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Thanks lance, great review as always. Please stick to the in depth format, I know you were contemplating it a while ago but this is so much better than the usual “reviews” on TH-cam. A good comparison to the Mara is the Lelit Elizabeth which is a dual boiler with steam boiler prebrew for the same price as the Mara. It’s also more energy efficient and I’m debating the choice between the two.
about the slow ramp up on the pressure at the beginning you just need to change the spring inside the three way selonoid valve after that you have the full control of the pressure from first second to end of the shot.
About the high temperatures. This is because the machine goes to super heat mode right after the first shot. It will overheat the coffee once you wait too long, if you want to pull head to head shots. Thus to not overheat, you will need to pull the next shot after two minutes from your previous shot. If you wait longer than 5 minutes the machine will overheat. Then you will need to wait 15 minutes before the temperature level goes back down. Kaffeemacher found that one out they also have a great TH-cam channel…
I wish there was somewhere in the USA to buy this machine for the $1400 you qouted instead of $1800... I continue to be dissapointed by how wildly marked up most machines are in North America. It's one thing when we're talking saturated group flagships, but these E61s aren't on that level. Just all the more reason for Americans to buy a Decent, back machines like the Argos and Meticulous, and generally consider these massively marked up E61s something more like a last resort I guess.
The temperature drops , because you are on brew mode and the heating element is off , and when you have the flow control closed, the machine pulls fresh cold water in the hx brew chamber .
Great video as usual Lance. I almost pulled the trigger on the MaraX a year ago but the V3 Bianca was too good to pass up. I’m glad you reviewed both the MaraX and Bianca because it really validated my purchase and my research process. The tear down was mind blowing and I learned more about a HX in one video than I have in a dozen others. Maybe you could tear down a dual boiler next? 😬
I was thinking about Bianca, but just don’t see any benefit of flow control, other features… once you master gaggia classic pro. All those ‘extra’ features are just noise. For me, I pull the perfect espresso shot with just 9 bar spring upgrade, wdt tool, shake prep, right grind, etc…that’s where the money is at. Gaggia does have quite few plastic components inside and that would be one of the main reason for an upgrade-better components, not necessarily a better shot :) Oh yeah, I would rather invest the difference between Bianca and marax into eureka libra grinder.
I love the full nerd deep dive. Please never stop doing you, your passion comes out big time in all the technical details and it’s so interesting to learn about the innovations happening under the hood! Out of curiosity, any plans to review a londinium r24? Would really love to hear your take on the spring lever
what a great timing for the video. I just got my MaraX 2 days ago. I am still in the learning stage and debugging phase but I got answers to most of my questions in your video. Thank you! I am playing with the grind size as currently I am only reaching 4 bars in pressure and the flow is extremely fast. I tried the blind basket the pump is working as it should so it is definitely the grind....but I am getting there. One thing which was a surprise for me that when it is heating it is hot almost everywhere and when it stops heating it stays hot for hours :D
Great point about the HX issues with thermal management when the machine has been on for too long. I have an ECM mechanika slim (the current one) and I deliberately leave the eco mode on to avoid it overheating. 👌
That would be also my idea. Plus: Adding a E61 temperature sensor ('Eric's thermometer') to understand the behavior of machine. Maybe not all the time, but from time to time. Also helps to detect changes over time, e. g. due to build up of scale in the HX
It was mostly because it got depressing in there at night. 98% of my time in the studio is not filming but testing at night. A big part was actually for my own sanity
Thank you for showing the inside of this machine. Two things I have been asking for Stainless Steel and Copper element. So many videos don't show this or they don't know what is inside. And they never talk about high-temperature boiler applications, three general grades (Stainless Steel), 304, 321, and 347, are the most widely used. Know ones about this! I have to go directly to the MF.
Chrome, brass, copper, and stainless steel. What's not to love? The mechanical isolation of the vibratory pump is a nice touch. This is a little mod that can be made to cheap machines for quieter operation.
The best review of the Lelit MaraX!👍 The Mara X was for one year my Espresso machine and working great over this time. After I give her away and buy the Dual Boiler Rocket R Nine One.
What a great review! I have always had the flow control kit on my mara x v2, but I couldn't ever figure out how to even use it properly. Thanks for explaining this. I noticed that when you pulled your first shot, the temperature was still getting stable cause the temp lights were blinking. Also, while pulling back to back shots, I've found that turning the machine off, and while i get my puck prep done and turning back on when i finish, still build the temp back up pretty quick, while ive not confirmed if it has been increasing temperature, ive always never felt the coffee taste different.
Thank you for doing such a thorough review- your videos have really helped me. I’d love to see reviews on grinders priced 1000-2000. I’m looking to upgrade from my current one because I’m frustrated with it.
Hi Lance, great video! Thanks for that. One remark though, the effect of the knob positions on the right hand side are opposite of what you mentioned in the video. Position 1 is brew mode and position 0 is steam mode.
Very good detailed video, not seen anywhere other! 👏 As an owner of stock v2 it came a bit cold about the 90 degrees, all shots taste badly sour. So i decided to set 92 as reference.
I like the new studio look. The long locks are looking quite luscious too. You have a bit of a younger-Ron-Jeremy look going on… respect. Love your content.
First of all thank you so much for this in depth review. 👏🏻 However, How We can trust heat exchanger models in terms of temperature stability after that. I definetly face forward to dual boiler machines.
Great video and a thorough walkthrough, Lance! Thanks for that, but damn, I was about to pull the trigger on a profitec pro400, especially after seeing whole latte love‘s video on it where it seemed to have great thermal stability after a short flush. After seeing this video and your words on HX machines I’m rethinking it again…the pro400 seems really well built though and it has a real preinfusion mode. Also, I have a profitec dealer and repair shop nearby, so I might still go for it if they convince me. Tough decision…
This isn't really modified. The temp sensor and pressure sensor do absolutely nothing to the coffee. They simply give me readings. The flow control is the only mod. And I discuss the machine as if it didn't have a mod. And I pull a shot without using it. This js essentially out of the box if you pay attention.
Lance, this video was amazing. I was looking at a Quickmill Silvano Evo because it is a single boiler with a PID and has a separate thermoblock for steaming. For that extra temp control, do you think an HX (like the mara x) or a higher end single boiler is better? THANKS FOR THE KILLER CONTENT!
