i like that both Thrustmaster and Logitech are great entry and mid level sets. I believe they both can and should expand their product line upwards to become full spectrum lines.
Logitech G Pro Racing Wheel is not lowend or midrange its a fantastic wheel base but just no eco system still and thats the part that makes it hard to recommend
@@arranmc182 I'm pretty sure the G Pro is going to get phased out/replaced and made irrelevant with a cheaper entry level DD base. I have never seen a streamer or anyone use the G Pro.. If I was gonna make a guess, I'd guess that whole thing was a MASSIVE flop. It's been out for TWO YEARS and there's not one singular bit of hardware released for it. That's not a great sign. I would never advice anyone to get into the Logitech pro racing line. That thing is either dead or will evolve at a glacial pace. Two years... Nothing..
@@JimmyNuisance I agree its not great that they haven't added anything but as someone with just one set of pedals, one wheel, one gearshift, I've never really had the need to change things. Sure and f1 style wheel would be cool but just having a solid base that works and keeps working seems to be plenty for a lot of people.
I was for 4 years with Thrustmaster on Playstation and it was a good start, but it took to long for a Thrustmaster DD base on Playstation, so decide to go 2 years ago to Fanatec DD and love it. Went from DD Pro 8nm to the DD+ now
Can’t wait! I hope the Tlcm and the SF1000 are gonna be compatible with it. If yes, I’m surely going for it! 😁 Please make possible to change wheel settings on the wheel itself and then EVERYONE will want it! 😉💪🏻
@@tomtom-iu4zsIn what sense careful, do they brake easily? Because as of right now the only thing I’m seeing is the color that’s fading from the x due to the use.
Thrustmaster and Logitech have both raised the floor for their offerings into the lower tier of direct drive options but don't have anything mid-range and above. You might say that at 10nm the T818 is the lower end of midrange, but that's their absolute top and it's a great placement. It's not all about the peak or continuous hold force in nm, however, as the actual force feedback algorithms used to translate game inputs will be the key to their success, esp with the 818.
I don't think Thrustmaster needs an upper tier ultra rich middle-aged-guy series of hardware. For me, a person who is OK with spending quite a bit, but would not ever be tempted to pay 3 fricken grand for a force feedback brake pedal, or thousands for a motion rig.. Thrustmaster is the perfect brand. It's right there in the area where anything better is going to come with diminishing returns in terms of cost for new or improved features. If you want something "twice as good" as the T-LCM pedals, you'll have to pay multiple times the price. Want something better than the Sparco hand brake/sequential shifter? Good luck. The stuff that is "better" than Thrustmaster's best stuff is _incredibly_ expensive. Fanatec and Thrustmaster's best stuff is kinda right there in the level of quality where improving upon them in a noticable way would make them prohibitatively expensive for 98% of simmers. I mean I can not believe they sell a LOT of that 300 dollar handbrake.. If that one was hydraulic and 899 bucks, who would buy that? Thrustmaster doesn't care about making a wheel that will sell 3.000 units a year at 3500 bucks.. They have the facility to produce hundreds of thousands of units and sell them at a decent margin. The reason the "deluxe" hardware is expensive and manufactured in small batches is that that is the ONLY OPTION they have, they can't mass produce 10.000 400 dollar bases because that takes large facilities and many workers. But they can churn out 400 bases a year in an office and then sell them for 3 grand to people who will swear that 20nm is totally necessary because of clipping. Thrustmaster knows what they're doing. It would be stupid to step up. There's already stuff out there for the feinschmeckers with way too much money in their pockets.
Moza SRP, Simjack UT, Simsonn Pedals, Elite V2s are not multiple times the price of the TLCM. Want something better than the Sparco hand brake/sequential shifter? Good luck. >>> Moza Handbrake and Seq Shifter costs far less. Same goes for the Simjack versions
@@Miguel-th3wx Moza's handbrake is pure fucking trash compared to the Thrustmaster one though. If you want worse handbrakes of course you can go cheaper. If you want something better, you're gonna have to pay a lot. I don't really know who makes a better hand brake then Thrustmaster tbh. Personally, if TM had a cheaper one I would actually have gone for that. It was the only part I bought that I just felt was way the hell too expensive for what it does and how often I use it. The pedals you listed are all load cell. No force feedback, most of them don't even have brake rumble (which I find lame personally). They are in no way shape or form substantially better than the T-LCM. Marginal improvement sometimes at 2x the price. The Moza pedals are literally hella primitive and you get TWO pedals.. They MUST be used in a cockpit cause they're literally just bent aluminium plates with no real base plate or anything like that. They also look extremely uncomfortable, but that's beside the point. If you want BETTER pedals, like I said.. You WILL have to pay multiple times as much. Just the brake pedal with force feedback is already close to 10x what I paid for my pedal set ffs... The step up from load cells is not load cells, it's force feedback. You get nothing under a thousand bucks.. Which is 5x the cost of the T-LCM.
@Miguel-th3wx Good luck ever talking to someone from Moza for customer service. I bought a 488 gt3 wheel dorm TM and the right handle had a very small tear, figured I'd reach out about it and just assumed I'd be told "sorry that's wear and tear" instead I had two new side handles shipped overnight from France. Crazy good customer service.
i thought they were above logitech, but below fanatec, just looking forward to a direct drive on the low end priced under the cheapest fanatec, i don't need anything over the top, just better than a belt system
I still think of Thrustmaster as being entry to maybe lower middle ground in Sim Racing hardware. Don't get me wrong I am using a TS-XW and T-LCMs and love them, but not enough FFB for my liking. Nost sure which way to go Moza, Simagic or Asetec. The trucking stuff from Moza appeals to me.
Surely it needs to sit between tgt2 and t818 I’d be disappointed if it was less powerful than tgt2 which is a great wheelbase one of the best for gt7 in fact
I hope for Thrustmaster fans it could be the same level as the T818, just with a Ps chip in it. I had the Fanatec DD Pro 8nm and I feel 8nm is a really good torque you need the least. I went from T300, to TGT 1 and 2, DD Pro 8nm and now DD+ 15 nm, but that last one is a beast I cant tame 😂
Pretty sure it's going to be about as powerful as the TGT2. I have the TGT2 and it's already way more powerful than I personally need. I'm driving at 25-40% power. If I'm drifting I sometimes set it to 50ish but I don't need to. If it has like 10nm that's just a waste imo. I'd rather have a better motor with less clipping than just going for brute force. You get tired of achy wrists pretty quick, at which point that whole wheel-wrestling novelty is gone. I'm not a race car driver, but I'd say that if your car is as hard to turn as the TGT2 on full power, you need to take that car in for a service, cause your whole steering assembly is locked up..
