Dell P1130 CRT Review
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ม.ค. 2020
- A Sony Trinitron in disguise! Here I "review" a CRT from 2003.
Hardforum Sony FW900 thread:
hardforum.com/threads/24-wide...
spacediver's WPB Guide:
hardforum.com/threads/windas-...
Convergence guide:
hardforum.com/threads/24-wide... - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
“I love crt”. Words I haven’t heard since watching steins gate.
What you mean?
@@guisampaio2008 its an anime, the charachters work out of a room above a CRT store and repair shop in 2011. Infact CRT's are the secret to make time travel possible.
@@EllRiver How?
@@guisampaio2008 So it was a little complicated but effectively the data was being compressed by the massive vacuum tubes and sent through a connection that was accidently connected to Cerns super colider which happend to be a time machine of sorts. With phone controlled microwave being the control mechanism. This was all an accident but the core concept is what invents time travel.
xD
Man, LCDs were a mistake. A stopgap technology giving people what they thought they wanted. I remember my first LCD, in 2008, was such a disappointment.
Ah you see people would rather have a monitor that doesn't weigh 60lb and take up half a desk also find me a 500hz CRT
@@theaverageblitzer4351 the maximum refresh rate that a normal person would use is 240, and there are many CRTs going easily up to 180hz which is still more than enough for the most competitive gamer.
And by the way they're 20 years old monitors that weren't even intended for extreme esports gaming.
If a CRT would be made today for gamers, it would easily reach 500hz.
Also, CRTs even with lower refresh rate are still better for gamers than 240hz LCDs because they have 0 latency and handle motion much better: your "but they can't do 500hz so they're useless 🤓🤓😭😭😭" argument makes no sense because the benefits of a CRT are still better for gamers, a 180hz CRT is much better than a 500hz LCD for gaming.
@LeoTheHuman_ there would be zero input delay if any modern gpu didn't have to go through a digital to analog converter and CRTs can consume like 200-400w of power compared to like 65w for an LCD or OLED also 240hz oled looks better when it comes to blacks and color depth overall the only way a CRT can match those refresh rates is by dropping below 1024x768 which is unacceptable the only advantage CRTs have is res scaling
@@theaverageblitzer4351 Well, with a non-VGA GPU I wouldn't buy a CRT to use it with an adapter and get so much latency, but for any older hardware I would definetly get one.
CRTs don't consume over 200w at worst, they're still mostly under 100w.
In color depth and especially blacks, CRTs are much better: I just watched a lot of comparsions, you should go watch some because here CRTs are clear winners and close seconds only to OLEDs.
Also no, only on a low end monitor you'd need to drop down the resolution to sub-720 for a high refresh rate, and well on a over 1440p resolution most modern games won't even run at such high framerates anyways.
And even sub-720p resolutions on a CRT mostly look better than +1080p on a LCD.
the montor just goes back far, most peoples desk have room@@theaverageblitzer4351
I'm a 15 year old that loves CRT TVs and I think they look cooler and more high-definition in my perspective than the LCD screens.
this is one of the best videos I have watched that discusses the pros and cons between cathode ray tubes and flat panel displays
It's by far the best I've seen.
I purchased one of these new in 2003-2004 for $100 with shipping. Loved it dearly and it made me postpone switching to LCD until at least 2009-10! I never knew the obscurity or true power of it (one of the highest end consumer CRTs) and wound up giving it to a scrapyard after a few issues that likely could've been remedied with a couple cap replacements. I have missed it ever since.
That's heart wrenching to hear...!
i still using one from 2005, samsung syncmaster. truly highend trinitron monitor. got it for $10, when people got mad from LCD, and was trowing out these massive space eaters in quantities. If I would know, and have more room, I would take at least 10 of them.
Do you remember the type of CRT you had?
What a nice screen. I used to have one myself, it unfortunately died few years ago, after 15+ years of service. Unfortunately in my case the CRT itself died, it developed internal short and the power from the green gun started to leak in to the red one. As a result, over time I had to tone up the green and town down the red to keep the image color balanced, right before death I had green at 100%, blue about 70% gain and red at 20%. It also started to suffer from the common issue of being "too bright before warm-up", and in last years in those bright periods it started to have red flashes which sometimes resulted by the power supply's self shutdown. I have measured the voltages and they were all fine, all guns were powered equally, so the issue was in the CRT itself. Well, thankfully for it to die it took years so it was not a "sudden surprise". By death I mark the point the red flashes became constant and did not go away after warmup.
