His main message was to deny all authority...now think in this way"what if you hear something which you think is bad ,he has done"..your all respect will tend to convert into hate..are you seeing what it is..first you gave someone your respect..and then destroyed it..
@@akashsaini5889 My respect for the man doesn't come from the fact that I want to get something from him. My respect comes from a place of letting go of all those things that I don't need. So no scope for my respect being destroyed, as I have not put him on a pedestal. I have nothing that I want from the man.
So, I create the past and I create the present separately from the past and then from this division I create conflict, then I say: I have conditions.. BUT I am all that.. Past, Present and the Conflict. I AM THE CONDITIONS... Marvelous.. Thank you 💞🙏🌷
he said it as simple as he can, as it is the only way to say it, ,but we listen and translate from our knowledgh which is limited, with that we do not grasp a thing! but now after ages! i got it. it simple,only we are not aware that it is we who make it complicated.
Thinker and thought is one,when one realizes this then there is no action and supreme acceptance arises. Union happens. Thats the whole teaching of jk dada.
Hi Arvind, i dont know but it seems like you have probably experienced that supreme acceptance after Realizing the thinker is the thought, it feels like so to me because such profound words like No action and supreme acceptance makes me feel like you have really touched it .. So i am just curious to ask you that whether have you really experienced that state and can you explain a bit more about that, i standing down the foothills of the mountain want to know that what is the experience of such a person who has touched the peak of the Mountain....
@@nikhilvr917 this is truly inquisitive and curious! But I feel deeper things go beyond expression and mere words. Can there be something beyond expression? Can there be something beyond thoughts? May be that's truth. Let us explore. To raise beyond mind, one has to still use the mind!
He is the only man in the world who showed you a working process. Unfortunately we live in a different world. This is why we have such a fragmented world, endless wars, prejudices, etc. He never talked about a human generated God. But he mentions the immeasurable several times. A very smart man I say, very smart indeed.
There is a conditioned I or a subjective I(SI) and an unconditioned or objective I (OI) . When (SI) watches itself then then the observer is the observed. But when (OI) is aware of the limitations of(SI) then that is choice less awareness or observation without the observer which helps to wipe away the subjective influences of our mind and make it free . This is my understanding of K's talk.
Watch what you do, think, speak. Watch the consequence. Behavior modification will happen when you dont like what you see. Use your own faculties--- sensory inputs, the brain and the mind to modify your behavior. Develop an objective view of your idea of yourself. Watch, observe, understand, change, move on.
@sanju b consult a psychologist who specializes in counseling. Not a clinical psychologist and not a psychiatrist. Get counseling first. You may have to visit a few to identify one who really listens to you and is able to focus you outside of your idea of yourself relatively quickly.
You are the humanity, their doings are human doings, watch them, watch their violence, now who's responsible for it? Are you not human like the rest of us? Only your so called conditioning separates yourself from them. That individual can never save it self from any thing. Just separate itself. Every human being is directly responsible for every human beings action, and only with love can you save your self from their conditioning. Not a self inquiry. They are you. Stop with becoming something better, or something separate from them, you are becoming just another violent creature like the rest of them in different clothing. The next thing you will do is become violent like the rest of them and tell them what to become, and be towards those who does not fulfill your criteria. Love. Are you capable?
I was into Osho, and I still like and do dynamic meditation and kundalini. But I am actually more into Krishnamurti now, because my mind works like his, I am disolving my identity through analitycal observation. I need first to observ and then understand, and afterwards I can accept it.
i have read the power of subconscious mind book which is there for realizing goals and curing yourself from diseases using mind power .BUT here jk is giving a good talk as a psychotherapist just with some spirtual dimensions.
When the point is reached where a voice comes from inside telling, "Yes, this was what I wanted", then all other conditioning gets automatically stripped off, all other things automatically becomes unnecessary.