@@JimmyNuisance DD is smoother and more direct driving, but thrust me, a higher torque option can eliminate clipping, it does not mean you have to use high torque. I just hope for you guys it is higher then 6.2 nm, it will give you a headroom
As a former TM user, the only reason I changed sides is because as a T300RS user, the jump from there to T818 is too high. All I wanted is a CSL DD in TM but it never came. So if they're finally doing it, they might be able to bounce back.
So this new wheel will be positioned below the T-GT2 in the console range? I’ve been holding off getting a T-GT2 thinking I’d wait for Thrustmaster DD wheel assuming it would be better than the T-GT2… but is that wrong? If I have a T-GT2 -sized wedge of cash should I go with that? 🤔
I would wait for the direct drive, I have a TGT2 the power sometimes cuts out as the cable vigils its self loose from time to time and there is no quick release and the wheel mounting is all plastic.
My first wheel was the Logitech Driving Force GT, but Thrustmaster was my first with a big ecosystem. I started with T150, T300 and then finally the TGT. I switched to Fanatec when the Podiium F1 was first launched. I made the switch because I thought TM was a little slow on developing new hardware for racing. And it seems like they're trying to catch up now. Many TM users have jumped ship to Fanatec and Moza. Maybe TM will be good for entry level players but I cant see them getting any better than that. I do still use 2 of their Sparco TSS tho. Those are discontinued and BAD ASS.
I started with my pxn v9 then TM T150 & it was awesome. Then csl elite. Now I stepped up to my csl dd pro 8nm w/csl elite bmw rim. Very nice set up I must say. I'm happy with it. Yes I would've said trust master is an entry level start up sim. But, now I'm not so sure. That 818 looks like a monster. Maybe down the road it can be something to own for sure. Granted I started my sim racing like three months back and cant stop. I find myself on the tack at like 430am at times. Lol. Cheers! Thank you for the video.
Logitech started my son and I, then switched over the thrustmaster. Products are affordable and to the higher end. Fanatech, Moza and Camus still need to come down in price. My son and I do sim racing for fun. We just upgraded to a rig instead of a wheel stand. It is for sure a rabbit hole once you start. Only takes money to stay up. We have the Ts-XW but run on PC now.
started with t150 than t300 and a few years on a ts-pc , standat pedal than tlcm and finally sold everything , Thrustmaster always worked but everthing felt always a bit cheap like toys .
I'm a little upset with this news. I have been a T300 user since GT5, and when it was time to upgrade to a DD wheel, my choice was limited as the price for the Fanatec was just too high once all of the fees to get it here. So I went with MOZA R5 and hoped that they would be PS ready some day.
I don’t know how nobody is talking about the Simagic Alpha Mini / P1000 Sim Racing Bundle for 1175. I've preordered mine, and the anticipation is real. With options for the GT Neo or GTS Leather/Alcantara wheels and 2 or 3 pedal sets, the precision and craftsmanship are simply top-notch. In the $1000 range, it's hard to imagine choosing anything else. Unless you're on console. For sim racing, it's the perfect 'chef's kiss' moment. This bundle definitely deserves more attention and would make an epic video.
My journey in sim racing with wheels start with the t300rs in 2017 i think... i pay with a promotion very cheap!!! 199€ and one year later i receive a proposition to sell from a friend and i sold 280€... and from half a year i stop playing and only play with the controler... and half year later i bought in a promotion the logitec g29 for ps4 at 250€ with the gear shifter.... and i start to play more ofen and i decided to upgrade to a csl elite ps4 fanatec and i sold the g29 with the gear shifter one year later for 250€.... i pay 275€ for used csl elite and it is here my real love for sim racing started... wheels pedals playseat m9nitor stand.... After that they released the gt dd pro i waited for a ps4/5 compatibility, and i think i dont need more than 8nm... i have 6 wheels 2 csl elite like mclaren gt3 the rally for x box wheel . 3 club sport like formula 2.5 formula F1 green" black friday" and the podium porsche swede "round" at 600 and change€.... and that it my journey
Looks like an interesting wheel for upgrading my T300, but then i also need it to be compatible with linux for my PC gaming. The T300 doesn't have good support, for instance i can't get the FFB to work. Many years ago i paid i think 99 euros for my Logitech GTGF (or is it GFGT) and some years ago i went with the Thrustmaster T300 which i still use for both console and PC. I think Thrustmaster can be classified as low end, mid and high end.
So a 5-ish Nm then? I own a T818 and I really like it but I get why people go the Moza route when they come in fresh. I'm not sure they going to be able to win people over unless they really undercut the competition on price. I'm afraid they are kinda stuck with the QR unless they bring out another type of adapter wich would be kinda crazy at this point. That being said i haven't had any real problems with the QR of the T818 myself. The new pedals look really basic but if they are reliable and the load cell isn't expensive they might be a good option.
I think for a Playstation console player like me, there's not a whole load of choice and Thrustmaster does the job well. I'm a busy family man with little free time and more important expenses, so having a Next Level fold out chair and a T300RS with T-lcm pedels work well for my couple of hours a month I get on there. It always brings a smile to my face when I first set off and I think that's the whole point of sim racing, without spending a small fortune. I would like to upgrade to a console compatible DD to kill the sound of the noisy fan and belt, so a cheaper DD would be great. But I'm staying clear of Fanatec atm. I do like the fact you can easily buy Thrustmaster and Logitec off off Amazon (or others) and deliver in the UK without added delivery and import charges, the price is the price! Keep up the great work.
TM is my all time favorite atm as ive only tried logi, and i honestly dont have a feel for the gear drive. its good, but thrust has a different approach for getting people deeper into the feelings of the car with the T150 being belt driven. sadly had to sell my 150 before my recent move.
I have a TGT2 my only compaint is the plastic housing used to attach the wheel. You have to drive a srew into the whell and base. I can hear slight cracking noise every now and then. I hope it does not break on me. I have been holding off on buying a replacement wheel . No quick release
Hello and thanks for the update I’m very excited about this. I’m using a tgt2 and tlc-m pedals, on a Playseat trophy. In my opinion it’s a great setup. Playing Gtr7, ACC and some rally games. I hope the wheelbase will have at least as much force like my tgt2. What do you think about that.? Stronger or weaker? I will hopefully think it will be at least under top end stuff. Now I think; beginner to mid range level for Thrustmaster.