I have other CRTs of almost equal quality tho, my daily used one is IBM P260. Nice and very bright, high contrast and gamut, but it has developed a flaw of the screen being too bright (and even more so before warmup), so I had to dig in and add manual potentiometers to control the brightness. After this fix it keeps working fine and ironically "thanks" to it I can drive it very hard to the point I sometimes have to lower the contrast. Other two are NEC FE1250+, two units, one stored as backup one used. The one being used has also developed a flaw, before warmup the image can be horizontally a bit shorter, by about 0,5cm on each side, it stretches slowly as it warms up. I consider this not a serious issue, probably just a capacitor, this screen is noticeably sharper than the IBM P260 at high resolutions, but less bright.
Overall, they are all veterans that are starting to show old age, but as long as the CRT is fine, everything else can be repaired. Iv so far had to retire 2 CRTs, the Dell, and IBM P200, which was my first high-end model, and I ran that thing to the ground, I ran so many hours on it that the CRT gun became tired over the years and lost most of its contrast/brightness, but otherwise it still worked fine. That thing was a trooper.
I have P1130 with identicial problem as yours. It's too bright on start, and it has flicker red color at turn on. I think it's going to die.
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Thank you for this beautiful comment sir
dang, you seem to know a lot about CRT's and keeping them running over the years.
I wish I had your knowledge as I just picked up an RCA TruFlat TV, a Toshiba 20FA44 I believe, and a 32 inch Sony Trinitron KV-32FS210 which is a 160 pound beast.
wow, such a quality in-depth review and tutorial, it answered the pvm hyped broadcast monitors demand for retro all in one gaming crt monitor. you saved me from buying that expensive crt and opted to med quality average consumer PC monitors, for such having capability of that pvm with more affordable price. sir, you deserved a sub!
I'm in love with your channel and I am binge-watching your videos
This video brought good old memories :D awesome review, keep it up!
This is the the BEST CRT explanation video on TH-cam. This guy tells you everything. Excellent job. I’m looking for one of these crt monitors now.
Thank you! Sometimes you can find them on craigslist by searching for "dell monitor" instead of CRT. But I think most people now know what they have. Good luck!
By far the best in-depth look at modern CRT use! Thank You!!
Absolutely brilliant video sir, like others have said I think you covered everything that everyone should know about CRTs and how they compare to LCDs, you went the extra mile with all the explanations too. I will be sure to link to this video to people when I explain why CRTs are still very relevant to this day.
just checked for new videos yesterday hoping for more of the excellent monitor reviews you make x) (by far the best on youtube). guess I was a day to early to get my wish fulfilled o:
you are an amazing narrator, thanks a lot for this work.
My P1130 waits for a recap, need to prepare myself for that mentally), but even now the experience is great.
I have a P1130, used it for a while, then got a FW900 (which I use as my main monitor). The P1130 has an intermittent short in the tube which I think I managed to almost-fix (it still sometimes happens but only briefly and only when the tube is cold, there is no reasonable way to fix that unless it gets worse). Then did the white point calibration and it looks nice now. It is not as bright as the FW900, but I do not need that much light (some LCDs are a bit too bright for me even at the lowest setting). So, now I have a working P1130 and some skills in repairing CRTs. I still hope to find a FW900 to keep as a spare though.
It's a shame CRT monitors are not made anymore.
Just saw you link this on the monitors subreddit. What an excellent video! You got a new subscriber.
Shadow mask CRT monitors made in the late 90s and early 2000s really did catch up to Trinitrons when it came to dot pitch (also brightness). These P1130 have a horizontal dot pitch of .24 mm. I actually own a ViewSonic A90-2 shadow mask with a horizontal dot pitch of .22mm. I also had a Dell trinitron 1000hs and the Viewsonic was noticeably much sharper and brighter then the Trinitron to the degree that I replaced my Trinitron with it and gave the Dell to my buddy to enjoy. Shadow mask viewsonics from that time really were something special I recommend keeping an eye out for one and grabbing it if you ever come across one.
Your post on reddit is one of the first results to pop up when searching for the ViewSonic A90-2! Looking at your videos, driving games like Forza really demonstrate how CRTs blow away LCDs in terms of motion clarity.
@@ApertureGrille Thanks lol I didn't know my posts would pop up on that. And yeah I've been meaning to make more videos I'm just currently trying to get a better setup. I'm still using my phone to record and I just got a tripod for it the other day. I just wanna show off how good some games look on CRTs. Not every game looks amazing but a lot do and if you are after the best quality the black levels, motion clarity, softness they have really can make a nice difference.
Diamontron is also an aperture grille I guess
I know this was 4 years ago but maybe I will find a viewsonic shadow mask one of these days. I have a 32 inch sony trinitron i picked up off the curb and its a huge TV, but I love the CRT monitors the most because they remind me of the old days playing games with my dad
This is a great video showing some amazing comparisons.
story time: back in 2005 i bought a dell dimension and the retailer was literally begging me to get a flat 17" screen over the 19" crt that i wanted and offered me a discount of nearly 150$ on a digital camera (big deal lol) and i said no because i hated how lcd screen looks on laptops back then, since 2010 the whole pc was sitting in the closet with a bunch of useless things because it was so heavy to carry it to my place, until a saw the Digital Foundry video, i was so happy that the monitor was still there nearly intact.
