The Age Of The Merger
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 เม.ย. 2024
- Before the AFL, there was the VFL, and by the mid-1980s it was almost completely bankrupt. Seven of the league's twelve teams were bankrupt, millions of dollars in debt, and the creditors were about to be called in. These teams were faced with three paths to go down - win, merge, or die.
In this 9-part series, the GAZ-man explores the full history of how the AFL came to be the massive empire it is today. Part 7 covers the time period from 1983 to 1996 - how the VFL found itself in debt, and how the VFL clubs held discussions with basically everyone to huddle together in the cold, trying desperately to survive.
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All match content is the property of the Australian Football League, with additional material from Fox Sports and Channel 7, and is used for entertainment and educational purposes under Fair Use.
All music and backing tracks were humbly, and clumsily, self-made on GarageBand and BandLab. - กีฬา
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Incredible video mate well done and thanks for the shoutout ❤️
Thanks mate!! Loved the AFL23 video, very entertaining!
@@thegaz-man No worries mate would love to do something with you RE: 15:00
That'd be amazing, you're an absolute legend!! Won't have it all sorted til sometime next year but will definitely reach out when I have something!
Sometimes I think about what VFL park could have been if they built the train line out there. 150,000 seat stadium would have been unreal.
proabbly the best afl content on this site, elite research and info combined with dry humour, keep it up mate
No "probably" about it. No other AFL media presenter treats his listeners as intelligently as Gaz.
Thanks!!! Will do my best to keep the same vibes!
@@user-kw1gp3dq4o exactly
First, king of AFL video essays 👑
Ahhh thanks haha
This was the time I enjoyed watching Geelong Cats during the early to mid 90s.
At the time when I was a kid, I never knew about the dire situation that Fitzroy were in until 1996 when I noticed something seriously wrong with how the AFL would pride itself as being financially stable while at the same time it wasn't as rosy as they marketed themselves as.
As someone who wasn't around for that point in time, it seems really strange that more wasn't made of these clubs being destitute (probably the AFL trying to protect their image)
Definitely seems like the AFL were desperate to sacrifice a Vic club or two so that they could expand, and the Fitzroy-Brisbane deal allowing Port to come in killed two birds with one stone
@@thegaz-man Maybe it was because I was a kid in school and never read the Herald Sun at the time.
Often only reading the Herald Sun on Saturdays and Sundays but most of the merger talks would have been written in articles during the Monday to Thursday outside of match day.
I did hear some concerns about Fitzroy in 1995 but never really took notice at the time until the situation with Naru came to a critical point in June 1996.
30:15 And that is the reason why every time I go to Southern Cross Station, I see the massive Meat Pie stadium next to my train coming into SCS.
As an international fan this channel has been great for learning more about the history of this great game. Keep up the good work!
Thanks! Its really cool to see viewers from outside Australia watching my vids!!
Of course in the same period, the creation of the Adelaide Crows caused the Woodville Warriors and West Torrens Eagles to merge into the Woodville-West Torrens Eagles in the SANFL.
I'm gonna make a video someway down the line about SANFL in the 1990s, fascinating period of history with the merger talks, AFL deals and varied winners
The quality of these videos get better with every upload, thanks for another banger Gaz 🔥
Thanks so much! I was a bit worried bc I had to rush bits of the last couple of vids, glad they still present well enough
Young Aussie Jon Bois, instant sub, great work king
Ahhh thanks! Love Secret Base's work, can't wait for the new season of Pretty Good they have planned.
Gaz delivers again.
Thanks!!!
Love your work GAZ-man. Can't wait for the North/Fitzroy series when they come around.
Thanks! North series is probably gonna land around the start of next season, with the Fitzroy series either late 2025 or early 2026. These series tend to take about a year for me to produce, start to final release.
It’s crazy to think that teams such as Carlton and north were trying to merge yet they were winning premierships during that time (Carlton supporter)
Hawthorn was the surprise for me - dominated the 80s and yet were bankrupt within half a decade.
