Regarding the polish of the helmets, that may be for theatrical purposes. A big shiny piece of metal in the middle of the shot is going to create a ton of glare for the camera. If your goal is to blind and intimidate your opponent, that's great. If you want to get a good color-balanced shot with a modern camera, dulling the steel is probably a practical necessity.
The show really shines if you’re German, because it really makes the Romans seem like foreigners, the way the Germans saw them. It’s a cool way to see Romans.
The stir ups were probably a safety measure for the actors. That was also a noted inaccuracy in the 2000 film 'Gladiator,' but were installed for safety reasons as well.
Yeah I'm not sure many cavalry stunt men necessarily know how to ride without them, it seems like an aspect of training, same with lacking saddle. Maybe some do but insurance companies are picky like that, safety wise.
Right? It's no wonder that many nobles and emperors throughout history died by falling off their horses. Without stirrups I can imagine it would be much less safe getting on and off the horse.
Just FYI, on a film set when using horses you almost HAVE to have stirrups legally. It's a danger to the actors and the unions have deemed them necessary, so I wouldn't be too hard on them for that. It's a detail that doesn't have a huge difference in historical accuracy and makes it a LOT safer for the actors.
Thanks. I was already thinking that they used the stirrups to make the riding safer and easier for the actors, but I didn't know that it was a rule. Makes sense.
Roman Soldier 1: "Why are we wearing 20 pounds of armor when it provides zero protection from basic weapon attacks?" Roman Soldier 2: "More to the point, why is the government putting so much money into the labor intensive act of producing enough armor for entire armies if they provide no defense?"
A cool thing about roman costumes you didnt mention, the soldiers were wearing scarfs to stop the armor cutting them which we know is historically accurate
I would rather think scarfs are worn to protect the armour from rain and other elements and to keep the soldiers warm since at the time Germania was a freezing hell hole. Armour cutting its wearer seems like bad a armour smith.
@@dumitrache12 The Romans did most definitely wear scarfs to protect against their armour. It has nothing to do with bad armour smiths. Just rub a blunt piece of metal on your skin, eventually it will start to cut in.
@@dumitrache12 No, it is well known that the scarf is to protect the neck form sharp edges on that part of the armor (if any, because of quality differences), bruises or/and painful pinches.
@@slopcrusher3482 it actually doesn't cost that much now, most film companies shoot digital now, and you aren't adding something to the film, just subtracting. A full frame of CGI costs in general 5,000 to 20,000 per minute, I'd assume that just a small part of the film would be a lot less per minute. And how many minutes in the show have stirrups in them?
@@gregmattson2238 "Just Subtracting". it is hard to remove something from a movie without people immediately noticing and going "Hey what the hell is that". This is not just taking something out. you have to ensure you only remove the stirrup, you have to fix the lighting around the rider's feet, you have to make sure everything tracks properly, you have to fix a lot of stuff. this all had to be done by a team of individuals that are normally specialized. you cant just pay a guy 50 bucks per hour for a couple days, these guys make an average of 80 grand a year each, they aren't cheap. in the end they decided it wasn't worth the costs.
Still doesn't change the fact it should have been polished bright enough to see your face in. Roman soldiers were trained to take great pride in the appearance of their war gear.
@@tenarmurk Actually NOT that unusual. Legio V Alaudae were called the Meadowlarks and had their helmets decorated with Blue Meadowlarks on the sides. Incidentally, their tunics and shields were also blue instead of the Roman red.
What kills me about light sabers is no one let's the light go past the three feet. Must be knightly fetish but you would thing Darth Vader would have taken the pin our an let the saber rip to it's max cutting and piercing and smoking 'em distance of 100 meters. Yeah, even peon me took the pin out of my shotgun to allow two extra shots!
@@fjack1588 It has a set length, and losses potency the longer it gets. Vader's saber allows him to freely choose between 1 length and a another longer length. So he already has a longer saber.
@Gustavo Octavio deCampos The King is a horrible movie, dialogue and acting is terrible and it is ridden of modern progressive sensibilities. Its battle might be more accurate but it is incredibly boring to watch. I'd take Henry V (1989) rendition of the battle of Agincourt any day over that trash.
The face mask of Arminius is actually a replica of a mask found during the excarvation. It's known that there was a shiny layer on the mask, maby even made of silver, but it might have decayed over the years or was torn of he mask, because it appeared to be valuable. The film crew might have forgotten this information from the archeologists
The funniest criticism i've heard from this series is that it doesn't uses actual Latin and ancient germanic languages like this is a major improvement over British Romans and you expected more?
It is a case of failled expectations. It was advertised as the most accurate historical TV show ever and these details are a valid point of criticism. Also, I honestly do not like members of Germanic tribes speaking modern German, probably because I can actually understand German. That turns it into a weird gimmick; why make the characters speak a modern language if we are going for historical accuracy? I would rather they spoke English then, otherwise it just looks silly. As for the Latin, it does sound funny, but at least it is a more exotic language, despite the weird pronunciation, so it is not such an issue.
@@piotrpiotrowski4681 I cannot say about them using modern German. But considering that Roman soldiers came from all over the empire, I would imagine that they would all have their own funny accents when speaking Latin so that may not be too far off from reality, just as there are so many different accents of English today.
@@piotrpiotrowski4681 Why shouldn't they speak German? It's a German production. There are tons of English movies with people speaking English and subtitled foreigners.
Any English only speakers watching Barbarians, i strongly suggest you run it in the original German and use captions. The optional English dub hurts the dramatic effect.
That complaint is really annoying me on various channels. There is talking about historical authenticity and there is ignoring realities of the modern world. Like insurance pay or plainly that an actor might be trained in horse riding, which in our times means with a saddle, stirrups and harness so he won't be trained riding without stirrups and feel comfortable controlling a horse while acting without them. In the same vein what stunt coordinators would do to a historian who wants to force them to use equipment that risks stunt men breaking their necks. One can acknowledge that this is anachronistic but should also acknowledge why this is not a mistake, but an intentional necessity.
The whole time he was going on about the stirrups I was waiting for him to say "...but we can forgive this because of the safety factor--the production insurance requires stirrups for everyone but trained stunt players." Nope. Apparently he has no idea, but I guess he's a historian, not a student of the movie industry. Still, you'd think if WE know that...
Yes it is rather sad that such a problem gets in the way. I understand it, but people were able to do this process of horse riding for years, which makes me think it wouldn't be too much if a stretch to have the actors learn such a method.
@@fabulous_finn7810 It would cost more time and money to train the actors. And for a series, that's going to be much tougher to accomplish. Especially over something that most people who aren't historians are going to catch.
@@fabulous_finn7810 When the lord of the rings was being made the producers had a world wide search for men who could ride bear back, for just such resions.
*My main gripe about the series is the actual events leading to the battle itself. The series presented the ambush like it happened for a couple of hours instead of a methodical 3 day massacre for the Germanic tribes. Wouldve been awesome if the ambush was presented as a 3 day struggle for survival for the doomed Romans to the point that youd feel sympathetic towards them as the series presented the Romans as the antagonists.*
in my opinion the roman soldiers seemed to be portrayed as inferior fighters which for the most part kind of irked me,yes you see a few kills for the romans ,but it would have been atlot more instense in reality i would say.
They could have stretch the episodes up to 10 if they really made the battle long but yeah it seems they don't have enough budget to portray more episodes.
@@ahronsumar5075 well thats normal since the winning side has always plot armor. its like comparing it with star wars and its storm troopers. Maybe in Barbarians season 2 when Germanicus delivers a Roman Blitzkrieg into Germania we would see Legionarii besting almost all of Germanic warriors
@@sfjlfkjsdlfkjds 'Das Nibelungenlied' is not set in any particular time period. In fact it is scattered all over the time scale. On top of that it is estimated to have been written around 1200 AD from folk memory. These folk memories were at this point from 5 to 12 centuries old. Obviously they would get severely distorted into folk tales/legends. As to the connection 'Siegfried - Arminius': This and other links to historicals events have been made by historians and other literary professionals. Laugh as much as you like but that won't illegitimize their interpretations of this story. The idea is that the dragon represents the roman army forced to march through the forest while stretched out into a long line. Originally even in Europe dragons were imagined as serpents (without limbs). Hard to prove but as good an interpretation as any other. Btw, the belief that Siegfried is copied from Sigurd is nonsensical. It was the other way around. Scandinavians could not be the progenitors of a story largely based on early Frankish history...
I had heard that the Romans had kept the German subjects in their territory before the rebellion “iron-starved” by taxation and confiscation, since iron implements are easily converted to sharp, pointy things. When the Germans began their night raids against Varus’s column, they were often armed with short oaken cudgels split from younger trees, thereby forming triangular-sections that could concentrate a blow against a Roman helmet or lorica armor sections into deep dents. That’s often more effectively damaging to flesh and bone than a puncture or a slash, since the iron stays dented, compressing the wound. Romans rarely fought at night, being used to resting then behind their palisaded and moated encampments. By continuing the increasingly panicked marches at night, the Romans were vulnerable to sudden rushes from the flanks by black-painted warriors with clubs and light shields into and through the marchers. Gradually, the Germans were able to arm themselves with left-behind Roman arms to be ready for the final set piece ambush battle where the remnant was trapped at the barricade at the lakeside.
