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Rogue: The Revived in D&D's Unearthed Arcana
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ต.ค. 2019
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Jeremy Crawford talks about the The Revived subclass for the Rogue in Dungeons and Dragons 5th Edition. This new Unearthed Arcana is available now on D&D Beyond: www.dndbeyond....
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Rogue reaches level 3:
"Hold on. I'm dead."
Rogue gets shot in the throat at lvl 1. 4 sessions later: oh I think I died before
Man, everyone's here debating the thematic and mechanical implications, but I'm just mad they didn't call it "The Grave Robber"
You sir, thinking with a big brain there.
(Seriously laughed so hard I took a screenshot and sent it to my friend)
i wish that name made sense bc its frickn awesme, but they arent really robbing any graves, they're more of like if a necromancer failed a reanimate dead action and ended up accidentally giving them their entire life back
This would make a fun NPC. The player characters keep killing the rogue, but he/she always comes back...slightly changed.
I can see humorous side-effects to abusing Audience with Death...
Need to know something for certain? Well kill the rogue who can just check the knowledge of ALL WHO HAVE EVER DIED
That's basically Raven Queen tier information.
Figure out a way to consistently but dip the rogue to 0 hp and attempt death saves with advantage and come back, altered yes, but with useful information.
Or for NPCs, imagine the leader of a death cult doing this to gain information on his enemies and further increase his influence.
@@no-relic Drowning or suffocation is the answer.
Known as perverts & special victims. 🌉
Firstly, Mollymauk would make an insane Revived Rogue
Secondly, I made a character when I was younger who was forced to repeat life until she had a life in which she died of old age. This new rogue is perfect for it
This subclass concept can literally be applied to any other class is my only issue. It doesn’t make sense that this should be specific to rogue, probably better for a sorcerer tbh.
Exactly
I was thinking Druid but I can see Sorcerer working.
I would argue rogue suits better than a sorcerer, as sorcerers get their power through their bloodlines in this regard this is a much more spiritual thing which while yes could then be applied to clerics or druids I think rogue suits best because of the characters in our own myths and legends it harkens back to. Roguish types who made deals with the reaper or the devil and outwitted them to remain on the material plane, etc etc
ak318 A sorcerer has inherent power through some means. It isn’t necessarily their bloodline.
ak318 none of the rogues previous sub classes have anything similar to what this sub class is giving off. This honestly feels like it just wants to be a revenant but play it safer and actually leaving the threat of death in. If you were right in its intent we should have gotten a fighter or cleric because of all the generals and saints in our history. Robin Hood is the only rogue I can think of as a figure you might be referencing.
Am I the only one getting a Doctor Who, Time-Lord Regeneration vibe from this?
I feel like this could be applicable to any character, so what if it was a feat instead of a subclass. Like when you take it on, you realize you’ve died before, so the changing of personality/proficiencies happens, but only at the levels that one can take feats
John Constantine, The crow, Deadman, undertaker, John snow hell even Kenny from south park lol. If ur wondering why you came back from the dead and can only use rogue abilities then get creative. Maybe you were a mighty paladin but u fell in battle, now you've lost ur smite, ur lay on hands and other abilities. U arent as strong as u once were. The trauma having coming back from death has changed u physically being that this wasn't just a simple revivification.
You know that meme where the paladin is about to die, but they just say:
"I'm not done."
...this subclass seems like a natural progression from that idea.
The rogue has to grapple with the idea that they were previously this righteous hero, but they are now somewhat...well, rogue-ish. They may even be cowardly.
The Bolts of the Grave seems like a necrotic smite, even.
...in thought, this does seem like a nice paladin concept.
"Oath of Undying" or "Oath of the Endless" or "Oath of the Arch-Lich".
Optional necrotic smites...resistant to death saving throws...an almost lich-like resilience at high levels.
...yeah, that's going to be a homebrew.
I mean, you can just go for the Oathbreaker and steal/use the 3.5 idea of "smite good/evil" having A LOT more options you can pick up instead (and thats ignoring the other classes with non-alignment smites like Crusader).
What a fantastic idea! The Aberrant Mind and this Rogue are gold! Thank you for explore this dimensions!