Had this machine for over two years and it normally doesnt over heat after a few hours. Once every three months or so the temperature can idle att a temperature about 2-3C too high, then I either just flush a couple of dl from the tap or do a descaling and after that the problem is solved.
Thanks, Lance, for a thoughtful review. I am unclear what mods you did to the machine and would have preferred a review of the out-of-box machine. A PID heat controller properly programmed should have been able to prevent the heat increasing over time. Cheers!
I didn't do any mods that mean anything. The parts in the group head are strictly to help showcase what I'm doing. It doesn't affect performance. The flow control Mod is the most commonly used mod on e61 platforms. But even with that, I show a shot example without using it. So, no worries.
Hi Lance... Once again great review. U know I almost bought this machine but after watching your review I may have second thoughts. What would u recommend at this similar price point? Hope to hear from u! 😊
I am a MaraX owner, it is possible to lift the lever enough to allow water into the puck for preinfusion without triggering the switch that actuates the pump. I use this technique to preinfuse lighter roasts
@@LanceHedrick True but it still preinfuses the puck and sets the stage for a more gentle ease in of pressure which is noticeably better to prevent the evil channeling monster :D
@Kurt Paris maybe. It doesn't see much pressure at all do its moreso the.top part saturating. Arguably could be worse for the puck. Would be better off filling fast and shunting flow with needle valve.
@@LanceHedrick i find this hard to picture since there is quite a bit of dripping evenly through the puck happening which i don't think corresponds to just the top getting saturated. Tomorrow morning I'll see if any pressure is registered. When you installed the needle valve did you also change the springs in the group head?
@@LanceHedrick You are correct, there is no noticeable pressure buildup - however, especially once the machine is hot there is a fair amount of flow. I did some tests with just opening the lever (no pump) and pulsing the motor to keep < 2bar of pressure and then stopped the shot before extraction. In both cases when i was digging through the puck it was fully saturated with water (takes anywhere from 20-40s for flow to appear through the puck)
Hi Lance, as a marax owner i really enjoyed your video, the best review I've seen so far. Unfortunately for the last 2 years I've had some issues with the machine which needed to be fixed under warranty... At the end i guess you were referring to dual boiler machines. Which models do you recommend at this (or below) price range?
Actually I prefer the Gaggia classic pro. That's why I bring up tinkering. If you do the gaggiuino mod, the thing is built well with all stock parts. Can have an insane machine for $650
@@LanceHedrick I actually had a Gaggia classic. It was incredibly reliable but no temp control and i steam alot for milk drinks so it is not for me. Maybe lelit Elizabeth could be a better option
Hey Lance! Great video! We all know you also love the BDB. Since the Mara X and the BDB are around the same price, which do you think is superior for temp stability (since the BDB has a PID)?
Hi Lance, thanks for this detailed video. Where I live, the Mara X is maybe 5-10% cheaper than Breville Dual Boiler. I like Mara X for the smaller footprint and look, but the Dual Boiler is easier to manage when it comes to temperature it seems. Which machine would you recommend?
As the video progressed, it was a back and forth. I want this machine, Maybe not, I want this, maybe not. I think for me, maybe. One quad latte in the AM. Then a Cappuccino or straight espresso in the pm and the increase of heat over time would not be an issue.
Lance, I have the new MaraX V2. The brew and steam mode buttons are completely different to yours. The brew mode ramps up the steam pressure after the shot, while the steam mode ramps up the pressure during the shot. Both, at idle, will not be turning on the steam heating element. So if you come back after 30 minutes, in either mode, it will be ready to brew. This is really confusing because you have a white MaraX so I assume it's quite new? Mine didnt't even have an updated manual. But you definitely can't set it to act like a normal HX machine.
I have to wonder if maybe Lance's review machine is defective. The group does overheat (beyond the temp set point) after about 4-5 minutes of pulling the last shot in steam mode, but it cools back to idle in 15 minutes, unless you flush it down. This temp cycling has been discussed exhaustively in many forums, as well as Dave Corbey's review, albeit on V1, but the V1X-mode is very similar to the steam mode of V2.
Hi Lance, I do own this machine and I do not have the issue you describe that the machine overheats after it sits for too long. It is known that the Mara X starts overheating 3-4 minutes after you pull the last shot, but settles down to the adjusted temperature 15-20 mins later. This can be awkward, since you cannot wait more than these 3-4 minutes when pulling back-to-back shots or the temp will be too high. Other than that, it really is a great machine.
@@LanceHedrick I have a thermal probe in the service thread you use as well (hope that‘s what it‘s called…), so yes. Also, I have confirmation about this directly from Lelit (about the overheating and settling down), but mine definitely settles. I have it on most of the time and I can normally walk up to it and pull a shot at around 92-93 (I‘m at setting 1, brew prio obviously…)
@Peter very interesting. I'm curious how deep your probe goes? Mine is about 4 inches long. I tested not only with the probe but a scace, so well. Perhaps its because mine wasn't completely idle. I'd actuate the flip or something. But regardless, every time I hit that 2 hour mark of shot pulling, it'd shoot up
@@LanceHedrick Hey Lance, I don't think mine goes in so deep. I have the E61 group head thermometer from Coffee Sensor. However, I also don't think the difference between yours and mine will be significant. I never got to pull shots for 2 hours straight, so I cannot attest to that behaviour. However, the machine definitely SHOULD stabilize after roughly 15-20 minutes after the overheating phase. The overheating phase is necessary to keep the temperature stable for consecutive shots.
@Peter perhaps it should, but it doesn't ha! Same with their Bianca. They have a new feature of temp offset to allow changes in shot temp mid shot. I proved that to be untrue. I think it's a nice idea but hard to execute with a hunk of brass and a HX
When you are pointing to something, please let us first see you pointing to the thing in the wide shot, THEN go to the B-roll of the close up shot. Otherwise I am hunting about in the B-roll what I am supposed to be looking at. Thanks.
Hi Lance! Thanks for the great review. Is the power button on this machine a momentary switch or a toggle switch? I use a wifi-enabled plug to turn on my machine in the morning, so the power button needs to be a toggle switch to ensure the wifi plug can actually turn the machine on!