You can change your conditioning, maybe replace it with something else or you can dissolve it in yourself. But for dissolving it you have to be aware to such an extent that it doesn't seem to be a different part of yourself. For that you need immense practice to stop that identification process and craving. For that u need a state of mindfulness and thoughtfulness like that of buddha. It seems easy but it's not. Krishnamurti's way of changing your conditioning seems plausible but we are highly social, economic and political beings now. It's hard for us to embrace solitude. You can make little changes in your environment, in people's company, in your speech, thoughts and action and also you can practice will power and become less susceptible to it or you can replace with some sort of other conditioning. Like if you have addiction of soda drinks, everytime your mind craves for it you offer yourself a juice instead of soda. In that way you can change the neurological patterns of the brain and replace it with a better habbit. Same stands for social conditioning.
I think you forgot to watch the video. Moral of the story: You are the conditioning. You are trying to remove your self. Everything about you has come from outside.
The primal thought is "I" from which springs forth other thoughts (including the world). Even that "I" is false, wonder how that tallys with what JK is saying.
Although regarded as a spiritual 'leader', something that he has repeated denied, K. is a pragmatist. If only he had studied neuroscience in addition to his understanding what is actually taking as brain activity, he might have presented his understand more scientifically. As it is his insight of what it is to be a human (organism!) is still grasped by (his) followers to make him something of a guru. How frustrating for him to have so many listeners who, after all that effort, just don't, can't get it. (I kind of understand where he is coming from but this old brain is still constantly trapped by incompleteness - the past, as a brain electrochemical activity, forming escaping as alternative to what is. The effect being fear sensation.
I have to say I got thoroughly confused by his apparent references to the relative I (AKA ego) which is made of fear and the absolute I (AKA timeless awareness) which is one with the impersonal sensation of fear.
There is conditioning and then there is you. Now you and conditioning are the same. Observer is the observed. Now watch that. Who is then the new watcher? Has it not been always there? Watching what? Watching the conditioned (Conditioning plus you). Can we observe/watch the watcher!
Ultimately it's not. Everything is seamlessly connected, though from a dualistic perception it is more helpful to speak to things as if they are separate. Because of the ultimate lack of separation none of these things technically exist anyway. The I is the also the ego which is also the entirety of all that is, because the beginning of a rope and the end of the rope are both the rope. The distinctions we make are only temporarily meaningful because they are dependant on transitory illusory perception.
How is it separate? "I" is made up from the past experience and thoughts. And these experience thoughts try to separate itself from other thoughts and experiences.
The thinker is the thought...so according to JK, there is no division..hard to digest but it might be true..so far " I " feel that I am diffrent from my thoughts, but that I : the observer itself is past..🤔
So I hear people repeatedly saying you are not your feelings, you are not your thoughts. Is this talk saying in fact you are your feelings, you are your thoughts, you are your conditioning?
Isn't the one who's watching is also the conditioning.... because the mind started behaving in this manner after listening to krisnamurti....so it's again conditioning, isn't it?
Thought this too at some point, but in my understanding, it is not. While observing you will notice certain feelings, which I tend to see as a background thought/ulterior motive. These will come to the surface if you keep observing. Observing is practiced to distance yourself from your active thinking, so you don't identify with it. While you observe you will start to see the patterns that you believed and formed your condition. At first you might think that observing is another trick by the ego, but it's not. It's more that you thinking, that when you are observing is again conditioning, is the trick by your ego. But if you go into the observer state with the goal to dissolve your ego, than this is your ego hiding again behind that motive. Observing means sitting still and observing without any goal and without any motive. I might be false here it's just how I see it currently.
Yes if your not quietly,lovingly,facing this.If your stuck in this dead end ditch it will still own you...Real life(being) is not stuck its love,it’s enough,it’s free.That is your responsibility not Buddha’s,Krishnamuurtis,or any one else’s..May grace find you....
Here is how I understand it: The I and the conditioning is the thought. So he is talking about observing your thought. So you kind of step away of the conditioning. In that observation there is no sense of I nor past nor future. Just the observation itself. The difference is that you dont observe it with your thought (that would be concentration). But actually I think this is very hard to be expressed through words. You have to live it to understand fully
yes i think whole point here is just observing so that the past or conditioned self is brought to the present self where there is no conditioning no past.. just present
All the human conditioning happens on the elementary level. To literally, the five basic elements. Once the elements which are internal are harmoniously integrated with the elements manifest externally, conditioning have no way but to reset themselves. As this happens, life will always be fresh, young and vibrant. If not, the very conditioning which seems to give a person the persona which he seems to cherish will weigh him down, and will become the root cause of all miseries the moment even a small disharmony would arise in those conditioning. As it is known, no programming is ever perfect and it is bound so that some glitch happens somewhere, and problems, sufferings and sadness begins to manifest.