This video looks great on my GDM-C520K. Nicely done.
These reviews are incredilby informative, well scripted, and well edited too. I also really like how you talk like patrick bateman explaining huey lewis and the news when talking about what a monitor does well.
that's a tonn of research behind that video
thank you truly, it's so interesting
I appreciate your hard work)
I think I can remember those Dell CRTs from advertising.. I always liked that Dell dark grey stealth look, and the super flat trinitron tube..
Great video. I just saved two P1130 from the trash yesterday. My old 19” trinitron had a blow driver IC a few years back so I ditched it. Afaict the P1130 is a 4:3 version of the FW 900 with a dot pitch that is 0.24 mm rather than 0.23 and fewer input options. The FW900 is the Cadillac but this puppy’s the Lincoln. I didn’t realize how nice a find these monitors were.
If something in CRT blows they're easy enough to fix it you know how to be safe. you don't have to throw it out, big waste
@@NicheAsQuiche Yeah man let me just go out and find a replacement FBT or driver IC that stopped being made decades ago. Unlike you I actually know how to fix CRTs and do it. Not all can be saved. Fuck off.
Awesome video,you went into great detail and cool how you got native scanlines.
I just got a Dell E773c for free off craigslist,got my pi running on it with a hdmi to vga,have it outputting 240p at 120hz
Nice! Free really is the best price for a monitor!
Is it any good? What have you been using it for?
Super in depth and a very good explaination.
Thank you! I've still got this CRT right beside me. I'm going to keep it going forever!
Technically, the Dreamcast VGA signal is an improperly coded 720x480 signal, not 640x480.
Amazing video showing step by step why CRT are so good. Liked and subbed!
Awesome! Thank you!
I have one CRT to give in France.
Diamontron 22' from Mitsubishi, fully working, no glass scratch, refresh rates up to 160hz in the lower res.
You can check some of my fps gameplay using it.
A lot of people don't seem to realize if your CRT is emitting a high pitch noise, which it shouldn't do, it's because of the power supply it's plugged into, it is similar to the background noise you get on a sound system, interference as well as just a dirty power grid can cause this. All you need is a power strip with a filter, as well as ideally a kettle lead for your CRTs that also has filtering, not only will it get rid of any high-pitched noise it will give you a cleaner, flicker free image. Your audio quality will be much better too.
I wish i knew this.
Thanks, this is some good info to know. I don't know how to get a cable with filtering but a power strip is easy enough to get.
i used a big crt tv as the tv for the bedroom up until a year or two ago but now i use it for my old consoles
I'd love to see more CRT reviews. Specifically the models you'd expect offices to dump in bulk. Personally if I could find one that can do 1280x1024 90Hz and do it well, for dirt cheap/free, that'd be great.
the sharpens contrast ratio is overrated, natural "bloom" is an attractive image trait, and cinematographers try their best to encourage it. to much contrast ratio can look digital or in a movie, look like a soap opera, falling for the tech specs of technology can actually blind ones aesthetic until its too late and that aesthetic is sort of lost. great video.
Nice vid. Found it while looking for specs to post for one I am selling. You're right! CRTS ROCK! So does PLASMA for that matter. Imagine how far along Plasma would be if Panasonic never gave up on it?
We needed more of this information 20 years ago when everybody was crazy about switching to terrible flat panels. It could have helped to prevent their "culling"
My Pre-K class had two of these in the classroom to play starfall on. Memories :P
Awesome video, thanks a lot!
Nice video! Grabbed my P1130 2 days ago for less than 20$. Previous owner said that he used it for about one month in 2003. It looks a bit used but the display is almost untouched!
wow lucky
Every Quake player will remember the pain of trying an LCD display as a replacement for their CRT. Amazing video, but depressing to realize that we are still behind 20 year old technology with respect to motion clarity. LCD strobing has a long way to go, and strobed high refresh rate displays still suffer from awful general picture quality (black levels, colors, backlight bleed, vignetting).
For emulating 224/240p 60FPS games on a VGA CRT monitor, I recommend using Retroarch at 224/240p@120Hz with black frame insertion.
It's just about as sharp as a 15kHz PVM.
1440p with a filter is much nicer
@@MaggotInfestedGod panics go back to reddit
what is PVM?
Professional Video Monitor, which is Sony's brand of professional grade 15kHz CRT monitors. The grille pitch, which is the distance between two phosphor bars of the same color, and the beam spot size are very fine on PVMs, which is what makes them professional grade.