Kevin, I have a Mara X hooked to a WiFi power strip and it works great. I leave the button toggled “on” all the time and just use the WiFi or my smart assistant to turn things on.
Thanks for the video, it manifested my love for the mara x. I´m thinking about upgrading to the v2 gicar box for the new improved brew and steam mode. I find it interesting that the machine heats up over time so much. The v1 does not do so, on temperature setting I it stays on 93-94° the whole time… At least the bottom temperature sensor says so, which you can easily read out with an Arduino. I wonder if the temperature for the brew is actually higher, did u have the corresponding data from the gicar box itself after 2 hours? Or did the temp only spike at the lowest settings?
I have the Mara v2 and temps seem to stay stable over longer periods without issue. Granted I don't have the flow control mod and only have one of those cheapish temp probs installed above the group. Maybe you got sent a dud Lance or could the flow control mod be affecting temps??
Is this machine designed for home usage? I just can’t wrap my head around incorporating a morning espresso routine where you have to wait 20-25 minutes just for the machine to heat up.
most high end heat exchangers machines use counter flow such as all Cimbali machines including the Junior , its more expensive but a much better design!
Nobody is doing such high quality and informative videos, nobody! not even Pappy Hoffy. This is stupid good, and producers would pay big $$ for something like this. This is an in depth review, with all the details, and data. Nothing hidden or stupid music transitions.
Well, though I know youre giving our bruh some love, there is Xris, Real Sprometheus, Ms. Eckroft, Hoffman and others doing high quality content too in the barista space too
@@DJ_BROBOT I just watched Hoffman’s review of the best machines for 1500 or less and his “review” of the Mara X when he got to it, was pitiful. He skipped almost everything interesting about this machine but took the time to mention the feet… then moved on to talk fluff about the next machine. Very disappointing. However I haven’t searched his videos to see if he ever did a better review of it.
I agree that the video is very extensive, however most people who buy or intend to buy such a machine will not put on paddle for flow control and pull some complicated shots with light roast coffee. It would have been more helpful if the measurements and instructions were done with the machine as it comes and not with the installed modifications.
Hi Lance, thanks for making this in dept review! I’ve been seriously considering on buying this over the past couple of weeks, but I didn’t expect your conclusion. I’m wondering what other machine(s) you would consider buying instead of the Mara X for the same budget?
The thought, care and genuine willingness to inform the consumer in an unbiased fashion continues to amaze me. I’ve commented before and I’ll comment again, thank you!
Great and thorough review as always! I loved every minute of it. I would be curious to see you review one of the Profitec HX lineup. I guess the 400 would make the more sense because it is very similar to the MaraX. Have you ever played around with Profitec machines?
Thanks a lot for this very interesting video and your insight. I'm a Mara X owner and have built in the thermometer in the grouphead but no flow control. My machine turns on at 5am. I make espressos at 6am 1pm and 3pm without turning the machine off inbetween and the eco mode off. The thermometer shows exactly 92.2°C ever single time when i step at the machine after idle for several hours, literally without exception. During the shot, the temperature shows 94.6°C every time, which results in 92°C in the portafilter, as tests have shown. I wonder where the instability comes from after idle time with your machine. Is it possibly because of the flow control? I actually forgot to turn off the machine today after 3pm, walked at the machine at 11pm and it showed 92.2°C. It seems to be incredibly consistent to me. I'm in brew mode ond temperature level I btw. The only inconsistency I notice is a high temperature around 15min after i pull a shot or s temperature drop if i pull back to back within the same minute without giving the machine a 2min break. Other than that, it seems to settle at exactly 92.2°C again.
@@erihsehc2 I have the V1 of the Mara X on the what was then called "brew mode" which is the exact same mode that is called "steam mode" on V2, so yes.
Got the Mara today, but the Water Tank Sensor Switch does not work. The little pin under the water tank does not reach to the micro switch. Only, when I press down the tank manually, it clicks. Getting my hands away from the tank, it releases the switch and the machine shows: no tank.. Anybody else with this problem?
Btw, someone may have mentioned but it seems like you have power saving mode turned off. That obviously helps with the temperature spiking if left on, as it will hibernate at some point, essentially turning the system off, but ready to be turned back on (after any needed warmup) with the lift of the paddle. Since power saving mode is on by default I thought I'd mention it (and you may get to this later in the video!)
Am I the only one who after all the 4/1 stuff came here expecting a joke only to find another thoughtful, deeply researched and meticulously crafted video? I guess the real jokes were the friends we made along the way... Great work guys!!
My test shows me that you on brew mode , you need to pull up the lever for 1-2 seconds( heating flash), to wake up the machine, to reach 1.5 bars. When 1.5 bars reached, then you brew!
I have a 250ml single boiler Lelit Anna with PID and I love it. Added preinfusion / flow control using your Gaggia classic mod video as a reference for the wiring. I couldn’t justify spending twice as much on the Mara X just to save the minute the Anna takes to come up to steam temp which is the biggest difference I could tell.
This is the most indepth review on the internet of a very relevant HX machine. I am highly interested in this machine, thank you for doing this review.
I have had the Mara X for 2 years without the flow control and it produces great coffee day in, day out for 6 to 8 coffees a day... Cannot rexxomend this machine enough for the value it provides
Hey Lance, I've been waiting for your review on Marax. Also amazed that you mentioned the reduced flow rate of the machine. So I wanted to ask you, considering the reduced flow rate (5ml/sec) and the slow ramp up (10 sec), does that mean that the recommended brewing time should be longer than the normal 25-30 seconds?
I am on the wait list for a Profitec GO. It looks to be closest to a Gaggia if you did every mod, without looking Frankenstein or relying on my abilities to do the work. ($1000) I make 1-2 cappuccinos daily. This will be my first pro-sumer machine I appreciate your reviews and espresso theory youtubes. I watched Everything before I settled on the Profitec GO, and would value your opinion before I commit.
Just my 2 Cents as a consumes that wants most bang for my buck. If I would have under 1000 to spend, after ALOT of Research, the go would be by choice. Seems like nothing will beat it at this price point
You say at this price point that there are other models that you would recommend. I am curious at what your recommendations are. What is the best home espresso machine between $1000-2000?
