I have a hunch we'll trade some of our future picks with Richmond and get back into the first round this year. They have something ridiculous like 7 first round picks, and Pikey mentioned we played nice with Richmond for Baker, so just maybe there was a handshake deal that they'll be nice back to us and deal one of their first round picks. Watch this space!
I really don't think it's that bad. Baker and Owies are fantastic players and draft picks can always be hit or miss anyway. Our draft hand for next year is already huge with hawthorn's picks that we got which is probably why wce chose to get baker this trade because we will have a strong draft next year
The reason its actually bad is because west coast could of got all the same deals done and still had pick 3 in such a highly talked about draft, but to be fair I’m not sure anyone expected hawks to stuff youse up with pick 14
Giving up pick 3 for 27 and 28 year old in the middle of a deep rebuild. How is that good when the players coming in are either retired or well past their prime when eagles next contend. Recent history shows there is a need for top 5 picks to win flags. Yes draft picks can be hit and miss but the higher you go up the draft order the greater the chance of success that is proven whether we like it or not. The trade would not have been so bad if west coast were not in such a deep rebuild but we are so throwing away top 5 picks is blatantly reckless and gambling the future in my opinion. This year's top 6 players could all go number 1 and are mids eagles could have grabbed 1 of those. Imagine that an elite young premium mid to pair with Reid ? We gave up Sheezel now we give up O'Sullivan/Langford/Lalor. And your saying no big deal we got baker and owies ?
@user-ln8we1ud9c yes I am saying it's not THAT big of a deal. Sure it's not great but like I said next years draft we will most certainly make the most of it because let's be honest we will finish bottom three again and also have all of hawthorn's picks
@@TheGamingGatheringYT You seem to lack understanding, for example next years draft is considered weaker and more compromised ? hawthorn have made their team stronger through the acquisition of Barass and Battle so would seem unlikely they drop away much to allow us great draft picks. So no guarantees here. Ive outlined why giving away top 5 picks is fraught with danger in my previous comment and you have said very little back so I can only assume you dont know too much and are just trying to be optimistic. I will leave you with this example the eagles historically have protected their high draft picks very well in previous rebuilds, think Naitaniu at 2, Judd at 3, Fremantle traded theirs away for establish players, missing out on guys like Luke Hodge and Sam Mitchell.
I was watching Scott Cummings and Tim Gossage interview Eagles list manager and he mentioned something about building good relationships between the managers and agents of players and clubs also Don Pyke mentioned something about admitting the trades look "odd" We can only hope whatever they're lining up in the background this year will pay off over the next couple of years
Sounds like there more interested in being nice guys and helping other clubs out then our own. Matt Clarke thinks he still works for Richmond. Don Pyke cares more about his reputation with other CEO's. How about putting eagles the club first not baker other clubs or yourselves. Disgusting self-preservation behaviour
@@user-ln8we1ud9c Trade period is not like playing games of footy. You can’t just force your will onto other teams. The other clubs can just say no and refuse to work with you. All this talk about Baker being walked to the draft doesn’t take into account that North Melbourne could’ve taken him and that’s even if he made it that far, considering that Fremantle were gunning for him and had the picks to do it.
We can always just say no to trading in oldies and keep our picks did you think of that ? I never actually said walk baker to the draft cause I never wanted baker. You've been reading someone else's comments.
Thanks Jesse for the wrap up and honesty piece at the start, I feel your passion and see you have tempered it 18:10 . While yes we could of got Baker and Owies for free at the draft, so could any other team, they will provide valuable seniority to the team and support for McQualter. Overall I am happy with the trade period. We shall see what the draft brings. Let's not forget that at the start of the year this draft was supposed to be poor now the media are calling it even up until the end of the 1st round and historically West Coast has done very well with later picks. I feel that we should not be trading our future picks for this years draft. Keep up the awesome work 💙💛🦅🦅
Don't pay too much attention to criticism, you will never be harsh enough for some or wave the flag enough for others. Getting criticism from both angles is a good sign. But I think I can speak for quite a few people when I say that one of the reasons I watch your channel(s) is that I am getting your genuine opinion, it isn't some manufactured, agenda driven crap to please anyone or create controversy. You are obviously a passionate supporter, any bad result on the field or trade table should spark an emotional response. Don't change
Glad we got Baker and Graham in, but the pick trade deal might be the worst trade in the club's history. Owies is great, but surplus to our needs. Really disappointed in the club's negotiation skills.
I reckon we came out two second-rounders short. Once we decided to split pick 3 for picks 12 and 14, we should have got a second-rounder to sweeten that deal. I have no idea why we sweetened the deal for Carlton. That's baffling. And we should have got something similar back when giving up pick 14 for Baker. If we'd split pick 3 for picks 12 + 14 + a second-rounder... and then traded pick 14 for Baker + a second-rounder. I feel that would have been far more acceptable. We'd have 4 picks in the first two rounds this year and something even stronger next year. As it stands, I just don't think we have enough picks for a team that is right in the middle of a major rebuild. Look at Richmond's draft hand and compare it to ours. We're not bringing in sufficient volume of high-end youth. That's the context for the meltdown around splitting pick 3 for unders. We're not getting enough elite kids, and we sacrificed a golden opportunity to do that.
One thing that I think is good about Owies... he's got experience playing alongside two very good dominant forwards. Eagles basically have two very good dominant forwards in Waterman and Allen, so that could work well
If healthy West Coast low key have a top level forward line between Allen, Waterman, J.Williams, Owies, Ryan and Cripps. Add in Hewitt and Reid spending time there the team should be able to score. We've been straight up getting bodied in the midfield hopefully Baker and Graham can help in that department
Everyone (besides you of course) is focusing how the dogs got screwed, but hardly anyone is talking about what this is going to do to Geelong as a team next year. In terms of filling a void, he is precisely what we need. 😺 🎶 See the Catters fly up, up, to win the premiership flag!
I watched the entire trade period this year, sad I know, but completely lost my shit after the pick 3 deal. As you said, time to park it and move on Hoping we can target Richmond’s #24 with some next year selections 🙏
what do ytou think of the three delistings. feel sorry for culley. i was chatting to a mate and looking at the eagles wiki site with squad members. noticed that there was no culley. rushed to the website and saw they'd just done a press release and already had dropped him from the wiki page.
We needed to build up our draft picks (for either Warner or more draftees) AND bring in capable leaders that will be with us over the next 5 years. Considering that there was no way Fremantle would’ve let Baker walk to the draft, keeping pick 3 wouldn’t have allowed us to achieve our goals. The club did what it needed to do, just like they did when they split pick 2 to bring in Ginbey and Hewitt.
What do you reckon about our prospects of trading back into this year's draft? Kinda hoping that Richmond gave us an assurance before doing the Baker deal that we could do something once they'd finalised everything else. Do they really want to take all those picks this year? Might we have a crack at getting their pick 18 with our two future second-rounders?
That's exactly what I've been hoping too. The relationship should be sound between Richmond and WCE given both the personal relationships (Mini, Clarke) and that we dealt in (very) good faith on Baker. Surely there's some quid pro quo in there...
@@matthewstephen6869 The relationship should be sound because we got absolutely violated due to our desire to get a deal done for Baker, apparently without even trying to negotiate.
Clarke mentioned many times about maintaining relationships with clubs and management… I found it odd how often he said it. Then I checked what management group managed both Baker and Warner.
Ive come to terms with the trade period and while the 3 for 12+14 wasnt good, it was a disaster either. Draft is very even with a weaker top few than most years so the drop from 3 to 12 is smaller than usual. Baker for 14 was the real stuff up for me, shouldve gotten pick 29 that the Tigers had back at least.
@user-ln8we1ud9c The gap between FOS and Allan isn't as big as the gap between Mckercher and anybody who went around that pick 10-15 area last year. All the top draftees this year have big red flags, aside from Ashcroft. Smith could be too small to be an inside mid, Draper doesn't do damage, FOS didn't play much footy at all this year, Langford is slow, etc. Ryley Sanders, who went pick 6 last year, would be in the mix for pick 1, maybe even the favourite if he was there this year.
Apparently all list mangers involved in that baker trade use to work for Richmond no wonder. Everybody in the trading industry feels to polite friendly wish wce was more aggressive on the trade table.
I think trading out a top 5 picks is dangerous for 1 year let alone 2. The silver lining to West Coasts terrible form was 3 top 5 picks in the past 3 years, we used 1 and traded the other 2 out, if Harley leaves we have no top 5 picks to show from 3 years of misery ? This sort of decision making erodes the hope of supporters. Not all top 5 picks will be superstars but they are far more likely to end up as such then picks outside the top 5, it really is a sliding scale.
we got overs for the barras deal, so it all balanced out. and remember we don't get baker without graham and vice versa. so when considering the richmond carlton deal you should includ graham
@@user-ln8we1ud9c what part? you do realise how close to the abyss we are in. We're set to bottom out in the next 2 years you know. Baker and Graham will stabilise things in the meantime. They brought these two guys in and will change mindsets and accountability. Guys were being gifted games and not laying tackles or being comeptitive. Spending half a season at WAFL will work a treat. They'll be watching what some of the other guys will be doing on the training track and field. Hopefully for guys like Brockman and co somethng will click.
