I'm totally heart broken, she was my home from Apr. 1966 to Oct. 1969. My memory of her is still intact. I knew everything and everywhere about her. Scrapping her is sad. She should have been a preserved.
she was my first Ship...boarded in 1997 and left at the end of 2000...took her to Japan to relieve the Indy...my first and favorite ship in my 20 year career.
I believe she has to go. If we preserve her as a museum chinese will come and inspect her as tourists. She is so modern that we cannot let that happen. I believe that is the reason why the navy decided to scrap her. To sink her into the abyss where no one can come and study her.
She was my home from 1968 to 1971!! My last year I worked for KTTY station 94 FM on your dial 🤣 I called it the "Just Rock" sound of yours truly Robbin here on the Sleeping Taco show. The best Desk Job I've ever had I use to say.That's a long story in itself. This is truly a disappointment! I also worked on the Bridge in Navigation for about a year and a half. Holy crap I have a lot of bitter-sweet memories with her!
She was not only the pride of the fleet but Camden NJ and was one of the most powerful ships ever to set sail and now she meets her end at the torch instead of being put to rest at sea like several before her my lady we salute you for your service
I loved her, and was on 2 westpac cruises with her, but everyone claims that their ship is the pride of the fleet. Its a touching sentiment, but it isn't true but to those who crew them and honor their memories. When I was on her there were 12 super carriers in the fleet plus the Midway, and the Coral Sea. 8 were the 4 Forestal's of which I was on USS Ranger for a partial Cruise. The 4 Kitty Hawks of which I was on Kitty Hawk for 2 cruises and several work ups between 1984 and 1987, and I got to go out on Enterprise for a 2 week work up. Then there was Nimitz, Ike and Vinson. I forget which one was going to be 71, but they were building that one when I got out of the Navy and joined the Army. I got to see USS. Midway out in the Pacific in 1986 from the Kitty Hawk's decks. They really should have taken one of these ships, or hell even 2 and made a museum, but I don't think anyone short of Elon Musk, and or Bill Gates could afford to do so. They Bombed and sunk the America, which is probably a more honorable death than what they are doing to the rest of these ladies. Anyway I still have a large photo of her from the 80's but like Tiffany and Debbie Gibson they get old and eventually they have to scrap them. I do wish that I could have went down to Brownsville and slept in my old berthing rack one last night just one more time. RIP Kitty, and the other 13 that sailed the seas in those days. In my Humble Opinion they were all the Pride of the Fleet.
My dad’s pride and joy during his 30 years of Navy service from WWII, Korea and Viet Nam. I just conditioned his VF 213 Black Lions bomber jacket. He cherished it until he passed at 94 years of age. This carrier and those on board served our country well and deserve a peaceful rest.
I knew your father's squadron very well. I was acqainted with the C.O Cdr.Ted Steele. And Ltjg Tom Mills. I give you my condolences to your father. God bless you.
My dad was an AW onboard when it was based out of SD in the 90's. I got the privilege to also serve onboard the same ship from 2006-2008 as an AW. Sad this thing never became a museum. Soo many memories of this ship. The first week I was onboard I watched a guy chain a 45 pound plate from the gym around his waist and flop over the sponson hand railing.
I served onboard USS Kitty Hawk in the early 80's. Air Department, V-4 Division. What a ship and so many memories, collision with a Victor Class Soviet Submarine, and so much over my tour on the KH. She will always have a special place in my heart. Thanks for the memories. I salute you!
She will be missed. I had the honor of taking her from Philly, down around the Horn and up to San Diego making me an honorary 'Mossback'. Worked flight deck. Catapults and Arresting gear. She now joins my other 2 girls, CV-60 and CV-64 which I retired on
Thank you for sharing, I just became aware of this video. This was my grandfather’s ship for three tours of war and just found out he was a barber too. I live so close and would have been great to see in person.
There were 4 in her class, and technically she was the second, as the actual hull that was Kitty Hawk caught on fire when constructed, and the hull for the Constellation became this ship and was commissioned Kitty Hawk. The hull that was Kitty Hawk was commissioned second as Constellation but had been laid down first.
I first deployed on the the "Hawk" during the 1994 Westpac deployment and again I served on the "Hawk " from 1999 to 2001. Good times and great port visits . I was SeaOp Det in 1994 and ship's company 1999 thru 2001. Bye!!!!!