They did mention that they wanted to explore the less traditional archetypes in fantasy
I have fun imagining the Rogues final teleport. Like their ghost leaps from their body to land somewhere else. Their body crumbles away before their partys eyes, returned to the earth while reforming around the soul wherever it manifests itself again. It has such a unique feeling to it. I wish they had access to it earlier in the class like others instead of right at the end. Itd be such a cool story point.
This blows my mind because 2 weeks ago I came up with a character who had been in his previous life, an assassin (rogue) for a demi-god, that had died later in his life, and was resurrected with no memory or indication of who or where he was and takes on being a ranger after discovering his proficiency with bows (as in a past life) only to discover in later levels who he was and reverts back to his old self with multiclassing into a rogue from a gloomstalker. So this basically does all that for me. Its perfect lol
So, if we end up in a part with a Githzerai Eldritch Knight, A Tiefling Rogue and a floating skull, are we obliged to play this subclass?
Best game ever
yes.
I've been trying ti figure out what book their working on for all these new subclasses; this one certainly screams planescape....
Yes
I like the theme, but it seems more like a background than a subclass. And it seems weird that someone who had died before just happens to fit all the bills of a Rogue?
And it can fire magical beams of necrotic energy somehow? Rogues being good at everything is one thing, but I think a ranged, non-piercing sneak attack is a bit much, especially since it's basically a free action.
The rogue doesn't ever have to make the Attack action. It can use any other action in the game, then disengage, and get a ton of d6s in damage without being threatened by anyone in combat. Imo, too strong.
And still should be a background, this makes it seem like the concept of the "many past lives I've experienced" character is Rogues only. If so, make it Elf exclusive because of their actual past lives.
Totally agree. The concept is cool and interesting but I find the class overall pretty boring.
problem with using a background is backgrounds do not give this many mechanical benefits.
As far as the "should be a background" commentary I keep seeing everywhere . . . I mean, sure, but you could say that of a lot of subclasses. Does the existence of the draconic sorcerer make having a dragon ancestor exclusive to sorcerers? I think that would be an un-fun way to think about that, and so I don't. Instead, other characters are absolutely allowed to fluff their class/race abilities in any way that makes sense. This is merely one way to express the story of "I've transcended death," or "I've returned from the beyond" as a rogue. You could do this as a cleric with the grave or knowledge domain. You could do some of this with the shadow domain as a sorcerer. You could do this with any class just by accepting limited/no mechanical support for this story. Support for a concept with one class isn't anti-support for that concept with the other classes.
I agree with you on the two main sticking point of the subclass as written.
The necrotic bolts, I feel, should be more of an Inflict Wounds type of interaction. That feels like more of a “thief of life” type attack than the current “I shoot magic rays of death as I run away, though I don’t use magic otherwise.”
Same with Ethereal Jaunt. Feels too magic producing and less magic responsive like the rest of the subclass. I understand like a Misty Escape type ability, where the surge of magic is triggered by something. Or even just limiting the uses of it. But as it is, it just feels wrong for the subclass.
M O L L Y M A U K
Fits too well.
"The Crow"
Vax'ldan
iVardensphere Mattim from WoT
Eric was a musician. So would likely have been a bard.
Kreigmstr you can play an instrument and not be a bard, there are several backgrounds that give proficiency in a musical instrument.
This is the only explanation that makes sense as to why this was given to the rogue rather than the sorcerer.
This feels like a character archetype that should be freely available, but this rouge subclass is great
Well, the "rouge" subclass is actually not that great unless you apply a good foundation first. And you have to carry around your Makeup Kit all the time. But it's great for a 2-dip multiclass into the Lipgloss Bard (I think that was another one of the Bard types that came out in the last round of UA, but there are so many it's hard to keep track).
@@DoyleAndrewCarson I cannot tell if your comment is satire, litteral or some kind of reference nor do i know what you mean with makeup, the disguise kit perhaps?
@@defensivekobra3873 He's making a joke at the fact you said "rouge" instead of the proper spelling "rogue". Rouge is red.
@@SpookGod ah, he really did see an opportunity and took it.
Thanks mate, typos really do make great puns/jokes
Whatever book this is coming in, I'm willing to bet the Revenant as a race (or generic subrace for any race) is not far behind, if not in the same book as it is.