@@darksoulzfreak thanks
I just got one of these from a free monitor pile at my local pc repair place. Found this awesome video while digging up info on mine :>
Those finds are still out there even now, you just have to keep your eyes open and be patient. I for one am completely ok with the fact my PC is potentially broken. Fair trade, universe. Fair trade.
Just found your channel, you definitely deserve more subs. I'm picking up a Iiyama Vision Master Pro 454 for free soon, i hope the CRT experience is as good as it has been hyped.
Free is good! The specs say 132 kHz horizontal frequency and 200 Hz max refresh, so the Iiyama is a bit better there than the Trinitron. If you haven't used one before, play a racing game at 1600x1200 and just watch the scenery go by.
@@ApertureGrille Yeah, just gotta figure out how to hook it up to my rtx3080 first :D
@@KotatkoVonDrapekit will not work. You need a gpu with analog input for the best experience....active converter vga hdmi are crap
@@KotatkoVonDrapek In the hardforum FW900 post they recomend using the Startech DP2VGAHD20, which reportedly hits 375 MHz pixel clock, and doesn't have weird issues like the Delock one. That's a really nice monitor BTW.
@@theunculturedswine8605 i got the delock one, the displayport connector is of awful quality but otherwise no problems, pushes the iiyama to its native res and beyond
Thanks for the vid. I still use a CRT with a 980ti to avoid the 1000s needed for a modern GPU. 1280 resolution. Everything you said was right especially the blacks in some games I can see detail in the fog I could not see in the LCD.
I need your help. I have gtx 1070 and was thinking if its better to buy high quality VGA to DP adapter or should i downgrade to 980Ti. I was gonna replace 1070 anyway but should i keep her or sell and buy 980Ti. There is Startech adapter but im still concerned that i will lose picture quality even if i get high refresh rates.
@@fiece4767 reviews I've seen say cheap adaptors are no good for high Res CRT analogue displays. I would suggest reading some reviews from geeks and trying an adaptor first if you have a LCD. Remember blur busters do a good 1080p monitor now it's on their website. If you need to use a CRT get a 980ti as at 1280 x 1024 it still rocks. 👍 and has support for Windows 10. Or get a blur busters approved monitor and if you have the money a 3060ti or AMD card equivalent.
@@fiece4767 DP to VGA adapters are pretty good, I have compared two cloned high-end Sony CRTs, one connected directly to native VGA port and one to an adapter and there's no difference in quality or higher input lag, just make sure they're passthrough and don't do any sort of scaling or postprocessing, normally the ones that do advertise it somewhere so stay away from those, only buy the "dumb" ones that only do a fast digital to analog conversion.
Such in-depth reviews, you could potentially become main TH-cam monitor reviewers. You can potentially purchase monitors review them and return for the beginning. I really wish you could review LG 27GL850-B
Thank you. It's tough when you first start out... no one is sending me monitors to review! I don't mind purchasing, but I really need to choose carefully to make sure I'm not reviewing stuff that's already been done. I don't really want to take advantage of returns, but I can probably sell the monitors after I've finished the reviews to make some of my money back.
I have plans, but it may be several weeks before I get a new video up.
@@ApertureGrille I actually have a monitor that it seems no one has done a real indepth review of, and it's cheap. Check out the Lenovo l24q-20 it's a 23.8" 1440p 60hz ips display that you can get from bestbuy for $160 honestly for the price I think it's a rather good monitor but I don't have the proper equipment to really see how good it is. Could be an interesting video.
When I still have a old crt monitor from a Dell pc my mom bought a long time ago.
The high pitch whine of CRT is age/wear/tear , they were not noisy when new, the noise comes from the high voltage transformer breaking down, changing HV transformers was routine work for TV repair men. so you can still find NOS, New Old Stock HV transformers fairly easily, worth getting one or two, they are fairly easy to solder out and in.
Just got this one from local listing. It has 47k hours and still looking awesome.
Great vid - made a lot of topics clearer for me - although I think I still need to watch it again to really get it. - I have a JVC 21" TM-A210G - which I think is amazing - it definitely doesnt do scanlines but I like the fuzzy look - there is a kinda chromatic aberration effect which seems to have been taken advantage of in some games - Mega Turrican for instance. - although that might be just because I am using composite. - I don't think I would play Sonic on an emulator, but playing Dreamcast at 640x480 sounds pretty sweet - but doesnt that lower the FPS? - It seems intuitive that if you increase resolution that you would also need to increase the hertz - how can the gun draw more horizontal lines if it doesnt move faster?. I would love to see the gun in slow mo at diff resolutions.
Nice review of my CRT Monitor, still hanging to life with some hits here and there. 1600x1200 @100Hz is best :D
Feels weird dumbing down to 1980x1080 on normal LCD monitors. Lucky for me I jump between the CRT and the 2200x1080 Galaxy S9 OLED, even sensing an LCD gives me eye cancer.
