Musical Paradise MP301 MKIII: Subjective Listening Review
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 ส.ค. 2024
- In this segment I give my subjective evaluation, spoiler alert: this amp simply doesn't sound good. On top of baseline hum, even with the volume all the way off, it has no bass and just sound bad IMHO. Lots of design issues, along with recommended tubes that should never be used for audio etc. How this amp got the good reputation it has, I have no clue.
I was sent this amp to test and review from @intoitreviews
He included a bunch of driver tubes to roll into it and did his own review linked below. I haven't watched it as I didn't want it to influence my evaluation.
• Musical Paradise MP-30...
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Also I think I can softly say most of the people that watch you is because you call a spade a spade …...
That's one of the reasons I watch your channel is for the honest opinion. Too many reviewers are worried about not getting products to review if they tell the TRUTH.
Thank you for taking this on Stephe. I bought a pair of these amps to drive mid and tweeter horns in my tri-amped JBL speakers that utilize a DBX Driverack PA+ as a crossover. I went the tube rolling route immediately looking for acceptable sound but never achieved my wish. I then read all of the online "mods" and determined that there must be something intrinsically wrong with the basic design and layout of these devices.
In my application I don't miss the bottom end output but I do wish for clear and accurate mids and highs, which is another part of the spectrum that is really screwed up.
Hopefully, with your guidance, I can bring these amps to life and actually enjoy my speakers again.
Thanks again Stephe, you do things the way they should be done. Analytics then solutions.
Lol at John Coltrane sax sounds like a kazoo. 😂
I have the mrk3 2018 deluxe version of this amp, I've owned it for around 5 years now, (problem free).
Out of the box it sounded just as you described stephe, but as I was burning in a pair of GL KT66's, at around 140 hour's or so the sound started changing, the harshness was going away, and the whole sound stage was filling out and getting fuller and warmer.
I thought it might be the GL KT66's, so I replaced GL KT66's I was burning in with a brand new pair of GL KT66's, and nope it wasn't the tube changing the sound it was the amp's sound that was changing. I have it paired with some Klipsch RP4000F tower's 2x 4" inch woofer's and a 1" inch dome tweeter. My fav. tube's right now with it are GL KT77's and Sylvania Jan 6sj7WGT pre-amp tube's.
I have no issuses with hum or noise of any kind, the amp is quiet as a church mouse.
This tube compliment,,at least for me and my room, works well with all genres of music.
This amp is well burned in by the previous owner, it's not a new amp. and no amount of "burning in" is gonna revive 8db of bass response.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics I agree, the bass could be improved to extend lower but the rest of the sound stage seems fine, it images very well, the treble and mid-range are smooth.
I've compared it with 2 other amp setups;, 2 marantz ma500 monoblocks, and 2 aiyima a07"s in bi-amp mode and the MP bested them both in everything but the bass.
We will just have to agree to disagree. This morning I've received several emails from folks saying they hear this same lispy sibilance I was hearing. And you are using an Aiyima class D chip amp as your "reference" amp? I was sent one of these to review and, well, it's pretty cringy as well. Maybe super budget audio gear all sounds like that?
Are we looking at the same frequency curve? Or the THD vs frequency curve that looks like a smile? That's the amp laughing at us.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics Can we see the "cringy" and "lispy sibilance" of any amp under objective survey of the AD (2 or 3) kit? Which of the graphs should be analyzed? Will you kindly share some of your experience on this matter in some of your future videos, if possible.
Or maybe the subjective listening test only and solely can reveal the amp's music true "features"? As was the case with this MP-301 MKIII. Initial technically objective view of the gear seemed to be somewhat encouraging.
Probably it's inevitably/objectively true that "measurements and hearing don't match up", as you've pointed out already today in one of the comments. Hence we better stop using and get rid of the AD gismo, as generating misleading data, unmatchable with our ears?
Thank you very much Shunkie for showing through your tests the truth about this type of product.
This is very appreciable for us amateurs.
My pleasure!
I keep meaning to send this advice to you.
I have noticed the trepidation you have when drilling holes in sheet metal.
Your normal drill is sharpened to a118 degree angle for general purpose use, on sheet metal the point breaks through before the full diameter is cutting, leaving you with a triangular hole & heavy burring on the other side or it tries to rip your arm off
If you get the drills resharpened to a 140 degree angle the full diameter of the drill is cutting before the tip of the drill breaks through.
Hole saws I have tried many from many countries & the best I have found is Starret from the UK they produce a brilliant kit for the electrical trade & yes you have to pay the $$$ but for something this good what do you expect.
Kiwi Rod
So, the emperor wears no clothes - again. This is why I consider your channel worth watching.
Now, there are many great Chinese amps that are actually very good but many that are just not.
Having someone of your expertise who is willing to properly analyze these units with both technical
analysis and a listening test is well, gold.
