The NEW Bowley Rotasera Disk Detainer Lock Teardown
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ม.ค. 2022
- This is a FULL teardown of the new Bowley Rotasera High Security Disk Detainer lock 😃🔐💪 Let me know what you think in the comments! If you want to see the reassembly, head on over to my side channel 😃 • Reassembling the Bowle...
Product link: www.bowleylockcompany.com
Remember: only pick locks that are yours and that are not in use! Keep locksport legal!
Contact me at: locknoobcontact@gmail.com
Disclaimer: These lock was kindly sent to me by the Bowley Lock Company, and so under the Committee of Advertising Practice (CAP U.K.) rules, this counts as sponsored content. This is not an advert and there is no control over the content or views expressed. I make no money of sale of this item. I do not accept money to do reviews and and there is no expectation for me to review an item positively or even at all. The opinions expressed are my own. I do provide designs and consultation to multiple lock pick manufacturers, including Multipick, Sparrows Lock Picks and Wendt. As I only like to show and review items on my channel that I think have some merit, if I don’t like something, I generally don’t tend to do a review and I feed any issues back to the supplier.
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![[636] Bowley Lock Analysis and Update](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/qV8QKZNFxLw/mqdefault.jpg)
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This is a FULL teardown of the new Bowley Rotasera High Security Disk Detainer lock 😃🔐💪 Let me know what you think in the comments! Reassembly here on my side channel too! th-cam.com/video/_2AiBkr0B9U/w-d-xo.html
I’ve seen Huxley pick the original Bowley using a fairly cheap epg. It’ll be interesting to see who can reliably get through one of these. Definitely not a novice lock and very, very cool.
@@adamwest8711 all that matters is that 99.9% of pickers cannot open it. Chances are a thief will go elsewhere or try using physical attack.
Would be nice if there was a UK distributor.
@@seriousthree6071 thieves don’t really pick locks. Not on buildings anyway. Even on cars they’re more likely to use a laptop to clone keyless entry and just drive off. Shimming old locks was pretty common in the 80’s but that just needs a credit card. Isolated targets like vending machines are far more vulnerable and they tend to be pretty easily decoded. Even that’s changing now though with the advent of card payments. It’s useful for lost keys and not wanting to make a mess but that’s about it really. Last year I helped a woman whose 2 year old had used the thumb turn when she stepped outside to smoke. That was kind of cool and made me feel like a badass for the day but really it’s just a fun hobby.
@@adamwest8711 I went to school with some of the nastiest kids in England, I learned quite a bit about how to bypass car locks, although only used the knowledge with the owners permission. Left keys inside or other issue.
I then worked for NACRO, so got even more knowledge about how they handle locks. Mostly going equipped involves a known thief with a screwdriver or solid object like half a brick or bit of metal bar. Stealing a modern car is a relatively high end thing, so on average they won't bother. They will try to nick valuables in the passenger compartment or, if unlikely to be caught, in the boot.
@@seriousthree6071 I feel like we’re arguing the same point here.
A big thanks to Lock Noob for reviewing our new lock. Great job.
Thank you Bowley! You bring both enhanced security and lock sporting to the next level. Genius designs!
Bowley is IMO the royalty of both lock works innovation and high security at the moment
Bowley, what is the Pamex thing? Has your company been sold? Thanks.
Thanks to Bowley Lock Company for allowing gutting and also providing CAD images! This is the only way to proceed so that we can get better locks in long term. Many other companies just love secrecy (basically security by obscurity).
My hat's off to Bowley Lock Company Inc for not only their amazing designs, but also their full disclosure nature. Being COMPLETELY willing to provide samples for examination to some of the most gifted, skilled, and VISABLE lockpickers out there, shows that you're not only confident in your design, but committed to improving your design, if an exploit were to be found. As a full time locksmith, that willingness, along with complications in your design, make me feel strongly confident in your company's, and your hardware's, integrity.
The idler appears to be the primary problem to solve in attempting to pick this lock. It’s really a genius design.
