How do Tubes and Capacitors influence the sound of the MP-701 Mk2?
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 พ.ค. 2023
- I tried endless compinations of Tubes, Capacitors on different Speakers,
here is the results of my listening sessions!
Pre-Amplifier: Musical Paradise MP-701 mk2 www.musicalparadise.ca
End-Stage: FM-300A (Clone)
I am not sponsored by any company or whomever...
If You want to support the channel a little:
ko-fi.com/iam_mad
This Video is also in German on TH-cam!
Dieses Video auf Deutsch: • Der Klang von Röhren u...
Tubes and Capacitors for this Test came from BTB,
the most experiencend and friendly Tube expert from Germany
with some million tubes on stock!
btb-elektronik.de/en/start-en/
The Tubes I used:
E88CC-Performance-6922WA-S4A (hand selected)
btb-elektronik.de/en/product/...
6N6P-i Mil Grade Russia, Pair
btb-elektronik.de/en/product/...
6N23P/6H23n V1+low mic+lownoise Set (Pair)
btb-elektronik.de/en/product/...
Capacitors:
choose 1,5μF for less Bass,
choose 2,2μF for more Bass,
choose 3,3μF for neutral Bass (! the ø of Alu-Oil Sup. is 2mm too big !)
Filmcap 2,2uF/800V 36x34mm Mundorf Supreme EVO AL OIL
btb-elektronik.de/en/product/...
Filmcap 2,2uF/1000V 36x56mm Mundorf Supreme Silv.-GOLD-Oil
btb-elektronik.de/en/product/...
#musicalparadise #mp-701 #preamp #tube #audiophile
#FM300A #clone #mundorf #capacitor
Music from Apple 🍎
Clipart: domina von vectorpouch auf Freepik
Bubble Butt Ursula By Grimphantom - Rayman Legends Princesses N*de
found on clipartmax - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
You’ve spent a ton of time listening to each of these and keeping your focus and attention on each tube, very hard to do. And then analyzing rectifier tubes and finally caps, quite a through review. One of the best reviews on TH-cam
Thank You for the comment! Yes, it was quite a tough week of listening sessions.. 😉
Another great video. Much as you ARE mad, that's the way I like it!
Truly valuable
Simply amazing I was about buy a MP-701 MK2 and some other amps, I am some glad I found your channel. I am sold on thr FM300A after listening to your reviews and doing more research on the unit. Thank you dearly for your insight and knowledge. You spent a ton of time listening and experimenting. This is extremely valuable. Thank you.
Thank You for Your comment Mark 😊
Valuable? It is gold to me |!
I learned a lot. thank you :)
this is such a good, informative video i watch again
Excellent. Thank you.
Hi Jurgen, bought the MP 701 & the clone. I got the upgraded capacitor from MP. Ordered the tubes you recommended so far it sounds great, waiting for the new tubes from BTB Germany. Great detailed review. Keep up the good work
Thank You for Your comment Mark! 😊
Enjoy Your combo, I´m sure You will have fun! 😉
Hi Jurgen.
Watching your videos on the MP-701 convinced me to purchase the unit at the dismay of my wife. Just received the Mk3 and out of box sounded great connected to my Willsenton 300b amp. I switched out the tubes and in the process of purchasing the MCAP Alu/Oil. Thank you for sharing your knowledge and expertise.
Did u connect to the preamp connector for the r300?
I have Casta B horn speakers, marvellous
Cool!
i have just come across your videos, and i very much enjoy them. the thoughtful, thorough discussion covers a lot of ground and addresses interests and concerns i have regarding this preamp. at the same time you do not waste time or go one too long. excellent work.
Thank You very much for Your nice comment!
@@iam_mad youre most welcome, sir, glad to have your channel to watch/hear, and your english is fantastic. how many languages do you speak, my brother?
@@ceylonmooney 😂 not enough...
no, seriously only English and German.
But I can scowl my daughter in Chinese and order Pizza in Italian 😉
@@iam_mad HAHAHAHA!
i wrote the company to inquire about tubes and they responded but did not answer my question. i find it common with people and companies selling mystery tubes to refuse to disclose what tubes theyre selling you.
Thank you for this video, Jürgen! It is packed with so much information!! The only issue is that you made me curious about how it sounds and I want to buy it to do similar experimentation haha Lucky me I dont have anywhere to put it, I guess. This pre amp seems a great find, congrats! I bet your system with this pre amp, the FM clone and the le petit puts many 10k "hifi" systems to shame! PS: I can swear I hear mosquitos laughing every time after they bite me ^^
Thank You for Your comment Thiago! Yes, I think Garry has quite a unique Pre Amp here, and it makes me everytime happy, when I plug it between and DAC.
