Douglas Murray Goes Full Fash Speaking To Dave Rubin
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ส.ค. 2024
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Stephen Fry once quoted Bertrand Russell: The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people are so full of doubts.
Stephen Fry also thinks it's a good idea to platform Jordan Peterson.
He may want to look to the log in his own eye.
@@michaelccozens there's nothing wrong with platforming as long as you're challenging their ideas. No matter who is on the platform.
Do you have to taint Russell by bringing up Stephen Fry: the dumb person's idea of what a smart person is like?
The quote is meant to be pro sceptic and pro epistemic humility. I prefer this version personally: The fundamental cause of the trouble in the modern world today is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt. I am not quite sure how relevant this quote is, with regards to this piece?
@@RichO1701e Fry didn't challenge his ideas though - he bangs on about anti-semitism then buddies up to a guy pushing right wing conspiracies to the mainstream
A bonus fact for anyone interested in history as opposed to reactionary fictional rubbish - The only reason we have such good preserved works of the Ancient Greeks are because of the great translation and preservation efforts of the early Islamic World (~700-800AD)
Only reason is stretching the facts beyond reality.
@@Mr___X Pedantry.
Also, and I hate these nebulous/dumb/arbitrary categories but still, look what the supposedly great "western" world was doing at the time mentioned, what a surprise, mostly slaughtering each other, vikings and shit, ubiquitous social turmoil, there's your "western values" - term curiously never defined concretely but can only really imply one definition, the divine right of domination. Also see: Islamic Golden Age.
@@Mr___X You know the joke about Ronald Reagan where it was reported that his library was burned down and he lost both his books ... and one he hadn't finished colouring in yet?
Well, the number of books in Western Europe before the printing press was about proportional. The rest of the world had hundreds of thousands of books.
Islamic invaders burnt down libraries in Alexandria, Bagdad, Byzantine and India. The amount of knowledge lost can never be put in words 😔
@@clowncarqingdao inane and ridiculous, not to mention wrong. the hardbook book was a specifically european craft.
I love how right wingers claim they're "done being nice" as if they've ever been owt other than violent and abusive
That's their nice. You don't want to see them when they're not being nice.
@@rais1953 actually the fake act is why they attain power......if they came out with it unfiltered the game would be up
When have you seen the right doing what BLM or ANTIFA did?
'Violent and abusive', like Antifa?
I am right wing. You are talking about right wing extremists
Stating that western cultures "took interest" in others misses the point of that interest: mainly exploitation.
It's like saying: "The mugger took a keen interest in my wallet".
@@grantkerr8298 Lacking in parts but not all of the left.
Indeed, it was the expansion of empire in an era of industrial production that led to such 'interest' being expressed. To portray something like (e.g.) the scramble for Africa as a benign act of European enlightenment is beyond thick.
our culture depends on its ability to assimilate other cultures. 🍵 tea anyone? anyway can't hang about I've got to go for a curry with a girl I met while visiting the entirely British British museum down on the Thames near the obelisk.
@@grantkerr8298 I am not sure your revelation that there isn't a single mighty leader uniting "the left" under one banner is quite as dramatic a revelation as you want it to be!
We debate and disagree all the time. This is healthy and normal
He's saying the bit out loud you're supposed to keep quiet if you're a fascist. This is the mentality that built an Empire, as it slaughtered its way across the planet.
He knows the public aren't allowed to be vocal in the street anymore. It will be interesting to see how many of these fascists get arrested for being too loud.
An excellent comment.
You could be talking about Islam as much as the British Empire though.
Errrr, that may be because he isn't a fascist. You are looking at the world through an indoctrinated lens. You have been taught to believe that your far left views are normal, and that anyone who doesn't agree must be a fascist.
@@leswallace2426 irrelevant we live in the UK
If it wasn't for his crisp public school accent, Murray would've been dismissed as just another yob long ago. I've read enough of him to know he's a pseud, and a dangerous one at that.
He’s incredibly ignorant. Has no idea about history. His books are shockingly bad in their ignorance.
He loves having an opinion but can’t be bothered to get the knowledge first.
Sadly too many outfits rely on hate-clicks for relevance so an an intellectual flyweight like Murray will continue to have a platform. This pile of filth Murray wants to define what’s most important in the world in which he lives. The problem for him is that other people also live on the planet and we also have ideas about how the world should look.
@@yussepig6629 Clearly, he's cut from the same cloth as Nadine I've Written More Books Thank I've Read Dorries.
Knob
Good deconstruction of how the eradication of the right has been in the anglosphere since 1945. Enoch Powell? A yob. Andrea Dworkin? A true thought leader. Miraculous stuff.
I have very little sympathy with Douglas Murray. As part of a jet-setting international liberal intellectual elite he can afford to be as disrespectful and ignorant of others' cultures as he likes with little consequence. The rest of us, living in multi cultural communities, understand how destructive chauvanistic that kind of cultural imperialism can be. His insufferable sense of superiority shines through whatever waffle he is spouting.
