How Does a CYC Photon Mid-Drive eMTB Conversion Stack up to Production eMTBs?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.พ. 2025
- CYC Motor designed the Photon to be a DIY eBIKE conversion kit for your existing mountain bike or city cruiser bike. I've been researching ways to continue riding despite my disability/chronic illness, and I believe an eBIKE will be in my future. My research led me to CYC Motor's Photon, a bolt-on motor and battery solution for bikes. In all my research, it seemed the highest quality and most "serious" conversion kit for modern MTBs. In today's video we install it on the bike to see what it's like. Overall, I'm extremely impressed, despite finding a couple things that could be improved. If you're interested in converting a commuter, ebike, or emtb, use coupon code "BBP5OFF" at cycmotor.com for your discount.
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A couple things to add:
1) use discount code: "BBP5OFF" at cycmotor.com for your 5% discount on your order:
2) I totally forgot to mention this, and it's a game-changer. The instant engagement of the sprag clutch makes this thing feel so much better than most other ebikes. Most ebikes have slop in the motor, then you add the slop in a poor engaging hub, and you have a ton of slack to take up when pedaling. The instant soft engagement of this is AWESOME. Id love to see all ebike motors use this technology, but it's more expensive to do, so many others will skip it, hoping most riders wont notice.
Drivetrain slack from standard pawl freewheel added to rear hub slack is annoying. Sprags are great but getting one to survive trials type pedal kick maneuvers has been a challenge so far. Cyc has done the best job of packaging a sprag, an ISIS spindle, and torque sensing BB. It will be interesting to see how they hold up long term.
@dansacco1964 it's a HUGE sprag, im hopeful it'll be robust in the long term, but we'll see.
@@BigBrainPartygood to know. I suppose with true torque sensing the motor is going to contribute right away and reduce the crank torque on the sprag.
@@dansacco1964 now you've got me curious if the motor is driving though the sprag clutch, or just the human power...
@@BigBrainPartythere might be 2. But the one im talking about is the one that allows the motor to spin without bringing cranks with it. That one has to deal with a standing rider jumping on the crank for a tech move. There may be a smaller one that keeps your legs from turning the motor. Id guess that small one is internal on the motor shaft. High rpm and low torque there.
That's awesome. When I lost the ability to pedal in 2016 I bolted a Paradox Kinetics Hermes throttle only motor to several "Amish" bikes and it saved my sanity and probably my marriage. I finally got my Full Right Knee Replacement July 15th and can pedal again after 2,814 days. It's crazy how not being able to ride affects us. So happy for you.
Thanks, interesting video. For 18 months and 4500 miles I have been running a Photon motor on an old Marin 'Attack Trail' full-sus XC MTB, on and off-road. Battery is 48V 20Ah mounted on a rear rack mounted to the saddle stem as there is no room in the triangle. Weight distribution can get very light on the front, and I broke a vertebra finding that out! Mid-drive has proven good for me due to ease of fixing punctures, and no heavy unsprung hubs to cause a harsh ride. I run a set of three chains on molten candle wax lubrication with no measurable wear so far. Motivation was a diagnosis of pre-diabetes and the blood tests are now right back to the normal range! For info, the motor's continuous heat rating (with clean heat-sink fins) is 750W and it will go to twice that level for a short burst - but if you ride it above 750W for too long it will get above 90degC and thermal-throttle to avoid damage.
In this day and age everyone seems to want MORE POWER but the case for less power and lighter more compact systems makes a lot of sense.
Wishing you many more heathy miles in 2025!
In the settings (when you first turn it on & within 10 seconds you hold down the menu button) it does give you additional options not in the app. I think there is a brightness setting, but also mph, wheel size, and how quickly you want the system to power down if left alone. Also, all the way at the bottom there is an option called "Gear" and it allows you to adjust to 3, 5, or 9 increments of power, if you find 3 is too few. Personally, I have a custom made battery 52V 8amp/h that is way, way smaller from Bicycle Motor Works. You can get custom batteries with a Bluetooth BMS that allows you to monitor what each cell in the pack is doing, as well as get super high quality cells. Overall, great system!
Excellent additional info, thank you so much!
