Thank you SO MUCH for this interview! I'm currently in month 28 of tapering off 13 psychotropic drugs. I've been to hell and back many times over. Chris, all your points are so relevant, meaningful and helpful❤
Wow! That's one Hell of a number. I kicked all psych-drugs, only to end up with a tobacco habit which stabilized me fairly well. But now I'm being ordered to quit tobacco, cold turkey. Sure wish I had more time, so it's down into the swirling pit of fire I go. Withdrawal for me is every bit as horrible as described by the speaker above, so I do hope that your ride is easier than mine. But given the number you list, I can only imagine the specifics. And that being the case, my heart goes out to you. Best of luck making it across the line.
I’m a 68 year old women. I’d been taking Benzos as perscibed for over 20 or more years. The. Akathisia was indescribable. Thank god I never went to detox, although I thought I was going crazy & would exercise like my life depended on it; which it probably did. My doctor had no clue & because he’d helped me for quite a while, I trusted him when he advised no internet because I wouldn’t even take an aspirin when they talked side effects. In desperation I did look almost 2 years ago & learned so much. I wish I looked during the pandemic shut in period. I have a coach & support groups, but have almost identical symptoms as you describe. I’m tapering slowly off the Benzo, but have to trust that even my 68 year ild brain & nervous system will heal. I’ve lost many friends “social phobia”…& other symptoms. Restless energy, & inability to process info,…are 2 some of the worst, I just have to believe I will get better. Great interview. Thank you
I know you will. Being old doesn’t mean you can’t heal. You said you exercised a lot. You could be much healthier than many out there. Keep going. 🙏🏻❤️
You are a walking miracle! I endured the crazy symptoms, negligent medical field, poly drugging, shunning of friends and family, that had no understanding of the torment, but I found my way out after a couple of years. I can’t imagine going through it as long as you did. That is HOPE and perseverance. It happened to me in ‘96, when the internet was fairly new to every home. I somehow stumbled on the Ashton Method and a small group of people suffering like I was. I left no stone unturned in finding the answer. I’m nearly 30 years free, with no after affects. Praise the Lord. There is HOPE! This channel is so amazing, and I know it will be life saving for many!
Great interview! Nicole Lamberson mentioned you were on, Chris, so I immediately watched this! (I also watched another interview you did a couple of years ago). Two points I think are really important: 1. I don't think akathisia should be defined only as the movement part. I think you can have a lot of the internal, severe agitation and many other horrible symptoms - and only some of the movement part - and still call it akathisia. People can look pretty normal on the outside while experiencing excruciating inner akathisia; and, 2. It's easy to hold onto frustration and disappointment about the reactions and advice of family and friends, but they have no idea how to help and usually give very unhelpful advice as a result of society's ignorance. They're just trying to do their best in a very difficult situation, so much more education and awareness is needed. Big thanks to you and Dr. Josef for all you're doing!
I agree Susan about the akathisia, that was my experience also, like I had a coat hanger stuck in an electrical outlet and I could not let go. I did not have the need to pace. These drugs fried my brains and body and I hate them so much.
Thank you for this, I attempted my life severely last july, from a antidepressants, to be put on more medicine in the hospital, and benzos, I know we all need healing stories, Im sort of getting my life back, its been so hard. Thank you.
Compassion for the patient is what's in short supply in the medical field. If only every pdoc could experience just for 5 minutes what akathisia feels like. It would be extremely helpful to know how different psych meds cause akathisia. Is there a universal cause or are there multiple mechanisms that cause it? Is there a deficiency/overabundance of any particular neurotransmitter, and if so, where in the brain? And why does propranalol help some people, which does nothing on dopamine that seems to play a role in akathisia? The glutamate theory seems to make sense. Maybe this is why biperiden (an NMDA antagonist) seems to help. I'm curious about your thoughts on this. Maybe you could provide links to some good reading on this problem?