I am sure there are good sounding Chinese amps out there, but maybe they don't export them? There is absolutely no reason, that I can see, as to why they seem to go out of their way to export garbage.
As a speaker amp..it’s ok. As a headphone AMP, it punches above its class. I primarily use it as a Headphone amp. Try headphones.
I wish they would just sell it as a headphone amp and remove the speaker jacks.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics I agree
Everyone can say the joy in how it sounds is subjective , But you use technical mesument of how the sound is output to judge an amp. So i would say if you say it sounds like crap it sounds like crap. please keep up the Good work keep teaching people . Don’t get frustrated trying to understand that some people are tone deff . Just keep being honest & teaching the People who art tone deff.
Interesting stuff! This amplifier definitely needs to right system and tube combination to thrive. I have been perplexed as well with it in terms of the tube combinations and what some people rave about and recommend. This is why I sent a variety of tubes to showcase the differences in hopes that at least one might match up well for you. Sorry none of them did! With that said, it also doesn't surprise me that this might be the outcome with the RP600M and the other DIY speakers. I can get this amp to sound surprisingly good in the right situation, and I just figured this is why so many people rave about it... meaning maybe they can get it to sound right in their situations too. But this is why we have you take a look at the internals to tell us the cold/hard engineering facts that relate to the sound outcomes. I will support you and this project in whatever way I can. Hopefully it ends up making financial sense to do so. I would like to see what this thing can do if spec'd out well! Would be a nice comparison with your amplifier to test afterwards. We'll have fun with it! Maybe some supporters out on the interwebs can help help out with the costs if they want to see what the outcomes could be too.
There are DOZENS of posts of people using this amp with the exact speakers I tried, gushing over how fantastic it is. Don't try to blame this on the speakers... I tried 4 different pairs of speakers that sound fine with other amps, so all of them are the problem and not this amp? There is no way for an amp that has a measured frequency response this bad to sound good.
How many hours do you figure the amp has on it? as far as burn-in?
Not enough for fan boys lol. I know I've got at least 10 hours on it (it hasn't changed at all) and my production amps are fully "burned in" in around an hour, after that there is no change. Burning in an amp isn't gonna pull out 5db+ of missing bass response.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronicsYeah, it is astounding how many people report good outcomes, and then one listens to the same thing, and wonders how? I had the same experience with the 5693 tube with this very amp. I really didn't like it at all, and there was nothing I could do to change that observation. Still, many say its the best tube out there for this amp. It baffles me. I only really sent that tube to you so you could compare it to be thorough, and maybe find some situation it could work in. I guess it just won't work in general. Thank you for your directness about the measured frequency response. I understand your stance there, and no blame was intended. I was only trying to be thoughtful in my understanding the circumstances. Thanks again for all your hard work! I really do appreciate your insights, opinion, and your channel! I'm sorry it isn't sounding great for you. Hopefully the mods can change that!
@@1dirtydog620 The amp I sent them was purchased used, and then I put a substantial amount of hours on it as well. The set of Sylvania tubes I sent in is a second new set of Sylvania Tubes that are NOS, and likely have no time on them, at least none from me. I might should have sent my used set of Sylvania tubes with it, but they are used in my other amp. I also did not use the stock tubes that much, as I found other tubes sounded better. So the amp itself should have plenty of hours on it, and I'm sure the tubes Skunkie is using as power tubes that are burned in fine. Perhaps the other tubes I sent in could benefit from some break-in, but who knows? I'm sure that was considered. The 5693 tubes are burned in for sure.
for $300 it sounded very decent. I had the mk2 deluxe. i used amperex 807 (w/ adapter) and 6sj7. i got this many years ago. lots more competition at this price range now.
I have the Mk3 and after tube rolling my favorite power tube was also the 807 (using the adapter). I also liked the el34 and 6l6. I suppose the 807 offsets some of the amps limitations somehow. But I’m grateful for using this amp to swap different tubes if only to discover the lovely 807.
Hi! What would you recommend in this price range please ? (music and streaming movies here)
What's your favourite amp you have built or modded?
Hmm that's tough. I would have to say I enjoyed building that 47 globe tube amp. Mainly because it uses 100 year old tubes in a modern circuit and sounds amazing!
I am not surprised, would love to get you a Cayin MT45 to try. They use tordial which I know you aren’t a fan of but it has caught my eye. Your genuine and honest reviews are always great. And appreciated.
Very eagear to see how to fix "this thing" because I already own it for more than a year (only difference are KT88 tubes with my amp) and totally confirm your both objective and subjective view of the device regarding its bass performance. Automatic biasing (among other features) attracted my attention when purchasing this amp. It was promoted as a totally Canadian (not Chinese) design, including its schematic (was it a lie or a fake information, I don't know, though).
I also ordered the AD 3 kit (have not received it yet) to test the device but you appeared to be ahead of me in this matter....