Very timely video! Last week, I installed the exact same kit (with throttle) on a customer's Larry Vs Harry Buillitt cargo bike, and was extremely impressed with the simplicity of the system, and the performance! It's smooth, surprisingly quiet, and was fairly simple install once I watched the instructional videos. I had a heart attack in September, and this system has me wanting to build up a hardtail to help with recovery!
Im so sorry to hear about your heart attack, I'm glad you're still with us. Ill pop this on my hardtail in a couple weeks over on hardtail party
Many thanks for this review. I'm 74 and losing endurance, so this kit will keep me going. It's the one I've been looking at, so good to hear your review; it answered most of my questions.
Nice vid, I did a hardtail conversion back when these were released. It is great to see somebody competent taking these seriously.
Great job Steve and break down of the CYC conversion. Great seeing watching you on the trail and having fun!!! Looking forward to what other bikes you will convert and the how it changes the bike and what specific usage the role the bike will play!!!
I love it. The most important aspect for me is that I already own a bike, I don't want to buy another e-bike, so this makes it an ideal solution if you want to have both options yet spending another 6K+ is out of question.
Exactly!
Great video, you really captured what I love about the CYC Photon. I have it on both of my bikes, one of which is a new Sklar Tall Tale MTB that absolutely shreds. It’s amazing to be able to target specific bike frames and builds and convert them to electric for my personal needs.
Thanks for the video, Steve. My set up looked like yours at first. Next, I flipped the battery around so that it hung below the downtube, allowing me to mount it closer to the BB and lowering the center of weight substantially. Closer to the BB also made it clear the front tire when the fork was bottomed out. I got my water bottle back as well. Better on jumps due to weight distribution front to rear as well as top to bottom.
Unfortunately mine won't fit that way, it'll contact the front wheel on compression. That sounds like a great way to do it though!
Great to hear you are able to ride more. I've not seen this system before.
Ebike or not, you being able to talk with this much power, while riding, is really impressive, especially after all that stuff going on with your health
That’s what I was thinking. The nonchalant speech does not match the speed of travel! I was blown away
Thanks!
Thank you so much for the support! This channel wouldn't be possible without generous viewers like you.
This is really cool. I love how versatile it is.
Happy to see you riding!
Happy to see you back riding
Looks like a blast plus anything that gets you on the trail having fun is a good thing.
Thank you for this review. You have me sold on the idea of an SL ebike version of the Transition Spur.
I cant wait to see those bikes exist.
same.
I’m glad this is a thing and I look forward to the second generation of this and as you said an SL version for my 2017 Patrol
Just curious what you're hoping the 2nd generation has that this doesn't? I dont think we'll ever see an sl version, but a guy can dream
@ smaller battery, smaller motor, integrated bashguard, lower weight….essentially build it as an SL eMTB kit. Moore’s law should apply to Ebikes.
Great video as always. Excited to see the hardtail party version
I put this kit on a hardtail two weeks ago. Vid coming soon to hardtail party.
the code # 28 is because the throttle is not in the line. Go into settings and turn off throttle setting. Owning 4 of their different motor kits for the past 2.5 yrs. teaches you to appreciate these over the factory stuff. No comparison. Your batt. choice your bike frame type and the tunability with phone apps. Plus the crazy power at your discretion. Built 50 of these for myself and others. Never seen a factory rig that would compete with em. I ride ark, la, miss. and out west.
Just FYI, this motor is not 1200 watts. It's 1500 Watts and you can unlock it for 2000 Watts. Regarding your issues on battery size, you should consider the mini shark battery from Electrify Bikes. It only weighs 6.6 lb, and it doesn't stick out on the sides like the battery you're using in this video. It also has the capability of 50 amps burst and 40 amp continuous power. It's an amazing battery, I have four of them and four different mountain bikes with the CYC Photon. My Trek fuel EX8 weighs 44 lb. That is definitely in SL territory it's right on par. Not only that, but for that 44 lb, I have a 500 w battery. SL e-mountain bikes usually come with a significantly smaller battery. And you mentioned it's more power than most e-mountain bikes, it's not. It is more than any other e-mountain bike that I'm aware of. Significantly more. And regarding the heat of the battery charger, you most likely have a much faster battery charger, probably four or five amps versus the two or three amps that most e mountain bikes come with. That extra amperage creates more heat, but charges your battery faster.