Hey Lance! Thank you for this video, it was very informative! I was looking to buy the Mara X v2, but now im curious to hear what you would recommend for this price range? As you said you would buy something else over the mara x. Thank you !
The temp drops because this machine is setup with perfect flow at stock setup to inject enough thermal energy into the large mass of brass to maintain the programmed temperature curve. When you choke the hot water you choke the heat input into that huge block of metal and the temp must fall as a result. Other machines may behave differently because they are limited by the heating elements power output so reducing flow helps the heat rise. But here we have a very large thermal mass in the boiler cushioned via a heat exchanger, thus providing a very stabile source, choking it does not spike the it high at source but it does reduce what goes into that huge cool block of brass at the front, without enough heat input into the brass the temp falls. Amazing thermal design and construction quality. I'm a heating engineer and I recognise the fittings and construction methods used here to be top notch. Solid old school hydronic design, its been tried and true since steam engines ruled and looks similar in rocket engines that go to space today, good old compression fittings, soldered connections and formed metal pipes. Boilers a boiler weather, its heating a hospital or coffee cup. We use the same sensors and prv valves.
Hi, I'm planning to buy this. I usually make a latte with dark roast beans. So if i set the PID at low, in brew mode, can i still froth my milk at that setting? or should i switch to steam mode or set to high the PID. Just the thought of it stresses me. You're answer will help a lot with my decision. Thanks, Lance!
I'm still crossing my fingers for an Ascaso Steel review just because I love their aesthetic, and the fact that they're NOT an e61, but I'm still here because you're always fun to listen to.
These videos are super insightful! I would love to see a comparison of heat exchangers and thermal blocks. Maybe this Lelit vs the Ascaso Steel Duo soon? 🙏🙏🙏
Great review Lance, so much better than the typical sales-driven stuff that is so ubiquitous on YT. I have had an old-school, non-E61, pressurestat-driven HX (with an electrically heated brewhead) for 10 years, which at the time of purchase was about the smallest machine in its class on the market. The MaraX is even more compact, but with so much stuff in a small casing, how would you rate its maintain-ability? Do you have to take out all the internal parts when you want to, say, change out the pump?😊
The small footprint was a big factor in my choice of the MaraX 2 1/2 years ago, as was the expected longevity and ease of repair. The internals are very accessible simply by removing the casing (which is also easy). Changing the pump would be simple.
I would also consider the new ECM Mechanica IV slim. Same tech as the Profitech 400 Pro, plus all additional innovations from ECM. If you get a Heritage Line version, it’s an absolute masterpiece for the price.
@@nikitasheremetov5011 : If you talk about ECM Mechanika VI Slim, this one has an 1,9 liter boiler instead of Pro 400 1,6 liter. Whether that's a good or bad (slightly higher energy consumption?), I can't tell
Let's chat below! Ask any questions that may pop up. And don't forget to hit like, subscribe, and the bell for notifications to show some support! Cheers!
Thanks lance, great review as always. Please stick to the in depth format, I know you were contemplating it a while ago but this is so much better than the usual “reviews” on TH-cam.
A good comparison to the Mara is the Lelit Elizabeth which is a dual boiler with steam boiler prebrew for the same price as the Mara. It’s also more energy efficient and I’m debating the choice between the two.
about the slow ramp up on the pressure at the beginning you just need to change the spring inside the three way selonoid valve after that you have the full control of the pressure from first second to end of the shot.
About the high temperatures. This is because the machine goes to super heat mode right after the first shot. It will overheat the coffee once you wait too long, if you want to pull head to head shots. Thus to not overheat, you will need to pull the next shot after two minutes from your previous shot. If you wait longer than 5 minutes the machine will overheat. Then you will need to wait 15 minutes before the temperature level goes back down. Kaffeemacher found that one out they also have a great TH-cam channel…
I wish there was somewhere in the USA to buy this machine for the $1400 you qouted instead of $1800... I continue to be dissapointed by how wildly marked up most machines are in North America. It's one thing when we're talking saturated group flagships, but these E61s aren't on that level. Just all the more reason for Americans to buy a Decent, back machines like the Argos and Meticulous, and generally consider these massively marked up E61s something more like a last resort I guess.
Hey! Does de Bianca worth the extra bucks over Mara x? In terms of temp stability, and others?
The temperature drops , because you are on brew mode and the heating element is off , and when you have the flow control closed, the machine pulls fresh cold water in the hx brew chamber .
Great video as usual Lance. I almost pulled the trigger on the MaraX a year ago but the V3 Bianca was too good to pass up. I’m glad you reviewed both the MaraX and Bianca because it really validated my purchase and my research process.
The tear down was mind blowing and I learned more about a HX in one video than I have in a dozen others. Maybe you could tear down a dual boiler next? 😬
Bro, it's $3k+ :)
I was thinking about Bianca, but just don’t see any benefit of flow control, other features… once you master gaggia classic pro. All those ‘extra’ features are just noise. For me, I pull the perfect espresso shot with just 9 bar spring upgrade, wdt tool, shake prep, right grind, etc…that’s where the money is at. Gaggia does have quite few plastic components inside and that would be one of the main reason for an upgrade-better components, not necessarily a better shot :) Oh yeah, I would rather invest the difference between Bianca and marax into eureka libra grinder.
I love the full nerd deep dive. Please never stop doing you, your passion comes out big time in all the technical details and it’s so interesting to learn about the innovations happening under the hood!
Out of curiosity, any plans to review a londinium r24? Would really love to hear your take on the spring lever
You mentioned at the end that there are other machines you would prefer for the money. What machines do you recommend instead?
I appreciate these detailed reviews 🙏🏽
Amazing video, Lance. Absolutely great to have a deep dive inside espresso machines!
Really appreciated the technical walk through in the cut away version, excellent job with these videos Lance (as usual)!
Thanks for the video Lance. As a Mara X owner, I thought I knew the machine well, but you still taught me a few things.
what a great timing for the video. I just got my MaraX 2 days ago. I am still in the learning stage and debugging phase but I got answers to most of my questions in your video. Thank you!