Amazing I didn't think of it before, but the Revived Rogue has shades of the Euthanatos Tradtion from Mage: The Ascension. A group of mages dedicated to life, death, fate, and reincarnation. Dealing the "Good Death" to those who need killing (whether it's a mercy kill of someone who suffers and can't recover, or a just killing of a wicked person who refuses to change). And their standard procedure for initiating members is that, if they haven't already had a near-death experience, they induce one (usually with magic, sometimes not), giving the young thanatoic a personal understanding of death and the world beyond our mortal life.
It would be a neat NPC that has a presence throughout history. Like every time they have been brought back to life, a chaotic event or events happen after following resurrection, almost as if they're tied to it somehow
I love this class and the way it works on a rogue, I just feel that thematically its super a sorcerer subclass (if only one class gets it) though I also feel like each class should get a revived subclass. its too cool to pass up and can easily be applied different ways
You could probably repurpose the Shadow Sorceror to fit this kind of story. The Undying Warlock may also scratch the itch of a magic user with similar premise.
@@ViktorTheMusician yeah, i just meant that its backstory is literally describing a sorcerer, also shadow sorcerer wouldn't really work here tho, undying warlock sure, grave cleric maybe, zealot barb fluff change. shadow sorcerer is literally a darkness user and has nothing to do with death
I like the idea of a revived subclass for each class. But unlike so many others, don’t have any problem with letting the rogue have this one. I do have a bit of an issue with how the ethereal jaunt feature is written to work, though. Seems a little too teleport-y, magic dependent for the rogue subclass whose other features are more tied to their past lives and less to blinking. My thought would be to limit the teleports per rest, or have them trigger with something more external than ‘new turn, new teleport.’ Maybe that feature plays better with a revived sorcerer as written.
@@KCBCollier true, once the backstory becomes "death has changed you and you can do magic things" it by definition becomes a sorcerer
Don't know why this is a Rogue subclass. Seems like it should be a class of its own.
I think that if it is made into print, it will be easily accepted. Its features smoothly mesh with the Rogue overall, if they need to be tuned a bit, and while the flavor could go "anywhere" (including many classes that already have one or several shadow/death-themed subclasses), anywhere includes here. Plus, "hero who cheats death," is a classic Rogue trope -- and the features are tuned to reflect that.
Also, a class is just a tool for bundling archetypes. I don't know what archetypes I would bundle together with this one to make a whole new class, the most expensive mechanical space in the game. I'd much rather it were spent on the Psion (I get at least one of my wishes) and maybe the Warlord.
I do hope that the reason the Acrobat hasn't shown up yet is because it is so mechanically simple and had such great initial reception, it doesn't need UA playtesting, just behind-the-scenes tuning.
This is awesome archetype for a changeling character, with you taking on the faces of your old dead selves.
I'm still not 100% sold on why this needed to be a rogue subclass. Stuff like this makes me miss the 3.5e templates.
Mollymauk! He was a bloodhunter but still, same concept
This channels the Nameless One so hard and I'm here for it
While I like the idea of a new Rogue subclass and different mechanic for applying sneak attack damage, I'm not a fan of wrapping it in a mandatory backstory. I feel that is what your character background is for.. I hope they consider releasing the 'Revived' as an accompanying background pick because it could be cool for any PC class to RP and rewriting the new Rogue class in a more standalone form rather than tying down your backstory should you want to play this subclass.
This is a side effect of D&D being such a Kitchen-Sink generic borefest in terms of its core presentation. The designers are bored and so they're designing interesting characters almost reflexively.
@@Amrylin1337 Could well be. I don't really follow MM, JC et al and I guess this is what UA is for after all. I like the thinking behind this sub class I just think they tackled this idea from the wrong angle. Personally I'd like to see them finish developing the Mystic Class it was so close after the last revision and then they scraped it and started again but I digress...
Why is this a subclass and not a background? This could be a cool thing to apply to a character of any class and you don't need a whole subclass of abilities to say "I've died and come back to life". A fighter who has never picked up a sword but suddenly realizes they're really good with one, a sorcerer who's magic keeps bringing them back to life, or a Cleric that's a champion of a god and the god keeps reincarnating them to continue working in their name all sound really cool. If you just want a rogue with these abilities, why not make it some sort of necromantic assassin that practices death magic instead?