I got my first thrustmaster wheel 20 years ago. Glad thrustmaster will compete on the mid range products aswell.For me its already too late, I switched to Moza and Im happy to be in their eco system now.
Running a TGT2 with TLCM's as my first wheel and pedal combo. Would have thought a Thrustmaster DD wheel would sit above the TGT2 wheel but will have to wait and see.
I have t300 and t-lcm for years only racing on Gran Turismo. Many times considered switching to DD, but I was happy with T-LCM and switching completely to Fanatec was too expensive. Also the latest news with Fanatec raised some concerns. I’ve been waiting for this for so long.
Have a thrustmaster T300 and Tlcm pedals that I've had since before the DD market exploded and they both have been great, no issues at all with either and they've been abused! I've looked forward to an upgraded more refined version of pedals from thrustmaster. That being said, I feel pricing would be the big thing when comparing qaulity equipment from the other big companies in the market.
I had my first Thrustmaster wheel in the 90', and for the time it was great. Don't think this company should rethink their brand at all. Now I'm currently on a T300RS with TLCM Pedal and looking for to upgrade to a direct drive compatible with PS. Thanks again for you great videos!
Your claim to 99% is misleading, try and state only facts based on evidence that can be substantiated. you are doing investigative journalism, that also means that you should invest more time in getting to know the target material and report only that which you can prove with evidence, I like your videos and you have a very presentable voice for TH-cam... Keep up the good work and take this as positive critisysm to help in impoving your viewers experience
As I only play gt7 for about 2-3h a week I’m still on a g29 mounted on a playseat. I’m really interested in DD wheels but the price is still way to high for the time that I’ll use it. I think I’ll wait until there’s some package (DD wheel / pedals with clutch / manual shifter) somewhere sub 500. It might take some time but when you see what’s going on in the current market there’s a small chance I think ;)
If Thrustmaster made an elite line, I think it would do well. Especially if it was easy to upgrade the hardware in its ecosystem and connections. ie: Thrustmaster GT-Elite (model number) wheel. Etc.
Endor is getting destroyed year by year to be finally stomp on the ground by other manufacturers...it's sad, i still have my CSL elite (i'm a casual GT7) and it works well and i dont even know for how long it's gonna work. Thumbs up to TM, great news for us consol-ers!
I love my Thrustmaster wheel & pedals. But I guess I’m bias cause I’ve never used Fanatec dd. Absolutely looking forward to the new products from Thrustmaster. Thanks for the info.
Started with the t150 and used it for 3 years before upgrading to Fanatec DDPro. If this was available at the time I would have stayed with thrustmaster.
@@Kireth i watch in the phone my friend, i had to restart the phone all videos became black only with the automatic subtitles.... sorry i was thinking it was a error from the video but the error it was from my android phone... keep up the good work, i follow you from the beginen....love from france
I STILL have a T500RS with T-LCM pedals, fed up of the newer rims not being fully compatible with the T500RS, so i'm looking forward to see what they're offering up next, can't see me buying their new pedals tbh, IF I was going to change the pedals, i'd probably plump for some Simpson pro pedals or something similar.
I started with the g923 trueforce, then my lad got into f1 so I went and got a t300 with tlcm pedals. 2 years and never skipped a beat, I’ve been waiting for this DD console since it was announced one was coming. Everyone I know with fanatec gear wish they never got it with the disconnection issues. So I’m glad I didn’t go down that route. Thrustmaster missed the mark for DD for years. But with only 2 options out there at the minute I’m excited to see what this new DD will bring to the competition
Hooray, my old T500 is pretty tired and the brakes are a real limitation with the lack of feel. I would have liked Moza to have ps compatibility but doesn’t seem likely soon? Thrustmaster I think of as in the same league as all the others, swings and roundabouts for me.
I started with thrustmaster ,3 diferente wheel bases until i got fanatec, but i Will love to see a thrustmaster direct drive like the ddpro , and they got good ecosistem❤
I've been waiting for them to release a DD for PS4/ PS5 since they announced the T818. I almost bought into Fanatec but to pay almost 1k usd and wait then hoping they still stay afloat to upgrade in the future. I have a wheel and aluminum hub I used on my T300 servo base 6 years ago. Pedals is a refreshing view because Simjack Pro has been a serious thought. Hopefully, they will have better and adjustable pedal throw like LC100. I will wait longer to upgrade if released by Xmas.
@@Kirethif you have access to a t-gtii you should try it since GT7 last update. The road texture and vibrations through the wheel and transducer is through the roof. The steering sensitivity setting in GT7 now actually does something, a lot infact and it's hard to keep the wheel straight at high speed if you have it on 10. Will the direct drive have the transducer in? I have base shakers connected to simhub so can still get those affects but for people who don't, the transducer is a lot of the immersion on the tgtii.
At a pro level, is there a real added value to go from a T818 to whatever is out there? Asking as a novice. Would someone fighting for wins in big F1 esports or iRacing be any slower with a T818 compared to their preferred setup, given all the time to prepare? Is there laptime or consistency to be had above the T818, or is it more about being like a heavy to steer race car?
I use the g29 wheel with included pedals to play gt7 and was thinking of upgrading but joking aside I don’t think I’ve ever been so confused as to what to upgrade to and after watching this video I’m even more confused maybe just me lol
They “need” to make a PlayStation app for updates and customization, some don’t have PC’s (I have a Mac) How great would it be to just keep everything plugged in and get going
Would buy it if Thrusmaster direct drive is good and not so overpriced like the Logitech one. But the brake pedal need be good too because on the G29 Pedals I have a hydraulic brake pedal installed. Moza aktive pedals would be great but I doubt that would work on PS5.
If this Direct Drive could be purchased like most other Thrustmaster products, I would have peace of mind knowing I could also purchase an extended warranty from the store.
