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@@trevoncowen9198 It was becoming apparent that their older designs were going to have trouble meeting tighter emissions standards, and they also tended to be harder on fuel than the competing 4-stroke engines. It turned out to be a good decision for them in the long run, and their 4-stroke Series 60 became a legend in its own right in the OTR world.
Despite oil leaks and maybe higher fuel consumption the Detroit Diesel 71 series was simple to maintain and would run with more wrong with it than any other engine I know of . It was easier to jury rig to get home in a pinch...less likely to leave you stranded. It's BIG cousin the EMD ,IMHO, the best designed engine for simplicity and maintenance of big engines ever. Blow a hole in a piston? Stick big screw driver under injector rocker, tie down to blow down valve to shut off fuel to that cylinder and run it home. 2 min jury rig. Most of the unit injectors have to all break down all at one time to stop engines and no glow plugs on GM 2 stroke engines pre electronics. My love for these engines is as a mechanic, tugboat engineer and captain for 35 years. New electronic engines are complicated, expensive, and will leave you stranded or run over by your own barge... DANGEROUS to your health. What good is fuel economy and green technology if YOU end up injured or dead because of it. Farmers are losing millions of dollars worth of crops because a sensor shuts down their tractors or combines and they can not diagnose or easily fix the problems without expensive tech reps arriving hours too late. I am an analog guy living in a digital world remembering how easy it was to keep your machines running. I prefer reliable and easy to fix over power and fuel economy.
Everyone made fun of the leaking 2 cycles. Until the first V6 Fuel Squeezer became popular. Drivers and owners loved them. Mechanics just prayed the started never died. They put those engine in short nose trucks and the starter was basically in the frame rail. I changed two in my life. Not fun.
I've been running marine Detroits for over 60 years. Mostly 71 series. 53's in Vietnam. Until 1980's, most ships had Detroit generators. The 2 cycle, mechanically injected diesel is the most reliable engine on the ocean. No injector pump, no electronics, no computer, and no f'ing sensors. They don't burn as clean, and the mileage isn't as good as newer electronic engines, but they keep running, an important attribute on the ocean. You don't need thousands of dollars worth of test equipment to keep them running or a room full of electronic spares to get home. On the ocean you don't just pull over when your engine fails. There's lots of horror stories about electronically controlled marine diesels. I also ran Winton and Cleveland diesels. I have a Ford powerstroke pu. You change sensors like fuses. If I was a young man, I'd put in a Detroit.
@@asphalt_matt A few years ago a fisherman friend was 100+ miles at sea. A circuit board partially failed and his main engine wouldn't run faster than idle. It took a day to come in and he still had to be towed into port because he couldn't overcome the tide. Plus he lost fishing days. Now he carries $2Gs in electronic spares. In Vietnam I was running a Mike boat with twin 671s. An anti tank round came thru the side, and all the way thru one block. It still ran, poorly. Nobody had time to see what was wrong, so I ran it for another 1/2 hour, dodging while it was spitting oil and coolant. It would only turn about 1000 rpm. But it turned. I'm retired and live on a former USCG 83' patrol boat with twin 671s. I rebuilt them 12 years ago for their first time. They were made in 1947. I suppose they'll be running past 100 years old for some new owner long after I'm dead.
The only special tools for aDetroit I ever used was those little things you set the injector with. And nothing makes as much noise as a runaway Detroit. 😂
As a 29 year employee of Detroit Diesel and now a lead trainer in the machining division, we may add this to our yearly training program as a history lesson for new employees. Great Job!
I was a transit bus mechanic for 38 years, built and worked on many DD’s 453s, 671s, 6V71s, 8V71s and 6V92s. The later versions also being turbocharged. Interesting to note the series number on these early DDs represented the number of cubic inches per cylinder. And if the idler gear was moved from one side of the gear train to the other side (a provision for this was designed into the block) and a different rotation starter was installed, the crankshaft would run clockwise or counterclockwise depending on the application. Sure liked working on them. Later years the four stroke series 50 ( a 4 cylinder version of the series 60, DD couldn’t call it a series 40 because that name was used by international) became a popular transit bus engine. Built a lot of Allison transmissions also.
The reversible rotation was good in use in boats. I took a “river queen” tourist boat ride in Ft. Lauderdale. It had the unmistakable scream of twin 71 series.
Great Job! As a third generation Detroit Diesel employee who gives plant tours, you did a great job with this video. My Grandfather hired in here in 1956 and my family has been here ever since.
Thoroughly enjoyed my two assembly line tours I had back in 98-99 when the 2 strokes were all condensed into one line in late 99. Got to see a 20v-149 block being put together with the big alignment bar. Shed a few tears as that was late August 99 and the 2 stroke line was to be shut down around 2000. Glad I got to see all that history before it was gone.