Nice tip on the NES native res solution. What's your opinion on adding scanlines to double resolutions like this?
Fantastic video. I have hopes for oled and micro-led to give me something as good when my Philips p202 gives out.
i googled "Philips p202" and got "PHILIPS LMP-P202 Projector Lamp"
so you use a projector lamp? mind if ask your use cases?
@@Vary180 no, it's a crt monitor.
@@TuiCatNZ well i blame google cuz all i see is lamps 😂
Your cadence reminds me of Christian Bale in American Psycho (Enjoying the crt vids)
Excellent video!
We had 1130s in our LAN room and they were gorgeous when running Quake and older DOS games... the design was neat too.
I still have a small CRT "farm" going albeit most are stashed away - among them big IIyama's and Suns(rebranded Trinitrons). No matter how good technology gets a CRT is awesome because it's a CRT - same with old cars like the Ford GT40 or an 80ies Lamborghini.
Thanks! I'm always glad to hear that other people collect CRTs like I do.
great video ! i found the same monitor as in the video for like 25$ and i think im going to buy it .
The thing you did a 10:00 was the most impressive configuration I ever saw for PC Crts on youtube.
Almost ALL the channels always tells us that CRT its not good enough for retro gaming because the resolution its higher than TV crts and also because they are progressive's instead of interlaced, but you just made a CRT show TRUE beautiful scanlines just as good if not better than a PVM, that's AMAZING.
You should really make a guide on how to get the most of this setting custom resolutions and making the scanlines apparent as this for different consoles/arcades... People would love to see that SPECIALY if it works with lower end CRTs, it would give a option for people that don't have/want buy a PVM because they (like me) mostly play emulators anyway.
ive got one of these left from the 3 i aquired back in 2007, I havent used it since 2010, you inspired me to pull it out of the closet for the first time in 10 years!
If you need any help setting it up, drop by the Sony FW900 thread on HardForum.
@@ApertureGrille yeah ive been lurking on there the last 2 days, after i saw this video of yours.. I bought the Delock DAC (inernationally for like $120 shipped) that has the same Synaptics IC as the famed SUNIX, so i should be able to reach 500-550MHz pixel clock resolutions, we'll see. The only thing I need help with is figuring out how to properly calibrate the P1130 without a XP PC & WinDAS lol..as i dont have access to any XP PCs anymore, or a color calibrator... any tips?
@@CubanLegend561 WinDAS will run on Win10, but you really need a colorimeter to get the most out of it following spacediver's guide. But OUCH on the price of that adapter! I'm sticking with the 980 Ti for at least a little bit longer. Spent a lot of time recently playing through Dead Cells on the CRT; it's way better than on either of my ASUS panels.
@@ApertureGrille oh neat news about WinDAS on W10 I'll def have to look into it now! would i need any special cables or things to get it working with a colorimeter to properly calibrate it? which do you recommend, and did you ever make a video of the calibration process for the P1130? Yes OUCH for that DAC price, but its worth it as these are out of production and seemingly really hard to get in the US, plus if i ever get a better CRT like a FW-900, i can use the Delock on it and reach the max res the monitor can take without issue. BTW what's the highest Pixel Clocks you've been able to get on your 980Ti and P1130 combo? oh and are there any CRT monitor Discord servers? lol
@@CubanLegend561 You can still find X-Rite DTP94 colorimeters on eBay for pretty cheap, and they work great, but they're a bit of a pain; to even install drivers, you need to disable windows driver signature enforcement, and I can't get my Ryzen system to recognize it at all.
The 980 Ti will do 400 Mhz, so I'll usually top out my CRT at 2496x1872 at 60 Hz if I want the analog super-sampled look. Most of the time, though, I use 1340x1005 at 120 Hz, and that only needs a 240 MHz pixel clock.
I just got a P1130 for 55 bucks, I love it so far, and I've barely used it with MiSTer only so far.
I will post yet another recollection
buying my first high end monitor , a Sony GDM 2038
It was second hand but nearly new and in a pawn shop for £500, this was back in 1992 i think.
I sold my body for some medical experiments, cashed the cheque, bought the monitor, which was not lightweight, carried it across the city, 1.5 miles to my friends house, then brought it home the extra 45 miles, on my motorcycle.
used the rest of the money to buy the highest end graphics card at the time, a whole whopping lotta 4MB of memory.( actually it might have been 8MB or perhaps even 16MB, it was a long time ago )
further back I recall splashing out on a 1MB graphics card , then worked my way up each time graphics card spec increased.
but at the time, it could run the monitor perfectly.
It was awesome, it took my friends, some of whom were working as games programmers, several years to get anything anywhere near it.
i still have it, and it still works.
Thank you
07:24 Thanks a LOT! The NES looks OUTSTANDING at 09:54
great vid, you should do more on CRTs!!