The revived subclass could be with any class
I wish they'd spoken about why this is a rogue subclass instead of, say, Sorcerer (the "getting innate power from having been touched by death" thing feels like it fits sorcerer to a t) or Barbarian ("I fight with all the fury of the great warriors of my line") or Monks ("I have achieved such control of my soul that I may access knowledge lost to me in the fogs of death")
I want to meet this man and shake his hand and thank him for creating the PERFECT CLASS for me personally
High elf revived rouge is pretty good. Take true strike so every round after first your cunning action sneak attack has advantage
They finally did it. They built a whole subclass to make true strike work.
@@ptrlyonawesome If that's what it takes...
The abilities of the subclass are good but this thematically speaking feels like it would better suit a Sorcerer than a Rogue.
Rogues are all about having talents. Acquiring said talents from multiple lives makes sense.
The best part about this is that this a Rogue not a more magical class.
@@jhinpotion9230 A fair point I must admit, but I would argue that learning how to acquire knowledge and skills from not only your own past lives but potentially the past lives of others isn't something just anyone could do, even with a penchant for magic.
@@n00bmanQ You're right. Level 3 rogues aren't, "just anyone."
If you ever wanted to RP as Raziel from the Legacy of Kain series...nice.
The one downside I see to this subclass is the ability where you can change your personality upon resurrection. It just seems entirely useless to me, there’s nothing really stopping you from doing that already with any character, just talk to your DM and role play it out. Sure the rogue has the flavour of having remembered something from a past life but that’s the only special thing about that ability and even that you could talk to your DM about. Other than that a very interesting subclass.
I like the idea and i see what they are trying to go for, connecting the idea of death with the rogue, but as it is now it just feels like the connection is flimsy, only two of the subclass abilities (Bolts from the Grave and Ethereal Jaunt) directly connect to the rogue and the rest can apply to anything. For most classes, the subclasses feel like extensions of the base class, this feels like they had the base class rogue and the idea of tradition reincarnation and past lives and just connected them with a piece of string and tape. If more of the class features were ingrained with the idea of a rogue who weirdly skirts the edge of life and death and awakens to new powers from it, i feel like this could work better.
I think one major step is to make it so that rather than the rogue just realizing that they have past lives, they instead realize that everyone, including themselves, have past lives. Then make it so that some of the abilities allow them to alter themselves, like Revived Nature, but abilities allow then to tap into the past lives of others, like being able to instill fear into another person by tugging at their connection to their past lives, or gain a temporary buff from some who has recently died or you killed, or be able to gain information about a person by looking into their past lives.
Overall I like the idea, but I think they need to reexamine this and ask how understanding rebirth can help a rogue and how they can apply this ability to others. The key idea being that this doesn't apply to only themselves, but can be used to hurt or maybe help others as well.
.....so THAT'S how they'll bring back Molly (and Vax)
Vax isn't really "dead" per se though. He is still very much around just with the Raven Queen. Now Molly, maybe? But not too sure Tal wants it much.
@@IcyNova115 Oh, Vax is dead. And his afterlife is in service to the Raven Queen.
@@IcyNova115 Vax is D-E-A-D dead, Scanlan's wish in the Dalen's closet one-shot let him come back for a very brief amount of time (just enough time to say hello and goodbye really) but he is 100% dead, Vax is not a Shadar-Kai, he already got to come back from death (and was somewhat immune to it) but only with the condition that once his mission was over she would claim his soul once and for all. Taliesin decomposed (a homebrew cantrip) Molly with Caduceus, I think he has moved on, if Molly does ever return it will be as an NPC
@@thefracturedbutwhole5475 Vax is dead, yes. For all intents and purposes he's completely gone. However, Vax still exists, albeit removed from anyone being able to contact him except via Wish. Vax's spirit literally lives on; that's all I meant.
@@thefracturedbutwhole5475 The gentleman still has molly's blood but I'm 100% sure Tal has moved on. I still hope to see what Molly's backstory would have been, Would love to see it interconnect with the current plotlines so we at least have glimpse of it, of how he died before and how he was brought back.
Another note: While a Revived Rogue is not a Revenant, what if such a character HAD one? Like, as an enemy?
Picture this: in a past life, the Rogue did someone wrong, and that victim came back as a Revenant. The Revenant killed the Rogue, and found peace. For some reason, though, the Rogue has something bringing him back to life. A mechanism that seems to trigger the Revenant to return to life, because his vengeance was suddenly undone. So the Revenant hunted and killed the Rogue again.