A message of hope .. a share it with someone who desperately needs hope in here worst suffering from Akathisia an dystonia injured by Benzo’s . Thank you so much 🙏🙏
It was absolutely impossible for me to work and I had to go on disability due to benzo withdrawal. My main symptom was akathisia and I wish I was strong enough to stay off, but I ended up reinstating. I want to come off completely, but have only been able to taper my dose from 40mg diazepam to 15 mg. I’m still disabled, but can function better than before. I feel like less of a person because I’m still on this drug. I quit all benzo support groups due to constant negativity. I’m glad you were able to heal and share your story!
Don't allow anybody to make you feel like an outsider of something that you are a part of. Getting off of benzos is very, very hard, and not everybody does it on their first try. You'll do it one day...in your time. 🙏✝💖
@@ministryofpeacekmk Thank you!! It’s actually my 3rd time. The first 2 were CT’s and made me so much worse. You’re right though, I shouldn’t feel bad for not being off yet. I know God has me. God Bless ❤️🙏🏻
Thank you 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼 I had 16 years on Serapax 180mg daily the last two years plus 90mg Mirtazipine. Dropped off both December 2020 over 11 days, in a hospital detox (AUSTRALIA) it’s been 27 months of hellish terror & so far NO Drs here acknowledge my terror & other symptoms are not recognised as related to this rapid withdrawal. Like you iv been diagnosed with numerous mental health conditions & prescribed 9 different psyc meds ‘none helped’ I to ended up 4 hospital admissions & one time 8 days in psyc ward same experience, more psyc meds prescribed, again none helped. I am still looking for acknowledgment & help… 😞
@@Waves353 🙏🏼❤️ yes, it’s one day, sometimes one minute at a time isn’t it.. it’s the HOPE that something will change, the HOPE that it has to get better & better. Very very difficult but right now HOPE, for me is all that keeps me going. This was interview was such an acknowledgment of symptoms for me, that after five GPs & four psycs, I still had not been able to get in Australia. No one told me what I possibly was in for, & for however long… Take Care 🙏🏼🤗
Awesome Interview. Right On Chris with everything. YOU are the first that is truly addressing the akathisia issue. I really would like to direct message you if possible Is that possible. Dr. Doerring thank you for your information always and bringing light to benzo. We need help in the medical field. There needs to be change. I know that this hell I am going through serves a purpose and for me it means helping others. I am committed to helping. Anyway Chris how can I DM you. Thank You Dr. Doerring.
16 mg of clonapin over 3.5 months is only about 0.15 mg a day. It is incredible how poisenous that garbage is. Thanks for telling your story and all you do. Thanks Joseph too.
What an interesting story. Reminds me of Les Miserable. Is it possible that the effects of psychotropics are not the same for everyone. It seems that there are either metabolic differences or individual structural differences between people an neurotropic medications lead to more damage in some but not all people
I believe there are many forms of Akathisia, but most people are experiencing adrenaline surges and mistaking it for Akathisia. I also think there are different forms of Akathisia, however. I have had them all. 1) Walking/Inability to sit still for a second for 18 hours a day (pacing) 2) Mental Akathisia - racing and looping intrusive thoughts 24/7 for YEARS - not many have this, and when combined with pacing, it's another level of torture 3) Focal Akathisia - adrenaline/trapped energy/internal vibrating/terror that focuses on different body parts (brain, neck/throat, chest, torso, legs - anywhere in the body). This usually happens when slow-tapering a drug that masks Akathisia, such as mirtazapine. A significant histamine component and 5H2TA antagonism. In my opinion, Akathisia is low dopamine in one area of the brain and high in another. There is also a considerable OCD component to Akathisia that is not commonly discussed. I am an extremely severe case, and think I would be a good fit for an interview. I am not healed; however, 4.5 years off adverse/kindling/reinstatement reaction clonazepam. Polydrugged with antipschoyics and remeron. Six psych ward stays. Second to second survival, 0 windows, but I know I will heal one day.
It only took me a little over 2 weeks of continuous use to cause almost 3 years of nonstop hell. The benzo basically stopped working after about 1 week. Then when I started cutting down.... all hell broke loose. and life for me also is now better than ever...Praise God.
Great interview and I am glad to learn that my approach mirrors yours Chris. I had a question - have you or any of your clients developed dysautonomia as a result of withdrawal?
