"Men's angry reactions when you don't treat them the way they think they should be treated" is just what "trans women" are displaying when women (especially) don't treat them as women.
I don't agree past a point. I'm not a man pretending to be a woman and then insisting I be treated as such. But if an angry feminist "treats" me in a prejudicial or antagonistic or simply hostile way, I don't have to accommodate her projections. Agreed: biological males don't belong in women's only spaces.
The man posturing and screaming, “IT’S MA’AM!” is quintessential example of the very masculine rage that supposed trans-women display when they are challenged.
@@zadkiel242I think that is the idea; and to make gayness taboo, once again. Isn't it funny how right-wing the achievements have been, anti-woman and anti-gay, for a movement that purports to be leftist?
Thank you!! I often point out this weird focus on 'defining the word woman' but never pushing these 'non binary college girls' to please 'define the word man'. The disgust and discomfort they all have in being what they are, in being women is so strong that they don't want to BE women. Just think about that for a minute. What on earth is going on? These psychologically troubled, vulnerable kids...this really is the medical scandal of the century. And of course, the greatest scandal in academic institutions I've ever seen. Combined with the normalisation of critical race theory it's just monstrous.
@@lostincredulity5369 no they're not. You have nothing to back that up, it's just a glib, misogynist comment. It is true that most rapes are not reported and that when they are a miniscule amount get to court and very few result in convictions. In the UK it has been irrefutably demonstrated that the number of false reports of rape is in keeping with the number of false reports of other crimes. Around 2%.
The refusal to discuss the trans issue is a strategy. Like the way they kicked Bob out of the bookstore. They brag about that. The misogyny behind the trans movement is off the chart.
@@SuperKripkeyet none of the mainstream tv news channels and such will they just gaslight. Nice try tho. Of course the public is discussing it , while the establishment pretends it doesn't exist. Classic leftism. "It's not happening" and "it's a good thing it's happening "
What intellectual lightweights the students of today seem to be. I remember really great debates with people with opposing views throughout Uni. It expanded my world view, helped me understand my own position and often changed or broadened that position. In our generations, we did not know where we stood on an issue until we could successfully debate it and either win or make substantive points that well refuted an opposing view. Now days, students have opinions based on what someone told them, do not research it, claim it is backed by science (which they never show), then shout down anyone who they even suspect would disagree. It's not about the truth or the best way forward for everyone, but what serves oneself best and often at the expense of others.
When words end, wars begin. The left can't and won't communicate! Their talking "points" aren't cohesive and make less and less sense the more I try to make any sense of it. I miss the debates of yesteryear and you DIDN'T always get to debate the side you agreed with 😂
The problem is guys like this speaker Jensen. A prime example of the Dunning Kruger effect. He writes articles on economics, on biology, psychology - when his only qualifications are in journalism. All his is in reality is a Neo Marxist activist. Can you imagine this guy giving both sides of the story to his classes?
Julie Bindel is the OG of gender critical feminism. She took to much backlash from the queer activism faction, and here she is 20 years later being proved right.
Julie is a man hater. That's the reason she has been black balled from society. I agree with her on some issues, such as "Transgenderism". However, she implied in this video, that ALL MEN ARE BAD, but we "are not born this way". That is the most disgusting, man-hating mentality of any feminist I've ever known.
She's also not "gender critical" as far as I know, she's simply a radical feminist. So-called gender-critical folks are usually randomers from across the political spectrum who don't care about abolishing gender but just want things to go back to good old blue for boys and pink for girls, more or less
@@morganm4768 Who said I wanted to police it? I just think everything about it is horrible and soul-destroying, but by all means, you keep at it, hunched over your screen like a little gremlin.
That whole “Cancellation doesn’t exist” gaslighting thing the left is now doing is so ironic, because what they’re actually saying is “If you have enough money you can be cancelled and survive.” It doesn’t take into consideration all of the people who aren’t wealthy whose lives have been completely destroyed because of false, very casually thrown out, accusations of being phobic or racist etc. What about the two working class people whose lives got ruined when a student at Smith decided to claim that they asked her why she was in a locked room that was for a kids summer camp? She didn’t even know which of them asked this, but named them on Twitter and called them racist, and so they got fired and their income gone.
A man can become a woman but a white person can't be a black person. I'm 50 and want to identify as a senior citizen...I feel like one. Can I be a senior citizen and get my old age pension?
I have too......duuuuuh.......everyone has had bad experiences with agressive abusive men.........BUT I LEARNT THAT IT WAS THE TYPE OF MEN I WAS CHOOSING to be with that was the problem. Yes bad people exist and theres little wishing it werent so can change that. Not ALL mem( or women) are bad so we NEED to learn THAT AND learn HOW TO DISTINGUISH between bad and good people. THAT ....IS....LIFE!!!
@@mindyourownfuukingbiz6737 True. The fem movement ruined things for many women too. They got all uptight about the bathing suit part in Miss America. Stupid.
So he is saying what I also believe - trans ideology is not "left" wing at all. Much of trans doctrine (anti homosexuality, girls wear pink, boys wear blue etc) is actually very right wing. The trans definition of gender is so utterly old fashioned and sexist that I cannot understand why more people don't realise that it is conservative.
No it's not right wing. Sorry, you can tell yourself that, but it's almost entirely propped up by the left. You can think what is ideally should be, but without the left today, this trans cult stuff would have died long ago. Unfortunately the left has done a 180 on what they used to believe (as a party platform).
To only think in a binary of left or right wing in a goal to define whatever you oppose as the opposite wing is stupid. We cannot treat everything as a sport with teams winning and losing
Excellent. I've been looking for a podcast like this for a while without really knowing what to search for - thrilled to find it and delve in. Thanks a million, Julie Bindel et al!
I think this applies to all activists, none of them have the best interests of the majority at heart. As the great Thomas Sowell asserts: Activism is a way for useless people to feel important, even if the consequences of their activism are counterproductive for those they claim to be helping and damaging to the fabric of society as a whole.
It definitely doesn’t apply to all activists, but I’d agree with the proposition that it’s most. Especially Marxian activists, which pretty much all feminist activists are. It’s all about liberating their respective oppressed identity category, and often, as you said, to the detriment of society-whether said identity category is actually oppressed or not. It always deteriorates to the goal of equal outcomes, which requires the demolishing and subversion of the very societal hierarchies and structures that allow society to function, as well as the active oppression of whoever is perceived as the oppressing identity category. Marxism needs to be viewed in a similar light to Nazism-it’s certainly killed more people, and will again if it’s not stopped.
Unfortunately, the people who kept participating in the lie and believed themselves to be kind are the ones who paved the way for the onslaught on the rights, boundaries, and 'identities' of others. A reminder that participating in lies only ever feeds lies.
I am of the opinion that NO ONE can be offended. 'Being offended' is giving POWER to someone you disagree with, who didn't ask for this power, and doesn't deserve it! Don't give it to them. Don't be offended.
Ms Bindel is the charming seductive face of feminism, and because of her charm and intelligence, a great interviewer. I love this series, and applaud The Spectator for affording her this platform 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
some of us don’t want anything to do with men but it’s not about seeking protection from other men. it’s just living life with as little interaction with men as possible. men should be helping each other to be better. women shouldn’t have to deal with that emotional labor
There is a major mating crisis and a growing demographic shadow. Its time to support cooperation and long term strategies because without well brought up children there is no future.
Personally I think thats the end game. Its what they want. What ever happened to all the people crying about overpopulation for 20 years? They started supporting trans ideology instead. Bill Gates is a good example.
What comes across quite strongly in the stories of being deplatformed without explanation or discussion is where are the grown-ups? It is all so intellectually lightweight and childish.