The most fascinating thing is how much the Caps differ in sound, its actually more severe than the tubes partially. The white Mundorfs shocked me how shrill, and the Gold Silver Oil Supreme is now out again, because the supreme Evo Alu Oil sounds soo good and is much cheaper...
When You hear for 2-3 weeks permanently A/B You get the sound in a few seconds, when I pause for a week or two, I need to get into the listening again, before I hear the mosquitos again... 😂
@@iam_mad very interesting! When I updated my speaker crossover Janos recommended me the mundorf evo oil as basically best cxb for the musical direction I was pursuing! I wonder if there would be such a thing as "burn in" of the caps on the pre amp, like it getting less shrill after many hours? Also looking forward your opinion on their DAC in case you ever get one. I have upgraded my speakers a while ago and put all other small planned changes on hold due to lack of time to listen and get used to the system. I am far from having special hearing and also do not have the best audio memory as it seems 😅
@@Thiago_S.. Caps have a burn in, it differs from type to type.
The basic Sup - Evo - Alu Oil is so good, I took out the classic sil/gold/oil because these smeared the higths a bit, the Sup - Evo - Alu Oil are much better to my ears.
But I don´t think the sound of a coupling cap is the same situation to how it works in a cross over.
I think there will be different behavious...
But the Sup - Evo - Alu Oil is right now the price/quality overkill, no doubt!
@@iam_mad Thank you for sharing these insights. My amp has now Elna Silmics as coupling caps, I bought auricaps xo to try but still have not installed, I will maybe put the supreme one day for comparison as well, if it fits. I have just sent a message to you via another "channel", hope it arrived.
well, the cathode follower sets the output impedance, so in matching equipment this is an important choice.
Do you recommend this preamp for the Martin Logan electrostats like yours? I see one in the background and I have a pair of ESL X.
I can recommend You for the Logans the Dartzheel clone, if the combination with the MP-701 works out I still have to try myself!
de.aliexpress.com/item/1005006920424717.html
Hello again !What would you think about adding a bypass cap [.1uf ] to the Bennic filtering cap [ 6.8uf] on MP-701?
I had no time to examine the influence on the bypass caps
Hi Jurgen just came a accross your channel excellent and have subscribed ,one question i biamp my quad s2 speakers does the mp701 have 2 preouts many thanks 😊
Thanks for a quality video! Also, the upgrade order is signal tubes & rectifier tubes --> Coupling Capacitors. Do I need to replace the Power Filtering Bypassing Capacitors? Because I saw in other forums that someone replaced him and got good results, which is quite crazy for tube newbies. (LoL)
Thank You for the comment! 😊
The most difference in sound You get with the signal tubes and the coupl-caps.
To hear diff in the Rect tube You need sensitive speakers.
With the baypass caps I had no time yet to play, sorry 😉
A lot of words yes but every word had useful information.
Have you made a video showcasing capacitor upgrades for the FM300A amp?
Thank You for Your comment!
There is a video about the FM300A in my videos list, but since it has original ELNA "For Hifi" Caps from Japan, I see no need to modify this device.
th-cam.com/video/KL346EfvKDw/w-d-xo.html
@@iam_mad Thank you. I saw that video when it came out. I guess I forgot you said in it no need to modify. LOL the urge to tinker or mod is strong in me. Enjoy your content and humor very much.
Hello! Great tips, just received my MKIII, 4.7uf VCAP to accommodate 75K solid state amp. 6H30p tubes and a 5t4 installed. Getting very sweet and brilliant. Would you still recommend LinLai rectifier or maybe a Sophia Electric? Thoughts?
I personally like the 5T4 the most, the Linlai sounds great, but can sometimes have issues, when the power stage creates too high currents.
@@iam_mad Just to confirm, I did hear that Musical Paradise does not recommend the 5T4 in your other video. If the LinLai has power stage issues and 5t4 not recommended, what is your safe bet? Thanks
I've been reading through some of the forums regarding this preamp and found that you can run 6SN7 and 12SN7 tubes on this with an adapter for the sockets. I'm curious to find out if you've tried either of these tubes? If so, what were your impressions?
Thank You for Your comment!😊
6SN7 is not suited as long as You don´t have this type of extreme boomy speakers, because the 6sn7 will sound very clear and thin.
But if You have equipment like for Dolby Sorround etc. You can use it, but then I would recommend other gear for You in general, like Your usual Yamahas, Accuphses etc.
Here on this channel I go for the audiophile sound, not for the commercial sound.
Great video Jürgen, thank you for your labor of love!
Just one clarification if I may, the stock tubes were 12AU7? And you were able to roll a 6922 equivalent the E88CC S4A?