*Best* scene: Germans before the battle: "We can't win, we're going home" That chick: "We're gonna win, I cut my face so I must know" Germans: "K, sounds legit, we're staying"
For what I've read online (so take it with a pinch of salt) "mohawk" type of crests where used my rank and file legionaries but as decoration and on parades, not really on the battlefield. The big mistake people usually make is putting mohawk crests on centurions. Centurions used exclusively the horizontal crest to make them easier to locate on the battlefield and as a symbol of their rank
Pfft! Such things are unimportant to the effect of a TV show. The effect comes from the story. Does it show what happened or does it make people get a false understanding of the politics and economics of the era? Barbarians shows the main points I have learnt about the era, so I approve.
Aren't they both horizontal? I mean the mohawk type doesn't strike me particularly vertical. Distinction is rather between inline or perpendicular to the line of sight.
Casting British actors as Romans (especially when they are the villains) is an American productions' custom. For example, in French movie "Druids", the character of Julius Caesar is played by Klaus Maria Brandauer who is an Austrian!
It's funny how a tv-show goes to so great lengths to be, say 95%, historically accurate - and then just intentionally really fuck up the remaining 5% (like cutting through armor). I cannot grasp why they would do that.
Fanrik I think they fall to the temptation of using such devices to deliver clear messages. Like in action movies, when people get shot and die instantly, or pass out by a single punch. The message is "he's dead". Similarly , in medieval themed battles the most realistic way would be to have the soldiers fight HEMA style and die form infected wounds several days later but a) doesn't "look cool" for the (uneducated) audience b) takes to long to deliver the message: "he is dead". Soooo: swords cut through metal plate because is what people are used to :'(
@@jamie_d0g978 someone said its harder to do thrusts than cuts when doing stunts and with the cgi thing i think its way less work for the tech dudes plus its saves more budget idk. in the show i saw less of those armor cutting swords than any other shows i've watched so far
@@rapidvetD ultimately it does come down to budget, and time, I would add "sex sells" but that technically falls under budget (marketing and potential profit).
15:03 She stabbed the guy into the neck. Just finished watching the last episode, so I'm pretty sure of it. So, she didn't pierce the armor, she bypassed it.
You can say god damned you know. God is a Germanic word and has nothing to do with that desert crap. It’s a god damned shame that people associate native things with xtians and then try to circumvent them. But, very cool!
Though I understand what you mean, since thought has crossed my mind aswell, Iwould not say the Romans were depicted as "evil". Metellus was clearly arranged as an antagonist, as was Varus, but both had moments of "humanity". I explained the difference in portrayal of the "Germanics" and the Romans by two things: One, the PoV is clearly on the Germanic side, and for a compelling story of this sort you need antagonists. Two, the Romans were an occupying force. These are not civilians, these are not even soldiers in their (semi-)permanent forts, these are the soldiers of an expanding empire on campaign, sent to subjugate a sometimes friendly, sometimes unruly and sometimes outright hostile populace. They're sent to collect tribute und establish a more direct form of rule, and I do not doubt - given Varus' ultimate destiny - that they weren't always the most careful and understanding of rulers.
I mean, Arminius kinda fucked up explaining the Tribes' views on execution, but... yeah... pommel-bashing a kid? _not_ very "hearts and minds" on that one...
The battle of Teutoburg forest was in 9 CE, and Germanicus found the remains of the legions who died in that battle in 15 CE, so Germanicus went to Germania 5-6 years later.
I'd like to see Roman North Africa.....and no, not another Biblical movie about Jesus in Roman Palestine (where they spoke Greek as lingua franca, not Latin mind you).
I was expecting them to show the slow march to ruin of the legions, the final battle happened to quick. I feel they missed the essence of the Teutoburg forest battles. But they did set up what comes next for Arminius.
EXACTLY...it was several skirmishes and two battles over the course of almost 4 days...it was a series you would have thought they could portray that part better :(
@@Moritz606 thing is, movies and tv series are rarely ever shot in the order it is viewed. They shoot all the scenes taking place in the same location at one time. So it could very well be that this battle was the very first thing they filmed. Could also be the last, I dont know.
I appreciated that, even though the Latin wasn't 100% accurate, it managed to convey the conversational and casual sound fo Latin. So often the church style of stiff rigid Latin is what people associate with it. I liked that touch.
There is liturgic latin and vulgar latin. Completelly different languages. While in church the language didn't change, the vulgar changed as much as today we have different languages very different, all of them steaming from latin.
When the german dude who spat on the standard didnt get crucified i was dissapointed. He wouldnt have gotten off so easy. It also feels like one of these modern series who treats the audience like children. “These guya are assholes. Hate them. This guys are the good guys, relate to them”. This is why the HBO Rome is the best. All characters have vile character flaws and disgusting traits yet you love them.
You didn't pay attention then, every character had good and bad traits, it's just shown in a more subtle way. Also the series was too short to fully grow each character.
I agree misere nobis, it was in some ways over simplified. But as pointed out they had a limited time frame. The barbarian were very basic even though we know tribes bordering roman land wernt savages so to say. Also the main female lead caused all the issues. She is never held acountable that she assaulted the roman standard and caused the whole chain of events. Any way it was enjoyable but there was a definite narrative
The battle seemd rather small and insignificent. I'm not complaining about a lack of stand-ins or CGI. More on how everybody behaved. It felt more like a minor first victory that got their spirits up. I happened and was over. I really prefer films like The Eagle or Legion - not accurate! BUT so much more effective when it comes to depicting the dread and otherworldliness the invaders are facing. Personally, I had hoped for a journey like Heart Of Darkness / Apocalypse Now. This was a bland and unemotional clusterfuck.
Funny thing about Arminius is that no one seems to know what the heck he was trying to do: his family disowned him because they wanted to be Roman clients, the Germans killed him because he seemed over ambitious, and most Germans traded with Rome, so being involved with him would always be a problem no matter what.
When in doubt, assume he wanted to have power. In this case this might be the control over his and neighbouring tribes with the knowledge of Roman strategy and tactics. It might be a bit of a stretch to paint him as a "patriot" since, while the Germanic tribes had a sense of identity, it wasn't on such a national level like the Romans, but more tribal. There was a lot of infighting, the fact they mostly raided Romans seems to be owed to the fact that there was simply better loot to be had compared to fighting other Germanic tribes.
Most warriors of the Germanic tribes of nort and middle germany followed him as military leader, so his acceptance was bigger than you describe here. He was no outlaw in the cherusci society but a nobleman with good relations to rome.
@@couchpotatoe91 The Romans sort of projected their national identity on other groups (They saw the tribes as all being part of the ''Germanic'' people). So maybe Arminius was more ''patriotic'' than other Germans; because he had the ''Rome vs Germans'' idea in his head due to his upbringing.
From a production perspective, my wife and I thought they needed a bigger budget. Meaning the tribes should have been bigger to give us the audience a hint as to why the Romans went through the hassle of putting someone loyal to Rome in power, and why there was any attempt at peace. As is, the tribes looked like a handful of people and the Roman army should have just cut them down. It is obvious the scope was kept to a min due to cost, which is ok. But for additional seasons, it would be great if these different factions had some more scale.
I liked the first 5 episodes but I found the last disappointing, with all the build up I was hoping for a more accurate portrayal of the battle. But still overall I liked the show and judging by how it ended there might be a season 2.
I feel Netflix curtailed them. They could have easily used 2-3 more episodes to build the set up more, why Arminius decides to betray Varus, why do the Germans turn openly rebellious. Another episode to cover the battle more. A lot of this show feels rushed due to the episode count.
Yeah, I take issue with the scene where everyone just forgets to use shields or formations. Film-makers have a thing for chaotic, pell-mell battle-scenes!
@@Will-SFC06 The funniest thing about it is that both sides just charge against each other like dumbf*cks, while there is the monologue of Arminius in the background saying that keeping the ranks in check is so important. Btw, that monologue was the worst part of the entire show.
Oh, and Just editing it out would cause the riders to sit there, with their legs still in stir up positions, just without stir ups... leading to "They edited out the stir ups blabla" etc.
Super! You should check out the Chinese series; the longest day in Chang'an, a Chinese series set in the Tang dynasty, here the swords don't go trough armor, which is great to see and it's said that the armor, weapons and architecture are the most historically accurate in all of the Chinese series and movies.
Probably because he got it from the same guys. From what I understood, the other helmet was shipped directly to Matt. This one, I think, is the one that he went and got.
@@SithLord2066 That's easy to say. VFX work is tightly scheduled and no one has the time to work on an irrelevant detail that 99% of the audience won't even notice.
I'm just glad their wearing decent armour for once and not leather straps or coats like they did in that Rome rise and fall of an Empire show on the history channel years back.
What are you talking about?! ALL Roman's had British accents! TV told me so. Seriously though, be glad they didn't use an American accent. One name: Channing Tatum: th-cam.com/video/3PKNvIocm9w/w-d-xo.html
I really wish they would show the Roman retaliations for the Battle of Teutoburg Forest.... Because this gave the illusion, just like Crassus' defeat at Carrhae, that the Roman's were "helpless" and just took this defeat on the chin.....
I am sorry, but I love the intro "I'm not going back to that forest. I'm not." I wish more historical fiction had more characters with common sense. :-D
You realize that nearly every European language was influenced by Latin You don't need to be a Romance speaker to understand what the Romans were saying. Heck even the Nahautl speakers have Latin(Roman Catholic Church) origin words in their vocab today. Altough if you are an Iberian Romance speaker, you could understand some sentences in 'Al Hayba' (2017 Drama) .