There are 3 billion men who can prive you wrong. Porn has more net traffic traffic thank all other sites put together. You are wrong snd your opinions don't matter.
Way to miss the point. It's like saying sweatshops are pointless because people there don't produce quality clothes. Sweatshops are bad not because they don't produce the desired effect, it's because they are synonymous with human rights abuses. Same with porn. You're 70 and still think with your dick.
Bob touched on the real issue, by advocating nurturing, or being a good role model for boys. The real issue is parenting of all children and especially of infants. It is a mess. We see the results all the time, everywhere-good and bad. Anything else is shutting the barn doors after the horses have bolted. Or herding cats, to be less defeatist.
Julie is a heroine of mine. Thank you Julie for your Northern strong woman, thoughtful but no nonsense approach to life and for all the important work you do.
Yet the whole series about honoring male allies. LOL Plus I just watched the first three minutes an there was no insult. So what are you talking about?@@aclark903
I find the trans movement's arguments and actions to be exasperatingly illogical. There is a glaring distortion of language e.g. a dismissal (maybe it is because of ignorance) of the use of metaphor and simile. The metaphor saying "transwomen" are women - plainly false - is not even acknowledged as a metaphor, let alone an invalid one. The simile "transwomen are (superficially) like women" is plainly true (and yes more nuanced that those few words indicate) and utterly ignored. Transwoman is not a synonym for woman. Transman is not a synonym for man. I think those two examples are illustrative of the intellectual incoherence of trans ideology. A further incoherence, this time in law, is the concept of 'doli incapax' or the principle that children (and yes the legislated ages vary) are incapable of criminal responsibility because their reasoning, and understanding of the consequences of their wants and actions, are not yet fully developed. Notwithstanding that, under the rubric of 'gender affirmation' such momentous processes as taking puberty blockers and undergoing transsexual surgery are taken to be fully informed. One of the most idiotic trans assertions is that someone has been 'born in the wrong body'. We have restrictions for chidren regarding: tobacco, drugs alcohol etc but (mostly) not for transitioning. In 'transworld' contradictions abound.
It's wonderful hearing from such thoughtful, really well-spoken gender critics whom I'd never heard of before like Bob Jensen. Very heartening knowing he's fighting the good fight in Austin; he might actually inspire some to think harder and do some learning. Many thanks to him for soldiering on in the face of such mistreatment. Who knew tenure would become so necessary to defend basic ethics and common sense.
I actually disagree with this endearing assertion, 'You can be a real man or you can be a human being'! I think the men who inherently think as Bob Jenson espouses here, and live in the way that honours it, are absolutely, 1000% REAL MEN! A 'real' is secure and doesn't need to prove anything about themself. Thank you for this beautiful, encouraging, educational and edifying interview, Julie Bindel and Bob Jenson.
Yes but Bob just defers to women for a fee, which is fine if you are an academic in our woke universities. Not so much if you wish to be sexually active or actually have a life purpose beyond a doormat.
I don’t see why Rachel Dolezal can’t call herself black when she grew up with black kids, and this is how she feels about herself. After all, it’s a culture, not a race, really. She has more of a claim to her identity than people who claim to “feel” female. What does it mean to feel female? I’ve been female my entire life, and I don’t know what it means. Am I feeling female when I got picked last for softball in high school? Am I feeling female when I had my period? Am I feeling female when I wanted to wear a cute dress and when I was attracted to a cute boy? I suspect it’s these last two things that make people who aren’t female believe they “feel female.”
African Americans have a shared ethnicity and history. If you don't have a shared ethnicity and history then you cannot tell me that you are a black person or an African American person. Besides Rachel didn't grow up with black kids. She was white as snow up until her adulthood. If you and I hung out together, you would not magically become black. Nor can a man magically become a woman. What is wrong with you?
It starts in the family. Parents need to educate themselves so that when raising sons and daughters, humanity, kindness, understanding and etc are the values being imparted.
Should you want to, I hope you feel free to openly express that without fear of being attacked for internalised transphobia, etc. Because from what I've observed, that is the experience for people who take the position you do.
When I used to be supportive of trans people, it was to support people like you. I went from being an "ally" to being revoIted by anything related to the -community- cuIt. Sad.
@@Anne_Onymousyou can still be supportive of normal, sane people, no?! I don’t understand that. Many people in the ‘community’ don’t like how a loud minority really bugger up their peaceful, respectful life. No need for that.
Julie- the Labour Leader seems to have allowed his daughter to identify as his son. In a recent interview he says he has two ‘boys’ - 13 yrs and 16 yrs old. How can we trust a leader who clearly is lying and captured by gender ideology?
Politicians no longer represent mainstream beliefs or people. They are talking to the minorities who are active on social media because political parties today don't know how to govern, they are election-winning machines.
Keir Starmer has pretty much announced that he has a child pretending to be the opposite sex. This is a huge issue for the electorate but there’s no sign of it in mainstream media. Censorship is rife!
My mother was a feminist and it took me decades to overcome her prejudice against men. She could not differentiate between male tyranny and male authority. She kept upholding a victim role that was not helpful, blaming men instead of her poor choices for her misfortunes. Feminism is not kind with men and children who often end up without fathers. The feminists I intensly dislike are the upper class ladies who live well because their male partners pamper them while killing themselves with work. Feminism has become a red flag for me. Maybe they can redeem themselves by helping women out now against transwomen.
@@amandag5072 I lived feminism, read feminism and left feminism. What you say reminds of those defenders of communism who suggest that the real communism was never implemented. Feminism fosters a victim mentality and a narrow and subjective world view.
@@amandag5072 feminism is pro trans which is anti woman misogyny. Im a gay woman and im for woman but im against radical feminism. They went too far as they did with queer and trans. It became toxic and they did not come out for womans sports which to me is unacceptable
Great talk I love the points you raise and thank you for sharing with us the responces you've recieved. I feel less alone now as I have shared similiar questions and been bullied by people of the trans movement myself. As a non bianary person I feel that these questions are fair and honest and need to be answered and discussed logically without throwing hate around... I have never experienced such hate as I experienced going to an LGBTQ meeting and being told something was wrong with me because I was ok with my body and that I should want to be trans. Why must everything be sexualized?
The cancel culture we have today sprang out of the political correctness of the 80's or 90's. It started with not being allowed to use words like "postman" or "busboy" and now we aren't allowed to point out facts. Thank you so much, Bob, for the excellent critique of the trans ideology.
I think you can get more men on board by showing how it is not a tug of war. At the moment, each side sees it as a zero sum game, where if one side wins, the other one looses. If you can present it as a win-win, it will be easier to get everyone to align.
There is a big antiporn movement coming from men, but their concerns are not really about the violence against women that it presents and encourages and more about the sexual and social consequences it has for men themselves : - the epidemic of erectile dysfunction amongst young men, - incapacity to achieve orgasm without pornography or masturbation (a lot of men cannot achieve orgasm inside their partners because of decreased sensitivity or "death grip syndrome"), - porn addiction ruining their relationships, - the decreased in their drive to seduce women or to have actual sex, - decrease in drive to do... anything at all (depression and retreat into the self), - needing more and more violence and degradation in the porn they watch to achieve anything and ending up looking at fetishistic content, rape videos, snuff films, content relating to pedophilia, - a lot of increase in strange paraphilias from young men due to porn wrapping their tastes from a young age (sissy hypno porn, autogenyphilia etc etc), - the hentai guys not even being attracted to "3d women" anymore, - decreased capacity to feel romantic love for their partner, You can find those communities on reddit communities like r/antiporn or from initiatives like "fight the new drug"
I think you are expressing exactly the false concept of feminsm (a tug of war) they both adress in the video. Men are also suffering from patriarchy and patriarchal ways of thinking which are deeply ingrained in our souls.