They all truly wanted a Premiership no matter the cost.
Brilliant series, and great video! I'm all for the long form essays, keep them coming!!
(I'm getting about 15mins of black at the end of this one, might want to check that out)
Same, They rendered out a bit further than the video!
Thanks!
Yeah the weird bit at the end is my fault, left a bit of video right at the end of the timeline and forgot about it. Edited it on Studio to fix it just now, hoping that fix goes through soon
AFL essay KING (second)
Haha I don't think I'm good enough to be king but cheers!!
@TheGAZ-man this is the best analysis I have seen, it actually deals in the real facts not the fiction like others or the fantasy utopia some other like to believe
Cheers! Yeah, as a huge fan of the sport I really hate how the V/AFL sanitises its history. Self-interest has always been a key pillar of the sport, which is fine, but they try to hide it.
also what was the 13 minute of silence at the end lol
Yeah that's my bad, left a bit of video waaaaay at the end of the timeline and didn't realise.
Just edited it on YT Studio to get rid of it so hopefully that'll be taken care of soon!
@@thegaz-man Why lose the best 13 minutes of the video?
C'mon man! :)
I was there that night for the Melbourne -Hawthorn game. I'd never experienced an atmosphere like it.
That would have been absolutely amazing! Did you happen to save a 'No Merger' banner at all?
Great video
Fantastic video- have you considered doing a video on the history of the code wars between the NRL, AFL and Soccer? I think that could be quite interesting
The next part (The Money Era) will touch on the AFL's relationship with rugby and soccer in pretty broad detail, but a dedicated video on the Barassi Line could definitely be fun!
What is crazy is how often club presidents would keep their own club supporters totally in the dark and most things found out by supporters at the last minute in the press before they could do anything about it themselves. Basically the first time any normal supporter heard of Fitzroy Bulldogs being a thing was in the newspaper when it was actually happening. Absolute crazy shit and to think this was two of the least supported clubs and even those few supporters were able to turn this on it's head in weeks.
Many of those people running these clubs gave any thought to what a normal footy fan of their club would think. I mean if you were a diehard supporter of your club and wanted to goto nearly every game during the season or all of them, fancy finding out by the press when it just about too late to do anything about it, that your own club president is basically deciding everything about the identity your club and where they play, with really no consideration or consultation with the clubs week in and week out fans themselves that make the club, an actual club.
Imagine finding out via the newspaper article that the team you goto see 20 to 22 times a season was basically going to all of a sudden play 11 times in another state and you had not even been told it was even a proposal at any point before that. So if it happened, all of sudden you gone from attending every game you could in your city for season after season to now only being able to attend once every two weeks. Yet you were not even consulted or asked whether you would like that for your own club. Noel Gordon of Brisbane Bears infamy sort of sums up what most of these guys were like at virtually every club in these mid 80's to the end of the 90's. Shame on them all.
Hawthorn and Melbourne proposed merger is virtually the only one where supporters of those clubs had any inkling things were well advanced before they had a chance to do anything themselves. Most of the other mergers most footy fans would never even heard about from their own club. Those presidents involved are all a disgrace.
I think I've recommended this book a few times in the comments but The Pheonix Rises does a grest job of expressing those self interests and backroom dealings.
The fact that the Footscray Fitzroy merger basically went ahead before the fans knew about it is completely insane, especially as other merger talks that were far less advanced (Melb-NM for example) were waaaay more public knowledge. Absolutely agree with you.
terrific video as always Gaz! BUT WAIT! As a disgruntled Saints fan who had to make my way to the dungeon of GMHBA Stadium earlier this year. you forgot to explain how the Cats dodged this rationalisation of home grounds! If memory serves me correctly, Geelong was VERY much in debt until Brian Cook rolled around and turned the club into a slot machine.
Thanks!
Yeah I didn't really chase up too much on the Cats as I focussed on the metro sides - I think the success they had in the late 80s and early 90s hard-carried them through their (almost) bankruptcy.