I run the biggest version(x1 Pro) but run it as class 1. I build these conversions for people so having the biggest and turning power down to what the customer is looking for is great for test/demo bike. Also unfortunately the frame I have couldnt run the photon without pushing my chainline out a bit more than I would have liked(you can download 2d scaled files from CYC to check fitment on your bike before buying the motor or bike to mount motor).
As for battery I came up with a way to use EGO lawn equipment batteries(labeled as 56v but really are 52v like the CYC A battery) by 3D printing a mount for my water bottle holder under my frame and just use a strap as extra support. Good things about these is they change out supper fast(about 15 seconds with dealing with the strap) and the off brand ones can be had for crazy cheap. I got a 10ah which is 520wh and same capacity as the CYC you use but it was only $150 for black friday sale on Amazon and so far it seems to be true to capacity. If you already have EGO tools it makes perfect sense and if doing a short ride throw in the 2.5ah and its only a ~2lb battery(my 10ah is about 7lbs). Mine is on an enduro/all mountain bike for self shuttling and its great being able to knock out a few laps and swap batteries on breaks.
Mine is two years old it has 2800 miles on it
It has no issues at all .even the app is xlnt. No issues .
how many watts do you have it set at?
This is funny to see this video immediately after I just finished typing a message to someone about ebike conversion kits being science projects. I think there are plenty of less refined kits out there, so it's cool to see a more comprehensively developed kit like this.
I have a Gen 3 Levo and love it, but I want a shorter travel SL bike for my next emtb. 55 lbs is just a lot to throw around on tight trails.
Because these have an ISIS spindle, there is a lot of choice for crank length. I bought mine with 165mm, but more recently fitted Miranda 155mm, and love them.
You need to try the bafang M820 if I r looking for compact battery and less powerful motor
I hope CYC takes your input seriously. It's the kind of R&D that is hard to come by for a company with good engineers and city cyclists but not necessarily experienced mountain bikers. I would definitely consider this conversion if the battery and motor were smaller.
Another great one Steve! Question…what bike rack is that and do you recommend? Thanks!
You should check out the compact batteries (and improved chargers) from Electrify Bike. And I also wish CYC would offer a smaller 750W limit motor-but unfortunately, it might not be the most profitable since so many of their customers seem to want a mini electric motorcycle regardless of any laws…
Awesome RSD, looking to get an RSD Middlechild frame to replace a middlechild frame I sold 2 years ago. Great to see a good non carbon fiber full sus.
The ideal frame for this motor to mount has a straight lower downtube, with a curved upper section. This steepens the downtube and allows you to get the motor horizontal in front of the BB instead of under. Unfortunately many FS bikes have the same frame shape as yours (my Trance is the same) and that reduces clearance a little.
Nice video! What battery are you running? A52 or A52L? I can't find the exact specs, but it looks like they're both the same size. If you're looking for a smaller battery, check out the smaller options from Electrify Bike or Bicycle Motor Works.
I just put this kit on my son's new 26" Trailcraft full suspension bike. I have been looking at it for a while and it will be great because I don't want him having an E bike for most rides, but can easily put it on for bike trips to Bentonville, etc, where he needs the help to last a full week.
I have had good luck with the 52v 10ah packs from electrify bike company. They are just the right size to fit in a small under the seat or frame bag which makes it less noticeable. I also find the range is just fine with the 10ah size.
You can run brake sensors to disable the motor and lightly pull the brake when shifting to preserve the drivetrain. There are also gear shift sensors available to do the same thing. People report wearing out a drivetrain per season with 1000watts. Id get cheap microshift cassettes and just consider them a wear item. 9speed isnt so bad with a motor.😊
I've personally been running this system since they were first released. You do NOT need brake or gear sensors at all because this system has torque sensing and not just cadence sensing like Bafang - you can't compare the two. Waste of time, more clutter and add zero functionality. Throttle is however useful.