He's as liberal as Donald Trump. But apart from that, I agree entirely.
He's no liberal as far as I'm concerned. He's about as liberal as Tony Blair is labour. There seems to have been some musical chairs going on in recent years as far as political definitions are concerned. I don't know where this bollocks notion of the word 'liberal' meaning far-right has stemmed from. Some mischief I bet.
@@josefschiltz2192 I presume the op meant liberal in the sense of believing in free trade, holding superficial bourgeois concepts of rights and freedoms above more nuanced and well-thought-out ones, etc. Liberal in the same way that most of the establishment is liberal (or neoliberal).
@@monkeymox2544 Well, I'd would go with the nuanced and well thought through concepts that don't mean that people are hammered into a grave well before their time through being stressed out and ill . . like I've almost been. The PTSD is finally lifting and I'm starting to sleep soundly at nights! - just! I'm Traditional Liberal. I don't pretend to know exactly what this Neo-liberal is meant to be. I'm sixty and my family were Liberal voters for the best part of the Twentieth Century. If this Neo-liberal is right wing then they can take this neo and stuff it - very painfully - where the monkey keeps his nuts and stop giving real Liberals a bad name.
I mean, he stated people in "non-western" societies don't care about their ancestry and language, lol.
Of course we need to define what Western means, I'm assuming "white" but don't know for sure.
People in Latin America have been trying to preserve indigenous languages and understand their dynamic social-relationships, especially of Meso-America but also across the continent, as European colonists suppressed the culture of indigenous people.
I understand this isn't just in the Americas, and most people want to preserve culture and language around the globe. I'm just far more familiar with the anthropology of Meso-America, such as recent discovers under the temples in Tenochtitlan.
Very revealing when he said he'd no longer pretend to respect other cultures
he never did
@@SlowhandGreg That's kinda my point, he was only ever pretending to
We're in good times society is emploding and I want a front see view, what a joker😂🤣😂🤣
Yes, I caught that too.
is it right to automatically respect other cultures? There are actions and beliefs in some cultures, that I think are entirely appropriate to criticize and therefore could be seen as disrespectful. Personally, I would focus on the individual ideas that I felt were worthy of criticism not a whole culture - but it wouldn't take some other people long to point out that those ideas, beliefs or rituals, map to a culture and therefore declare that one shouldn't "disrespect" them.
His grift is easier in the US, when he came back from his last US visit he was telling everyone that the election was rigged until his fellow Brits started laughing and caused him to back pedal lol
There's a certain type of American that thinks a posh British accent means you're smart, it couldn't be further from the truth.
He's smart enough to exploit an opportunity for monetary gain. That basically sums up the left's entryism for the last 200 years. Worried your playbook is being used by others?
Yep. He's always been a Teflon coated tool. Used to say the quiet part out loud before it became fashionable and went all in on the coo in a very unseemly way. He seems to think he has special dispensation among the hard right propagandists because of the attribute he brings them
@@celestecanyon although he wouldn't last a minute in a fascist convention being gay and that
Oh that's the Racist guy, unfortunately he gets about making people around the world dislike the English too :(
@@grantkerr8298 I'd say Joe Rogan and Lex Friedman had him on their show he has some reach... Also, he's angry about something intangible and he comes across a bit racist to me
"Making"
God, people who go to Eton really are taught to open their mouth and let whatever half-formed ideas are in there just pour out, aren't they? Not only is this hateful bullshit, it's incoherent.
Etonians are drilled into believing they are born to rule over us, regardless of competence in leadership. The sitting PM shows the worst of this establishment.
The public school system in Britain teaches two main things to young boys: the art of lying and the practice of buggery.
Definitely no ulterior interests with a name like that, eh?
@@Mr___X Malcolm?
No, you just don't have the intellectual capacity to understand him.
Murray is talking about last 30-40 years, especially the last 20 (not how we were in previous centuries) when he says we have been polite and its not doing us any good.
and in actions, "muh western civilization" has continued to be very unpolite
Have you been polite to the immigrants asdfghjklkjhsadkfjnslkdjfnksjdfksdjfnlkj? Looked into their cultures? Yes? Well quite right, because so has every single other true born son of England for the last up-to 40 years, no wait 20. If only someone like Stephen Lawrence had been more polite after being knifed in that stairwell, then we could carry on being polite to him.
and the Iraq war, the height of politeness. People are just so fucking ungrateful hahahaha hahha ha urghh
Being incompetent isn't doing you any good, bombing countries and then inviting their refugees over without making sure they integrate properly, no matter how you look at it, you've brought this upon yourselves.
I find his pretentiousness really annoying, I just can't stand listening to his BS, he really imparts zero knowledge just biased opinions.
Exactly
That's what I was scrambling for when I said "self assured", cheers😆
We must all dutifully remember that he is Douglas Murray and we are not.
