No disrespect to you, but where was it ever said that they didn't talk for 6 years. Also they still had 2 years of UA as well. What was said was since they all started working it was hard to plan meet ups meaning they all still see each other, just not as often, again no disrespect, but what's with this mean spirited topic of Izuku being "ghosted" when that was not stated or implied at all. If anything what was said debunks that entirely.
i can see where you're coming from, but honestly, i really think some of the blame is a bit misplaced here. shows like steven universe is geared to younger kids and anime like MHA, a shounen anime, is geared to teenagers, so some Common Teenager Behavior (thinking they're right and being loud about it, active on social media and having some takes that may be questionable, arguing online about their takes, etc) is somewhat expected. it's just the demographics, though i can see why it can get read as toxic. shows geared towards adults with more mature approach generally aren't quite as loud or confrontational. and i can guarantee you even with the older shows like naruto, bleach, sailor moon, etc there are absolutely fans who are toxic about shipping and will get in your face about it, we just didn't have twitter yet and anime didn't quite have the same reach back then. in a way, i think we should all remember that most of the time the way to really enjoy fandom is to find your own peaceful, comfy spot and camp out there with likeminded people who just want to chill and hang. i was in voltron fandom and i didn't even realize half the drama was happening because that was exactly what i was doing. granted, i don't use twitter, so that's probably a big reason why.
Arcane was alright. I don't think it failed really, it just didn't live up to its fullest potential. The CaitVi scene in ep8 was not as bad as people think, it was just poorly placed sorta. They clearly wanted Ekko to be the one to save Jinx so they had to give Vi something else to do and that something else was Cait apparently. I do think shipping is generally an issue with shows but for me that wasn't the biggest issue of the show. I could definitely buy into the idea that Vi would switch sides after what she experienced after all the time she spent in jail (Silco and the gangs ruining the underground and Jinx commiting war crimes, essentially destroying Vander's legacy) and also by meeting Cait and seeing how the upsiders weren't as bad as she thought. However, what I actually had an issue with was how the initial conflict from season 1 was pushed to the side for a strange magic plot and outsiders attacking Piltover, forcing everyone to now work together. It felt very rushed, as if I was watching 2 seasons of content all crammed into 1. I feel like the conflict between Piltover and Zaun was interesting and the first 3 episodes did focus on that but I think it should've been stratched to an entire season where it was better explored and ending it with the Vi vs Jinx confrontation. It would've given the characters and their relationships more time to develop, especially Cait and Vi. Then the 3rd and final season could focus more on healing the wounds from the previous events and developing the final conflict against Noxus and Viktor. I also really didn't like Isha's inclusion as it basically worked as a plot device to force Jinx back into the good side, which I found a little cheap. So yeah, overall it was pretty badly handled. They simply needed to give the story more time. As it stands now, Arcane is a show with beautiful animation and a good soundtrack but a lackluster story overall. (Edit: Also, the Vander Warwick plot I feel like went nowhere. It was just there to mentally scar Vi again for some reason. As if she didn't have enough of that already.)
yess I totally agree with that, though I feel like there were even more random moments like Viktor randomly leaving Jayce the rose girl thingie (I've had no idea on what was going on with that one. Why does Mel have powers outta nowhere suddenly) the Isha plot (what you said basically) the Vander plot (what you've mentioned too) the 'romance' between Jinx and Ekko (it might be confusing to some, but I find their romance random. I haven't seen their signs of that 'love' before) the Maddie plot (she had like what? 12 minutes of screentime? also her being in Caitlyn's bed..c'mon, it's like she came out of a fanfiction) Jinx and Vi suddenly reconnecting as sisters after trying to kill themselves (it would've been good if it had more time to develop) and some more I can't really think of Also what they set up in the last ep of the 1st season (killing half of the council) was totally ignored later. It was the biggest cliffhanger, yet the death of these 3 councils was mentioned for one episode at last. And the fact that some (if not most) characters felt out-of-character. Jinx before was unpredictable, the definition of literal chaos just to become a show girl later. Yea, she used to do things "for-show" before, like her bomb signature, however the "big fat hero" felt like something a different character would've said. Or the line "what's wrong with my pants?" - it sounds like it's just made to make people laugh at it or drop that line on social media. Like, these lines are not bad, but they just don't feel like Jinx anymore. I understand they wanted her to change, but it felt out of place. I've heard from Vi's fans that she felt like an NPC, that she's had almost no character development. I'm not sure about other characters, so I'll leave it on those two.
@Chakinpop5800 Of course it's not the worst season in the world. Just wasted potential when you consider the first season. First season took its time and was overall a lot more solid. Comparing it to the Acolyte and Rings of Power really doesn't mean much either cause any decent show is better than that.
@@ether2275 True, Every show he mentioned in this video are on a much higher level of storytelling, characters, world building, depth, and messaging than The Acolyte, Rings Of Power, or even Game Of Thrones.
Horikoshi has a twitter it's been blowing up with queerbaiting, telling him to kill himself (I wish I was joking but I'm not.), saying he shouldn’t write another manga (which I find hypocritical given comic writers) and more. It's been fun, crazy, and inventive. Confused on 1 thing do u believe what MosIIey said or no?