I think all the companies you mentioned as well as thrustmaster are all entry level, to mid. Their great for what they are, abd have some high emd products. Then there's the 3rd tier awesomeness like, simucube, asetek, simagic, heusinkveld, g.s.i., simgrade (Playstation compatibility) simlab, list goes on.
lol…. I agree, it’s hilarious to keep hearing ppl say upper tier and mention Moza & Fanetec like they aren’t entry level to mid. Whoever does Moza’s marketing needs a raise because ppl are believing it’s the best company in sim racing when it’s a C+ at best. Hahaha
I'd say TM is just late to the party. I began my journey back before 2009 with Logitech G27, as that died had an T300RS (very annoying FAN, such poor quality Pedals compared to the G27) and got later that sort of plastic Ferrari-F1-Wheel for that and as that died just this year, I switched to the MOZA R9 together with a KS and RS-V2 Wheel. And I enjoy this MOZA-Stuff really a lot, those 31 and 33cm wheels are such an amazing boost in ergonomics and quality after these years of puppet 28cm things that put so much strain on my shoulders, neck and back. And of course, this being my first DD-Base, also adds a lot to the experience. However, nothing of that money spent made me really faster, but iRacing has been more enjoyable than ever. A friend of mine who started the Sim-Racing journey at the same time as me, is still on his G27 "without any ecosystem" all these years (and is still quicker than me!). So you don´t have to play the FOMO-Game, "what´s next", spent tons of money. You just don't have to. Actually nowadays for it´s more about the quality and ergonomics for me.
Just a day after I decided to switch and purchased a Moza ES-X using your affiliate link! Oh well, Thrustmaster isn't cheap where I live, already have a T300 with shifter and t-lcm, but Moza here I come
1. You never tried one (that expensive) 2. You dont care about cars /simulation When you love sim games and cars ,you will pay even ten times more just to feel that thrilling emotions driving alien cars like f1. Le mans , wrc , gt3 , than most of us will never drive in the real life or even seen on the streets
thrustmaster needs to step it up with companies like moza and sim magic. moza seems to be killing it in the sim world with all the new stuff coming. thrustmaster is entry to me i was waiting for their dd base and when it came out i was pretty sad the qr just doesnt looks safe to me. im a big guy i want something i can believe in that qr just looks weak. that is why i got an moza R9 V2 with CS wheel. it wasnt much more then thrustmasters base
Thrustmaster DD is above Moza and Fanatec to me in terms of FFB feel. They still haven’t lost their mojo, their software FFB is top notch. Many people forget but pre DD era pre covid. They were the the best choice for sim racing for many since the release of belt drive wheels, basically since 2010. To me it was matter of time, where they catch up, big players always move slow . They are back in mid tier race again now for that everyday consumer. They only need good price and t818 to come also to consoles.
lol…. Most ppl will never know because 3-5yrs ago Fanetec ppl started the Thrustmaster hate band wagon and it’s never stopped. Now it’s all about how great Moza is and over the next couple years it will be about how another company is great and is so innovative. It’s the same dumb cycle. Companies like Thrustmaster and Logitech will continue to just snail along with entry to mid gear while the Fanetecs & Moza’s will burn out or just fade because the shine eventually wears off
Got me a ts pc a few years ago with the hope that Thrustmaster uses the potential of there ecosystem, then they released nearly nothing for a long (to long) time... I will be switching to moza in about a week. For me Thrustmaster killed them self...
If Thrustmaster doesn't lower the prices of their products, this won't be a good option. The Moza R9 (which is the equivalent of the T-818) is $200 cheaper and has better build quality and better QR. Even the R12, which is superior, is $100 cheaper than the TM. It doesn't make any sense.
I'm a dad of four boys with so many other priorities, but I still love firing up ac with my thrustmaster tx with the 599 wheel and t3pa pro pedals to knock out some laps when I get a spare moment. I've been wanting to upgrade to load cell pedals, but the tlcm pedals just didn't impress me. I'm hoping these new ones do the trick. Can't wait
Thrustmaster should get into DD properly at all levels. They have been around for over 30 years, think they deserve to be a top choice in sim racing.
i like that both Thrustmaster and Logitech are great entry and mid level sets. I believe they both can and should expand their product line upwards to become full spectrum lines.
Logitech G Pro Racing Wheel is not lowend or midrange its a fantastic wheel base but just no eco system still and thats the part that makes it hard to recommend
@@arranmc182 I'm pretty sure the G Pro is going to get phased out/replaced and made irrelevant with a cheaper entry level DD base. I have never seen a streamer or anyone use the G Pro.. If I was gonna make a guess, I'd guess that whole thing was a MASSIVE flop. It's been out for TWO YEARS and there's not one singular bit of hardware released for it. That's not a great sign.
I would never advice anyone to get into the Logitech pro racing line. That thing is either dead or will evolve at a glacial pace. Two years... Nothing..
@@JimmyNuisance I agree its not great that they haven't added anything but as someone with just one set of pedals, one wheel, one gearshift, I've never really had the need to change things. Sure and f1 style wheel would be cool but just having a solid base that works and keeps working seems to be plenty for a lot of people.
I was for 4 years with Thrustmaster on Playstation and it was a good start, but it took to long for a Thrustmaster DD base on Playstation, so decide to go 2 years ago to Fanatec DD and love it. Went from DD Pro 8nm to the DD+ now
Can’t wait! I hope the Tlcm and the SF1000 are gonna be compatible with it. If yes, I’m surely going for it! 😁
Please make possible to change wheel settings on the wheel itself and then EVERYONE will want it! 😉💪🏻
99% satisfied with my G-PRO DD but great to see Thrustmaster coming in because competition is great for consumers
My thoughts exactly, and I have a G Pro as well 😊
So how do you change wheel?
I have a T248, and love it, but have been waiting on a DD wheel for Playstation for a long time. I want to stay in the Thrustmaster ecosystem.
Same, but I will wait because I recently got my t248, so I hope something good comes when I need it
Once you Thrust, you never go back
Careful with the buttons on the t248. Had to take my wheel rim apart to fix the X button with silicone. Besides that I've had no problems with it.
I just received my TS-XW
@@tomtom-iu4zsIn what sense careful, do they brake easily? Because as of right now the only thing I’m seeing is the color that’s fading from the x due to the use.
I’ve raced the t818 hard from first release and the quick release has been solid
Oh my my. I'm so glad i waited!! Just got a psvr2 and was looking for a cheaper dd wheel. I can't wait!
U will be in Heaven. I have the VR2 as well, and a DD 😊
Thrustmaster and Logitech have both raised the floor for their offerings into the lower tier of direct drive options but don't have anything mid-range and above. You might say that at 10nm the T818 is the lower end of midrange, but that's their absolute top and it's a great placement. It's not all about the peak or continuous hold force in nm, however, as the actual force feedback algorithms used to translate game inputs will be the key to their success, esp with the 818.