@@robroux5059 I know, I speak Spanish and german as my mother tongues but Im also fairly fluent in portuguese, french and guaraní (and english, duh). Speaking any language makes it easier for you to understand whats going on on any other similar language, like italian or dutch for example. Im right now looking to learn arabic or turkish but I cant really decide between the two, turkish is probably more useful but arabic is going to be easier due to many similarties between spanish and arabic vocab.
@@robroux5059 that is a massive exaggeration, just because some can do it doesn't mean all can. The vast majority of Spanish speakers can't even understand portuguese and you expect that a Russian will understand latin
I was really impressed when you explained the special and expensive armor of the "eagle barer"! Thanks a lot for this video. E prima che mi dimentico: grazie per la raccomandazione di evropaantiqva!
@@lucasraphaelpianegonda2058 It's probably eurocentric to assume that Battle of the Teutoburg Forest would be covered in history classes around the world.
Metatron: The helmet’s aren’t shiny enough✨. 😂 I appreciate your precision. You really hone in on the subtlety. It’s too mad you can’t monetize this episode for copyright reasons. You totally deserve it.
@@300leothelion IIRC he lived in London. There's a video where he talks at length about his language skills and where he lived (which includes Japan), but i watched it a long time ago and i don't even remember the title or subject.
He's Germanic. If you want to see real Romans, look up terenetius neo or the Pompeii portrait of Achilles. Or the Pompeii portrait of Mars as a reference
It's been awhile since I've seen the show, but if I remember right, they didn't even mention the weather. There was a horrific storm going on during the first and possibly second day of fighting. The Germans were accustomed to this sort of weather and fought accordingly, the romans, not being used to it were not only terrified by it, but also being more heavily armored, had more difficulty in maneuvering as well. I don't remember who said it now, but someone said that the weather changed history
Fun fact: Several roman historians have apparently scolded Varus for commiting suicide in their chronicles, calling it cowardice and claiming that he did so to avoid having to answer for his failure and the loss of his legions to the roman people and the emperor (and ignoring the fact that he likely wouldn't have survived the battle either way and even if he did, he probably wouldn't have made it back to rome in one piece).
But every roman commander who failed hard either died in battle or committed suicide with maybe varro as an exemption but cannae is a whole other honeypot
Varus made it back to Rome, in six bags of body parts, delivered by the few legionnaires the Germans allowed to live, with a message for the emperor "Try that veni, vidi, vici shit again and this is what happens, Schweinehunde!"
@@alexmag342 not it's not always. The ancient greeks were more forgiving with failures, who saw it more as good people who just happened to stumble into human errors. This is why we have many tragic heroes in greek myths
Honestly, super shocked at how good this show was. The costuming was just awesome. Sure there's was a few details wrong, but in comparison to 99.9% of all TV about Rome... I was blown away when I turned the first episode on and saw actual Roman armor
"That is who we are. The Forsworn. Criminals in our own lands. And we will cut a bloody hole into the Reach until we are free." ―Madanach, the Forsworn King in Rags
There is also evidence that the initial area for the ambush was prepared months in advance with some rudimentary fortifications for the Germanians built up high on both sides along the path through the forest. Also, according to Tacitus, the battle took place over 3 to 4 days like you've mentioned but it was in late autumn and during all of those days it was raining which contributed to the ease for the Germans to defeat the Romans. (Light infantry versus heavy infantry being able to move easier in wet conditions.) The Romans also had difficulty with the shield covers getting sodden from several days and even had difficulty seeing the enemy from rain dripping onto their faces from areas of their helmets.
Shouldn't be much different than how it would be done in modern times (in the absence of tranquilizers). You really only need sticks and nets, and isolate an animal to capture it. You're not doing it with your bare hands.
@@andrewcheng2113 Would probably be really pricey to get it to look smooth. The other CGI in the show was pretty glaring (especially that spear throw), so I can understand why they wouldn't bother
Hey, Raph. Could you ever take a look at the Asterix and Obelix movie from 1999 and see how close they got with the Romans and perhaps the Gauls. Love your work, from a Viking up north ;-D
Me: * reading the comments, not paying attention to the video * Metatron: *speaks italian* Me: *MMH, ORA DI ISCRIVERSI AD EVROPA ANTIQVA!* P. S. Complimenti davvero! Non sapevo che fossi italiano! Lodevole pronuncia inglese, un punto di riferimento per il mio studio! Continua così!
Surprising, at this point Nyet-flix is synonymous with revisionist history so to see a positive review based on historical accuracy is actually kind of exiting.
MonsieurHiroshima Except they had thousands of slaves, they didint care much for common people and they were ruthless during their military campaigns. Julius Caesar killed a million people and burned and looted thousands of villages in Gaul.
@MonsieurHiroshima While I admire Roman achievements as much as anyone there can be no doubt that they would have been absolutely hated by many of the people they came into contact with. Roman brutality in dealing with tribes is well documented and was even by the norms of society back then sometimes considered to be excessive. Of course that is only part of the story and often relationships were more peaceful. It is recorded that some barbarians were actually very proud to become Roman citizens. Yet it is entirely believable that from the perspective of other tribesmen the Romans were indeed evil.
@MonsieurHiroshima Only educated and/or skilled slaves were treated with care because they were expensive (but they still had little to no rights and slaves of either sex could be raped). Uneducated & unskilled manual labor slaves were not treated with care and were disposable - that's why many were sent to work in mines which had a high injury and fatality rate.
For every minute in your Latin video I’ll send a dollar on Patreon. I know it’s nothing crazy but I love your content and I really enjoyed this show so I’m showing my support in the strange way that I do. Thank you for the awesome videos!
To the point that the romans are portrayed as evil. Yeah it is told from the germanic side and they really hated Varus for ignoring germanic laws and forcing them to pay high tributes.
Theres good and bad people on both sides, thats how it should be. Rome is anyways portrayed as the superb civilization most of the time, while slaves and tributes contribuition is often ignored.
I mean, every society at one point or another did slavery back in ancient times, and if it was a universal practice then you cannot really use it to make judgements between different societies.
The problem to me seems that the Romans had a army to maintain and the taxation of a subsistence farming society as the german tribes has nearly nothing to spend.
What an honor! The series is originally in German. This time, English in the synchronised version. I can watch it in my mother tongue and it will feel authentic. I was immeadiately surprised by the deep and realistic sound of the father’s voice at the beginning. His first two sentences were mumbled and I didn’t understand them the first time. The third sentence: “Mach die Haare auf!” (Open your hair!) had a different colour to it. It was warm, deep and touching. I thought, it would be then a good idea to hear the original voices, as it already seems to be a well made series, as soundtrack and voices pierce straight through you and I would profit from it even more in English... And then I saw it: Deutsch [Original]. 😊
@@sauromatae9728 I know that he knew about them. But I don't think he fought them. As there lived quite a bit afar from the Gaul region. They didn't settle in today's svabia until the 5th century
@@sauromatae9728 Yeah, you are right, it is quite a time ago that I read De Bello Gallico. However, it was only a expansion force. The bulk of Suebi still lived in todays Bohemia. They also didn't ally themselves to Arminius.
It is a complicated issue. Military History Visualized have made several videos about this. The Red Army became very competent, about one year into the war. The Red Army had plenty of fuel, the Germans did not. The Red Army was supported by the world markets and the resources of the global empire of USA and Britain.
@@martinan22 Notably, the german head of state was also an idiot. Oh yeah, why wouldn't you attack another super power you made a non-aggression treaty with when you are already at least evenly matched against your current opponents? What could possibly go wrong?
@@darthplagueis13 pretty much every german general were for the war. the plans they drew up was made by the okw. the generals wanted operation citadel while hitler did not. this meme about hitler being the idiot and the generals being overruled is nonsense.
This is the first video of yours I watch, but I love your attitude! Informative, well researched and also supportive of other channels that have helped you learn, and positive in your tone, acknowledging the choices made for some fiction aspects and conceding points where historical accuracy wasn't perfect, and overall being fair in not being tremendously nitpicky. Definitely subscribing! Beautiful video.
The same way how US Marine in early part of WW2 were still equiped with WW1 weapons like the 1903 springfield rifle and and water cooled Browning machine gun.
The Roman fort looked like they just set up tents in a clearing and put down spikes and called it a day. To my knowledge Roman were very keen on making effective fortifications. Otherwise good show and in particular the equipment and clothing was mostly spot on.
At last! I had to scroll down here to find your comment. I was worried nobody noticed it. Fort of two plus Legions? without serious engineering work? at the very extremity of the woods? absurd! CGI could fix it at no time (but hey, how could they steal the Eagle then?) -en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudis_(stake) is suitable for temporary castra gr.pinterest.com/pin/511862313873813898/visual-search/ for longer periods www.slideshare.net/GrahamAPhone/roman-camps
I really like what you said about Arminius looking more italian than barbarian. Like for real tho, he does! The actor could even play Julius Caesar in his prime. When I first saw the poster without knowing the history behind it, I legit thought that it's just another show about the glory of Rome and that the main guy is like one of their many emperors. Then I watched the series and he's supposed to be germanic? It felt kinda off for me specially when almost all of his fellow barbarians look like siblings with their typical north european features; he stood out more in his native tribe than within the roman infantry. Good thing the actor was really good and he pulled it off, the series is still 🔥
For all of you, who can speak German: the historic advisors have a TH-cam Channel and made an q&a about the good and the Bad stuff in the series and the process. Their Channel is kaptorga. Edit: they are a team of a historian and an archaeologist.