I listened to your talk! I have not heard of some of the topics you speak about, but I think you have made me realize that I am a feminist, by the way that I respect my wife and treat her as my equal. Thank you to you both, for deep and important information about women and men ( and transgender ideology ).
There's only one problem with that. I would very much agree with you. But really the only thing you can do is not fall into the same trap those people fell into. Half of my life was almost ruined by drugs and alcohol, It took that to learn this lesson. And I even know people who's lives were completely altered because of it. In a VERY unfair way. Just for those people to end up giving up and join them again, Just to repeat the cycle. It's sad and depressing. But they're ultimately making the decision of being an addict, So there's not much anyone but themselves to fix themselves and acknowledge their problems. I've tried EVERYTHING, For half of my life to go back to the way it was. Nothing you can do effects their decision. I've tried being blunt. I've tried manipulation, I've learned many lessons. And what I learned. Is even in a world without anything to be abused. That doesn't solve anything. You just made people hide their problems or find other ways to end their problems. Their problems aren't magically fixed, But ironically, What they're abusing isn't fixing their problems either. Just making it easier to deal with them, They're just postponing it.
Yes its true ❤ just get the word out how bad porn is on lots of levels - spiritually, prostitution, destroys relationships , loveless, damaging to womens safety, warps peoples brains, look into nofapp and its benefits for men. Porn is a definite spiritual attack its sad as F something losers use 😂
I would have always considered myself to be "left" wing but am being pushed to the right. I think that the definitions of right and left have changed to the point where they are not recognisable to older people, ie over 40.
@@ktwashere5637 I would just focus on economic issues and not get too bogged down in the identity stuff which is a sideshow and really doesn’t have much impact on most people’s day to day lives … I think you’ll find yourself realising you’re still left wing pretty quickly .. if you don’t then it’s not really that the left has changed in any real way but that you have … hope that helps
Trans people, just be happy that you have lives to live. I'm sure that this is what the real trans people want, as do others. Whoever you choose to be is still your choice and no one else's.
Thought- provoking interview, thanx. You ask the important question of how to interest men in the aims of feminism? For what its worth, and speaking as a man: 1) The term itself, 'feminism' , is problematic for many men. Unfortunately, and to the detriment of men and women, the term is widely understood as being hostile and anti man, 2) Is it not time for a radical rebranding? Is it not time to present its principles and values as 'redeeming' and enlightening and beneficial not only to men but the whole of society? 3) Finally, the shift came for me when I grasped that every woman is at some level my 'sister' and I, their 'brother'...We can disagree and become frustrated with each other, but to routinely disrespect or exploit each other, , is not normal - it is a sign of 'family' unwelness and 'maladjustment'.
While I understand your input, no, it is not time for us to water ourselves down and erase ourselves or take "fem" out to be "more inclusive" or less threatening. If calling ourselves feminist, if centering the rights, concerns and needs of women "is problematic for many men," I dont see how men hung up on the simple NAME of our movement are ever going to help us. It is not time to "present its principles as 'redeeming'" whatever that means. If it means make it more palatable so the boys will play with us, All aboard the OhHellNo Train to F*ThatS*Ville!
So as a matter of interest, which part of my input do you actually 'understand'? I could provide many examples, but do you have any idea what it feels like to be the 20 year old, new father, who wants to co-parent, but is repeatedly excluded by hostile 'feminist', anti-male, social workers? 'How could the 'perpetrator' possibly care'? (eye roll). Or to be only opposing voice in room full of seething 'feminists' advocating for the virtues of sex work as a legit career path for young women.... Like any worthwhile cause, the so-called 'feminist' movement has its fair share of skeletons in the cupboard, and strategic cul-de-sacs....methinks it's time for thoughtful reflection on strategic partnerships going forward.....
That's a good point. The term itself stresses the feminine side of it (women) although it's more about overcoming patriarchy which is structurally ingrained in everyone and we all have struggles to overcome those patterns. And thanks for opposing / questioning sex work. :)
I am a man of the right so when you spout off on nonsense buzzphrases straight out of the academy like 'patriarchy', 'capitalism' and 'white supremacy' I tend to tune out, but that doesn't mean there isn't value in what you are saying.
Patriarchy, capitalism, and white supremacy may be terms adopted by “the academy” but they are also real and observable phenomena at work in the world. You can be skeptical of people who use these terms idiotically while also recognizing that they are real
Marxism is alive and well. His analysis of society is true today as it was when he wrote it all down. Read Das Kapital Vol 1 together with the Paris Manuscripts (1844). Then you can have an informed view of Marxism.
Joe cotter. Love lover. I think you are banging your heads against the wall trying to educate irate pirate who is a simpleton.... Worrying too cause irate pirate is cocky but thinking is intelligent 😵💫😵💫 Ive identfied lots of holes too in what irate pirate is saying , its pointless to try to educate because the persons psychology is evident in its disagreeable tone & troll like, a sociopath basically. By their very nature they arent going to try to understand and cannot transcend their egos 😂 sad as F loons.
Aged 6 I went to a battered wives hostel with my mum and we were rejected because some of the women opposed me and my 4 yr old brother staying there. It was such a shock being told they saw us as a danger.
The way the world is coming at me:I support feminism but it continually tries to force me to support and buy into a radicalized form of feminism that gives a nod to a trans using their bathroom while going out of their way to psychologically destroy men who just want to live as men. I'm glad the algorithm's gave me the chance to discover her and the amazing guests she has on. I'm going to reach out to this guy.
I'm a bloke. A conservative white blokey bloke. I listened to your duolloquium [sic]. I giggled at the hilairious literato burlesque. But, I'm still a bloke. I need bullet points. Apolitical bullet points. Is it enough to provide, protect, respect, challenge sexist beliefs and behaviours, avoid derogatory language, active listening and empathy, empower and encourage, respect boundaries and consent, advocate policies that encourage gender equality, listen, validate, show compassion... Need I go on. Am I missing something? Same with race, Shirley?
I am glad that progressives are acknowledging the contradictions within trans but I'm afraid talking about the patriarchy, the idea of a blanket male privilege, the assumption that 'most men don't read books', the assumption that the only way forward is 'anti-racism' ... All those things are why I won't ever call myself a feminist. I will continue to listen to Julie with interest and admiration, I will treat everyone I meet with respect and as an individual, but I'm never going to join a gang that IS full of hatred and blanket assumptions about me or the men in my life. Great video with some fascinating topics.
As a recently graduated MD who is also extremely left-wing, I have been criticising the trans movement for years and have argues with many (I live in Europe) on gender-affirming surgery. I am blown away by this interview! Please: Which three BOOKS on feminism would you two recommend I read on feminism and the key topics connected to it (feminist critique of pornography, surrogacy and prostitution)?
As a conservative I disliked much of what was said here.That said, I agree with both the discussion on trans ideology and pornography. I just wanted to say that it's refreshing to see people who back much (even most) of the "woke agenda" who still push back against other parts. It reminds one that there are still some who honestly believe in their causes but aren't so inculcated in it that they blindly promote every aspect of wokism.
@@Operasinger0 Yes, I have my conservative side, and do not believe that supporting feminism will necessarily benefit men (much depends on the variety of feminist). I am quite eclectic in my views though, pray we never have a revolution because whichever side wins will likely have me shot. I did very much like when he indicated the contradiction of insisting that to be transgendered is completely normal, yet it requires highly invasive medical procedures.