Outstanding shipmate. Press on. USS Kitty Hawk CV-63. Jan 1980 to July 1983. My sister and i were over there on the beach in front of the Ampitheater with all the vet`s that served on the hawk. I have not been Nere that ship in 40 years. So glad I got to see her one last time.
You sound like my Chief. PRC Belt had three statements, "Outstanding", "No way like Underway" and of course "Shipmate" Everyone, including the Captain knew Chief Belt. He was the guy that had a line way back in the hangar inspecting before liberty. When he first showed up as our Division Chief, everyone was terrified. When you learned everything about him. HE WAS THE GREATEST. If you were right, he would be your defense even Captain Edney CV64 respected the heck out of Chief Belt. The Capt would always visit the Jet Shop, just to get away once in a while. If you were wrong, WATCH OUT, LOL. FINALLY, I Loved standing duty with Chief Belt, so many funny stories. Bobby Estey (Nov 1977 - June 1981)
I served with VF-114 Aardvarks - with the F4J Phantom from 1970-1971 on Yankee Station and just off the coast of Vietnam. Great squadron mates, great shipmates. Dropped lots of napalm to assist US troops and bombed the heck out of targets. The Kitty Hawk was a wonderful ship. Yup, sorry she was not preserved - and sorry more F4J's were not preserved. God bless US Naval Aviation.
I knew your squadron very well, although I was more familiar with 213 black lions, I knew some of the pilots. I think they were rivals of 114. Brand ,X ring a bell? ha.
So sad... was a blue shirt Aboard her 1983 . V-1 division. Life changing experience. Seen the sun rise and set a 100 times from her flight deck ..seen 500 dolphins swimming in her wake off the starboard side . Seen two waves break over her bow . Seen ST. Elmo"s Fire around her radar mast . Seen a S3 viking catch the wire . Scrape it s wing . She looks like hell .
I also served on her 68-71 worked bow cats and last cruise was in charge of number three cat saddens me so much was proud to have served on her. Jerry Haddock. ABE 2
Hey older shipmates, I think she flew a pennant indicating she was the oldest commissioned vessel in the US Navy (other than USS Constitution) when I was on her from '95-'97.
I got one cat launch off the Kitty Hawk's Cat 1 aboard a C-2 Greyhound in July '84, after I re-upped as we were transiting the San Bernardino Strait between Luzon and Samar, RP, after a lengthy stay in the I.O. and North Arabian Sea, earning my second Sea Service award. I was flying back to CONUS, to my next duty station, NAS Lemoore, CA, to learn F/A-18s at VFA-125 Raiders, and then up to NAS Fallon, NV for VFA-125 DET Fallon, where I was stationed from December '84 to July '88. I had just spent nearly three years at NAS North Island, San Diego with VS-38, the Red Griffins, who flew Lockheed S-3A Vikings. I checked into the VS-38 in October 1981, the very day they were deploying for a WESTPAC/I.O cruise onboard the USS Constellation, after completing my S-3A FRAMP training at VS-41 Shamrocks. I turned 21 someplace out at sea between San Diego and Pearl Harbor, HI. Our AirGroup changed over to the Kitty Hawk in early 1982, after she came out of SLEP that year. We did a lot of work-ups off the coast of California that summer, which included a visit to San Francisco for Armed Forces Week. Both those boats, Constellation and Kitty Hawk, are just memories now.
A veteran of my beloved “shitty kitty.” Lotsa mems as though yesterday. Westp late 70s/80. Rocky’s theme. Great skipper, Capt W Chapman. We couldn’t get her saved as a museum. O well. …. Thank you for the vid however :( “Be proud. Press on”
I love to read the comments posted by those who served on these ships/carriers headed to the scrap yard. Makes you feel that you were on board them with those who served on them.
Almost 30years ago , I got a full tour, inside and on the uss kittyhauk in California, got to sit in some plaines and underdeck , saw the bomb storage bay , my cousin was in charge of bomb handling loading
Vietnam, 71 thru 75, S-5 division, race riot and engine room fire, Mombasa Kenya, Africa, Olongapo city and 'de carrier club, San Miguel beer,remember that?