What's the journey to the stadium like?
I don't even watch AFL but this is so fascinating.
Thanks! Honestly that means a lot that the content still comes across well with people who enjoy other sports!
Allan Jeans coached hawthorn to 3 premierships.
1983, 1986, 1989.
I'm also counting the one that he missed due to the brain injury (1988) as that was basically his team too.
True, it's factually incorrect to count it but I just really like Yabby.
And then there's the VFL Reserves becoming the VSFL, then a short time later the VSFL merging into the VFA, which had a couple of years earlier become the VFL!
And of course just recently the VFL gobbled up the NEAFL reserves sides too, which could sow the seeds for a full AFL reserves comp.
I might cover the decline of the VFA in a bit more detail later down the line, felt like I skipped over it quite a lot to make room for more VFL stuff.
Great Video, its crazy as someone born in 1998. I could never see an AFL team merging or losing their AFL license. But fuck, Kangaroos is a basketcase....
Thanks!
The AFL seems way too rich and overprotective of its teams now for them to fold. Of course Fitzroy was seen as expendable bc Port were waiting in the wings, with a ready-made 30,000 member fanbase.
Kangaroos by far the most likely to move, but where would they go? Tassie off the table, GC would be a really lame merger, Darwin is a logistical nightmare, and Canberra might still hate them for abandoning them for the GC money in 2006.
They're in trouble, and have been for a while - my next big doco series will be about them, actually.
@@thegaz-man perhaps they could merge with a sanfl or wafl club. I doubt that will happen tho but it would lovve to see more clubs there
Great work. Beautiful day..
especially knowing port fans are suffering. 3-0 baby!
Does feel nice after a Showdown win 🤣🤣
Can wait for the next one where u go into the code wars between the AFL’s competitors and all that
Cheers! Hoping I can get it finished off before the end of the month.
@@thegaz-mannice take all the time u need the grind u do for the videos I applaud u going from state to state just to read a paragraph from ur script for the videos is impressive
Not sure if you remember the North Melb and East Perth deal in 1980 approx. I think it was about $200-$300k to extend Glendinning and to sign up Phil Kelly and Peter Spencer. All very good players. But in the case of Kelly and Spencer became injury prone after moving to Melbourne and playing on small waterlogged grounds. A lot of money.
Haven't heard of that one! Goes to show how much cash was flowing through from Melbourne to WA. There's a full episode on Headliners about the formation of the Eagles (on TH-cam, I'd recommend giving it a watch as it helped heaps for this video) that showed just how reliant the WAFL was on Vic transfer fees.
@@thegaz-man interesting that some wafl teams still made it very difficult for players to go to Victoria and wouldn't clear them. For example Glendinning in 1978 and Grant Campbell in early 1980s and both were in high demand. That's just from one WAFL club East Perth. When the Eagles joined the VFL clubs scared WA kids that they wouldn't approve a WA team, so in the year of formation you got guys like Christian Darui Starcevich all going to Victoria. Around the same time you got Winmar Bairstow Dorotich Dean Spalding... some a year before. So Eagles weren't exactly the state team.
What I think AFL needs have two divisions of 11 with two teams in SA, QLD, NT, and Tasmania. In each division will have 11, this means the AFL will have 20 each will play twice. Each division have bye will play each other. The finals will top Four or six will each.
I think the AFLW operates under a similar conferenxe system. The only change I would make would be 12 in each division, which eliminates the bye and gives us the 'traditional' 22 game calendar.
Also chuck in an all star game between the best players of each conference/divison.
Not sure I'd have two NT and Tas teams, would rather have one of each plus an ACT and NZ team, but a cool suggestion!
I remember seeing the Fitzroy Footscray talks at the time. Fitzroy were in a stronger position (not sure about dollars) as a club in general. Were playing well and getting good crowds. But when I saw how stacked it was in favour of Fitzroy I thought it was ridiculous. I remember that after it fell through a journo said that now a club will fold and it will most likely to be Fitzroy. Sounded surprising but that's what happened and they plummetted not long after as a force off the field and then on the field.