I don't think Thrustmaster needs an upper tier ultra rich middle-aged-guy series of hardware. For me, a person who is OK with spending quite a bit, but would not ever be tempted to pay 3 fricken grand for a force feedback brake pedal, or thousands for a motion rig.. Thrustmaster is the perfect brand. It's right there in the area where anything better is going to come with diminishing returns in terms of cost for new or improved features. If you want something "twice as good" as the T-LCM pedals, you'll have to pay multiple times the price. Want something better than the Sparco hand brake/sequential shifter? Good luck.
The stuff that is "better" than Thrustmaster's best stuff is _incredibly_ expensive. Fanatec and Thrustmaster's best stuff is kinda right there in the level of quality where improving upon them in a noticable way would make them prohibitatively expensive for 98% of simmers. I mean I can not believe they sell a LOT of that 300 dollar handbrake.. If that one was hydraulic and 899 bucks, who would buy that? Thrustmaster doesn't care about making a wheel that will sell 3.000 units a year at 3500 bucks.. They have the facility to produce hundreds of thousands of units and sell them at a decent margin.
The reason the "deluxe" hardware is expensive and manufactured in small batches is that that is the ONLY OPTION they have, they can't mass produce 10.000 400 dollar bases because that takes large facilities and many workers. But they can churn out 400 bases a year in an office and then sell them for 3 grand to people who will swear that 20nm is totally necessary because of clipping.
Thrustmaster knows what they're doing. It would be stupid to step up. There's already stuff out there for the feinschmeckers with way too much money in their pockets.
Moza SRP, Simjack UT, Simsonn Pedals, Elite V2s are not multiple times the price of the TLCM.
Want something better than the Sparco hand brake/sequential shifter? Good luck. >>> Moza Handbrake and Seq Shifter costs far less. Same goes for the Simjack versions
I have the moza hanbrake and price-quality is top, it comes with two springs and a elastomer, and sofware is top too @@Miguel-th3wx
@@Miguel-th3wx Moza's handbrake is pure fucking trash compared to the Thrustmaster one though. If you want worse handbrakes of course you can go cheaper. If you want something better, you're gonna have to pay a lot. I don't really know who makes a better hand brake then Thrustmaster tbh. Personally, if TM had a cheaper one I would actually have gone for that. It was the only part I bought that I just felt was way the hell too expensive for what it does and how often I use it.
The pedals you listed are all load cell. No force feedback, most of them don't even have brake rumble (which I find lame personally). They are in no way shape or form substantially better than the T-LCM. Marginal improvement sometimes at 2x the price. The Moza pedals are literally hella primitive and you get TWO pedals.. They MUST be used in a cockpit cause they're literally just bent aluminium plates with no real base plate or anything like that. They also look extremely uncomfortable, but that's beside the point.
If you want BETTER pedals, like I said.. You WILL have to pay multiple times as much. Just the brake pedal with force feedback is already close to 10x what I paid for my pedal set ffs... The step up from load cells is not load cells, it's force feedback. You get nothing under a thousand bucks.. Which is 5x the cost of the T-LCM.
@@JimmyNuisance Moza handbrake isn't trash and it's almost 3 times cheaper - You can buy a sequential shifter too and still have £70 left over!
@Miguel-th3wx Good luck ever talking to someone from Moza for customer service. I bought a 488 gt3 wheel dorm TM and the right handle had a very small tear, figured I'd reach out about it and just assumed I'd be told "sorry that's wear and tear" instead I had two new side handles shipped overnight from France. Crazy good customer service.
I'm still on the T-150 here!! It still puts in work! Dirt rally 2.0 really got me hooked during quarantine.
i thought they were above logitech, but below fanatec, just looking forward to a direct drive on the low end priced under the cheapest fanatec, i don't need anything over the top, just better than a belt system
Just waiting for Logitech to release another wheel for the Pro. Not a fan of the TM quick release system
I like what TM are doing, but that QR ... 😢
I still think of Thrustmaster as being entry to maybe lower middle ground in Sim Racing hardware. Don't get me wrong I am using a TS-XW and T-LCMs and love them, but not enough FFB for my liking. Nost sure which way to go Moza, Simagic or Asetec. The trucking stuff from Moza appeals to me.
I hope Logitech respond by finally bringing out a formula rim for their direct drive wheel.
Surely it needs to sit between tgt2 and t818 I’d be disappointed if it was less powerful than tgt2 which is a great wheelbase one of the best for gt7 in fact
I hope for Thrustmaster fans it could be the same level as the T818, just with a Ps chip in it. I had the Fanatec DD Pro 8nm and I feel 8nm is a really good torque you need the least. I went from T300, to TGT 1 and 2, DD Pro 8nm and now DD+ 15 nm, but that last one is a beast I cant tame 😂
Pretty sure it's going to be about as powerful as the TGT2. I have the TGT2 and it's already way more powerful than I personally need. I'm driving at 25-40% power. If I'm drifting I sometimes set it to 50ish but I don't need to.
If it has like 10nm that's just a waste imo. I'd rather have a better motor with less clipping than just going for brute force. You get tired of achy wrists pretty quick, at which point that whole wheel-wrestling novelty is gone.
I'm not a race car driver, but I'd say that if your car is as hard to turn as the TGT2 on full power, you need to take that car in for a service, cause your whole steering assembly is locked up..
Ye I also race on tgt2 which I really love. So I’m hoping it’s a noticeable improvement.
@@JimmyNuisance DD is smoother and more direct driving, but thrust me, a higher torque option can eliminate clipping, it does not mean you have to use high torque. I just hope for you guys it is higher then 6.2 nm, it will give you a headroom
As a former TM user, the only reason I changed sides is because as a T300RS user, the jump from there to T818 is too high. All I wanted is a CSL DD in TM but it never came.
So if they're finally doing it, they might be able to bounce back.
Hoping it's at least 6nm tq like my tsxw is. If so I may just upgrade my wheelbase .
So this new wheel will be positioned below the T-GT2 in the console range? I’ve been holding off getting a T-GT2 thinking I’d wait for Thrustmaster DD wheel assuming it would be better than the T-GT2… but is that wrong? If I have a T-GT2 -sized wedge of cash should I go with that? 🤔
Will wait for real numbers. Ppl that try it couldn’t go in the files or game option to change the ffb.