Thank you! I should have some new stuff coming relatively soon, and the CRT may make an appearance.
I used to have an IBM P260 and now I'll never have a monitor as cool as that ever again.
RGB Phosphor triads are not physical pixels; they are just there to provide color, they are not the building blocks of the digital image.
A monochrome CRT lacks RGB phosphors, but the image is still made up of logical pixels in the GPU's frame buffer.
Overclock it to 160hz interlaced 1920x1440i with CRU
p1130s dont accept interlace for some reason
@@usonianassembly3962 Yes mine doesn't like it somehow
that mini guide to get 448p was like water in the dessert. Been looking for that for a while, but everybody uses external scalers. I even gave up on it, an suddenly here it is. Thanks a lot
Great video
I've got a samsung syncmaster 753v looks fine but black level is high, it looks the same as my LCD monitor and color precision is not great. I tried correction via the windows controls but nothing made it better. I don't think this monitor is that bad at black level do you know of some configuration or service menu to correct it?
Honestly I've been meaning to get a CRT to play my old consoles on (mostly my wii, i crave to play Mario Galaxy again when i get everithing set up) since 2018, but it's been this year were i've really got into it. After discarding SD TV's, failing to find HD CRT's near me and not even considering BVM's for their absurd prices and scarcity, I decided on CRT monitors.
I snarched a free Flatron 915ft which i calibrated by hand (really sloppy) and, despite the wear it had, i really got to enjoy the aspects that make crt's the best for me: their adaptability (went from 240p on my various emulated games, to 480p on my Wii, to 1600x1200 or even connecting my vita to it), their cheap good black levels and motion clarity.
Sadly, i think something in the power circuit blew out yesterday. I was already looking for an aperture grille replacement for better color, so it wasn't much of a setback. I would repair it but i don't have the tools nor the time to troubleshoot. At least it definitely isn't the tube as they don't die suddenly.
Bit of a ramble, but i just wanted to say that your review was awesome and you really nailed the aspects of crt's i love. Your LCD panel reviews are also golden.
Hah, no worries. Too bad about the CRT. I don't have the skill to repair any of mine should something go wrong, so I'm hoping they last a good bit longer.
I still occasionally see 17" CRTs pop up on craigslist in my area, but people now know when they have something valuable, so trinitrons are hard to find or expensive.
@@ApertureGrille It's sad to see CRT's go, even if they are replaced by more convenient displays.
And that Trinitron scarcity is real! Over here i only see 15 inch ones pop up and then an old and very used 19-20 inches sony who can't go over 1600, for upwards of 150 euros! It makes thinking of spares really difficult.
we are together, i love CRT screens too
I've watched the whole video and I also love CRTs.
But at 14:22 I've felt a need to defend TFT manufacturers. ULMB monitors like the ASUS PG279Q that I currently use, love (brightness and resolution) and hate (motion blur and contrast) allows the usage of a 60 Hz ULMB mode via the CRU utility (for Windows at least, on Linux via custom Modeline). You need to select the 85 Hz mode as base and increase the vertical total size until you get 60 Hz. The monitor will take it and it works fine with 60Hz locked games like Freedom Planet. But you still get Strobing Crosstalk as the IPS response time is not fast enough.
Now here is the issue. This just can't be integrated in the product itself as people with epilepsy might get a seizure. I use a Siemens MCM 1706 17" CRT next to my Asus for Retro gaming purposes and the 60 Hz of that monitor is not nearly as harsh on the eye as the 60 Hz strobing of the TFT. I can't really say why that is but my assumption is the time it takes for the phosphor to stop glowing. And I guess is that Asus wanted to avoid being taken to the court for health issues. 85 Hz already flickers noticeably on this monitor.
Also at this position you say that the TV you use is capable of doing it at 60 Hz. But has it a strobing or a scanning backlight? Scanning backlight monitors seem to be very rare. OLEDs are now also using this technique by simulating a rolling shutter by incorporating the fast pixel response times. So I'm quite looking forward for the first OLED monitors if they will eventually arrive. They finally might be on par to CRT motion performances.... hopefully.... O.o
Ooh, I didn't know about that 85 Hz trick. I just tried with both the VG27AQ and the VG279QM, but I can't get it to work. With CRU, are you increasing the vertical total to match the horizontal frequency in kHz with the 85 Hz mode?
The TV I showed, the Samsung UN40KU6300, legitimately strobes the entire backlight at 60 Hz. It's a VA, and one of the slowest I've ever seen, so the end result looks quite bad, but they offer the option. A full blast strobe at 60 Hz is hard to look at when dealing with bright scenes, but it's tolerable for most video game scenes.
CRTs at 60 Hz would sit well with more people because they have a rolling scan, like you mentioned. That keeps at least some part of the screen lit during the entire frame time, so it's less stressful on your eyes/brain.