I will dutifully wake up every morning, acknowledge that I am not Douglas Murray,
and be joyfully happy about it 😁
Some cultures were far too polite when western interests turned up and began constructing their empires.
Not really. They were defeated militarily and surrendered. UK and western Europe apparently won the last major war yet are subjected to colonisation. Indeed, the major victors of that war, the USA, are subjected to it as well. Which raises a number of interesting questions, none of which you lads can possibly wrestle with.
@@Mr___X Subjected to what colonisation?
@@johnwright7916 Is this your first time on the internet, John?
@@Mr___X :: Blatantly _Side-Stepping_ John Wright's question, obviously you don't have a legitimate answer !
Support your comments w / facts.
( Is this your first time on the Internet, Mr. X ? )
@@cliffgaither Support your comment with facts, Cliff. Prove I obviously don't have a legitimate answer.
Murray has always been the polite face of the far right
A posh voice and long words seem to make even the most appalling of ideologies acceptable to broadcasters. Wasn't it back in 2005 Murray was openly pushing his view of "repatriation" of Muslims out of Europe. No difference between him and EDL Tommy
is not gay? does not know his will target first.
polite for a fasc means "hiding what you really are in order to fool the libs"
he's never been polite!
Wow, Douglas is gonna say rude words - I'm so scared.
Poor attempt to rubbish the perfectly sensible things Douglas Murray said. As usual, the presenters come across like superannuated student political activists.
Typical Spectator, full of nonsense puffed up with long words.
Long word make hurt head
While the west was languishing in the 'Dark Ages' after the fall of the Roman empire the middle East was positively thriving during the Islamic Golden Age. Scholars preserved and translated ancient Greek and Latin into their languages without their cultural interest and preservation of ancient 'western culture' and science we would have never got the Renaissance or the Enlightenment those historical events were contingent upon cultures beyond the west having enough interest and respect of foreign knowledge to choose to preserve it for future generations.
Read more
@@Mr___X Elaborate more
@@OAInbox nice mask
@@Mr___X At least my picture is up. Elaborate more.
@@OAInbox no
He use that word 'tolerate' like he's some kind of 'god' or some superior being ,when he really is a psychopath.
By definition he's not a psychopath
Well said.
No, he really isn't a psychopath. He's a very well educated man, who's ideas are beyond your comprehension.
@@tonyr4873 with lack of empathy, sounds like a psychopath
@@tonyr4873 his ideas dear, are as intellectual as a human waste product... 😂
The way he presents himself as some kind of intellectual while talking absolute bull is disgusting. Americans probably lap this right up
which intellectual would you have us listen to? let me guess KARL MARX..whos nonsense theories have proven after 100s of millions of genocidal deaths are absolutely pathetically dangerous and inaccurate
Absolutely hate Murray’s performative face pulling in this clip.
We are tolerant of people like him.
If he wants intolerance, he'll suffer more than most.
No you aren't lol. You are trying to get people like cancelled and k*IIed
So, when I see bullying and intimidation and implicit threats outside cinemas,
when I see a mother with 14 year old autistic boy who scuffed a Qu'ran responding to death threats in fear and the local police capitulate, tell me Novara,
which do you think I should do
1. Pretend to be respectful ?
2. Actually be respectful ?
As usual Novara: no bigotry or bias here on your part ( ppppphhhhhhtttttt!)!!
Oh, the Japanese are an unusually courteous culture but then Japan has no record of international cultural diversity.
Douglas is purely making the point for mutual respect, you just hurl insults and of course he's a "fash" because he doesn't subscribe to your world view....perhaps you're the "fash"?
He’s asking people to respect his history and his ancestors when they’ve caused suffering for the world. He’s asking people to present his culture when his culture isn’t even respected by his own people. He’s asking people to respect him when he is an abhorrent individual
People like Douglas goes around judging everyone’s history and past and then gets butthurt when people critique his own ancestors. People like him don’t want to study history. They want to use history as a propaganda platform amplifying the “good” and erasing the “bad”.
Their 40 year economic experiment has come to an end and this is all they’ve got. It simultaneously great and terrifying to see
He's the living embodiment that if you sound posh, people automatically give weight to what you say, despite talking bollox. Americans, especially right wing ones, love these types.
You mock him because you don't have the intellectual capacity to understand his ideas
@@tonyr4873 explain his ideas mr ultra intellectual
I'll wait
Like jacob rincemogg
@@enosger his so called "ideas" are as intellectual as a human waste product...
He speaks of tolerance with no knowledge of Popper's theory of intolerance. I'm intolerant of his intolerance. Against the wall.
Yup. As Popper explains, just as MLK's thoughts on "white moderates" did; if you aren't against fascists, you are one.
@@michaelccozens This is what happens when you get picked last for sport in school.
Lol. Come the revolution, brother!
You’ll do nothing
@@JohnM-sw4sc If you want to do nothing that's your choice, as the saying goes: If you don't think it can't be done, please get out of the way of the people doing it.
