?
I believe the lights come on based on the rate of deceleration...
Have you tested adaptive cruise control efficiency vs your own driving?
Same I was asking for, I think that cruise control also will interfere with way od force applied in regeneration. I think that on downhill drive would be excelled way to control regen force, simply changing the desired speed.
So regen level 0 sucks because it SHOULD be the most efficient, but it disables blended braking for the first “10 stops” of every drive to clean the rotors of any rust. In other words, for like the first 20 minutes, maybe your entire local drive, all braking is waste heat.
My biggest question is: does auto level 0 do that same thing, or does it keep braking as blended rather than friction-only to start?
That blended braking disabled period in regen 0 implies that regen 1 (and maybe auto regen 1) is the REAL efficiency king, and 3 only wins because you didn’t test 1, so I’m very curious about that.
I just went out for a test drive! Lo and behold, Auto-0 DOES always do blended braking! Coast away on flat and level with no traffic, slight regen going downhill, strong regen behind someone slowing down. This is my new favorite mode.
Not quite as coasty as true-zero, of course, and I'd still rather have a toggle for "brake cleaning mode" given that I'd prefer to do that once every 6 months rather than every drive. But Auto-0 seems like a pretty solid set of compromises to me.
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1) You can specify to which manual regen level the car defauls at start-up, except level 0, in the settings.
2) Using the break pedal doesn't waste energy in Auto level 0, only in manual level 0.
3) You can switch between Auto levels with the paddles while driving, just as you can between manual levels. And you should for best efficiency.
4) There is no difference between manual level 3 and auto level 3. Both settings lock the car at level 3.
This! Sadly both videos had a lot of half knowledge. Also, if you want to test regen lvl 0 (the most efficient mode, Period. cause... physics!!), you'll need to do some hard breaks in before so regen breaking is active again. EV6 has blended breaking, so it will always regen brake before using the mechanical ones. Except for lvl0, which doubles as a break cleaning program - hence the need to break several (according to Kia ~10) times. One can check for regen breaking while looking at the dash. Reset you trip computer afterwards and this will give you the best efficiency. If not, it's one of the many factors that you cannot control while driving the same road several times...
I like i-pedal, but not going down a steep hill with fresh snow
as your car slows down in regen, as you take your foot off the accelerator, will the break lights come on to show vehelcles that your are slowing down because you will not touch your break pedal unless you really have to.?
Yes, that happens in regen level 3 or higher...
How about in sport mode if you drive normal does it give you more regen when slowing down another test for you to do?
spór mode most efedc spred demin cars bukt 155 mph or fasterr w farueß lamghi meçed
Any thoughts on these results with RWD versions?
Genauso. Ist nur in Version mit dem großen Akku etwas effektiver, sprich mehr Reichweite. Fahre den 77 kw Akku mit RWD.
I have seen this in other ice cars. The eco mode doesn’t really help anything. The dampened acceleration seems cause you to have to work harder to drive in a reasonable manner without being in everyone’s way every time you take off from a stop.
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Correct me, but isn't there a setting to which you can pick your regen mode in Auto?
Auto halten und auf 0 stellen.
What’s the best option for highway driving?
Right now I get 3.4 at best. I drive 70 mph about 80 miles round trip
I always use eco mode since I thought it was the best. I had no idea it would limit the ac power. No wonder I hardly felt the cold air
If you use HDA : There is no effect from the 'modes'.
If not, use Regen 0 in Normal and let it glide as much as possible. But that needs constant attention.
I chose auto 0 + left paddle braking out of HDA on highways. Quite satisfied with it
Using HDA (cruise control) is probably the best as it keeps the car at a constant speed. Otherwise, from my testing, it looks like the other modes all deliver similar numbers. Normal mode with Auto level 3 is probably the best bet. But I think your 3.4 may be really the result of your speed 😀😀. Next time try 65 or 60 mph and see how it changes. I’m working on an efficiency test at different speeds so stay tuned for that…
I'm new with my car, so if I want to enter regen lvl 3 and Auto mode, I would first go to regen 3, then hold the right paddle down for a second or two, until AUTO becomes displayed? I previously thought that there was just one Auto regen mode.
The procedure you’ve described is correct! Yes, at first I thought there was just one auto mode, too! This car has so many drive mode options, it can be confusing…
On my Ioniq 5 it does not matter what regen level is selected, when I select auto it always starts at auto level 0. You can change it by using the left paddle. So I have to enter auto mode and then select the regen level
Also note that you can change regen levels 0 through 3 while you are in Auto mode by using the two regen paddles. So, if you like Auto but also like to change regen levels based on driving situation, you don’t need to get out of Auto to change regen level.