33 years on lorazepam and was stopped much to quick. Now my legs and feet are shaking and cramping 18 hours a Day since 25 month's! Pain!! Will this torture ever stop?
How do we get a hold of this guy? He was like the only doctor in Ohio and the one other guys that was going to help me from the benzodiapine coalition Brett Jones, doesn't work at the same place anymore which sucks.
I am one of the people who got a severe injury from trintellix (a Benzo antagonist for 20 days). Every symptom that has ever been spoken of on these forums, I have it.
@@germainedenon311 Well..I don't relly want to give out my email or phone on TH-cam.... But I can respond to ANY questions you hae right here. If you have never heard MY story..it is right here th-cam.com/video/595-neD7Zrc/w-d-xo.html
@@taperclinic Absolutely... great video. I learned a lot about my own condition. Specifically about pacing the floor. I had no idea that was Akathesia. Keep spreading the knowledge. It's much appreciated!
I’ve experienced the opposite. Gaslit because I was not bedbound. Not sick enough. Not disabled enough. Not a bad withdrawal because I could work three days a week. The community is incredibly judgmental. Are you actually healed if you are still on two very powerful meds? I’m curious. Maybe it’s masking symptoms and if you came off those medications would you still be healed?
No tapering for me, and certainly not over the kind of time-span described--months and/or years. I'm crawling out of my skin just contemplating the prospect. The mood swings and insomnia are aweful, and there is no such thing as a truly beneificial psychiatric drug when it comes to treating this condition. Tobacco, so long a basis of stabilization amidst the strom, has to go. And go fast. Much appreciate the discussion as one must set expectations. Because it's true. Once the system is destabilized, the goal usually is stabilization by whatever means are necessary. But in this case, there's no choice. So it's cold-turkey or bust. And that means enduring the worst of the worst, with tobacco very much as witnessed with bernzos and SSRI's. It's a crazy trap.
I was floxed too in 2013 for 60 days... My Symptoms started later in 2015 with insomnia, anxiety and akathisa. The clinic can only operate with lyrica and clonazepam. Is there another way to medicate the adverse effects from Cipro? How can the damage be undone?
Dr. B. I want to know if benzodiazepine effects can pass on to the baby through the father who has been prescribed. Does it Effect the sperms and can it damage the baby??? My son was born when I was taking them. He is having some weight issues and mood issues am worried. He was in nicu after birth.
Thank you SO MUCH for this interview! I'm currently in month 28 of tapering off 13 psychotropic drugs. I've been to hell and back many times over. Chris, all your points are so relevant, meaningful and helpful❤
Wow! That's one Hell of a number. I kicked all psych-drugs, only to end up with a tobacco habit which stabilized me fairly well.
But now I'm being ordered to quit tobacco, cold turkey. Sure wish I had more time, so it's down into the swirling pit of fire I go. Withdrawal
for me is every bit as horrible as described by the speaker above, so I do hope that your ride is easier than mine. But given the number
you list, I can only imagine the specifics. And that being the case, my heart goes out to you. Best of luck making it across the line.
Hey pls how can i contact you.
I’m a 68 year old women. I’d been taking Benzos as perscibed for over 20 or more years. The. Akathisia was indescribable. Thank god I never went to detox, although I thought I was going crazy & would exercise like my life depended on it; which it probably did. My doctor had no clue & because he’d helped me for quite a while, I trusted him when he advised no internet because I wouldn’t even take an aspirin when they talked side effects. In desperation I did look almost 2 years ago & learned so much. I wish I looked during the pandemic shut in period. I have a coach & support groups, but have almost identical symptoms as you describe. I’m tapering slowly off the Benzo, but have to trust that even my 68 year ild brain & nervous system will heal. I’ve lost many friends “social phobia”…& other symptoms. Restless energy, & inability to process info,…are 2 some of the worst, I just have to believe I will get better. Great interview. Thank you
I know you will. Being old doesn’t mean you can’t heal. You said you exercised a lot. You could be much healthier than many out there. Keep going. 🙏🏻❤️
❤
For me all this began from Cipro too. And then I was polydrugged after being told all the Cipro symptoms were in my head!