In relation to your video 2 years ago about "Black Washing History." I'm glad they didn't do it here. And for anyone who will call me a racist, I'm a Malayan race Filipino. I would be equally offended if there were Filipinos in Ancient Rome.
@@dilonruns4797 They wouldn’t. There weren’t black people in that part of Europe that long ago. Black people coming to Europe in large, noticeable numbers beyond the Mediterranean coastlines is a very recent thing.
The Roman Empire literally included North Africa and half the Middle East. It also traded with places as far away as China and. India. Of course there were people of colour living in the Roman Empire. Sub-Sahran Africans might have been uncommon but there were plenty of mixed race and brown skinned North Africans and Egyptians in the Roman Empire. A burial site in Southwark, London had 22 people in it and four of them appear to be of African ancestry. 4 out of 22. That's a minority sure, and it was probably a much smaller minority outside of urban areas, but it's still a significant number.
You might also want to look up Romans like Lusius Quietus, a Roman general and governor of Judea who was originally a Berber prince from modern day Morocco.
It threw me off a tad, not being a computer tech., but I often wonder what foreign keyboards look like. I mean.. Control isn't Control in other languages, y'know?
Regarding the polish of the helmets, that may be for theatrical purposes. A big shiny piece of metal in the middle of the shot is going to create a ton of glare for the camera. If your goal is to blind and intimidate your opponent, that's great. If you want to get a good color-balanced shot with a modern camera, dulling the steel is probably a practical necessity.
Commenting to boost this comment.
Good point.
That is something I should have known, but didn't consider. Upvoted so Metatron sees it.
That was my thought, too. Unless you're JJ, you don't want those flares 😉.
As a photographer, i endorse this. Nothing worse than big shiny stuff glaring at random points in your picture
The show really shines if you’re German, because it really makes the Romans seem like foreigners, the way the Germans saw them. It’s a cool way to see Romans.
I'm more convinced to believe arminius about Rome... If only he didn't forget about it in the end, cause he was right after all...
What I find ironic is that the Eagle of Rome is now the national symbol of Germany.
@@loxodoncyclotis1823 haha, they did kiss the eagle..it's fate
actually hurt to see this show as a german.
@@OkabexKurisu why? It’s German, if you watch it, watch it in the original
The stir ups were probably a safety measure for the actors. That was also a noted inaccuracy in the 2000 film 'Gladiator,' but were installed for safety reasons as well.
Yeah I'm not sure many cavalry stunt men necessarily know how to ride without them, it seems like an aspect of training, same with lacking saddle. Maybe some do but insurance companies are picky like that, safety wise.
In Alexander the Great movie they didn't have stirrups, credit to the riders
@@TheTariqibnziyad Alexander (2004) was the most historically accurate movie about antiquity ever made
@@Giorno. yup, loved how they delved into his pshyci too, amazing movie
Right? It's no wonder that many nobles and emperors throughout history died by falling off their horses. Without stirrups I can imagine it would be much less safe getting on and off the horse.
Just FYI, on a film set when using horses you almost HAVE to have stirrups legally. It's a danger to the actors and the unions have deemed them necessary, so I wouldn't be too hard on them for that. It's a detail that doesn't have a huge difference in historical accuracy and makes it a LOT safer for the actors.
Thanks. I was already thinking that they used the stirrups to make the riding safer and easier for the actors, but I didn't know that it was a rule. Makes sense.
Commenting just to give this comment more attention because it deserves it.
+ no insurace wouldn't cover no damages if they havent used them.
This.
In the HBO show Rome I think there are no stirrups. They even show that Caesar gets on his horse stepping on the back of a servant.
Legionnaire Metatron: I don't want to go back to the forest. No.
Germanicus: Titus, get the cross...
Vulpes, get the cross
@Mexican Rocks for Trump 2020 It's always worked better as a torture device than a religious Icon.
Crucifixtion time.
@Mexican Rocks for Trump 2020 Really I haven't seen him around. Last I heard they nailed him to one 1987 years ago.
@Mexican Rocks for Trump 2020 We're both a little off-topic but there is no one behind me. The metaphysical/supernatural world doesn't exist.
Roman Soldier 1: "Why are we wearing 20 pounds of armor when it provides zero protection from basic weapon attacks?"
Roman Soldier 2: "More to the point, why is the government putting so much money into the labor intensive act of producing enough armor for entire armies if they provide no defense?"
"How did a simple civilian take one of our soldiers out in an unarmed tussle even though he was trained in wrestling?"
This hits even harder to a medieval knight
@@dusk6159 a knights full plate armor was extremely effective though
@@thecakecakecake8198 And that's why it's more confusing and impactful to them
That last episode when the sharp sticks hit with the same force as a ballista bolt.
A cool thing about roman costumes you didnt mention, the soldiers were wearing scarfs to stop the armor cutting them which we know is historically accurate
I would rather think scarfs are worn to protect the armour from rain and other elements and to keep the soldiers warm since at the time Germania was a freezing hell hole. Armour cutting its wearer seems like bad a armour smith.
@@dumitrache12 The Romans did most definitely wear scarfs to protect against their armour. It has nothing to do with bad armour smiths. Just rub a blunt piece of metal on your skin, eventually it will start to cut in.
@@dumitrache12 No, it is well known that the scarf is to protect the neck form sharp edges on that part of the armor (if any, because of quality differences), bruises or/and painful pinches.
They also had them to use as bandage if they got hurt in battle and no medic was aveilable
they also used them as pillows
They actually wanted to not use stirrups, however it was impossible to get insurance without them. Thats should be really considered.
At least in most shots they tried to not make the stirrups obvious
yeah I would have retouched with CGI..
Greg Mattson that also takes a lot of money. Would you rather have the Romans wearing different types of armour, or not see stirrups?
@@slopcrusher3482 it actually doesn't cost that much now, most film companies shoot digital now, and you aren't adding something to the film, just subtracting. A full frame of CGI costs in general 5,000 to 20,000 per minute, I'd assume that just a small part of the film would be a lot less per minute. And how many minutes in the show have stirrups in them?
@@gregmattson2238 "Just Subtracting". it is hard to remove something from a movie without people immediately noticing and going "Hey what the hell is that". This is not just taking something out. you have to ensure you only remove the stirrup, you have to fix the lighting around the rider's feet, you have to make sure everything tracks properly, you have to fix a lot of stuff. this all had to be done by a team of individuals that are normally specialized. you cant just pay a guy 50 bucks per hour for a couple days, these guys make an average of 80 grand a year each, they aren't cheap. in the end they decided it wasn't worth the costs.
This show was much better than I feared. I mean Netflix has a very poor track record for this genre, but it was actually decent.
you're wrong. netflix have a lot of amazing shows of the same genre. the last kingdom, knightfall, the frontier, etc.
Poor is an understatement
@@nurval1093 Agree on The Last Kingdom, Knightfall not so much.
I think the Last Kingdom was BBC
Its actually a German Show
The face mask Arminius is wearing, was actually found and is a museum artifact. I think this is the reason it was shown.
Still doesn't change the fact it should have been polished bright enough to see your face in. Roman soldiers were trained to take great pride in the appearance of their war gear.
The mask is cool and it was found at the battle but his helmet is a bit embellished like i dont think Romans had skulls on their helmets
@@clothar23 Yea you are right. But this artifact was shown because it was found at the actual battle field.
Historians to this day do not know why this helmet was there, too.
@@tenarmurk Actually NOT that unusual. Legio V Alaudae were called the Meadowlarks and had their helmets decorated with Blue Meadowlarks on the sides. Incidentally, their tunics and shields were also blue instead of the Roman red.
"armor cut like butter..." as Shadversity said : the lightsaber syndrome
@Gustavo Octavio deCampos I think you’d enjoy „the king“ then. Loved their portrayal of medieval hand to hand combat
What kills me about light sabers is no one let's the light go past the three feet. Must be knightly fetish but you would thing Darth Vader would have taken the pin our an let the saber rip to it's max cutting and piercing and smoking 'em distance of 100 meters. Yeah, even peon me took the pin out of my shotgun to allow two extra shots!
@@fjack1588 It has a set length, and losses potency the longer it gets. Vader's saber allows him to freely choose between 1 length and a another longer length. So he already has a longer saber.
@Gustavo Octavio deCampos The King is a horrible movie, dialogue and acting is terrible and it is ridden of modern progressive sensibilities. Its battle might be more accurate but it is incredibly boring to watch. I'd take Henry V (1989) rendition of the battle of Agincourt any day over that trash.
Your description doesn't quitecapture the energy in the word *LIGHTSABAAAH!*
The face mask of Arminius is actually a replica of a mask found during the excarvation. It's known that there was a shiny layer on the mask, maby even made of silver, but it might have decayed over the years or was torn of he mask, because it appeared to be valuable. The film crew might have forgotten this information from the archeologists
Worth to ay, it was found in the town of Kalkriese and can be seen in the Kalkriese Museum.
Throwback to me 10yrs ago thinking Roman statues were all white 😂
I doubt they ever knew that or talked to an archaeologist
I personally find the unpolished look pretty cool on that mask.
@@simonphoenix3789 That's probably why they left it unpolished. It looks better on film
The funniest criticism i've heard from this series is that it doesn't uses actual Latin and ancient germanic languages
like
this is a major improvement over British Romans and you expected more?