@wendylacey2745 FR like I ❤️ MHA but I'm also going to criticize it and there are things in the ending I did not like but people be taking their dislike way to far like sending death threats all because 2 boys aren't fucking says more about them. Not like Horikoshi's going to see them or care, but it's still distasteful and honestly sad.
Regardless of what you think of these series before or now, at the end of the day, they all managed to accomplish many things during there runtime. Both good and bad. There are a lot of things that are flawed about each of those shows, but we still find ways to love them regardless. There is really no shame in that.
@ Thank you. I do wish that these shows could have been more than what they turned out to be, but they all had genuine effort put into them. In a way I’m glad series like these exist, because even though they won’t really be making it in your top tens or higher, they are a great source for entertainment and fun memories.
I honestly don’t engage with the negative parts of fandom. Sure I’ll put in some thoughtful discussion and critiques within the context of the story as opposed to my own imagined version of the story shoved in other people’s faces. At the end of the day, I appreciate a good quality storytelling and forced character dynamics to please an overbearing minority projecting their imaginations onto an already established story should never be the case. Heck I’m even a Timebomb shipper but I’m mature enough to understand certain dynamics shouldn’t be rewritten or erased from the story that’s been established. That would ruin the quality of the overall story imo, unless the author possessed the godly ability to incorporate changes that might elevate the material (but that’s unrealistic). Fanfics should stay separate from the original work. There’s my 2 cents.
I respect you for saying the things you did and I agree with the points you made. I just don't think the conclusion has anything to do with the faults you found in Arcane. I actually think you hold that perspective on Arcane because you find too much similarity with it and shows you had problems with and conflate their poor writing with the events in Arcane. I also think you have this perspective because you might just not know the source material. I say this with love. I really was engaged with your argument but I just don't think it applies in the same way to Arcane. To understand the character arcs in Arcane you have to know that Arcane is an adaptation. You have to understand that Arcane does not just exist alongside League of Legends but purely because of League of Legends. Arcane does so much to expand and interweave the characters that inspired it that I hold the opinion that this is the single greatest adaptation of a video game ever. Arcane is also laced to the very brim with fan service for LoL fans. The very ships that you find issue with have been a part of the characters years before Arcane ever began it's production. Caitlyn and VI have always had hints to their romance through voicelines, dev jokes, dev blogs, game events and official forum posts , you name it this has been an enduring part of the characters for most LoL fans for as long as they can remember. Ekko and Jinx have been a ship that has existed with the characters since the very day May 29 2015 where Ekko has a voice line towards Jinx remarking on his crush of her before she went crazy. Even something as meaningless as finding out the name of the scientist who created shimmer is Reveck was nothing but fan service those who held fan theories on the identity of Orianna's father on the official LoL forums all those many moons ago. Arcane is so full of love and sincere pride in its source material. So much background noise and character threads serve to build on the franchise for the pleasure of the old fans. You may argue that constructing plot lines in the pursuit of fan service is a poor decision but I would argue that when the only reason the show exists in the first place is the love and passion of two old devs who have been with Riot Games since the beginning that their passion for the IP, fan service is what should construct Arcane. It is only the love of the fans that could have birthed this project. In a show that ends every episode with 'Thank you to all League of Legends players past and present.' servicing the fans who made it possible is the one thing all adaptation should accomplish, and to say otherwise would be quite insincere. And the sugar on the cream is that none of the fan service is done poorly. I truly think the Fortiche writing team is incredibly skilled and have constructed such a tidy and concise narrative which really uses each character to their best ability. Does this mean I think Arcane is a masterpiece? No, but for every one problem I have, there are 100 things I think are well done. I truly do credit the writers for their work. To your point about the all the poor writing decisions you identified in the example shows being about people inspired by a generation of badly written cartoons, I also don't think that applies to Arcane's writers. Christian Linke and Alex Yee, the creators and Rioters who pitched the show in the first place, are in their 30s. They would have grown up with the shows you regard as the correct ones to grow up with. I understand your point of people being inspired by badly written media but Arcane is neither poorly written or would have been inspired by any by your metrics. Actually I hope more people are inspired by Arcane and see its success and realise that high quality technical animation can reach a wide and receptive audience. I really did like your video but I have seen so many critiques against Arcane miss the forest for the trees. I really don't want to see yours be one of them. I would love to speak with you on this if you ever respond.
I really appreciate a breakdown like this about how obnoxious shipping culture can get and how it clouds people's judgment of the next stories they consume. I love my toxic, awful ships as much as my fellow "freaks", but I HATE the way some people bend over backwards to try and pretend their favorite toxic ships are actually wholesome somehow...? I dunno if it's just plain immaturity or if it has to do with what shipping wars have turned into, where if your ship *isn't* "wholesome", you get death threats or worse just for enjoying it for fun. x_x People need to learn to be okay with enjoying fictional concepts that would be bad in real life, and maybe then they'll stop making concerningly stupid excuses for their "problematic faves". (People said Bakugou only hit Deku "affectionately"? wha??) Also thank you for talking about all that stuff without condemning the idea of innocent escapism into shipping as a whole. I miss when people could critique fiction without the shitty pearl-clutching. Also I agree about MHA, ugh, I just--stuff like having Ochako get her perfect happy romance with Deku despite ghosting him for 7 years is a turn-off on its own (seriously, that's so un-romantic, ew), but it's downright awful to pair it with a dead minority encouraging her to go live her best girlboss life or some shit. I, god, they did Toga so dirty, wtf. -_- I'm so tired of stories abandoning the politics THEY SET UP when they get messy to cover (and yes, Arcane absolutely does this in season 2, random commenter reading this, cope harder I guess). I'm not reading replies to this lol. But good video, OP! Gave me some stuff to think about. Hope your day is good! :3 Also I'm sorry if I said anything confusing or failed to clarify any of my thoughts. I get pretty easily scatter-brained heheh.