My hat is off to the Bowley Brothers. They are seriously moving the goal posts. Seriously. I was utterly fascinated with the 543's reverse fork key design. These guys are Rock Stars. Thanks LN
I love Bowley. I plan on buying whichever of their mortise locks is the current best when we move to our own home next year. Truly nearly unpickable locks. They're experts at "disconnecting" ... at making it nearly impossible to manipulate what needs to be manipulated by moving it to where it can't be accessed. Great engineering!
I have only heard of one person managing to pick any Bowley lock and they needed a set of custom tools to do it.
@@seriousthree6071 huxleypig did it with what was basically a bent paperclip and a cheap epg. I’ll see if I can link his video.
@@seriousthree6071 here you go. Huxley gets a lot of hate from people for not showing the tools he uses to pick assas like the ‘unpickable’ protec series but he’s pretty transparent with this one.
th-cam.com/video/KS0FSzamUzc/w-d-xo.html
@@adamwest8711 Hux is a lock tool maker who has been burnt by people ripping off his designs so many times, so it's pretty understandable that he doesn't like to show them, because 1 hour later a copy is available on less reputable websites.
@@benisted1614 yeah, I totally get why he does it but that doesn’t stop the hate.
Bowley's next key will be shaped like a middle finger
That's serious confidence to freely provide full technical specs of your design
Hi Lock Noob, Thanks for showing - a very clever design, and far more practical than the original Bowley as the cylinders can be retro fitted into existing locks. Perhaps too much emphasis making it as "pickproof" as possible. Impressive for the Locksport Community - not so much in the real world. Key control and retro fitting in the real world is much more important, and this key looks very difficult to duplicate without dedicated machinery - a big plus there. Would be interesting to see if the cylinder holds up long term, as a Locksmith we constantly see gunk in locks ( the little flap may help prevent that! ) locks get oiled, graphited, matches inserted etc. etc. particularly in large Master Key Systems. It appears that the ball bearings must PUSH the side bar into the gates, when the key is pressed in further, rather than the sidebar being forced into position just by rotation. Down the track, a little bit of something in one true gate, and the side bar may not seat. The lock, with the action required on the key to turn, may become iffy. Complexity is the enemy of reliability ... but I guess only time will tell.
about sidebar must be pushed is really advantage, makes it much more pick resistnat, check out first lock cylinder with this principle i know is GM car cylinder lock from 50's, practically pickproof
Excellent video, thank you!
Hey is it possible to pick a lock like this
Bowley Locks are always amazing. I think someone there must have studied Topology in school. Or they have a 'transporter' that accidentally turns things inside-out to their advantage. Thanks for the clear and detailed tear-down. Great video.
Holy crap I'm jealous, I desperately want to play with one of those. You are incredibly lucky! I'm surprised at how reasonably priced they are as well.
😂😅👍👏👏👏🐾🐈⬛🐾🐈
This Bowley lock looks a nightmare to try and manipulate/pick, great vid on the workings of this lock as always you give the honest opinions very unbiased keep up the great work LN.
Thanks to you and Bowley for allowing us to see the internals and workings of this interesting lock.
Love that its a KIK! Thats the greatest thing for Bowley as it can bridge the gaps for many other products
Super impressive. All the parts right down to the key are clearly high precision, machined. Definitely a high quality piece of engineering.
Bowley has the best home locks I've ever owned. I started with these two brothers back when they were on KickStarter. I've used these locks for years and they are awesome! I'll be speaking with the brothers to see if I can order these new locks. If you have never purchased one of Bowley locks, I HIGHLY recommend them. I have seven of their original locks and I love them and never have to worry about someone using bumplock keys to pick my home locks :)
Excellent of you to do this for us! Mine is on its way :) (Norlin from LPU here)
What a brilliant explanation oh how it works! Hats off to Bowly on the new design!
If you live in a bad neighborhood like I do Bowley locks are the only way to go. You can go to bed at night time and don't have to worry about nobody picking or bumping your lock. I took a Bowley
padlock to a local locksmith in Chattanooga Tennessee and he said it looked like something from outerspace. He thought he could pick any lock. But he found he couldn't pick a Bowley lock.
OMG thats amazing. Cant even imagine trying to open something like that. Wow.
Oh man, this is so freakin cool!!! A year ago i wouldn't believe you if you told me I'd get hyped about a lock 🤣🤣🤣
Very nice year down and explanations. Thx to Bowley for being so open with the design. That alone exudes confidence in there product.