It is a case of failled expectations. It was advertised as the most accurate historical TV show ever and these details are a valid point of criticism. Also, I honestly do not like members of Germanic tribes speaking modern German, probably because I can actually understand German. That turns it into a weird gimmick; why make the characters speak a modern language if we are going for historical accuracy? I would rather they spoke English then, otherwise it just looks silly.
As for the Latin, it does sound funny, but at least it is a more exotic language, despite the weird pronunciation, so it is not such an issue.
@@piotrpiotrowski4681 I cannot say about them using modern German. But considering that Roman soldiers came from all over the empire, I would imagine that they would all have their own funny accents when speaking Latin so that may not be too far off from reality, just as there are so many different accents of English today.
do we even know what language the Germanics spoke back then? Is it as well documented as Latin?
@@piotrpiotrowski4681 Why shouldn't they speak German? It's a German production. There are tons of English movies with people speaking English and subtitled foreigners.
@@stc3145 It is believe among historians that "American" accents more closely represent pre-19th century British accents than modern British accents.
Any English only speakers watching Barbarians, i strongly suggest you run it in the original German and use captions. The optional English dub hurts the dramatic effect.
Now you tell me? I feel cheated now
@@danielc9967 always glad to be of service ;)
I didn't even see a dub option. Just started playing and had subtitles.
Subtitles are the only way to go. Dubs are blasphemy.
@@andrew_mb Amen
No stirrups, no insurance coverage from insurance company in case of riding accidents during filming. Plain as that.
That complaint is really annoying me on various channels. There is talking about historical authenticity and there is ignoring realities of the modern world. Like insurance pay or plainly that an actor might be trained in horse riding, which in our times means with a saddle, stirrups and harness so he won't be trained riding without stirrups and feel comfortable controlling a horse while acting without them.
In the same vein what stunt coordinators would do to a historian who wants to force them to use equipment that risks stunt men breaking their necks.
One can acknowledge that this is anachronistic but should also acknowledge why this is not a mistake, but an intentional necessity.
The whole time he was going on about the stirrups I was waiting for him to say "...but we can forgive this because of the safety factor--the production insurance requires stirrups for everyone but trained stunt players." Nope. Apparently he has no idea, but I guess he's a historian, not a student of the movie industry. Still, you'd think if WE know that...
Yes it is rather sad that such a problem gets in the way. I understand it, but people were able to do this process of horse riding for years, which makes me think it wouldn't be too much if a stretch to have the actors learn such a method.
@@fabulous_finn7810 It would cost more time and money to train the actors. And for a series, that's going to be much tougher to accomplish. Especially over something that most people who aren't historians are going to catch.
@@fabulous_finn7810 When the lord of the rings was being made the producers had a world wide search for men who could ride bear back, for just such resions.
*My main gripe about the series is the actual events leading to the battle itself. The series presented the ambush like it happened for a couple of hours instead of a methodical 3 day massacre for the Germanic tribes. Wouldve been awesome if the ambush was presented as a 3 day struggle for survival for the doomed Romans to the point that youd feel sympathetic towards them as the series presented the Romans as the antagonists.*
in my opinion the roman soldiers seemed to be portrayed as inferior fighters which for the most part kind of irked me,yes you see a few kills for the romans ,but it would have been atlot more instense in reality i would say.
budget, you want more pay them more, shit is not free
They could have stretch the episodes up to 10 if they really made the battle long but yeah it seems they don't have enough budget to portray more episodes.
@@ahronsumar5075 well thats normal since the winning side has always plot armor. its like comparing it with star wars and its storm troopers. Maybe in Barbarians season 2 when Germanicus delivers a Roman Blitzkrieg into Germania we would see Legionarii besting almost all of Germanic warriors
@@sephiroaone-of-nine101 Muh budget. You're boring.
They should do a season covering the campaigns of Germanicus
I want to see Scipio and Hannibal.
La vendetta
@@sfjlfkjsdlfkjds 'Das Nibelungenlied' is not set in any particular time period. In fact it is scattered all over the time scale. On top of that it is estimated to have been written around 1200 AD from folk memory. These folk memories were at this point from 5 to 12 centuries old. Obviously they would get severely distorted into folk tales/legends. As to the connection 'Siegfried - Arminius': This and other links to historicals events have been made by historians and other literary professionals. Laugh as much as you like but that won't illegitimize their interpretations of this story. The idea is that the dragon represents the roman army forced to march through the forest while stretched out into a long line. Originally even in Europe dragons were imagined as serpents (without limbs). Hard to prove but as good an interpretation as any other. Btw, the belief that Siegfried is copied from Sigurd is nonsensical. It was the other way around. Scandinavians could not be the progenitors of a story largely based on early Frankish history...
@@kev3d Scipio and Hannibal wouldn't be called "Barbarians"
Season 2 - Roman come back and massacre every Germanic tribe who tries to opose them.
I had heard that the Romans had kept the German subjects in their territory before the rebellion “iron-starved” by taxation and confiscation, since iron implements are easily converted to sharp, pointy things. When the Germans began their night raids against Varus’s column, they were often armed with short oaken cudgels split from younger trees, thereby forming triangular-sections that could concentrate a blow against a Roman helmet or lorica armor sections into deep dents. That’s often more effectively damaging to flesh and bone than a puncture or a slash, since the iron stays dented, compressing the wound. Romans rarely fought at night, being used to resting then behind their palisaded and moated encampments. By continuing the increasingly panicked marches at night, the Romans were vulnerable to sudden rushes from the flanks by black-painted warriors with clubs and light shields into and through the marchers. Gradually, the Germans were able to arm themselves with left-behind Roman arms to be ready for the final set piece ambush battle where the remnant was trapped at the barricade at the lakeside.
That's a gem... "Spoiler alert for those who didn't go to school". It should probably rate as the best burn of the decade.
Though one could argue that there is someone watching this video who hasn't learnt it yet in school lol.
Because a school in Argentina is gonna teach about a battle in Germany. sure bro
*Best* scene:
Germans before the battle: "We can't win, we're going home"
That chick: "We're gonna win, I cut my face so I must know"
Germans: "K, sounds legit, we're staying"
IKR that made me cringe so hard
@@calvin5541 why did that make you cringe?
@@reudensplasher1659 because it is stupid?
@@lewistaylor2858 but how? It's their religion and they believe that she can see the future
@@lewistaylor2858 It actually made sense since people back then was superstitious as heck.
Nothing looking back this far can ever be 100% accurate, how could it be, but the effort must be recognized. Well done in my opinion.
Modern day plebs:
"Roman's wore mohawk helmets."
Grand Master Metatron:
"CREST HORIZONTAL"
For what I've read online (so take it with a pinch of salt) "mohawk" type of crests where used my rank and file legionaries but as decoration and on parades, not really on the battlefield. The big mistake people usually make is putting mohawk crests on centurions. Centurions used exclusively the horizontal crest to make them easier to locate on the battlefield and as a symbol of their rank
Pfft! Such things are unimportant to the effect of a TV show. The effect comes from the story. Does it show what happened or does it make people get a false understanding of the politics and economics of the era? Barbarians shows the main points I have learnt about the era, so I approve.
Aren't they both horizontal? I mean the mohawk type doesn't strike me particularly vertical. Distinction is rather between inline or perpendicular to the line of sight.
Thing is they did, about 250 years later.
its not mohawk, its a halo. it can be vertical of horizontal.
Love how they cast an Italian as Varus. So used to seeing Romans being played by British actors 😅.
Casting British actors as Romans (especially when they are the villains) is an American productions' custom. For example, in French movie "Druids", the character of Julius Caesar is played by Klaus Maria Brandauer who is an Austrian!
@Sjwaria Law Your joke wasn't really funny.
If this was the BBC, they would have cast IDRIS ELBA as Varus...Claiming historical accuracy to the time.
@Sjwaria Law well the empire recruited from North Africa and Middle East why would all the soldiers look southern Europeans
Yeh well, what you gonna do chap 😂
It's funny how a tv-show goes to so great lengths to be, say 95%, historically accurate - and then just intentionally really fuck up the remaining 5% (like cutting through armor). I cannot grasp why they would do that.
Fanrik I think they fall to the temptation of using such devices to deliver clear messages. Like in action movies, when people get shot and die instantly, or pass out by a single punch. The message is "he's dead". Similarly , in medieval themed battles the most realistic way would be to have the soldiers fight HEMA style and die form infected wounds several days later but a) doesn't "look cool" for the (uneducated) audience
b) takes to long to deliver the message: "he is dead".
Soooo: swords cut through metal plate because is what people are used to :'(
First 5 episodes i only saw armored people getting sliced in the most vulnerable parts and no armor piercing just yet
@@rapidvetD Even in the final battle most of the detailed kills are cutting throats or stabbing under the arms. People like to complain
@@jamie_d0g978 someone said its harder to do thrusts than cuts when doing stunts and with the cgi thing i think its way less work for the tech dudes plus its saves more budget idk. in the show i saw less of those armor cutting swords than any other shows i've watched so far
@@rapidvetD ultimately it does come down to budget, and time, I would add "sex sells" but that technically falls under budget (marketing and potential profit).
When I heard the first line I Latin I thought "I need a metatron video about it". Thank you man, you are the best
Ok that opening bit about teutoburg forest actually made me audibly laugh 😂
Best opening ever... 🤣
Mike Mcgoldrick surely???
When the trees start speaking German.