I never heard 1-12 was the same and we wont be picking from at 12, it will slide to 16/17, so it is a huge drop from 3/4 to 16/17. Sheezel to Ginbey is a big gap in talent already.
You're right - it is more even than it is 'super' in terms of top end talent. In my uneducated opinion however there is a clear group of 5-6 clear top mids in this draft and the talents in the teens, at this stage, are more talls or utilities.
Exactly what I've been trying to say having followed the draft. There's 6 standout mids. By the time we get to the teens there looks to be a drop. Allen is not a pure mid more utility. We aren't getting a premium mid in the teens
Let’s just hope the poor guys we bought in don’t feel too deflated with their new club, that’s not going to be a good start for them. Forget about pic 3, let’s look to the future, we may have to eat humble pie. Let’s let our leaders move us forward, right or wrong we don’t work there, so we don’t know. I too have been frustrated with some of the clubs moves, but I’m happy to see a light ahead. Let the journos in the east mouth off, let’s get behind the boys. My comments are no reflection on your channel or yourself sir.
15:21 we never got offered that. It was 14 and F3. Can you imagine how fans would have reacted if we had traded Barass essentially for Baker and a F3? People would have lost it.
Nowhere near as pick 3 we would have lost 2nd round pick for the Barrass deal but pick 3 would be there in our hands Baker Graham Owies for free pick getting delisted anyway 3,26, better than 12,26
@@sleekism23 no Owies for free Baker pick 14 if they didn’t stuff around try to get 2x first round picks that was never going to happen for a 29 year old should come back First round and 2rd round probably got it done in the end they got 1,2,3,round picks take away the 3rd round pick and pick 3 still there clearly they can’t do there job
@@nicolacantatore7095 no. The hawks final offer before they went with Carlton was pick 14 and a F3. If Eagles had done that deal it would have left us with Barass for Baker and a F3 and fans would have been furious.
@@sleekism23 I would rather lose a second round pick than pick 3 this will go down same as Tim Kelly deal you can sugarcoat it anyway you like but it was a terrible decision
feel like west coast should trade pick 12 + carltons future first for pick 8, unless they plan on holding everything for a chad warner mega offer next year
Could we try future 1st for some tigers or a very high tiger pick like 6 or 10, 18. I feel like helping tigers and the connects with tigers surely they help us out since we have helped them?
worth a try but not sure a future hawks first will entice richmond to give us anything other than 18. This is the draft to be in not next years, we played our hand already and we lost
It’s clear that the Eagles recruitment team recognise the need for mature bodies that can support our young midfield. Overall, they have identified that an immediate improvement is needed. I’m sure they have factored in recruiting a gun inside mid that will take 3-5 years to develop, and perhaps that wasn’t quite what they were looking for. Time will tell if this will work out for them, however, I think many have been butt hurt by their own egos with thoughts of being robbed by rival clubs. It’s horses for courses, possibly the correct play is to work on building the late to mid 20’s age bracket around a Chad Warner, Harley Reid & Elijah Hewitt midfield in 2026. In my view this makes more sense to me than recruiting Sid Draper/Finn O’Sullivan who probably do not suit the game style the Eagles are looking to explore.
Yes lets just focus on late 20 year olds in a deep rebuild so we can rebuild again when they all retire in 4/5 years. Right so Draper O'Sullivan who have not played an AFL game are not suited to West Coasts game plan which we don't even know what it will look like yet with a new coach ? Sounds like good reasons for not having pick 3. Warner is no certainty to play for West Coast ? You do realise that ? Hewitt is no certainty to play again ? The last top 5 mid we let go Sheezel did not take 3-5 years to develop last I checked and Harley looks pretty good for a first year mid ? Lets focus on Baker and Owies though cause they are superstars, maybe we can get some magic beans too
I think the pick 3 deal is seriously bad take out Harley Reid having ginbey as your best talent after finishing in the bottom 4 for the last 3 years is pretty terrible, im interested in your overall thoughts because owies and baker will improve your team in 2025 but in 3 years time how bad is this going to do to the rebuild overall your under 23 is very concerning and your midfield is just as bad if yeo doesn’t play like he did last year I can’t see you’s winning any midfielder battles at all
Also adding to this after the year west coast has had u guys will probably get allen out of this draft which u compare that to the other 3 teams at the bottom that is depressing
I think ginbey has been played out of position. He has the potential to be an elite half back. Hewett this season will be like a new signing. A lot of our youth is underated because they are playing in a bad team - hough, long, dewar, Johnson, maric, j williams and Hutchison are all excellent in addition to the obvious talents like Reid, ginbey and Hewett.
@@drdc22 Now we have traded in oldies Graham, Owies and Baker, some of that youth you mention, will struggle to get games. Hutchison in particular looked good in midfield against Geelong, how will he get regular games now ? Johnson Dewar ditto, it looks all round bad. It might prop us up in the short term but when Yeo, McGovern Kelly retire I actually think we might have extended our rebuild even longer.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c they aren't old and this is not a bad thing to let the young guys get more seasoning in the wafl. I think more likely you'll see petch, sheed, Cripps and possibly witherden propping up the wafl team, making it more competitive and accelerating the development of the youngsters there.
Baker Graham and Owies will be tough for the Eagles small forwards, Ryan, Cripps, Long, Petch, Brockman, Sheed, Hewitt, Rawlinson, Maric, Hutchinson, Dewar.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c Yes its harsh on Culley. Won rising star nomination. Did his knee the next week and 15 months later he has gone. Culley was in the list for 2 and a half years. In 2024 played WAFL well. Only had 3 AFL games this year, in which he was average in a game and poor in others. It was clear after the Essendon game (I think) which indicated the club's thoughts. A very good tackler, but I found that he was more focused on tackling then grabbing the footy when up for grabs. I see him as a mid sized forward or defender in future.
@@BDub2024 I did not feel as though we gave Culley or Trew proper time in the middle. Trew was often the sub and Culley barely played a game. It feels like we are relying on other clubs' players to rebuild our list rather than showing faith in our own young guys which I don't like. Don't get me wrong some de-listings I get but those 2 did not get a proper chance and now we bring in blokes much older than them. Its got to hurt our culture cutting the young home grown and importing oldies.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c Honestly Trew was very lucky to get a contract in 2024. He'd been on the list as a rookie for 3 years at the time. According to Wiley it took until about the third year until things clicked. He got games because of the number of injuries. But saying that, they did contract him in 2024 but then hardly played him until the end of the year. What's the point of giving him a fourth year if he wasn't getting a game? Anyway he ended up playing 7 games and just isn't good enough. I think they need to give more guys chances as rookies and not just keep extending guys and then delisting as 23 year olds. they're missing out on a lot of young talent by sticking with the same olds that aren't stepping up.
I know but Freo are in the window so they can afford to roll the dice and overpay, I dont think we can afford to overpay especially with Reid unsigned and Tassie coming in. Sadly we shat the bed this time
Whilst I’m a big freo fan, hope the trades work out for yas, much better when both sides are up there, in saying that really hoping Warner lands with us and not you 🙌🏻
Few things to consider: 1. New coach needs some protection. Trading in some experience, albeit overpaying for it, is the right thing to do. Helps give the new coach some breathing room in terms of big losses, as well as some much needed leadership to help. 2. The draft is apparently one of the deepest in recent times (so they say). This means pick 12 is as valuable as it ever has been and is the least risky move, compared to say last year where value after pick 10 was limited. People losing their minds over trading pick 3 is actually insane. By their logic, it’s the least valuable pick 3 in a decade. 3. Barrass was always going to hawthorn. Fucking him or hawthorn over, as Pyke said, would be bad business. We played the hand we were dealt and I think the result was satisfactory. You then go on to say something along the lines of “at the end of the day, trying to ascertain what we could have done differently is difficult”. Exactly my point. No one seems to have a better answer than “should have walker baker to the draft”, which we all know was never an option. 4. Reid needs to see some experience and hard bodies to help him out and keep him happy. Baker and Graham bring this.