"woke" or "woke agenda"? Because there is a difference. "Woke" is a presumptuous term that took over for "politically correct" back in the day and meant that you were on the "right" (as in correct) side of politics. Today it's used largely to refer to Progressive social justice stuff. The "woke agenda" is a small but powerful subset of progressives who push things to the extreme and use their clout and resources to manifest them physically.
better to be on the “woke” side than the pro-eugenics side. y’all are really in line with SS politics more and more not trying to be rude. it’s just the truth
...What? What are you talking about? Wokeism pushes eugenics more than any right wing extremist I've come across.The worst we contend with is the neo-Nazis and their ridiculous sense of "racial purity". Most of us reject them. Meanwhile the Woke are trying to bring about a new apartheid because "white man bad" and establish the hierarchy of victimhood they call "diversity and equity". Not to mention public discourse is routinely shut down any time it moves too far to the right.
“We don’t hate men. We are hopeful. We just think if they’re raised differently, they could be acceptable.” Who comes up with that way of raising boys, and how is it enforced?
Julie, thank you for introducing me to the work of Robert Jensen, which I was previously unaware of. (Another reading-list ahead of me...) I have enormous difficulty convincing young (or even middle-aged) people today that there was a time when _Men Against Pornography_ groups, not coming from a right-wing religious perspective, but informed by feminist analysis, actually existed, and find it virtually impossible to persuade them that there was ever a time when the gay male world (or at least the gay movement) was less heavily “pornographized” than it is at present. I used to be an enthusiastic (and rather envious) admirer of John Stoltenberg, and still think he did some good work in this area in the past, though he seems to have somewhat “lost the plot” these days, not just with his endorsement of trans rights activism, but also with his apparent claims to “channel the thoughts” of the late Andrea Dworkin from beyond the grave. I would be interested to know whether you have, either on video or in print, addressed Stoltenberg's claims and/or Dworkin's legacy more generally, and if not, would keenly encourage you to do so. Being six years older than you, and a student at York University in the 1970s, I must be one of a rather select group of people (and surely a vanishingly small number of gay men) to have been strongly influenced by the _Leeds Revolutionary Feminist Group_ earlier than yourself. I am greatly encouraged by the fact the Sheila Jeffreys, yourself and a few others continue to “fight the good fight”, and even if, in a way, it “shouldn't matter”, knowledge of the existence of male allies like Bob Jensen gives me heart too.
RADIOHEAD song , is perfect for the FEMINIST movement : “You do it to yourself, you do And that's what really hurts Is that you do it to yourself, just you You and no one else You do it to yourself…”
I appreciate hearing from both of you. The trans movement has caused many to realize that many who would not normally think of themselves as allies, absolutely are in this area. Liberals and conservatives. Julie, I’ve seen you with Douglas Murray. The trans movement threatens women, no matter our politics. I’ve noticed the working together is happening more. A couple years ago, it was so depressing mit seemed like we were losing so much. In the last couple of years, there has been a lot more working together and we’ve accomplished a lot more. I know we have many differences, but we’re on the same page on the trans thing. Thank you for your message.
In my language sex and gender are same word, and language is gendered, it makes it so much easier to not to let this bulshit in) just because there can't be linguistic and mental gymnastics made to differentiate woman and female
Only a small minority of human languages are gendered. If your language is Slavic (as I infer from your name) then the words for grammatical gender -- taking Russian as an example _род_ - and biological sex - _пол_ - are *not* the same.
"Men's angry reactions when you don't treat them the way they think they should be treated"
is just what "trans women" are displaying when women (especially) don't treat them as women.
They still have that male mentality.
Yeah, they act like the men they are the minute they don't get their way. Congratulations , it's a boy!
I don't agree past a point. I'm not a man pretending to be a woman and then insisting I be treated as such. But if an angry feminist "treats" me in a prejudicial or antagonistic or simply hostile way, I don't have to accommodate her projections.
Agreed: biological males don't belong in women's only spaces.
Hits the nail on the head.
The man posturing and screaming, “IT’S MA’AM!” is quintessential example of the very masculine rage that supposed trans-women display when they are challenged.
Nothing says what a misogynistic movement it is more than the threats of violence against women but not men.
I thought the same. It is probably men thinking they are owed sex again.
How else are women going to be put back into their rightful place?
@@zadkiel242I think that is the idea; and to make gayness taboo, once again. Isn't it funny how right-wing the achievements have been, anti-woman and anti-gay, for a movement that purports to be leftist?
@@janelliot5643 Someone has to set things straight right?
Thank you!! I often point out this weird focus on 'defining the word woman' but never pushing these 'non binary college girls' to please 'define the word man'. The disgust and discomfort they all have in being what they are, in being women is so strong that they don't want to BE women. Just think about that for a minute. What on earth is going on? These psychologically troubled, vulnerable kids...this really is the medical scandal of the century. And of course, the greatest scandal in academic institutions I've ever seen. Combined with the normalisation of critical race theory it's just monstrous.
One doesn't have to be a feminist to go against pornography.
Agree but I see feminism everywhere these days. I didn’t think identity politics was a right wing play.
@@lostincredulity5369 Feminism is bullshit.
Or against rape and violence.
@@SereneBobcat sadly most rape allegations are false.
@@lostincredulity5369 no they're not. You have nothing to back that up, it's just a glib, misogynist comment. It is true that most rapes are not reported and that when they are a miniscule amount get to court and very few result in convictions. In the UK it has been irrefutably demonstrated that the number of false reports of rape is in keeping with the number of false reports of other crimes. Around 2%.
The refusal to discuss the trans issue is a strategy. Like the way they kicked Bob out of the bookstore. They brag about that. The misogyny behind the trans movement is off the chart.
Bullshit.
Gender critical feminists are the ones that block anyone who disagrees with them
'Trans' is misogynist and homophobic to its core. LGBw/oTheTQ
Yeah the only people discussing this issue is everyone on the internet. So much refusal.
@@SuperKripkeyet none of the mainstream tv news channels and such will they just gaslight. Nice try tho. Of course the public is discussing it , while the establishment pretends it doesn't exist. Classic leftism. "It's not happening" and "it's a good thing it's happening "
What intellectual lightweights the students of today seem to be. I remember really great debates with people with opposing views throughout Uni. It expanded my world view, helped me understand my own position and often changed or broadened that position. In our generations, we did not know where we stood on an issue until we could successfully debate it and either win or make substantive points that well refuted an opposing view. Now days, students have opinions based on what someone told them, do not research it, claim it is backed by science (which they never show), then shout down anyone who they even suspect would disagree. It's not about the truth or the best way forward for everyone, but what serves oneself best and often at the expense of others.
When words end, wars begin. The left can't and won't communicate! Their talking "points" aren't cohesive and make less and less sense the more I try to make any sense of it. I miss the debates of yesteryear and you DIDN'T always get to debate the side you agreed with 😂
This is because many uni professors are in fact Neo Marxist activists rather than researchers.
This speaker is a perfect example.
A very good summary of "higher education" then and now.
The problem is guys like this speaker Jensen. A prime example of the Dunning Kruger effect. He writes articles on economics, on biology, psychology - when his only qualifications are in journalism. All his is in reality is a Neo Marxist activist. Can you imagine this guy giving both sides of the story to his classes?
you have nailed it
Julie Bindel is the OG of gender critical feminism. She took to much backlash from the queer activism faction, and here she is 20 years later being proved right.
Julie is a man hater. That's the reason she has been black balled from society. I agree with her on some issues, such as "Transgenderism". However, she implied in this video, that ALL MEN ARE BAD, but we "are not born this way". That is the most disgusting, man-hating mentality of any feminist I've ever known.
She's a treasure.