He was a Buddhist. Whether he agrees to it or not.. A true practitioner would know immediately. 🙏❤️ And a true Buddhist is not even a Buddhist. Because even being a Buddhist, a self comes into being. And the dharma teaches to dissolve the 'I'.. Buddha called it non-self. Anatta. Rather, he was a buddha. On his own right. But he was taught Buddhist teachings deeply by the esoteric practitioners. Of the theosophical society.
He was quite literally selected to be the physical 'vessel' for the next buddha by the theosophical society. You may be very right - he may well have been a buddha. In his notebook he speaks of an 'other' being with him. He also speaks of seeing the center of creation itself.. very curious man who knew even more than he let on. Absolutely transcendent wisdom and vision. I understand why he chose to speak very little of the more 'mystical' side of things. It presents a path and he wanted people to find the pathless. Perhaps "find" is not even the right word. To see it and walk it for themselves, which needs an unconditioned mind
This is absolutely profound...the construct of I, trying to secure itself
Yes it is!!
It is wht it is 💯
If I see this fact that "I" is also conditioning I am not able to know the truth
Exactly
This short recording made it so clear; the division we create when there is no division- superb, never heard anything like this before.
I am reminding you of your your comment ☺️
The Grand Old Man of spirituality. I bow my head to you Krishnamurti ji.
His main message was to deny all authority...now think in this way"what if you hear something which you think is bad ,he has done"..your all respect will tend to convert into hate..are you seeing what it is..first you gave someone your respect..and then destroyed it..
@@akashsaini5889 My respect for the man doesn't come from the fact that I want to get something from him. My respect comes from a place of letting go of all those things that I don't need. So no scope for my respect being destroyed, as I have not put him on a pedestal. I have nothing that I want from the man.
Well he started from a very young age.
He wouldn't l Iike that.
K and friends 🙂.
So, I create the past and I create the present separately from the past and then from this division I create conflict, then I say: I have conditions.. BUT I am all that.. Past, Present and the Conflict. I AM THE CONDITIONS... Marvelous.. Thank you 💞🙏🌷
You explained all the better bro 👏🏻👏🏻
he said it as simple as he can, as it is the only way to say it, ,but we listen and translate from our knowledgh which is limited, with that we do not grasp a thing! but now after ages! i got it. it simple,only we are not aware that it is we who make it complicated.
Hold on I need to see it again.
And see it again and again 😅 still😢
Thinker and thought is one,when one realizes this then there is no action and supreme acceptance arises. Union happens.
Thats the whole teaching of jk dada.
Thinker and Thougts are the one and the same --- How these words of 'Advaitha Relaxes me ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Hi Arvind,
i dont know but it seems like you have probably experienced that supreme acceptance after Realizing the thinker is the thought, it feels like so to me because such profound words like No action and supreme acceptance makes me feel like you have really touched it ..
So i am just curious to ask you that whether have you really experienced that state and can you explain a bit more about that, i standing down the foothills of the mountain want to know that what is the experience of such a person who has touched the peak of the Mountain....
@@nikhilvr917 this is truly inquisitive and curious! But I feel deeper things go beyond expression and mere words. Can there be something beyond expression? Can there be something beyond thoughts? May be that's truth. Let us explore. To raise beyond mind, one has to still use the mind!
Understanding self is the most complicated yet easy process. One must clear mind and accept things as it is .
Yes. It is so hard to keep ones mind still. Our minds are constantly skitting off in all directions.
nothing is completely accepted when it is completely understood. :)
Listening to this man makes me want to think deep
Though Krishnamurti- ji speaks freedom from thought- just observing is what is needed, thinking about it deeply or not deeply is still conflict
He is pure and unique..
O m g....This is ultimate....I am that (which is heap of past)
That is literally the definition of meditation
there is meditation whether you are aware of it or not
But without a practioner.
We can consciously recondition ourselves thru' revised habits & beliefs - incl. but not limited to mindfulness.
