Mr Bates Vs The Post Office: The Real-Life Victims Open Up On Their Story | This Morning
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ม.ค. 2024
- Last night, ITVX and ITV1 began to tell the true story of the post office staff who found themselves accused of stealing thousands of pounds from post office branches. They were the unfortunate victims of a faulty IT system - developed to make their lives easier - but which actually left innocent people with criminal convictions and time in prison. The Producers of 'Mr Bates vs the Post Office' turned to those caught up in the scandal to help make the show - and spoke to Janet Skinner and Tracy Felstead who join us today. Both women were imprisoned for crimes they never committed, their lives have been irreparably damaged by the scandal.
Broadcast on 02/01/2024
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The senior management of the Post Office should now face criminal charges and Paula Vennells, the previous CEO should be the first to face the shameful corporate failure she led.
I don't know how Paula Vennells sleep at night. Still she left with a nice bonus.
She also needs to be stripped of her CBE
Send her to prison
Agreed, all of them, Fujitsu included. 732 convictions by the Post
Disgrace
If you work in post office and someone will came to do road tax. If customer card will be declined then you can't only reverse it from the system,- you also must call to DVLA. As from the system you are reversing only payment method, but car already been taxed and post master is paying for it!!! Please share this with all the fellow posties as many don't know!!! Post office area managers are telling to everyone that only they have this problem!!
The people higher up at the Post Office knew exactly what was going on. They are the real crooks. They need to be brought to justice and the ones going to prison.
Too right and did they pocket any money themselves? Makes you wonder? They were all bullies, a bully gets a thrill out of taunting his victim, that's what they did, if the police were investigating no charges would have been brought, but the Post Office can pursue their own cases. Time the Post Office had their wings clipped, Mr. Bates stood up to the Post Office and they did not like it, no bully likes being challenged.
One very small consolation for the Sub-postmasters is they now have public opinion on their side, the establishment will receive the backlash, they tried to buy off Mr. Bates with a CBE, it didn;t work.
Also the the fujitsu company have a lot to answer to
@@ian500i Oh don't they just!
Look up CEO Adam Crozier and his jobs, that makes for interesting reading. He’s a professional hatchet man! …
See
How do the post office chief executives and the people who did the investigation sleep at night. And giving out a CBE to the boss of the post office is an utter disgrace.
The Post Office management in place at the time should all face prosecution - on a guilty verdict they should all go to prison with confiscation of all property both real and fiscal in order to reimburse the life costs incurred and paid out by the innocent postmasters.
Absolutely agree with you! Without that kind of consequence, individuals within big companies will feel they are immune to wrongdoing. They must pay a personal price for their lies and crimes.
Don’t forget removal of the titles - type in CEO of Post Office removal of title and follow the link.
Also, these victims - because that is what they are - need to search and see if a solicitor will take their case pro-bono and go after Fujitsu.
What happened to those employees? Iris Riley
True justice for those caught up in this travesty has to include not only compensation, but accountability. Those culpable in the post office have to be seen to be punished.
And people need to remember that this happened under a Labour government and think very carefully about allowing Starmer in.
What these good people went through is just outrageous and shameful to the extreme.
The Post Office thought...and continue to think...that they are untouchable.
Send the managers who covered it up to jail
HOW has this NOT all been thoroughtly investigated and ALL victims made as whole as possible?! When the system/courts come for you and you are innocent ...
Dreadful story.. the post office should have investigated properly each case, that’s the least you would expect
They did and found themselves at fault, hushhhh.
Surely the Post Office bosses didn’t believe that 100’s of their subpostmasters were criminals? All at the same time!
Another question relating to this scandal is who backed the Postmaster's litigation? The court awarded the JSPM's case £58 million but they were told only £12 million would be left to share, between 550 litigants, after the backers got their percentage!! Who would take that much of a cut from these poor people? This whole criminal scandal by the so-called justice system is shameful.
The backer is probably the crown as well…
Just another way to waste peoples time so they don’t attack the royals and government.
Unfortunately using a number of high level barristers-over long periods of time, plus all the associated staff and admin, costs this much. According to the programme they were forced to settle due to running out of funds, so that’s why the post office were not liable for their costs.
Good luck for all the postmaster's.
The post office should be held to account and also the justice system, how can so many people be prosecuted, all saying the same thing and no investigation. Absolute disgrace.
I hope you can get a resolution that is acceptable to everyone of you.
Good luck .
Every judge that passed sentences on these people should be made to step down
As one of those people , I don’t hold judge accountable . I hold MP that passed law in 99 that made computer evidence absolute. So you have to show as a defendant that system is not robust at time of said evidence. Aka guilty until you can prove innocent. This law is still on our books today. Judge have to follow the law.