I will respond to in points; 1. New coach needs protection ? sounds like an excuse for the coach to act selfishly in his own interests instead of the clubs. If the new coach needs that much protection Pyke could have given him a 5 year deal instead of 3 years rather than sold pick 3 and loaded up with 27 and 28 year olds at the draft. Owies was going to be de-listed and was going for free, Baker was uncontracted, we did not need to overpay, we chose too. We already have more experience then other bottom clubs North Melbourne and Richmond, what we need is high draft picks and we will have less of them than both those clubs 2. This is where so many don't understand drafts. First of all, pick 12 wont stay pick 12 it will slide down likely to 16/17. Pick 3 will only slide to 4. Secondly, you have to know where the talent drops away in each draft to know what your giving up, you clearly dont know that if you think this pick drop is no big deal. The top 6/7 picks are all considered potential number 1's after that there is a drop, there is a further drop once you get outside the top 11/12, eagles pick around 16/17, have a look at Bo Allans numbers and highlights and compare that to a Jagger Smith, Harvey Langford, Sid Draper, there is a decent gap there we are giving up. You would know that if you followed the draft. 3. I think we agree somewhat on the Barass deal in that I am satisfied with what the eagles got for Barass, i think most eagles fans are, its the pick 3 give up for oldies that disgusts me and most eagles supporters, so lets not divert away from the main issue 4. Reid also needs not be the only elite young mid we have, that is too great a burden for him and the chances of pick 3/4 being an elite mid were fairly good, pick Reid could have been paired with Sheezel we chose a pick split. This year if we had of kept pick 3 we could have paired Reid with Langford/Draper/Smith but instead we will pair him with Bo Allan. Anyone who knows the draft will know what I am talking about here, there is a big difference unless Bo Allan can improve massively which is possible.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c I will re-respond to your points 1. It’s not an excuse for a selfish coach, it’s not the coaches decision for a start. It’s the club making sure he doesn’t get 12 x 100pt flogging in his first 2 years and his career is derailed by the media and nutty supporters before it even starts 2. I completely understand how the draft works, and so does the west coast list managers. In fact, they have more insight than anyone on this comments section combined. So who should you trust, your expert opinion, or theirs? 3. Agree most of the dissatisfaction is around pick 3, not Barrass. But the same principle applies, what else were we supposed to do? We wanted baker and we were prepared to pay for him. 4. Reid won’t get better by having another young bloke half his size and talent running around the midfield with him. Look at how good he and Yeo were together. Now imagine the freedom he will enjoy with Baker, Graham and Yeo all providing him with some space. Agree we need more young midfield talent to come in, but we need to get more competitive right now. Get spanked by 200pts isn’t helping anyone, except the opposition
@@kanecross 1. If the club was so concerned about 12X floggings they could have just increased the offer and kept Barass who is a better player than Baker, Owies and Graham. Anyway, it's not about protecting the coach, it's about the club, the long-term health of the club, not some short-term Band-Aid solution, do we want to be a premiership contender or do we want to be a mid-table club. 2. what so they are perfect and beyond critique because they are list managers, what rubbish, we are free to criticize poor decisions, you're a fool if you trust every so-called expert based on title 3. yes we wanted baker but we should not be prepared to pay any cost mate, it's just common sense, if I want a car it doesn't mean I am willing to pay any cost, that's just foolish reasoning, you draw a line and say this is how much I am willing to pay and you walk away if the other party is not reasonable, the eagles acted foolishly by trading away pick 3 4. You really don't follow the draft, do you? The 6-7 top picks in this years draft all are premium mids, 2 are named Langford and Smillie, Langford is 190cm, and Smillie 194cm, that's their heights measured at the beginning of this year, they are both bigger than Reid, Lalor another top 6/7 mid measured 187cm earlier this year, as big as Reid and likely will be bigger than Reid when he debuts next year, that's 3 of the top 6-7 mids all bigger than Reid, but you say they are half Reid's size, mate if you did your research on the draft you would not make false comments like this. By the way all 3 of those kids are well built tanks too not skinny kids like you suggest. last I checked we never got spanked by even 100 points this year let alone 200pts so bit of an exaggeration there hey, when you have to exaggerate and lie to make a point you know you're struggling
The trade has grown on me to be honest, we could have a really nice hand next trade period and we have got better this off season so I’m somewhat excited for next season
The Barass trade went ok but it was separate from the Baker/pick 3 disaster. It doesnt make up for it. The only way we get out of jail on this sh*t show is if pick 16/17 can be a superstar, it seems unlikely but its possible. We also still need Hewett's body to come right and Ginbey to come on more to justify giving up Sheezel. its been a tough few years.
Opinions are always subjective, for example, I hate Tayler Swift music, yet others love her music, that's just one example. What you talk about on your channel is subjective and your opinion. With social media, we hardly see any mature discussions these days. Just do you mate, your a decent content creator.
I think it’s hard to take the emotion out of this situation. We probably got close to fair value for TB (still wish it was two firsts but I accept we got a good deal). We definitely paid overs for Baker and Owies however we can only judge this trade on how good pick 3 goes and who we pick. I think there is clearly a plan for next year either the get Warner or back to the draft. I think we have a decent core of kids but not everyone has performed. We had a hole and we’ve tried to fill it
I think if pick 3 ended up a dud it would just mean we go lucky rather than any genius of our list managers. Most pick 3's end up much stronger than a pick 15/16. Plus we dont know that we would have picked the same player at 3 as Carlton will. That said we can look at the past and quickly realise that its not a good idea to trade out of the top 5 too often and AFL history is littered with champions who come from the top 5 of draft pools.
I’m happy for the players we got but we could have had all them and pick 3 Pyke and Clarke need to stop making excuses for there stuff up last CEO Trevor wouldn’t allow this mess
In the short term these guys will be great for the team and will help the development of the younger guys. No one will know if pick 3 was worth it until years on. No one knows. You could get a Chris Judd, or a Paddy Dow.
That is true but your far more likely to get a Judd from pick 3/4 than pick 16/17. Just look at the difference between Sheezel and Ginbey and thats only 3 - 9.
In my imaginary perfect world, you return to this trade period 12 months from now and talk about how well it ended up being and how competitive the eagles were for the 2025 season. Nothing crazy, maybe finishing around 9th/10th. Carlton and Richmond finish below us. But back in the modern times, I think people are putting too much stock on Reid as our sole champion. He's a great payer, but great players need great teams around them. Judd and Cuzzy were great players but they DID have a great team around them. No team with a single stand out player has ever won a premiership *cough* freo *cough*. We need players in the team who can support the kids. I'm sure there is plenty of talent in the top 10 drafts picks, but are we that desperate for anyone in particular? Are are we just needing to backfill the youth?
It's wired but I do look at the pick 3 trade as a whole it's not great but when you break it down it's not bad at all. Pick 3 for 12 & 14 is fair value especially for a club that needs good quality youth coming through it's a good trade every year and a really good trade in such a deep draft. Owies for JD is a good trade for us. The pick we got for JD we used to get Owies with our 4th round and got a fourth back. We have a lot of KPF not many small forwards. The deal falls apart with the baker trade for 14. But it is what it is it's a loss on our end but not a huge loss there is value in getting a kid and an experience player. Can argue about was is it worth it. That just arguing around the edges. I don't think the hawks seriously had 14 on the table it wasn't a serious offer. So if 14 wasn't on the board then how do we get it done. I don't mind how it played out maybe getting a second or third back for baker but again it's just around the edges. I think the hawks dropped the ball over TB if the hawks took the 2 first rounders and a second back would have left them in a better position than what they gave up. The look of 2 first rounders sounds big but it's 2 later first round picks. Had the hawks traded 14 to the blues kept the second round pick they got for that trade and took our 2024 early second round pick then they would have 4 second round picks one of them early instead of one late first round pick and 2 later second round picks and no future 3rd. I think Cripps keeps his spot Owies can back up Cripps until Cripps drops form/ gets injured or retires. But that just me. I love true eagle and true footy it's true it's true
You think giving away pick 3 in a deep rebuild in a stronger than usual draft for players who will be either well past their prime or retired when we challenge again is not bad at all ??? Eagles enter the draft at 12 which drifts to 16/17 and then the next pick wont be till around 30, Eagles finished 3rd last, you would expect to have a strong draft hand finishing so low but no. I think people with your thoughts have a lack of understanding on how the draft works, higher picks equal greater chance of success, the pick drop from 3 (sliding to 4) to 12 (sliding to 16) is a massive drop, I dont think many who are positive on this understand the difference. For perspective Eagles gave up Sheezel/Wardlaw for Ginbey/Hewett which was actually a better trade than this one, so far Ginbey is nowhere near either of those players and he was pick 9, Hewett is suffering from debilitating injuries and may not even make it as an AFL player. When a draft is strong the top 5 are usually mostly very good to elite, this is what I think people are not understanding here. Yes you can get decent outside top 10 too but it becomes more hit and miss. What happens if Harley Reid leaves, how many top 5 picks will we have to show for 3 bottom 3 finishes ? the answer is 0 - how does that sound to eagles fans, not too bad at all ?
@@user-ln8we1ud9c I don't think you understand how list building works or how the draft works or took 2 seconds to read what I said. Pick 3 for pick 12 & 14 is good in a deep draft. Yes that is good we can get 2 players instead of one. Two firsts rounders rather than 1. Why care if Reid leaves we will get great draft picks for him plus when building a list you need more than 1 player. How good was the pick 2 Shezzel for Ginbey and Hewett. If Hewett never plays again we still end up with a bloody good player. Could you imagine if we picked wardlaw missed on Ginbey and Hewett and wardlaw injured his foot and couldn't play again. See, see how getting extra players is beneficial in a rebuild. If you followed the draft prospects there is no Harley Reid quality kid in this draft and we only had pick 3. So in a deep draft 2 players in the middle of the first round instead of one pick. We have spread the risk. It would be disastrous for us if we picked a player who was a bust, injured just a meh player. Then how do we look after all this bottoming out Reid leaves and pick 3 is a bust. Then how do we look. How far behind would we be if that happened? The Baker part was the problem and a different story like I said but you conveniently left that out. We swapped Owies for JD helps the age bracket a little but most importantly position gap more than age gap. 3 for 12 & 14 in a deep draft is good if you can't see that then you have huge gaps in your knowledge on list building.