Please find your way, Stephe, to help us, the owners of the gear, to improve it affordibly in any (let it be any) possible way .
Wish health to your pretty beloved Dolly-dog.
The "automatic biasing" is just normal cathode bias, i.e. a resistor and a bypass cap...
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics If you don't feel like wasting time to advise on modifying the crap-like Canadian gear - pls do not. It's understandable: you are busy enough.
Ah OK :)
I absolutely love your channel, Skunkie.. Not that you’re a reviewer, but some are either objective and measure everything. Some are subjective and tell you how it sounded. You do both, but without a label as a reviewer. It’s nice to know the absolute truth. I consider your channel Skunkie, to be so much more than that. You go pretty deep, which I know is appreciated.
I was banned from a channel now called Michael Andrew. I explained to him how he gave either incorrect or dangerous information in a non argumentative manner. I’m sure some other people saw it, and also said something,, then BAM! Banned! He’s on other audio channels and websites reading from a script, so he’s just a shill.
Lots of people consider your channel to be so much more than any of that, Stephe. A really big thank you for that. 👍🎶😊
A reference for knowing what frequencies matter on the low end: lowest note on a standard tuned guitar is 82hz. Lowest note on a standard tuned bass is 41hz.
Yeah, I honestly don't care about stuff below 40hz, there isn't any real music down there.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics agreed most things 40hz is the bottom of most music, unless you get into organs. I’ve been building tube guitar amps for over 10 years now. I am about to try my hand at hifi, two different worlds. Guitar amp design, I pick the colors for the artist to paint with. Hifi I have to be able to reproduce all possible colors.
I've had similar experiences building Nelson Pass clones and his own low watt design he gave away for kit builder's. Plus a famous chip amp. All were cold and brittle transistor sounding amps. I also have no idea why so mamy people praise them.
Yup, it turns into hype mob mentality.
To me it makes no sense to mess any further with that thing. If there are people who love it as is, and the owner even bought a second one, then so be it. As long as it's safe to use and won't damage other equipment or burn down the house then let it slide. You have too much on your plate as is and there is no reason to give yourself ulcers over it.
I know you don't care for the Willsenton R8, but after watching all of your videos and work you did on it I still went ahead and bought the revised version, and so far I'm loving it. If it doesn't hold up into the future then that's my problem. Thanks for all the effort you put into this crazy way of life.
Yeah both the R8 in the new revised form and that Muzishare X7 sound nice, especially with some new tubes. I actually have an R8 (with some further mods) I listen to from time to time, and it's a nice amp.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics
Being new to tubes, I'm wondering if you suggest swapping the KT88 for the EL34. What are the benefits of the EL34 over the KT88?
EL34 is more "mellow" sounding. I would ask do you like "triode" or "Ultralinear" better? If you want something in between them, then you would probably like the EL34 sound as the EL34 in UL mode is kinda like halfway between UL and triode mode on the KT88 if that makes sense.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics
I've been using it in triode since I seem to prefer it. I'm happy with the KT88 but I'm wanting to get a quad for backups and I was thinking of the EL34. Maybe I will give them a try. Thank you so much.
I bet there's a lot of these "budget overseas" amps that could be made a lot better with nice output transformers. Also, I sympathize with the "no schematics" problem, I've got a pair of VTL MB-300 monoblocks (12au7wa -> 6350 ->8x 6550) and I can't find a schematic for it anywhere. I've heard a few people mention a Manley / VTL book that has some schematics in it, but I can't find anything meaningful online. It's just irritating because they are circuit board amps, and the way they're assembled, it's a pain in the ass to do any kind of troubleshooting.
Another review I can trust , thank you . 👍
Yeah, looks like another piece of both bad design and execution. Basically not worth spending time on fixing. I for one does not need to see you fix that one. Much more fun with those you design and build yourself. Great with some honesty in the world. Keep up the great work you do!
Coltrane playing the kazoo was great 😂
Isn‘t the MP301 a headphone amp, expecting higher resistance at the output? Frequency response looks very similar to measurement of 8 ohms output with 2 ohms resistor. MP301 seems not to be made for low efficiency / low resistance speakers … but connesting with high efficiency / high resistance speakers might change the assessment completely
Per the manufacturer specs: "4Ω- 8Ω(Speaker)" and 91db/M speakers are no low efficiency. The measured tests were done into an 8ohm non-inductive load so speaker type/efficiency has zero impact as per the listed specs. And no where is this claiming to be a headphone amp.
I am curious where all these folks challenging my assessment came from today. These videos have been out for a while and the comment section exploded with fan boys defending this amp and accusing me of all kinds of nefarious stuff lol...
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics die kommen von dem voodoo meister "iam mad" der diesen Verstärker puscht.
Hast du dir den letzten Beitrag angesehen?