Love the videos mate! I'd say that your videos have gotten me into physical security, and learning more about locks and locksport as well. Thank you so much for introducing me to this lovely community and hobby, and I wish you the very best in this new year!
Thanks to Bowley and Ash for showing us this interesting lock design. Looks like some quite tight tolerances are needed -- makes me wonder about long term reliability; time will tell, BUT in any case a unique and novel approach for a High Security KnK "universal" cylinder. Well done Bowley.
Thanks 🙏
Fantastic, detailed first look inside of the newest Bowley lock system! Thanks Ash for this terrific tour of the inside workings of this really innovative lock from Bowley. What will they come up with next?
Excellent review as always. I was waiting for the innards to go pinging out in all directions as you removed the disc pack and was relieved when that didn't happen. I don't own any Bowley locks but they have my mad respect for being a company that is trying something different, innovative and creative. By all accounts they also seem to network with our community, take criticism and then use that learning to try and improve their product. They're taking on sometimes centuries-old mechanical concepts and adapting them with cutting edge precision engineering. I wish them and others with this mindset every success. If this makes generic lock manufacturers up their game then that has to be good for us all.
An excellent breakdown, and explanation of the lock. Bowley is doing some excellent work.
Beautiful, just beautiful! Great thorough review, which is always the standard with your reviews Ash, thanks! 👍👍
Thanks for the great analysis Sir Noob (is that a thing yet?).
Wow, that one is a beast, even with a complete schematic and teardown. I agree with Bowley that disc detainers are the future of medium to high security lock mechanisms, due to their relatively low tolerance machining requirements and high durability - same reason wafer locks were so great. But, how to make them pick resistant?
Well, now we know! Complicate the picking tool to the point of surgical absurdity. Great job, Bowley.
Sure, a 10mm carbide drill would get the door open, but so would a 16lb sledge hammer, or a 3' prybar.
Sir noob…. I like it
Absolutely beautiful! I would LOVE a lock like that on my door, key like that on my keychain! The key really is beautiful.
Thank you, that is quite something. Not a surprise that Bowley take inspiration from Abloy.
Thank you for this and all the information you provided. You are a true internet gem. I appreciate your time spent on this project. Cheers :)
I so waited for this video since i watched the demo video by Bowley itself. Great job explaining it. I think Bowley now can scrap their own video and use yours instead, as you did a far better job explaining it. 😉
Very cool design. I love how Bowley combined the shrouds with the newer lock tech. Wonder if they will come up with a shrouded tubular lock as well... 🤣
Very cool design! Nice demonstration/explanation too!
I like this key better than the other funky-anchor-looking key Bowley has. The key you showed wouldn't shred the inside of a trouser pocket.
Can't wait to watch your re-assembly video! :-)
Bowley locks are amazing. Thank you for the video.
thanks for the excellent introduction into this new lock model!
Wow, awesome job breaking down and explaining! Very very cool lock. Thank you👍🍻
13:53 that nervous laugh was so fitting looking at all those tiny pieces.
Changed out the locks in our house over to Bowley a few years ago and they've been great. This looks like a really nice new option!
Amazing video.... the lock is almost a piece of art... thanks for sharing...👍👏
this thing is so over-engineered
I love it
Great teardown and explanation. I get why you were apprehensive about tearing into this lock. Bowley keeps making really interesting locks
WOW I am impressed with the design. Bowley make amazing locks and this no exception. I agree the concept of a DD style lock that can be switched into different lock bodies will be very appealing.
Cheers for such a great review LN : )
Nice one Bowley?
Very cool lock, thanks for sharing with all of us!
Outstanding tear down and explanation. This lock is amazing, the only concern I have is the little amount of sidebar protrusion. I'm afraid that with not much force it may be compromised.
I had the same thought but Bowley is known for specifying outstanding quality materials. Also, you would need a tool to insert that would be capable of transferring a relatively high torque, and the pusher & idler take up essentially all the volume so you would be stuck hammering in, say, an easy-out (backout tool) for something to twist, a brute force attack for sure.