One of the best interviews ever. The hope is invaluable. Thanks so much Chris & Josef.
thank you
This is amazing; I’m in my second year of this bs and it seems to be lifting.
I am seriously considering coaching; we got this!
You are a walking miracle! I endured the crazy symptoms, negligent medical field, poly drugging, shunning of friends and family, that had no understanding of the torment, but I found my way out after a couple of years. I can’t imagine going through it as long as you did. That is HOPE and perseverance. It happened to me in ‘96, when the internet was fairly new to every home. I somehow stumbled on the Ashton Method and a small group of people suffering like I was. I left no stone unturned in finding the answer. I’m nearly 30 years free, with no after affects. Praise the Lord. There is HOPE! This channel is so amazing, and I know it will be life saving for many!
Great interview, both of you! So glad you made it, Chris.
Thank you, Dr. Witt-Doerring, and thank you, Chris Paige for shedding light on these difficult issues.
Our pleasure!
Great interview! Nicole Lamberson mentioned you were on, Chris, so I immediately watched this! (I also watched another interview you did a couple of years ago). Two points I think are really important: 1. I don't think akathisia should be defined only as the movement part. I think you can have a lot of the internal, severe agitation and many other horrible symptoms - and only some of the movement part - and still call it akathisia. People can look pretty normal on the outside while experiencing excruciating inner akathisia; and, 2. It's easy to hold onto frustration and disappointment about the reactions and advice of family and friends, but they have no idea how to help and usually give very unhelpful advice as a result of society's ignorance. They're just trying to do their best in a very difficult situation, so much more education and awareness is needed. Big thanks to you and Dr. Josef for all you're doing!
I agree Susan about the akathisia, that was my experience also, like I had a coat hanger stuck in an electrical outlet and I could not let go. I did not have the need to pace. These drugs fried my brains and body and I hate them so much.
Thank you for this, I attempted my life severely last july, from a antidepressants, to be put on more medicine in the hospital, and benzos, I know we all need healing stories, Im sort of getting my life back, its been so hard. Thank you.
Thank you for saying one improves. & Yes, HOPE is the one thing I try to hold one to. 🙏🏼🇦🇺
The most helpful Benzodiazepine withdrawl interview I have found yet 🙏🏼 Thank you with all of my heart 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼
Glad it was helpful!
Gosh Chris you suffered, like so many, thank goodness you are improving.
Thank you for this insightful interview, Chris you are a godsend to this community.
i agree!
Beautiful interview, thank you 😊
Glad you enjoyed it!
Compassion for the patient is what's in short supply in the medical field. If only every pdoc could experience just for 5 minutes what akathisia feels like.
It would be extremely helpful to know how different psych meds cause akathisia. Is there a universal cause or are there multiple mechanisms that cause it? Is there a deficiency/overabundance of any particular neurotransmitter, and if so, where in the brain? And why does propranalol help some people, which does nothing on dopamine that seems to play a role in akathisia? The glutamate theory seems to make sense. Maybe this is why biperiden (an NMDA antagonist) seems to help. I'm curious about your thoughts on this. Maybe you could provide links to some good reading on this problem?
Thank you and I have a paper coming out soon that addresses this specifically
Thank you. Gives me hope x
A message of hope .. a share it with someone who desperately needs hope in here worst suffering from Akathisia an dystonia injured by Benzo’s . Thank you so much 🙏🙏
Great interview! Thanks Josef again
Thanks for listening
Chris, your so spot on in your description
It was absolutely impossible for me to work and I had to go on disability due to benzo withdrawal. My main symptom was akathisia and I wish I was strong enough to stay off, but I ended up reinstating. I want to come off completely, but have only been able to taper my dose from 40mg diazepam to 15 mg. I’m still disabled, but can function better than before. I feel like less of a person because I’m still on this drug. I quit all benzo support groups due to constant negativity. I’m glad you were able to heal and share your story!