@@joshhowie7657 But we did not trade pick 3 for 12-14 we traded it for 12 and Baker and Owies 🙄, and 12 slides further then 3 because the further you go down the draft the greater the slide. The greater the slide down the draft your picking from the less chance you pick a champion, this is facts mate and 3/4 down to 16/17 is a huge drop. Whose the bloody good player we got for giving up Sheezel 🤣 can you name them ? I would have been happy to get either Wardlaw or Sheezel and given up Ginbey and Hewett, they both had far superior junior football careers and now have better afl careers. Why care if Reid leaves ??? the fact your asking that shows your lack of knowledge. We dont have pick 14 in this draft we traded it for a 27year old 🤣😂.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c jumping and jiving now aren't we. Because I isolated the pick 3 for 12 & 14 and that on its own was not bad at all. I clearly explained that if falls apart with trading pick 14 for baker. It's poor form to flip and flop like that just to try and save face. The bloody good player is Ginbey, maybe not elite but he played well in his first year during when playing as main inside mid in a skeleton midfield during an injury ravaged side. This year he played more on the outside and he didn't shine at all. Small glimpses but not great at all But then his last month and a half off the halfback he was awesome he is going to be a bloody good player. Not sure how Hewett turns out but if he turns into an average player averaging 18-20 touches a game then both Ginbey and Hewett will be better than just 1 Shezzel or wardlaw. The whole sooking about the pick sliding is so overblown. The players getting picked aren't available to anyone not just us but everyone who isn't the FS or academy club. So sooking is just a waste of time. But getting back to getting Baker for 14 is definitely overs for him but not by much we can only deal with the cards we are dealt. But it goes back to the topic before what if pick 3 is a bust then you have missed out. Yes you are right you have a better chance of getting a gun at 3 then you will at 12 and if 12 is a bust then we have a reliable solid player in Baker. Yes it's overs but I'm not denying that never did. We started the trade period with 3, 26 and something in the 60s. We left with pick 12, 26, 70 something Baker Graham Owies 2 first rounders next year 2 second rounders next year and 2 third rounders next year And it only cost us pick 3, 60 something TB & JD and another pick in the 60s Could it have been better yeah a bit was it worth it yes we are now set up for a strong draft hand next year or trade back into this year's draft or make a play for Warner. Non of that possible with the trading out pick 3
@@joshhowie7657 Ginbey is still young so he could end up decent but right now a bloody good player Ginbey really ? That is delusional. You know nothing about football, calling Ginbey a bloody good player in the here and now is just a ridiculous thing to say. I am hoping he can become a bloody good player but most people who understand football know he is far from that. Then you even say Ginbey is maybe not elite. I think being unrealistic is a waste of time, deluding yourself into thinking it doesnt matter if Reid leaves, Ginbey is a bloody good player. I get being optimistic but not to the point of being unrealistic and delusional. Pick 12, 26 and 70 is pathetic for a team that finished 3rd last and gave away picks for old blokes, its the draft hand of a finalist not a rebuilding team.
And yeah, you're a good person Jesse, at no point have I ever thought you were being vitriolic towards a player or players, if anything you go out of your way to consider the welfare of players and staff alike in AFL.
"we're a good club", we have actually been a historically bad club over the past 3 years. We were a great club, now people laugh when I say I support the eagles lol
I'm ok with the trades, we may have given up good picks, but from what I've heard from the West Coast list manager, fair enough, you have to deal with other clubs in good faith.
I understand people being disappointed in trades, but acting aggressive to people not acceptable. Completely fine with calls for people involved to lose their jobs.
It’s all only speculation of what’s right what’s should or shouldn’t of happened is just one massive bottomless pit and after all only time can tell 🦅🦅 GO THE EAGLES 2025
patrick cripps went 13, lochie neal 58, gary abblett 40, pick 12 could be anything, the trade blends the list too help our midfield yeo and kelly need that blend we could a jump up the ladder. but still not the greatest trade ever made!!!!!
true but its harder to get champions the further you slide down the draft, again lack of understanding shown here, we wont pick at 12, our pick will slide out to 16/17, drafts are more compromised these days then when P Cripps was drafted
@@user-ln8we1ud9c the draft has been noted as strong top 30 even has been the word used alot again coming back to original comment definitely think relies on the club to spot talent Matt Clark found alot of good talent in his time hopefully there's a star just waiting to be found but again no matter were you draft number it doesn't mean your going to make it in the AFL look how many top ten picks get delisted brander is a fine example for west coast!!!!!
Baker is overrated he butchers the ball his highlights reel is just pressure and tackles...should of kept pick 3 some skilful young kids jagger draper in the draft🤷🤷🤷🤷
People that aren't outraged don't grasp how bad this trade is.. they'll find out soon enough. After a few more wooden spoons they will suddenly be outraged too.
Most fans dont understand the draft, how it works, they seem to think its all a lottery, I mean it is possible to get judd at 60 and a dud at 1 but the chances of that happening are so dam slim, H Reid was pick 1 last year and how good is he ? who was the last guy picked in the draft last year, I dont know either
WC Big Footy and Fakebook groups are littered with bootlickers who think they know their ish but don't. They're always playing apologist for the club, excusing their ineptitude, spinning negatives into positives and rationalizing blatant f' up's. The average WC supporter would rather hear sweet sounding lies than the cold harsh truth. This is evidenced by the many calls that denounce the "bedwetters," and the endless cries to discuss only the positives, not the negatives. This is why I have no respect for the happy clapper brigade. They make for the most moronic of supporters. They're incapable of holding the club to account for their unbelievable stupidity. It's misguided loyalty. It's also the case that the supporters that get dogpiled by the happy clapping seals turn out to be correct in many cases. Their against the grain views are the ones that I appreciate, even if I don't always agree with them or agree in entirely. The so-called "bedwetters" proved to be correct, yet not 12 hours after the monumentally disastrous Baker trade were the bootlickers back to their putting everything into the spin cycle with their typical white washing. I despise the bootlickers, they're cretins.
WC Big Footy and Fakebook groups are littered with bootlickers who think they know their ish but don't. They're always playing apologist for the club, excusing their ineptitude, spinning negatives into positives and rationalizing blatant f' up's. The average WC supporter would rather hear sweet sounding lies than the cold harsh truth. This is evidenced by the many calls that denounce the "bedwetters," and the endless cries to discuss only the positives, not the negatives. This is why I have no respect for the happy clapper brigade. They make for the most moronic of supporters. They're incapable of holding the club to account for their unbelievable stupidity. It's misguided loyalty. It's also the case that the supporters that get dogpiled by the happy clapping seals turn out to be correct in many cases. Their against the grain views are the ones that I appreciate, even if I don't always agree with them or agree in entirely. The so-called "bedwetters" proved to be correct, yet not 12 hours after the monumentally disastrous Baker trade were the bootlickers back to their putting everything into the spin cycle with their typical white washing.
To start the trade period with pick 3 and the obvious 12 from Hawthorn as part of the Barrass trade and end up with pick 12 and Baker,Owies (Could’ve got in the pre season draft for NOTHING) and Graham (Who’s injury prone) and future picks (In the hope of getting Warner next season) is an unmitigated disaster if Warner doesn’t come because they need to be better NOW??!
Drop everything!
Alex Witherden has been delisted!!! 😍😍😍😍
My faith in the club has been fully restored
Unsure about Culley though, and what has Luke Edwards got on them
@@jeffbrown2034 my money is on Edwards getting a Carmichael type deal. Quite 2 year deal and let him medically retire next year
What do we need to do to get rotham out the door.
Your critique has always been balanced and fair imo, dude! As fans, we're allowed to be frustrated, caring is a good thing.
Thanks I appreciate that!
I have a hunch we'll trade some of our future picks with Richmond and get back into the first round this year. They have something ridiculous like 7 first round picks, and Pikey mentioned we played nice with Richmond for Baker, so just maybe there was a handshake deal that they'll be nice back to us and deal one of their first round picks. Watch this space!
I doubt that, the future picks are for Warner
Keep up the amazing work! And as always great review of the trade period for the eagles.(get this legend to 4k subs)
Thanks mate!
I really don't think it's that bad. Baker and Owies are fantastic players and draft picks can always be hit or miss anyway. Our draft hand for next year is already huge with hawthorn's picks that we got which is probably why wce chose to get baker this trade because we will have a strong draft next year
The reason its actually bad is because west coast could of got all the same deals done and still had pick 3 in such a highly talked about draft, but to be fair I’m not sure anyone expected hawks to stuff youse up with pick 14
Giving up pick 3 for 27 and 28 year old in the middle of a deep rebuild. How is that good when the players coming in are either retired or well past their prime when eagles next contend. Recent history shows there is a need for top 5 picks to win flags. Yes draft picks can be hit and miss but the higher you go up the draft order the greater the chance of success that is proven whether we like it or not. The trade would not have been so bad if west coast were not in such a deep rebuild but we are so throwing away top 5 picks is blatantly reckless and gambling the future in my opinion. This year's top 6 players could all go number 1 and are mids eagles could have grabbed 1 of those. Imagine that an elite young premium mid to pair with Reid ? We gave up Sheezel now we give up O'Sullivan/Langford/Lalor. And your saying no big deal we got baker and owies ?