Thank You for Your comment! 😊
the stock tubes are the russian 6N1P, but these do not go so well with the FM300A.
The 6922 run very nice a bit less crisp as the E88CC, with more body and good voice mids.
There's a 6/12v switch internally for different filament voltage signal tube types.
( 5/6v switching for rectifiers)
🎵🎶😉🎶🎵
Gutenmorgen Jurgen! I hope I can ask you where did you buy the 6N23P otk tubes, RCA 5T4 steel tube and the Mundorf Mcaps Supreme EVO Aluminium oil? Thanks again for the work you put down for the video.
Hello Mikael! Of course You can ask! 😉
The cap is in the Set1, You may call BTB for this, I cant find the 2,2 Link as an extra
btb-elektronik.de/produkt/5560/set1-musicalparadise-mp-701mk2-5u4-sed--6n6pi--supevooil-2-2u/
There is the 6N23P:
btb-elektronik.de/produkt/1201/6922sovtek-6n23p-reflector-6n11-6dj8-6h23ntube--nos/
and the 5T4:
btb-elektronik.de/produkt/1029/5t4-steel-2-way-rectifier-/
Many thanks 🙂 I´ll use this store!
Salve Jurgen! Thanks for this video. I am about to buy the MP-701 MK2, I have a Primare A35,2 class D poweramp.
My input impendance on the poweramp is 15 Kohms, is this recomendable? Kind regards Mikael
Thank You for Your comment! 😊
Please send the question to Garry, he will help (support on musicalparadise.ca)
I am sure You will like it, but I would strongly advise You to move away from Class D if You look for more natural sound.
Which speakers do You have?
Ok Jurgen! I´ll do that thanks for your answer and keep up your good videos =)
Hi
Thanks a lot for your informative review.
Have you also tried swapping the bypass capacitors?
If so, what was your findings?
Many thanks again ;)
Thank You for Your comment!
I had no time for the BP Caps, I am sure the Bennics make a good job.
If You want to try something, then it would be to change one to another type that can polarise even better, because both are in parallel...
Thanks
Think iWill try the mundorf supreme classic 4.7mf for around $35 per piece.
I already upgraded all the rest;)
@@ilanspiro1645
Dont go for classic! I didn´t like them.
Go for "Supreme EVO Alu Oil" without Go/Sil, no gold no silver.
These cost relatively little but perform extremely good!
Gutenmorgen Jurgen! I´m sorry about all questions but here comes moore. When you change tubes for example to the 6N23P otk or SA4 E-88-cc ptb
6N23P and E88CC need the setting on the tube section on "6V" if You would use 12BH7 it would be "12" Volt.
5T4 and 274b need the rect tube switch on "5AR4"
You should check out the manual:
musicalparadise.ca/files/MP-701-MK2-Manual.pdf
Thanks again! I got my preamp yesterday and when connected to the poweramp the poweramp sends out a big humming to my speakers. I´ve mailed Garry about this but he have not answered yet. Thanks for response as usual ;o)
@@mikaelsjogren6315
This is a problem with the ground shield of Your home. In this case You need to remove the ground shield from the 701 power cord, I know this issue is quite often.
To find the origin of the humm You can unplug other devices like A/C or TV-Sat or LAN via powerline.
Ok Jurgen! I will try that, thanks a lot 🖖
Do you think the tube set up would sound good on a pair of rodgers 5/9s
It is difficult for me to know every speakers characteristics, even if its such a famous one.
The driver tubes characteristics from rich mid-tone to more emphasis on trebble goes like:
(Max Mids) 12BH7 - 6N6Pi - 6N23P - E88CC (Max bright)
The CCaps also make a big inpact on sound!
Can the 12a?7 series tube be used or only 12au7? Your thoughts maybe?
Alain, You can use 12AU7 and 12BH7, the latter I love a lot for the full ranges, a tick better then the 6N6Pi..
12SN7 I don´t know, and 6SN7 will be less dynamic.
What's the best tube for female vocals
The choice of tubes is everything about harmony with the endstage and the combined speakers.
The topic of aiming for certain genres like vocals or instrumental is much more defined through the speakers. Best speakers for voice are speakers with fullrange drivers.
When You have the speaker, then You look for the amp that haemonizes with the speaker.
In accordance to the MP-701 the best combination to fullrange speakers is the 6N6Pi or the 12BH7, if its the FM300A You have inbetween.
Hi again Jurgen! Here comes the question guy again =) You never mention the filter capacitors. Are they not so relevant for the output signal? Greetings from a wintery Sweden
Do You mean the Coupling Caps or the Bypass Caps? I described the CCs but I did not talk about the BPCs.
The BPCs make the Power support more flexible or dynamic as You like to name it. I had no time to play with these...