It sounds like you're saying there is regen happening at Level 0? I didn't think there was any regen at Level 0 because the charge section on the cluster screen does not light up with regen charging at that level.
Oh, and thanks for the follow-up video, always good to hear your info!
On our Ioniq5 I do see some slight regen occurring even when in level zero.
There is Regen at Auto 0 not in Regen 0
Brake disc cleaning is enabled when using manual regen level 0.. this does not happen with auto regen level 0 so it has a tiny regen. After 10 brakes (so the manual tells, but its hard to verify) it should also provide tiny regen at manual level 0
I suspect this test demonstrates that you basically drive like an eco-driver. What I mean is, you accelerate and decelerate in the same way the computer would choose for economical driving. As a result, eco mode delivers no benefit. If you were more aggressive on the accelerator in your normal driving, eco mode would be holding you back. That wouldn't improve the eco-mode results, but it would mean your normal-mode results would generally be poorer. That's my experience in an ICE too..
How do you get it to stay in Auto 3? Mine keeps setting back to normal level 3 when i turn it off then back on.
Mit dem linken Lenkrad Paddel kann man auch in der Autostellung die Rekuperation reduzieren.
You observed the behavior of physics... There is no real eco normal sports mode. For a certain speed, lets say 30mph, the motor needs an specific amount of energy. So if you drive 30 mph it is always the same, eco, normal or sports mode. There is a difference ein acceleration. So from 0 to 60 mph acceleration will give you some small differences compared by the drive modes. But in normal driving condition in a town you wont hammer down you gas pedal in sports mode, you will slowly accelerate it (or you gone hit the car in front of you). Eco mode will more or less dampen it down so you cant hammer your gas pedal but in the end effect you get similar acceleration speeds compared to carefully accelerate in sports mode. And then aging, no difference in energy consumption.
My information to Eco mode and AWD (for Europe) is that it will use the rear motor. But at constant speed driving an AWD in AWD or RWD will not have any big differences.
Thank you for sharing that...
i-pedal engages 4 wheel drive, hence worse consumption in AWD cars.
Interesting but I need to clear up one misconception. When you apply the brakes, there is always regen braking, even in Level 0. It just isn’t as efficient as when you use the regenerative braking that replacing pure coasting. If you want to try out what it is like to brake the car without any regen, charge it to 100% and run down a mountain. The car will then refuse to do any regen because the battery is full. You will see the difference!
The EV6 does not regen when braking in non-auto level 0. In auto-0 it does. You can see that in the little graphics with the energy flows.
@@mmmmwwwwYT2 , you are right. I should have said Level 1. Level 0 works as if the battery is fully charged and applying the brakes does not yield any regen, unlike in all other levels.
Correct. Interestingly, my eSoul behaves exactly as you suggested.
There is no regen in mode N and when driving backwards either.
I've been enjoying your videos a lot and I'm always glad to see your research projects in which you try to help us better understand our EV6s. But in this video you appear to have made some assumptions about "auto" level that I'm not sure are true. You appear to have hypothesized that if you're in, for example, Level 2 and you press the right paddle to get into auto mode that you enter an undocumented mode you call "auto level 2." You made an assumption that if you press the paddle to enter auto mode, you enter a different level of auto mode depending on what level you were in when you pressed the paddle to enter auto mode. I see nothing in the manual nor anything on the screen to support your assumption of these 4 new regenerative levels - auto level 0, auto level 1, auto level 2, and auto level 3. But perhaps I am missing something. My impression of what is happening is that when you hold down the right paddle to enter auto mode, you enter auto mode, full stop, and there is only one auto mode not 4 levels of auto mode. It's clear from looking at the screen when you are in, for example, Level 3 - it's clearly marked that way. If there were an "auto level 3" I would expect the screen to indicate that as well - as Auto Level 3 - but it doesn't.
If there are levels of "auto" as you hypothesize, I'm having trouble understanding the difference between, for example, "Level 3" and "auto level 3." My thinking is that Level 3 sets a certain level of regen that is fixed. Auto regen varies the level of regen depending on a number of variables (driving conditions, terrain, etc). I don't see the logic in combining these.
On a related note however, if you are looking for ways to affect the level of regen while in auto mode, I do see that under "EV Settings" in the car menus there are 3 levels of "Smart regeneration" - Strong, Medium and Gentle - and it looks like by choosing one of these you maybe can influence the behavior of deceleration while in auto mode. It's not clear at all to me.