I have no idea who that is, go look at the manufacturers website, these are the advertised specs.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics ich gebe dir absolut recht mit deiner Einschätzung 👍🏻
An amplifier is and should be only optimized for one tube type family ........;sometines even for one specific brand of the type ......you are correct instating that fact !
Even the choice of switching between UL and Triode mode is never to be the ultimate way to go ............marketing makes a sales attractive argument by doing so and audiophiles who do not have the knowledge of tube technology fall for it.
Pentode entry tube /driver followed by another pentode/beam power will ( in almost all cases but the exception ) not have a musical harmonic structure.
Experience of the past tube era ...........Pentode driver/Triode power tube .........the RIGHT combination and choice of the synergy between tube types will sound great ..
Classic WE combo ...310A /348 WE......300B...............NF2/AD1.........etc
The other way arround..........Triode input/driver to a Pentode/beampower tube...
This is with only two stages......mutiple stages are more complicated but rarely get to the same harmonic harmony ( mostly PP ) than a good two stage SET amplifier...
Triode input /triode outputtube often sound to smooth and overloaden withn to much second harmonics.........some may like,that , trying to compensate the lack of tone from sources and or speakers..
The lesser components and ampligfier stages ....it tells the story itself......
Simple circuit but as Albert said it ................make it as simple as possible but not to simple....
Cutting of below 500 Hz is a serious flaw. What I don't like in an amp with power tubes is using boards instead of free wiring. Thanks for the review series on the MP301, enjoyed it.
Very interesting. Thank You! I would like to have your opinion about their 701 pre amp. I really have an eye on this. Have a nice day too.
Someone would need to send me one :)
I want to hear John Coltrane play the kazoo.
No you don't lol :P
HI, another Chinese device that need reengineering and redesigning, really need to rethink the way they do electronic or if they still go on like this, they will be the master of lowfi and nothing more. That's why I'm very carful before buying device from China. Anyway good luck with that one. Thank for the honest review.
total agree yours, seller made fake review on online shop also on youtube many youtuber tell the new item at same time/day
Glad to see you being very honest and calling it for what it is.
Never heard a chinese tube amp that sounds at least ha1fway decent.
they give tube amps a bad rep and many people turn away from the hobby due to that.
After watching Intoitreviews’ YT review of this amp and seeing now his comments here, makes me wonder if they are the same person?
For more bass, check out the circuit on page 706 of the RCA book that you have. It uses a 6EU7 tube for tone control and boosts 30Hz by 10db.
Or redesign the circuit correctly. Wait till you see the measured voltages on the driver tube :P
@@danbuffington75 If the lack of bass response in this amp is due to output transformer shortcomings, no amount of mods will fix it until they are replaced with units with better L.F. response. You're only going to saturate them & probly have yourself a kazoo effect or something! 22:28
I loved your directness. I was thinking about buying a DAC tube from this brand, but I'll think better. Maybe it would be more worthwhile to buy a DAC board and do the tube stage myself.
You should write a book on this stuff. I’d love to learn where should I even start with this stuff.
I'm not a writer, thousands of books have been written on this subject.
th-cam.com/video/Ou33pF9aYbk/w-d-xo.html
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics thank you
I bought the MP-301 MK3 this year Jan 1, from their site. Got here by Feb 5. So far it’s been amazing, but my set up is a bit weird when you think about the price of the components around it. I don’t have any power conditioner either.
The MP-301 MK3 has eBay bought red RCA 5693s and Tung-Sol 7581As from the tubestore. I leave the volume around 60% and use it to power my Heresy 4s. The preamp is a Yamaha RN-2000A, Phono preamp in the iFi Zen Phono and a Technics 1200 mk7 is going into that. On the CD side I now use a Rotel CD 11 tribute but before that most of my experience with CDs was the digital coaxial out from a Onkyo c-7030 to the Yamaha’s DAC. Oh I connected a REL Classic 98 via the speak on connecting directly to the back on the amp for sub duties. Been in sonic bliss, feels pretty detailed and plenty of bass in my set up. I play all day every day.
I’m still curious about checking out more tube amps around the 300-500 price range, for fun to swap out with. I suspect I’ll keep looking for different tube amps but I’ll most likely keep this amp in the mix. Sucks that people aren’t getting the same experience with the amp as others, thought this thing was universally loved. Kind of shocked to hear. Hope the tweaks you add to this amp can help others enjoy it.
I'm curious why you would want to buy multiple cheap made in China tube amps rather than just invest in a good one? I think the main reason this thing is "loved" is most of these people are comparing it to other $50-300 made in China amplifiers.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics Hey, just curious about other amps; manufactured and hand made as well as some vintage used ones. I already have a spot in line for Decware’s SE84UFO2.1, I hope to make this my main power amp if I dig it, but I’ll most likely switch around different amps for fun a different flavor. There isn’t a main amp that I want to invest in and stay with, I like trying different equipment.