@@MikeBenko Mein Wald
@@MikeBenko GUTEN TAG
15:03 She stabbed the guy into the neck. Just finished watching the last episode, so I'm pretty sure of it. So, she didn't pierce the armor, she bypassed it.
But in the final battle of the show they cut through it like butter
She did stab that dude in the neck, but I'd more so take issue with Arminius's kill around 28:15 of episode 6
I have been a sport extra in the ending battle. Was a fun job. Even tho 10 hours in that lorica is a Woden damned misery sometimes...
I am so envious. It must have been a blast.
how cool! can you tell me where it was filmed? Thanks!
@@henner645 The series was supposedly filmed in Budapest (probably near it)
You can say god damned you know. God is a Germanic word and has nothing to do with that desert crap.
It’s a god damned shame that people associate native things with xtians and then try to circumvent them.
But, very cool!
That must have been soaking
Though I understand what you mean, since thought has crossed my mind aswell, Iwould not say the Romans were depicted as "evil". Metellus was clearly arranged as an antagonist, as was Varus, but both had moments of "humanity". I explained the difference in portrayal of the "Germanics" and the Romans by two things: One, the PoV is clearly on the Germanic side, and for a compelling story of this sort you need antagonists. Two, the Romans were an occupying force. These are not civilians, these are not even soldiers in their (semi-)permanent forts, these are the soldiers of an expanding empire on campaign, sent to subjugate a sometimes friendly, sometimes unruly and sometimes outright hostile populace. They're sent to collect tribute und establish a more direct form of rule, and I do not doubt - given Varus' ultimate destiny - that they weren't always the most careful and understanding of rulers.
I mean, Arminius kinda fucked up explaining the Tribes' views on execution, but... yeah... pommel-bashing a kid? _not_ very "hearts and minds" on that one...
Romaboos be like
I liked Metellus. He was pretty bad ass and yes, he did have a moment of humanity. Too bad, Arminius betrayed him.
@@seand.g423 Napoleon's marshalls in Iberia committed the same mistakes 1800 years later so idiotic commanders will always exist.
Alright so Germanicus' campaigns when? Also I'm still holding out for the hope someone one day does Ancient Roman James Bond series; Setorius.
*Ancient Roman _Connery_ Bond.
The battle of Teutoburg forest was in 9 CE, and Germanicus found the remains of the legions who died in that battle in 15 CE, so Germanicus went to Germania 5-6 years later.
I'd like to see Roman North Africa.....and no, not another Biblical movie about Jesus in Roman Palestine (where they spoke Greek as lingua franca, not Latin mind you).
"Should I say 'spoiler alert'??
I mean, this is history..."
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
You're the best, The Metatron!!
I was expecting them to show the slow march to ruin of the legions, the final battle happened to quick. I feel they missed the essence of the Teutoburg forest battles. But they did set up what comes next for Arminius.
The end battle felt like they ran out of money tbh! Still enjoyed the series for the costumes and locations, the fighting was sadly a fantasy cliché
@@Moritz606 well its what it comes down shit ain't free
EXACTLY...it was several skirmishes and two battles over the course of almost 4 days...it was a series you would have thought they could portray that part better :(
@@Moritz606 thing is, movies and tv series are rarely ever shot in the order it is viewed. They shoot all the scenes taking place in the same location at one time. So it could very well be that this battle was the very first thing they filmed. Could also be the last, I dont know.
It was compressed and I don't know why.
I appreciated that, even though the Latin wasn't 100% accurate, it managed to convey the conversational and casual sound fo Latin. So often the church style of stiff rigid Latin is what people associate with it. I liked that touch.
Church latin isn't classical latin, people 2000 years ago didn't speak like the Pope or whatever
My personal pet peeve is that some of the characters pronounced Varus as "Vawus" when it should be more like "Warus"
A mí me sonó muy italiano el acento.
There is liturgic latin and vulgar latin. Completelly different languages.
While in church the language didn't change, the vulgar changed as much as today we have different languages very different, all of them steaming from latin.
Agree. Nothing ruins Latin like Catholicism. 👍🏻
When the german dude who spat on the standard didnt get crucified i was dissapointed. He wouldnt have gotten off so easy. It also feels like one of these modern series who treats the audience like children. “These guya are assholes. Hate them. This guys are the good guys, relate to them”. This is why the HBO Rome is the best. All characters have vile character flaws and disgusting traits yet you love them.
You didn't pay attention then, every character had good and bad traits, it's just shown in a more subtle way. Also the series was too short to fully grow each character.
Man I miss Rome I think it's due time I rewatch the 2 series box set absolutely fantastic show.
What do you expect German miniseries about how Romans got whooped by Germanic tribes.
I agree misere nobis, it was in some ways over simplified. But as pointed out they had a limited time frame. The barbarian were very basic even though we know tribes bordering roman land wernt savages so to say. Also the main female lead caused all the issues. She is never held acountable that she assaulted the roman standard and caused the whole chain of events. Any way it was enjoyable but there was a definite narrative
The battle seemd rather small and insignificent. I'm not complaining about a lack of stand-ins or CGI. More on how everybody behaved. It felt more like a minor first victory that got their spirits up. I happened and was over.
I really prefer films like The Eagle or Legion - not accurate! BUT so much more effective when it comes to depicting the dread and otherworldliness the invaders are facing.
Personally, I had hoped for a journey like Heart Of Darkness / Apocalypse Now.
This was a bland and unemotional clusterfuck.
Funny thing about Arminius is that no one seems to know what the heck he was trying to do: his family disowned him because they wanted to be Roman clients, the Germans killed him because he seemed over ambitious, and most Germans traded with Rome, so being involved with him would always be a problem no matter what.
He's quite the benedict arnold. Very complicated motivations.
When in doubt, assume he wanted to have power. In this case this might be the control over his and neighbouring tribes with the knowledge of Roman strategy and tactics.
It might be a bit of a stretch to paint him as a "patriot" since, while the Germanic tribes had a sense of identity, it wasn't on such a national level like the Romans, but more tribal. There was a lot of infighting, the fact they mostly raided Romans seems to be owed to the fact that there was simply better loot to be had compared to fighting other Germanic tribes.
At least he archieved a form of Immortality
Most warriors of the Germanic tribes of nort and middle germany followed him as military leader, so his acceptance was bigger than you describe here. He was no outlaw in the cherusci society but a nobleman with good relations to rome.
@@couchpotatoe91 The Romans sort of projected their national identity on other groups (They saw the tribes as all being part of the ''Germanic'' people).
So maybe Arminius was more ''patriotic'' than other Germans; because he had the ''Rome vs Germans'' idea in his head due to his upbringing.
From a production perspective, my wife and I thought they needed a bigger budget. Meaning the tribes should have been bigger to give us the audience a hint as to why the Romans went through the hassle of putting someone loyal to Rome in power, and why there was any attempt at peace.
As is, the tribes looked like a handful of people and the Roman army should have just cut them down. It is obvious the scope was kept to a min due to cost, which is ok. But for additional seasons, it would be great if these different factions had some more scale.
The stirrups were probably used for security/insurance reasons, as to not need to train the actors in riding without stirrups
They should have added a disclaimer at the start: "Any and all historical inaccuracies are entirely the fault of the actors' union"
I have a feeling stirrups on horses are for occupational health and safety (ie: insurance) reasons......
I liked the first 5 episodes but I found the last disappointing, with all the build up I was hoping for a more accurate portrayal of the battle. But still overall I liked the show and judging by how it ended there might be a season 2.
I too was disappointed, but I think this a moment where they were constraint by the flow of the narrative, limited time and possibly budget.
The battle itself could have taken 2-3 episodes if they went for true display of 3 days of battle
I feel Netflix curtailed them. They could have easily used 2-3 more episodes to build the set up more, why Arminius decides to betray Varus, why do the Germans turn openly rebellious. Another episode to cover the battle more.
A lot of this show feels rushed due to the episode count.
Yeah, I take issue with the scene where everyone just forgets to use shields or formations. Film-makers have a thing for chaotic, pell-mell battle-scenes!
@@Will-SFC06 The funniest thing about it is that both sides just charge against each other like dumbf*cks, while there is the monologue of Arminius in the background saying that keeping the ranks in check is so important.
Btw, that monologue was the worst part of the entire show.
8:32 you cant get actor insurance for film without them they are safety concern.
but you can edit them out, shouldn't be that hard. Or film from angles where you dont see them.
@@Moritz606 lazy productions edits cost more production money again
@@Moritz606 yes, you can edit them out. But it’s weeks of methodical hard work.
@@shmekelfreckles8157 and the moment one is not Properly edited out, you're the joke of the internet.
Oh, and Just editing it out would cause the riders to sit there, with their legs still in stir up positions, just without stir ups... leading to "They edited out the stir ups blabla" etc.
Super! You should check out the Chinese series; the longest day in Chang'an, a Chinese series set in the Tang dynasty, here the swords don't go trough armor, which is great to see and it's said that the armor, weapons and architecture are the most historically accurate in all of the Chinese series and movies.
I like the look of the Romans that is depicted in the show.
I'm sitting here wondering if that's the same helmet that Matt Easton is about to destroy with his pilum
Hahaha so was I
Looks exactly the same.
Probably because he got it from the same guys. From what I understood, the other helmet was shipped directly to Matt. This one, I think, is the one that he went and got.
Whenever I see such videos on my feed, I just press subscribe! Great video!!
Last time I was so early the Roman empire was still around
That Centurion's helmet look like his mom bought it for him, like a couple sizes too large for when he grows up.