Im running microshift acolyte 8 speed on this now and I'm loving it
I loved this video and the one you installed the unit. Looks like so much fun to ride. Will this work on retro bikes without disc brakes? I'm still riding a 97' RM Altitude with a wonderful tange prestige ultralight steel frame. I never want to stop riding it.
Ebike kit does not care what type of brakes you have. It would work fine.
However, just like putting a v8 in your tiny sports car, upgrading power without upgrading brakes is risky. You'll be going 3x the speed, so I'd want 3x the brake power.
@@BigBrainParty yea that makes sense. I have magura hydraulic brakes. Not as strong as disc brakes but pretty strong. I saw a video with a different ebike kit that was attached to the brake rotor. I must have mixed it up with your video when i asked my question. Anyway, this unit looks incredible. Thanks for always giving us great content.
@@danielhartwig3150there are hydraulic switches to cut the throttle signal to the motor while breaking. If you really wanted to you could run something like that. I've seen that rotor drive system you are talking about. Looks pretty unreliable to me. I dont think it would cope well with dirt and it is placing weight in the worst possible spot on the bike. Time will tell but regular mid drive kits seem like the best tool for a regular feeling bike that will see true mtb riding.
@@dansacco1964 i agree. And just imagine this ebike kit just a bit smaller - can't wait.
Awesome video! I did want to touch on the wattage limit. The 750w limit refers to the motors rated wattage not what you can apply in the settings. Because the Photon is 750w rated you can even increase the power to 1200w and still be legal. If this wasn't the case even some 250w motors wouldn't be legal as they can peak above that. And second as you touch on because the photon can be used with aftermarket batteries and you don't need that much capacity you can always get a aftermarket one with less capacity. And because cyc uses heavy aluminum their batteries are very heavy for the capacity. I'm not sure which CYC battery you have bought even comparing to the smaller 500wh one its roughly 3lbs heavier than a aftermarket with the same capacity
Regarding a lighter battery, my motor is rated at 750w nominal, 1000w max. In reality, it pins in the 1370's (watts). I tried a lighter battery with high amp discharge cells (lower amp hours per cell) and found that under full throttle, the voltage sag was dropping into an unsafe level, way below 3 volts per cell. Even though I used high-amp cells, there were not enough of them collectively to produce a high enough amp discharge for the high drain motor. Mounting the heavier battery under the downtube as I mentioned in my other comment made the bike feel light as it took a bunch of weight off of the front end.
I love it... I'm building a trek stache with the same kit... I'm building a ss fully rigid commuter belt drive... Unfortunately there is no way of converting the front chainring to a gates. I'm thinking of mounting a small battery on the bottom of the down tube that way I can have space for a frame bag. I'm also thinking of a no display throttle only when I need it kind of bike.
In my opinion the CYC is the motor you want if you bike park ride. I run the CYC Photon on my trail bike and ToSeven DM02 on my commuter bike.
A few years ago, I installed a Bafang 750w mid-drive kit on my Trek Marlin 5. Now of course I know it's not really meant for rougher trails but I made it with the purpose in mind as a commuter / gravel e-bike. It has been absolutely awesome and still going to this day so I do know that e-bike kits definitely have a viability for different options for riding. Just as in your experience, its still much lighter than many of the other factory built e-bikes.
Then wouldn't you know it, just recently Trek made the Marlin + coincidence? LOL
Is it a crazy idea to have a backpack battery system, one with a good, quick-disengagement design for accidental crashes? Or are the batteries just too heavy?
Regarding the BB threads, I did the same thing that you did as the motor spindle would not fit through my 24mm Shimano BB and wondered (hoped) it would not wreck my threads. I recently watched a guy install a Bafang motor for the first time. He measured the motor spindle at 30mm and bought an FSA 30mm BB. Naturally, I thought "why didn't I think of that?"
Thats som good thinking! I dont think there's an option to do that on this design sadly. The cups that thread together take up the entire bb shell. They're far bigger than 30mm.