Looks like cherry picking, what is the context of this?
I googled “creepy fascist” and this guy was the first hit.
Aaron Bastani? Not surprised.
Far right? Until yesterday he was a traditional liberal
If he is considered liberal then the Western liberals lost all sense of tolerance and respect. Which is funny because Murray would argue no one besides his ancestors did anything for the civilization and no one can progress it further other than people of his own skin colour.
Douglas Murray is absolutely brilliant. Love watching people being offended by him.
I agree.
We've taken much from other cultures, as Aaron points out. In addition, medicines taken from native peoples. And I use the word 'taken' deliberately. Ghastly man.
We also do a ton of research on Indigenous cultures to study languages and their development, particularly to "rediscover" languages that are disappearing because we've committed deliberate genocide against the cultures from which they originated.
We should really make a conscious effort to start assuming that anyone with a posh accent is a moron until proven otherwise. Prejudicial, yes, but the prejudice in the other direction is killing us, and we don't have time for gradual readjustment.
@@grantkerr8298 Always good to start with a name.
I think it's fine to disagree with his point of view, but not to misrepresent it.
He is expressing that it's not ok to be racist against white people (although you wouldn't have known it from this clip)
I don't think it's OK to be racist against anyone. Racism in all forms is reprehensible and should be opposed by all non-racists - that is the opposite of Fascism in my view.
For example, when Michael Eric Dyson labelled Jordan Peterson a mean angry white man and stereotyped him/presumed he knew nothing of First Nations due to his "appearance" (JP is an honourary member of a FN tribe), Dyson was objectively being racist.
Normally I trust the content from this channel highly. Please don't go down this path. It will undermine your credibility and your message.
Represent his argument truthfully and challenge it honestly.
When did the British empire respect anyones ancestors Douglas?
Read more.
@@Mr___X Read more.
@@TheQeltar You dream in English.
@@wongfeihung6285 Agreed, imperialism is bad.
@@TheQeltar actually it’s not
The clip of Douglas Murray made me so incredibly angry. Michael and Aaron did such a fantastic job of taking apart every single thing he said.
@@poissonpuerile8897 The man has been a professional dog whistler masquerading as a cultural commentator on the internet since I first saw him.
He's always had very challenging ideas that never corresponded with my experience and I think he's a damaging (to the mainstream) spokesman to many extreme right wing echo chambers.
Horrible man.
Did you actually watch the video?
@@ThomasUptonWatts Yes
@@poissonpuerile8897 Do it better then
Why?
In fact we do go to 'aboriginals' for all sorts of things - there are chemicals derived from plants in the Amazon jungle that we are exploring for their medical efficacy that have been used by indiginous tribes for centuries.
Don't worry, we'll be back to using primitive medicine out of necessity soon enough. Fully luxury automated primitive medicine!
He went to Eton - that almost always tells you everything you need to know about someone.
Yes his back end was sore more of his teens.
@@daisyhoward5472 Homophobe
It really does seem like everyone who went there is a complete tool.
@@tonyr4873 Maybe it was a crumpet toasting reference, we shouldn't jump to conclusions 😛
That they are the kind of people who were born 'three nil up' but think they scored a hat trick.
That they have a sense of entitlement and think the world should be fun for their benefit only.
Doulas Murray why should I respect other peoples ancestors, history, cultures, people. Nevermind colonialism showing that the west has not been respectful to other cultures. Whats he's saying that we need to be more racist?
That's exactly what he's saying.
Precisely what he is saying, containing the reactionary spirit by misdirecting it at the effect rather than the cause.
Algebra was discovered in Iraq, which if I’m not mistaken is somewhere east of the UK 🤔.
Do you know the difference between a contemporary relevant culture and one lost in time? He’s not talking about cultures lost to history.
Is that not a bit of a red herring? I've read about how it originated in India and came to Europe (probably after quite some time) via the Middle East. So, in a way, algebra was discovered by mathematicians in what is Iraq (and given something like the name we recognise today), only after it had been discovered earlier in India - even further east of the UK. However, perhaps without the understanding of great mathematicians in the Middle East, this branch of maths may have taken much longer to reach the far reaches of Europe.
I see labeling someone as right wing is the new euphemism for "I don't like what you're saying"
"We don't go to them to learn their languages", and "It is time to be discourteous"
What language is he going to speak to them in when he tells them he is going to be discourteous?
There could possibly be some slight advantage in learning Arabic, Persian, Hindi/Urdu, Tamil, Thai, Indonesian, Mandarin, Japanese, among many others. Especially if you happen to live in a country that has cut itself off (ever so politely) from its main trading partners and is looking for some new trading partners like - randomly picked - Indonesia which has enormous resources and over four times your population and is thought likely to have one of the world's largest economies within decades; or Vietnam which has a larger population than yours and is rapidly growing more prosperous (Warning: Their language is *hard.)*
He'll just speak very slowly and loudly. Every true Englishman knows this is the only way to communicate in foreign lands.