See comment below. I do look forward to your analysis of the the so called R300 (Plus?).
I came close to purchasing that amp but did not once I saw your take on it.
Hi Stephe.. Mod time: besides the 6ej7 triode strapping.. Try to convert the output to Parafeed (largish parafeed film cap + stock OPT) to get some good bass response.. A couple of good film caps (like entry level Jantzens) would be less of an expense than a couple of new OPT’s, IMHO..
Still feels like a band aid, if the OT are junk, there just isn't a lot to redeem it. And without a schematic or fixing these other issues, I'm not sure they are junk but it's my guess they are.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics
The main compromise is on the LF response based on your Analog Discovery sweep.. At least the Midband to HF is relatively linear with this OPT.. But yeah, you make a valid point..
There is also this lispy sibilance to vocals it has. Stuff like that is hard to measure.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics Yes, that’s the hard part to narrow down.. In well designed amps with good quality transformers, sharp or harsh sibilants are usually caused by cheapo caps..
@Skunkie I could tell already from the photo to click on the post on you holding your head that this amp is another Chinese nightmare, and I guessed right! As far as my guess in lieu of what is wrong with the amp, I am definitely going with the output transformers. I can see they are way too small for the job at hand. They are probably the main reason why the low end is rolled off. Put a pair of Edcors on it as an experiment and I bet that low end will come right up. I am sure the other issues have to be addressed as well.
I too don't get how people hype these cheap amps up when it is clear (from your testing) that they have major problems. I recall back when you tested the Nobsound 6P1 and mentioned the voltage issues with the transformers and even correcting that the power transformer still felt too hot.
Naw, this is NOT a path I would go down. You end up sticking more money into these amps and in the end, someone is better off buying one of your amps. Yeah, they are more expensive, but they are FAR better and you KNOW it is good. There are expensive amps out there they you THINK they might be good, but it could be the same as the Chinese amps. There is so much trolling going on in the hi-end audio world that is hard to figure out who is legit and who is taking the buyer for a ride. At least with your amps, people know how they are built, where they are built, and what components go into them.
For the DIYer, you have done a great service by creating your amps and step by step going through how they are built. You are definitely a great asset to the tube audio community and this has to be one of my favorite You Tube sites, bar none. Keep up the great work in determining what is good and what is crap!
Thanks!
Is there another tube amp for ~$360 USD that sounds better than this?
Yeah, a class D chip amp. I was just sent one of these, and while still not "HiFi", it doesn't distort the source material where it's hard to listen to.
😂😂sorry, kazoo comment just got me, are there any Chinese built tube amps that are even worth purchasing as a base for mod/rebuild project? Your final opinions on all of them seem to say NO!
The R8 second version is pretty decent once you replace all the tubes.
Hello Skunkie thanks for a great review. Just wish it had come a week sooner. Since I ordered one about a week ago based on all the reviews, Not sure what I will end up doing now since I do not have a lot of money to spend. So I figured it was a good amp at a good price. My mistake. If I saved up is there a good amp for about 800 dollars or so? Thanks for any info on that. I will be subscribbing to your channel and hopefully I will be able to find a decant amp in my price range. Sorry for my writing I have dyslexia.
No worries my friend, you ordered a very good sounding amplifier. I have 301 mk3 version for last 3 years paired with Monitor Audio RX6 small floor stander speakers and very satisfied with the sound. Trust your ears first. Enjoy!!!
LOL
@@A34163 Thanks
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics Not sure what you are laughing at that I fell for the hype of this amp or my disability. Either way not exactly a nice response.
I was laughing at A34163 saying this is a very good sounding amp, continuing the hype. Not laughing at you at all.
Well said Stephe. People tend to like what they parted with cash to buy. (So deep psychological component). I appreciate you frank review and I hope others do too
Maybe needs some burn-in time? You take the price into account? MP is quite a trusted brand. On the other hand so is b&w and I was always shocked how crappy and lifeless it sounds...
The amp I believe has MANY hours on it, this was not a new amp. And "burning in" might shift some frequencies around here and there .5db , it's not gonna pull 5db of bass out of an amp. I'd rather listen to a decent chip amp for $100.
Hmm. I find it always interesting how differently people who obviously have heared a lot of gear, judge gear differently and how convinced they are. Thomas & Stereo for example gave it a good review. I personally cant say anything about it. Its bigger brother the mp 501 is currently out of stock, probably because of the TH-cam Channel "I am mad" and a very good Reputation on the web in general. Never heared anything bad about a musical paradise product. Maybe it is voiced in a dedicated way to satisfy a certain type of costumer that has the same taste as the owner? I mean who would design an amp if he thinks it sounds worse than the most basic amp imaginable? MP is not a rip off!
I posted a video with objective measurements. They advertise a 15hz to 30khz frequency response. Try to spin from looking at my measurements and also my hearing this same curve, that something isn't matching up. Go rewatch that T&S video and actually listen between the lines. I'm just saying the quiet part out loud.