Ross Oakley said in his autobiography (The Pheonix Rises, which I'd recommend to anyone keen on footy history) that Fitzroy were the dominant partner in that deal. That was just after Hecron pumped some sponsor money into them, when the takeover failed.
Sponsors just fled from that point - really didn't help that the club essentially had no assets, as they were ground-sharing, so they had little to borrow against.
The 80s side way overperformed compared to their means so when results stopped coming, they were doomed because of that.
@@thegaz-man I meant as a footy lover, when i heard that Fitzroy was the club most likely to fold (when the deal fell through) I was surprised. But clearly they needed to be based in Footscray and probably called Fitzroy Footscray.FC. Then work the rest out. You've got to give a bit to get a bit.
@@thegaz-man Remember when Hawks used to play at Princes Park. Hawks were clearly fortunate to have a good zone .
history of collingwood question mark?
North and Fitzroy are the next two teams in line, but it would be nice to talk about a successful team for once 🤣🤣
Would be a great story to tell for sure, and I'll definitely do it at some point - won't be this year or next year though unfortunately
I remember Carlton and North. To wear North jumpers away and Carlton were going to buy the shares or something.
Sounds like similar terms to the Carlton-Saints merger, which would make a lot of sense.
Just insane to think about how different the league would look with no Dogs and no Hawthorn
Yeah, it'd be crazy! I've actually got a video planned later in the year, which explores what the league would look like of every merger had happened, so stay tuned!
There was some talk about Geelong and North when both clubs were struggling. More speculation rather than detailed talks like the other examples. Geelong Roos. I did wonder whether they'd play in diagonal stripes. Anyway with Tassie coming in, there could be some danger for North actually. Not sure who they'd merge with, but with outstanding juniors coming through they may actually have a reasonable hand in negotiations just because of that. I'm not sure how it could happen... but just saying that the risks have now increased from them. The Roos must paint themselves as absolutely irreplaceable which they're not doing at the moment.
Wow, that's something that slipped through the cracks for me! Geelong were in a tough position as a merger with the Melbourne clubs would have been a bit of a logistical issue.
Interesting to mention that North no longer have the Tassie option - probably the most likely merger partner imo would be Carlton: close proximity, good list and training resources.
Agree that of all teams, they really need to prove how important they are so they stay around
@@thegaz-man Eddie and Jimmy podcast talked about it a day or so ago. It was good that they agreed with what I was saying. For me that shows its damn obvious. McGuire talked about all these suburbs and how North could have access to then a huge pool of academy players first generation. Geelong North would have worked well, but Brian Cook got the place sorted out.
Crazy having the clubs so close together. I feel Perth was more spread out in the 1980s and clubs were already talking about going north towards Wanneroo (all that was before Joondalup existed which was later in the 80s). East Perth even talked about going beyond Morley Dianella then. But the Vic clubs seemed delusional. Especially North Melb who could have moved into an outer suburb in the fringes. They still could move into an area with high numbers of immigrants and forge their way.
I was really surprised, I was able to walk between Princes Park, University's ground and Brunswick Street super easily while filming.
Managed to hit up the MCG, Marvel, Punt Rd, South, Port Melb and North across half of the next day.
Insanely close, surprised that it took so long for mergers to seriously be considered.
It could’ve been viable but I’d have doubts about moving. Geographically probably one of the biggest hurdles post WWII for Fitzroy was that they were squeezed between Carlton and Collingwood. Even playing at the Junction Oval south of the Yarra was still St Kilda territory. North however was hemmed in by Footscray which largely had the west to fall back on and Essendon the north west. The areas to the north were generally Ess, Coll and Carl. North’s metro zone was way out east towards the foothills of the Dandenongs 25km away, which may have brought in a few punters as the recruiting zones did to a degree. Following a club through family was still probably a big pull and the post war migration from inner Melbourne to the suburbs is where we see North to this day. Winning those flags in the 90’s plus being highly innovative (playing on Friday nights in the 80’s etc) and gritty as an under resourced club has kept them somehow afloat, they’re stable financially as we speak but really, how much longer will it last for?