@@SteveDorrans A well known strategy! The funny thing is that although we call this a symptom of English speakers' arrogance I can testify that it works. I have learned French and Arabic but if you want to communicate with me in those languages you need to speak slowly and carefully. In English or Indonesian you can speak to me at normal conversational speed, I'm fine. :-)
Whenever I hear some right-winger say that non-Western cultures have contributed nothing of worth to us, I can't help but think of the following: corn/maize, tomatoes, potatoes, chocolate, vanilla, manioc/cassava/yuca, chile peppers, Phaseolus beans (which are most of the beans we eat), peanuts, rice, bananas, chickens, turkeys, rubber, on and on. And if you look into just the domestication of corn and vanilla, those are some of the most complex domestications in the history of humanity. We still don't know how it was originally figured out, but we do know that not a single white person was involved.
"Bloody Beaker folk, coming over here with their drinking vessels!" Stewart Lee (approximately..)
oh! you enough with educating the plums, you know they wallow in ignorance, now pack it in! ha ha!
Lol speaken like a true consoooomer.
@@Mr___XSpoken not speaken, brainrotted Douglas Murray meatrider.
Our numbers are actually Indian. The Arabs got them from India and we got them from the Arabs.
Have a discussion with him then.
Thanks
Murray has become an internet sensation by striking a cord with ordinary everyday people. Everything he says is spot on.
Everyday racists, more like.
Happy to see that ordinary people have a ordinary political commentator
Well said Douglas. Integrity matters to sincere people. The hosts if this show wouldn’t let a little honesty get in the way of an opportunity to virtue signal.
Can you give an example? I’m guessing the answer is no.
THE HOSTS SPEWED SHITE.
Missing the main argument (the harm immigration has caused UK), grasping at straws (courtesy, mathematics, etc.)
WAY TO GO, DOUGLAS!!
Still waiting for that example.
@@vikramadoddamani just keep voting tory. They divide and rule you.
@@henrypierce8900 Hey man 👋 I neither live in UK nor am a citizen to have any say🙂. I just said what I felt. And it’s not about Tory or Labour or Liberal Dem, it’s about supporting the person who fights for the right cause.
"Respect my history and I'll "pretend" to respect yours..." That would be classed as a Freudian Slip with any other person. Full fash as the description accurately states. Lmfao
Here comes Uncle Addy on his flying carpet again
Haha yeah. I thought the same
Great minds are misunderstood Douglas is saying that such a Civilised culture that the West once was ? Is becoming uncivilised by foreigners ? He is on our side ! He is entitled to his opinion just because you disagree , or don't get what he says doesn't make him wrong Douglas makes people think ? But people don't want to think ? They would rather criticise like your all doing
novara have to call him fascist in order to create their own job. if you look a bit more clearly, their purpose vanishes.
@@wendyjones5853when in tf was the west civilized thing, every century the west has engaged in bloodshed amongst its respective nations. If you can point me to a passive time in history where the west was at peace with itself then okay maybe we can it civilized but it’s gonna take more than some fancy posh accent to convince me otherwise
Why does the Western Nations culturally appropriate from all of the countries that they have colonise and never credit them for the advancement
you're mistaken, margaret
The man seems to say a lot without actually saying anything.
The Jordan Peterson school of speaking. Just keep saying words that mean nothing until people stop trying to understand and simply assume from your deliberately-adopted outward indicators that whatever you're saying must be very intelligent and well-supported.
It's also a very popular tactic amongst those selling snake-oil.
Such people may be described as the "stupid person's idea of a smart person".
@@michaelccozens yes that was certainly my impression when I heard him speak.
Nice!
😜
Or maybe what he says a lot you don't understand
The boot won't always be on someone else's neck.
Something to keep in mind especially if you've gone from "World's Greatest Naval Power" to "aircraft carrier with no aircraft".
Indeed. Britain was defeated militarily in 1941 and has since been a vassal state of the USA.
Beginning to sound like Rees mogg sister in law.
Someone should tell Murray that the British Empire is over and all the racist arrogance in the world won't bring it back.
Claiming that western civilisation is based in “courtesy” is the most cartoonish lies in the world
I don’t think Douglas Murray and Dave Rubin are fash, sorry. He’s a conservative exploring the paradox of tolerance.
If Douglas Murray possessed even a fraction of the intellectual curiousity he clearly thinks he does, he might reflect on how "First Peoples" aquired that label and what that says about the "courtesy" of the West.
Indeed. It marks the hypocrisy in protecting nativism in the new world while denigrating and attacking it in the old world. Who is responsible for this? Therein lies the answer.
He likely subscribes to the Stefan Molyneux “Hey we didn’t kill literally all of them down to the last man, woman and child, what’s their damn problem?” line of thought.
lol the answer is "First People" acquired that label from the political correctness movement in the 80s. A meek and appeasing gesture from the self-aggrandizing moral supermen.