And again. And again. And again. Possibly for centuries.
The Rogue forgot who he was and what he'd done many incarnations ago, but the Revenant never did. But at the same time, while the Revenant hates the Rogue - if for no reason than because of the grudge magically keeping him bound to the world - he's become _very tired._ No matter how many times he exacts his revenge, in all the many painful ways he could imagine to do it, the Revenant is never allowed to rest. At least the Rogue forgets; the Revenant has no such luxury. He wants it all to END, and for good this time.
So while the current incarnation of the Rogue tries to figure out who he was and what keeps bringing him back, the Revenant also looks for the mechanism behind the Rogue's resurrection. That way, he can sever it, allowing his quarry to die permanently.
I'm thinking the Haunted One background for the Rogue, with the Revenant (and his minions, for the undead has had time to build up his temporal power) being the one who hunts him.
Bluecho4 you just gave me an awesome idea for a story. Thank you!
Really struggling with this option. Neither the flavour nor abilities scream Rogue, or complement their skillset especially. It would make much more sense as, say, a sorcerer or warlock subclass.
As if the rogue wasn’t an edgelord already.
I don't feel it for the Rogue. I like the flavour, but it really doesn't fit the Rogue. For a Sorcerer or a Paladin it would work way better. I could see it work for Monk too.
Seems like they were playing Shadow of Mordor (or Dishonored) or revisited The Crow when they made it.
Shadowy once-dead sneaky boys
So from the fluff, this is not the same as getting hit by an _reincarnate_ or _revivify_ this is hindu style reincarnation
I could see it as this or also maybe in death they made a deal to come back. The draw back being they are basically a new character and don’t remember who they use to be. Ether way it great for flavor and Role play. I love this subclass.
@@dylanclayton7606 Yeah it is great
While I like the idea, I honest don't think this belongs as a Rogue Subclass, or really any subclass for that matter.
If you really wanted it to be a subclass, I think the most thematic would be Druid, but even then that's a stretch.
I feel this should be a template, rather then an (sub)-class.
You get ressurected after 24-hours, you become a “Revenant Elven Warrior” or something similar.
Defintly making this a homebrew template for my ressurection-ritual.
I like it but Why Rogue
It was the last one left, I guess.
Exactly, this is kinda just... Applicable to all classes? I dont know why this is a rogue subclass.
Deadman. If u dont already know who that is google dcs dead man it very much reminds me of him. A devilmay care charismatic roguish type who was killed perhaps or died in some other way. They've been brought back to complete some unfinished business. Perhaps solving their own murder
It could not be applied to all classes via subclasses due to them all getting features at different levels. Also, rogues in RW myth tend to be the ones who interact in interesting ways such as this with death.
Why not?
The first idea that I have for this, is to use all of the characters that I have played of his race, to represent his "past lives", that he would pull his options of changes in personality traits or changed proficiencies from. This would give you a good established reference point and take some of the "meta-gaming" of the choices out of play.
This is probably my favorite of the recent unearthed arcana subclasses. The only problem is that the game I'm in right now is Tomb of Annihilation and I feel like this subclass doesn't play nice with the Death Curse and I already have one party mate that's been continuously losing max hp from it due to their backstory. ^^'
Getting major “live die repeat” vibes of completing an entire dungeon flawlessly and they ask you how many times it’s taken you to do it... “I lost count”
Dungeon of the groundhogs day
This just reminds me of the Nameless One from Planescape Torment which is a dnd game.
Vax'ildan is that you?
Scott Lynch must have called and complained that he couldn't make Locke Lamora.
This reminds me a lot of being a watcher from pillars of eternity
There somme debate on whether or not the Flavor is very Rogue specific and/or whether or not this should just be a background or something and I have to say imo it seems fairly obvious why this is Rogue stuck.
Imo it just seems like Rogues(Flavor wise) come closest to death most often. Especially if they are extremely bad or good at what they do
This sounds like a cool subclass for a Steel Dragon in disguise
One would think this understanding of reincarnation and past lives would be in the realm of monks....