@@Havencheese Even now, I don't get why Arden St got redeveloped in the last 10 years. They needed to move into a fringe suburban areas high in immigrants and develop an area. Would have been good for them and the AFL.
You got Saints moving to Moorabin and then they tried Seaford. Melb made Casey a part time training base. Bulldogs are now playing games in Ballarat. What have North done.
@@Havencheese The AFL will keep propping them up for time being. But you see the big Melb clubs getting all the privileges with fixturing, press coverage, big matches etc. So the kids will continue to be drawn to them in big numbers. So you're going to see the Collingwoods Essendons and co getting bigger in support and then North will keep dropping. In the past North had a zone and clubs had a presence in suburbs so people barracked for the clubs. so driven by families but also where you lived. but going forward kids will choose to barrack for clubs that are successful, on tv all the time and get the exciting matches in big stadiums. North Bulldogs will keep dropping away. Ultimately, what will happen is that the wealthy clubs with $100k in the bank will get sick of propping up teams and a salary cap. They'll have these huge bank balances and asset portfolios that can't be used for success. So change will be forced ultimately and by then North would have further shrunk.
@@BDub2024 Oh I agree, North should've absolutely done that. Initially I thought you meant North moving back in the day.
Can you do a video on the state league war
Already done! Check out the previous part of this series for more. Wish I'd touched more on State of Origin in it though, might look at that someway down the line
@@thegaz-man cheers for the reply. I'm more of a union/league man being from sydney. but i find the state leagues in nrl and afl before nationalisation (is that right word??) so interesting. I wish we couldve had more of the original clubs in these leagues other than some of the artifical clubs made up in boardrooms we have now.
I remember talk of Melbourne North as a name. I thought Melbourne Lions should have been considered. The colours certainly suited even if their supporter groups were opposite. Melb needed to include a bit more Fitzroy in the jumper and be the lions. Ironic because the Demons name and logo is totally not connected with Melbourne now. Not a pitchfork in sight. Is that to attract new supporters from overseas? I'd like to see a video look at how clubs have branded themselves over time. Not just jumpers but logos and nicknames and what they've focussed on. Clearly Melbourne now are just trying to be the Melb CBD team and they don't want anything to distract.
Maybe a bit more gold in the Melb jersey, or a lion on the front? The colours absolutely would have worked.
Yeah, since the 2007 rebrand the whole 'Demon' thing kinda fell by the wayside a bit. Perhaps the tanking controversy had something to do with a shift in the club's PR strategy, trying to reposition themselves as the team for all Melburnians?
A video on club identies would be interesting, good call! St Kilda’s a favourite of mine, trying a bunch of nicknames in the 40s and 50s that didn't stick at all.
@@thegaz-man I think Saints were seagulls at one time. Even played around with yellow during WW1. Fitzroy Gorillas. Melb Fushias etc.
@@thegaz-man Actually East Perth is the Royals but changed to Eagles for a few years in the 1950s. Unfortunately it coincided with poor form. So instead they were labelled One Sparrow (name of coach) and 17 galahs. It wasn't long until it was back to Royals.
Also in a stupid move the West Perth Cardinals switched to Falcons in the 1980s largely because they thought it was really marketable and Commetti the coach loved the Atlanta Falcons in the US. They lost a bit of history and tradition there for a lack lustre name. Now they're up at Joondalup. But they still have kept their iconic jumper which is the best going around.
@@thegaz-man Melb needed to give more to Fitzroy and Hawthorn. Yes MFC is iconic jumper. But they could have easily trimmed the red yolk with yellow and yellow numbers. Also a gold lion and name. Not difficult. Then play in a similar Fitzroy jumper when required as a clash. But ultimately from my memory Fitzroy got too greedy themselves with Footscray and blew it.