Died by the torch they could have made it a museum or sunk it for a reef heck even the latter would be more respectable for the ship and thoes who served on her
NOT ONE OF OUR COLD WAR ICONS HAS BEEN SAVED ,,,WHY??? 3.M.M.R. ...RAN LOWER LEVEL OVER 40 YEARS AGO... U.S.S. JOHN F.KENNEDY CV-67... MAKES ME SICK TO MY STOMACH...
My Friend Sarah O'Reilly St.James Nursing home 🏡 ❤️ Bother Serve U.S.S.KITTY HAWK Gulf War Sad Great Ship 🚢 😢 like Kitty 😻 Hawk Scape Metal When Turn it Museum 😢 Lot History on Decks
If only it were sunk by torpedo back in 1963. That ship belonged to hell. Everyone who lived on it hated it passionately. It did help the gangsters in government bomb their competition though. If you call that service then you are a benighted ignoramus or mindless jingoist.
I was ship’s crew. Plenty times we’d come back drunk from the amphib base at Cora or the area 4th & E in SD, turn the corner from North Island entrance to CV-63 standing proudly all aglow: “damn, she didn’t sink yet?”. But that’s how folk kid about their homes. Only the residents can use names & statements against her. Everyone else who bad-mouthed her, including the clueless bone-head of the comment to which I’m responding, got their ass kicked as we come to her defense. “Be Proud. Press on”, after which Rocky theme comes on. That was the standard with Kitty Hawkers.
@@dllively7771 I was ships screw you hopeless buffoon. ‘02-‘06 (7th fleet, Yokosuka, V-1, Airman, flight deck blue/gold vest). Being sent to the Kitty Hawk was like getting a prison sentence. It was a run down relic of a ship that constantly needed repairs (which meant that it never visited any enjoyable ports, but instead had to steam to places like Pusan and Guam), and commanded by some of the most incompetent and thankless climbers in the checkered history of naval warfare. You don’t know what you’re talking about and it shows. That was the most dreaded command for very good and very many reasons. It was called the shitty hawk or shitty kitty because its crew despised it with a passion. Any ships crew trying to reimagine that sorry ass boat as a point of pride is an outlier or twit. Which one are you?
@@florjanbrudar692 I don’t assume anything. I was on board that floating turd for four years (felt like 10). It was despised, to a man. Anyone who tells you otherwise is just trying to idealize their years onboard for optics. But nobody, and I mean absolutely NBODY on the shitty Hawk, wanted to be there. Even the commanding officers were just trying to maneuver in order to get sent somewhere else. Even the people who loved their jobs were trying to get orders to another command at every available stratagem. Make it up any way you want to, I was right there in the belly of the beast. It was a dreadful experience.
![เกิดใหม่ทั้งทีก็เป็นสไลม์ไปซะแล้ว ซีซั่น 3 - ตอนที่ 66 [ซับไทย]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/qcaUguFlwdM/mqdefault.jpg)
I'm totally heart broken, she was my home from Apr. 1966 to Oct. 1969. My memory of her is still intact. I knew everything and everywhere about her. Scrapping her is sad. She should have been a preserved.
she was my first Ship...boarded in 1997 and left at the end of 2000...took her to Japan to relieve the Indy...my first and favorite ship in my 20 year career.
I believe she has to go. If we preserve her as a museum chinese will come and inspect her as tourists. She is so modern that we cannot let that happen. I believe that is the reason why the navy decided to scrap her. To sink her into the abyss where no one can come and study her.
@@haharrr7018 areas on museum ships that are “top secret” are locked up. That’s not a reason to scrap her.
My dad was on the USS Epperson DD 651 at the time you were on the Kitty hawk and he’s got lots of 8mm footage of the kitty hawk during that time.
She was my home from 1968 to 1971!! My last year I worked for KTTY station 94 FM on your dial 🤣 I called it the "Just Rock" sound of yours truly Robbin here on the Sleeping Taco show. The best Desk Job I've ever had I use to say.That's a long story in itself. This is truly a disappointment! I also worked on the Bridge in Navigation for about a year and a half. Holy crap I have a lot of bitter-sweet memories with her!
She was not only the pride of the fleet but Camden NJ and was one of the most powerful ships ever to set sail and now she meets her end at the torch instead of being put to rest at sea like several before her my lady we salute you for your service
I loved her, and was on 2 westpac cruises with her, but everyone claims that their ship is the pride of the fleet. Its a touching sentiment, but it isn't true but to those who crew them and honor their memories.