I would wait for the direct drive, I have a TGT2 the power sometimes cuts out as the cable vigils its self loose from time to time and there is no quick release and the wheel mounting is all plastic.
My first wheel was the Logitech Driving Force GT, but Thrustmaster was my first with a big ecosystem. I started with T150, T300 and then finally the TGT. I switched to Fanatec when the Podiium F1 was first launched. I made the switch because I thought TM was a little slow on developing new hardware for racing. And it seems like they're trying to catch up now. Many TM users have jumped ship to Fanatec and Moza. Maybe TM will be good for entry level players but I cant see them getting any better than that. I do still use 2 of their Sparco TSS tho. Those are discontinued and BAD ASS.
Thrustmaster T300 user. Very happy with it for the price! I'll get a direct drive when I upgrade from wooden simulator 😅
I started with my pxn v9 then TM T150 & it was awesome. Then csl elite. Now I stepped up to my csl dd pro 8nm w/csl elite bmw rim. Very nice set up I must say. I'm happy with it. Yes I would've said trust master is an entry level start up sim. But, now I'm not so sure. That 818 looks like a monster. Maybe down the road it can be something to own for sure. Granted I started my sim racing like three months back and cant stop. I find myself on the tack at like 430am at times. Lol. Cheers!
Thank you for the video.
Logitech started my son and I, then switched over the thrustmaster. Products are affordable and to the higher end. Fanatech, Moza and Camus still need to come down in price. My son and I do sim racing for fun. We just upgraded to a rig instead of a wheel stand. It is for sure a rabbit hole once you start. Only takes money to stay up. We have the Ts-XW but run on PC now.
Awesome to hear this hope you are both having fun!!
started with t150 than t300 and a few years on a ts-pc , standat pedal than tlcm and finally sold everything , Thrustmaster always worked but everthing felt always a bit cheap like toys .
I own the T-LCM Pedals and love them have been looking at an upgrade but unless the pedals ship with clutch by default I will give them a pass
I almost bought thrustmaster back before direct drive was cheap but they have always looked toy like.
I'm a little upset with this news. I have been a T300 user since GT5, and when it was time to upgrade to a DD wheel, my choice was limited as the price for the Fanatec was just too high once all of the fees to get it here. So I went with MOZA R5 and hoped that they would be PS ready some day.
I really want to upgrade from my TX to a DD but I wanna keep my thrustmaster pedals and shifter. Really hope they release one for Xbox.
The t818 is top notch with tlcm pedals is 👌🏻
I don’t know how nobody is talking about the Simagic Alpha Mini / P1000 Sim Racing Bundle for 1175. I've preordered mine, and the anticipation is real. With options for the GT Neo or GTS Leather/Alcantara wheels and 2 or 3 pedal sets, the precision and craftsmanship are simply top-notch. In the $1000 range, it's hard to imagine choosing anything else. Unless you're on console. For sim racing, it's the perfect 'chef's kiss' moment. This bundle definitely deserves more attention and would make an epic video.
My journey in sim racing with wheels start with the t300rs in 2017 i think... i pay with a promotion very cheap!!! 199€ and one year later i receive a proposition to sell from a friend and i sold 280€... and from half a year i stop playing and only play with the controler... and half year later i bought in a promotion the logitec g29 for ps4 at 250€ with the gear shifter.... and i start to play more ofen and i decided to upgrade to a csl elite ps4 fanatec and i sold the g29 with the gear shifter one year later for 250€.... i pay 275€ for used csl elite and it is here my real love for sim racing started... wheels pedals playseat m9nitor stand....
After that they released the gt dd pro i waited for a ps4/5 compatibility, and i think i dont need more than 8nm... i have 6 wheels 2 csl elite like mclaren gt3 the rally for x box wheel .
3 club sport like formula 2.5 formula F1 green" black friday" and the podium porsche swede "round" at 600 and change€.... and that it my journey
Looks like an interesting wheel for upgrading my T300, but then i also need it to be compatible with linux for my PC gaming. The T300 doesn't have good support, for instance i can't get the FFB to work. Many years ago i paid i think 99 euros for my Logitech GTGF (or is it GFGT) and some years ago i went with the Thrustmaster T300 which i still use for both console and PC. I think Thrustmaster can be classified as low end, mid and high end.
So a 5-ish Nm then? I own a T818 and I really like it but I get why people go the Moza route when they come in fresh. I'm not sure they going to be able to win people over unless they really undercut the competition on price. I'm afraid they are kinda stuck with the QR unless they bring out another type of adapter wich would be kinda crazy at this point. That being said i haven't had any real problems with the QR of the T818 myself. The new pedals look really basic but if they are reliable and the load cell isn't expensive they might be a good option.
I think for a Playstation console player like me, there's not a whole load of choice and Thrustmaster does the job well.
I'm a busy family man with little free time and more important expenses, so having a Next Level fold out chair and a T300RS with T-lcm pedels work well for my couple of hours a month I get on there.
It always brings a smile to my face when I first set off and I think that's the whole point of sim racing, without spending a small fortune.
I would like to upgrade to a console compatible DD to kill the sound of the noisy fan and belt, so a cheaper DD would be great. But I'm staying clear of Fanatec atm.
I do like the fact you can easily buy Thrustmaster and Logitec off off Amazon (or others) and deliver in the UK without added delivery and import charges, the price is the price!
Keep up the great work.
I’ve had 2 thrustmaster tx bases first one lasted me 5 years and this second one is going on year 6 is the 818 that much better then the tx
TM is my all time favorite atm as ive only tried logi, and i honestly dont have a feel for the gear drive. its good, but thrust has a different approach for getting people deeper into the feelings of the car with the T150 being belt driven. sadly had to sell my 150 before my recent move.
I have the tgt2. Because a play on console. I can’t wait for the dd from Thrustmaster for console. I also have the Tlcm pedals.
What do you think of the Logitech G Pro? I have a G29 as I'm starting out but I def want to go DD.
I have a TGT2 my only compaint is the plastic housing used to attach the wheel. You have to drive a srew into the whell and base. I can hear slight cracking noise every now and then. I hope it does not break on me. I have been holding off on buying a replacement wheel . No quick release
Hello and thanks for the update
I’m very excited about this. I’m using a tgt2 and tlc-m pedals, on a Playseat trophy. In my opinion it’s a great setup. Playing Gtr7, ACC and some rally games.
I hope the wheelbase will have at least as much force like my tgt2. What do you think about that.? Stronger or weaker?