You ask "who would design and amp that sounds bad?" Go look at my videos on the nobsound 6P1, the Reisong A12 and the A50 etc. It appears a lot of folks do.
What would you recommend I can listen to and buy here in Europe as a serious tube amp? Audio Note? Fezz?
I bought the MKII version of this amp over a decade ago. The rave reviews I saw was it being used as a headphone amp, which is all I ever used it as. It has speaker outputs, but that was kind of just an add-on was my perception back in the day. Haven't listened to it in many years, so can't comment on the fidelity at this point in time.
But how do people get past the hum it has?
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics300-600 ohm headphones. Just plugged my MKII in and put on Donald Fagen - Morph the Cat listening via Sennheiser HD600s. Bass sounds too me.
Glad you like the way it sounds.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics I did try it with speakers at least once and don't remember being impressed with the fidelity.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics i use a powercord with the ground prong removed. that's what the manf recommended.
John Coltrane - the kazoo sessions 😂
I appreciate your review because you’re also a designer and you measure as well.
As you said before about how people get funky with circuits: "Simple Sounds Better"
Durrr
Starrett is actually a USA company
Kiwi Rod
hi stephe i think you have a good ear and you know what a good amp look like,You can not have a good amp with cheap electronic and good amp need minimum quality stuff to sound good,
Looks like what you have there is a case with a power supply and some tube sockets. Probably not worth reverse engineering. Better to start with a clean sheet. If you still want to use a circuit board that's fine, just make a new one with a better circuit.
I think there are some DIYers who can "build stuff" but aren't good fabricators. If they already own one of these, it could be a starting point for a project within their skill set? Casually looking at the board from one side, changing it to a triode strap driver might be fairly easy.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics if I had the dimensions and critical positions of the board, a schematic, I could redesign the board for people to download and have printed. Approximately $10 per board.
Not to easy to modify the circuit board It is why point to point shine 😊
Please send the Musical Paradise MP301 to my to Switzerland!!! I bay the shipment o.k. ?... Please, please.
This is a viewers amp and I don't ship anything electrical outside the US for a variety of reasons.
Music paradise или reisong a12 по звучанию лучше? Кто из них лучше звучит?
The modified A12 is MUCH better! Out of the box they both suck.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics спасибо за помощь! Я заказал А10 . Жду его. Я с нетерпением хочу его изменить. Я купил все детали ,резисторы и конденсаторы nichicon fg,и другую выпрямительную лампу , а также лампу советскую 6n2p.Я буду делать изменения по вашим рекомендациям и деталям. Я надеюсь у меня все получится. И я буду доволен звучанием этого усилителя!Спасибо!!!
I'm not surprised, when I seen the huge drop at 200hz and below , it's going be very disappointing. There not only bass but vocal range and more that is going to be lacking
you will never run out of content with so many overhyped tube amps around.
Thanks for sharing your insights! On first glance your impression sounds like mine of the Reissong A10 amplifier😅
I'd be grateful to get more examples of the product's sound in future reviews (instead of "sounds great / bad"). For instance,
- On "Your Power" by Billie Eilish, are the low bass notes (ca. 40Hz) at 1:19 audible?
- When you play string quartets, do the instruments sound like they would in real life? (or are there any Kazoo sounds, lol)
- When you play Beastie Boys, is there lots of bass and drums and pain in the ears or do they sound smooth and inoffensive
- On Eric Clapton's unplugged album from '92, can you hear/feel the foot tapping (almost infrasonic sound)
- Is London Grammar's "Non Believer" full of low frequency synth bass (almost too much) or is that bass almost inaudible
- On smaller choir pieces lik "Miserere Mei Deus", are the diferent singer clearly distinguishable or is it all one big mush of singing
- Does heavy Metal music sound dynamic and aggressive or smooth and inoffensive
- How do male or femal voices (in isolation, i.e. without too much instruments around) sound
Not everybody loves the same sound after all and the above examples illuminate a product from more angles.
So, Kazoo lovers 😁 or people with boomy speakers or an adversion to bass or dynamic sound (they exist) might be tempted to buy this MP301 after your description in this video.
I expected to see finel schematic?🤔
In one day? Seriously? It's gonna take weeks of experimenting and working on details before there is any sort of "final schematic".
The facepalm thumbnail is never a good sign….😂
Keep up the good work.
Thanks, will do!
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics watching your videos has opened my eyes. It makes me realize that I need to be very careful when listening to the reviewers.
The key question here is who makes that device, whether they have any technical knowledge at all, and how they make it in the first place for 20 years, with so many system errors.
I am very grateful to you, for exposing the first class ignorant people, with a soldering iron in their hands.