She's also not "gender critical" as far as I know, she's simply a radical feminist. So-called gender-critical folks are usually randomers from across the political spectrum who don't care about abolishing gender but just want things to go back to good old blue for boys and pink for girls, more or less
That word queer is horrendous too. Im a gay woman queer and the alphabet ruined the gay movement.
I wish they would just abandon the term feminism altogether. It's synonymous with misandry these days, and I doubt Julie holds that viewpoint.
It’s all about feelings and not facts. You can’t have a rational discussion with an irrational person.
I'm old enough to remember when protesting porn was a normal part of feminism.
Who are you to police people looking at porn, Ms Puritan?
@@morganm4768 Who said I wanted to police it? I just think everything about it is horrible and soul-destroying, but by all means, you keep at it, hunched over your screen like a little gremlin.
Easy. Back then, women couldn't go on OnlyFans and make 'easy' money 'directly'.
@@morganm4768 Porn is woman abuse. Personally, I would police it.
You must be pretty old then.
This is utterly bananas. And if you ever talk about this to the left they’ll gaslight you and say no one ever gets cancelled?
Other people watching porn is none of your business.
@@morganm4768until it affects your family.
@@morganm4768 No man is an island unto himself.
@@morganm4768 It is when it ruins men having decent relationships towards women, and effects all of society.
That whole “Cancellation doesn’t exist” gaslighting thing the left is now doing is so ironic, because what they’re actually saying is “If you have enough money you can be cancelled and survive.” It doesn’t take into consideration all of the people who aren’t wealthy whose lives have been completely destroyed because of false, very casually thrown out, accusations of being phobic or racist etc. What about the two working class people whose lives got ruined when a student at Smith decided to claim that they asked her why she was in a locked room that was for a kids summer camp? She didn’t even know which of them asked this, but named them on Twitter and called them racist, and so they got fired and their income gone.
Civilized people discussing current topics is a rare treat. Excellent video.
A man can become a woman but a white person can't be a black person.
I'm 50 and want to identify as a senior citizen...I feel like one. Can I be a senior citizen and get my old age pension?
I have too......duuuuuh.......everyone has had bad experiences with agressive abusive men.........BUT I LEARNT THAT IT WAS THE TYPE OF MEN I WAS CHOOSING to be with that was the problem.
Yes bad people exist and theres little wishing it werent so can change that.
Not ALL mem( or women) are bad so we NEED to learn THAT AND learn HOW TO DISTINGUISH between bad and good people.
THAT ....IS....LIFE!!!
@@mindyourownfuukingbiz6737 True.
The fem movement ruined things for many women too.
They got all uptight about the bathing suit part in Miss America. Stupid.
A man cannot become a woman. Maybe he can become a male without a todger.
Ironically race can be fuid unlike sex
In mixed race
A man can become a woman legally, but a man cannot become a woman.
9:42 well said: "We're trans and we're normal! Now hand over the puberty blockers..."
So he is saying what I also believe - trans ideology is not "left" wing at all. Much of trans doctrine (anti homosexuality, girls wear pink, boys wear blue etc) is actually very right wing. The trans definition of gender is so utterly old fashioned and sexist that I cannot understand why more people don't realise that it is conservative.
No it's not right wing. Sorry, you can tell yourself that, but it's almost entirely propped up by the left.
You can think what is ideally should be, but without the left today, this trans cult stuff would have died long ago.
Unfortunately the left has done a 180 on what they used to believe (as a party platform).
But trans expression certainly isn't, which you can see by who attacks and supports it, who uses it as a club to beat the other side with.
To only think in a binary of left or right wing in a goal to define whatever you oppose as the opposite wing is stupid. We cannot treat everything as a sport with teams winning and losing
Excellent. I've been looking for a podcast like this for a while without really knowing what to search for - thrilled to find it and delve in. Thanks a million, Julie Bindel et al!
The problem is that there are biological differences between men and women and to pretend they can be educated away completely is dangerous.
I think this applies to all activists, none of them have the best interests of the majority at heart. As the great Thomas Sowell asserts: Activism is a way for useless people to feel important, even if the consequences of their activism are counterproductive for those they claim to be helping and damaging to the fabric of society as a whole.
It definitely doesn’t apply to all activists, but I’d agree with the proposition that it’s most. Especially Marxian activists, which pretty much all feminist activists are. It’s all about liberating their respective oppressed identity category, and often, as you said, to the detriment of society-whether said identity category is actually oppressed or not. It always deteriorates to the goal of equal outcomes, which requires the demolishing and subversion of the very societal hierarchies and structures that allow society to function, as well as the active oppression of whoever is perceived as the oppressing identity category. Marxism needs to be viewed in a similar light to Nazism-it’s certainly killed more people, and will again if it’s not stopped.
Nah, that's a populist exaggeration and generalization as well. Doesn't help at all.
Unfortunately, the people who kept participating in the lie and believed themselves to be kind are the ones who paved the way for the onslaught on the rights, boundaries, and 'identities' of others. A reminder that participating in lies only ever feeds lies.
The problem with identity politics or the oppression Olympics is that in a race to the bottom a lot of people's feelings get hurt.
I am of the opinion that NO ONE can be offended. 'Being offended' is giving POWER to someone you disagree with, who didn't ask for this power, and doesn't deserve it! Don't give it to them. Don't be offended.
Ms Bindel is the charming seductive face of feminism, and because of her charm and intelligence, a great interviewer. I love this series, and applaud The Spectator for affording her this platform 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Great sarcasm there
@@spurge83it wasn’t sarcasm, you sound like a mean person
some of us don’t want anything to do with men but it’s not about seeking protection from other men. it’s just living life with as little interaction with men as possible. men should be helping each other to be better. women shouldn’t have to deal with that emotional labor
Unfortunately women need men to protect them from other men
Wonderful conversation, thank you both!
There is a major mating crisis and a growing demographic shadow. Its time to support cooperation and long term strategies because without well brought up children there is no future.
only in small affluent pockets of the planet - the majority of poor nations are firing out babies like fury.
Leftists generally don’t breed, I guess we can be thankful they aren’t passing on their genes at least.
Personally I think thats the end game. Its what they want. What ever happened to all the people crying about overpopulation for 20 years? They started supporting trans ideology instead. Bill Gates is a good example.
Loved this! Thanks Julie and thanks Bob ❤
What comes across quite strongly in the stories of being deplatformed without explanation or discussion is where are the grown-ups? It is all so intellectually lightweight and childish.
The grown-ups are too distracted with trying to look and feel like a 20 year old 😂
I'm a 70yo man who thinks porn is utterly pointless. It's like looking at an ad for a plate of spaghetti: it looks attractive but I can never eat it.
Seriously man. 100%.
There are 3 billion men who can prive you wrong. Porn has more net traffic traffic thank all other sites put together. You are wrong snd your opinions don't matter.
Way to miss the point. It's like saying sweatshops are pointless because people there don't produce quality clothes. Sweatshops are bad not because they don't produce the desired effect, it's because they are synonymous with human rights abuses. Same with porn. You're 70 and still think with your dick.
Except imagine the ad for spaghetti was addictive and contributed to s3x trafficking
“That’s not how this works, that’s not how any of this works!”
Bob touched on the real issue, by advocating nurturing, or being a good role model for boys.
The real issue is parenting of all children and especially of infants. It is a mess. We see the results all the time, everywhere-good and bad.
Anything else is shutting the barn doors after the horses have bolted.
Or herding cats, to be less defeatist.
Great interview!
Julie is a heroine of mine. Thank you Julie for your Northern strong woman, thoughtful but no nonsense approach to life and for all the important work you do.
She's an idiot
Yeah, insulting men in the opening seconds is sure gonna build allies..
