Excellent video and so glad I found it! Just retired, a newbie to rc, and just picked up an Apprentice STS 1.5. So, let’s see if I’m understanding this correctly. 1. Put plane on a level surface. 2. With the plane on and bound to transmitter make sure you’re in experienced mode and all electronic trims are set to zero. 3. Mechanically set the ailerons, elevator, and ruder surfaces to line up with adjacent surface. 5. Fly the plane and adjust electronic trims as necessary and land plane. 6. Measure the surface with the trim from the flight, put the trim to zero on the transmitter, adjust the clevis on the plane until the surface measures the same as it did with transmitter trim. 7. Go fly and adjust from there.
yep, you got it! Don't be shocked if you end up with a control surface that isn't perfectly aligned to the adjacent surface after you get the plane trimmed and flying perfect in the air. Typically a brand new plane out of the box is pretty close to being trimmed out of the box. If you are just starting out in RC, I wouldn't worry too much about making trim adjustments in the air. SAFE will compensate to keep the plane flying level. As long as the plane is starting out with the control surfaces aligned with the adjacent surface, SAFE will do the rest. As you progress with learning and get out of beginner mode, then you will start to notice if the plane is out of trim and needs adjustment in the air. The good thing is that you can use SAFE to help you trim the plane. I only recently learned about this trick. Once you get into intermediate mode where you are comfortable flying the plane, go up to an altitude where you have plenty of room to recover and put the plane in experienced mode. See if the plane rolls or pitches in experienced mode and take a mental note of which direction it is going and then put it back into intermediate mode. Use your trim switches to add the trim to counteract what the plane was doing in experienced mode. Note that the elevator moves with SAFE on to keep the plane in the air so expect it to begin to dive slightly at half throttle compared to what it does with SAFE on beginner mode. That is normal. You should be able to go into experienced mode at 50% power and the plane should fly level and then slightly climb with SAFE on beginner mode. Ok, back to trimming. So if the plane rolls right, add a few clicks of left aileron trim to balance it out. Go back into experienced mode and see if the plane still wants to roll. If so, add a few more clicks of trim. The idea is that you should go from intermediate to experienced mode without the plane wanting to roll or pitch. Then you have the plane trimmed out properly. Land and then adjust your control surfaces so you can set the transmitter trim to 0.
@@BRGT350 WOW, lots of good information you gave us. I will do as you suggest and play with it. Really looking forward to trying it all out. I've always been one who likes to tinker with stuff anyways. For instance - I'm a Ham Radio operator but actually like building and modifying equipment and antennas more then actually talking on the radio. Thanks again, Your help is much appreciated!
Happy to help out! I also love to tinker with my planes, but most of the modifications are all related to making them look more realistic. I have started to get into designing 3D printed parts to make the planes look more real.
@@BRGT350 haven't gotten into 3d printing yet but that sounds interesting. I will have to check into that one day. It's amazing what people are making with those printers. Good luck with that.
thanks, I have found that foam planes need some additional trimming as the weather changes, mostly with the elevator and rudder as the fuselage expands and contracts with heat and humidity. The ailerons stay pretty consistent, but not always. I have had a few cases in which a plane trimmed perfectly in the fall is out of trim in the summer. The best solution is to get it as close as you can to being trimmed for all seasons and then add a few clicks as needed to adjust for changing weather.
I built a Veron balsa Cherokee glow powered with an all flying elevator, however on its first flight the elevator started to fishtail up and down. I can see that the model that you have on the table has an all flying elevator. What prevents fishtailing on your model?
I assume you are referring to a plane that is pitching up and down caused by stabilator flutter. I didn't have to do anything to the E-flite Cherokee to prevent that from happening. I did lower the amount of throw on the stabilitor and increase the expo to make it less sensitive to pitch inputs, but that wasn't to fix a flying issue, but rather to make the plane react how I wanted it to when applying up and down elevator. I wanted a very sedate Cherokee. Typically stabilator flutter is caused by too high of airspeed and/or not enough support to maintain the stabilator's position. Aerodynamic forces begin to act upon the surface and overpower the rigidity of the surface, hinges, or servo.