After several years now i started understand Krishnamurthy
Wow. Never heard it like this before.
Yes
the truest person in this world
Wow. When he asks the question if you are different from conditioning is like a bomb dropping on the head...
Same omg I was shocked
I felt same brother 🙏
I think this is one of those WOW moments in life. And you can appreciate that you are not the body/vehicle. 🙏💜
Good
Incredible!
Thanks so much Sir for sharing remain ever blessed
He is the only man in the world who showed you a working process. Unfortunately we live in a different world. This is why we have such a fragmented world, endless wars, prejudices, etc.
He never talked about a human generated God.
But he mentions the immeasurable several times.
A very smart man I say, very smart indeed.
I (ego) is trying to secure it self by creating conflict
I maintain that Truth is a pathless land, and you cannot approach it by any path whatsoever, by any religion, by any sect.
:- J. Krishnamuthy
only silence. only meditation
Great Sir 🙏🙏🙏
Thank You!
NewCultureofPeace&Love....Now!🙏
Thank you
A lot depends on one's power of detachment from sense of ownership and generosity of spirit that enables one to give more than received.
Exactly!!!
It's the most distilled knowledge
Thanks
All he is saying is: "As long as I remains, there is conflict. Just to observe this fact is freedom."
Please upload videos with subtitles 🙏
It has cc. I used it and got the subtitles -
Very deep!
If you believe the conditioning is only an outside influence, you are going to struggle with this truth.
I got him!
There is a conditioned I or a subjective I(SI) and an unconditioned or objective I (OI) . When (SI) watches itself then then the observer is the observed. But when (OI) is aware of the limitations of(SI) then that is choice less awareness or observation without the observer which helps to wipe away the subjective influences of our mind and make it free . This is my understanding of K's talk.
Watch what you do, think, speak. Watch the consequence. Behavior modification will happen when you dont like what you see. Use your own faculties--- sensory inputs, the brain and the mind to modify your behavior.
Develop an objective view of your idea of yourself. Watch, observe, understand, change, move on.
@sanju b consult a psychologist who specializes in counseling. Not a clinical psychologist and not a psychiatrist. Get counseling first. You may have to visit a few to identify one who really listens to you and is able to focus you outside of your idea of yourself relatively quickly.
You are the humanity, their doings are human doings, watch them, watch their violence, now who's responsible for it?
Are you not human like the rest of us? Only your so called conditioning separates yourself from them. That individual can never save it self from any thing. Just separate itself.
Every human being is directly responsible for every human beings action, and only with love can you save your self from their conditioning.
Not a self inquiry. They are you. Stop with becoming something better, or something separate from them, you are becoming just another violent creature like the rest of them in different clothing. The next thing you will do is become violent like the rest of them and tell them what to become, and be towards those who does not fulfill your criteria. Love. Are you capable?
I love this guy !!! 🤣 😊
Wow❤
I was into Osho, and I still like and do dynamic meditation and kundalini. But I am actually more into Krishnamurti now, because my mind works like his, I am disolving my identity through analitycal observation. I need first to observ and then understand, and afterwards I can accept it.
*Jk sir is Ineffable*
Respect yourself
Please upload the whole video...🙏
The full interview was featured on episode 26 of our podcast, listen here: th-cam.com/video/iU8JUH3m4eU/w-d-xo.html
@@kft thank you ❤️👍
i have read the power of subconscious mind book which is there for realizing goals and curing yourself from diseases using mind power .BUT here jk is giving a good talk as a psychotherapist just with some spirtual dimensions.
When the point is reached where a voice comes from inside telling, "Yes, this was what I wanted", then all other conditioning gets automatically stripped off, all other things automatically becomes unnecessary.
Ego is attaching to time and creating 2 different situations n 2 different conditions
Everything he's said is wasted upon us until we realise it ourselves
You can change your conditioning, maybe replace it with something else or you can dissolve it in yourself. But for dissolving it you have to be aware to such an extent that it doesn't seem to be a different part of yourself. For that you need immense practice to stop that identification process and craving. For that u need a state of mindfulness and thoughtfulness like that of buddha. It seems easy but it's not. Krishnamurti's way of changing your conditioning seems plausible but we are highly social, economic and political beings now. It's hard for us to embrace solitude. You can make little changes in your environment, in people's company, in your speech, thoughts and action and also you can practice will power and become less susceptible to it or you can replace with some sort of other conditioning. Like if you have addiction of soda drinks, everytime your mind craves for it you offer yourself a juice instead of soda. In that way you can change the neurological patterns of the brain and replace it with a better habbit. Same stands for social conditioning.
its a condition to change your condition.