Yet the whole series about honoring male allies. LOL Plus I just watched the first three minutes an there was no insult. So what are you talking about?@@aclark903
Thank you for this discussion.
I find the trans movement's arguments and actions to be exasperatingly illogical. There is a glaring distortion of language e.g. a dismissal (maybe it is because of ignorance) of the use of metaphor and simile. The metaphor saying "transwomen" are women - plainly false - is not even acknowledged as a metaphor, let alone an invalid one. The simile "transwomen are (superficially) like women" is plainly true (and yes more nuanced that those few words indicate) and utterly ignored. Transwoman is not a synonym for woman. Transman is not a synonym for man. I think those two examples are illustrative of the intellectual incoherence of trans ideology. A further incoherence, this time in law, is the concept of 'doli incapax' or the principle that children (and yes the legislated ages vary) are incapable of criminal responsibility because their reasoning, and understanding of the consequences of their wants and actions, are not yet fully developed. Notwithstanding that, under the rubric of 'gender affirmation' such momentous processes as taking puberty blockers and undergoing transsexual surgery are taken to be fully informed. One of the most idiotic trans assertions is that someone has been 'born in the wrong body'. We have restrictions for chidren regarding: tobacco, drugs alcohol etc but (mostly) not for transitioning. In 'transworld' contradictions abound.
we are listening to your talks! Keep going!
Bindel as brilliant as ever!
Absolutely ❤
Radical feminists are nuts.
It's wonderful hearing from such thoughtful, really well-spoken gender critics whom I'd never heard of before like Bob Jensen. Very heartening knowing he's fighting the good fight in Austin; he might actually inspire some to think harder and do some learning. Many thanks to him for soldiering on in the face of such mistreatment. Who knew tenure would become so necessary to defend basic ethics and common sense.
Who are you to tell people what to do with their body?
@@morganm4768 Go tell that to the thousands of women and children that are trafficked for porn. Are you REALLY that ignorant!
I actually disagree with this endearing assertion, 'You can be a real man or you can be a human being'! I think the men who inherently think as Bob Jenson espouses here, and live in the way that honours it, are absolutely, 1000% REAL MEN! A 'real' is secure and doesn't need to prove anything about themself.
Thank you for this beautiful, encouraging, educational and edifying interview, Julie Bindel and Bob Jenson.
Yes but Bob just defers to women for a fee, which is fine if you are an academic in our woke universities. Not so much if you wish to be sexually active or actually have a life purpose beyond a doormat.
Ironically one of those moronic statements that keep men from feminism.
I don’t see why Rachel Dolezal can’t call herself black when she grew up with black kids, and this is how she feels about herself. After all, it’s a culture, not a race, really. She has more of a claim to her identity than people who claim to “feel” female. What does it mean to feel female? I’ve been female my entire life, and I don’t know what it means. Am I feeling female when I got picked last for softball in high school? Am I feeling female when I had my period? Am I feeling female when I wanted to wear a cute dress and when I was attracted to a cute boy? I suspect it’s these last two things that make people who aren’t female believe they “feel female.”
African Americans have a shared ethnicity and history. If you don't have a shared ethnicity and history then you cannot tell me that you are a black person or an African American person. Besides Rachel didn't grow up with black kids. She was white as snow up until her adulthood. If you and I hung out together, you would not magically become black.
Nor can a man magically become a woman. What is wrong with you?
It starts in the family. Parents need to educate themselves so that when raising sons and daughters, humanity, kindness, understanding and etc are the values being imparted.
Yes! This is where it starts! With the family.
Either you’ve never raised kids or you’ve never read any biology.
@@hugolindum7728Nooo
Please make your knowledge more available by participating on other platforms as well. Thank you for the information.
Lovely interview! Thank you😊❤
Post op 32 years, never an activist. Stayed in my lane.
being a normal person that minds their business and lives their best life is a rarity. All the best to you and yours.
Should you want to, I hope you feel free to openly express that without fear of being attacked for internalised transphobia, etc. Because from what I've observed, that is the experience for people who take the position you do.
When I used to be supportive of trans people, it was to support people like you. I went from being an "ally" to being revoIted by anything related to the -community- cuIt. Sad.
Love you, Sister!
@@Anne_Onymousyou can still be supportive of normal, sane people, no?! I don’t understand that. Many people in the ‘community’ don’t like how a loud minority really bugger up their peaceful, respectful life. No need for that.
Thank you, my feminism is reinforced and as strong as ever after listening to this conversation.
Great conversation, could listen to you both all day!
Julie- the Labour Leader seems to have allowed his daughter to identify as his son. In a recent interview he says he has two ‘boys’ - 13 yrs and 16 yrs old. How can we trust a leader who clearly is lying and captured by gender ideology?
Politicians no longer represent mainstream beliefs or people. They are talking to the minorities who are active on social media because political parties today don't know how to govern, they are election-winning machines.
Keir Starmer has pretty much announced that he has a child pretending to be the opposite sex. This is a huge issue for the electorate but there’s no sign of it in mainstream media. Censorship is rife!
Who exactly are you to police people's language?
And you?@@morganm4768
@@morganm4768
Invent another copy & paste statement. "Who are you to..." has become trite.
Very thought provoking discussion.
My mother was a feminist and it took me decades to overcome her prejudice against men. She could not differentiate between male tyranny and male authority. She kept upholding a victim role that was not helpful, blaming men instead of her poor choices for her misfortunes. Feminism is not kind with men and children who often end up without fathers. The feminists I intensly dislike are the upper class ladies who live well because their male partners pamper them while killing themselves with work. Feminism has become a red flag for me. Maybe they can redeem themselves by helping women out now against transwomen.
Then you don't understand feminism, and nor did you fully understand your mother's view point.
@@amandag5072 I lived feminism, read feminism and left feminism. What you say reminds of those defenders of communism who suggest that the real communism was never implemented. Feminism fosters a victim mentality and a narrow and subjective world view.
@@herzl67 lol. You're just proving my point You fundamentally, and probably are willfully, misunderstanding feminism.
I had the same experience with my mom and it did damage. An inability to look at her choices snd why she chose them
@@amandag5072 feminism is pro trans which is anti woman misogyny. Im a gay woman and im for woman but im against radical feminism. They went too far as they did with queer and trans. It became toxic and they did not come out for womans sports which to me is unacceptable
Lovely chap!
Spot on.
Great talk I love the points you raise and thank you for sharing with us the responces you've recieved. I feel less alone now as I have shared similiar questions and been bullied by people of the trans movement myself. As a non bianary person I feel that these questions are fair and honest and need to be answered and discussed logically without throwing hate around... I have never experienced such hate as I experienced going to an LGBTQ meeting and being told something was wrong with me because I was ok with my body and that I should want to be trans. Why must everything be sexualized?
Because unfortunately, the lunatics have taken over the asylum so now you can expect nothing but lunacy!
I agree. They also argue that the sex organs are not how you gender someone.....whilst saying they are in the wrong body and want a sex change.
Great conversation!!
Love your lack of ego Bob Jensen. Great clarity.
You could "talk to him forever". I could listen to him for long periods of time.
#TerfsWereRight
@@littlecatfeet9064 TH-cam informed me that this hashtag had been removed from the ability to search. Nice.
@@m-alexandria-g How…TH-cam of TH-cam. Bastards.
brill ,quality discussion ..i will watch this again .thanks
It's a joy listening to you both. You're so calm and level-headed.
Paul
Man
New Zealand
Yes talking about "white supremacy" in a society that hates whites and patriarchy in a society that hates men is just *so* level headed. 🙄
Excellent discussion
Great interview!
Excellent series, more of the same! JB is a legend, and Bob joins the long list of brave people, who have done absolutely NOTHING WRONG!
