Are E-collars cruel? Do electric collars SHOCK dogs? Is a vibrating collar better than an e-collar?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 19 พ.ย. 2018
- The fact that the English government is looking to ban e-collars (‘shock collars’ if you get excited by media hype), yet considers both vibration collars and electronic containment system collars to be perfectly acceptable, shows just how little empirical research and understanding of canine individuality they actually have.
Jamie penrith of take the lead dog training.
How do I train a dog? Through a healthy balance of motivation, based on reward training; consistent repetition of consequences; establishing boundaries and discipline early on; understanding what makes each dog tick and so developing a healthy relationship between my dogs and myself. The same consistent method - namely fair, situational training, with a committed undertone of enhancing welfare and establishing freedom through control. This might involve clicker; verbal marker training; whistle trained commands; slip lead or leash pressure; physical pressure; verbal and spatial pressure and e-collar pressure and a TON of love and respect for being the amazing animal that is the dog!
If you would like to build your relationship with your dog or young puppy; if you would like to learn more about how to train your dog to perform reliably and how to use a variety of different training tools to get the very best out of your relationship with your dogs; contact Jamie Penrith either through his website www.taketheleadtraining.co.uk or email him directly at: jamie@taketheleadtraining.co.uk
Jamie Penrith at Take the Lead Dog Training offers professional, private 1-2-1 dog training and behaviour modification services throughout the U.K. and beyond. Having worked with thousands of dogs and owners, Jamie Penrith is the national media lead representative on the humane, professional and proportionate use of electronic training aids ( electric collars / shock collars / e-collars) throughout England.
Jamie Penrith has been involved at English parliamentary level; advising members of parliament in London and throughout England on the professional use of electric training aids for dogs, in line with enhancing animal welfare, safety, control and responsible stewardship.
Jamie Penrith is incredibly passionate, dedicated and committed to educating dog owners and persons involved in the care, control and stewardship of dogs throughout the British Isles. Jamie is the founder member of The Association of Responsible Dog Owners (www.joinardo.com). This is the first and only association of its kind in Britain, representing and educating responsible dog ownership from ordinary, everyday dog owners and e-collar users. The Association is not-for-profit, and runs an active survey for dog owners with experience in the use of electronic training aids for pets - including e-collars, electric pet containment systems and anti-bark collars. This survey is unique, since it serves to gather first-hand information regarding electronic pet training aids, without bias of agenda. Presently, from hundreds of dog owners who have completed the training aid survey, over 99% report NO NEGATIVE EFFECTS on the welfare and behaviour of their dogs or cats, with 92% reporting that training their dog or cat with the use of an electronic training aid RESOLVED the problem behaviour. For further details on this survey, please email: info@joinardo.com
Jamie penrith has appeared on multiple national and regional TV and radio shows throughout the U.K. He is a passionate, intelligent and polite national expert speaker on the use of electronic training aids for dogs, speaking and providing honest, accurate, expert advice on live TV debates against the U.K. national vet of the year, prominent U.K. doctors in animal behaviour and professional animal behaviourists. Jamie Penrith has been sought and trusted to live and train with many dogs, including a those of high celebrity status. He is confidential with an exceptional level of personal integrity.
Jamie’s appearances include:
ITV Good Morning Britain
ITV This Morning
Channel 5 The Wright Stuff
Sky News
BBC Breakfast
Channel 5 The Dog Rescuers
TalkRadio Matthew Wright Show
BBC Spotlight Southwest
BBC Radio 5-Live
BBC Radio Kent
BBC Radio Newcastle
BBC Radio Cornwall
BBC Radio Scotland
BBC Radio Oxford
BBC Radio Hereford
BBC Radio Merseyside
BBC Radio Solent
TalkRadio
LBC Radio
Radio Plymouth
Travelling to provide expert and discreet dog training and behaviour modification throughout England, Scotland, Ireland and Wales, Jamie Penrith is also available for public speaking, canine behaviour seminars and workshop appearances for all dog-related organisations and businesses throughout the U.K. and beyond.
Jamie Penrith also offers personal, residential dog training in his bespoke board and train, dog obedience boot camp programmes. Providing full, structured training for your dog or puppy.
www.taketheleadtraining.co.uk
It makes dog feel alarmed. If something is vibrating in my neck, I would be very alarmed as well.