Conditioning is caused by ignorance. Remove that, and all is done. Ignorance is the highest fetter of the mind.
I think you forgot to watch the video. Moral of the story: You are the conditioning. You are trying to remove your self. Everything about you has come from outside.
Just came by to see what condition my condition was in
Sir, krishnmurti ji never talks about mere mindfulness, rather he has always stressed upon absence of the self, the ego..
genius
Exactly.
We have breaking my conditioning &pattern.
its so true it makes me laaaaaffff☺😉😉😉😉
The observer is the observed, when we lose our attachment to our strange thoughts about things.
There is only you!
I,self,me. Super ego, Ego, ID. Spirit, Soul,Body.
I read a lot of his books.Interesting,but ultimately frustrating . I'll try a bit more with these ,same " rabbit hole " feeling.
K.......❤️
The primal thought is "I" from which springs forth other thoughts (including the world). Even that "I" is false, wonder how that tallys with what JK is saying.
Although regarded as a spiritual 'leader', something that he has repeated denied, K. is a pragmatist. If only he had studied neuroscience in addition to his understanding what is actually taking as brain activity, he might have presented his understand more scientifically. As it is his insight of what it is to be a human (organism!) is still grasped by (his) followers to make him something of a guru. How frustrating for him to have so many listeners who, after all that effort, just don't, can't get it. (I kind of understand where he is coming from but this old brain is still constantly trapped by incompleteness - the past, as a brain electrochemical activity, forming escaping as alternative to what is. The effect being fear sensation.
Where is the full version?
❤❤🙏
What he mean by 'watch it without any movement of thoughts" isn't thoughts movements happening automatically ?
~~~ ✨ 👁️ ✨ ~~~ #NAMASTE ~~~ 🎶 🕊️ 🎶 ~~~
Gratitude for such a profound video. Where can I access the complete interview?
Thank you again. :-)
Please see video description for link.
@@kft Thank you very much for your response. Gratitude.
@@kft Im so rejoiced to see this response. Wow. Please keep it up. And the dedication in prompt updating of description. 🙏
Drop I, he meant that...
Bowdown to master
That last part
How do he know division make conflict
Not everything is conditioned, where there is insight there is no conditioning.
What he is saying is that you need to meditate?
🙏🙏🙏
❤
I have to say I got thoroughly confused by his apparent references to the relative I (AKA ego) which is made of fear and the absolute I (AKA timeless awareness) which is one with the impersonal sensation of fear.
But the I is there..! 😬😁😵....... 😄😄.
That's the fact Sir..., which everyone must realize. 😊🙏🏽🙏🏽👐🏼👌🏼😇🙌🏽😊
Original
The conditioning and the unconditioning Is one in the same. You don't simply strip away your conditioning, you obscured it along the unconditioning
How do you strip away the conditioning? That is the whole point.
Stop seeing your past experience as the present moment. The present is all there is. The past doesn't exist Or the future.
There is conditioning and then there is you. Now you and conditioning are the same. Observer is the observed. Now watch that. Who is then the new watcher? Has it not been always there? Watching what? Watching the conditioned (Conditioning plus you). Can we observe/watch the watcher!
I is that
But wait, I thought the "I" is separate to the mind and thoughts 🤔
It is seperate , but he is explaining that the "I " we think we are is still mind & thought.
Ultimately it's not. Everything is seamlessly connected, though from a dualistic perception it is more helpful to speak to things as if they are separate.
Because of the ultimate lack of separation none of these things technically exist anyway. The I is the also the ego which is also the entirety of all that is, because the beginning of a rope and the end of the rope are both the rope. The distinctions we make are only temporarily meaningful because they are dependant on transitory illusory perception.
How is it separate?
"I" is made up from the past experience and thoughts. And these experience thoughts try to separate itself from other thoughts and experiences.