No, she's an unhinged radical feminist.
SMART & INTERESTING
(THE BOTH OF YOU )
The cancel culture we have today sprang out of the political correctness of the 80's or 90's. It started with not being allowed to use words like "postman" or "busboy" and now we aren't allowed to point out facts.
Thank you so much, Bob, for the excellent critique of the trans ideology.
Nope. I'm fully human and a real man. Not a "real man". A real man. Pretty much agree with everything else.
I think you can get more men on board by showing how it is not a tug of war. At the moment, each side sees it as a zero sum game, where if one side wins, the other one looses.
If you can present it as a win-win, it will be easier to get everyone to align.
There is a big antiporn movement coming from men, but their concerns are not really about the violence against women that it presents and encourages and more about the sexual and social consequences it has for men themselves :
- the epidemic of erectile dysfunction amongst young men,
- incapacity to achieve orgasm without pornography or masturbation (a lot of men cannot achieve orgasm inside their partners because of decreased sensitivity or "death grip syndrome"),
- porn addiction ruining their relationships,
- the decreased in their drive to seduce women or to have actual sex,
- decrease in drive to do... anything at all (depression and retreat into the self),
- needing more and more violence and degradation in the porn they watch to achieve anything and ending up looking at fetishistic content, rape videos, snuff films, content relating to pedophilia,
- a lot of increase in strange paraphilias from young men due to porn wrapping their tastes from a young age (sissy hypno porn, autogenyphilia etc etc),
- the hentai guys not even being attracted to "3d women" anymore,
- decreased capacity to feel romantic love for their partner,
You can find those communities on reddit communities like r/antiporn or from initiatives like "fight the new drug"
We need each other & we are wasting time, money and energy with the man v woman battle. We should unite to improve our species.
Excuse me, I'm off to join some TRA group just to be on any other side than Bindel.
I think you are expressing exactly the false concept of feminsm (a tug of war) they both adress in the video. Men are also suffering from patriarchy and patriarchal ways of thinking which are deeply ingrained in our souls.
Thanks for covering this
I listened to your talk! I have not heard of some of the topics you speak about, but I think you have made me realize that I am a feminist, by the way that I respect my wife and treat her as my equal.
Thank you to you both, for deep and important information about women and men ( and transgender ideology ).
Thanks both of you
Great interview
Porn and weed kills souls and destroys people. I wish I lived in a place where neither existed.
Move to Saudi Arabia! Or Taliban Afghanistan. Both have banned Porn and weed. You belong there. So does Julie Bindel.
There's only one problem with that. I would very much agree with you.
But really the only thing you can do is not fall into the same trap those people fell into. Half of my life was almost ruined by drugs and alcohol, It took that to learn this lesson. And I even know people who's lives were completely altered because of it. In a VERY unfair way.
Just for those people to end up giving up and join them again, Just to repeat the cycle. It's sad and depressing. But they're ultimately making the decision of being an addict, So there's not much anyone but themselves to fix themselves and acknowledge their problems.
I've tried EVERYTHING, For half of my life to go back to the way it was. Nothing you can do effects their decision. I've tried being blunt. I've tried manipulation, I've learned many lessons.
And what I learned. Is even in a world without anything to be abused. That doesn't solve anything. You just made people hide their problems or find other ways to end their problems. Their problems aren't magically fixed, But ironically, What they're abusing isn't fixing their problems either. Just making it easier to deal with them, They're just postponing it.
Yes its true ❤ just get the word out how bad porn is on lots of levels - spiritually, prostitution, destroys relationships , loveless, damaging to womens safety, warps peoples brains, look into nofapp and its benefits for men. Porn is a definite spiritual attack its sad as F something losers use 😂
Weed is fine. Porn is cancer
@@nono-yw3tvyou're brave, and honest.
Thank you.
Thank you for creating and posting this conversation.
❤Julie Bindle ❤
😊Love your channel. No bias. Reasoning that makes sense. Take care
I would have always considered myself to be "left" wing but am being pushed to the right. I think that the definitions of right and left have changed to the point where they are not recognisable to older people, ie over 40.
@@ktwashere5637 I would just focus on economic issues and not get too bogged down in the identity stuff which is a sideshow and really doesn’t have much impact on most people’s day to day lives … I think you’ll find yourself realising you’re still left wing pretty quickly .. if you don’t then it’s not really that the left has changed in any real way but that you have … hope that helps
Julie you interrupted where Bob was going with his point a few times. It's very annoying, i wanted to hear him finish.
Trans people, just be happy that you have lives to live. I'm sure that this is what the real trans people want, as do others. Whoever you choose to be is still your choice and no one else's.
Thought- provoking interview, thanx.
You ask the important question of how to interest men in the aims of feminism?
For what its worth, and speaking as a man:
1) The term itself, 'feminism' , is problematic for many men. Unfortunately, and to the detriment of men and women, the term is widely understood as being hostile and anti man, 2) Is it not time for a radical rebranding? Is it not time to present its principles and values as 'redeeming' and enlightening and beneficial not only to men but the whole of society? 3) Finally, the shift came for me when I grasped that every woman is at some level my 'sister' and I, their 'brother'...We can disagree and become frustrated with each other, but to routinely disrespect or exploit each other, , is not normal - it is a sign of 'family' unwelness and 'maladjustment'.
While I understand your input, no, it is not time for us to water ourselves down and erase ourselves or take "fem" out to be "more inclusive" or less threatening. If calling ourselves feminist, if centering the rights, concerns and needs of women
"is problematic for many men," I dont see how men hung up on the simple NAME of our movement are ever going to help us. It is not time to "present its principles as 'redeeming'" whatever that means. If it means make it more palatable so the boys will play with us,
All aboard the OhHellNo Train to F*ThatS*Ville!
So as a matter of interest, which part of my input do you actually 'understand'?
I could provide many examples, but do you have any idea what it feels like to be the 20 year old, new father, who wants to co-parent, but is repeatedly excluded by hostile 'feminist', anti-male, social workers? 'How could the 'perpetrator' possibly care'? (eye roll). Or to be only opposing voice in room full of seething 'feminists' advocating for the virtues of sex work as a legit career path for young women....
Like any worthwhile cause, the so-called 'feminist' movement has its fair share of skeletons in the cupboard, and strategic cul-de-sacs....methinks it's time for thoughtful reflection on strategic partnerships going forward.....
That's a good point. The term itself stresses the feminine side of it (women) although it's more about overcoming patriarchy which is structurally ingrained in everyone and we all have struggles to overcome those patterns. And thanks for opposing / questioning sex work. :)
This stuff ive been trying to explain to people for years!
So MLK's vision shouldn't be upheld?
This extra focus on race is why we're further divided than before Obama (on race).
I am a man of the right so when you spout off on nonsense buzzphrases straight out of the academy like 'patriarchy', 'capitalism' and 'white supremacy' I tend to tune out, but that doesn't mean there isn't value in what you are saying.
There's nothing wrong with criticizing capitalism, bit otherwise, this woman is largely full of shit, as most feminists are.
Patriarchy, capitalism, and white supremacy may be terms adopted by “the academy” but they are also real and observable phenomena at work in the world. You can be skeptical of people who use these terms idiotically while also recognizing that they are real
@@lovelover4408 They are as real and observable as astrology, cargo cultism and marxism.
Marxism is alive and well. His analysis of society is true today as it was when he wrote it all down. Read Das Kapital Vol 1 together with the Paris Manuscripts (1844). Then you can have an informed view of Marxism.