I am playing with the grind size as currently I am only reaching 4 bars in pressure and the flow is extremely fast. I tried the blind basket the pump is working as it should so it is definitely the grind....but I am getting there. One thing which was a surprise for me that when it is heating it is hot almost everywhere and when it stops heating it stays hot for hours :D
Great point about the HX issues with thermal management when the machine has been on for too long. I have an ECM mechanika slim (the current one) and I deliberately leave the eco mode on to avoid it overheating. 👌
yeah. it's really the only way even with the innovative dual thermoprobe solution here
That would be also my idea.
Plus: Adding a E61 temperature sensor ('Eric's thermometer') to understand the behavior of machine. Maybe not all the time, but from time to time. Also helps to detect changes over time, e. g. due to build up of scale in the HX
The dark studio was SUCH A VIBE! Best backdrop in the coffee game. But I get it if you felt like you had to go basic for light and stuff.
It was mostly because it got depressing in there at night. 98% of my time in the studio is not filming but testing at night. A big part was actually for my own sanity
Thank you for showing the inside of this machine. Two things I have been asking for Stainless Steel and Copper element. So many videos don't show this or they don't know what is inside. And they never talk about high-temperature boiler applications, three general grades (Stainless Steel), 304, 321, and 347, are the most widely used. Know ones about this! I have to go directly to the MF.
great review. Now waiting for my Mara X to arrive
I assume you’ve gotten it by now. What are your thoughts? I’m looking at this for myself
Chrome, brass, copper, and stainless steel. What's not to love? The mechanical isolation of the vibratory pump is a nice touch. This is a little mod that can be made to cheap machines for quieter operation.
Love the in depth technical explanations, first time i actually liked, commented and subscribed :)
The best review of the Lelit MaraX!👍 The Mara X was for one year my Espresso machine and working great over this time.
After I give her away and buy the Dual Boiler Rocket R Nine One.
What a great review! I have always had the flow control kit on my mara x v2, but I couldn't ever figure out how to even use it properly. Thanks for explaining this. I noticed that when you pulled your first shot, the temperature was still getting stable cause the temp lights were blinking. Also, while pulling back to back shots, I've found that turning the machine off, and while i get my puck prep done and turning back on when i finish, still build the temp back up pretty quick, while ive not confirmed if it has been increasing temperature, ive always never felt the coffee taste different.
Thank you for doing such a thorough review- your videos have really helped me.
I’d love to see reviews on grinders priced 1000-2000. I’m looking to upgrade from my current one because I’m frustrated with it.
Check James Hoffman review series for top-end grinders
Thank you for this report, superstar. Really appreciate the level of detail
Hi Lance, great video! Thanks for that. One remark though, the effect of the knob positions on the right hand side are opposite of what you mentioned in the video. Position 1 is brew mode and position 0 is steam mode.
Damn, the new studio looks amazing! Loving the tache as ever mate
thank you!!!
First, ah damn… thank you King for not posting an April fools video like Hoffman
haha! I got you
Thank you Lance. Really great explanation of a heat exchanger machine.
Very good detailed video, not seen anywhere other! 👏 As an owner of stock v2 it came a bit cold about the 90 degrees, all shots taste badly sour. So i decided to set 92 as reference.
Great review and lot's of useful knowledge. Thanks Man !
Awesome review! All the references to "brew tube" makes me think of a TH-cam spin-off for coffee geeks 😂
Very Very good video, thought it might be over my head (Tech wise) but info was great :)
I like the new studio look. The long locks are looking quite luscious too. You have a bit of a younger-Ron-Jeremy look going on… respect. Love your content.
just trying to be like the GOAT! lol he and I are both known for our long videos ;)
I can't wait for the Zerno review! Also have you seen the Niche Duo yet?? So much crazy stuff coming out
Great videos. My Breville Dual Boiler has died and i wasnt to get a new machine. Your reviews are helpful
Studio looks great! Great video as well.
thank you! Appreciate it loads!
Thank you for the thorough review on this machine. What would your thoughts be on this machine compared to the ECM Classika PID?
First of all thank you so much for this in depth review. 👏🏻
However, How We can trust heat exchanger models in terms of temperature stability after that.
I definetly face forward to dual boiler machines.
Great video and a thorough walkthrough, Lance! Thanks for that, but damn, I was about to pull the trigger on a profitec pro400, especially after seeing whole latte love‘s video on it where it seemed to have great thermal stability after a short flush. After seeing this video and your words on HX machines I’m rethinking it again…the pro400 seems really well built though and it has a real preinfusion mode. Also, I have a profitec dealer and repair shop nearby, so I might still go for it if they convince me. Tough decision…
sounds like Prof is the way to go, tbh.
Would be great to get a review from Lelit Mara X out of the box. Not modified.
This isn't really modified. The temp sensor and pressure sensor do absolutely nothing to the coffee. They simply give me readings. The flow control is the only mod. And I discuss the machine as if it didn't have a mod. And I pull a shot without using it. This js essentially out of the box if you pay attention.
Lance, this video was amazing. I was looking at a Quickmill Silvano Evo because it is a single boiler with a PID and has a separate thermoblock for steaming. For that extra temp control, do you think an HX (like the mara x) or a higher end single boiler is better? THANKS FOR THE KILLER CONTENT!
Lovely as always!
thank you so much, Melker!
I dont even care much about this machine but I like your videos Lance. You becoming my online friend who doesnt even know me :D
great review, as usual Thank you
The Ron Jeremy of coffee.
trying to make dad proud. I just lube up actual mechanical joints. I think he uses lube for something else.
Had this machine for over two years and it normally doesnt over heat after a few hours. Once every three months or so the temperature can idle att a temperature about 2-3C too high, then I either just flush a couple of dl from the tap or do a descaling and after that the problem is solved.
I think the issue is I didn't have it sit 100% idle. I never let it hit eco mode.
Studio looks excellent!
thank you!!!
Thanks, Lance, for a thoughtful review. I am unclear what mods you did to the machine and would have preferred a review of the out-of-box machine. A PID heat controller properly programmed should have been able to prevent the heat increasing over time. Cheers!
I didn't do any mods that mean anything. The parts in the group head are strictly to help showcase what I'm doing. It doesn't affect performance. The flow control Mod is the most commonly used mod on e61 platforms. But even with that, I show a shot example without using it. So, no worries.