im glad u enjoyed the video! :) yeah i think a lot of ppl are too hellbent on judging ppl who ship certain things, rather than focusing on those bad apples that use it as an excuse to be annoying. none of this is helped by a bad story that subtly encourages that shit like MHA does. cause the actual romances in that show otherwise are terrible 😭
It’s never stated Ochaco ghosted Deku during those 8 years. They were all busy with shit, so they just couldn’t find the time to actually get together.
Ok... I don't want to be rude, so I'll try not to be. But when you watch a popular show, that is targeted towards teens and young adults, the problem is not in "whitе quееr pеоpIе". The problem is in most of the show's fans being childish in their behavior, while simultaneously being the loud majority about it. You saying that they "ruined" their respective fandom is like going to a soup store and complaining that there are no clothes. It's a little silly, don't you think? If you want good story, where it's theme is explored to the fullest and the characters get interesting and fullfilling arcs, you won't go to children to ask for a recommendation, right? But you DO go to those children. Because there are 10 of them in the building and they are all loudly talking about their favorite shows RIGHT NOW! So, who else do you go to? Certainly not to that older woman in the corner with headphones on her head, writing something in a notebook. She is too focused on her own thing, that's too specific of a description and you need people to actually thoughtfully discuss stuff with! }:D In fact, you don't notice her at all. The children are much more noticable, approachable and most certainly would love to talk wiith you about their favorite character for two hours.) So of course you go to them. There is no surprise that in the end you go away unsatisfied.
@@sometimeselii What? 🤨 My point is that you are looking for the wrong thing in fandoms of popular shows, where the loudest are not the smartest, despite being also he most active ones in the fandom. If all you see around is teens and young adults throwing hands and accusations with eachother over fictional characters day and night, you will think that the entire fandom consists of those teens and young adults. So maybe, instead of consuming popular media, where those loudest gather in big numbers and become a majority from a minority, you should look at less attention gathering shows and stories, that often times are much better written, if you don't like fandom culture that much?
Wow so basicly throught 20 minute video you talk about arcane for like a minute and a half at the end and your main point for arcane ,,failing" is that VI and Caitlyn had sex after Jinx ran away. This show has more problems than that but calling it a failure because of something like sex is a bad take. I'm not saying it was good that they did that at that particular moment, I thought it was bad too because of the implication that Vi forgot about her sister when Caitlyn asked her if she wants to fuck. But on the scale of problems that this show has, for me it's really low. Pacing was off, Caitlyn's story arc about being dictator starts and ends in 3 minutes, Ambessa being a morron and her death from idnk being touched I gues, ending Zaun's conflict with Piltover with bigger threat so they unite, these are the problems that you might say made arcane a ,,failure" (of course ignoring everything that it did right for the sake of making a clickbait title so people watch it). And I can't shake the feeling that you had an idea for a video, a good idea, it was intresting to watch + quality was good but included arcane only because it's treding right now so people watch it. And if the whole video was about it I wouldn't mind. But it being such a small portion of it looks like you added it at the last minute just for the algorythm to promote it
I don't think you exactly hit the nail on the head but you made some good points. On another note, man that sex scene was uncomfortable. Like I totally get why it's there, but they didn't need to drag it out like that.
I do think that Arcane had a good ending though, at least Jinx, Jayce, Ekko and Viktor did. Cait, Vi Piltover and Zaun were a bit rushed, but knowing it's not the end of Piltover/Zaun shenanigans means I can live with the 'kumbayah' of it all. Especially because it's not a true kumbayah. I got money on Sevika dying in the next piltover show, essentially.
@@brendajameson5093 out of all universes, their ending was the happiest of them all. At least now, they died in each other's arms saving the world. And when you think about it logically and seeing how things would've gone if certain key moments changed, there's little chance Jayce and Viktor would've met or become close, and in those cases, that either would live long (Viktor from his disease, Jayce from... jumping without getting interrupted, or the explosion that took Other Vi). At least this way, they were able to reach the culmination to each of their arcs, _together._ And isn't it sad, that the happiest universe for them is the one where they sacrifice themselves together for the betterment of the world? But it _is_ their good ending, even if not long-lived. And I, personally, love it.