I will hopefully think it will be at least under top end stuff. Now I think; beginner to mid range level for Thrustmaster.
I got my first thrustmaster wheel 20 years ago. Glad thrustmaster will compete on the mid range products aswell.For me its already too late, I switched to Moza and Im happy to be in their eco system now.
I was going to get a Logitech Pro any day here….thoughts??
Logitech maybe releasing a new rim for the G PRO this october/november. I have been waiting for a new rim from them for nearly 2 years.
Running a TGT2 with TLCM's as my first wheel and pedal combo. Would have thought a Thrustmaster DD wheel would sit above the TGT2 wheel but will have to wait and see.
I have t300 and t-lcm for years only racing on Gran Turismo. Many times considered switching to DD, but I was happy with T-LCM and switching completely to Fanatec was too expensive. Also the latest news with Fanatec raised some concerns. I’ve been waiting for this for so long.
Have a thrustmaster T300 and Tlcm pedals that I've had since before the DD market exploded and they both have been great, no issues at all with either and they've been abused! I've looked forward to an upgraded more refined version of pedals from thrustmaster. That being said, I feel pricing would be the big thing when comparing qaulity equipment from the other big companies in the market.
I had my first Thrustmaster wheel in the 90', and for the time it was great. Don't think this company should rethink their brand at all. Now I'm currently on a T300RS with TLCM Pedal and looking for to upgrade to a direct drive compatible with PS. Thanks again for you great videos!
Need this , i am fully in to the TM system and being on PS5 Fanatec was looking as my only option for DD.
Logitech G Pro?
@@supercededman No other Steering wheels for that , just stuck with what it comes with.
I'm hoping they have a DD for Xbox coming... I've been waiting to upgrade my TX
Your claim to 99% is misleading, try and state only facts based on evidence that can be substantiated. you are doing investigative journalism, that also means that you should invest more time in getting to know the target material and report only that which you can prove with evidence, I like your videos and you have a very presentable voice for TH-cam... Keep up the good work and take this as positive critisysm to help in impoving your viewers experience
I think te QR system is the same in new base and T818. In traxion gg is the picture from top of base.
I use a TS-XW with T3PM pedals and I honestly don’t feel the need to upgrade, but Im definitely gonna keep an eye out for these new products.
As I only play gt7 for about 2-3h a week I’m still on a g29 mounted on a playseat. I’m really interested in DD wheels but the price is still way to high for the time that I’ll use it.
I think I’ll wait until there’s some package (DD wheel / pedals with clutch / manual shifter) somewhere sub 500. It might take some time but when you see what’s going on in the current market there’s a small chance I think ;)
First! And I'll check out the booth at Gamescom tomorrow :)
Take some pics for us please!!! 🙌🙌🙌
If Thrustmaster made an elite line, I think it would do well. Especially if it was easy to upgrade the hardware in its ecosystem and connections.
ie: Thrustmaster GT-Elite (model number) wheel. Etc.
Endor is getting destroyed year by year to be finally stomp on the ground by other manufacturers...it's sad, i still have my CSL elite (i'm a casual GT7) and it works well and i dont even know for how long it's gonna work. Thumbs up to TM, great news for us consol-ers!
I love my Thrustmaster wheel & pedals. But I guess I’m bias cause I’ve never used Fanatec dd. Absolutely looking forward to the new products from Thrustmaster. Thanks for the info.
Started with the t150 and used it for 3 years before upgrading to Fanatec DDPro. If this was available at the time I would have stayed with thrustmaster.
Why i have a black screen? I can not see your video
Turn the monitor on bro
@@Kireth i watch in the phone my friend, i had to restart the phone all videos became black only with the automatic subtitles.... sorry i was thinking it was a error from the video but the error it was from my android phone... keep up the good work, i follow you from the beginen....love from france
I STILL have a T500RS with T-LCM pedals, fed up of the newer rims not being fully compatible with the T500RS, so i'm looking forward to see what they're offering up next, can't see me buying their new pedals tbh, IF I was going to change the pedals, i'd probably plump for some Simpson pro pedals or something similar.
Finally Direct upgrade when it comes out the Direct Drice wheel!
I started with the g923 trueforce, then my lad got into f1 so I went and got a t300 with tlcm pedals. 2 years and never skipped a beat, I’ve been waiting for this DD console since it was announced one was coming. Everyone I know with fanatec gear wish they never got it with the disconnection issues. So I’m glad I didn’t go down that route. Thrustmaster missed the mark for DD for years. But with only 2 options out there at the minute I’m excited to see what this new DD will bring to the competition
Hooray, my old T500 is pretty tired and the brakes are a real limitation with the lack of feel. I would have liked Moza to have ps compatibility but doesn’t seem likely soon? Thrustmaster I think of as in the same league as all the others, swings and roundabouts for me.
I started with thrustmaster ,3 diferente wheel bases until i got fanatec, but i Will love to see a thrustmaster direct drive like the ddpro , and they got good ecosistem❤
Looking forward for this, l have a t300 with load cell pedals which has served me well
I've been waiting for them to release a DD for PS4/ PS5 since they announced the T818. I almost bought into Fanatec but to pay almost 1k usd and wait then hoping they still stay afloat to upgrade in the future. I have a wheel and aluminum hub I used on my T300 servo base 6 years ago. Pedals is a refreshing view because Simjack Pro has been a serious thought. Hopefully, they will have better and adjustable pedal throw like LC100. I will wait longer to upgrade if released by Xmas.
Thrustmaster brand is trusted
Trustmaster
@@Kireth 😂
@@Kirethif you have access to a t-gtii you should try it since GT7 last update. The road texture and vibrations through the wheel and transducer is through the roof. The steering sensitivity setting in GT7 now actually does something, a lot infact and it's hard to keep the wheel straight at high speed if you have it on 10. Will the direct drive have the transducer in? I have base shakers connected to simhub so can still get those affects but for people who don't, the transducer is a lot of the immersion on the tgtii.
I have a t300 and was gonna get a tgt2 but now I’m thinking about waiting for the new ps compatible tm dd 😬 any idea on timelines??
At a pro level, is there a real added value to go from a T818 to whatever is out there? Asking as a novice.
Would someone fighting for wins in big F1 esports or iRacing be any slower with a T818 compared to their preferred setup, given all the time to prepare?
Is there laptime or consistency to be had above the T818, or is it more about being like a heavy to steer race car?