@@ApertureGrille The VG27AQ and VG279QM both use ELMB as Blur Reduction technique. I don't know if ELMB allows this hack. I'm also not sure if it has something to do with the horizontal frequency which makes this work and I currently don't have access to Windows. But I can send you some Linux Modelines which I have derived afterwards from my CRU settings and just tested to check if they still work. And it still is an issue for my eyes. During gameplay it's not as bad as on the desktop though.
ULMB 85 Hz Modeline: "2560x1440" 346.50 2560 2608 2640 2720 1440 1443 1448 1499 +hsync -vsync
ULMB 60 Hz Modeline: "2560x1440" 346.50 2560 2608 2640 2720 1440 1443 1448 2123 +hsync -vsync
Both Video timings are exactly the same if it wasn't for the last number, which is the total vertical size in pixels that leads to the reduction of the frame rate.
Sadly the strobing phase seems to be unchanged by doing so. So the Strobe Cross Talk remains. ULMB TN monitors are quite better at this but well... they have other problems.
My TV is a Sony KDL-55W828B and also supports backlight strobing at 60 Hz. They call it MotionFlow Impulse. But the picture gets very dim and the mode doesn't support 50 Hz Input. You can mod most of the old gaming consoles to 60 Hz but the dim picture still makes it unusable.
That's crazy how Digital Foundary or a Metal Jesus video turns sellers into predators
Can you give me a headsup on how many hours should it have? I'll be testing and hopefully picking up a CRT next week. I have no idea what the hour count should be so that it's not towards the end of it's lifetime.
I quite miss my IBM P260 (19.8 inch diagonal, Trinitron). It worked really well, I usually used it at 1600x1200 at 85Hz for desktop work, coding, etc,. but it also rocked in gaming. I bought it used around 2004, for like 20$. And used for years, but many years later, I got rid of it (for essentially nothing). It served me well.
I am still searching for the perfect monitor. Still not there yet. Technology is already there, just model selection on market is really crappy, due to manufacturer choices.
For work (and some non-fps gaming), I use Eizo EV2730Q 26.5 inch, 1920x1920, which is absolutely amazing. But for media consumption and gaming I am still looking for something that I would fully want. And considering this second (and third probably) monitor I will also want to use for work, not just gaming, I don't want 16:9 or anything wider. 16:10 should do fine, but there are no high refresh monitors with VRR on the marked and that aspect ratio. My Crossover 2560x1600, can be pushed to 105Hz at 1920x1200, but at 2560x1600 it only does 60Hz.
For my unit the "hum" noise is minimal, easily covered by a pc fan at 700rpm. Speakers "blank noise" is actually more noticeable, while still being silent at an arms lenght.
I have a very quiet room, so the CRT was definitely a bit irritating. And the pitch would change depending on what was being displayed:
thume.ca/screentunes/
i went from dell p1130 to lg 27 uk650 and now have that and lg 27gp950
Hey a5hun!
I currently run my P260s (also 21" Trinitrons to the readers here) at 1600x1200 @120hz and their limit is only 121kHz!
The Video Bandwidth is set to 1152x864 in windows since I used the resolution setting of 1152x864@120hz and from there I set the resolution to 1600x1200@120!!
They are only using 108.0, 108.9, and 108.9 kHz so it even works on my Nokia 445XiPlus!
My setup is a cheap eBay DP to VGA adaptor and a DP to VGA cable for the second P260 off of my 1660ti. Also, CRTs still draw the image faster than 144hz monitors. (MG279Q for me which takes like 11ms total)
CRTs forever, CRTs for life!
I have a P260 in the basement! How is that working? What's doing the downsampling?
@@ApertureGrille how much for shipping to AZ? And I have no clue what the conversion is doing.
@@ApertureGrille picture quality is great! I think CRU shows it at 1024p output @ 60hz, but my monitors are showing it as a 120hz signal.
Sorry that i need to ask: so you used a DVI to VGA Cable ?
I just bought a GT 710 years ago. I run it paired with my RTX 2070.
Works as smooth as butter, too bad it has only one Analog output (VGA paired with HDMI and DVI-D) instead of more Analog outputs (because that would be nice). At least I can use CRTs natively.
My cousin just let me have his old p1130 but it has a yellow tint all over the screen and some horizontal lines, I really want to fix this problems to enjoy this monitor
I buy a near new Dell E773c CRT in Box for 30 Bucks. Its not the best CRT but it was cheap and great for retro stuff (old games, Animes, Movies)
Those CRT's are better than the monitor I'm using right now. 😢
Go on eBay marketplace and have a sniff mate, you can get a bargain if you are quick enough and patient, otherwise go on eBay and you will also find something on therem although bargains are increasingly hard to find, I noticed the USA especially has a good stock of decent CRT's available, can't go wrong with a nice 17"+ Viewsonic, or a Dell which are often rebranded Sony Trinnys.