I do have some criticism about the 2 season, but calling Arcane a failure is literally just cope, it's one if not the most succesful animated shows the west has produced
@@Kantorek17 calling something bad just because YOU didn't like it is really cheap don't you think? Arcane was both loved by the critics and the audience just see the sheer amount of people praising it and how high the reviews are If that doesn't make it good I don't know what would
Good on you for sticking to your gut. S2 is a mess while S1 is a masterpiece. I wish I stuck with my gut when I first heard the show was abruptly ending after S2 (That's not _nearly_ enough seasons to cover all the main characters and conflicts from S1). Arcane should've either been 4-5 seasons long or just ended at S1.
@@Gloomy_Knight-dw5pm I don't blame you for watching S2. After all, we all saw how good S1 was, so we expected S2 to have a similar level of quality. TBH, I think S2 could've wrapped S1's arcs had some characters been cut out (e.g. Mel). For me personally though, one reason I didn't watch S2 was because I've seen too much nonsense with shipping in the past (e.g. RWBY, TLoK) that I wanted to stay FAR away from it.
@@krraika1847 Good intuition. S1 caught us all by surprise. It wasn't _supposed_ to be amazing given the track record of video game adaptations. But it somehow managed to be deep, compelling, had nuanced characters, and was, most importantly, accessible.. With a show that has as many main characters with their own personal conflicts, S2 never stood a chance. Didn't help that they added more plotlines in S2 that only led to more and more cramming and speed running throughout the season. But I think the biggest problem with S2 is that it lost most of its S1 writers (the highly experienced writers). With only the novice writers left (Amanda, Christian, and Alex), S2 was doomed to fall victim to cringe-y shipping bait, dumb character moments, poor pacing, and lots of plot holes. A lot of people probably don't know this but during S1's development, Alex and Christian almost abandoned the project altogether because of how bad the writing was until they hired experienced writers to rewrite S1's story from scratch. So S1 would've sucked too if they didn't. lol S2 is what S1 would've been without the additional help. At least now people will be able to write fan fictions of S2 that have better writing than S2's canon story lol.
This is a pretty interesting video, that ties together a lot of media I am a fan of while not reasonating with me at all. So its kinda like a glimpse in to another world. Maybe its because I got into this a bit later in 2018 or when I was a bit older, but shipping wars and things like that never really entered my radar. Maybe its because I mainly stick to TH-cam and Reddit? Not sure. While it might be a cultural issue you've encountered, it might also be in your circles. I remember my Twitter was full arcane after the last arc dropped with fantastic memes and good times all around, but with in a week it had "stans" at each other's throats discussing things I didn't find relevant at all. One thing I found that makes part taking in fandoms more fun is entering into much smaller ones with less active and older memeber (who don't have all day to doom post). E.g. I've been part of the Vinland Saga (Manga) fandom for 5 years and we are chill af. Sure takes get spicey etc. etc. but the most a fan art will every get on Twitter is like 1k likes. People just don't put all their personality in the thing they like, let along a hyper specfic ship. The larger your fandom, the more people tend to try and find a way to feel "special" and unique. Good video, got me thinking. Which I like!
I think this video applies more so to the 2nd season than the 1st. I don’t know anything about League of Legends and find much of the “shipping” in internet culture to be cringe and I adored it. I loved the characters and their arcs. Season 2 was underwhelming to me and I saw much of what you said here in that Season.
I can identify all the black characters somehow got screwed out of a happy ending and characterization respectively the sorta desperately trying to make the world a better place despite and comfort even one person hit me specifically and made it my favorite show ever
Great video, though I think the problem more lays with the fact that people like the drama of it. People are social creatures, and many people enjoy seeing something burn than actually achieving something great. But I get where this video is looking from
I see you watched that one DAMN. Breakdown video😏
how could u tell? 🙄🙄🙄
that 54min one ?
Don't interact with other members of your fandom, you will be disappointed no matter what the fandom is.
No disrespect to you, but where was it ever said that they didn't talk for 6 years. Also they still had 2 years of UA as well. What was said was since they all started working it was hard to plan meet ups meaning they all still see each other, just not as often, again no disrespect, but what's with this mean spirited topic of Izuku being "ghosted" when that was not stated or implied at all. If anything what was said debunks that entirely.
💀
@@sometimeseliinext time read the ending before saying something unintelligent
@@sometimeselii Why are you reacting with a skull emoji like that??? He’s right lmao
Honestly internet culture is the main reason why I am terrified to publish any of my personal works
LMAO fair. i wish u the best, ur art style is rlly nice :)
@ omg!! Thank you so much!!
Don’t let that hold you back from being true authentic self, it’ll be worth it in the end, and they’ll be people who enjoy your work💯
i can see where you're coming from, but honestly, i really think some of the blame is a bit misplaced here. shows like steven universe is geared to younger kids and anime like MHA, a shounen anime, is geared to teenagers, so some Common Teenager Behavior (thinking they're right and being loud about it, active on social media and having some takes that may be questionable, arguing online about their takes, etc) is somewhat expected. it's just the demographics, though i can see why it can get read as toxic. shows geared towards adults with more mature approach generally aren't quite as loud or confrontational.
and i can guarantee you even with the older shows like naruto, bleach, sailor moon, etc there are absolutely fans who are toxic about shipping and will get in your face about it, we just didn't have twitter yet and anime didn't quite have the same reach back then.
in a way, i think we should all remember that most of the time the way to really enjoy fandom is to find your own peaceful, comfy spot and camp out there with likeminded people who just want to chill and hang. i was in voltron fandom and i didn't even realize half the drama was happening because that was exactly what i was doing. granted, i don't use twitter, so that's probably a big reason why.