:D Conehead!
To be fair, the equipment in this show was the best I've ever seen on film. Was it perfect no.
Maybe she did... 😉
He'll grow into it 😂😂
-reading stirrups: you can't get insurance for your actors without stirrups.
So they don't really have a choice if they wanted to use them or not
It's only in a couple of scenes, they could've easily CGI'ed the stirrups out. Or change the camera angle so the feet aren't visible.
@@SithLord2066 That's easy to say. VFX work is tightly scheduled and no one has the time to work on an irrelevant detail that 99% of the audience won't even notice.
As long as the Romans being portrayed are at least attempting to speak Latin instead of using British English, this show already wins me over.
I'm just glad their wearing decent armour for once and not leather straps or coats like they did in that Rome rise and fall of an Empire show on the history channel years back.
What are you talking about?! ALL Roman's had British accents! TV told me so. Seriously though, be glad they didn't use an American accent. One name: Channing Tatum: th-cam.com/video/3PKNvIocm9w/w-d-xo.html
I really wish they would show the Roman retaliations for the Battle of Teutoburg Forest.... Because this gave the illusion, just like Crassus' defeat at Carrhae, that the Roman's were "helpless" and just took this defeat on the chin.....
Ok give them a couple million or more and boom, what don't have the money for something so big..ahh well we can all dream
Exactly, Arminius and many of the Cherusci warlords were killed in a battle a few years later by the Romans.
@@alexdobma4694 Wasn't Arminius backstabed after countless defeats by fearfull/jealous warlords?
@@armorking7258 My bad, yeah. He did die as a result of losing a battle, just not directly.
Could definitely be a season 2. Netflix hasn't officially ordered it yet but it's a very popular show.
I am sorry, but I love the intro "I'm not going back to that forest. I'm not." I wish more historical fiction had more characters with common sense. :-D
I'm sure a great many of the legionnaires had that common sense but the threat of crucifixion really has a way of motivating you lol
2:19 Missed the perfect oppertunity to say "copy pasta" and you just let it slip like that. Incredibilis.
I don't even speak Italian but I understood that one sentence perfectly, speaking any romance language really fuckin helps I guess
You realize that nearly every European language was influenced by Latin You don't need to be a Romance speaker to understand what the Romans were saying. Heck even the Nahautl speakers have Latin(Roman Catholic Church) origin words in their vocab today. Altough if you are an Iberian Romance speaker, you could understand some sentences in 'Al Hayba' (2017 Drama) .
@@robroux5059 I know, I speak Spanish and german as my mother tongues but Im also fairly fluent in portuguese, french and guaraní (and english, duh). Speaking any language makes it easier for you to understand whats going on on any other similar language, like italian or dutch for example. Im right now looking to learn arabic or turkish but I cant really decide between the two, turkish is probably more useful but arabic is going to be easier due to many similarties between spanish and arabic vocab.
ita
@@robroux5059 that is a massive exaggeration, just because some can do it doesn't mean all can.
The vast majority of Spanish speakers can't even understand portuguese and you expect that a Russian will understand latin
@@garciagar64 its not difficult really, incredibly simple gramatic and structure like english. The only difficult part is pronouncing it
I was really impressed when you explained the special and expensive armor of the "eagle barer"!
Thanks a lot for this video.
E prima che mi dimentico: grazie per la raccomandazione di evropaantiqva!
"spoiler alert for those who didn't go to school"
😂😂
Yeah.. That's probably overestimating the quality of the history classes around the world..
@@lucasraphaelpianegonda2058 No kidding
@@lucasraphaelpianegonda2058 It's probably eurocentric to assume that Battle of the Teutoburg Forest would be covered in history classes around the world.
@@MaggotDiggo1 I doubt 95% of European schools would have covered that anyway
Yeah. I was so burned by that. And I ended up catching some actual spoilers for the plot. He did warn, though, so it was my fault. XD
Metatron: The helmet’s aren’t shiny enough✨. 😂
I appreciate your precision. You really hone in on the subtlety. It’s too mad you can’t monetize this episode for copyright reasons. You totally deserve it.
Movie industry today tends to take the "weathering" of props and costumes so far that they often look excavated.
This chap knows his stuff. Pronunciation of the words perfectly. You can tell his family are Italian. 👍🏻🇬🇧
Lol he's Italian himself
@@leandrog2785 I didn’t know mate. I thought by his accent he was from London. But his ancestry’s Italian.
@@300leothelion IIRC he lived in London. There's a video where he talks at length about his language skills and where he lived (which includes Japan), but i watched it a long time ago and i don't even remember the title or subject.
He's Germanic. If you want to see real Romans, look up terenetius neo or the Pompeii portrait of Achilles. Or the Pompeii portrait of Mars as a reference
@300leothelion he is not english, he's 100% italian
It's been awhile since I've seen the show, but if I remember right, they didn't even mention the weather. There was a horrific storm going on during the first and possibly second day of fighting. The Germans were accustomed to this sort of weather and fought accordingly, the romans, not being used to it were not only terrified by it, but also being more heavily armored, had more difficulty in maneuvering as well.
I don't remember who said it now, but someone said that the weather changed history
They did include the rain after Arminius was giving a monologue about needing help from the gods, mostly for dramatic effect.
Fun fact: Several roman historians have apparently scolded Varus for commiting suicide in their chronicles, calling it cowardice and claiming that he did so to avoid having to answer for his failure and the loss of his legions to the roman people and the emperor (and ignoring the fact that he likely wouldn't have survived the battle either way and even if he did, he probably wouldn't have made it back to rome in one piece).
But every roman commander who failed hard either died in battle or committed suicide with maybe varro as an exemption but cannae is a whole other honeypot
Romans were not gentle on failure.
@@TheodoreMinick nobody is gentle on failure, it always is unnacepatble
Varus made it back to Rome, in six bags of body parts, delivered by the few legionnaires the Germans allowed to live, with a message for the emperor "Try that veni, vidi, vici shit again and this is what happens, Schweinehunde!"
@@alexmag342 not it's not always. The ancient greeks were more forgiving with failures, who saw it more as good people who just happened to stumble into human errors. This is why we have many tragic heroes in greek myths
Honestly, super shocked at how good this show was. The costuming was just awesome. Sure there's was a few details wrong, but in comparison to 99.9% of all TV about Rome... I was blown away when I turned the first episode on and saw actual Roman armor
When the trees start speaking German
"That is who we are. The Forsworn. Criminals in our own lands. And we will cut a bloody hole into the Reach until we are free."
―Madanach, the Forsworn King in Rags
I have only recently found your channel.................And I love it.
There is also evidence that the initial area for the ambush was prepared months in advance with some rudimentary fortifications for the Germanians built up high on both sides along the path through the forest. Also, according to Tacitus, the battle took place over 3 to 4 days like you've mentioned but it was in late autumn and during all of those days it was raining which contributed to the ease for the Germans to defeat the Romans. (Light infantry versus heavy infantry being able to move easier in wet conditions.) The Romans also had difficulty with the shield covers getting sodden from several days and even had difficulty seeing the enemy from rain dripping onto their faces from areas of their helmets.
imagine being the guy who is tasked with capturing those exotic animals for the games lol better get paid well
I thought about that aswell. I reckon they used slaves for that or like "professionals" who were paid well?
The Giraffes you sold me wouldn't mate
Shouldn't be much different than how it would be done in modern times (in the absence of tranquilizers). You really only need sticks and nets, and isolate an animal to capture it. You're not doing it with your bare hands.
Got any lions? Nah fresh out but I got a pissed off boar and thirty lemurs.
Thank you for all these content Metatron. I discovered my fascination for history through this channel.
08:30 it's a insurance thing. They need to use them.
They could probably remove it with cgi, no?
@@andrewcheng2113 Would probably be really pricey to get it to look smooth. The other CGI in the show was pretty glaring (especially that spear throw), so I can understand why they wouldn't bother
they could hide it somehow. or even use the magical technique called "avoiding focus on stirrups".
Hey, Raph. Could you ever take a look at the Asterix and Obelix movie from 1999 and see how close they got with the Romans and perhaps the Gauls. Love your work, from a Viking up north ;-D
Awesome, thanks for the Video, Metatron. Looking forward to the next ones, and Barbaren S2
Me: * reading the comments, not paying attention to the video *
Metatron: *speaks italian*
Me: *MMH, ORA DI ISCRIVERSI AD EVROPA ANTIQVA!*
P. S. Complimenti davvero! Non sapevo che fossi italiano! Lodevole pronuncia inglese, un punto di riferimento per il mio studio! Continua così!
Surprising, at this point Nyet-flix is synonymous with revisionist history so to see a positive review based on historical accuracy is actually kind of exiting.
@MonsieurHiroshima they were cruel though Rome wasn’t known for civil rights
MonsieurHiroshima Except they had thousands of slaves, they didint care much for common people and they were ruthless during their military campaigns. Julius Caesar killed a million people and burned and looted thousands of villages in Gaul.
Mister Albanian that quote is from the end of the HRE. It was definitely holy, roman and an empire earlier on
@MonsieurHiroshima While I admire Roman achievements as much as anyone there can be no doubt that they would have been absolutely hated by many of the people they came into contact with. Roman brutality in dealing with tribes is well documented and was even by the norms of society back then sometimes considered to be excessive. Of course that is only part of the story and often relationships were more peaceful. It is recorded that some barbarians were actually very proud to become Roman citizens. Yet it is entirely believable that from the perspective of other tribesmen the Romans were indeed evil.