@user-ln8we1ud9c yes I am saying it's not THAT big of a deal. Sure it's not great but like I said next years draft we will most certainly make the most of it because let's be honest we will finish bottom three again and also have all of hawthorn's picks
@@TheGamingGatheringYT You seem to lack understanding, for example next years draft is considered weaker and more compromised ? hawthorn have made their team stronger through the acquisition of Barass and Battle so would seem unlikely they drop away much to allow us great draft picks. So no guarantees here. Ive outlined why giving away top 5 picks is fraught with danger in my previous comment and you have said very little back so I can only assume you dont know too much and are just trying to be optimistic. I will leave you with this example the eagles historically have protected their high draft picks very well in previous rebuilds, think Naitaniu at 2, Judd at 3, Fremantle traded theirs away for establish players, missing out on guys like Luke Hodge and Sam Mitchell.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c they sayt those things about the draft every year, I won't be surprised if we get some of the next best players for wce
I was watching Scott Cummings and Tim Gossage interview Eagles list manager and he mentioned something about building good relationships between the managers and agents of players and clubs also Don Pyke mentioned something about admitting the trades look "odd"
We can only hope whatever they're lining up in the background this year will pay off over the next couple of years
Sounds like there more interested in being nice guys and helping other clubs out then our own. Matt Clarke thinks he still works for Richmond. Don Pyke cares more about his reputation with other CEO's. How about putting eagles the club first not baker other clubs or yourselves. Disgusting self-preservation behaviour
@@user-ln8we1ud9c Trade period is not like playing games of footy. You can’t just force your will onto other teams. The other clubs can just say no and refuse to work with you.
All this talk about Baker being walked to the draft doesn’t take into account that North Melbourne could’ve taken him and that’s even if he made it that far, considering that Fremantle were gunning for him and had the picks to do it.
We can always just say no to trading in oldies and keep our picks did you think of that ? I never actually said walk baker to the draft cause I never wanted baker. You've been reading someone else's comments.
Thanks Jesse for the wrap up and honesty piece at the start, I feel your passion and see you have tempered it 18:10 .
While yes we could of got Baker and Owies for free at the draft, so could any other team, they will provide valuable seniority to the team and support for McQualter.
Overall I am happy with the trade period. We shall see what the draft brings.
Let's not forget that at the start of the year this draft was supposed to be poor now the media are calling it even up until the end of the 1st round and historically West Coast has done very well with later picks.
I feel that we should not be trading our future picks for this years draft.
Keep up the awesome work 💙💛🦅🦅
Thanks Sean! Already feeling excited for round 1 again after a few days to calm haha
Don't pay too much attention to criticism, you will never be harsh enough for some or wave the flag enough for others. Getting criticism from both angles is a good sign.
But I think I can speak for quite a few people when I say that one of the reasons I watch your channel(s) is that I am getting your genuine opinion, it isn't some manufactured, agenda driven crap to please anyone or create controversy.
You are obviously a passionate supporter, any bad result on the field or trade table should spark an emotional response.
Don't change
Thanks mate really appreciate you!
Glad we got Baker and Graham in, but the pick trade deal might be the worst trade in the club's history. Owies is great, but surplus to our needs. Really disappointed in the club's negotiation skills.
Great videos mate keep them up
Thanks mate!
I reckon we came out two second-rounders short. Once we decided to split pick 3 for picks 12 and 14, we should have got a second-rounder to sweeten that deal. I have no idea why we sweetened the deal for Carlton. That's baffling. And we should have got something similar back when giving up pick 14 for Baker.
If we'd split pick 3 for picks 12 + 14 + a second-rounder... and then traded pick 14 for Baker + a second-rounder. I feel that would have been far more acceptable. We'd have 4 picks in the first two rounds this year and something even stronger next year. As it stands, I just don't think we have enough picks for a team that is right in the middle of a major rebuild. Look at Richmond's draft hand and compare it to ours. We're not bringing in sufficient volume of high-end youth. That's the context for the meltdown around splitting pick 3 for unders. We're not getting enough elite kids, and we sacrificed a golden opportunity to do that.
Spot on
One thing that I think is good about Owies... he's got experience playing alongside two very good dominant forwards. Eagles basically have two very good dominant forwards in Waterman and Allen, so that could work well
"probably more of a comprehension thing" FROM THE TOP ROPE. though I agree with what you said
Hahaha, couldn't help myself!
If healthy West Coast low key have a top level forward line between Allen, Waterman, J.Williams, Owies, Ryan and Cripps. Add in Hewitt and Reid spending time there the team should be able to score. We've been straight up getting bodied in the midfield hopefully Baker and Graham can help in that department
Everyone (besides you of course) is focusing how the dogs got screwed, but hardly anyone is talking about what this is going to do to Geelong as a team next year. In terms of filling a void, he is precisely what we need. 😺
🎶 See the Catters fly up, up, to win the premiership flag!
I watched the entire trade period this year, sad I know, but completely lost my shit after the pick 3 deal.
As you said, time to park it and move on
Hoping we can target Richmond’s #24 with some next year selections 🙏
what do ytou think of the three delistings. feel sorry for culley. i was chatting to a mate and looking at the eagles wiki site with squad members. noticed that there was no culley. rushed to the website and saw they'd just done a press release and already had dropped him from the wiki page.
Damn! I chat about that a bit in my vid coming out in an hour
Try listening to Paul haselby's top 22 for the Eagles on SEN drive time with Hase and Marto online. Did it on the 17 Oct.
We needed to build up our draft picks (for either Warner or more draftees) AND bring in capable leaders that will be with us over the next 5 years. Considering that there was no way Fremantle would’ve let Baker walk to the draft, keeping pick 3 wouldn’t have allowed us to achieve our goals.
The club did what it needed to do, just like they did when they split pick 2 to bring in Ginbey and Hewitt.
What do you reckon about our prospects of trading back into this year's draft?
Kinda hoping that Richmond gave us an assurance before doing the Baker deal that we could do something once they'd finalised everything else. Do they really want to take all those picks this year? Might we have a crack at getting their pick 18 with our two future second-rounders?
That's exactly what I've been hoping too. The relationship should be sound between Richmond and WCE given both the personal relationships (Mini, Clarke) and that we dealt in (very) good faith on Baker. Surely there's some quid pro quo in there...
@@matthewstephen6869 The relationship should be sound because we got absolutely violated due to our desire to get a deal done for Baker, apparently without even trying to negotiate.
I consider myself more hopeful than optimistic we will find a taker for a trade. But my fingers are crossed
Clarke mentioned many times about maintaining relationships with clubs and management… I found it odd how often he said it.
Then I checked what management group managed both Baker and Warner.
This is a ripping post - good insight!
Witherden delisted 🎉🎉🎉🎉
Apparently we needed players in Witherdens age bracket, must be only players we pay high prices for in that age bracket
Ive come to terms with the trade period and while the 3 for 12+14 wasnt good, it was a disaster either.
Draft is very even with a weaker top few than most years so the drop from 3 to 12 is smaller than usual.
Baker for 14 was the real stuff up for me, shouldve gotten pick 29 that the Tigers had back at least.
I disagree. The top 6 look good in this year's draft. I think it's a decent gap between say Allen and O'Sullivan
@user-ln8we1ud9c The gap between FOS and Allan isn't as big as the gap between Mckercher and anybody who went around that pick 10-15 area last year.
All the top draftees this year have big red flags, aside from Ashcroft.
Smith could be too small to be an inside mid, Draper doesn't do damage, FOS didn't play much footy at all this year, Langford is slow, etc.
Ryley Sanders, who went pick 6 last year, would be in the mix for pick 1, maybe even the favourite if he was there this year.
We got two class players and a good pick , two out of three aint bad😅
Apparently all list mangers involved in that baker trade use to work for Richmond no wonder. Everybody in the trading industry feels to polite friendly wish wce was more aggressive on the trade table.
I think trading out a top 5 picks is dangerous for 1 year let alone 2. The silver lining to West Coasts terrible form was 3 top 5 picks in the past 3 years, we used 1 and traded the other 2 out, if Harley leaves we have no top 5 picks to show from 3 years of misery ? This sort of decision making erodes the hope of supporters. Not all top 5 picks will be superstars but they are far more likely to end up as such then picks outside the top 5, it really is a sliding scale.
we got overs for the barras deal, so it all balanced out. and remember we don't get baker without graham and vice versa. so when considering the richmond carlton deal you should includ graham
Your kidding yourself
@@user-ln8we1ud9c what part? you do realise how close to the abyss we are in. We're set to bottom out in the next 2 years you know. Baker and Graham will stabilise things in the meantime. They brought these two guys in and will change mindsets and accountability. Guys were being gifted games and not laying tackles or being comeptitive. Spending half a season at WAFL will work a treat. They'll be watching what some of the other guys will be doing on the training track and field. Hopefully for guys like Brockman and co somethng will click.
Also wasn’t it like 3 months ago everybody was it wasn’t a strong draft everybody from like 1-12 was the same player. When did the narrative turn?
I never heard 1-12 was the same and we wont be picking from at 12, it will slide to 16/17, so it is a huge drop from 3/4 to 16/17. Sheezel to Ginbey is a big gap in talent already.
You're right - it is more even than it is 'super' in terms of top end talent. In my uneducated opinion however there is a clear group of 5-6 clear top mids in this draft and the talents in the teens, at this stage, are more talls or utilities.
Exactly what I've been trying to say having followed the draft. There's 6 standout mids. By the time we get to the teens there looks to be a drop. Allen is not a pure mid more utility. We aren't getting a premium mid in the teens
Let’s just hope the poor guys we bought in don’t feel too deflated with their new club, that’s not going to be a good start for them. Forget about pic 3, let’s look to the future, we may have to eat humble pie. Let’s let our leaders move us forward, right or wrong we don’t work there, so we don’t know. I too have been frustrated with some of the clubs moves, but I’m happy to see a light ahead. Let the journos in the east mouth off, let’s get behind the boys. My comments are no reflection on your channel or yourself sir.
