Cutting Helical Gears on the Horizontal Mill 3: Installing & Setting up the Universal Head
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 พ.ย. 2022
- Cutting Helical Gears on the Horizontal Mill 3: Installing & Setting up the Universal Head
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Can't wait till the next episode. I can't wrap my head around how the x and y is gonna work .
Same here, I have no idea how this is going to work, I thought the piece has to be introduced and move at a 45 degree angle to the cutter, and if the table isn't turned (just the cutter is!), that won't be the case. There must be some trick here that I'm just missing!
I agree. I think that when he tries it we will see another setup. I have a similar but much smaller gear to cut and I need to angle the workpiece not the cutter to get the angle.
@@TheFreshmanWIT it should work, the piece is at a 45 degree angle to the cutter either way you look at it. your first thought is it would feed into the side of the cutter, but the rotation of the gear blank is matched to the feed of the table keeping the cutter square to the actual cut as it goes through.
Same. I know it’s the relationship between feed rate and rotation, but picturing it in my head... this project has my full attention.
@@TheFreshmanWIT The cutting action must stay in line with the gear teeth. So the gear blank will rotate clockwise as the table moves to the left, the same as it would have in the previous setup if there had been no clearance issues.
My wife just said ‘are you listening to Keith Rucker again?’ I have listened to so many of your videos that she knows your voice!
Engine hoists make life so much easier in the shed. About the only thing mine has never been used for is lifting an engine!
I'd like to cast my vote for your K&T mill as the most anthropomorphic machine tool on TH-cam. 🙂
It’s such a pleasure to watch you work as your videos are highly instructive. You are such a wonderful teacher you hold my attention even though I am not a machinist. The workers with the skills you demonstrate make our lives of relative comfort and abundance possible. Thank you!
Thanks Keith, I was just about to type “why not use a longer arbor?”, then you explained it. I’m still learning.
Really interesting project, I have so much respect for the guys of old who used to do this day in day out and not really think about it, sorry to say we're losing those skilled craftsmen, a gear cutting Co closed down here in Coventry England not so long ago
I'm pretty sure they thought a lot about it. Probably got into some arguments at lunch, too. :)
I was wondering how the 50 taper worked if they had a drawbar or not and then you answered my question, thanks Keith great video as always
I'm probably wrong but I'll put this out there. When you had this setup in typical fashion with the long arbor and table swiveled to 45° could you have retracted the over arms and put the cutter on the outside of the support you removed in favor of the universal head?
Exactly what i thought and how i cut gears on my bridgeport with an unsupported arbor.
That’s good lateral thinking. The art of thinking what you want to achieve and then filling the gap with what you have, rather than what you don’t. Thanks.
Was thinking the same thing! Save a ton of work
I don't know if that would work since you need the arbor nut which would be in the way of cutter.
Love the old school cliff hanger until next time. You are definitely pulling out all the tips and tricks on this project.
I'm gonna turn 64 next week. I hope I live long enough to see the end of this series. : )
Loved seeing the transition to the vertical head. I have a 50's era milling machine that I would love to adapt a vertical head to. Getting some ideas here watching this!
Andrew
Rube Goldberg would be SO PROUD!
necessity is the mother of invention
It’s been so much fun watching you build this setup because I’ve watch each piece as it was added. What a project. How many gears are involved to make a gear ?😂
been anticipating this very much
What an amazing machine! I love how you are using it as was intended. Great stuff!!!
The are so many set up steps for this one! Can't wait for the next one!
wow, what a project....a lot to learn
thank you Keith, following the whole project. step by step.
another brilliant and learning video keith!
Thanks Keith I can’t Waite to actually see you getting this done
Thanks for sharing.
Thanks for sharing
Well Keith, you have no lack of projects. Seems your projects each generator 4 or 5 projects to do all by themselves. Thanks very much for sharing.
Amazingly versatile tool! Fascinating to watch you configure it. GREAT that you're making videos that can serve as operator documentation for the future! Old iron never dies!
Amazing flexibility in that old machine!
Keith LOVE watching you use and work these old machines! just so interesting and fascinating to watch how it was once done!
Great video Keith, keep'um coming..
Thanks for sharing 👍
awesome work!!! you are on it!! I love it!!!
Thank you for my relaxation therapy. My blood pressure has come down to normal.
Really interesting project,
I have had to install the wheel cutter on the out side of the overhead support to gain clearance at times. it looks dangerous but works ok with light cuts.
What a surprise! You put an evening video out instead of in the morning. Always love your videos Keith you do a great job! By the way my third son's name is Keith!
I sharpen cutting tools for a living and if you ever need one sharpened I would be happy to fix one up for you no change.
Even if you have one that is badly burned up didn't throw it out. It can be fixed a lot easier than you might think . The key to doing it right is maintaining the correct rake angle by the offset marked on the cutter. Changing the rake angle will change the form.