As long as the plane is in the same attitude between measurements and the location of the measuring device didn't change, it doesn't matter the flatness of the surface. Now, I would suggest using a flat surface such as a table since you remove the possibility of surface variation and gravity works to your advantage. I wanted to transfer the mechanical trim from one Cherokee to the other a few weeks ago and since the landing gear aren't exactly the same height between the planes, I built a stand that located 3 points on the bottom of each plane. I verified the heights of the plane using the spinner and wing tip lights. Once both planes were sitting identical, I was able to measure the stab position on the one that has already been trimmed and transfer that to the other one. The results were pretty good, only needed a few clicks of trim on the elevator. The indent on the one Cherokee was gone due to the filler and paint, so I had to find a different way to align it. The method I describe in the video is what I have been doing for years and multiple aircraft and it works great each time. I either use a table or the garage floor. Results are the same either way. Measure the surface with the trim from the flight, put the trim to zero on the transmitter, adjust the clevis on the plane until the surface measures the same as it did with transmitter trim. Go fly and adjust from there.
I successfully binded my Apprentice STS to Spectrum DX6 but upon doing so, I noticed the rudder being way off center. I tried fully trimming it to the left and almost got it to center, but not quite. How do I mechanically adjust the rudder so it's center without trim? I tried unscrewing the servo but there's two steel rods attached to the servo arm from opposite directions, making it impossible to adjust.
You don't need to remove the servo or the arm from the servo to make any adjustments. Those rods you are talking about are the push rods that activate the rudder and nose gear. Go back and look at the rudder where the rod attaches to the plastic piece that is shaped like a triangle with holes in it. There is a clip that attaches the metal rod to the plastic part on the rudder. The rod is threaded. Unhook the plastic clip by sliding the rubber band towards the metal rod and pulling the clip apart with your fingers. Then turn the clip on the rod to make your adjustment. If it is to the left and the servo is on the right, then clockwise turning of the clip will shorten the rod length causing the rudder to move right. Center the trim on your transmitter and make sure the rudder is centered. Keep adjusting until the clip until the rudder is centered and there isn't any trim on the transmitter. Push the plastic clip back together and install the rubber band. If the Apprentice doesn't have the threaded rod, then it has a metal barrel on the servo arm with a screw on the top. Loosen the screw and push or pull the rod through the barrel until the rudder is centered, then tighten the screw. I am not sure which adjustment style the newer Apprentice has, but the manual should also have some details on how to adjust. Let me know if you have any questions.
@@BRGT350 Yeah, I already tried expanding and contracting the push rods as much as possible and it made no difference. So another problem that came to light was that my nose gear wasn't steering and there was no tension at all. I contacted Tower Hobbies two days ago and they sent me a return authorization label
sounds like something is wrong. Usually one turn of the clip on the push rod is enough to move the surface a noticeable amount. It is rare a plane needs more than a turn to get it trimmed. Before you make your first flight, take a credit card or straight edge and lay across the control surface to make sure it is flat and aligned to the adjacent surface. Make your adjustments before flying. Trim in the air as needed and then transfer that trim mechanically and put your transmitter trim back to zero.
Is it normal for surfaces to be out by like 3-5mm out of box ? 1 x aeleron looks really bad out of box conscendo evolution. Haven't flown yet as it's my 2nd rc and first bnf. Need help 😔
Not typical, but I have had a few that needed more adjustment than others. I have had some planes that every surface is perfectly aligned out of the box and others that needed some adjustment. Be sure to power up the plane first before making any adjustments. The surfaces may not be centered from packing the plane for shipment. Power up the plane and let all the surfaces move during the AS3X check. Once that is done, then check to see if any surfaces need adjustment. I use a credit card or business card as a straight edge to see if the surfaces need to be adjusted.
I wouldn't be too worried. I have had some planes that were pretty far off when I powered them up. Made the adjustments on the bench before flying and they have been perfect planes ever since.
@@BRGT350 im not overly worried. But it is interesting that after adjustment, one end of the right aeleron is 1mm up, and the other end is 1mm down. I guess that's as close as it gets. The other side is fine.
Excellent video and so glad I found it! Just retired, a newbie to rc, and just picked up an Apprentice STS 1.5. So, let’s see if I’m understanding this correctly.