Would you rather have your dog trained or be put down because they hot to out of control if used the right way it doesn't hurt it feels as if you were to plug in your phone and it gave you a shock it's uncomfortable but that's the point.
Stop the zero-sum argument, it doesn't work and neither do these torture collars.@@zoooweeemama1808
And they DO HURT, try them out yourself if you're so righteous about that.@@zoooweeemama1808
I just bought a Dr.Trainer Dog Training Collar for my German shepherd. This Training Collar has auto retractable and will not cause irritation to my dog's neck. Also I can record my voice to the system, I can use my voice recording to train my dog, say goodbye to the traditional beep sound for good. So far it seems really effective. All I do is pressing the voice recording button to correct my dogs behavior. We hardly have to use the shock setting.
If you don't have time to properly train a dog, then how about not getting a dog.
@@camilomorales9500 so you mean people like you lmao honey that's how you train a dog who doesn't listen Verbally Obviously you don't k how much about that why do you think so many dogs get into shelters or Are on the streets..... because people can't handle them dogs aren't human therefore can't understand everything we say When used right and on the lowest setting they work great I know someone who used one And her dog wasn't faded by it or what y'all say "traumatize" but she listens when her owner Says to it's not a matter of time you have to train the dog it's what works. And her dog is the happiest dog ever.
Yes! I love the sound ones or potentially vibration verses shocks. I hate the shocks it’s terrible and the burns they get is awful. I love the fact they have voice recorded commands to help them learn
@@camilomorales9500 it’s not about time in a lot of cases. Some dogs are very difficult and have different fears and such that have to be controlled for safety if the animal and the society it’s in.
@@Iloverandomness100 Then how about not getting a dog that you know you can't control.
Obviously it depends on the dog, but out of interest what level of electronic stimulation generally elicits a similar level of response to the vibration?
James Bradwell exactly as you say, entirely individual and contextual. As such, the levels are largely irrelevant , the Dog is the dial.
Yep. My dog + his environment and its distractions are the dial. In my case the vibrate gets absolutely zero response out of him. I'm sure he feels it but seems totally fine just ignoring it. I've tried to keep it as an "interruptor" but it's useless in my case.
But on the other hand you have trainers such as panzertoo who seem to have high levels of success with pager/vibrate
@@JamiePenrithDogTraining excuse me for asking that but are you from New Jersey? You have this very charismatic accent... (that I love by the way)
The vibration really worried the dog,not so with the stim. Mind you I do use a bleeping/pager as a warning prior to any stim.
Dogs have feelings people need to know this they can feel you can’t just think their a toy
yeah they do, but dogs also need to be punished when they do things wrong, the only thing thats a bit eof;w is that fact that he's punishing the dog when they aren't doing anything wrong
True, if a big dog is biting people use it or just being bad at all time use it but dont over use it or use it in a moment of anger, because eif a big dog bites it get put down what's worse a lil shock or death. So I agree with you
@@jayskelley1917 u can train a aggresive dog without a e colar
@@tango5074 You sick wanker. Dogs do not need to be punished.
@William Petersson Oh yes i 100% agree, but think of dogs in the wild. If they do something wrong, the alpha dog will give them a nip to punish them. An e-collar is the same idea
Dog *what are you doing?
Vibration definitely work but only if they were shocked a few times before with the vibration on
Wrong
That is cruel.
I had this very same experience but with a e collar and a spray collar, with the e collar the dogs reaction was a short sharp reaction then over with, with the spray collar using citrus spray the dogs reaction was more exaggerated sniffing sneezing and just looked more mentally in discomfort
Alpine160 and yet David Ryan - The former chair of The Association of Pet Behaviour Counselors and a parliamentaryadvisor on canine welfare - advocates (in his published book) not only spray over stimulation, but the utterly senseless practise of soaking cotton wool balls in lemon concentrate beforehand, holding them firmly against the scent receptors in the mouth of the dog for a good minute beforehand - to intensify the disgust in the dog ...... Go figure .....
No. I can’t tell the difference! Someone says vibrate not shock yes my dog doesn’t respond to the stim like vibrate so is vibrate worse or better? Not in effectiveness but for pain
Wow....way to mess with your dogs head...your applying stim for no reason. If she was trained with it already, she would look up at you...not at the leash confused. Which is exactly how I know you have no idea what you're doing.