Hi Lance... Once again great review. U know I almost bought this machine but after watching your review I may have second thoughts. What would u recommend at this similar price point? Hope to hear from u! 😊
Dude, you took my coffee making knowledge to another level of perception...
I am a MaraX owner, it is possible to lift the lever enough to allow water into the puck for preinfusion without triggering the switch that actuates the pump. I use this technique to preinfuse lighter roasts
It isn't the same as normal e61. Perhaps a little water escapes but it doesn't build pressure
@@LanceHedrick True but it still preinfuses the puck and sets the stage for a more gentle ease in of pressure which is noticeably better to prevent the evil channeling monster :D
@Kurt Paris maybe. It doesn't see much pressure at all do its moreso the.top part saturating. Arguably could be worse for the puck. Would be better off filling fast and shunting flow with needle valve.
@@LanceHedrick i find this hard to picture since there is quite a bit of dripping evenly through the puck happening which i don't think corresponds to just the top getting saturated. Tomorrow morning I'll see if any pressure is registered.
When you installed the needle valve did you also change the springs in the group head?
@@LanceHedrick You are correct, there is no noticeable pressure buildup - however, especially once the machine is hot there is a fair amount of flow. I did some tests with just opening the lever (no pump) and pulsing the motor to keep < 2bar of pressure and then stopped the shot before extraction. In both cases when i was digging through the puck it was fully saturated with water (takes anywhere from 20-40s for flow to appear through the puck)
Hi Lance, as a marax owner i really enjoyed your video, the best review I've seen so far.
Unfortunately for the last 2 years I've had some issues with the machine which needed to be fixed under warranty...
At the end i guess you were referring to dual boiler machines. Which models do you recommend at this (or below) price range?
Actually I prefer the Gaggia classic pro. That's why I bring up tinkering. If you do the gaggiuino mod, the thing is built well with all stock parts. Can have an insane machine for $650
@@LanceHedrick
I actually had a Gaggia classic. It was incredibly reliable but no temp control and i steam alot for milk drinks so it is not for me.
Maybe lelit Elizabeth could be a better option
Hey Lance great video. My only comment is I think you got the brew modes switched. Up is brew priority and down or off is steam priority.
Yeah I said it wrong 🤪
Thanks!
Super instructive review, esp for a machine noobie like me.
Hey Lance! Great video!
We all know you also love the BDB. Since the Mara X and the BDB are around the same price, which do you think is superior for temp stability (since the BDB has a PID)?
Bdb for temp stability for sure
Hi Lance, thanks for this detailed video. Where I live, the Mara X is maybe 5-10% cheaper than Breville Dual Boiler. I like Mara X for the smaller footprint and look, but the Dual Boiler is easier to manage when it comes to temperature it seems. Which machine would you recommend?
Breville is finite, and always avoided. V poor internals and reputation.
Looking at MaraX and Bezzera BZ 10 similar prices but the heating time is a bit faster with the Bezzera.
As the video progressed, it was a back and forth. I want this machine, Maybe not, I want this, maybe not. I think for me, maybe. One quad latte in the AM. Then a Cappuccino or straight espresso in the pm and the increase of heat over time would not be an issue.
i'd just turn it off then back on. Shouldn't be an issue at all!
pl62t is the best!! simple and a nice look, no problems or unnecessary technology
Lance, I have the new MaraX V2. The brew and steam mode buttons are completely different to yours. The brew mode ramps up the steam pressure after the shot, while the steam mode ramps up the pressure during the shot. Both, at idle, will not be turning on the steam heating element. So if you come back after 30 minutes, in either mode, it will be ready to brew.
This is really confusing because you have a white MaraX so I assume it's quite new? Mine didnt't even have an updated manual. But you definitely can't set it to act like a normal HX machine.
I have to wonder if maybe Lance's review machine is defective. The group does overheat (beyond the temp set point) after about 4-5 minutes of pulling the last shot in steam mode, but it cools back to idle in 15 minutes, unless you flush it down. This temp cycling has been discussed exhaustively in many forums, as well as Dave Corbey's review, albeit on V1, but the V1X-mode is very similar to the steam mode of V2.
awesome stuff!!!
Lance what do you prefer, this, the profitec pro 400 or the new Rocket TCA?
Hi Lance, I do own this machine and I do not have the issue you describe that the machine overheats after it sits for too long. It is known that the Mara X starts overheating 3-4 minutes after you pull the last shot, but settles down to the adjusted temperature 15-20 mins later. This can be awkward, since you cannot wait more than these 3-4 minutes when pulling back-to-back shots or the temp will be too high. Other than that, it really is a great machine.
Do you have proof yours doesn't heat like this? Or just assuming? I ask because I can't imagine I have a lemon
@@LanceHedrick I have a thermal probe in the service thread you use as well (hope that‘s what it‘s called…), so yes. Also, I have confirmation about this directly from Lelit (about the overheating and settling down), but mine definitely settles. I have it on most of the time and I can normally walk up to it and pull a shot at around 92-93 (I‘m at setting 1, brew prio obviously…)
@Peter very interesting. I'm curious how deep your probe goes? Mine is about 4 inches long.
I tested not only with the probe but a scace, so well. Perhaps its because mine wasn't completely idle. I'd actuate the flip or something. But regardless, every time I hit that 2 hour mark of shot pulling, it'd shoot up
@@LanceHedrick Hey Lance, I don't think mine goes in so deep. I have the E61 group head thermometer from Coffee Sensor. However, I also don't think the difference between yours and mine will be significant. I never got to pull shots for 2 hours straight, so I cannot attest to that behaviour. However, the machine definitely SHOULD stabilize after roughly 15-20 minutes after the overheating phase. The overheating phase is necessary to keep the temperature stable for consecutive shots.
@Peter perhaps it should, but it doesn't ha! Same with their Bianca. They have a new feature of temp offset to allow changes in shot temp mid shot. I proved that to be untrue.
I think it's a nice idea but hard to execute with a hunk of brass and a HX
When you are pointing to something, please let us first see you pointing to the thing in the wide shot, THEN go to the B-roll of the close up shot. Otherwise I am hunting about in the B-roll what I am supposed to be looking at. Thanks.