1. Put plane on a level surface.
2. With the plane on and bound to transmitter make sure you’re in experienced mode and all electronic trims are set to zero.
3. Mechanically set the ailerons, elevator, and ruder surfaces to line up with adjacent surface.
5. Fly the plane and adjust electronic trims as necessary and land plane.
6. Measure the surface with the trim from the flight, put the trim to zero on the transmitter, adjust the clevis on the plane until the surface measures the same as it did with transmitter trim.
7. Go fly and adjust from there.
yep, you got it! Don't be shocked if you end up with a control surface that isn't perfectly aligned to the adjacent surface after you get the plane trimmed and flying perfect in the air. Typically a brand new plane out of the box is pretty close to being trimmed out of the box. If you are just starting out in RC, I wouldn't worry too much about making trim adjustments in the air. SAFE will compensate to keep the plane flying level. As long as the plane is starting out with the control surfaces aligned with the adjacent surface, SAFE will do the rest. As you progress with learning and get out of beginner mode, then you will start to notice if the plane is out of trim and needs adjustment in the air. The good thing is that you can use SAFE to help you trim the plane. I only recently learned about this trick. Once you get into intermediate mode where you are comfortable flying the plane, go up to an altitude where you have plenty of room to recover and put the plane in experienced mode. See if the plane rolls or pitches in experienced mode and take a mental note of which direction it is going and then put it back into intermediate mode. Use your trim switches to add the trim to counteract what the plane was doing in experienced mode. Note that the elevator moves with SAFE on to keep the plane in the air so expect it to begin to dive slightly at half throttle compared to what it does with SAFE on beginner mode. That is normal. You should be able to go into experienced mode at 50% power and the plane should fly level and then slightly climb with SAFE on beginner mode. Ok, back to trimming. So if the plane rolls right, add a few clicks of left aileron trim to balance it out. Go back into experienced mode and see if the plane still wants to roll. If so, add a few more clicks of trim. The idea is that you should go from intermediate to experienced mode without the plane wanting to roll or pitch. Then you have the plane trimmed out properly. Land and then adjust your control surfaces so you can set the transmitter trim to 0.
@@BRGT350 WOW, lots of good information you gave us. I will do as you suggest and play with it. Really looking forward to trying it all out. I've always been one who likes to tinker with stuff anyways. For instance - I'm a Ham Radio operator but actually like building and modifying equipment and antennas more then actually talking on the radio.
Thanks again, Your help is much appreciated!
Happy to help out! I also love to tinker with my planes, but most of the modifications are all related to making them look more realistic. I have started to get into designing 3D printed parts to make the planes look more real.
@@BRGT350 haven't gotten into 3d printing yet but that sounds interesting. I will have to check into that one day. It's amazing what people are making with those printers. Good luck with that.
Excellent video and who would have thought its not just trim but retrim very great and thanks for this video
thanks, I have found that foam planes need some additional trimming as the weather changes, mostly with the elevator and rudder as the fuselage expands and contracts with heat and humidity. The ailerons stay pretty consistent, but not always. I have had a few cases in which a plane trimmed perfectly in the fall is out of trim in the summer. The best solution is to get it as close as you can to being trimmed for all seasons and then add a few clicks as needed to adjust for changing weather.
I built a Veron balsa Cherokee glow powered with an all flying elevator, however on its first flight the elevator started to fishtail up and down. I can see that the model that you have on the table has an all flying elevator. What prevents fishtailing on your model?
I assume you are referring to a plane that is pitching up and down caused by stabilator flutter. I didn't have to do anything to the E-flite Cherokee to prevent that from happening. I did lower the amount of throw on the stabilitor and increase the expo to make it less sensitive to pitch inputs, but that wasn't to fix a flying issue, but rather to make the plane react how I wanted it to when applying up and down elevator. I wanted a very sedate Cherokee. Typically stabilator flutter is caused by too high of airspeed and/or not enough support to maintain the stabilator's position. Aerodynamic forces begin to act upon the surface and overpower the rigidity of the surface, hinges, or servo.
i understand what your saying but,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,the landing gear would have to be perfect to the level surface to do that,,,,right?