Joe cotter. Love lover. I think you are banging your heads against the wall trying to educate irate pirate who is a simpleton.... Worrying too cause irate pirate is cocky but thinking is intelligent 😵💫😵💫
Ive identfied lots of holes too in what irate pirate is saying , its pointless to try to educate because the persons psychology is evident in its disagreeable tone & troll like, a sociopath basically. By their very nature they arent going to try to understand and cannot transcend their egos 😂 sad as F loons.
Great conversation thank you
Real men protect women.
Real women procreate men, & trans women, in fact ALL of us!
Protect women from what? Other men? Why do women need to be protected?
Aged 6 I went to a battered wives hostel with my mum and we were rejected because some of the women opposed me and my 4 yr old brother staying there. It was such a shock being told they saw us as a danger.
Thank you for mentioning the violins in this movement. YT bans my comments if I use true words.
I myself was a*s*s*a*u*l*t*e*d by a TPA in Nanaimo
Yes, I noticed this too, TH-cam and Reddit do not allow anyone to question the identity cult.
I’m sorry.
this was excellent, thank you
Julie is simply the greatest. My heroine and inspiration. Even with her prejudice against panettone
She is prejudiced against men, which should ring more alarm bells.
hero
The way the world is coming at me:I support feminism but it continually tries to force me to support and buy into a radicalized form of feminism that gives a nod to a trans using their bathroom while going out of their way to psychologically destroy men who just want to live as men. I'm glad the algorithm's gave me the chance to discover her and the amazing guests she has on. I'm going to reach out to this guy.
I'm a bloke. A conservative white blokey bloke.
I listened to your duolloquium [sic]. I giggled at the hilairious literato burlesque. But, I'm still a bloke.
I need bullet points.
Apolitical bullet points.
Is it enough to provide, protect, respect, challenge sexist beliefs and behaviours, avoid derogatory language, active listening and empathy, empower and encourage, respect boundaries and consent, advocate policies that encourage gender equality, listen, validate, show compassion...
Need I go on.
Am I missing something?
Same with race, Shirley?
I am glad that progressives are acknowledging the contradictions within trans but I'm afraid talking about the patriarchy, the idea of a blanket male privilege, the assumption that 'most men don't read books', the assumption that the only way forward is 'anti-racism' ... All those things are why I won't ever call myself a feminist. I will continue to listen to Julie with interest and admiration, I will treat everyone I meet with respect and as an individual, but I'm never going to join a gang that IS full of hatred and blanket assumptions about me or the men in my life. Great video with some fascinating topics.
I didn't agree with many points of this video, but that final statement of "you can be a man or a human but not both" is absolute garbage.
Yeah, it sure is. It could have been stated better. Real men and human beings are synonymous. Colonized men and human beings are not.
As a recently graduated MD who is also extremely left-wing, I have been criticising the trans movement for years and have argues with many (I live in Europe) on gender-affirming surgery. I am blown away by this interview! Please: Which three BOOKS on feminism would you two recommend I read on feminism and the key topics connected to it (feminist critique of pornography, surrogacy and prostitution)?
As a conservative I disliked much of what was said here.That said, I agree with both the discussion on trans ideology and pornography.
I just wanted to say that it's refreshing to see people who back much (even most) of the "woke agenda" who still push back against other parts. It reminds one that there are still some who honestly believe in their causes but aren't so inculcated in it that they blindly promote every aspect of wokism.
@@Operasinger0 Yes, I have my conservative side, and do not believe that supporting feminism will necessarily benefit men (much depends on the variety of feminist). I am quite eclectic in my views though, pray we never have a revolution because whichever side wins will likely have me shot.
I did very much like when he indicated the contradiction of insisting that to be transgendered is completely normal, yet it requires highly invasive medical procedures.
define woke.
"woke" or "woke agenda"? Because there is a difference. "Woke" is a presumptuous term that took over for "politically correct" back in the day and meant that you were on the "right" (as in correct) side of politics. Today it's used largely to refer to Progressive social justice stuff.
The "woke agenda" is a small but powerful subset of progressives who push things to the extreme and use their clout and resources to manifest them physically.
better to be on the “woke” side than the pro-eugenics side. y’all are really in line with SS politics more and more
not trying to be rude. it’s just the truth
...What? What are you talking about? Wokeism pushes eugenics more than any right wing extremist I've come across.The worst we contend with is the neo-Nazis and their ridiculous sense of "racial purity". Most of us reject them. Meanwhile the Woke are trying to bring about a new apartheid because "white man bad" and establish the hierarchy of victimhood they call "diversity and equity".
Not to mention public discourse is routinely shut down any time it moves too far to the right.
“We don’t hate men. We are hopeful. We just think if they’re raised differently, they could be acceptable.”
Who comes up with that way of raising boys, and how is it enforced?
This is the real question - who deliberately prevents this education and what do they have to gain?
Julie, thank you for introducing me to the work of Robert Jensen, which I was previously unaware of. (Another reading-list ahead of me...)
I have enormous difficulty convincing young (or even middle-aged) people today that there was a time when _Men Against Pornography_ groups, not coming from a right-wing religious perspective, but informed by feminist analysis, actually existed, and find it virtually impossible to persuade them that there was ever a time when the gay male world (or at least the gay movement) was less heavily “pornographized” than it is at present.
I used to be an enthusiastic (and rather envious) admirer of John Stoltenberg, and still think he did some good work in this area in the past, though he seems to have somewhat “lost the plot” these days, not just with his endorsement of trans rights activism, but also with his apparent claims to “channel the thoughts” of the late Andrea Dworkin from beyond the grave. I would be interested to know whether you have, either on video or in print, addressed Stoltenberg's claims and/or Dworkin's legacy more generally, and if not, would keenly encourage you to do so.
Being six years older than you, and a student at York University in the 1970s, I must be one of a rather select group of people (and surely a vanishingly small number of gay men) to have been strongly influenced by the _Leeds Revolutionary Feminist Group_ earlier than yourself. I am greatly encouraged by the fact the Sheila Jeffreys, yourself and a few others continue to “fight the good fight”, and even if, in a way, it “shouldn't matter”, knowledge of the existence of male allies like Bob Jensen gives me heart too.
Getting there but still pretty insufferable.
I was born in the wrong body, you have no idea of my suffering!!! I should have been born as Pamela Anderson!! Why, not me, God?? Why????😉😂😂
RADIOHEAD song , is perfect for the FEMINIST movement :
“You do it to yourself, you do
And that's what really hurts
Is that you do it to yourself, just you
You and no one else
You do it to yourself…”
I appreciate hearing from both of you. The trans movement has caused many to realize that many who would not normally think of themselves as allies, absolutely are in this area. Liberals and conservatives. Julie, I’ve seen you with Douglas Murray. The trans movement threatens women, no matter our politics. I’ve noticed the working together is happening more. A couple years ago, it was so depressing mit seemed like we were losing so much. In the last couple of years, there has been a lot more working together and we’ve accomplished a lot more. I know we have many differences, but we’re on the same page on the trans thing. Thank you for your message.
‘REEEEEEEEEE!’ 😂
Most of these people I have seen in the media come across as self indulgent narcissists.
Why don't you all just keep it in your own bedroom?
Why don't you just stop stealing your own time by listening to something you don't like? Stick to your own advice.
Thanks for this interesting interview, which I found helpful in my efforts to understand this issue. 😊
Thanks Julie. Another good conversation.
In my language sex and gender are same word, and language is gendered, it makes it so much easier to not to let this bulshit in) just because there can't be linguistic and mental gymnastics made to differentiate woman and female
Only a small minority of human languages are gendered. If your language is Slavic (as I infer from your name) then the words for grammatical gender -- taking Russian as an example _род_ - and biological sex - _пол_ - are *not* the same.
Great Stuff!