Follow up question ...The input voltage specs says 110-120 volts 220-240 volts AC .So if you have 240 instead of 220 OR 120 volts Instead of 110 volts AC , is there a regulator because the heater voltages would go up 9% ,so you get 7 volts DC instead of 6.3... On the filaments. I have 121.4 volts AC so this is the only hurdle that prevents me from buying one ...Before the Holydays...
On the back of mine is written 230V, so I guess it is fine. The tubes run very solid and I have had feedback of 2 Experts in Germany, both praised it 😉
This is good news ! Thank You !
Just purchased a 115 volts model just under 1000 CDN$ shp inc. Thank You for your support into me getting what I am looking for .You are a very good Mentor !@@iam_mad
I tried 5931 [5u4] and the 3 Amperes current draw is too much ! The heat goes up to 65-70 C ! The red base TAD 5ar4 sounds fast, punchy it floats ...
who manufactures the S4A? there are no tubes made in germany today.
I will see Michael in some time, then I can ask him, which fab is producing them! 😉
so, @@iam_mad, who makes the SA4?
@@ceylonmooney
well, I guess its the country, that does make all things, do they? 😉
I see some German handmade tubes here cost more than my Mercedes Benz, ouch 🙃 best regards and bye 😊
it must be so, @@iam_mad. i believe i saw those german tubes on thomas mayer's vinyl savior blog site. it is very interesting.
i look forward to the MP-DX review.
don't you need to burn in those tubes/capacitors?
certainly they have to be burned in!
Bought this one and got it today. Have a three way speaker and the 6N6P did performed really bad as you said. I preferred the 6N1P-ev by far. However, waiting for some 6NS7 tubes, according to several people and the manufacture that is the best tube. Will be interesting to see, right now I have a little thin sound with to little bass..... :( Need to experiment more when more different tubes arrive.
Thanks for Your feedback!
But which endstage/poweramp do You use?
(Sorry if I don´t remember all comments right now😉)
@@iam_mad I am using a Nord Purify(class d) power amp. :)
@@fearwolfbrewery5014 I would kindly advice You first to consider investing in the powerstage before You buy tubes.
I will soon make a review for a class A amp thats extremely cheap, but sounds fantastic. (JLH 1969)
For Your 3-way speakers the FM300A would be the ideal partner to the MP701.
My video is fully meant to this combo, Class D will change the story a lot 😉
@@iam_mad have you listen to a Purifi eval1? It is not harsch or bright at all!
@@fearwolfbrewery5014
I heard Yamaha with ICE Power. 😊
To understand the sound of amplification You need to hear the amp with a fullrange speaker, at best 4", then You hear the signal "as-it-is".
The speaker with network crossover will add information and remove details to the music signal.
I had a nice time bringing the "LePetit" to another YT Channel (biggest speaker tech channel in Germany) and we listened to many amps on my "LePetit", and he later said, how fascinating it is, how much difference between amps one can hear with this speaker. (LePetit)
The best sound came from an old British Lecson Amp, the worst was the ICE Power.
The reason why You can hear the details so clear is the membrane of this Fostex 4" driver has only 2,5 gramms (=0,088 OZ), so it renders the electric signal wave acustically perfectly without losses.
The frequ. crossover of an 2/3 way speaker will always change the signal, as heavier membranes will do too. 😉
Please tell me, I want to buy but is the board strong enough to sustain the pushing and pulling that comes with tube rolling? You are not mad ,you are crazy ,mad !!! Live on !
😂 Thanks for the comment!
There is some flex at the board, but it had no issues with all my many times plugging in and out, I don´t feel there is a problem, since I testet it thoroughly 😉
You did not tested the Miflex capacitor. ;)
Miflex is good, but 7cm diameter is way too big, and unfortunately they got now also very pricy 😢
@@iam_mad a 1,5 uF is 5 cm in diamater and 7 cms long. But yes a little pricy....
I have tube rolled in my mp 301..i was shocked. Vintage nos sound far superior to modern valves(UK name for tubes) RFT EL34 sound much better than Svetlanas...
It is a pity that some of the good NOS tubes turned insanely expensive, like a NOS carbon 6SN7 already costs like 500 and more, its unreal...
I personally like the NOS SQ Philips tubes (ECC) and some russian tubes like the 6N6Pi
@@iam_mad Luckily I purchased mullards 10 yrs ago... I paid 110 gbp for a pair of ecc83. Now the same 380 gbp.. I also paid 54 gbp for 6 mullard ecc83s.. U R right they have gone crazy.. But rfts el34 were 86 gbb... It is obvious they r broadcast vintage sound quality.. This Svetlanas r too warm flat n forward sounding