I agree . Any judge that couldn't see this was a travesty of justice, shows how corporate sponsored the legal system has become. Big corporations can pay for justice and private prosecutions.
In fairness, the judges would have been dealing with one case at a time. They would not have been aware of the extent of the injustice.
I really hope they all get the justice they deserve. Truly disgusting what they had to go through.
Absolutely shameful for those responsible for all the suffering they caused to these poor people.
Here is the thing- apart from all the other aspects of this affair the role of Lord Neuberger in the Recusal seems to have escaped attention.
I have therefore pasted the following ‘The role of Lord Neuberger in the recusal fiasco (Justice Fraser) should be investigated’ on as many TH-cam articles as I could, about ten, but when I checked to see if there was any response I discovered they had all been taken down including Talktv
This Kafkaesque episode staggers one at every turn, even when Big brother has been outed he seems to be still working away!
I really want to know why Lord Neuberger interfered , if the recusal had succeeded the whole noble attempt at taking on the stinking system would have failed
Peoples lives were ruined and they are still waiting for compensation!! It’s a disgrace
There are people at the top of the post office hiding behind “The Crown “ and people high up at Fujitsu should be prosecuted and sent to prison.
Ultimate gaslighting, telling these inoccent people they were alone, the only one....absolutely disgraceful.
Yes, Paula Vennells, former CEO of the Post Office is close to Jesus; as close to Jesus as Judas was. How was it that her conscience was so warped and she lied and led a team that lied. Justice must be restored to all the men and women whose lives have been harmed.
It's all good and well getting their convictions squashed but it's the time they innocently spent in jail which they won't get back which is shocking!
Totally appalling. Thank goodness this programme has been made to bring some resolution to this enormous miscarriage of justice. I hope the liars are brought down and everyone who has suffered is very quickly given justice finance and compensation. Hearts go out to everyone who has and is going through this ❤
Can't believe these 2 went to jail .poor women . absolutely outrageous and very sad !! Can't imagine what it must have been like nobody believing that that your innocent and the embarrassment they must have faced knowing they didn't do it !!
They've ruined people's lives ,
Just watched all 4 episodes on itv x well done all involved in getting this story out there.
how can those involved in the cover up sleep at night. I think the Fujitsu company should shoulder some of the blame and also be held accountable
Heartbreaking, I can’t stop crying for them
Convictions overturned after being in prison.whatever compensation given will never give you the time back.
Well, normally, I would shout out "PROUD TO BE BRITISH" because I am, with the HORRENDOUS injustice that the "Royal" cough, cough paymasters endured during this despicable witch hunt, I'm embarrassed to be a British "subject".
You needn't fear if you were born with British nationality. You aren't a subject. You are a citizen of the United Kingdom. The term 'subject' was done away with decades ago for British nationals. Go and check your passport or the government website. It is all there in black and white.
The system let these ladies and all the other victims down. The Post Office management, the politicians who failed to ask questions and the justice system all have questions to answer. Truly shocking.
Awaiting for the Vennells team to be prosecuted.
I cannot get over what happened here, am utterly shocked! Feel devastated for all those poor sub post masters. The most vile part is the lies the Post Office told to everyone AND THEN prosecuted the victims! I cry when I think of those who have died thinking people thought they were thieves. Heads need to roll in the post office! There has to be severe retribution for the disgusting and disgraceful behaviour of the Post Office.
National disgrace. Post Office CEO and senior staff (during that period) should be jailed.
I can't imagine how many people's lives were also lost in this enormous mess. You all deserve official apologies very publicly!!! This ruined so many lives 💔
The elephant in the room appears to be Fujitsu - alongside senior execs in the post office. I hope that justice prevails and those that lied and perjured themselves in court are found out and prosecuted and made to pay compensation out of their own pockets. This is a classic example of organizations and those running them behaving like psychopaths.
The drama does a brilliant job at revealing this revolting injustice.
Was in tears me and the wife watching those poor people. Justice
Ryan said that the series is a brilliant watch, which it is. However, i also found it quiet upsetting.
And yet those at the top - who knew what was going on and the problems with the system - have faced no consequences...
They are the real crooks and villans who need to be held accountable, face prison time, and made to pay up and have their massive pension pots seized!
The complete corruption by the public servants involved requires charges. Everyone involved should be jailed and made to pay restitution.
At 16 yrs old I asked my dad why are the bad people in church and the good people outside. He said they come to have their sins forgiven so they can sin some more the next week! Kind of explains Paula Vennells. I decided that day not to go anymore.