When I was on her there were 12 super carriers in the fleet plus the Midway, and the Coral Sea.
8 were the 4 Forestal's of which I was on USS Ranger for a partial Cruise. The 4 Kitty Hawks of which I was on Kitty Hawk for 2 cruises and several work ups between 1984 and 1987, and I got to go out on Enterprise for a 2 week work up. Then there was Nimitz, Ike and Vinson. I forget which one was going to be 71, but they were building that one when I got out of the Navy and joined the Army.
I got to see USS. Midway out in the Pacific in 1986 from the Kitty Hawk's decks.
They really should have taken one of these ships, or hell even 2 and made a museum, but I don't think anyone short of Elon Musk, and or Bill Gates could afford to do so.
They Bombed and sunk the America, which is probably a more honorable death than what they are doing to the rest of these ladies.
Anyway I still have a large photo of her from the 80's but like Tiffany and Debbie Gibson they get old and eventually they have to scrap them.
I do wish that I could have went down to Brownsville and slept in my old berthing rack one last night just one more time.
RIP Kitty, and the other 13 that sailed the seas in those days.
In my Humble Opinion they were all the Pride of the Fleet.
My dad’s pride and joy during his 30 years of Navy service from WWII, Korea and Viet Nam. I just conditioned his VF 213 Black Lions bomber jacket. He cherished it until he passed at 94 years of age. This carrier and those on board served our country well and deserve a peaceful rest.
I knew your father's squadron very well. I was acqainted with the C.O Cdr.Ted Steele. And Ltjg Tom Mills. I give you my condolences to your father. God bless you.
I knew some pilots from 213 . Cdr. Ted Steele , ltjg.Tom Mills. Great guys,
My dad was an AW onboard when it was based out of SD in the 90's. I got the privilege to also serve onboard the same ship from 2006-2008 as an AW. Sad this thing never became a museum. Soo many memories of this ship. The first week I was onboard I watched a guy chain a 45 pound plate from the gym around his waist and flop over the sponson hand railing.
Wow that guy must have been a really good swimmer to take on all that extra weight. What a beast.
are you saying you witnessed a possible suicide?
I served onboard USS Kitty Hawk in the early 80's. Air Department, V-4 Division. What a ship and so many memories, collision with a Victor Class Soviet Submarine, and so much over my tour on the KH. She will always have a special place in my heart. Thanks for the memories. I salute you!
She will be missed. I had the honor of taking her from Philly, down around the Horn and up to San Diego making me an honorary 'Mossback'. Worked flight deck. Catapults and Arresting gear. She now joins my other 2 girls, CV-60 and CV-64 which I retired on
Thank you for sharing, I just became aware of this video. This was my grandfather’s ship for three tours of war and just found out he was a barber too. I live so close and would have been great to see in person.
There were 4 in her class, and technically she was the second, as the actual hull that was Kitty Hawk caught on fire when constructed, and the hull for the Constellation became this ship and was commissioned Kitty Hawk.
The hull that was Kitty Hawk was commissioned second as Constellation but had been laid down first.
I first deployed on the the "Hawk" during the 1994 Westpac deployment and again I served on the "Hawk " from 1999 to 2001. Good times and great port visits . I was SeaOp Det in 1994 and ship's company 1999 thru 2001. Bye!!!!!
My friend landed his drone on the deck
Thank you great lady for your service.
Outstanding shipmate. Press on. USS Kitty Hawk CV-63. Jan 1980 to July 1983. My sister and i were over there on the beach in front of the Ampitheater with all the vet`s that served on the hawk. I have not been Nere that ship in 40 years. So glad I got to see her one last time.
You sound like my Chief. PRC Belt had three statements, "Outstanding", "No way like Underway" and of course "Shipmate" Everyone, including the Captain knew Chief Belt. He was the guy that had a line way back in the hangar inspecting before liberty. When he first showed up as our Division Chief, everyone was terrified. When you learned everything about him. HE WAS THE GREATEST. If you were right, he would be your defense even Captain Edney CV64 respected the heck out of Chief Belt. The Capt would always visit the Jet Shop, just to get away once in a while. If you were wrong, WATCH OUT, LOL. FINALLY, I Loved standing duty with Chief Belt, so many funny stories. Bobby Estey (Nov 1977 - June 1981)
I served with VF-114 Aardvarks - with the F4J Phantom from 1970-1971 on Yankee Station and just off the coast of Vietnam. Great squadron mates, great shipmates. Dropped lots of napalm to assist US troops and bombed the heck out of targets. The Kitty Hawk was a wonderful ship. Yup, sorry she was not preserved - and sorry more F4J's were not preserved. God bless US Naval Aviation.