I thank God everyday I never had decent internet watching Avatar as a kid
Arcane is in no way a failure. Conversely: such a fact means this video, by it's very concept, is.
Got em XD
Arcane was alright. I don't think it failed really, it just didn't live up to its fullest potential. The CaitVi scene in ep8 was not as bad as people think, it was just poorly placed sorta. They clearly wanted Ekko to be the one to save Jinx so they had to give Vi something else to do and that something else was Cait apparently.
I do think shipping is generally an issue with shows but for me that wasn't the biggest issue of the show. I could definitely buy into the idea that Vi would switch sides after what she experienced after all the time she spent in jail (Silco and the gangs ruining the underground and Jinx commiting war crimes, essentially destroying Vander's legacy) and also by meeting Cait and seeing how the upsiders weren't as bad as she thought.
However, what I actually had an issue with was how the initial conflict from season 1 was pushed to the side for a strange magic plot and outsiders attacking Piltover, forcing everyone to now work together. It felt very rushed, as if I was watching 2 seasons of content all crammed into 1. I feel like the conflict between Piltover and Zaun was interesting and the first 3 episodes did focus on that but I think it should've been stratched to an entire season where it was better explored and ending it with the Vi vs Jinx confrontation. It would've given the characters and their relationships more time to develop, especially Cait and Vi. Then the 3rd and final season could focus more on healing the wounds from the previous events and developing the final conflict against Noxus and Viktor.
I also really didn't like Isha's inclusion as it basically worked as a plot device to force Jinx back into the good side, which I found a little cheap.
So yeah, overall it was pretty badly handled. They simply needed to give the story more time. As it stands now, Arcane is a show with beautiful animation and a good soundtrack but a lackluster story overall.
(Edit: Also, the Vander Warwick plot I feel like went nowhere. It was just there to mentally scar Vi again for some reason. As if she didn't have enough of that already.)
yess I totally agree with that,
though I feel like there were even more random moments
like Viktor randomly leaving Jayce
the rose girl thingie (I've had no idea on what was going on with that one. Why does Mel have powers outta nowhere suddenly)
the Isha plot (what you said basically)
the Vander plot (what you've mentioned too)
the 'romance' between Jinx and Ekko (it might be confusing to some, but I find their romance random. I haven't seen their signs of that 'love' before)
the Maddie plot (she had like what? 12 minutes of screentime? also her being in Caitlyn's bed..c'mon, it's like she came out of a fanfiction)
Jinx and Vi suddenly reconnecting as sisters after trying to kill themselves (it would've been good if it had more time to develop)
and some more I can't really think of
Also what they set up in the last ep of the 1st season (killing half of the council) was totally ignored later. It was the biggest cliffhanger, yet the death of these 3 councils was mentioned for one episode at last.
And the fact that some (if not most) characters felt out-of-character. Jinx before was unpredictable, the definition of literal chaos just to become a show girl later. Yea, she used to do things "for-show" before, like her bomb signature, however the "big fat hero" felt like something a different character would've said. Or the line "what's wrong with my pants?" - it sounds like it's just made to make people laugh at it or drop that line on social media. Like, these lines are not bad, but they just don't feel like Jinx anymore. I understand they wanted her to change, but it felt out of place.
I've heard from Vi's fans that she felt like an NPC, that she's had almost no character development.
I'm not sure about other characters, so I'll leave it on those two.
I'll admit it's not the worst season in the world. Sure it had lots of flaws but it least it's not Acolyte or Rings of Power levels of bad
@Chakinpop5800 Of course it's not the worst season in the world. Just wasted potential when you consider the first season. First season took its time and was overall a lot more solid.
Comparing it to the Acolyte and Rings of Power really doesn't mean much either cause any decent show is better than that.
@@ether2275 True, Every show he mentioned in this video are on a much higher level of storytelling, characters, world building, depth, and messaging than The Acolyte, Rings Of Power, or even Game Of Thrones.
Jinx doesn't give a damn about zaun. She has murdered multiple zaunites.
ok but that's worse.
u understand how that's worse right?
This is a delusional video
Also Jinx isn't dead.
Horikoshi has a twitter it's been blowing up with queerbaiting, telling him to kill himself (I wish I was joking but I'm not.), saying he shouldn’t write another manga (which I find hypocritical given comic writers) and more. It's been fun, crazy, and inventive.
Confused on 1 thing do u believe what MosIIey said or no?
I know, it’s awful. No one deserves to be treated like that.
@wendylacey2745 FR like I ❤️ MHA but I'm also going to criticize it and there are things in the ending I did not like but people be taking their dislike way to far like sending death threats all because 2 boys aren't fucking says more about them. Not like Horikoshi's going to see them or care, but it's still distasteful and honestly sad.
Regardless of what you think of these series before or now, at the end of the day, they all managed to accomplish many things during there runtime. Both good and bad. There are a lot of things that are flawed about each of those shows, but we still find ways to love them regardless. There is really no shame in that.
i suppose....