People like her must believe they are without sin and all the sub-postmasters were sinners.
We all know there’s no truth and justice and I feel sad for all those who fought two wars to preserve the Great in Britain.
How truly dreadful disgraceful and corrupt the establishment is in this Country to allow this ,
Poor people just awful 😔
These things don’t just happen randomly , they happen because corporations and organisations get to a point where they are complacent , arrogant and see themselves as not being accountable. Throw in a good dose of greed and denial and this is what you get. There are many 1000s of organisations like this. They may not be as extreme as this , but they are out there. Bosses need to learn to listen to their workforce and trust them more. Many organisations will ruthlessly hang individuals out to dry to protect their own reputation. It’s the way of the world. The way we have allowed it to be by turning a blind eye to what we know is wrong.
That is the first interveiw ive been impressed with by 2 people on tv a real down to earth talik on a subject thats so raw for the victims also well done to rylan and josie reilly well put together interveiw .
Has Fujitsu - the company responsible for the Horizon IT network, been investigated for their part in all of this? It seems that they were also culpable in the treatment of these poor postmasters.
Exactly what I keep saying - somebody in the company made the decision to sign this off, and many more were involved in that company.
Teresa May gave Pauline Vennels the CBE in the 2019 new years honours list. What a surprise!!!
The post office and Fujitsu had control of the accounts but unfortunately the postmasters were responsible. Also postmasters were unaware that Fujitsu had remote access with postmasters login and passwords. The system was a disaster from the outset. No wonder the seniors at the post office have been against handing over files to independent investigators and keen to bury this at all costs.
They were responsible for maintaining accurate data but not for a glitchy system
I am 68 years old and I remember as a child I had a number of solid beliefs to hang onto. Firstly my family which has continued to endure over the years, secondly the NHS which at my age I use quite frequently and more or less get a good service, but am acutely aware of their financial problems. Lastly , the Post Office/Royal Mail or whatever they call themselves nowadays. They seem to be disintegrating over the past 10 years, it is definitely not the dear old Post Office that I loved and trusted as a child. I am lucky if I get a postman once a week to visit the house. But to be fair, most of my correspondence is via email so what is the future of mail. However local post offices are very important to communities in terms of banking (all major Banks seem to be slowly retreating from the High Street) and this programme highlights this.
That's Tony Blair for you.
Can you remember when we used to get two deliveries a day . We are lucky if we get one a week as well 😂
Why havent these people been given all there money back, corrupt government i say
Labour yeah
Did any of the postal Executives Ever go to jail. After the truth came out?
Some of the victims families were saying this morning they are still using the same system - how can that be and how does that look?
The backbone system is such a mess it difficult to transfer to other platform
This is an absolute travesty. The small man being bullied. By this big organisation. And acting that arrogant that it was impossible they could be in the wrong. I hope the post office and the monkey's in charge have to pay the price.
Congrats. for making this gripping drama; only sad that it is fact
and not fiction. It is good that this has revealed truth, injustice and widespread failures of a once revered, greatly loved and appreciated institution. No wonder that members of the public now are inconvenienced as they search to find a functioning P.O.
May all those affected receive full compensation SOON for all the suffering endured to them and all their families and friends.
ps. wondering if and how the Horizon company(Fujitsu) was involved in this scandal.
I’m in the states and watched the PBS first episode
So despicable that that could happen to ordinary people . I hope they got their life back after.
How do we get Paula Vennels and the Board Members. Simply how do we get them?
Lives were totally ruined. I hope and pray justice prevails.
The postmasters got convictions for no wrongdoing yet those that have committed a crime by lying and covering this up will see no criminal convictions I expect....utterly disgusting!!
Paula vennels who was the ceo of the post office at the time,evil lady
Time for the UK people to take matters into their own hands if the authorities do not bring the PO management responsible for this to justice.
PBS in the US just started airing the series recently. So sad. Heart goes out to these people for all of this. Let justice roll! Don't give up hope of resolution.
If it hadn’t been for the mini series, I wouldn’t have been aware of this horrific abuse of power and injustice. I should think there should be multiple people held accountable.
I've signed both petitions. That crook Vennells should never have been awarded a CBE.
Other high profile figures such as Naseem Hamed and Lester Piggott had honours removed for various respective convictions. Hopefully, the net is closing on Vennells and a conviction will follow and she can kiss goodbye to her honour.
There is. I justice…… absolutely disgusting that people can be treated this way and even when the truth comes out there is still No justice. Thank god for the programme now we can see what really happened
Absolutely scandalous
Why oh why should these ladies and other PO employees have to FIGHT!! They are innocent and legal entities provided and paid for by post office should be doing this for them!