Hes one of thousands incompetent trainers that has a huge lack of knowledge.
Exactly my thought the dog been trained on a shock coller not a vibrating collar. If anything hes just confusing his own dog
What’s a scenario where you have to use high power
When a dog is running towards a car that could run him over
When lower setting is not working and the dogs life or a humans is on the line most dogs are ok with e collars we used properly It's not really a bad shock kinds like when you plug your phone in and get a little shock it doesn't hurt at all I always test myself first and to make sure my dog is ok with the setting
What is the goal of the collar? Just to get the dogs attention or to give a continuous uncomfortable feeling that is turned off as soon as the dog does what he is supposed to do.
It's a torture device that these dopes claim "doesn't hurt" yet we never see them trying it ON THEMSELVES, I wonder why.
*Untrue* The very first thing I did was try the collar on myself so that I knew exactly what sort of stimulation the different settings gave. I love my dogs and the only reason I even considered using an e-collar was to be able to train a specific behaviour from continuing where other methods failed. I rescued a 4 year old Labrador from Romania, that had been left alone with zero interaction with other dogs or people. He's a lovely dog but would have repeated episodes of being hyper and shoulder barging my elder Labrador, to the point they would fight and cause injury. Because he gets so hyper any commands to stop were ignored. This was even worse when the dogs were off their leads, as I wouldn't be there to break them apart. It took me an hour and using the e-collar 4 times (in vibration mode) to get his attention and train that behaviour out of the dog. It's still early days, but he hasn't bullied my other Labrador for nearly a week now. He has started on him but now immediately listens to my command and the whistle, which I used alongside the e-collar during the training. Hopefully, I will be able to throw the collar away very soon! They are a tool that can be hugely effective when used correctly.
Where there IS a potential problem with e-collars, is when they are used by shitty owners that abuse their use and their dogs. Owning any dog is a privilege and should be treated as such. Any owner that abuses their dog and the use of e-collars should be prosecuted! @@radicalreactions1633
what happens if you give the same shock intensity used here, to a human? I really would like to know, is it bearable?
I know with my dog, he starts feeling it at level 8 and his happy range is around 8-15 (depending on his surroundings).
If I put the collar on my face I can just about feel level 15. To feel it on my neck it’s around level 30 before I sense it.
These e-collars are like cars. They are invaluable and improve everyones life if used responsibly but do also have the potential to cause pain and problems. I’m pro e-collar but i’d love to see them sold only to professional trainers and behaviourists as you do need training or lots of prior knowledge to use it positively.
No.
You're full of shit. You ain't never tried it on yourself.@@danielfry8882
Are you saying the sensation isn't bearable for a human? As that is untrue. The ''shock'' is actually a tingling sensation that's a little like putting your tongue on the terminals of a small battery. Obviously you can turn up the intensity but it's best to use the lowest setting possible. @@radicalreactions1633
Mate you can tell they the dog don’t like it
Lmao that's kinda the point duh derp duh derp hahah
better for it to get shocked than do someone really bad and get put down
@@soph_- or run into the road in front of cars
@@soph_- very strange, I have 3 big dogs never use one of this torture tool and they never hurt someone, maybe u just too lazy for train your dog?
Saturno D'angelo haha do you want to come and train my dog dickhead
I think shock collars are ok as long as you use then right, you cant use them out of anger or annoyance. And if you have a big dog that bites other and you cant stop it, use shock collars because if your dog bites someone your dog will be put down.
If you shock a dog whilst it's biting you, you will get electrocuted too it jumps to you from the dog.
Would you like it if I walked up to you a zapped you so hard you fall over?
You don't scare and hurt the dog into being nice, you train it and show that what it did was wrong
@fml dave aggressive dogs are usually scared or stressed. Shocking it won't do shit
@@drunkkhajit5035 hello, fellow elder scrolls fan lol, my cat attacks me for food aggression, and its downright dangerous.
true, you are far more likely to get the dog redirecting onto the nearest thing. e-collar needs to be trained properly and used as a form of communication, not punishment.
Try it yourself and see how fun it is.
I'm more concerned that the slip lead is being used incorrectly.