Your 24mm refers to the crank spindle size, and doesn't specify the actual BB size (how it interfaces with the frame). Photon is most easily fitted to BSA BBs in a range of widths, but can be adapted to anything bigger than that with adapters. For example BB86 is pressfit has a shell diameter of 41mm, so can be adapted down to BSA 34.8mm size and in fact CYC sell adapters for just this application. You can adapt any BB with a width that suits one of the 3 widths of Photon available, as long as the frame around the BB is thin enough to fit between the motor case and the shaft assembly (about 11mm).
hi, happy new year and hopefully a healthy one for you. I've been thinking about the CYC Photon for a while as I read it was having an over heating problem.
However, would love to know how you get on with it after a few weeks. It will be going on a 25 year Giant Boulder Sports Series 26" wheels, cromoly double butted frame and no suspension, still a great ride.
I think if you run it at max power, the full 1200watts all the time, you could get ot to overheat. This video was filmed at 95* F with 90% humidity. Zero overheating, but im usually not using more than 500w
how you liking the trails there? the environment reminds me of my motherland Slovakia a lot.
I miss Sedona's tech. I always prefer tech to flow, but I'm grateful for any day on the trail.
I’m curious about suspension settings and how you accommodate the additional weight on a bike that was designed for rider weight alone.
But all riders weigh different? Some riders might weigh 220 pounds, others 150 lbs. Thats a 70 lb difference, and its not an issue. You just tune front and rear suspension for a bit of extra weight. 17 pounds is nothing on a modern mountain bike.
Great video
Put a stem water bottle mount on your bike, they are actually really convenient…i had to use one on a older yeti
I may have missed it but what size is your battery and what kind if range are you getting?
Something like a Fox Float DPS on the back, might allow to drop the battery down significantly for all around better performance?
I've smacked the motor and cranks so many times and broke one raceface chester pedal oops. Gotta find some shorter cheap cranks. 6k miles on this system after I broke my back :)
I wonder what a 1250W 26" 'EJ' bike with a throttle would be like to ride😜
A bit heavy in the nose obviously but with a super short back end I bet it'd still power wheelie!
Edit: If I go this route I might put the front brake back on 🤔
Companies like this would have me if they made smaller motors and batteries that weighed less. 350 watt max motor would work for me. I don't need 5 levels of assist either. Preferably a torque sensor. If it's lightweight I don't need a big battery or power. I like the idea of the skarper design that removes quickly and is lightweight. I would love to change my bike from e bike to analog on the fly.
what drivetrain setup are you running with the photon?
I’d love to fit one on my Mojo HD3 but I can barely get a water bottle on the frame, let alone a battery. Unless it can fit underneath. Has anyone tried?
totally agree, I regret buying an enduro bike
I live in the NW Arkansas area what trail is this?
What voltage did you use? It seems there are 36 - 52 V Ranges.
I was about to buy it but its not legal anymore right? Sad
Welp. Im getting this kit for sure. Currently waiting on a warranty frame on my ebike. Would much rather have a normal bike converted
How do you find the unassisted pedalling? I've got a bafang and it has some resistance with the power off.
I cant compare it to a bafang, but I much prefer it over other ebikes. The sprag clutch means instant engagement, which is great
Is there any resistance when not using the assist?
Been thinking of putting this setup on my wife’s bike since she’s riding a kids 26” and no one makes an e-bike she can fit decently
There are starting to be more and more kids ebikes out there. Specialized, marin, and mondraker make some that I've seen
Would this work with 2022 Santa Cruz Tall Boy?
для облегчения велосипеда: перенеси аккумулятор в рюкзак, удлинив провод подключения.
I really do not like that there is no torque arm or other means of preventing the motor from rotating in the BB. I guess when it decides to rotate, the motor body just crashes into the frame down tube or your ISCG tabs (yuck!). 110 Nm seems like plenty of torque to overwhelm the frictional interface between the motor assembly and the BB shell.
I've been into ebikes for almost 20 yrs and agree with you totally, the power on most ebikes/kits are total overkill. I would love to see someone produce a light weight kit that gives just a little assistance. 250w is plenty imo. Check out the BMX chimera, motors don't have to be heavy, it's the gear reduction that is most important since electric motors like to spin fast.
Great for DIY but if u don't have the time just buy the big wigs nothing to worry about your home burning up plus Bosch set up is amazing and Shimano integrates with your Garmin can't compete with that but I do appreciate the folks who like diy they are great for that