As long as the plane is in the same attitude between measurements and the location of the measuring device didn't change, it doesn't matter the flatness of the surface. Now, I would suggest using a flat surface such as a table since you remove the possibility of surface variation and gravity works to your advantage. I wanted to transfer the mechanical trim from one Cherokee to the other a few weeks ago and since the landing gear aren't exactly the same height between the planes, I built a stand that located 3 points on the bottom of each plane. I verified the heights of the plane using the spinner and wing tip lights. Once both planes were sitting identical, I was able to measure the stab position on the one that has already been trimmed and transfer that to the other one. The results were pretty good, only needed a few clicks of trim on the elevator. The indent on the one Cherokee was gone due to the filler and paint, so I had to find a different way to align it. The method I describe in the video is what I have been doing for years and multiple aircraft and it works great each time. I either use a table or the garage floor. Results are the same either way. Measure the surface with the trim from the flight, put the trim to zero on the transmitter, adjust the clevis on the plane until the surface measures the same as it did with transmitter trim. Go fly and adjust from there.
I successfully binded my Apprentice STS to Spectrum DX6 but upon doing so, I noticed the rudder being way off center. I tried fully trimming it to the left and almost got it to center, but not quite. How do I mechanically adjust the rudder so it's center without trim? I tried unscrewing the servo but there's two steel rods attached to the servo arm from opposite directions, making it impossible to adjust.
You don't need to remove the servo or the arm from the servo to make any adjustments. Those rods you are talking about are the push rods that activate the rudder and nose gear. Go back and look at the rudder where the rod attaches to the plastic piece that is shaped like a triangle with holes in it. There is a clip that attaches the metal rod to the plastic part on the rudder. The rod is threaded. Unhook the plastic clip by sliding the rubber band towards the metal rod and pulling the clip apart with your fingers. Then turn the clip on the rod to make your adjustment. If it is to the left and the servo is on the right, then clockwise turning of the clip will shorten the rod length causing the rudder to move right. Center the trim on your transmitter and make sure the rudder is centered. Keep adjusting until the clip until the rudder is centered and there isn't any trim on the transmitter. Push the plastic clip back together and install the rubber band. If the Apprentice doesn't have the threaded rod, then it has a metal barrel on the servo arm with a screw on the top. Loosen the screw and push or pull the rod through the barrel until the rudder is centered, then tighten the screw. I am not sure which adjustment style the newer Apprentice has, but the manual should also have some details on how to adjust. Let me know if you have any questions.
@@BRGT350 Yeah, I already tried expanding and contracting the push rods as much as possible and it made no difference. So another problem that came to light was that my nose gear wasn't steering and there was no tension at all. I contacted Tower Hobbies two days ago and they sent me a return authorization label
sounds like something is wrong. Usually one turn of the clip on the push rod is enough to move the surface a noticeable amount. It is rare a plane needs more than a turn to get it trimmed. Before you make your first flight, take a credit card or straight edge and lay across the control surface to make sure it is flat and aligned to the adjacent surface. Make your adjustments before flying. Trim in the air as needed and then transfer that trim mechanically and put your transmitter trim back to zero.
Is it normal for surfaces to be out by like 3-5mm out of box ? 1 x aeleron looks really bad out of box conscendo evolution. Haven't flown yet as it's my 2nd rc and first bnf.
Need help 😔
Not typical, but I have had a few that needed more adjustment than others. I have had some planes that every surface is perfectly aligned out of the box and others that needed some adjustment. Be sure to power up the plane first before making any adjustments. The surfaces may not be centered from packing the plane for shipment. Power up the plane and let all the surfaces move during the AS3X check. Once that is done, then check to see if any surfaces need adjustment. I use a credit card or business card as a straight edge to see if the surfaces need to be adjusted.
@@BRGT350 thanks. Yes I already did. I made about 7 half turns while powered up.
Hope it's not gonna be a lemon 🍋.
I wouldn't be too worried. I have had some planes that were pretty far off when I powered them up. Made the adjustments on the bench before flying and they have been perfect planes ever since.
@@BRGT350 im not overly worried. But it is interesting that after adjustment, one end of the right aeleron is 1mm up, and the other end is 1mm down.
I guess that's as close as it gets. The other side is fine.
@@BRGT350 thanks for your replies :)