Thing that sucks is you have to turn on the machine and wait about 30 minutes before your first cup..
with how good this setup is (with the Bianca flipper added), how much was that upgrade and would the Bianca be worth it for almost 2k more?
Hi Lance! Thanks for the great review. Is the power button on this machine a momentary switch or a toggle switch? I use a wifi-enabled plug to turn on my machine in the morning, so the power button needs to be a toggle switch to ensure the wifi plug can actually turn the machine on!
Kevin, I have a Mara X hooked to a WiFi power strip and it works great. I leave the button toggled “on” all the time and just use the WiFi or my smart assistant to turn things on.
Hello Lance. Would you mind sharing which model ThermaQ products you used in this video to pair with the SEP? Thanks!
Nm found your comment on this. Is the probe being developed by Gabor?
Thanks for the video, it manifested my love for the mara x. I´m thinking about upgrading to the v2 gicar box for the new improved brew and steam mode.
I find it interesting that the machine heats up over time so much. The v1 does not do so, on temperature setting I it stays on 93-94° the whole time… At least the bottom temperature sensor says so, which you can easily read out with an Arduino. I wonder if the temperature for the brew is actually higher, did u have the corresponding data from the gicar box itself after 2 hours? Or did the temp only spike at the lowest settings?
bottom sensor isn't as accurate as the temp reading after going through the brew tube. Love that you hooked up the arduino to it!
I have the Mara v2 and temps seem to stay stable over longer periods without issue. Granted I don't have the flow control mod and only have one of those cheapish temp probs installed above the group. Maybe you got sent a dud Lance or could the flow control mod be affecting temps??
What do you think about a dimmer mod on the X or would the soft start of the pump cause an issue ?
but which would u recommend at 1200 usd? Lelit Elizabeth? or something else?, cheers
Is this machine designed for home usage? I just can’t wrap my head around incorporating a morning espresso routine where you have to wait 20-25 minutes just for the machine to heat up.
just what I need😅❤
most high end heat exchangers machines use counter flow such as all Cimbali machines including the Junior , its more expensive but a much better design!
Definitely! Should've used the caveat of "at this price point"
@@LanceHedrick right ,, exactly ,, the mara is in that case a unique machine -- and worth every penny
Awesome content, enough to make me like and subscribe (y)
Do you recommend smart profiler to an e61 like Bianca?
So what makes it compete with a dual boiler Elizabeth since they are pretty much the same price?
Video says 1100-1400 bucks. 11 months later I'm looking it up and it's 1700?! Did they really pump up the price that much in a year?
Nobody is doing such high quality and informative videos, nobody! not even Pappy Hoffy. This is stupid good, and producers would pay big $$ for something like this. This is an in depth review, with all the details, and data. Nothing hidden or stupid music transitions.
thank you! I really appreciate it, denis. and Hugo does, too! ha
Well, though I know youre giving our bruh some love, there is Xris, Real Sprometheus, Ms. Eckroft, Hoffman and others doing high quality content too in the barista space too
lance does music breaks…. with his own mouth often enough. but yes! excellent content
@@DJ_BROBOT I just watched Hoffman’s review of the best machines for 1500 or less and his “review” of the Mara X when he got to it, was pitiful. He skipped almost everything interesting about this machine but took the time to mention the feet… then moved on to talk fluff about the next machine. Very disappointing. However I haven’t searched his videos to see if he ever did a better review of it.
I agree that the video is very extensive, however most people who buy or intend to buy such a machine will not put on paddle for flow control and pull some complicated shots with light roast coffee. It would have been more helpful if the measurements and instructions were done with the machine as it comes and not with the installed modifications.
Hi Lance, thanks for making this in dept review! I’ve been seriously considering on buying this over the past couple of weeks, but I didn’t expect your conclusion. I’m wondering what other machine(s) you would consider buying instead of the Mara X for the same budget?
Wondering as well!
@@simonbellemare2289 Me too! He left us hanging with a total cliff hanger on that point.
Agreed! Please share!
👀
Same here!
The thought, care and genuine willingness to inform the consumer in an unbiased fashion continues to amaze me. I’ve commented before and I’ll comment again, thank you!
You're setting the bar very high with your reviews. A lot of useful information for the people who is looking to purchase this machine.
Congrats.
Actually, he set the bar at 10.2.but it could go higher 😂
Great and thorough review as always! I loved every minute of it. I would be curious to see you review one of the Profitec HX lineup. I guess the 400 would make the more sense because it is very similar to the MaraX. Have you ever played around with Profitec machines?
Thanks a lot for this very interesting video and your insight. I'm a Mara X owner and have built in the thermometer in the grouphead but no flow control. My machine turns on at 5am. I make espressos at 6am 1pm and 3pm without turning the machine off inbetween and the eco mode off. The thermometer shows exactly 92.2°C ever single time when i step at the machine after idle for several hours, literally without exception. During the shot, the temperature shows 94.6°C every time, which results in 92°C in the portafilter, as tests have shown. I wonder where the instability comes from after idle time with your machine. Is it possibly because of the flow control?
I actually forgot to turn off the machine today after 3pm, walked at the machine at 11pm and it showed 92.2°C. It seems to be incredibly consistent to me. I'm in brew mode ond temperature level I btw. The only inconsistency I notice is a high temperature around 15min after i pull a shot or s temperature drop if i pull back to back within the same minute without giving the machine a 2min break. Other than that, it seems to settle at exactly 92.2°C again.
Btw, do you turn on the steam x mode
@@erihsehc2 I have the V1 of the Mara X on the what was then called "brew mode" which is the exact same mode that is called "steam mode" on V2, so yes.
Got the Mara today, but the Water Tank Sensor Switch does not work. The little pin under the water tank does not reach to the micro switch. Only, when I press down the tank manually, it clicks. Getting my hands away from the tank, it releases the switch and the machine shows: no tank..
Anybody else with this problem?
Btw, someone may have mentioned but it seems like you have power saving mode turned off. That obviously helps with the temperature spiking if left on, as it will hibernate at some point, essentially turning the system off, but ready to be turned back on (after any needed warmup) with the lift of the paddle. Since power saving mode is on by default I thought I'd mention it (and you may get to this later in the video!)