The slip lead is not really being used, its just there as the dog isn't properly off leash trained
I also tried this out today in anticipation of the e-collar ban. i assume i will be ok to use the vibrate and sound functions if i remove the stimulation contact point from the collar.. luckily i have all ready trained down as my dogs response to the beep function which is great but not over confident how much help that beep will be when there is sheep or deer to chase.... she hates the vibrate function!! it scares the crap out of her! so much so that she was trying to run away from it which has never ever happened using the regular stimulation not even at correction levels. thumbs down to using vibrate from me.
but that's just your dog tho, (no hate), but just because your dog is scared doesnt mean every other dog will be
My dog will stop for the beep and if he doesn't he definitely stops for the vibrate but when he's trying to chase a cat I gotta shock him to get his attention
And just because you're still alive doesn't mean you have a functioning brain.@@tango5074
Stim is too high. Should barely see an ear twitch unless correcting for something very serious. My dog finds the vibrate aversive and the e-collar stim as a correction he knows how to turn off.
This is a good and humane tool plus it save dogs from being put down but it seems like you're using it wrong. You're showing him when he is listening to you. You should do it if he refuses to do it so wait for a couple of seconds before activating it.
The best way to find the lowest level of stimulation is when a dog is not focused on you. If they are misbehaving/distracted (which is the most likely reason a well adjusted dog wouldn't listen) they would need a higher level- plus this dog may be behaved enough that it's hard to catch them not listening. The lowest level they respond to should not be bothersome or even register as punishment to a properly trained dog, especially when only done for a quick video :)
BS.
My dog used to have one (my parents out it on him not meh) but now their illegal very glad
Why the he'll would this person use a 'correction' tool when this girl is behaving perfectly at the time. I am pro sensation collars as a training aid, but they are not a toy to tap away on continually. To be used as a correction/training tool, otherwise you just confuse the dog
How do you work out how the dog perceives a sensation without allowing the dog to experience the sensation?
How do you determine which ‘correction’ tool is most appropriate for the individual without allowing the animal to answer on its own behalf?
E-collars are not simply ‘correction’ tools. They activate as much as they inhibit, and the principal use is activation.
My dog would run for cars man shock collar suppressed that yo
Fuck u
You just contradicted yourself, yo.
This is an absurd test.
If the dog is used to the shock because she's been trained that way, then her reaction to the shock is conditioned. Whereas if she is not used to the vibration, it is a new feeling and cause the reaction in the video. This does not prove that the shock doesn't actually cause the dog to feel pain.
Thank you! I was worried no one would point that out.
The dog is not feeling any pain what so ever. Pain is NOT part of training with an e-collar. You know it is possible to feel electrical stimulation without pain, right? It happens every day in doctor's offices all around the world. E-collars, aka shock collars have a bad reputation because far too many people who know little about training dogs and even less about the collars. At the moment these folks hear the word "shock" they are instantly transformed into experts regarding all things canine. Despite having zero experience or knowledge of the subject.
@@renaissanceman7145 I don't deny that there are e-collars that can be used effectively and not cause pain. However, it's been shown many times that a lot of shock/e-collars do cause pain, even at low settings.
That wasn't even the point of my comment anyway. The point is that different stimulus causes different reaction and this video doesn't prove anything at all.
@@zuxzux every e-collar CAN cause pain but that's not how n it's supposed to be used. If I have an e-collar that causes pain on a low setting it's defective and getting returned .
I took your point to be the owner was using the collar to pinish the dog which you said despite that clearly not being the case.
@@renaissanceman7145 I said nothing about punishment. What are you talking about.
Surely the vibrate collar can be introduced at low levels with food as a positive association. With that training you wouldn’t get what looks like the heightened response from your GSD. Slow and careful conditioning is what’s required to turn it into a positive experience.
Yep my dog gets super excited if he sees the collar or hears the beep, he knows he gets to go somewhere, lmao
The point is that the vibrate doesn't have levels
@@hunterurban5465 yep I found that out when I got mine. I conditioned the pup to the vibrate and she’s never reacted badly too it. I do reinforce with the stim if need be. She is a deaf working type English setter. So her hunting drive even at 7 months is through the roof. Without the collar she would never have been able to be off lead. Now she runs and hunts with my other pointers and I have total confidence in her recall, change of direction and her drop to flush.
@@hunterurban5465 The one I have vibrate and sound, has 99 levels. What are you talking about!