I knew your squadron very well, although I was more familiar with 213 black lions, I knew some of the pilots. I think they were rivals of 114. Brand ,X ring a bell? ha.
So sad... was a blue shirt Aboard her 1983 . V-1 division. Life changing experience. Seen the sun rise and set a 100 times from her flight deck ..seen 500 dolphins swimming in her wake off the starboard side . Seen two waves break over her bow . Seen ST. Elmo"s Fire around her radar mast . Seen a S3 viking catch the wire . Scrape it s wing . She looks like hell .
I was on the kitty hawk in 70-72 v-2 division I kind of miss it . Good to see this video
I also served on her 68-71 worked bow cats and last cruise was in charge of number three cat saddens me so much was proud to have served on her. Jerry Haddock. ABE 2
Sad to see her go and get scrapped. I was assigned to her as my first tour of duty in Japan.
Thank you for sharing.
Hey older shipmates, I think she flew a pennant indicating she was the oldest commissioned vessel in the US Navy (other than USS Constitution) when I was on her from '95-'97.
I got one cat launch off the Kitty Hawk's Cat 1 aboard a C-2 Greyhound in July '84, after I re-upped as we were transiting the San Bernardino Strait between Luzon and Samar, RP, after a lengthy stay in the I.O. and North Arabian Sea, earning my second Sea Service award. I was flying back to CONUS, to my next duty station, NAS Lemoore, CA, to learn F/A-18s at VFA-125 Raiders, and then up to NAS Fallon, NV for VFA-125 DET Fallon, where I was stationed from December '84 to July '88. I had just spent nearly three years at NAS North Island, San Diego with VS-38, the Red Griffins, who flew Lockheed S-3A Vikings. I checked into the VS-38 in October 1981, the very day they were deploying for a WESTPAC/I.O cruise onboard the USS Constellation, after completing my S-3A FRAMP training at VS-41 Shamrocks. I turned 21 someplace out at sea between San Diego and Pearl Harbor, HI. Our AirGroup changed over to the Kitty Hawk in early 1982, after she came out of SLEP that year. We did a lot of work-ups off the coast of California that summer, which included a visit to San Francisco for Armed Forces Week.
Both those boats, Constellation and Kitty Hawk, are just memories now.
A veteran of my beloved “shitty kitty.” Lotsa mems as though yesterday. Westp late 70s/80. Rocky’s theme.
Great skipper, Capt W Chapman.
We couldn’t get her saved as a museum. O well. …. Thank you for the vid however :(
“Be proud. Press on”
She will be missed, was there from 97-2000
A book, "Troubled Waters" about a night on her that ended the '72' cruise is absolutely worth a read. Get it!!
I love to read the comments posted by those who served on these ships/carriers headed to the scrap yard. Makes you feel that you were on board them with those who served on them.
My dad helped build her in 1961, New York shipyard, Camden NJ
Almost 30years ago , I got a full tour, inside and on the uss kittyhauk in California, got to sit in some plaines and underdeck , saw the bomb storage bay , my cousin was in charge of bomb handling loading
What a beautiful ship. Sad we can’t keep her as a museum. I loved my time on the Kennedy.
Kennedy?
Served onboard her in 1993 during Desert Strike.
Left her in Dubai to get married.
Anyone else notice the SpaceX Starbase launch tower and Starship construction facility in the background at 1:43?
My dad and his brother served on that ship back in it's day dad's 84
I used to refuel unrep her 79-80 on USS Kansas City AOR-3 , in the IO
I retired off her. At NAS North Island. 31
May 1994. MA1. Sad. For sure
RIP mighty warrior
Looking very very nice...
Vietnam, 71 thru 75, S-5 division, race riot and engine room fire, Mombasa Kenya, Africa, Olongapo city and 'de carrier club, San Miguel beer,remember that?