Don't allow anybody to make you feel like an outsider of something that you are a part of. Getting off of benzos is very, very hard, and not everybody does it on their first try. You'll do it one day...in your time. 🙏✝💖
@@ministryofpeacekmk Thank you!! It’s actually my 3rd time. The first 2 were CT’s and made me so much worse. You’re right though, I shouldn’t feel bad for not being off yet. I know God has me. God Bless ❤️🙏🏻
Less of a person? You made it from 40mg to 15! You are a hero. No matter what you do from now on. (Continue taper, hold, stay on that).
@@naomimara3340 Thank You!! ❤️
Thank you 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼 I had 16 years on Serapax 180mg daily the last two years plus 90mg Mirtazipine. Dropped off both December 2020 over 11 days, in a hospital detox (AUSTRALIA) it’s been 27 months of hellish terror & so far NO Drs here acknowledge my terror & other symptoms are not recognised as related to this rapid withdrawal. Like you iv been diagnosed with numerous mental health conditions & prescribed 9 different psyc meds ‘none helped’ I to ended up 4 hospital admissions & one time 8 days in psyc ward same experience, more psyc meds prescribed, again none helped. I am still looking for acknowledgment & help… 😞
Thinking of you. Sounds similar, poly drugged and growing diagnoses. Hang in there, as painful as it is 💕
@@Waves353 🙏🏼❤️ yes, it’s one day, sometimes one minute at a time isn’t it.. it’s the HOPE that something will change, the HOPE that it has to get better & better. Very very difficult but right now HOPE, for me is all that keeps me going. This was interview was such an acknowledgment of symptoms for me, that after five GPs & four psycs, I still had not been able to get in Australia. No one told me what I possibly was in for, & for however long… Take Care 🙏🏼🤗
❤
Awesome Interview. Right On Chris with everything.
YOU are the first that is truly addressing the akathisia issue. I really would like to direct message you if possible
Is that possible.
Dr. Doerring thank you for your information always and bringing light to benzo. We need help in the medical field. There needs to be change. I know that this hell I am going through serves a purpose and for me it means helping others. I am committed to helping. Anyway Chris how can I DM you. Thank You Dr. Doerring.
thank you
Oh my god, this my story. I had prostatitis, prescribed Cipro and ended up benzos. I can’t believe this happened to you too. 😭
16 mg of clonapin over 3.5 months is only about 0.15 mg a day. It is incredible how poisenous that garbage is. Thanks for telling your story and all you do. Thanks Joseph too.
Chris Paige
Thank You
Can I ask you how you are tapering the mirtazapine?
I’m on 7.5 mg and having gi issues including two bouts of diverticulitis
What an interesting story. Reminds me of Les Miserable.
Is it possible that the effects of psychotropics are not the same for everyone.
It seems that there are either metabolic differences or individual structural differences between people an neurotropic medications lead to more damage in some but not all people
I believe there are many forms of Akathisia, but most people are experiencing adrenaline surges and mistaking it for Akathisia. I also think there are different forms of Akathisia, however. I have had them all.
1) Walking/Inability to sit still for a second for 18 hours a day (pacing)
2) Mental Akathisia - racing and looping intrusive thoughts 24/7 for YEARS - not many have this, and when combined with pacing, it's another level of torture
3) Focal Akathisia - adrenaline/trapped energy/internal vibrating/terror that focuses on different body parts (brain, neck/throat, chest, torso, legs - anywhere in the body). This usually happens when slow-tapering a drug that masks Akathisia, such as mirtazapine. A significant histamine component and 5H2TA antagonism.
In my opinion, Akathisia is low dopamine in one area of the brain and high in another. There is also a considerable OCD component to Akathisia that is not commonly discussed.
I am an extremely severe case, and think I would be a good fit for an interview. I am not healed; however, 4.5 years off adverse/kindling/reinstatement reaction clonazepam. Polydrugged with antipschoyics and remeron. Six psych ward stays. Second to second survival, 0 windows, but I know I will heal one day.
It only took me a little over 2 weeks of continuous use to cause almost 3 years of nonstop hell. The benzo basically stopped working after about 1 week. Then when I started cutting down.... all hell broke loose. and life for me also is now better than ever...Praise God.
Chris Paige you the best
Great interview and I am glad to learn that my approach mirrors yours Chris. I had a question - have you or any of your clients developed dysautonomia as a result of withdrawal?