@ Thank you. I do wish that these shows could have been more than what they turned out to be, but they all had genuine effort put into them. In a way I’m glad series like these exist, because even though they won’t really be making it in your top tens or higher, they are a great source for entertainment and fun memories.
what. Did I miss something, or is it just twitter?
definitely isn't just twitter lol
I honestly don’t engage with the negative parts of fandom. Sure I’ll put in some thoughtful discussion and critiques within the context of the story as opposed to my own imagined version of the story shoved in other people’s faces. At the end of the day, I appreciate a good quality storytelling and forced character dynamics to please an overbearing minority projecting their imaginations onto an already established story should never be the case. Heck I’m even a Timebomb shipper but I’m mature enough to understand certain dynamics shouldn’t be rewritten or erased from the story that’s been established. That would ruin the quality of the overall story imo, unless the author possessed the godly ability to incorporate changes that might elevate the material (but that’s unrealistic). Fanfics should stay separate from the original work. There’s my 2 cents.
I respect you for saying the things you did and I agree with the points you made. I just don't think the conclusion has anything to do with the faults you found in Arcane. I actually think you hold that perspective on Arcane because you find too much similarity with it and shows you had problems with and conflate their poor writing with the events in Arcane. I also think you have this perspective because you might just not know the source material. I say this with love. I really was engaged with your argument but I just don't think it applies in the same way to Arcane.
To understand the character arcs in Arcane you have to know that Arcane is an adaptation. You have to understand that Arcane does not just exist alongside League of Legends but purely because of League of Legends. Arcane does so much to expand and interweave the characters that inspired it that I hold the opinion that this is the single greatest adaptation of a video game ever. Arcane is also laced to the very brim with fan service for LoL fans. The very ships that you find issue with have been a part of the characters years before Arcane ever began it's production. Caitlyn and VI have always had hints to their romance through voicelines, dev jokes, dev blogs, game events and official forum posts , you name it this has been an enduring part of the characters for most LoL fans for as long as they can remember. Ekko and Jinx have been a ship that has existed with the characters since the very day May 29 2015 where Ekko has a voice line towards Jinx remarking on his crush of her before she went crazy. Even something as meaningless as finding out the name of the scientist who created shimmer is Reveck was nothing but fan service those who held fan theories on the identity of Orianna's father on the official LoL forums all those many moons ago.
Arcane is so full of love and sincere pride in its source material. So much background noise and character threads serve to build on the franchise for the pleasure of the old fans. You may argue that constructing plot lines in the pursuit of fan service is a poor decision but I would argue that when the only reason the show exists in the first place is the love and passion of two old devs who have been with Riot Games since the beginning that their passion for the IP, fan service is what should construct Arcane. It is only the love of the fans that could have birthed this project. In a show that ends every episode with 'Thank you to all League of Legends players past and present.' servicing the fans who made it possible is the one thing all adaptation should accomplish, and to say otherwise would be quite insincere.
And the sugar on the cream is that none of the fan service is done poorly. I truly think the Fortiche writing team is incredibly skilled and have constructed such a tidy and concise narrative which really uses each character to their best ability. Does this mean I think Arcane is a masterpiece? No, but for every one problem I have, there are 100 things I think are well done. I truly do credit the writers for their work.
To your point about the all the poor writing decisions you identified in the example shows being about people inspired by a generation of badly written cartoons, I also don't think that applies to Arcane's writers. Christian Linke and Alex Yee, the creators and Rioters who pitched the show in the first place, are in their 30s. They would have grown up with the shows you regard as the correct ones to grow up with. I understand your point of people being inspired by badly written media but Arcane is neither poorly written or would have been inspired by any by your metrics. Actually I hope more people are inspired by Arcane and see its success and realise that high quality technical animation can reach a wide and receptive audience.
I really did like your video but I have seen so many critiques against Arcane miss the forest for the trees. I really don't want to see yours be one of them. I would love to speak with you on this if you ever respond.
my twitter's the same as my channel name if u wanna shoot a DM.
I really appreciate a breakdown like this about how obnoxious shipping culture can get and how it clouds people's judgment of the next stories they consume. I love my toxic, awful ships as much as my fellow "freaks", but I HATE the way some people bend over backwards to try and pretend their favorite toxic ships are actually wholesome somehow...? I dunno if it's just plain immaturity or if it has to do with what shipping wars have turned into, where if your ship *isn't* "wholesome", you get death threats or worse just for enjoying it for fun. x_x People need to learn to be okay with enjoying fictional concepts that would be bad in real life, and maybe then they'll stop making concerningly stupid excuses for their "problematic faves". (People said Bakugou only hit Deku "affectionately"? wha??) Also thank you for talking about all that stuff without condemning the idea of innocent escapism into shipping as a whole. I miss when people could critique fiction without the shitty pearl-clutching.