Absolutely remember. A book, "Troubled Waters" about that night that ended that cruise is absolutely worth a read. Get it!!
My dad put up the yellow crane to the middle of the boat
They should’ve turned the Battle Cat into a historic monument. John F Kennedy is the last aircraft carrier that can be donated.
Anyone else expecting, and disappointed, not to see the drone land on the flight deck?
There is another video of a drone that did land on her flight deck. So cool.
Put in reserve fleet
Feels strangely like we might need her again in the near future right?
@@adamdeibel772 Totally obsolete hazmat nightmare.
It's sad but this is life. We have to let some things go.
They should be keeping these hulls.
Why they are worn out.
Hv a question why is the American flying these carriers once they r decommission and taken 2 b scrapped
It is sad but but selling a ship this big for as little as a cent is ridiculous.
Feels sad, kitty hawk
Semper Fortis
USS FORRESTAL CV-59 82-84
Met same fate in Brownsville Tx.
Allstar Metals Recycling.
First in Defense was it's namesake.
like scrapping the Lincoln Memorial
couldn't have said it better wish she had broke loose and sank
I would rather the U.S. Gov't tear down the Lincoln 'Memorial'
A lot of copper in there
Died by the torch they could have made it a museum or sunk it for a reef heck even the latter would be more respectable for the ship and thoes who served on her
NOT ONE OF OUR COLD WAR ICONS HAS BEEN SAVED ,,,WHY??? 3.M.M.R. ...RAN LOWER LEVEL OVER 40 YEARS AGO... U.S.S. JOHN F.KENNEDY CV-67... MAKES ME SICK TO MY STOMACH...
I worked lower level 1979-1982 on Camel Station..PJ Martin, Choco, Bash..BJ Terrel?
My Friend Sarah O'Reilly St.James Nursing home 🏡 ❤️ Bother Serve U.S.S.KITTY HAWK Gulf War Sad Great Ship 🚢 😢 like Kitty 😻 Hawk Scape Metal When Turn it Museum 😢 Lot History on Decks
Dfgcg😂😂❤❤❤❤🎉🎉🎉😂❤❤ff😢ygff😂😂😂gf🎉🎉f🎉😂😂ff❤❤❤❤
If only it were sunk by torpedo back in 1963. That ship belonged to hell. Everyone who lived on it hated it passionately. It did help the gangsters in government bomb their competition though. If you call that service then you are a benighted ignoramus or mindless jingoist.
How can you just assume everyone on board hated it?
I was ship’s crew. Plenty times we’d come back drunk from the amphib base at Cora or the area 4th & E in SD, turn the corner from North Island entrance to CV-63 standing proudly all aglow: “damn, she didn’t sink yet?”.
But that’s how folk kid about their homes. Only the residents can use names & statements against her. Everyone else who bad-mouthed her, including the clueless bone-head of the comment to which I’m responding, got their ass kicked as we come to her defense.
“Be Proud. Press on”, after which Rocky theme comes on. That was the standard with Kitty Hawkers.
@@dllively7771
I was ships screw you hopeless buffoon. ‘02-‘06 (7th fleet, Yokosuka, V-1, Airman, flight deck blue/gold vest). Being sent to the Kitty Hawk was like getting a prison sentence. It was a run down relic of a ship that constantly needed repairs (which meant that it never visited any enjoyable ports, but instead had to steam to places like Pusan and Guam), and commanded by some of the most incompetent and thankless climbers in the checkered history of naval warfare. You don’t know what you’re talking about and it shows. That was the most dreaded command for very good and very many reasons. It was called the shitty hawk or shitty kitty because its crew despised it with a passion. Any ships crew trying to reimagine that sorry ass boat as a point of pride is an outlier or twit. Which one are you?
@@florjanbrudar692
I don’t assume anything. I was on board that floating turd for four years (felt like 10). It was despised, to a man. Anyone who tells you otherwise is just trying to idealize their years onboard for optics. But nobody, and I mean absolutely NBODY on the shitty Hawk, wanted to be there. Even the commanding officers were just trying to maneuver in order to get sent somewhere else. Even the people who loved their jobs were trying to get orders to another command at every available stratagem. Make it up any way you want to, I was right there in the belly of the beast. It was a dreadful experience.
91 to 93,gunna miss ya ol girl!!
I guess China needs some more high quality American Steel.... Sigh......