This is complicated stuff! And I may be TOTALLY off base with my comments but I do appreciate your considering my feedback. You appear to be quite scientific in your approach to understanding the behavior of the EV6. Please let me know what you think. Perhaps you can help me better understand your basis for assuming the various auto levels you postulate. Thank you for your assistance.
Thank you for your feedback! There are different auto levels - I have tried them all out. They essentially work like the basic different regen levels, but with the added function of the 'Auto' feature, which adjusts for terrain, speed and distance of the vehicle ahead.
Yes, you are absolutely right about the 3 levels of Smart Regeneration - strong, medium & gentle. I haven't had a chance to test those out, yet... But, you are absolutely right - this stuff is complicated! Every time I feel like I've understood the car, I find a new setting lurking somewhere!
@@THEDRIVERDOWNLOAD Hi. Thanks for your reply. I know that you believe that there are different levels of auto regen. And you made these TH-cam videos in which you try them out. In this case, you appear to be relying on your perception of how the car behaves under these various hypothesized levels of auto regen. My point is, if you disregard your own beliefs and perceptions (which may be impossible for you to do) about levels of auto regen, have you seen or read anything that supports these beliefs or perceptions? I see nothing in the manual about this and I don't see anything on the screen to support levels of auto regen. Beliefs and even perceptions can be tricky things... I keep my eye on various Facebook forums and you appear to be the only person who believes in levels of auto regen (other than people who have viewed your TH-cam videos). I'm not trying to be difficult, I'm trying to be scientific about it. How did you get the idea there are levels of auto regen in the first place? Did you read about it anywhere or see anything about it? I am also trying to learn about the EV6. I just don't believe everything I read on Facebook or see on TH-cam. I'm one of those people who questions everything. Surely you have have references other than your own beliefs? Thanks again for indulging me...
@@eurosteve50 happy to indulge! I learned about the different auto levels from my viewers. When I made the part 1 video, a number of viewers pointed out that I was in auto 3 and asked me to test out the different auto levels. That’s when I began playing with the levels and decided to do part 2 of the test. You’re right, the manual makes no mention of the different auto levels. But as I’m finding out more things about this car, I’m realizing the manual doesn’t explain everything. And neither does the Kia official ‘how to’ video on regen braking - that’s woefully inadequate in explaining the depth of the system. And no, it’s not just perception. There is a marked difference in how the car drives. I chose to show auto 0 and auto 3 in my video because they are the ends of the spectrum. You can certainly feel the difference in how the car drives. And the test results show that they deliver different efficiencies, too. I gather from your comments that you don’t have an EV6 (yet). If you do get one or have the chance to test drive one, check the different levels out for yourself - I believe you will feel the difference!
@@THEDRIVERDOWNLOAD Well stated. The difference between the auto modes is stark! There can be no mistaking the level of regen applied between auto 1 and auto 3. To be clear, you still have to use the brake pedal to come to a complete stop in all modes except I-pedal right? Auto 3 definitely slows the car down to a crawl, but will not stop completely without you pressing the brakes.
@@elliotbaltazar that’s correct. You do have to use the brake pedal in all modes except I-pedal.
Your verbiage would intimate that regenerative PEDAL braking is not taking place in level zero drive mode. That is not correct. Pedal braking always produces regeneration. The friction brakes are actuated when regenerative braking is not sufficient to produce the desired amount of braking force. You can make a stop using regenerative braking ONLY in any mode if you brake carefully.
I-pedal automatically sets AWD, if you have it, regardless of the drive mode. Therefore, i-pedal must be less economical than auto regen which changes the regen mode according to driving conditions.
This merely highlights just how murky and unclear are the instructions and advice from Kia. I've had a Soul EV for close to 10 years (2 different models) and have tried to find out the technical nature of the different modes with each car and you might as well dig a hole in some mud and look there! Even within your descriptions, you don't specify the nature of the 'regen'.
For example, when driving along at a constant speed, the degree of regen should make absolutely no difference. It should make no difference to acceleration, because it's not regen! So why does higher regen cause a slower car? It's ridiculous!
The question needs to be answered as to what exactly is Kia doing and why do they describe it as various regen levels? How does the brake pedal work in terms of regen and physical friction braking? You will not find any specifications anywhere. Such information is like something 'Top Secret', kept hidden to a degree that would impress the CIA!
They should simply have different driving modes if they want to allow some to unleash their 'wild side' and to account for some people who have little or poor pedal control. As it is, they make it so ridiculously complex without any information to help with choices and obscure it even more with expressions like 'regen' (it isn't necessarily) and 'one-pedal driving' (it isn't necessarily and still needs an input!).
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