Do the West deserve any credit? in making this gesture?
If the answer is No, and that appeasement does them no favor than that necessarily means it was a mistake to messed with the simple and endearing term "Indian" in the first place.
Hopefully the Chinese or whichever culture that rise to dominance in succession to the West would learn this lesson.
It would look like colonialism where Britain went around the world destroying everything they touched.
Why do you think that, Chris?
@@Mr___X Reality, history and the ability to think.
@@chrisworthman3191 Ok sure bud
@@Mr___X Enjoy denial.
@@chrisworthman3191 the left always projects
No one speaks more eloquently and with erudition than Douglas Murray. Full respect to the man for his brazen courage.
Many people do. He's a very bitter man. You have to feel a bit sorry for him.
I Agree With The Man Speaking On Respect.
If these presenters bothered to play 10 seconds before the clip and continue to the end of his argument they would have seen that he makes very clear that these are not his views, but a fictional extreme view that might be held in the future. The dishonesty of these presenters is a great disgrace. Please go and watch the whole interview and you will see the straw man argument these guys make. So disappointed!!
Go and watch the whole clip people…
‘Unlike the western mind, the westerners had more interest in their culture’
What interest was that!?
Feels like a fan fiction Bond villain
Nobody tell him current mathematics uses Arabic numerals, he’ll be devastated.
@@manufacturedconsent7850 He's denying by omission.
Also that is not exclusive to "the west".
But whatever lets you pretend Murray isn't a has-been angrily lashing out at anything he perceives as different and using his posh accent to hide the fact that he has a room-temperature IQ.
@@manufacturedconsent7850 LOL. Wow. Really scraping the bottom of the barrel aren't we.
Gay people are incapable of bigotry and right ring populism now?
The Dave Rubin defence isn't as airtight as you think it is, sir.
Especially considering just how many atrocities and injustices have been enabled by men who were also gay.
Note, were also gay. Not because they were gay.
The rest of your prattle is so generic and demonstrably false it's not even worth dealing with.
What a horrible individual. Grotesque.
I will say this: Japanese cultures and the others you mentioned are certainly courteous, however they are by no means “tolerant.” Far from it. If you don’t conform to their cultural and social standards you are absolutely an outcast and not tolerated. As a foreigner you are never fully accepted in their society. They hold their people to a standard.
True accurate views. Douglas Murray sees Britain being taken a ride by racists.
Courteous. He's one of those people who think that talking slowly in a public school accent means you have valuable things to say.
That's what subverting norms does, though. If you fill your public speakers and thought leaders with bioleninist grievance types, it leaves room for a convincing speaker to imitate the true authority and excellence of the past to proselytise on behalf of his paymasters.
Luckily, in Murray's case, it ends up he's right, so we get both the accent and the valuable listening.
@@Triumph2024. - "valuable listening"
To what? Persistent drivel? Convoluted nonsense? Great, wonderful, marvellous. Maybe the walls could provide some backup commentary to this nothing-to-say
@@danielcrafter9349 Oh, a lefty shill discounts Douglas Murray, a man intelligent and talented enough to gain both the admiration and friendship of Christopher Hitchens, a just-barely-former Marxist who was a true progressive and likewise brilliant but shared very little with Murray as concerns social and political views.
But as anonymous regressive drone who's unexplained, cartoonish, reflexive insults of Murray ring through like a child desperately defending his favorite easter bunny--even after he's been caught and in the papers as arch criminal--we should defimitely consider your 'opinion'. Ok, considered it, it suc.ks.
He does speak bloody slowly, doesn’t he? Given it’s complete shit, one would hope he had the decency to at least spew it out at a fair lick.
Disrespect as a matter of foreign policy for 1,000 years, but God Forbid your stiff upper lip be put to the test. British Museum inspected for looted goods? The score is not even just because you say so, Douggy
It definitely is and then some
Murray is gay … wasn’t it a tolerance society which which changed in order for him to live his life the way he wants to?
no
Exactly !!! I was thinking the same thing. I hate to break to him that he is the product of tolerance.
When has he ever been “polite”?
When hasn’t he?
He was always polite to the extreme.
You guys wouldn't last 2 minutes actually debating Murray. And here you take a clip out of context and then straw man his argument. You are both a joke.
"If you don't show any respect for my history, I don't see why I should *pretend* to respect yours."
Telling.
Muslems are bringing in Sharia Law thank God for people like Murray who speak for us
Arguing for intolerance .Well we all know where that leads.
Order
It's amazing and frightening that when someone speaks so eloquently and calmly that people will absorb and believe their incoherent garbage. Please explain how a culture built upon centuries of genocide and colonialism can be considered to be courteous and polite.
Scientists believe that early mathematical functions, like addition and division, can be traced back to the Chinese, Indus, Mesopotamian, and Egyptian civilizations. The oldest clay tablets of mathematics are at least 4,000 years ancient, starting in Mesopotamia, and the oldest written findings on mathematics were Egyptian papyruses.