What cables are you using for the dreamcast?
Is this monitor suitable for modern FPS games such as Rainbow Six Siege where an enemy can be peeking from minute pixel holes? Are CRT monitors clear enough at that 1440 x 1080 resolution? Thanks
Yes
Wooooow beautifull I want one !!!!
What is the game name at the racing car scene at 13m ?
Doesn't Display Port plus plus natively support analog vga?
Great video! I bought a p1130 in 2009 for 20 euros. Used it daily since then, for like 6-16 hours a day and is still going strong! (although it does need to warm up for a couple minutes while I make breakfast)
I ran it at the standard 1280x1024 85 hz. I recently changed it to 1280x1024 100 hz. Cant see a real difference, but it might be slightly better) Difference with 60 hz and 85 hz is gigantic. 60 hz seems like a stroboscope.
I see you run it at 1340x1005 @120hz? Can you explain why you think thats better? And might 120 hz make the monitor last less long? When I put it on 1280x1024 120 hz it went black on me..
Maybe you can even give me some tips on how to maintain the p1130? When I start it up now, it goes green and then pops into some sort of a lightbulb shaped halo until its warmed up.. sometimes (especially in winter when its colder in my house) It seems that some protection kicks in and it switches itself off during warm up. I have to take out the powercable and wait till the light stops blinking and then quickly put it back in to continue the warm up. Sometimes I had to do this 4 or 5 times. But it has been doing that for like 5 years lol, it still isnt dead, and the colors still seem fine.
Is there any (preferably free and simple) software you would advise for calibrating it? I have been trying some simple monitortests and its looking fine, but I dont think its as great as it can be yet.
Thanks in advance, greetings from The Netherlands!
That's a 5:4 aspect ratio and you might have geometry problems with it, you're better running it in 4:3 resolutions like 960p (1280*960) or 1200p (1600*1200). The 1340x1005 is probably a 4:3 resolution. I think it's probably optimal to run it in 1600*1200@85Hz from what I've read.
That sounds like a cold solder joint or something.
If it was made after a certain time period (like 2002-), it might not develop the G2 voltage fault that many Sony monitors have, so it might not REQUIRE calibrating. But I doubt you can calibrate it without special tools. I personally have a X-Rite i1 Display Pro I got for 50 euros unused, but these usually go for much higher.
Did you finish that unity 1000fps test yet, can you share the source code please, thanks
Can I connect CRT monitor on my NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050
directly, or I need some special switch. thanks.
For modern gaming QD-OLEDs are superior. 240hz + HDR, finally a true upgrade to CRTs in 2023.
For competetive fps, the input lag+motion blur on lcd make them inferior to crts.
Yep. I connected my old CRT the other day and its crazy how much better they are when it comes to FPS games. The mouse movements felt like in real time and absolutely no motion blur. To bad my CRT is old as hell and the picture quality sucks etc.
11:31 mine actually did and also did 4k res. It said 200hz in windows 7 refresh rate pick or xp. Man i do miss the one I had but it caused me eye pain and headache so it had to go.
CRT is god tier
Hey, what's a good solution to my lack of analog out on my RX580? DVI or DP to VGA? And can the adapters be pushed to 1600x1200@75Hz (nothing fancier, this is my target)? If they can which one to get for best results?
1600x1200 at 75 Hz only requires a 205 MHz pixel clock, but you can do better. The current HardForum recommended DP to VGA adapters are these:
Delock DP to VGA:
www.delock.de/produkte/G_62967/merkmale.html?setLanguage=en
May be a bit hard to find, but it has a max output of 350 MHz, which is only slightly less than the native DAC on the 980 Ti.
Or for anyone with a graphics card with USB-C:
Vention CGMHA Type-C to VGA Converter
I have two Viewsonic CRT monitors that are just begging to be used once I get a PC. Is there a way to use both at once? Hmm
This is some high quality content shit.
This went from reviewing a monitor to talking about crts. Great video (no really it’s interesting)
Your speakers look intriguing - 2-ways with car subs as woofers. There must be quite a hole in the midrange.
Has the convergence guide post been removed? I can't find much of a guide at that link, only a few grid patterns for downloading.
You're right. This may work better:
hardforum.com/threads/24-widescreen-crt-fw900-from-ebay-arrived-comments.952788/post-1044341602
Should be a post from spacediver with links to the PDF guides.
@@ApertureGrille thanks a lot!
Im still amazed, how good CRT's in 2023 are.
Yes, they need lot of juice, are heavy, bulky and don't recommend it for video editting ect.
I scored 2 ViewSonic PT813 last Month. The Motion Clarity and Blacks are insane good, even better than my LED 144Hz Display.
The best Part about CRT Monitors is, you can use lower Reasolution and your game still looks great.