Lucky I didn't go for this amp(I bought used Cayin MT-35 (LS3/5A speaker)
tl;dr: to make it sound decent, gut the chassis, throw out the iron, use the chassis to wire a brand new amp point to point
Maybe not. The iron might have to go but might be able to use this board.
I wrote a comment that got deleted, maybe because I included an email, but you should write Garry who designs the Musical Paradise stuff with your findings, he is usually very responsive - lives in canada I believe, but is chinese. I own his DAC, not his amps.
Actually someone should have actually tested this amp before it was put on the market a decade ago to verify it met the published specifications. It appears in China advertised specs are just a guideline?
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronicsMusical Paradise is a one man project I believe, and there is an interview somewhere with Garry Huang about how he got it started. I don't think there is wilful negligence on his part, but maybe the Shenzhen factory cuts corners etc.. Maybe his designs are hit or miss
Wait till you see the follow up videos showing the problems before you start defending this guy. Getting a real 15hz-30khz on ANY tube amp is a huge accomplishment. Go look at a company like ISO-Tango, they don't try to claim that sort of thing on anything less than their top shelf iron that sells for over $1000. To do it falsely on something that could never meet those specs just makes it harder for the honest people to compete in a market full of folks making up stats and pumping hype. Amazon if full of these tube amps that make 20% of their rated power. It's simple to actually TEST something, these people just believe no one is ever going to do it, so they just make up whatever will sell product.
I find it extremely interesting that on the Musical Paradise website there is neither address, nor phone number. Looks like real "fly by night" to me.
Is that a BC-348 in the background
Yep! Someone gave it to me. Their husband actually worked for the US intelligence monitoring radio conversations in Europe using this whenever the time period was something like this would have been used.
Hello, other Hifi TH-cam channels have given you the right answer to your inefficient speakers. Too bad, try again.
Welche anderen Kanäle?
Tried this amp with some 101db Klipsh as well as some RP600M, same results. It's interesting a dozen posts saying this same thing show up today...
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics Hello, you can't hang this Klipsch on the MP301. This is completely disingenuous. Have you looked at the impedance curve of this speaker?
Did you look at the performance as measured into a non-inductive 8 ohm dummy load? There IS no speaker to blame that on lol. And amazingly dozens of other amps sound great with those speakers. BTW the manufacturer states:"4Ω- 8Ω(Speaker)". At no point do those speakers go under 4ohms.
Es ist relativ einfach zu erkennen...wie soll ein Verstärker dieser Klasse für ungefähr 300 € den Ansprüchen entsprechen? Die Übertrager das Netzteil die Röhren und ein Choke guter Qualität kosten schon mehr Geld als dieser Verkaufspreis !!! Leider ist der Endverbraucher nicht immer in der Situation dies zu wissen.Ich denke das ist auch normal.
Egal welche Röhren dort verwendet werden, nach deiner sehr guten Analyse wird das nicht funktionieren.
Das Teil taugt nur als Ersatzteilspender oder wer sucht ein gutes Gehäuse😂
Mach nichts daran Du hast ein Geschäft zu führen das ist wichtiger. Die Endverbraucher tun mir leid.
Mach weiter so !!!
Thanks for the review
Yeah Steph ! ..How many times ....and they still get glorious comments on the web !
Telling the truth hurts the feelings of many .......
Fact : In many cases it is building yourself that is the better way to go ......even within the limits of one's budget ......and let your ears and soul decide if it sounds good and musical .
Even sold at dumping prices it is in too many cases trowing your money away in the bin ....of illusions......
Is it worth fixing ?..................tube sockets mounted on the PCB ( asking for future problems ) and the use of a pcb , mostly also a bad design ........and maybe or probably low quality OPT's wound with recycled copper wiring?
Tube rolling and sacrificing rare nos tubes as well as the use of upgraded components and expensive capacitors won't save a bad and cheap design ....in France they have an expression ....not to feed pearls to the pigs .
Maybe not all chinese amplifiers are doubtfull and low quality but the risk of deception is high and the reviews are a trap for creating potential buyers.
Sometimes the chassis can be ( re)used to build something worthwile yourself.
kind regards
Basically this project would be a way to reuse the chassis for someone who owns one of these and wants to build something good from it.
Great review. What a POS, but the price is cheap. I've been interested in their MP-501 V5 the last couple months..& would have ordered one if it wasnt out of stock. It's supposedly a 60lb KT120-150 zero NF with decent iron & parts. It as well gets good reviews but obviously im a bit skeptical now.
Many interenet reviewers are either clueless to what good sound really is or they are liars with an agenda.
The key to listening to this amp is using unrevealing speakers and ear muffs.
HA!
Or donate it to an enemy.
A little hidden truth and secret sauce by old school ..............
UPGRADE components in an amplifier or source/system/cables...........
is VERY REWARDING ...............when you don't feel the NEED for it !