If someone has cut it wrong it too can be easily fixed. And I don't burn up the cutter. Give me a try some time.
Man what a lot of time spent on just setting up the machine to cut one gear. My trade was in leather before I retired. Set up was laying the hide on the cutting table, measuring or tracing a pattern to make cuts. Cheers from 🇨🇦
Thank You !
Most excellent.
Been lookin" for you. You are always so predictable, but surprised us today. Good video, thanks.
Thank you for sharing. Enjoyed.👍👀
I am REALLY looking forward to seeing you make chips here. Wow.
A pleasure to watch, amplified by the fact I can just buy the piece I’m watching be machined.
I'm not sure which is more impressive. Learning to use and using that machine in all its configurations or draining and building it in the first place!
PROBLEM SOLVING, GREAT JOB
Keith could’ve had this done weeks ago if he would have just sat in his recliner with a nail file & a depth gauge.
Next video: adding the toilet paper holder attachment and radial arm back scratcher! Man, that milling machine is so awesome
The way I see it, you still need the table at 45 degrees and the head in line with the machine spindel. If you feed on the X axis with the table straight and the head at 45, the cutter will cut sideways on an angle and will destroy the blank and maybe the cutter as well.
I was thinking the exact same thing. I'm curious to see what his solution is for that.
@@bradhayworth2926 Remember the blank will be rotating at a ratio of 45 Deg. or in line with the cutter. It's still pretty hard to wrap your head around!
Hi Keith from the UK
I remember a machinist I knew decades ago that had long arbor shafts for cutting severe angle gears. He had a pair of half open pedestals with 'half moon' bearing openings on top that were placed near the gear on each side, for support of the shafts. It really stopped vibration and was 100% out of the way.
Спасибо большое за очень интересное видео, ваш опыт и науку.!!))
It's about the journey, not the destination.
A remarkably versatile mill ! (If you have all the add-ons!)
Obviously its a lot of work to cut a helical gear the manual way. Been waiting for this since the first video several months ago. Very interesting to see how much is involved. I would never imagine... Thank you for sharing all the details.
Actually this project started 2 years ago...
@@petemclinc With the acquisition of the lead attachment you mean? I don't think the work on the gears has been going so long.
Eagerly anticipating the cutting of the gears. Most likely will be better than the running of the bulls.
Wow, no good deed… you’re a patient man.
Hiya Keith
Confused? Sure. :) Get you a soda can or something, and a marker. Draw the spirals on the can, at 45 degrees. Now, hold the can between your left and right hands, and rotate it. You need to keep the path of one of your spirals right underneath a cutter of some kind. The rotation and the left-right motion have to be synchronized; that's what the attachment does.
The cutter could be something like an a pointy end mill, I suppose, but what you really want is a form gear cutter, to make the teeth the right shape. And the cutter's going to have to be at 45 degrees, to stay in line with the gear tooth being cut; in line with the lines on the can.
None of this makes any sense if the can is not rotating in sync with the horizontal motion.
Great video, love all the explanations.. One question. As I understand it involute profile gears did not become common until the 1940's. Being from a 1928 Austin is it not probable that this is a cycloid gear? How would you tell the difference and identify the pressure angle that the manufacturer used?
That old K&T is turning into some kind of ancient monster with all that equipment attached to it. It saddens me to see these skills going by the wayside. Nothing against CNC but I think it tends to make us lazy. I think it causes us to forget how much skill was involved in creating set ups like this. Personally, I appreciate you desire and willingness to preserve the old ways.
Why not put overarm support inboard of cutter or longer driveshaft and move dividing head over to the left?
I can’t see why not, so I will ask; can’t you mount the cutting disc on the outside of the support arm? With such a short stick-out, it shouldn’t have any vibration issues. Or am I missing something?
The rigidity wouldnt be any worse than on the unsupported universal head!
In the dim and distant past, I had a similar problem. I solved it by mounting the cutter outboard of the arbor support, getting just enough clearance to do the job.
How did you work around the arbor nut? How did you key the cutter and did you use any spacers?
Given your demonstrated ability to find parts that us mortals can't, you need to get a parking attachment for that head. Even Adam had to give up and make one but you can show us yours next week.
Well, hopefully Keith, it won’t be too long before you’re ready to send out more videos on this with all of been waiting a long time to see how the gears are going to go maybe put up more videos per day would be a good thing I know I would be interested in watching them even if there was two or three videos a day please we could see what the project is in the process that you’re going through. Look forward to more videos when you can get them out
You know he has a full time job.....right??
Couldn't you put the cutter on the outside of the support to miss the gearhead. I'm puzzled at how having the cutting head at an angle will cut an angled gear with the table moving straight across it. I'll keep watching to see.
We used to realign out Huron universal table with a dial indicator, attached to table, and sweep machined column..but don't do it the other way round.