How could they believe that so many people would have done the same thing? It's not logical.
Public servants are never held accountable! If the revenue was owed the money it would be closed out very quickly….
Except the police and the fire service they get independently regulated by several bodies and scrutinised by the media continually; imagine if the likes of the Post Office, Court System and NHS were independently regulated in the same way….
Apparently the head of the post office was also an Anglican priest.
Such a joke given her lack of moral compass.
..And given a CBE ontop!! I mean how much more insane could the whole situation get?!
The church sets a very low bar on who they choose to represent them sadly,morally corrupt.
She voluntarily stood down from the clergy. I am told (so only hearsay) that the Archbishop of Canterbury threatened to have her unfrocked (sacked) for bringing the church into disrepute. If that is the case it looks like the Archbishop is the only person to have taken action.
Some MP's did some good work here, fighting for these poor people. We now need a national forum. Everyone should have a say on those responsible.
These people are actually lucky although they won't appreciate me saying that. There are thousands of people who have been found guilty of crimes they didn't commit and the reason it happens is the same as what happened to these post office workers. The legal system will NEVER find someone innocent when the only thing that makes you innocent is your own testimony. When big business or authority says you did something, their word will be accepted as the truth. It happens EVERY week of EVERY year and it will keep happening because the people in the justice system cannot handle the thought of someone who is guilty actually walking free so they would rather find a hundred innocent people guilty than let one guilty person walk free. People who work in the justice system are mentally defective - they believe everyone is a criminal and if you're not, it's because they just haven't caught you. The truth - the facts - are the total opposite but it's always their word that counts. Innocent until proven guilty is a misnomer and sadly, the only way you find out is when you're the person getting caned for nothing and you're left shocked at how easily they do it and don't give a stuff how it will impact your life. In this particular case, people in the justice system should be going to prison for what happened. They get presented with a case full of holes that can be summarised as "700-odd postmasters, all over the country have committed exactly the same crime" and nobody actually thought - "this looks more like an accounting error than 700-odd crimes of theft". Everyone responsible will all be diving for cover and some lowly clerk will get the blame for it - that's another chess-move that people in authority are good at - "It wisnay me" - they're a bunch of snivelling cowards, the lot of them. Anyone who has been to court wrongly accused knows that this happens all the time. To be found guilty makes it even worse and to never be acquitted saddles you with a burden forever.
This whole story is so dreadful. I had no idea all this had happened, and has been for nearly twenty years. The powers that be should be totally ashamed of themselves; how do they sleep at night. I could go on. Disgusted! 😡
Absolutely disgraceful!
Fijistu need to be accountable too ,don't forget
They should be compensated £5,000 for every week that they spent in prison!
People were jailed, people died, people lots their home and livelihoods, The CEO and other need to be jail because this country's core principles, that my grandparents when to war is been made worthless.
A little bit of a recap of what exactly happened to them and why they were sent to prison would have been helpful for non-Uk audiences who might eventually see this show would be helpful.
Have they had their money back?! Apart from anything they are owed the money they had to pay back!
Watch the documentary also ..it's scandalous ..surly the firm doing the tech have to answer also for telling these people there was nothing wrong with their system ..most still have not had compensation...
British justice😂😂😂😂 don’t make me laugh. How can anyone trust our system?
THEY CAN'T!!!!!!!🤬🤬🤬🤬
could they bring a private prosecution against the accusers ?
They should sue if they already haven’t!!!
No one from govt to do any prison time.
What the post office bigwigs did to these people should be in prison absolute disgrace...
If you work in post office and someone will came to do road tax. If customer card will be declined then you can't only reverse it from the system,- you also must call to DVLA. As from the system you are reversing only payment method, but car already been taxed and post master is paying for it!!! Please share this with all the fellow posties as many don't know!!! Post office area managers are telling to everyone that only they have this problem!!
This is a drama of a true story in which I can feel the anger inside of me whilst I'm watching. Sorry isn't good enough because in tonight's episode they practically told the Subpostmaster who was on duty during an armed robbery that he should have allowed himself to be shot dead by the burglars rather than open the safe so nobody was hurt. That was even when the police quickly caught them and returned all of the stolen money. It begs belief that an employer would tell their employee to risk their life even after all stolen money was recovered 😠😠
Yes, it was a complete disgrace. I worked for a major bank for 10 years and all the staff were always told in the event of an armed raid, ‘don’t try to be a hero, just hand the money over. We are insured’. Did that policy not apply to Post Office cash held in branches?