I love this ark type was thinking of spinning this for my players that if they die they could technically come back as this rouge so if your monk or something dies then I’d give them this option to come back as this I think it could be a neat story thing as well
I feel like this would work better as a feat progression rather than Rogue, since it doesn't seem all that 'rogue-y'.
if a Rogue PC dies just before getting to Lv.3, the DM can just offer it to them as the result of an unexpected Revivify
Would be cool if in critical role campaign 3 molly came back as a revived rogue and we slowly see him start remembering the mighty nein and even before that with his time as Lucien and maybe even his childhood, idk this is just wishful thinking
Such a wonky subclass for Rogue. Feels like it'd be a better Sorcerer or Warlock. Or maybe a potential background.
Mollymauk, revived rogue next?
Good news Liam. You can play Vax again
I see creating ninja like character with this one.
This should be more of a feat or a class of its own
Someone else getting some serious Nott vibes?
At the very begining when he said they surprised even themselves, I fully though this was gonna a sleeper-agent subclass like some Jason Bourne stuff. It doesn't fit with the theme of this particular subclass too much, but now I'm thinking...
Isekai rogue killed by Truck-kun?
This is one of best RP subclasses I've seen. So many possibilities.
I dont fully understand why being revived is exclusive to ONLY a rogue. Why cant other classes be revived as well? Like a warlock or a cleric especially? And if they can be, why is the rogue the only one who gets features from being revived?
Cinematically as a story telling device, this sort of Rogue sounds damn interesting.
Comment section is funny here. Everyone basically screams "Vax'Ildan!", yet no one so far is complaining that this subclass is actually broken (which it is!). Like rogue wasn't powerful enough for you so you gave them basically a better eldritch blast with a sneak attack damage as a part of a BONUS action. Just think about it, how utterly insane it is.
P.S. Though as a DM I'm gonna use this against my players, thank you very much.
As much as I want to play and have fun with it, I have the same concern. Rogue X/Warlock 2 for Agonizing Eldritch Blast + Bolts from the Grave every round seems too good. Perhaps if BftG where limited to N times per rest it would be fine, but as an at will ability, it seems over the top.
so basically if The Doctor from Doctor Who was a DND character? Awesome!
Wow. This is one of the coolest concepts I've heard in a while.
if you keep running games with the same people and same universe you can playing the same person like in the old TV show quantum leap
Just in time for the spooky Halloween season!
Vaxildan memories..
Did no one catch he said sneak attack damage as a cunning action. I like the flavor but that simple mechanic is a second chance on sneak damage for the round.
Looks great for role-play and different quirks to play with. I like it
now I wanna play one with only one natural hand & has a Crawling Claw as a Familiar-like pet thing
Sounds like the Circle of Twilight Druid was reworked into this, with some aspects of the Undying Warlock.
Makes me think of Molly from Critical Role
Only difference being he didn't glean from Lucien. In fact he actively avoided doing that.
Critical Role's Mollymauk multiclass someday? :)
If only T~T
i keep thinking of making it like an Avatar Last Airbender type past lives thing
SPOOKY ROGUE ON SPOOKTOBER!!!! WE DID IT BOYS, HE SAID IT!
This makes me think of the Immortal Man and Gilad Anni-Padda.
I really like this concept.
Hmm changeling revived. Can only become forms from their past lives. Some ancient curse cursing them to die young maybe in front of their beloved.
Makes me think of Soul Reaver's Raziel
How would this work with a revenant?
OMG -I could make a rogue character like Doctor Who! This is gonna be awesome :D
You could build a Timelord this way Doctor who style. New personality when they "die" jumping in space..
Oh my god, that's Jason Bourne!
lol
This sounds awesome
Duncan Idaho?
I like the concept but I think it needs to be its own unique class
Anyone else getting Talion vibes from shadow of mordor/ shadow of war?
Gabe Miller you could reflavor some of the Rune Knight fighter subclass and multiclass with this and have a pretty cool Talion!
This would be a great sublclass for Paladin, Fighter or maybe even Monk.
I've always wanted to play a revenant monk who swore an oath avenge his temple and can't die until he does. This could be a similar concept.
Use this as a 1 on 1 game to introduce someone to d&d and have it be a fantasy version of Groundhog's Day.
The Doctor Who of rogues with Jonah Hex mixed in.
This makes for the setting of a would be hero, heroine or each 😏 who failed. Grievously failed. There is ever choice. 🤪
Excellent take on it! Each & all spectrum involved as nature is the absolute power though it never was or could be sentience or life & it's death or transcendence at all. It certainly will be the throne...