@MonsieurHiroshima Only educated and/or skilled slaves were treated with care because they were expensive (but they still had little to no rights and slaves of either sex could be raped). Uneducated & unskilled manual labor slaves were not treated with care and were disposable - that's why many were sent to work in mines which had a high injury and fatality rate.
For every minute in your Latin video I’ll send a dollar on Patreon. I know it’s nothing crazy but I love your content and I really enjoyed this show so I’m showing my support in the strange way that I do. Thank you for the awesome videos!
To the point that the romans are portrayed as evil. Yeah it is told from the germanic side and they really hated Varus for ignoring germanic laws and forcing them to pay high tributes.
i love romans. But boy did I loved the take on the romans of this show. Pretty true and evil.
Theres good and bad people on both sides, thats how it should be. Rome is anyways portrayed as the superb civilization most of the time, while slaves and tributes contribuition is often ignored.
I mean, every society at one point or another did slavery back in ancient times, and if it was a universal practice then you cannot really use it to make judgements between different societies.
The problem to me seems that the Romans had a army to maintain and the taxation of a subsistence farming society as the german tribes has nearly nothing to spend.
@@misterrex684 its hard to argue that Rome wasnt the superb civilization really
Please someone remind me, on who's side did Xena fight in this battle?
All I heard her say was: "AEI-AEI-AEI-AEI-LI-LI-LI!"
What an honor!
The series is originally in German. This time, English in the synchronised version. I can watch it in my mother tongue and it will feel authentic.
I was immeadiately surprised by the deep and realistic sound of the father’s voice at the beginning. His first two sentences were mumbled and I didn’t understand them the first time. The third sentence: “Mach die Haare auf!” (Open your hair!) had a different colour to it. It was warm, deep and touching.
I thought, it would be then a good idea to hear the original voices, as it already seems to be a well made series, as soundtrack and voices pierce straight through you and I would profit from it even more in English... And then I saw it: Deutsch [Original]. 😊
They knew that the stir ups was wrong. They had to do the stir ups out of legal and work safety reasons. Sounds stupid but it is true.
Love your videos. Just a nitpick: in ecclesiastical English, C-T-R-L is pronounced "control" as in control-C or control-V.
Just recently discovered your channel Metatron. Loving the content on historical accuracy in Barbarians and Greek history. ❤
I saw the trailer. Some of the Germans even had the "Suebian Knot" hair like the ones found in bog bodies.
But the suebians were still in the north
@@magnajota4341 didn't Julius Ceasar fought with them 50 years earlier?
@@sauromatae9728 I know that he knew about them. But I don't think he fought them. As there lived quite a bit afar from the Gaul region. They didn't settle in today's svabia until the 5th century
@@magnajota4341 what are you talking about? Ceasar surely fought Suebi led by Ariovistus. then he crossed Rhine to pursue them.
@@sauromatae9728 Yeah, you are right, it is quite a time ago that I read De Bello Gallico. However, it was only a expansion force. The bulk of Suebi still lived in todays Bohemia. They also didn't ally themselves to Arminius.
"How did USSR win on their side in WW 2?"
Me: "well, you take a soldier, Ctrl+C, then Ctrl+VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV...
It is a complicated issue. Military History Visualized have made several videos about this.
The Red Army became very competent, about one year into the war.
The Red Army had plenty of fuel, the Germans did not.
The Red Army was supported by the world markets and the resources of the global empire of USA and Britain.
Memes really fuck up the mainstream view of history, for sure.
"We have more men than they have bullets comrades" quote by the memes
@@martinan22 Notably, the german head of state was also an idiot. Oh yeah, why wouldn't you attack another super power you made a non-aggression treaty with when you are already at least evenly matched against your current opponents? What could possibly go wrong?
@@darthplagueis13 pretty much every german general were for the war. the plans they drew up was made by the okw. the generals wanted operation citadel while hitler did not.
this meme about hitler being the idiot and the generals being overruled is nonsense.
This is the first video of yours I watch, but I love your attitude! Informative, well researched and also supportive of other channels that have helped you learn, and positive in your tone, acknowledging the choices made for some fiction aspects and conceding points where historical accuracy wasn't perfect, and overall being fair in not being tremendously nitpicky.
Definitely subscribing! Beautiful video.
Hey Metatron, I’ve been a watcher for years, and I appreciate all that you do to inform people of the history that our culture has forgotten
"these helmets wouldn't be thrown away"
Kinda like how some modern soldiers seem to carry what look like Cold-war era rifles at a glance.
The same way how US Marine in early part of WW2 were still equiped with WW1 weapons like the 1903 springfield rifle and and water cooled Browning machine gun.
@@anggi8699 Not to mention the B-52
So happy I found your channel!!
The Roman fort looked like they just set up tents in a clearing and put down spikes and called it a day. To my knowledge Roman were very keen on making effective fortifications.
Otherwise good show and in particular the equipment and clothing was mostly spot on.
At last! I had to scroll down here to find your comment. I was worried nobody noticed it. Fort of two plus Legions? without serious engineering work? at the very extremity of the woods? absurd! CGI could fix it at no time (but hey, how could they steal the Eagle then?) -en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudis_(stake) is suitable for temporary castra gr.pinterest.com/pin/511862313873813898/visual-search/ for longer periods www.slideshare.net/GrahamAPhone/roman-camps
@@BasildeRayen Literally the first thing I thought when I saw the camp. "Why are there trees up to the walls?"!
To make it easy for the protagonist to penetrate a Roman fort,
I was just wondering your opinion on this series! Lo and behold! :)
Excellent information, I also loved the production, gratias tibi for the explanation. Cheers from Phoenix Arizona. All the best.
You lost me at “c t r l C and c t r l Vvvvvvvv” I’ve never heard it pronounced that way. Amazing
I really like what you said about Arminius looking more italian than barbarian. Like for real tho, he does! The actor could even play Julius Caesar in his prime. When I first saw the poster without knowing the history behind it, I legit thought that it's just another show about the glory of Rome and that the main guy is like one of their many emperors. Then I watched the series and he's supposed to be germanic? It felt kinda off for me specially when almost all of his fellow barbarians look like siblings with their typical north european features; he stood out more in his native tribe than within the roman infantry. Good thing the actor was really good and he pulled it off, the series is still 🔥
You sir are a wizard. Liked, subscribed and notifications. And it criminal that TH-cam gives the revenue to Netflix. So sorry
"Is Skyrim historically acurate?" next please
It isn't
"Is France historically accurate", Skyrim is a location. And yeah, Dragonbreak...
It's not, everything after Morrowind is actually fanfiction.
😂😂😂 o no...
Of course it is accurate....lots of arrows in knees back then. 😂
yeah bro, don't you remember the Dragon Wars?
For all of you, who can speak German: the historic advisors have a TH-cam Channel and made an q&a about the good and the Bad stuff in the series and the process. Their Channel is kaptorga.
Edit: they are a team of a historian and an archaeologist.
th-cam.com/users/KaptorgaVisualHistory
Great breakdown of the series, Angel Boy. Love your channel, keep up the good work
In relation to your video 2 years ago about "Black Washing History." I'm glad they didn't do it here. And for anyone who will call me a racist, I'm a Malayan race Filipino. I would be equally offended if there were Filipinos in Ancient Rome.
I know but what if German people get offended
Shut up you idiot
@@dilonruns4797 They wouldn’t. There weren’t black people in that part of Europe that long ago. Black people coming to Europe in large, noticeable numbers beyond the Mediterranean coastlines is a very recent thing.
The Roman Empire literally included North Africa and half the Middle East. It also traded with places as far away as China and. India. Of course there were people of colour living in the Roman Empire. Sub-Sahran Africans might have been uncommon but there were plenty of mixed race and brown skinned North Africans and Egyptians in the Roman Empire.
A burial site in Southwark, London had 22 people in it and four of them appear to be of African ancestry. 4 out of 22. That's a minority sure, and it was probably a much smaller minority outside of urban areas, but it's still a significant number.
You might also want to look up Romans like Lusius Quietus, a Roman general and governor of Judea who was originally a Berber prince from modern day Morocco.
Metatron: C-T-R-L.
me, a computer technician: _internal screaming_ "Did you just.....?"
_heavy flinching_
It’s probs how they say it in Italy. It’s how in Spain they say wifi weefee! 😂
Worse, he pronounced it vivivivivi instead of the correct Latin wiwiwiwiwi
@@JoseCastro-fn9xs qqq was
It threw me off a tad, not being a computer tech., but I often wonder what foreign keyboards look like.
I mean.. Control isn't Control in other languages, y'know?
Polished metal means reflections which you want to avoid in a large production, because removing them is a hassle same thing with the stirrups.
lol I lost right at the start: "I'm not going back to that forest..."
Aside from the stirrups ... the production quality is surprisingly well researched and accurate. The battle was silly and inaccurate.
Silly how?
@@nid.del.aguila2549 Weapons cutting through the Roman soldiers’ armors like butter. 😂
@@anja1627 nah man, like cheese, cheese is tougher😂
@@nid.del.aguila2549 Or more like cake. It was just so cringe.
Very interesting! Thanks!
Greetings from South Africa 🇿🇦
"Spoiler alert for those who didn't go to school!" ROFL
Loved it
LPT: c-t-r-l is pronounced "control"
Yes, but c-t-r-l is much funnier
Homer pronounces it “catarl.”
Homer is never wrong!