33 years on lorazepam and was stopped much to quick. Now my legs and feet are shaking and cramping 18 hours a Day since 25 month's! Pain!! Will this torture ever stop?
I wonder if Chris was able to sleep during the time he was unwell.
How do we get a hold of this guy? He was like the only doctor in Ohio and the one other guys that was going to help me from the benzodiapine coalition Brett Jones, doesn't work at the same place anymore which sucks.
I am one of the people who got a severe injury from trintellix (a Benzo antagonist for 20 days). Every symptom that has ever been spoken of on these forums, I have it.
Thank you so much for this. What can people use for sleep, when at night your body is just firing with adrenaline and you can’t rest? Thank you.
Thank you so much. Chris I have been on a similar trajectory. You really bring hope. Do you do coaching for Australian clients?
It was literally IMPOSSIBLE for me to work...I lost my 20 year career over benzo "withdrawal".
same, i read that i have recovered. can i speak to you on this?
@@germainedenon311 yes
@@Q1776Q anyway to reach u directly? I have very severe symptoms
@@germainedenon311 Well..I don't relly want to give out my email or phone on TH-cam.... But I can respond to ANY questions you hae right here.
If you have never heard MY story..it is right here th-cam.com/video/595-neD7Zrc/w-d-xo.html
Have you considered applying for the "From a Licensed Doctor" certification from TH-cam?
Thanks for this comment, I didn't know it existed I've applied
@@taperclinic Absolutely... great video. I learned a lot about my own condition. Specifically about pacing the floor. I had no idea that was Akathesia. Keep spreading the knowledge. It's much appreciated!
Is there anyone near Michigan that can help with an adverse reaction to medication?
I’ve experienced the opposite. Gaslit because I was not bedbound. Not sick enough. Not disabled enough. Not a bad withdrawal because I could work three days a week. The community is incredibly judgmental.
Are you actually healed if you are still on two very powerful meds? I’m curious. Maybe it’s masking symptoms and if you came off those medications would you still be healed?
He has a video on this in this channel
Does he help people that are in that state of a dysregulated nervous system? Getting over benzo withdrawal etc.
He does. Google Chris Paige LSCW, he HD a website. There are other coaches and supports too
Chris and I both do this
Does he still counsel? I can’t find him.
Social work is not psychotherapy
No tapering for me, and certainly not over the kind of time-span described--months and/or years. I'm crawling out of my skin just contemplating the prospect.
The mood swings and insomnia are aweful, and there is no such thing as a truly beneificial psychiatric drug when it comes to treating this condition.
Tobacco, so long a basis of stabilization amidst the strom, has to go. And go fast. Much appreciate the discussion as one must set expectations.
Because it's true. Once the system is destabilized, the goal usually is stabilization by whatever means are necessary. But in this case, there's no choice.
So it's cold-turkey or bust. And that means enduring the worst of the worst, with tobacco very much as witnessed with bernzos and SSRI's. It's a crazy trap.
I was floxed too in 2013 for 60 days... My Symptoms started later in 2015 with insomnia, anxiety and akathisa. The clinic can only operate with lyrica and clonazepam. Is there another way to medicate the adverse effects from Cipro? How can the damage be undone?
If you think things are bad enough in America, it's worse in the UK. Nobody seems to care or know much about anything
Unfortunately, it happens the same thing in Spain.
Dr. B. I want to know if benzodiazepine effects can pass on to the baby through the father who has been prescribed. Does it Effect the sperms and can it damage the baby??? My son was born when I was taking them. He is having some weight issues and mood issues am worried. He was in nicu after birth.
I used to sit Infront of hospitals. I eventually got kicked out by security.
Can u talk about CLDR CHRISTIE HUFF KILLING HERSELF AFTER SHE STARTED BENZO COALITION & WAS OFF OF KLONOPON 5 ZyEARS!!!!!!
🙏🙏
rambling but inteeresting
This is obviously very serious stuff. Wondering if anyone has tried a course of somatic body exercises to try and help regulate nervous systeM?
Robinson Joseph Walker Anna Thompson Timothy
Classic pathologising.