@@ROBDee-ho9lu exactly so does mine
thanks for watching the video
She is feeling pain
😭
Shut up
You obviously don't know anything about E-collars and have just jumped to conclusions smh
I just wanna say that all you e collar haters who think that dogs are "fur babies", that this isn't cruel. It's a great way for telling your dog no. It's only cruel if you use it in an abusive way by clicking the button when they are being good, or turning it up high and holding it down which is cruel. However normal civilised ppl dont do this. Wolves and wild dogs will get nipped, bitten or scratched if they are disobeying their pack leader. The human is the pack leader so if the dog is disobeying you, you can give it a little shock. I've held an e collar to my neck and tested it and i couldn't feel a think until lvl 14.
Think of it like this....
If your dog is violent and you are a "ohhh i dont want to tell my little fur baby off" kinda person and your dog bites someone, that dog is gonna get put down. If you had an e collar, your dog would be shocked and would never have to be put down. So instead of just looking at this video and believing all these soft dog owners, you should actually listen to people who really know how to train a dog like this guy, there is nothing wrong with what he is doing.
And I just want to tell all you animal abusers, unless you have the huevos to use it ON YOURSELF, don't be using it on an animal. It ALL abusive, schmuck-the-clown. Looks like you're tangoing by yourself, I don't know anyone that would put up with this level of stupidity.
vibration is actually much more aversive for dogs then the low level shock. most people don't realize this.
My dog loves to chase a certain cat we have and she doesn't listen very well when we Try to Verbally train her that's why I'm trying to learn about these and how to use them properly she's not aggressive to humans just our one cat😂 She darts over to it right when she gets outside I'm also going to crate train her she just turned 1 and haven't been able to train her From personal issues this past year.
Before you use a shock collar use food training to keep her away from the cat
You can't just verbally train a dog
@@spencercorpuz Don't you think I've tried all that? Not all dogs listen all she would do is grab the treat and run right back to the cat😂 I'm not going to shock her I'm getting one that has a vibration and only shock when her life is on the line when she's running out in the road. I think I know When I've done all i could do with That She is just to stubborn.
@@spencercorpuzbut she doesn't listen and cats alot bigger then a treat that being said don't use it all the time
@@slapbass8723 lol you can't just say "she doesn't listen" .. of course she doesn't. That's what the training is for 😂 I swear, some people shouldn't own dogs
This should be banned dogs can feel shocking them is not right
It’s for training and if they are bad. There dig doesn’t always do positive training
How you shock a wolf with an electric collar
Shock collars should be made illegal because they don't do a dog any good, all they do is stress the dog out.
A dog in avoidance behavior. The opposite of joyful obedience. The typical bullshit of an unable trainer that doesn't know how to build orientation and obedience and needs abusive tools to compensate his lack of knowledge. 😂
Yep, a lazy wannabe "Trainer," who's just a glorified dog owner.
Quess what none of them are good!!! The collars are all bad and horrible!!! People who do this to a precious dog need to really STOP HURTING THEM😭❤🐶🙏🐕❤😭
The fuck is a fog
Of course a GACHA account would comment this...lol
Shut the Fuck up dramaqueen we are training our dogs to behave even the military uses that it’s easier for the dogs if they have rules to follow
why yall gotta bully just cause they are a gacha user
and everyone makes typing mistakes so thats rude ksjdgsksh
Hi, e collars and prong collars arent cruel, what cruel is people who treat their dogs like humans, let them get fat, dont punish them and then twine when their dogs become rowdy and misbehaving
Totally inhumane. It is quite clear the dog is worried and not happy. Totally unacceptable and your video should be removed
It is cruel. Trainers who use these awful torture devices are animal abusers and should not be allowed to be trainers.
Habe you ever seen these collars in correct use? Have you ever seen a dog correct another one totally force free?
Not defending these for any situation, but they are no animal abuse in general. Thats just nonsense.
Shocked dogs are stressed by the presence of their handler because they anticipate being shocked
Lol, tell that to my happy, safe, off leash remote collar trained dog. I'll let her know when she comes lick my face everyday I wake up.
You are not using them properly! If you don't fully understand you should not be using them!
No matter HOW you use these torture devices, they STILL HARM THE DOG.
Do electric collars shock dogs😑😑😑 no shit shurloc it’s called an e collar for a reason