I've come to the conclusion that... people with rave about anything tube with 2nd order harmonics... doesn't even have to have good bandwidth, lol
I really believe that sound is a preference and that people can like what they want but as an engineer that amp boggles my mind because it really isn’t functioning properly as an audio amplifier which kind of seems like a bad place to start in my opinion.
This type of amp is made to sell to people on a budget and without a lot of experience with tube amps. I don’t see the point of trying to make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear. If you have $300 for an amp that’s OK you can find a SS amp that would be better in every way. A GOOD tube amp has to cost more than that. The tube amps I make for myself cost way more than this to make and all the labor is free.
Sometimes you need to ask.... "Why bother?".... 🙂
Point taken. I guess I could see if a DIYer could invest >$300 into a amp they already own and end up with something that maybe sounds better or at least as good as a skunkie modd'd A12? It is a nice small footprint chassis too.
I know I'm not gonna spend my money on someone else's amp.
I was one of the cheerleaders at the pep rallies that went into a frenzy over this particular musical paradise, amp.. It's always been on my bucket list. The unit would probably be perfectly fine for a lot of people.
And would be thrilled to death considering it's a budget amp. If musical paradise could tweak it out. The amp would be something special. Thanks for your spot-on evaluation. Well appreciated!
The folks on the other side of the planet have no clue when it comes to tube circuit design and execution. They find a schematic, assume it's accurate and works and then go into production. If they run into a problem they fix it half arsed with a band-aid and ship it. Buyers beware.
this reminds me of that pice of shit "bob carver" crimson 275, which "bob carver" claimed put out 80WPC!!!
...with 15WPC edcor OPTs. all the gushing and ooing and ahhhing.
theres a specific buyer crowd this stuff is for.
"bob carver" is in quotations because i have no idea if its people using his name with permission, or its the person himself or what.
T&S made so much money for doge that they let him pick coupling caps and put his name on one of their amps.
Or that Carver EL84 based PP amp that weighed nothing. Remember the first time I picked one up and nearly hit myself in the chin with it expecting it to weight much more.
oh, wow @@monrosj .
As an engineer and 40yer vet of this industry, I can look at the inside of this amp and say it more than most would sound awful. Say what you will folks but I make a living at telling folks forget what you think you know. Granted Stephe has one of the worse setups (her room) for a system however I follow her channel because... 1. That is her reference and she speaks from that point about "artifacts and things that affect sound". 2. Not being technically trained she has a very good understanding of "Tube" based technology in Audio. 3. She has hands on experience with many combinations of parts and is not afraid to experiment. 4. I've actually taken some of her suggestions, one on the Little Bear" of a clients and the results were 200% improvement (I'm thinking of doing one for my secondary system).
Had to edit and here goes: $300 for a tube amp even build yourself, lmfao no wonder it sounds bad, go buy a knock off receiver... I can't stop laughing...
Keep up the great work you do for this community
this goes on to say how good Skunkie Designs amplifiers must sound 😄👍🍒
I don´t think this amp worth the extra money required as it would end to duplicate the price if not more, so better to point to other amps. You could do the job just for the satisfaction to hear it sounds good, but that would be not an easy path for non technician people, you know, rolling a tube, or even change a resistor or a capacitor, or even the output transformers could be feasable with a bit of manuality with the solder, but cutting the trace on the board, changin the mode from penthode to triode is not an easy thing to do. Anyway, thanks for your time on this amp, now I know this is not an amp for me :)
It is nice of you to do all this work in looking at this amp. I think you were too generous in what you will do. I think he should just take it back & if anything purchase one of your amplifiers. You build quality equipment & I personally believe your time is better spent on those kind of things, not spending so much time on very badly built amplifiers.
Could you please recommend a $300 tube amplifier?
At that price point, I would stick with solid state. Even low end, decent quality parts to build a tube amp cost more than this. All of these sub $500 tube products I have seen out of China are just junk.
@@SkunkieDesignsElectronics thank you ❤️
How can anyone do that? Tubes cost me $50 each ( on average with tax, shipping and handling) 2 pre tubes, 2 power tubes $175-$200 leaving a grand total of $125-$100 for the rest of it. If anyone offers you anything at under $600 be prepared to spend up to at least the $600 in total for something worth listening to.
Try yard sales for used.
Oh dear!!
Just the weight tells me that it's so-so to start with .Without even listening to it .6 pounds?!!
Bot farms hyping bad chi fi amps
You don't need to look at Chi fi for producing rubbish how about Jadis JP 30 from France.
Yes I know you have talked to Rene, for those who don't know him he is in his mid 70s lives in Thailand & what you see is his hobby beside his cars he has added the Klangwelt site. Rene has spent $10,000 + $10,000 + $10,000 + to no avail you see there is NO CONSUMER PROTECTION IN THAILAND & Jadis refuses to reply to any correspondence sent by him
Kiwi Rod
Most people are idiots and/or they lie.That's why you find the posts you find.