The reason Nauru was Fitzroy's creditors is easy
They were extremly rich at the time
Righto! How'd they get so loaded?
@@thegaz-man Bird shit. Literally
The islands overtime had so much bird crap it became phoruous which is used for science
Holy shit that's brilliant
So Fitzroy went bankrupt essentially because of bird crap, I love that so much
And now sinking in the ocean
@@thegaz-man the island was at one point the richest country in the world now it’s poor and sinking thx to recourse exploitation and other shit
Unfortunately it’s was the 80s VFL that evolved into what we now have have as the modern AFL. If they could do it all again the national league should have been set up by an independent body only taking in 6 Victorian teams and expanding from there. They may have initially lost some fans from the teams that dropped out, but it would have been a better league in the long run. No where in the world do you have so many professional teams concentrated in one city.
John Elliott's idea likely would have taken that form - even if every Vic side had got an invite, I doubt he'd throw a life jacket out to Fitzroy, Footscray etc.
Agree that a national league should have been formed in such a way but the VFL was always going to be too big to stop.
@@thegaz-man yeah i didnt see your other video where you did cover that, there is a bit of irony with john elliot being quite the progressive thinker with this national competition set up only for him to undermine the national competition an blow up carlton with the salary cap breaches in the late 90s which set them back 20 years.
Country zoning was corrupt
It really was. The original proposal was to rotate zones every 3-5 years, would have definitely helped a lot of clubs especially St Kilda
@thegaz-man thats right but Carlton and Hawthorn talked the league out of it as they landed the best areas
Good video but you gotta spend a couple bucks on a mic. I almost bailed because of it.
Thanks! Yeah, my old mic was pretty good when I got it, but I've had it for a few years now.
Looking at getting something new in a couple months, hopefully.
SANFL screw Port Adelaide because Port Adelaide was with hours coming the AFL. Then SANFL took Port to court and SANFL won over Port. Then VFL gave Adelaide Crows was from
The first club from SA was always going to be called Adelaide. The name was registered way back in 1981.
You kept saying "jersey" whilst your on screen text said "guernsey". A bit of consistency with your English Channel tax havens please.
🤣🤣🤣 I honestly do the same thing with 'derby' and 'darby' too haha
Your videos are very informative and cover stuff that the countless footy shows on telly don't. Good work.
10 minutes of blackness 32:00 onwards
Apologies about that, left a bit of video way at the end of the timeline and forgot about it. Performed a live fix on it so hopefully that comes through soon.
Nice... A sprinkle of Jew hatred in my AFL content. Thanks for that.
Definitely not my intention to express that sentiment, and I'm sorry that it came across that way for you. I also apologise that this comment negatively impacted your day, and experience with the content.
Hatred for any race, religon or group is not what I'm about at all. I did not wish to make a comment about any groups, just Netanyahu in particular.
My point, fleeting as it was, is that a significant amount of responsibility for the current conflict both beginning and continuing is on Netanyahu's shoulders in particular, much like it would be for any leader in any armed conflict. Other leaders are hardly blameless as well, for the record.
@@thegaz-man I genuinely appreciate your sincere and considered response here. I enjoy your content, and otherwise congratulate you on making an excellent video. Responsibility for the current horrendous conflict is complex and multifactorial. I'm not a great fan of Netanyahu, but it is an immense over simplification to suggest he is entirely responsible. Thank you again for your content and your otherwise thoughtful response.
Thanks for that, honestly it was a misjudgement for me to reference events that I don't have a full understanding of, as I've got a responsibility to my viewers to present in a knowledgeable way (aside from my predictions by the looks of things!). Will definitely do my best to avoid that going forward.
He said Netanyahu is currently overseeing a mass purge of humanity, which is true. There was nothing hateful toward Jews in his comment.
Great video