Also I agree about MHA, ugh, I just--stuff like having Ochako get her perfect happy romance with Deku despite ghosting him for 7 years is a turn-off on its own (seriously, that's so un-romantic, ew), but it's downright awful to pair it with a dead minority encouraging her to go live her best girlboss life or some shit. I, god, they did Toga so dirty, wtf. -_- I'm so tired of stories abandoning the politics THEY SET UP when they get messy to cover (and yes, Arcane absolutely does this in season 2, random commenter reading this, cope harder I guess). I'm not reading replies to this lol. But good video, OP! Gave me some stuff to think about. Hope your day is good! :3 Also I'm sorry if I said anything confusing or failed to clarify any of my thoughts. I get pretty easily scatter-brained heheh.
im glad u enjoyed the video! :) yeah i think a lot of ppl are too hellbent on judging ppl who ship certain things, rather than focusing on those bad apples that use it as an excuse to be annoying. none of this is helped by a bad story that subtly encourages that shit like MHA does. cause the actual romances in that show otherwise are terrible 😭
It’s never stated Ochaco ghosted Deku during those 8 years.
They were all busy with shit, so they just couldn’t find the time to actually get together.
Ok... I don't want to be rude, so I'll try not to be. But when you watch a popular show, that is targeted towards teens and young adults, the problem is not in "whitе quееr pеоpIе". The problem is in most of the show's fans being childish in their behavior, while simultaneously being the loud majority about it.
You saying that they "ruined" their respective fandom is like going to a soup store and complaining that there are no clothes. It's a little silly, don't you think?
If you want good story, where it's theme is explored to the fullest and the characters get interesting and fullfilling arcs, you won't go to children to ask for a recommendation, right?
But you DO go to those children. Because there are 10 of them in the building and they are all loudly talking about their favorite shows RIGHT NOW! So, who else do you go to? Certainly not to that older woman in the corner with headphones on her head, writing something in a notebook. She is too focused on her own thing, that's too specific of a description and you need people to actually thoughtfully discuss stuff with! }:D
In fact, you don't notice her at all. The children are much more noticable, approachable and most certainly would love to talk wiith you about their favorite character for two hours.)
So of course you go to them.
There is no surprise that in the end you go away unsatisfied.
?
@@sometimeselii What? 🤨
My point is that you are looking for the wrong thing in fandoms of popular shows, where the loudest are not the smartest, despite being also he most active ones in the fandom.
If all you see around is teens and young adults throwing hands and accusations with eachother over fictional characters day and night, you will think that the entire fandom consists of those teens and young adults.
So maybe, instead of consuming popular media, where those loudest gather in big numbers and become a majority from a minority, you should look at less attention gathering shows and stories, that often times are much better written, if you don't like fandom culture that much?
Wow so basicly throught 20 minute video you talk about arcane for like a minute and a half at the end and your main point for arcane ,,failing" is that VI and Caitlyn had sex after Jinx ran away. This show has more problems than that but calling it a failure because of something like sex is a bad take. I'm not saying it was good that they did that at that particular moment, I thought it was bad too because of the implication that Vi forgot about her sister when Caitlyn asked her if she wants to fuck. But on the scale of problems that this show has, for me it's really low. Pacing was off, Caitlyn's story arc about being dictator starts and ends in 3 minutes, Ambessa being a morron and her death from idnk being touched I gues, ending Zaun's conflict with Piltover with bigger threat so they unite, these are the problems that you might say made arcane a ,,failure" (of course ignoring everything that it did right for the sake of making a clickbait title so people watch it). And I can't shake the feeling that you had an idea for a video, a good idea, it was intresting to watch + quality was good but included arcane only because it's treding right now so people watch it. And if the whole video was about it I wouldn't mind. But it being such a small portion of it looks like you added it at the last minute just for the algorythm to promote it
MUSTAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARD
I don't think you exactly hit the nail on the head but you made some good points.
On another note, man that sex scene was uncomfortable. Like I totally get why it's there, but they didn't need to drag it out like that.
Arcane and fail
Should not be in the same sentence
Using songs from DAMN, While making a video about arcane. My kinda video
Terrible clickbait
I do think that Arcane had a good ending though, at least Jinx, Jayce, Ekko and Viktor did. Cait, Vi Piltover and Zaun were a bit rushed, but knowing it's not the end of Piltover/Zaun shenanigans means I can live with the 'kumbayah' of it all. Especially because it's not a true kumbayah.
I got money on Sevika dying in the next piltover show, essentially.
Viktor and Jay had a good ending? Didn't they die? Or do u think they had a good ending since Jayce was able to stop Viktor?
@@brendajameson5093 out of all universes, their ending was the happiest of them all. At least now, they died in each other's arms saving the world. And when you think about it logically and seeing how things would've gone if certain key moments changed, there's little chance Jayce and Viktor would've met or become close, and in those cases, that either would live long (Viktor from his disease, Jayce from... jumping without getting interrupted, or the explosion that took Other Vi). At least this way, they were able to reach the culmination to each of their arcs, _together._ And isn't it sad, that the happiest universe for them is the one where they sacrifice themselves together for the betterment of the world? But it _is_ their good ending, even if not long-lived. And I, personally, love it.
I do have some criticism about the 2 season, but calling Arcane a failure is literally just cope, it's one if not the most succesful animated shows the west has produced
calling arcane...what? 😭
Season 2 being successful? Maybe. Good? Hell no
@@Kantorek17 calling something bad just because YOU didn't like it is really cheap don't you think?