Well said. It occurred to me today, if we pay up for Warner next year, I fear how Eagles fans will treat him after every bad game (ala Kelly)
15:21 we never got offered that. It was 14 and F3. Can you imagine how fans would have reacted if we had traded Barass essentially for Baker and a F3? People would have lost it.
Nowhere near as pick 3 we would have lost 2nd round pick for the Barrass deal but pick 3 would be there in our hands Baker Graham Owies for free pick getting delisted anyway 3,26, better than 12,26
@@nicolacantatore7095 we wouldn’t have got Baker and Owies for free. Baker would have gone to Freo
@@sleekism23 no Owies for free Baker pick 14 if they didn’t stuff around try to get 2x first round picks that was never going to happen for a 29 year old should come back First round and 2rd round probably got it done in the end they got 1,2,3,round picks take away the 3rd round pick and pick 3 still there clearly they can’t do there job
@@nicolacantatore7095 no. The hawks final offer before they went with Carlton was pick 14 and a F3.
If Eagles had done that deal it would have left us with
Barass for
Baker and a F3 and fans would have been furious.
@@sleekism23 I would rather lose a second round pick than pick 3 this will go down same as Tim Kelly deal you can sugarcoat it anyway you like but it was a terrible decision
The Eagles should go after Denver Granger barass who has been delisted by the hawks, 22 might help replenish our defensive Tall stocks
Might be on the cards!
feel like west coast should trade pick 12 + carltons future first for pick 8, unless they plan on holding everything for a chad warner mega offer next year
Could we try future 1st for some tigers or a very high tiger pick like 6 or 10, 18. I feel like helping tigers and the connects with tigers surely they help us out since we have helped them?
worth a try but not sure a future hawks first will entice richmond to give us anything other than 18. This is the draft to be in not next years, we played our hand already and we lost
I recon our future 2nd and hawks future 2nd for pick 24 and tigers future 3rd would be a win for both parties.
@@mickw1842 maybe our future 1st plus a future 2nd or 3rd for 6 this year or 10 and a 2nd from tigers?
It amazes me why we didn’t ask Richmond for pick 6 and baker and let a F3 go back to Richmond . They were always going to get pick 6 for Rioli
It’s clear that the Eagles recruitment team recognise the need for mature bodies that can support our young midfield.
Overall, they have identified that an immediate improvement is needed. I’m sure they have factored in recruiting a gun inside mid that will take 3-5 years to develop, and perhaps that wasn’t quite what they were looking for.
Time will tell if this will work out for them, however, I think many have been butt hurt by their own egos with thoughts of being robbed by rival clubs. It’s horses for courses, possibly the correct play is to work on building the late to mid 20’s age bracket around a Chad Warner, Harley Reid & Elijah Hewitt midfield in 2026.
In my view this makes more sense to me than recruiting Sid Draper/Finn O’Sullivan who probably do not suit the game style the Eagles are looking to explore.
Yes lets just focus on late 20 year olds in a deep rebuild so we can rebuild again when they all retire in 4/5 years. Right so Draper O'Sullivan who have not played an AFL game are not suited to West Coasts game plan which we don't even know what it will look like yet with a new coach ? Sounds like good reasons for not having pick 3. Warner is no certainty to play for West Coast ? You do realise that ? Hewitt is no certainty to play again ? The last top 5 mid we let go Sheezel did not take 3-5 years to develop last I checked and Harley looks pretty good for a first year mid ? Lets focus on Baker and Owies though cause they are superstars, maybe we can get some magic beans too
Hoping pick 3 isn’t the next g ablett or Judd 🤞
I think the pick 3 deal is seriously bad take out Harley Reid having ginbey as your best talent after finishing in the bottom 4 for the last 3 years is pretty terrible, im interested in your overall thoughts because owies and baker will improve your team in 2025 but in 3 years time how bad is this going to do to the rebuild overall your under 23 is very concerning and your midfield is just as bad if yeo doesn’t play like he did last year I can’t see you’s winning any midfielder battles at all
Also adding to this after the year west coast has had u guys will probably get allen out of this draft which u compare that to the other 3 teams at the bottom that is depressing
Ginbey ain’t even that good aswell from what I’ve seen
I think ginbey has been played out of position. He has the potential to be an elite half back. Hewett this season will be like a new signing. A lot of our youth is underated because they are playing in a bad team - hough, long, dewar, Johnson, maric, j williams and Hutchison are all excellent in addition to the obvious talents like Reid, ginbey and Hewett.
@@drdc22 Now we have traded in oldies Graham, Owies and Baker, some of that youth you mention, will struggle to get games. Hutchison in particular looked good in midfield against Geelong, how will he get regular games now ? Johnson Dewar ditto, it looks all round bad. It might prop us up in the short term but when Yeo, McGovern Kelly retire I actually think we might have extended our rebuild even longer.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c they aren't old and this is not a bad thing to let the young guys get more seasoning in the wafl. I think more likely you'll see petch, sheed, Cripps and possibly witherden propping up the wafl team, making it more competitive and accelerating the development of the youngsters there.
It would have been better for WCE to try wait until Richmond had Picks that draft hand. Coulda got pick 6 or 10
10 isn’t much better but if that was the pick you kept would it be better?
Still can
Wes t Coast were one of best teams
Baker Graham and Owies will be tough for the Eagles small forwards, Ryan, Cripps, Long, Petch, Brockman, Sheed, Hewitt, Rawlinson, Maric, Hutchinson, Dewar.
Can't believe we delisted trew and culley and paid for baker Graham and owies who are much older. Culley got 18 months ??? Very harsh.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c Yes its harsh on Culley. Won rising star nomination. Did his knee the next week and 15 months later he has gone. Culley was in the list for 2 and a half years. In 2024 played WAFL well. Only had 3 AFL games this year, in which he was average in a game and poor in others. It was clear after the Essendon game (I think) which indicated the club's thoughts. A very good tackler, but I found that he was more focused on tackling then grabbing the footy when up for grabs. I see him as a mid sized forward or defender in future.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c Trew just isn't good enough. He has had so many chances. Going forward the players will have to be crash and bang types or speed.
@@BDub2024 I did not feel as though we gave Culley or Trew proper time in the middle. Trew was often the sub and Culley barely played a game. It feels like we are relying on other clubs' players to rebuild our list rather than showing faith in our own young guys which I don't like. Don't get me wrong some de-listings I get but those 2 did not get a proper chance and now we bring in blokes much older than them. Its got to hurt our culture cutting the young home grown and importing oldies.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c Honestly Trew was very lucky to get a contract in 2024. He'd been on the list as a rookie for 3 years at the time. According to Wiley it took until about the third year until things clicked. He got games because of the number of injuries. But saying that, they did contract him in 2024 but then hardly played him until the end of the year. What's the point of giving him a fourth year if he wasn't getting a game? Anyway he ended up playing 7 games and just isn't good enough. I think they need to give more guys chances as rookies and not just keep extending guys and then delisting as 23 year olds. they're missing out on a lot of young talent by sticking with the same olds that aren't stepping up.
My only solace in all of this was that Fremantle was compelled Fremantle to pay an absurd price for Shai Bolton.
Wow pathetic mate
I know but Freo are in the window so they can afford to roll the dice and overpay, I dont think we can afford to overpay especially with Reid unsigned and Tassie coming in. Sadly we shat the bed this time
They did give up a lot there. Could look bad in the future (Kelly-esque)
@@drdc22 Perhaps but I care more about West Coast, if Freo stuff up that doesn't make me feel better about our predicament
Whilst I’m a big freo fan, hope the trades work out for yas, much better when both sides are up there, in saying that really hoping Warner lands with us and not you 🙌🏻
Cheers legend! Although no hands off Warner!!
@@TrueEagleAFL love the general footy content also cheers man
Few things to consider:
1. New coach needs some protection. Trading in some experience, albeit overpaying for it, is the right thing to do. Helps give the new coach some breathing room in terms of big losses, as well as some much needed leadership to help.
2. The draft is apparently one of the deepest in recent times (so they say). This means pick 12 is as valuable as it ever has been and is the least risky move, compared to say last year where value after pick 10 was limited. People losing their minds over trading pick 3 is actually insane. By their logic, it’s the least valuable pick 3 in a decade.
3. Barrass was always going to hawthorn. Fucking him or hawthorn over, as Pyke said, would be bad business. We played the hand we were dealt and I think the result was satisfactory. You then go on to say something along the lines of “at the end of the day, trying to ascertain what we could have done differently is difficult”. Exactly my point. No one seems to have a better answer than “should have walker baker to the draft”, which we all know was never an option.