@@EngineerMikeF that's true about their quality, but I would be more comfortable with a deeper insertion of the side bar as in other high security cylinders. This is comparable to a quality safe company having its locking bolts only insert 10-20%, it will work but would you trust your valuables in it?
Also, the piece with the groove the sidebar rests in being brass doesn't help in that kind of attack.
Cool lock. Very good explanation. Very insightful. Thank you for sharing.
what a beautiful lock! Freaking love the Bowley designs!
With the discs catching and rotating in turn, this reminds me of a rotary dial combination lock, getting all the true gates to align. I better be careful because next Bowley will release a keyed rotary combination lock‼️: insert the Rotesara key, turn clockwise to 45°, turn counter-clockwise around past that 45° position into the -90° position, then counter-clockwise around past the -90° into the 180°, then clockwise around past the 180° to the 225°, continuing, for all of the 8 discs. Maybe, even, after all that: now, remove key #1 and insert key #2 to unlock.
Great lock, great video.
I do believe that a decoder tool and makeup key set could be successful.
I will offer Bowley my thoughts on the actual design of the decoder I have in mind.
Thanks for an excellent review. I’m impressed with the key design as opposed to earlier Bowley design. This should be much less susceptible to inadvertent damage.
Happy New Year.
awesome, i just recently found out about this lock, very cool to see it on your channel shortly after! :)
Great video, been waiting for this one.
Have a great day
Some clever features in that lock for sure. Nice review Ash. 👍
*I use one of these on my screen door.* Love it!
Great review and explanation! Thank you.
Looks like we're gonna need to bust out the sonic screwdriver to pick this thing
Awesome!
Very cool!!!
I want one 😅 🐾🐈⬛🐈🐾🇬🇧🍻
What a fine lock. Thank you.
Soo finally an amazing 🔒🔐. That passes scrutiny!!! Àfter installing it time to make sure the rest of your home is entirely secure. Lasers activated, pressure sensitive plates, Pitbull slightly underfed and hangry ROFL 🤣 Lock Noob is absolutely amazing! Always looking forward to his next video.
Bowley with another winner. I want one.
I wish I could get my hands on a bowley. these are so cool.
Another really innovative design from Bowley. What I like about this design is that the key seems more robust than some other Bowley designs. Of course we still get the security we expect from this manufacturer. Nice job Ash in showing us why Bowley is the leader in the field.
Very interesting and cool lock ash mate👍👊🇬🇧😎😊
Very interesting, thanks for the video. I know Bowley are getting free publicity here amongst the lock nerds who are likely to buy one, but they don't have to so I think it's great they are sharing not just the lock but also the CAD, so credit to them.
Thoughts on design:
In essence that idler is a bit like the DSS used on Abloy locks, but by going single sided on the key they can make it so there is no accessible feature for CCW disc rotation. Very clever.
Single sided will mean there is a bit more force on the discs which might increase wear a bit, hopefully it'll be up to it in the long term.
The vulnerability to dirt etc might be a bit of a problem in some situations, especially the reverse sidebar. Horses for courses though, just don't use it in a harsh environment.
Thoughts on picking:
Looks spectacularly difficult. I can see it would be easy enough to make a tool which could turn a disc, tip a bit like half an Abloy classic tip, obviously with a dog leg in it. But to do all the discs? Hard to imagine getting ten or so such tools nested in there.
Can't imagine that reverse sidebar will give much feedback, so incredibly difficult to know if you've set a disc right.
And no means of wobbling a disc for feedback, no CCW rotation.
I think it'll be a long time till someone picks one of these. I look forward to seeing what the DD ninjas come up with!
The only thing that concerns me about this kik is susceptibility to drilling and/or pulling attacks. The pick resistance is definitely extreme, but since that avenue of attack has been successfully closed, thieves are going to turn to drilling, pulling, and other brute force attacks; the lock's resistance to these attacks is going to define exactly how "high security" it really is.
amazing piece of machinery
So, you would need to rotate and press the idler (?) down to get the sidebar to lower and get feedback from the disks while picking. But I have a feeling there is something in there that prevent the disks from rotating when the idler is pressed down.
Another great lock from Bowley and a good video explaining how it works I wonder how LPL will do against it.