I use the g29 wheel with included pedals to play gt7 and was thinking of upgrading but joking aside I don’t think I’ve ever been so confused as to what to upgrade to and after watching this video I’m even more confused maybe just me lol
I literally just bought Moza SRP pedals to pair with my T300 🙈🙈
They “need” to make a PlayStation app for updates and customization, some don’t have PC’s (I have a Mac)
How great would it be to just keep everything plugged in and get going
Would buy it if Thrusmaster direct drive is good and not so overpriced like the Logitech one. But the brake pedal need be good too because on the G29 Pedals I have a hydraulic brake pedal installed. Moza aktive pedals would be great but I doubt that would work on PS5.
Do we have a projected release date for this???
wonder how many nM, and the price...
Man im so excited, really been wanting i low nM DD for PS5, i dont have a solid rig so a expensive wheel does me no good
That’s the problem with all the good new pedals and DD wheels - they don’t work well for those of us using foldable chairs or desks!
If this Direct Drive could be purchased like most other Thrustmaster products, I would have peace of mind knowing I could also purchase an extended warranty from the store.
meanwhile me with 2500iR and a G29
I'm hoping they drop some firmware for thr T818 so I can use my ps5?
really wish they would add a third pedal...
I think all the companies you mentioned as well as thrustmaster are all entry level, to mid. Their great for what they are, abd have some high emd products.
Then there's the 3rd tier awesomeness like, simucube, asetek, simagic, heusinkveld, g.s.i., simgrade (Playstation compatibility) simlab, list goes on.
lol…. I agree, it’s hilarious to keep hearing ppl say upper tier and mention Moza & Fanetec like they aren’t entry level to mid. Whoever does Moza’s marketing needs a raise because ppl are believing it’s the best company in sim racing when it’s a C+ at best. Hahaha
@@Breeezy333 at best 👌
I'd say TM is just late to the party. I began my journey back before 2009 with Logitech G27, as that died had an T300RS (very annoying FAN, such poor quality Pedals compared to the G27) and got later that sort of plastic Ferrari-F1-Wheel for that and as that died just this year, I switched to the MOZA R9 together with a KS and RS-V2 Wheel. And I enjoy this MOZA-Stuff really a lot, those 31 and 33cm wheels are such an amazing boost in ergonomics and quality after these years of puppet 28cm things that put so much strain on my shoulders, neck and back. And of course, this being my first DD-Base, also adds a lot to the experience.
However, nothing of that money spent made me really faster, but iRacing has been more enjoyable than ever. A friend of mine who started the Sim-Racing journey at the same time as me, is still on his G27 "without any ecosystem" all these years (and is still quicker than me!). So you don´t have to play the FOMO-Game, "what´s next", spent tons of money. You just don't have to. Actually nowadays for it´s more about the quality and ergonomics for me.
Just a day after I decided to switch and purchased a Moza ES-X using your affiliate link! Oh well, Thrustmaster isn't cheap where I live, already have a T300 with shifter and t-lcm, but Moza here I come
Let me know how it is when it arrives!
@@Kireth will do, R12 base is also on its way, can't wait
It all comes down to pricing. I could never ever justify buying a wheel which costs sometime twice or three times the console itself.
1. You never tried one (that expensive)
2. You dont care about cars /simulation
When you love sim games and cars ,you will pay even ten times more just to feel that thrilling emotions driving alien cars like f1. Le mans , wrc , gt3 , than most of us will never drive in the real life or even seen on the streets
wonder if the pedals will be better than the t3pa
I just got the R3 for xbox. Its awesome!
Huge!
thrustmaster needs to step it up with companies like moza and sim magic. moza seems to be killing it in the sim world with all the new stuff coming. thrustmaster is entry to me i was waiting for their dd base and when it came out i was pretty sad the qr just doesnt looks safe to me. im a big guy i want something i can believe in that qr just looks weak. that is why i got an moza R9 V2 with CS wheel. it wasnt much more then thrustmasters base
"99% Of Sim Racers Waited For This!" BIG claim this...
@@byrondubois_za 98%?
@@Kireth :P :P xD sounds good lol
luv my t500 t818
FANATEC 4-LIFE!!!. (Well until they die!,🤣).
The problem with Thustmaster and Logitech is the pricing.. Too much money for what you actually get compared to moza or simagic.
Depends on whether u need console compatibility
Will this new base work on ps4
It's too late... It's too late... I bought Simagic Alpha Mini)))
99% whut? Not like Kireth to clickbait. I guess I'm part of the 1% majority of sim racers! LOL!
Thrustmaster DD is above Moza and Fanatec to me in terms of FFB feel.
They still haven’t lost their mojo, their software FFB is top notch.
Many people forget but pre DD era pre covid. They were the the best choice for sim racing for many since the release of belt drive wheels, basically since 2010.
To me it was matter of time, where they catch up, big players always move slow .
They are back in mid tier race again now for that everyday consumer. They only need good price and t818 to come also to consoles.
The Thrustmaster DD experience is absolutely slept on
lol…. Most ppl will never know because 3-5yrs ago Fanetec ppl started the Thrustmaster hate band wagon and it’s never stopped. Now it’s all about how great Moza is and over the next couple years it will be about how another company is great and is so innovative. It’s the same dumb cycle. Companies like Thrustmaster and Logitech will continue to just snail along with entry to mid gear while the Fanetecs & Moza’s will burn out or just fade because the shine eventually wears off
Thrustmaster hardly has any good steering wheels and the pedals are really not good. But the main thing is that a small DD comes first.
too many lights and plastic. 100% Moza over this. Their clamping system is unbeatable for the money.
Got me a ts pc a few years ago with the hope that Thrustmaster uses the potential of there ecosystem, then they released nearly nothing for a long (to long) time...
I will be switching to moza in about a week.
For me Thrustmaster killed them self...
If Thrustmaster doesn't lower the prices of their products, this won't be a good option. The Moza R9 (which is the equivalent of the T-818) is $200 cheaper and has better build quality and better QR. Even the R12, which is superior, is $100 cheaper than the TM. It doesn't make any sense.
No, thank you.
Im waiting to MOZA for PS5 😎
Like deployed 👍
I'm a dad of four boys with so many other priorities, but I still love firing up ac with my thrustmaster tx with the 599 wheel and t3pa pro pedals to knock out some laps when I get a spare moment. I've been wanting to upgrade to load cell pedals, but the tlcm pedals just didn't impress me. I'm hoping these new ones do the trick. Can't wait