4. Reid needs to see some experience and hard bodies to help him out and keep him happy. Baker and Graham bring this.
I will respond to in points;
1. New coach needs protection ? sounds like an excuse for the coach to act selfishly in his own interests instead of the clubs. If the new coach needs that much protection Pyke could have given him a 5 year deal instead of 3 years rather than sold pick 3 and loaded up with 27 and 28 year olds at the draft. Owies was going to be de-listed and was going for free, Baker was uncontracted, we did not need to overpay, we chose too. We already have more experience then other bottom clubs North Melbourne and Richmond, what we need is high draft picks and we will have less of them than both those clubs
2. This is where so many don't understand drafts. First of all, pick 12 wont stay pick 12 it will slide down likely to 16/17. Pick 3 will only slide to 4. Secondly, you have to know where the talent drops away in each draft to know what your giving up, you clearly dont know that if you think this pick drop is no big deal. The top 6/7 picks are all considered potential number 1's after that there is a drop, there is a further drop once you get outside the top 11/12, eagles pick around 16/17, have a look at Bo Allans numbers and highlights and compare that to a Jagger Smith, Harvey Langford, Sid Draper, there is a decent gap there we are giving up. You would know that if you followed the draft.
3. I think we agree somewhat on the Barass deal in that I am satisfied with what the eagles got for Barass, i think most eagles fans are, its the pick 3 give up for oldies that disgusts me and most eagles supporters, so lets not divert away from the main issue
4. Reid also needs not be the only elite young mid we have, that is too great a burden for him and the chances of pick 3/4 being an elite mid were fairly good, pick
Reid could have been paired with Sheezel we chose a pick split.
This year if we had of kept pick 3 we could have paired Reid with Langford/Draper/Smith but instead we will pair him with Bo Allan. Anyone who knows the draft will know what I am talking about here, there is a big difference unless Bo Allan can improve massively which is possible.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c I will re-respond to your points
1. It’s not an excuse for a selfish coach, it’s not the coaches decision for a start. It’s the club making sure he doesn’t get 12 x 100pt flogging in his first 2 years and his career is derailed by the media and nutty supporters before it even starts
2. I completely understand how the draft works, and so does the west coast list managers. In fact, they have more insight than anyone on this comments section combined. So who should you trust, your expert opinion, or theirs?
3. Agree most of the dissatisfaction is around pick 3, not Barrass. But the same principle applies, what else were we supposed to do? We wanted baker and we were prepared to pay for him.
4. Reid won’t get better by having another young bloke half his size and talent running around the midfield with him. Look at how good he and Yeo were together. Now imagine the freedom he will enjoy with Baker, Graham and Yeo all providing him with some space. Agree we need more young midfield talent to come in, but we need to get more competitive right now. Get spanked by 200pts isn’t helping anyone, except the opposition
@@kanecross
1. If the club was so concerned about 12X floggings they could have just increased the offer and kept Barass who is a better player than Baker, Owies and Graham. Anyway, it's not about protecting the coach, it's about the club, the long-term health of the club, not some short-term Band-Aid solution, do we want to be a premiership contender or do we want to be a mid-table club.
2. what so they are perfect and beyond critique because they are list managers, what rubbish, we are free to criticize poor decisions, you're a fool if you trust every so-called expert based on title
3. yes we wanted baker but we should not be prepared to pay any cost mate, it's just common sense, if I want a car it doesn't mean I am willing to pay any cost, that's just foolish reasoning, you draw a line and say this is how much I am willing to pay and you walk away if the other party is not reasonable, the eagles acted foolishly by trading away pick 3
4. You really don't follow the draft, do you? The 6-7 top picks in this years draft all are premium mids, 2 are named Langford and Smillie, Langford is 190cm, and Smillie 194cm, that's their heights measured at the beginning of this year, they are both bigger than Reid, Lalor another top 6/7 mid measured 187cm earlier this year, as big as Reid and likely will be bigger than Reid when he debuts next year, that's 3 of the top 6-7 mids all bigger than Reid, but you say they are half Reid's size, mate if you did your research on the draft you would not make false comments like this. By the way all 3 of those kids are well built tanks too not skinny kids like you suggest. last I checked we never got spanked by even 100 points this year let alone 200pts so bit of an exaggeration there hey, when you have to exaggerate and lie to make a point you know you're struggling
Yeah about jai culley…😢
Owies was getting delisted and we could of picked him up for nothing - facts we got screwed
The trade has grown on me to be honest, we could have a really nice hand next trade period and we have got better this off season so I’m somewhat excited for next season
The Barass trade went ok but it was separate from the Baker/pick 3 disaster. It doesnt make up for it. The only way we get out of jail on this sh*t show is if pick 16/17 can be a superstar, it seems unlikely but its possible. We also still need Hewett's body to come right and Ginbey to come on more to justify giving up Sheezel. its been a tough few years.
Owies kicking 50 goals in 2 years
60!
do you think Owies will kick as many goals for west coast as he did for Carlton ?
Opinions are always subjective, for example, I hate Tayler Swift music, yet others love her music, that's just one example. What you talk about on your channel is subjective and your opinion. With social media, we hardly see any mature discussions these days. Just do you mate, your a decent content creator.
Should have put pick 3 away and not even had it available. If we kept pick 3 and next year have all Hawks picks.
I think it’s hard to take the emotion out of this situation. We probably got close to fair value for TB (still wish it was two firsts but I accept we got a good deal). We definitely paid overs for Baker and Owies however we can only judge this trade on how good pick 3 goes and who we pick. I think there is clearly a plan for next year either the get Warner or back to the draft. I think we have a decent core of kids but not everyone has performed. We had a hole and we’ve tried to fill it
I think if pick 3 ended up a dud it would just mean we go lucky rather than any genius of our list managers. Most pick 3's end up much stronger than a pick 15/16. Plus we dont know that we would have picked the same player at 3 as Carlton will. That said we can look at the past and quickly realise that its not a good idea to trade out of the top 5 too often and AFL history is littered with champions who come from the top 5 of draft pools.
I’m happy for the players we got but we could have had all them and pick 3 Pyke and Clarke need to stop making excuses for there stuff up last CEO Trevor wouldn’t allow this mess
In the short term these guys will be great for the team and will help the development of the younger guys. No one will know if pick 3 was worth it until years on. No one knows. You could get a Chris Judd, or a Paddy Dow.
That is true but your far more likely to get a Judd from pick 3/4 than pick 16/17. Just look at the difference between Sheezel and Ginbey and thats only 3 - 9.
In my imaginary perfect world, you return to this trade period 12 months from now and talk about how well it ended up being and how competitive the eagles were for the 2025 season. Nothing crazy, maybe finishing around 9th/10th. Carlton and Richmond finish below us.
But back in the modern times, I think people are putting too much stock on Reid as our sole champion. He's a great payer, but great players need great teams around them. Judd and Cuzzy were great players but they DID have a great team around them. No team with a single stand out player has ever won a premiership *cough* freo *cough*. We need players in the team who can support the kids. I'm sure there is plenty of talent in the top 10 drafts picks, but are we that desperate for anyone in particular? Are are we just needing to backfill the youth?
Judd was pick 3, naitanui was pick 2. Reid was pick 1. Kennedy was pick 4. Gaff was pick 4. top 5 picks usually make it and many become elite.
It's wired but I do look at the pick 3 trade as a whole it's not great but when you break it down it's not bad at all. Pick 3 for 12 & 14 is fair value especially for a club that needs good quality youth coming through it's a good trade every year and a really good trade in such a deep draft. Owies for JD is a good trade for us. The pick we got for JD we used to get Owies with our 4th round and got a fourth back. We have a lot of KPF not many small forwards.
The deal falls apart with the baker trade for 14. But it is what it is it's a loss on our end but not a huge loss there is value in getting a kid and an experience player. Can argue about was is it worth it. That just arguing around the edges.
I don't think the hawks seriously had 14 on the table it wasn't a serious offer. So if 14 wasn't on the board then how do we get it done. I don't mind how it played out maybe getting a second or third back for baker but again it's just around the edges.
I think the hawks dropped the ball over TB if the hawks took the 2 first rounders and a second back would have left them in a better position than what they gave up. The look of 2 first rounders sounds big but it's 2 later first round picks. Had the hawks traded 14 to the blues kept the second round pick they got for that trade and took our 2024 early second round pick then they would have 4 second round picks one of them early instead of one late first round pick and 2 later second round picks and no future 3rd.
I think Cripps keeps his spot Owies can back up Cripps until Cripps drops form/ gets injured or retires. But that just me.
I love true eagle and true footy it's true it's true
You think giving away pick 3 in a deep rebuild in a stronger than usual draft for players who will be either well past their prime or retired when we challenge again is not bad at all ??? Eagles enter the draft at 12 which drifts to 16/17 and then the next pick wont be till around 30, Eagles finished 3rd last, you would expect to have a strong draft hand finishing so low but no. I think people with your thoughts have a lack of understanding on how the draft works, higher picks equal greater chance of success, the pick drop from 3 (sliding to 4) to 12 (sliding to 16) is a massive drop, I dont think many who are positive on this understand the difference. For perspective Eagles gave up Sheezel/Wardlaw for Ginbey/Hewett which was actually a better trade than this one, so far Ginbey is nowhere near either of those players and he was pick 9, Hewett is suffering from debilitating injuries and may not even make it as an AFL player. When a draft is strong the top 5 are usually mostly very good to elite, this is what I think people are not understanding here. Yes you can get decent outside top 10 too but it becomes more hit and miss. What happens if Harley Reid leaves, how many top 5 picks will we have to show for 3 bottom 3 finishes ? the answer is 0 - how does that sound to eagles fans, not too bad at all ?