I have the same head for my 2HL Plain. I don't have a low lead attachment or a K&T dividing head. I'd love to have the model H dividing head he isn't using. :)
hope you're cutting more than one of those gears after all this headache with setup.
Interesting... 🙂
You should do some side consulting work with KitchenAid designing attachments.😀
You can rest assured that everything will be on camera and we know your real identities
7:16 only a true machinist knows what "dead nuts" is :)
Is it unnecessary to tran the head more accurately than what can be read on the index dials?
👍
Was thinking that all those adjustment/clamp bolts would benefit from a socket wrench...
I suspect the longer mandrel with it turned the other way would have been more rigid as now you have the cutter with a lot more flex instead of the part with a little more. Lots of ways to skin that cat though. 🙂
This is the first time us You Tube folks have seen you put in the four cap screws; the first time you installed the Universal Vertical Head, you did not have them. I am glad you are getting closer to cutting the spiral gear. What is it for by the way?
It's an upper (camshaft) timing gear for an antique engine, IIRC.
@@alantrimble2881 Wasn't it for the 1928 Austin engine?
It took a bit to get my head around what’s happening here. To cut a helical gear the cutter is turning,
the gear is slowly rotated and the table is slowly moving all the same time.
Helical gear teeth are slightly curved, making them very different from straight gear teeth.
Just waiting to see you turn the feed table parallel with the the cutter.....
Put the over arm support inbord of the cutter
i dont think the way you are going to be cutting the teeth is going to work because your slide table is going to be moving at a right angle to the cutter, also are the teeth on the gear right or left angle? i do enjoy your videos and look forward to the next one.
Just can't wrap my head around the cutter being at 45* and the table being at 0*.
My mind says it will not cut straight, but rather will 'mill' across the top.
My perspective is obviously not seeing something.
Can't wait to see the follow up video.
That's what I was thinking. I guess the rotation of the part will compensate??
@@natedoerfler652
Perhaps, but my perspective says no.
Guess we will see. Glad I am not alone in confusion. lol
I think an H-mill will feed the x and y axis simultaneously. So maybe combo of x , y , and rotation in dividing head will do it?
My guess: He'll turn the table back to 45 and turn the universal head shaft so it is identical to the horz. mill configuration.
He then has clearance to cut. Can't wait for part 4.
Is it possible to use the overarm support in the middle of the arbor with the cutter extending out to the end?
I noticed that there are 3 zerk connectors on the top of the universal head. Do you inject grease or oil into those?
Nothing like a project that requires a sub project with side projects. In other words a project of projects...
you need the parking attachment :)
Push the bearing supports in about 6 inches and put cutter on end of shaft?
The cam drive gear Keith will make will be of much higher quality than the original.
While I understand using the scales mounted on the Horizontal Mill to get things close, I'm a pinch surprised that it is sufficient.
Will there be no effort be expended on getting the angles precisely set and not simply "good enough"?
This is in Keith's wheelhouse.
7:33 - No tramming?
15:30 - Off by 2* on both scales? Seems tramming would be a good idea.
Maybe I'm missing something but why not mount the gear blank on a longer mandrel to get more clearance from the index head?
it looked to me as if that first setup would have worked with a longer shaft to hold the gear blank but what do I know, not much.
i see them old school craftsman tools!!! mostly made in china now tho
Changing that head looks like it would wear a person out. All those trips around the machine to tighten, loosen, adjust, and so forth.
Couldn’t you just put the cutter on the other side of the arbor support while in normal horizontal mode? Kind of overhang the cutter into free space ?
What would happen if you turned the table 45 the other way?
Hey Keith- how many ft. lbs. on the torque? One small grunt on the socket head cap screws, one serious grunt on the nuts. Any other silly questions?
I'm sure the degree marks on the rotating base are accurate enough for most needs, but what would you do if you wanted to indicate the table after rotating it (for peace of mind)? I've been racking my brain trying to think of a way to set up an indicator to nudge the table perpendicular and I can't think of a good setup. I guess you would need to hold a large ground flat surface in a collet and then another straight edge parallel to the table, and measure in two places. Sounds like a pain though. What would you do?
Just mount an indicator on the table and traverse across the column...or put the indicator in the spindle and sweep the back face of the table..similar to tramming the head on a Bridgeport.
@@mbbmidwest3556 There is no reference surface you can use to tram the table relative to the head that I can see. Traversing the table with an indicator mounted anywhere will not show any out of square with the head. I'm not a in the trade, therefore, in no way an authority. Also, my imagination isn't up to discovering the solution.
@@rexhapgood5000 the back face of the table is ground so that can be swept with an indicator in the spindle. The front of the column that makes up the z-axis can be used too..with the indicator mounted to the table and the stylus touching the column face, moving the table would show its not parallel to the the column.
Couldn't the dividing head and the other equipment to the right be placed on the left hand side of the table? I have no clue, just asking.