Thank you for this! Have you tested this?
How do you turn that off?
@@xer0cool if you power the machine off, lift the group head lever completely, then power back on, it will toggle the standby mode off
Same thought here. Maybe another good reason for the factory default setting (besides regulatorics)
Am I the only one who after all the 4/1 stuff came here expecting a joke only to find another thoughtful, deeply researched and meticulously crafted video? I guess the real jokes were the friends we made along the way... Great work guys!!
Jokes on me! Now I need this machine
meticulous home?
My test shows me that you on brew mode , you need to pull up the lever for 1-2 seconds( heating flash), to wake up the machine, to reach 1.5 bars. When 1.5 bars reached, then you brew!
I have a 250ml single boiler Lelit Anna with PID and I love it. Added preinfusion / flow control using your Gaggia classic mod video as a reference for the wiring. I couldn’t justify spending twice as much on the Mara X just to save the minute the Anna takes to come up to steam temp which is the biggest difference I could tell.
Interesting. I have the Anna with PID too. I will look into the preinfusion & flow control mod. Thanks for commenting :)
This is the most indepth review on the internet of a very relevant HX machine. I am highly interested in this machine, thank you for doing this review.
I have had the Mara X for 2 years without the flow control and it produces great coffee day in, day out for 6 to 8 coffees a day... Cannot rexxomend this machine enough for the value it provides
You drink 6 to 8 coffees a day! I gotta up my game.
Why did u pick this over rocket apartamento or profitec pro 400?
Hey Lance, I've been waiting for your review on Marax. Also amazed that you mentioned the reduced flow rate of the machine. So I wanted to ask you, considering the reduced flow rate (5ml/sec) and the slow ramp up (10 sec), does that mean that the recommended brewing time should be longer than the normal 25-30 seconds?
This really made sense for me. I have my shots dialled at 40 seconds. I thought I was weird, but maybe it’s the flow on the machine
Yeah, by taste mine are 35-40 seconds. I always assumed it was the preinfusion / slow ramp up, I didn't realise the flow was considered slow
Good old question about when to start the shot timer. Some (including me) start when the flow starts (first drops in the cup)
I am on the wait list for a Profitec GO. It looks to be closest to a Gaggia if you did every mod, without looking Frankenstein or relying on my abilities to do the work. ($1000)
I make 1-2 cappuccinos daily. This will be my first pro-sumer machine
I appreciate your reviews and espresso theory youtubes. I watched Everything before I settled on the Profitec GO, and would value your opinion before I commit.
Just my 2 Cents as a consumes that wants most bang for my buck. If I would have under 1000 to spend, after ALOT of Research, the go would be by choice. Seems like nothing will beat it at this price point
@@Caffeine.And.Carvings thanks for your feedback👍
You say at this price point that there are other models that you would recommend. I am curious at what your recommendations are. What is the best home espresso machine between $1000-2000?
Hey Lance! Thank you for this video, it was very informative! I was looking to buy the Mara X v2, but now im curious to hear what you would recommend for this price range? As you said you would buy something else over the mara x.
Thank you !
The temp drops because this machine is setup with perfect flow at stock setup to inject enough thermal energy into the large mass of brass to maintain the programmed temperature curve. When you choke the hot water you choke the heat input into that huge block of metal and the temp must fall as a result. Other machines may behave differently because they are limited by the heating elements power output so reducing flow helps the heat rise. But here we have a very large thermal mass in the boiler cushioned via a heat exchanger, thus providing a very stabile source, choking it does not spike the it high at source but it does reduce what goes into that huge cool block of brass at the front, without enough heat input into the brass the temp falls. Amazing thermal design and construction quality. I'm a heating engineer and I recognise the fittings and construction methods used here to be top notch. Solid old school hydronic design, its been tried and true since steam engines ruled and looks similar in rocket engines that go to space today, good old compression fittings, soldered connections and formed metal pipes. Boilers a boiler weather, its heating a hospital or coffee cup. We use the same sensors and prv valves.
Hi, I'm planning to buy this. I usually make a latte with dark roast beans. So if i set the PID at low, in brew mode, can i still froth my milk at that setting? or should i switch to steam mode or set to high the PID. Just the thought of it stresses me. You're answer will help a lot with my decision. Thanks, Lance!
Please review Lelit Elizabeth vs Ascaso Duo PID 😊
Liked your in depth explanations 👍
I'm still crossing my fingers for an Ascaso Steel review just because I love their aesthetic, and the fact that they're NOT an e61, but I'm still here because you're always fun to listen to.
These videos are super insightful! I would love to see a comparison of heat exchangers and thermal blocks. Maybe this Lelit vs the Ascaso Steel Duo soon? 🙏🙏🙏
Great review Lance, so much better than the typical sales-driven stuff that is so ubiquitous on YT. I have had an old-school, non-E61, pressurestat-driven HX (with an electrically heated brewhead) for 10 years, which at the time of purchase was about the smallest machine in its class on the market. The MaraX is even more compact, but with so much stuff in a small casing, how would you rate its maintain-ability? Do you have to take out all the internal parts when you want to, say, change out the pump?😊
The small footprint was a big factor in my choice of the MaraX 2 1/2 years ago, as was the expected longevity and ease of repair. The internals are very accessible simply by removing the casing (which is also easy). Changing the pump would be simple.
This seems extremely similar to the Profitec 400. Any sense on how these two machines might stack up against each other?
let's see if profitec will send me one for a proper tear down!
@@LanceHedrick fingers crossed! I was almost pulling the trigger on the 400 until I saw this! Be very interested to see any differences
I would also consider the new ECM Mechanica IV slim. Same tech as the Profitech 400 Pro, plus all additional innovations from ECM. If you get a Heritage Line version, it’s an absolute masterpiece for the price.
@@nikitasheremetov5011 : If you talk about ECM Mechanika VI Slim, this one has an 1,9 liter boiler instead of Pro 400 1,6 liter. Whether that's a good or bad (slightly higher energy consumption?), I can't tell
Lelit Mara X V2 or Profitec Pro 400? What is your choice?
What about the LELIT Elizabeth PL92T ? I only drink espresso and bought the LELIT victoria but I had too much quality issues on it.