I'm just a mechanic, and a graduate of the NYC public school system but isn't it because of the "First peoples, First nations, Aboriginal peoples, Native peoples, Indigenous natives, or Autochthonous peoples" early European colonies survived their 1st winters and learned to harvest the local crops like corn beans and squash and the reason we celibate Thanksgiving? The Mayan and Aztec cultures built mighty cities in the Americas. it seems too easy for Mr. Murray to discount their contributions.
The settler-colony US also lifted the macro "balance of powers" thing for its constitution from the from the Iroquois's Great Law of Peace, but you know, still "savages" apparently...gotta genocide them and steal their land since they haven't "mixed their labor with it" by our arbitrary Lockean standards, breaking essentially every treaty made with them because they're just so...savage...you know? Definitely not the epitome of irony/grotesque brutality or anything...
But seriously, the late great David Graeber/David Wengrow's The Dawn of Everything I hear illuminates a far more essential role of these indigenous tribes toward creating those supposed "western values" in the first place.
_"The first man who, having fenced in a piece of land, said 'This is mine', and found people naïve enough to believe him, that man was the true founder of civil society. From how many crimes, wars, and murders, from how many horrors and misfortunes might not any one have saved mankind, by pulling up the stakes, or filling up the ditch, and crying to his fellows: Beware of listening to this impostor; you are undone if you once forget that the fruits of the earth belong to us all, and the earth itself to nobody."_ - J.J. Rousseau, 1754
No "just" about being a mechanic, Davit. The world would stand still without your skills. Just, as you say, the skills of our collective forefathers provided shoulders for us all to stand upon. Murray is a xenophobe, plain and simple, which is why he loves America, a country whos very language is riddled with racism.
As a boy I spoke with my grandfather, at great lengths, regarding how we allowed the Painter to do his deeds and why the people didn't stop it.
He said (paraphrasing)
Fascistic behaviours mean it happens with out you even seeing it. You know it feels wrong, but you are told everything is fine... You do not believe your own eyes and ears.
Then one day you see a small child shout an awful slur to another human with different beliefs and skin. Then you realise it is already too late.
☮️💚🙏
Too much Hollywood, not enough reality. The f'st states received mass popular support, something neither communism nor liberal democracy can offer.
Too much Hollywood, not enough learning.
@@Mr___X ...So stop watching movies, and read a book.
@@curmudgeon1933 Mr. X is a reactionary account. Operates all day, across multiple posts, no view is coherent across the posts.
New account (under 12 months) no content and a single subscriber.
Be aware. 🏴☠️
He’s not saying the West has been polite, he’s saying people that think like him and defend Western tradition have been polite to people on the other side of the debate. And that if the people on the opposing side are not polite, why do they have to be? Then the commentators go misinterpret him and insult him. You are kind of proving his point. Also, he is not saying other cultures haven’t achieved anything, he’s saying the West has given us plenty of things that first nations have not, starting for an interest in other cultures. Instead of looking for a reason to attack the man, you could actually listen and engage with what he’s saying
That’s actually not what he said. When he was talking about being discourteous he was talking about you.
The problem with the "What about Japan" argument is these people would very much consider Japan *as part* of "the West", as they're inoffensive to them culturally and admirable to them capitalistically. Same goes for any non-muslim successful capitalist country.
The West is not a geographic place. It's a list of countries with "acceptable cultures".
Historically the West was imagined as a place, but you're absolutely right about acceptability.
@@grantkerr8298 These people as in the one the video was about, fucking obviously.
That's because the very notion of the west was corrupted by a certain group, who happen to play a big role in neoconservatism, the branch of politics that Murray is paid to advocate for. The West became a simile for 'countries within America's sphere of influence', and naturally includes the US's greatest ally of all. It is evident that this idea is antithetical to the true west, its people, history, culture etc as its primary purpose has been to control and decimate Europe since it entered the war in 1941.
What an absolute ringpiece.
I could listen to Douglas Murray talk all day. I love his voice.
We've been too tolerant of Douglas Murray.
The method of immunizing her children used by Lady Montagu came from India.
I thought that was bathing in cow crud?
Tolerance overcame normality. It’s a weakness now.
This channel spouts utter nonsense. It would be funny were it not so tragic. Murray distances you intellectually by far.
... in which direction?
In the downward direction no doubt.
Perhaps we could begin by not tolerating Douglas Murray. Hateful and boring, terrible combination
Weird guy. Clearly way too into identity politics. A lot of bizarre generalisations. Not making much sense at all.
It's clear neither of you have bothered reading Murray's last three books.
What exactly is he saying? Does he want to go back to the crusades? Someone needs to tell him the world has moved on. If he’s not happy he should get off the world merry go round.