The thinker is the thought...so according to JK, there is no division..hard to digest but it might be true..so far " I " feel that I am diffrent from my thoughts, but that I : the observer itself is past..🤔
Is there a difference between you and your conditioning 🥶🤯
I don't know who I am
So I hear people repeatedly saying you are not your feelings, you are not your thoughts. Is this talk saying in fact you are your feelings, you are your thoughts, you are your conditioning?
yes, according to him. This is the part most difficult to understand.
Isn't the one who's watching is also the conditioning.... because the mind started behaving in this manner after listening to krisnamurti....so it's again conditioning, isn't it?
Thought this too at some point, but in my understanding, it is not. While observing you will notice certain feelings, which I tend to see as a background thought/ulterior motive. These will come to the surface if you keep observing. Observing is practiced to distance yourself from your active thinking, so you don't identify with it. While you observe you will start to see the patterns that you believed and formed your condition.
At first you might think that observing is another trick by the ego, but it's not. It's more that you thinking, that when you are observing is again conditioning, is the trick by your ego.
But if you go into the observer state with the goal to dissolve your ego, than this is your ego hiding again behind that motive. Observing means sitting still and observing without any goal and without any motive.
I might be false here it's just how I see it currently.
Yes if your not quietly,lovingly,facing this.If your stuck in this dead end ditch it will still own you...Real life(being) is not stuck its love,it’s enough,it’s free.That is your responsibility not Buddha’s,Krishnamuurtis,or any one else’s..May grace find you....
Here is how I understand it:
The I and the conditioning is the thought. So he is talking about observing your thought. So you kind of step away of the conditioning. In that observation there is no sense of I nor past nor future. Just the observation itself. The difference is that you dont observe it with your thought (that would be concentration).
But actually I think this is very hard to be expressed through words. You have to live it to understand fully
yes i think whole point here is just observing so that the past or conditioned self is brought to the present self where there is no conditioning no past.. just present
everything is observed my friend, its what you do with it that is governed by your conditioning.
BTW he never answered the question, just went in a circle.
I dont understand a thing..
😂 same with me.
All the human conditioning happens on the elementary level. To literally, the five basic elements. Once the elements which are internal are harmoniously integrated with the elements manifest externally, conditioning have no way but to reset themselves. As this happens, life will always be fresh, young and vibrant. If not, the very conditioning which seems to give a person the persona which he seems to cherish will weigh him down, and will become the root cause of all miseries the moment even a small disharmony would arise in those conditioning. As it is known, no programming is ever perfect and it is bound so that some glitch happens somewhere, and problems, sufferings and sadness begins to manifest.
How does one integrate the elements?
so very true, and gratitude for life is so hard to have, when we take ourselves so highly, unable to see it wholly. we are still barbarians.
Needs a great deal of observation of ones mind to understand J.K Words.
yeah, but when you quit the observation then you understand.
naman
He was a Buddhist. Whether he agrees to it or not..
A true practitioner would know immediately.
🙏❤️
And a true Buddhist is not even a Buddhist. Because even being a Buddhist, a self comes into being.
And the dharma teaches to dissolve the 'I'.. Buddha called it non-self. Anatta.
Rather, he was a buddha. On his own right.
But he was taught Buddhist teachings deeply by the esoteric practitioners. Of the theosophical society.
He was quite literally selected to be the physical 'vessel' for the next buddha by the theosophical society. You may be very right - he may well have been a buddha.
In his notebook he speaks of an 'other' being with him. He also speaks of seeing the center of creation itself.. very curious man who knew even more than he let on. Absolutely transcendent wisdom and vision.
I understand why he chose to speak very little of the more 'mystical' side of things. It presents a path and he wanted people to find the pathless. Perhaps "find" is not even the right word. To see it and walk it for themselves, which needs an unconditioned mind
First time not agreeing. The witness is not made of the past. Did anybody really gain for this teacher.?
Just be an observer ...
you have been condition to become something in life so now you are trying to "just" be an observer :)
You can't be the observer as you are the observed.
dissolve the i
This is practically useless for 99.9999 percent of people. At the best it ll add to some knowledge
there no “I", there nothing.
❣
🙏🏻
❤️