Arcane was both loved by the critics and the audience just see the sheer amount of people praising it and how high the reviews are
If that doesn't make it good I don't know what would
@@sometimeselii .......animated?
@@salomaogabriel5264 You didn't put anything after "calling Arcane " in your original, a grammatically error.
Yeah, it's kinda why I stopped at just Arcane season 1. I wasn't sure if the writers could top it, and the reactions have kinda proved me right.
Good on you for sticking to your gut. S2 is a mess while S1 is a masterpiece. I wish I stuck with my gut when I first heard the show was abruptly ending after S2 (That's not _nearly_ enough seasons to cover all the main characters and conflicts from S1). Arcane should've either been 4-5 seasons long or just ended at S1.
@@Gloomy_Knight-dw5pm I don't blame you for watching S2. After all, we all saw how good S1 was, so we expected S2 to have a similar level of quality. TBH, I think S2 could've wrapped S1's arcs had some characters been cut out (e.g. Mel). For me personally though, one reason I didn't watch S2 was because I've seen too much nonsense with shipping in the past (e.g. RWBY, TLoK) that I wanted to stay FAR away from it.
You should watch it and form your own opinion on it over just following what others say about it
@@SF17777 I appreciate the advice. Still, I think I'll stick with season 1 since I felt that was enough for me anyway.
@@krraika1847 Good intuition. S1 caught us all by surprise. It wasn't _supposed_ to be amazing given the track record of video game adaptations. But it somehow managed to be deep, compelling, had nuanced characters, and was, most importantly, accessible..
With a show that has as many main characters with their own personal conflicts, S2 never stood a chance. Didn't help that they added more plotlines in S2 that only led to more and more cramming and speed running throughout the season.
But I think the biggest problem with S2 is that it lost most of its S1 writers (the highly experienced writers). With only the novice writers left (Amanda, Christian, and Alex), S2 was doomed to fall victim to cringe-y shipping bait, dumb character moments, poor pacing, and lots of plot holes. A lot of people probably don't know this but during S1's development, Alex and Christian almost abandoned the project altogether because of how bad the writing was until they hired experienced writers to rewrite S1's story from scratch. So S1 would've sucked too if they didn't. lol S2 is what S1 would've been without the additional help.
At least now people will be able to write fan fictions of S2 that have better writing than S2's canon story lol.
1:38 respect
This is a pretty interesting video, that ties together a lot of media I am a fan of while not reasonating with me at all. So its kinda like a glimpse in to another world.
Maybe its because I got into this a bit later in 2018 or when I was a bit older, but shipping wars and things like that never really entered my radar. Maybe its because I mainly stick to TH-cam and Reddit? Not sure.
While it might be a cultural issue you've encountered, it might also be in your circles. I remember my Twitter was full arcane after the last arc dropped with fantastic memes and good times all around, but with in a week it had "stans" at each other's throats discussing things I didn't find relevant at all.
One thing I found that makes part taking in fandoms more fun is entering into much smaller ones with less active and older memeber (who don't have all day to doom post). E.g. I've been part of the Vinland Saga (Manga) fandom for 5 years and we are chill af. Sure takes get spicey etc. etc. but the most a fan art will every get on Twitter is like 1k likes. People just don't put all their personality in the thing they like, let along a hyper specfic ship. The larger your fandom, the more people tend to try and find a way to feel "special" and unique.
Good video, got me thinking. Which I like!
16:19
That's cold. That's a cold line.
Control people with Deku has me rolling 😭😭😭
I think this video applies more so to the 2nd season than the 1st. I don’t know anything about League of Legends and find much of the “shipping” in internet culture to be cringe and I adored it. I loved the characters and their arcs. Season 2 was underwhelming to me and I saw much of what you said here in that Season.
Thought the arcane finale was beautiful and perfect in my eyes, I am also a white queer person, tracks
I can identify all the black characters somehow got screwed out of a happy ending and characterization respectively the sorta desperately trying to make the world a better place despite and comfort even one person hit me specifically and made it my favorite show ever
😭😭😭😭
Spreading misinformation about IzuOcha to hate on Arcane? Not on my 2024 bingo card, but i guess I shouldnt be surprised by antis anymore.
Great video, though I think the problem more lays with the fact that people like the drama of it. People are social creatures, and many people enjoy seeing something burn than actually achieving something great.
But I get where this video is looking from
way too much music in this video bro. also there didn't need to be two long-ass intros.
there's one and it's 20 seconds 😭
I could say the same thing about Arcane S2.
@@blacktigerpaw1Good call. 😂
12:25 volk is straight though
#AgendaIsAgenda #WeCouldTell #GottaGetThatNameRegisteted
12:25 ayo WTF
When I heard they did time travel in Arcane Season 2 I decided not to watch Arcane Season 2. Time travel is never written right.
What time travel?
Ekko’s entire story revolves around time travel and you expect him to progress without that?
Lucky you, spared yourself from witnessing such merciless character assassinations
@@Kantorek17 nobody acted out of character it just moved too fast
@@SF17777
Yeah tell me about it