@@user-ln8we1ud9c I don't think you understand how list building works or how the draft works or took 2 seconds to read what I said.
Pick 3 for pick 12 & 14 is good in a deep draft. Yes that is good we can get 2 players instead of one. Two firsts rounders rather than 1. Why care if Reid leaves we will get great draft picks for him plus when building a list you need more than 1 player.
How good was the pick 2 Shezzel for Ginbey and Hewett. If Hewett never plays again we still end up with a bloody good player. Could you imagine if we picked wardlaw missed on Ginbey and Hewett and wardlaw injured his foot and couldn't play again. See, see how getting extra players is beneficial in a rebuild. If you followed the draft prospects there is no Harley Reid quality kid in this draft and we only had pick 3. So in a deep draft 2 players in the middle of the first round instead of one pick. We have spread the risk. It would be disastrous for us if we picked a player who was a bust, injured just a meh player. Then how do we look after all this bottoming out Reid leaves and pick 3 is a bust. Then how do we look. How far behind would we be if that happened?
The Baker part was the problem and a different story like I said but you conveniently left that out. We swapped Owies for JD helps the age bracket a little but most importantly position gap more than age gap.
3 for 12 & 14 in a deep draft is good if you can't see that then you have huge gaps in your knowledge on list building.
@@joshhowie7657 But we did not trade pick 3 for 12-14 we traded it for 12 and Baker and Owies 🙄, and 12 slides further then 3 because the further you go down the draft the greater the slide. The greater the slide down the draft your picking from the less chance you pick a champion, this is facts mate and 3/4 down to 16/17 is a huge drop. Whose the bloody good player we got for giving up Sheezel 🤣 can you name them ? I would have been happy to get either Wardlaw or Sheezel and given up Ginbey and Hewett, they both had far superior junior football careers and now have better afl careers. Why care if Reid leaves ??? the fact your asking that shows your lack of knowledge. We dont have pick 14 in this draft we traded it for a 27year old 🤣😂.
@@user-ln8we1ud9c jumping and jiving now aren't we. Because I isolated the pick 3 for 12 & 14 and that on its own was not bad at all. I clearly explained that if falls apart with trading pick 14 for baker. It's poor form to flip and flop like that just to try and save face.
The bloody good player is Ginbey, maybe not elite but he played well in his first year during when playing as main inside mid in a skeleton midfield during an injury ravaged side. This year he played more on the outside and he didn't shine at all. Small glimpses but not great at all But then his last month and a half off the halfback he was awesome he is going to be a bloody good player. Not sure how Hewett turns out but if he turns into an average player averaging 18-20 touches a game then both Ginbey and Hewett will be better than just 1 Shezzel or wardlaw.
The whole sooking about the pick sliding is so overblown. The players getting picked aren't available to anyone not just us but everyone who isn't the FS or academy club. So sooking is just a waste of time.
But getting back to getting Baker for 14 is definitely overs for him but not by much we can only deal with the cards we are dealt.
But it goes back to the topic before what if pick 3 is a bust then you have missed out. Yes you are right you have a better chance of getting a gun at 3 then you will at 12 and if 12 is a bust then we have a reliable solid player in Baker. Yes it's overs but I'm not denying that never did. We started the trade period with 3, 26 and something in the 60s.
We left with pick 12, 26, 70 something Baker Graham Owies 2 first rounders next year 2 second rounders next year and 2 third rounders next year
And it only cost us pick 3, 60 something TB & JD and another pick in the 60s
Could it have been better yeah a bit was it worth it yes we are now set up for a strong draft hand next year or trade back into this year's draft or make a play for Warner. Non of that possible with the trading out pick 3
@@joshhowie7657 Ginbey is still young so he could end up decent but right now a bloody good player Ginbey really ? That is delusional. You know nothing about football, calling Ginbey a bloody good player in the here and now is just a ridiculous thing to say. I am hoping he can become a bloody good player but most people who understand football know he is far from that. Then you even say Ginbey is maybe not elite. I think being unrealistic is a waste of time, deluding yourself into thinking it doesnt matter if Reid leaves, Ginbey is a bloody good player. I get being optimistic but not to the point of being unrealistic and delusional. Pick 12, 26 and 70 is pathetic for a team that finished 3rd last and gave away picks for old blokes, its the draft hand of a finalist not a rebuilding team.
And yeah, you're a good person Jesse, at no point have I ever thought you were being vitriolic towards a player or players, if anything you go out of your way to consider the welfare of players and staff alike in AFL.
Thank you Samantha
Eagles left the trade period like an up and coming rapper leaving a Diddy party.
LOL I didn't expect a Diddy joke in my comments
"we're a good club", we have actually been a historically bad club over the past 3 years. We were a great club, now people laugh when I say I support the eagles lol
Lol. I can't actually argue with that. But we have been this low before. 2008-2010 was very bleak.
I'm ok with the trades, we may have given up good picks, but from what I've heard from the West Coast list manager, fair enough, you have to deal with other clubs in good faith.
perhaps we should just give away our first selections in every draft from now on to uphold good faith then ?
I understand people being disappointed in trades, but acting aggressive to people not acceptable. Completely fine with calls for people involved to lose their jobs.
It’s all only speculation of what’s right what’s should or shouldn’t of happened is just one massive bottomless pit and after all only time can tell 🦅🦅 GO THE EAGLES 2025
patrick cripps went 13, lochie neal 58, gary abblett 40, pick 12 could be anything, the trade blends the list too help our midfield yeo and kelly need that blend we could a jump up the ladder. but still not the greatest trade ever made!!!!!
true but its harder to get champions the further you slide down the draft, again lack of understanding shown here, we wont pick at 12, our pick will slide out to 16/17, drafts are more compromised these days then when P Cripps was drafted
@@user-ln8we1ud9c the draft has been noted as strong top 30 even has been the word used alot again coming back to original comment definitely think relies on the club to spot talent Matt Clark found alot of good talent in his time hopefully there's a star just waiting to be found but again no matter were you draft number it doesn't mean your going to make it in the AFL look how many top ten picks get delisted brander is a fine example for west coast!!!!!
It can be summed up in three words. Worst. Trades. Ever.
Agreed. If I'm Harley Reid I'm seriously considering leaving now.
@@user-ln8we1ud9cinstead, you are just a fool
Baker is overrated he butchers the ball his highlights reel is just pressure and tackles...should of kept pick 3 some skilful young kids jagger draper in the draft🤷🤷🤷🤷
People that aren't outraged don't grasp how bad this trade is.. they'll find out soon enough. After a few more wooden spoons they will suddenly be outraged too.
Most fans dont understand the draft, how it works, they seem to think its all a lottery, I mean it is possible to get judd at 60 and a dud at 1 but the chances of that happening are so dam slim, H Reid was pick 1 last year and how good is he ? who was the last guy picked in the draft last year, I dont know either
We won't be wooden spooners with Richmond around
WC Big Footy and Fakebook groups are littered with bootlickers who think they know their ish but don't. They're always playing apologist for the club, excusing their ineptitude, spinning negatives into positives and rationalizing blatant f' up's. The average WC supporter would rather hear sweet sounding lies than the cold harsh truth. This is evidenced by the many calls that denounce the "bedwetters," and the endless cries to discuss only the positives, not the negatives. This is why I have no respect for the happy clapper brigade. They make for the most moronic of supporters. They're incapable of holding the club to account for their unbelievable stupidity. It's misguided loyalty.
It's also the case that the supporters that get dogpiled by the happy clapping seals turn out to be correct in many cases. Their against the grain views are the ones that I appreciate, even if I don't always agree with them or agree in entirely. The so-called "bedwetters" proved to be correct, yet not 12 hours after the monumentally disastrous Baker trade were the bootlickers back to their putting everything into the spin cycle with their typical white washing. I despise the bootlickers, they're cretins.
@@lucasdecle they have 8 1st round picks and they cut the fat. Are you sure?
WC Big Footy and Fakebook groups are littered with bootlickers who think they know their ish but don't. They're always playing apologist for the club, excusing their ineptitude, spinning negatives into positives and rationalizing blatant f' up's. The average WC supporter would rather hear sweet sounding lies than the cold harsh truth. This is evidenced by the many calls that denounce the "bedwetters," and the endless cries to discuss only the positives, not the negatives. This is why I have no respect for the happy clapper brigade. They make for the most moronic of supporters. They're incapable of holding the club to account for their unbelievable stupidity. It's misguided loyalty.
It's also the case that the supporters that get dogpiled by the happy clapping seals turn out to be correct in many cases. Their against the grain views are the ones that I appreciate, even if I don't always agree with them or agree in entirely. The so-called "bedwetters" proved to be correct, yet not 12 hours after the monumentally disastrous Baker trade were the bootlickers back to their putting everything into the spin cycle with their typical white washing.
To start the trade period with pick 3 and the obvious 12 from Hawthorn as part of the Barrass trade and end up with pick 12 and Baker,Owies (Could’ve got in the pre season draft for NOTHING) and Graham (Who’s injury prone) and future picks (In the hope of getting Warner next season) is an unmitigated disaster if Warner doesn’t come because they need to be better NOW??!
The main reason (aside from his contract) that Carlton got rid of Owies was his lack of pressure up forward
Is that the case? I won't pretend to be an Owies expert. With his pace there's no reason he can't be so hopefully he makes that a focus