No. He is used as a release valve for native western anger at its colonisation in the 20thC by global finance, but only insofar as he will encourage white boys to sign up for the military and die fighting in another war. It's the same playbook they used 20 years ago, but much less effective.
when were "the West" courteous?
As an hobby historian of African and Native American history, I haven't seen much courtesy from "The West"
Read more then.
@@Mr___X I'm already reading to much, but thanks for the encouragement.
@@timothymanfrost8362 Look at this I can edit this comment as well ooooojhhjhhhhh
@@Mr___X read what exactly my dear
@@timothymanfrost8362 My work here is done. I don't want you getting attached to me in a co-dependent relationship of learning. You're on your own now. Best of luck, Timothee.
WELL SAID !!!! Douglas - I couldn't agree with you more. We should ALL respect and have consideration for others NOT JUST ON ONE SIDE !!!????
"Full fash" "far right"
These word's mean nothing because of clowns like Novira media. 😂😂😂😂🤡
"Other ways of doing maths"? Excuse me, what? Does he know that there's only one way of "doing maths", and that cultures all around the world have contributed to it, or is he just an idiot? "Anti-racist science"? You mean science? What specifically does he mean? Does he want to bring back phrenology and skull shape measurements?
And I don't know if he's choosing to ignore centuries of colonialism and genocide against indigenous people across the world or if he for some reason doesn't think it has had an impact on their technological and cultural output. It's telling that he mythologizes "the West" as tolerant, scientific and rational compared to (presumably) the savage non-Western (read, non-white) cultures. Completely ahistorical nonsense, ignoring the very reason the great divergence in the wealth of nations occurred in the first place.
Truly a great example of how far your accent and manner of speaking can get you, rather than the content of what you're saying
Does he not realise that we use Arabic numerals? And where does he think the word "algebra" comes from?
Half of the stars are named by Muslim scholars...
Douglas Murray keeping it real
Pity all those polymaths such as Averroes, Al-Farabi, Avicenna, Ibn Al-Haytham, Ibn Tufail, Avempace, (just to name a tiny few) wasted all that time preserving the likes of Aristotle's works in their writings. Of course, Mr. Murray is a far wiser and more open-minded man than any of those scholars. Perhaps someone should write a book about how ignorant he is of other cultures (as well as their influence on the west) but alas; that would take too many volumes. The pompous twit is in love with his own voice - but what can you do - his un-skeptical audience will lap it up and believe everything they hear from this pretentious toff.
The thing is, I am fairly certain the aforementioned mathematicians did maths in the same ways as the europeans that followed. There is only one right way to do mathematics, through a series of logical proofs. 2+2 can never equal 5 and only an idiot would claim that. Though there are interesting proofs of why addition works.
Thank you for reminding to the humanity about all those Muslim Mathematicians! Thank you very much! People like Murray should be ashamed of themselves for being ultra-bigots and peddling a fascist ideology.
Preserving the writings that were common in the former Byzantine territory they conquered is hardly a great claim for the Islamic world. Might explain why they’ve contributed nothing since though.
I'm sure the Tasmanian Aboriginal population would love to have a say in what Murrey claims "disrespect to his history", or "courteous"...
*Only ... there are none left after the "courteous and respectful" British genocide.*
We were very courteous as we stole they lands, subjugated them, committed genocides, and sold them off as slaves.
Why are you complaining? We are being polite, you savage!
Did not no who Murray was, and now I wish it had stayed that way.
He is going to be shocked when he is told what an algorithm is.
😂
Or any other scientific concept beginning with Al. Algebra, Alchemy etc
Or a cable. Or an alidade. Or a boomerang. Or a rocket.
@@kazman110 You wuz maths?
When was Douglas ever 'being nice'? Nothing that he says really squares up anyway; all his arguments are one sided. Posh geezers talking with certainty in this way has been the curse of this country for too long, that's what I reckon.
Yup. David Cameron would be another good example, although almost all current MP's fit that description.
Jason king Douglas is saying that we English are being taken for a ride ! Even Muslems are saying we are too soft But Novara Media has misunderstood Douglas ? And he is right ? We are being taken over by foreigners ? Any fool can see this ? It's becoming uncomfortable ? We are a very tolerant people but our kindness is being taken for a weakness ? And Douglas is attempting to say that most foreigners are from uncivilised Countries but are mixing with the Civilised West ? Why on earth is the guy wrong ? He 8s allowed his own opinion surely ? You may disagree ! But , this does not make him wrong does it ? Maybe MR Murray is far too intellectual and not many can keep up " GREAT MINDS GET MISUNDERSTOOD "
@@wendyjones5853 I do disagree. I also disagree that most foreigners are from uncivilised countries.
Jasonking2976 ! Jason you can disagree all you want But the West were building bridges and inventing things whilst the Uncivilised were finding the mud for their huts ! Fact
@@wendyjones5853 I still disagree. Also, your understanding of history seems a bit unrealistic. And just because you say fact about something, doesn't make it a fact: evidence is what you need.