_Nice Video, perfect presentation of this lock .... and this lock design is very nice .... i think nothing is 100 % secure, but this lock is more secure than you need in the normal world. Only the way to use this lock, it might make this not interesting for the "normally market"_
That lock has really nice machined parts. Too bad that you can probably *decode* the lock because the spring mechanism seems to allow pushing just some of the disks deeper to make some extra space and you can feel the true gate between the spacer and the disk. The true gate is really close to the key opening even without rotating the lock even a bit.
👍
That side bar mechanism is genius. It's impossible to control the tension on this lock because tension is not provided by the key, but by the springs inside the bible.
So if you want to pick this lock, you'll have to do it without tensioning the core, and do with what I assume to be very weak tension, all the while constantly pushing the center piece. Genius!
I think I have an idea of how to pick this. But it will be time consuming for sure!
Another big win for Bowley
Jaysis! Bowley just get more evil every day. I thought the curtained double pin tumbler was bad, but that's just...cruel.😮
Seems to be their schtick - perfectly normal locks - pin tumblers, disc detainers, dimples, just like any other (more or less), but good luck getting acces to the mechanism. Well, with any tool you're not going to have to fabricate yourself.
.
Look at those frikken discs! Bowley, who hurt you?
Interesting design! This is basically a normal disk detainer lock with a curtain to make accessing the disc harder. I've been thinking about having a curtain in DD lock, too, but I had different implementation idea myself. The form factor is pretty surprising, too. They could have used ramps for the sidebar similar to Abloy designs and avoid the bible part of the lock if they wanted.
I think Abloy Protec 1 is a better design overall but this was a really good first try for a DD lock by Bowley.
👍
I installed two today in my house.
Looks like I'll have to buy a Bowley again.
Very cool
Congratulations to Bowley for their design, quality, and generosity. And thanks for the interesting tear down, Ash. 🙂👍
Some points and questions come to mind:
# I can see it being vandalised with a few drops of adhesive being squirted into it.
# Can a vandal or child insert a foreign object into the lock, causing problems?
# It looks safe, but can it be bypassed easily?
# Will a stepped lever break it open destructively? The low sidebar rise might allow that.
# How strong are those disks? (See above.)
# Can it be punched or forced out easily? (Vandal with hammer; locksmith with lever.)
# How tolerant of wear is that tiny tooth which allows the bar to drop?
# If someone has tried and failed to pick the lock, can the key still be inserted easily?
# If the key has been damaged, and it breaks inside the lock, there is a removal problem.
# Is there a Eurolock version of this lock?
# If there is a Eurolocks version, does it have anti-snap protection?
I presume that Bowley have addressed most, or all, of these points, but it doesn't hurt to ask questions.
Good questions
Vandals can glue any lock, no easy bypass I can see, don’t know about strength, possibly a pull attack could work, don’t know about age… only time will tell it’s durability, resetting disks is pretty easy and euro version in the future looks possible
@@LockNoob Good to hear. 🙂 And thanks for responding.
Bowley Lock is the swiss watchmaker of locks.
someone had made a pick for the original Bowley lock after i had made a comment on how to potentially go about it almost to spec. this one really seems a bit easier, to make a pick for but i'd imagine picking it would be a bit more finnicky looking at how it operates similar to a disc detainer lock compared to the original Bowley. i've got a design in my head already, maybe have to try to get a hold of one of these and see if i can make the pick myself. i MAY just post the design and see if someone has the prowess to build one and see if they can't pick it.
False gates in discs that very likely can't be physically manipulated. That's just nuts! :)
If I had to figure out a tool to pick this, it would be bespoke to this type of lock. It seems pretty certain that the tool can't slide back and forth to access individual discs. You'd need to make an impressioning tool, lishi style but with individual manipulation levers for each disc.
It’s a cool lock!
that is amazing lock!!! can it be picked? just wondering............great video thanks where are they made
Lock noob, what would be your updated under 50 euro starter kit?
Loved your first video for beginner set and want to here your 2022.
@Lock noob - Looks like another great lock from Bowley, however surprisingly Bowley have stayed away from Euro profile cylinders, I don't know anyone nowadays that still uses rim locks on wooden doors.