There’s people at Fujitsu who know exactly what happened and how.
All that remains to be seen is wether they have the moral fortitude to do the right thing and tell the truth.
My suspicion is that the back door untraceable logins begun as a way to fix and hide issues in data transfer, but after Fujitsu call centre workers got more and more calls, the back door logins got used by tech experts to sabotage and silence people they considered nuisance callers, by getting them suspended.
Wouldn't suprise me if the PO thought about assassination next !?
Yes, keep fighting the good fight! For the injustice against those 555-900+ PMO and workers all over the country. Every worker should join a Union
To think 💭 some fools would put their lives on the line for this corrupt country.
Anyone who was involved from the top to the men who went to the branch to close the shop knew they were wrong, each and every one of them needs to stand trial. Even people at Fujitsu working on the Post office account need to come clean.
It's absolutely disgusting shocking and appalling that the Post Office treated many people that worked loyally for them like this how dare they!! unbelievable the people that where responsible for there incompetence not investigating it correctly and responsibly with computer IT fault's should be held to account entirely and sacked! and the Post Masters which are many people in total who had there life's blighted destroyed and ruined! should be apologised to unreservedly and given substantial compensation by the Post Office for an IT computer system which was not fit for purpose the then CEO should be held to account and she should be stripped of her CBE it's absolutely disgraceful and shameful let justice prevail!! 🤨
This is the sad reality of our justice system, especially when it comes to anything public. They have zero accountability and endless pots of tax payer money to price out justice. They close ranks, defend each other and attack the victims. This case is very much the exception to the rule and thousands of people in the UK do not receive justice. The whole system needs to be reworked to take care of the vulnerable.
Also see the Robo-Debt Scandal in Australia. From 2013 to 2019, the Australian Government unlawfully sent letters claiming overpayments of Social Security, to 560,000 people - totalling $1.76 billion. The debt-notices falsely assumed that the recipients had under-stated their earned income, by assuming that their income this year was the same as their income in last year’s tax return - ignoring that they may have since lost their job. The scandal led to an Australian Royal Commission in 2022 and found that Prime Minister Scott Morrison and two other Ministers had failed to check whether the scheme was lawful - where falsely-calculated demand letters were automatically sent by the social security computers. (Kym in Darwin). The scandal meant refunds totalling $760 million to 360,000 people - after 30 suicides. No mini-series on it as yet. (Kym in Darwin - the 7 Network in Australia started screening Mr Bates vs The Post Office on 14 Feb 2024, with huge publicity).
It was by design, disguised as a 'mistake' There will be no accountability for those who constructed this murderous scam.
How many other software systems are in place in the UK run by or installed by Fujitsu? That also needs to be investigated
Dishonesty at the Highest level, most postmasters don’t even have a pension with the Post Office, instead they have to take out their own personal pensions,
Then to have the injustice of big business knowing full well their state of the art computer system was flawed says it all,
So Paula Vennells was ordained to the C of E as a priest in 2006. Was that in order to cleanse her guilty conscience? Sorry that won’t wash. The man upstairs sees everything. Hear she ‘stepped back from duties’ in 2021. Doubt she’s that big a loss to her parish and parishioners.
This us absolutely disgusting the pain and suffering of decent people being accused. Where's the justice
That poor girl going to Holloway what a disgrace. I followed this the minute it hits the papers. That woman at the top needs to loose her wealth but it will be in a trust now. She needs a custodial sentence - she was a greedy woman, power and money. How can she serve god when serving money. She crawled her way up and I believe she said “ sack them all”. Btw Rylan is fab and getting better but oh dear that blond woman
It all started with Fujitsu. They are the one's responsible. THEY are the one's who got it wrong & should held to account & made to pay out MILLIONS in compensation.
My heart breaks for all of you who were affected by this horrible miscarriage of justice. Vennels and a few others should be jailed and all bonuses etc they received during this period, should be returned.
Here is the thing, apart from all the other aspects of this affair the role of Lord Neuberger in the Recusal seems to have escaped attention.
I have therefore pasted the following ‘The role of Lord Neuberger in the recusal fiasco (Justice Fraser) should be investigated’ on as many TH-cam articles as I could, about ten, but when I checked to see if there was any response I discovered they had all been taken down.
This Kafkaesque episode staggers one at every turn, even when Big brother has been outed he seems to be still working away!
I really want to know why Lord Neuberger interfered , if the recusal had succeeded the whole noble attempt at taking on the stinking system would have failed.
If they’re looking for real thieves, the justice system needs to find out where the money went that was taken from the subpostmasters