First, thank you so much Lock Noob for spending the time to show us how cool and genies this lock it is. I already bought the previous Bowley lock, and this one is as good as the other one, if not better. 🤣I guess you can't pick this one too with common tools, unless you have the tool that is similar to the key, or the actual key of the lock. Right ? Is any key, of this lock can open it ? I mean if someone has the same lock as mine, and knows my lock, they can use their key to open my lock, or every lock has a different combination ? If that's the case, than, anyone can buy the same lock, and he can use his key to open my lock. Did you understand me Mr Lock Noob ? Please reply to me. Thank you. 👍😊
Bowley: "yeah yeah do whatever... 'cept send it to the LPL"
Only joking 😂 Bowley are on the level!
I remember a tear down on the first Bowley and it was either Bosnian Bill, or LPL. They were both blow away by the design and all the innovations in the lock. Saw a few video's that were faked of people using a paper clip and an electro pick gun but yeah nobody has opened them or designed a proper tool as of yet. It's refreshing to see a company thinking far outside of the box, and adding true security to a lock, not security though obscurity.
Thanks for the highly informative tear down, and sharing your opinions, fantastic vid!
The original bowley lock was picked using separate picks for each pin or two... they all had to be inserted at once like a key. If I can find the video, I will leave a link or at least leave key words like the person who did it in a reply to this comment.
It was Chris Ahrens who I saw pick it. It was in his video bowley picking and gut 133. I believe it to be the first real pick of the original bowley lock.
picky mcpick did
@@Phred_Phlintstoner I have an original Bowley. The method you speak of only works if you have already had access to the interior of the individual lock. Not even close to a 'real world' test.
@@OldBenOne well yes and no. Chris did have access but he made the picks so that the little bit that it was able to move in and out could raise the pin from one extreme of the bitting to the other. If made well, there is no reason that similar tools couldn't work for a blind pick. They would have to be a little thinner than Chris's were, so you could cover all 5 pins instead of just 3, so it probably couldn't have been done blind using those exact picks, but he is on to something that could work. But yes you are right, Chris's pick of his bowley lock wasn't a blind pick. And I agree with you, as is, it isn't gonna work in the field. But with some work, I really believe it could.
If you were building a new house from the ground up would you go with the "traditional" Bowley or the Rotasera? How do they compare in overall security and ease of use?
This lock is like a puzzle.
Yeah!
Impressive design! Has LPL picked it yet? Since this was 8 months ago. LOL
I'm guessing, even he hasn't picked this?
Or has he?
I'm wondering this as well
I like that its a kik, eliminates popping the disks out like some abloys. Those disks look really thin though... What about ye old flat head screwdriver to force the core to turn (like the kwikset exploit). High security locks are kinda useless if they can be forced open with little to no visible damage, and the lock still SEEMS to work normally.
Or would the idler just spin round in that case?
Is there any drill resistance?
So the lock will not work if installed upside down or if there is any gunk preventing the sidebar from being dropped through the action of gravity.
They are sold out minutes after noon lol
I bought the previous Bowley lock with the fork key, and this is another genius lock from Bowley. Good on you Bowley. I'm wondering what they going to come up with in the next lock. I guess the sky is the limit they say. I have a tip for everyone who wants to make their Bowley lock anonymous, so no one can tell what type of lock you have on your door. I just wiped off the brand name Bowley with a grinder from the keys and from the lock, so nobody will find out out what type of lock I'm using. Do you think that's a good idea guys. let me know what do u think.
Thank you.
Bowley lock appears to be THE MOST resistant lock system to lock picking anywhere on earth.
Are you the British brother of The Lock Picking Lawyer? I need to know.... Please
How about physical attacks? No point in being pickproof if everthing is soft enough to be easily drilled out. Any hardened parts in there?
I could imagine an additional security feature would be to install a BLE (Bluetooth low energy) to add a electronic key feature.
Go Alberta! Looks that anyone can move the idler (5:00) making it impossible to insert the key. Is that right?
you could move the idler out of the keyhole yes. But it can be returned just as easily with a paperclip so it doesn't brick the lock or anything.
If anyone did that (which would be unlikely, in the same way anyone could squeeze glue into any lock, but tend not to), a paperclip could easily rotate it back around
I have a question about this before I run out and get one. If I am a would-be thief. How easy is it for me to break your lock?