Good video. The two stroke families and their many variants established DD as a leading engine producer. A few points I would give greater emphasis: DD's position as the go to source for both urban bus and highway coach applications was its stronghold for decades. When GM chose to exi Bus and Coach production, that in-family connection to a key customer was lost. Two cycle engines are inherently smooth having twice as many power pulses per rev as four cycle engines. BUT... Two cycles have terrible emissions characteristics, which brought about the end for that engine class for on highway vehicles. Penske wasn't just a business partner and co-owner. He was a saviour. DD was a disorganized mess and hemorrhaging cash after the decline of the two cycle cash cow products. He got the opperations back on track, and had the right connections to broker DD's new identity as an integral part of Daimler and its North American truck brand, Freightliner.
All the Series 71 Engines have a blower, but it doesn't really supercharge them as it is basically 1 psi above atmospheric pressure. Even the turbo versions retained the blower as it was essential for bringing in fresh air before the turbo spooled up. Non turbo 71 series are still considered naturally aspirated...I have one of these in a 1966 GM Coach
Very true. If you want to produce a good amount of boost with the blower alone you have to change the cam or at least its timing to get the exhaust valves shut before the piston covers the inlet ports so some air can pressurize in the cylinder before the piston travels up. There are a few Whipple charged 2 stokes out there making good boost and some pretty wicked sounds!
@@geoffmooregm you'd have to change the gear that does the blower you overdrive it, which is apparently a custom machine job...or at a second border with belt drive. It's been done...but adding a turbo is so much easier
@@rodfrost5051 it is a scavenger, but the Detroit Diesel service manual calls it a blower, because it was originally develops to blow air into industrial furnaces.
As a young mechanic, I worked on many Detroits from 3-53 to the 8V-92, and most everything between. There were many other diesels that I worked on like Cummins, Cats, and Buda, but Detroit was by far the most common of the time. I still have some of my Detroit tools that I haven't used in thirty years. Just can't bear to get rid of them.
Also the two strokes were a very complex design for their time. You could have the same block and have it run in either rotation. The inline’s could have the blower, exhaust on either side. The heads could be flipped end for end. Basically it could fit just about any application an engineer could come up with. Overall a very cool idea
Yeah I have a 72 Detroit 3-53 and it’s made so you can put everyone on either side so that it can fit for your truck and I just rebuilt that engine recently cause I’m restoring a 84 f150 lifted so that I can have a cool car but there really easy to work on and there gear driven so like
@@randomgamer6255 YES on my (353) on my 78 Backhoe. When I look at my Engine set up. So many ways it could be mounted. My Humble opinion is that's why the Military Loved it. Plus they could part out a damaged one. Put good parts back in another engine fast. Such universal mounting.
As I have pointed out in some of your other videos, I am a fleet mechanic for a public utility in California. While now have nothing but Fords and Navistar in the fleet, we did have “old yellow” that was the last of the trucks we had that was painted yellow before the company started painting them white. Old Yellow had an 8V92 Jimmy, and somehow stayed in the fleet long after the other yellow trucks had been retired. It is also the first and only engine that ever ran away on me. It was a sight to behold. Although it didn’t grenade, it came close. It was the first time I had adjusted the rack on it; needless to say, I did it wrong. As it started running away on me, I did everything I could to smother it before stuffing work uniforms into the intake which finally choked it. The engine survived and continued running like a clock after I correctly adjusted the rack a second time. The company finally retired old Yellow in 2001. I still miss that old Jimmy
Had a 76 Crown Coach School bus that ran away once. The driver pushed the button to close the intake ( manually reset on motor 6-71 T ) so the motor was flooded with fuel. As the motor earmed the fuel vaporized and the motor ran away somewhat. The cooling fan sounded like a helicopter taking off and the motor screamed until I ran out of the shop to the parking aera and hit the dampner door. Shut down quickly. Let it cool and restarted it. No damages and continued to run like a clock. Real fine motor.......
Despite being the most famous, as you mentioned Detroit was the last of GM's three diesel divisions, coming after Winton/Cleveland and Electro-Motive. I'm a railroader so I'm most familiar with the three series of EMD engines, the 567, 645 and 710. The 567 is exactly twice the bore and twice the stroke of a 71, and was designed at the same time by the same GM engineering team. The main differences from Detroits are that EMDs have fabricated (welded) blocks, and individual cylinders (power assemblies) can be removed and replaced fairly easily. Also, turbocharged EMDs do not have roots blowers, instead the turbo has a clutch and receives an assist from the engine geartrain when idling or at lower speeds. The clutch disengages once there is enough exhaust pressure for the turbo to start freewheeling. EMD has used this turbo design since the late 1950s, and it might be the earliest example of what we now call twincharging. EMDs are all 45 degree V engines, with power outputs ranging from the 600 HP roots-blown 6-567 all the way up to the 5500 HP turbocharged 20-710. The 567 is a legend in the railroad world, as it more than anything else is what killed the steam locomotive in North America. EMD is now owned by Caterpillar and the 710 engine is still in new production today. It gained electronic injection and controls in the mid-1990s (the computer in our locomotives is called the EMDEC, their version of DDEC), and can be found in locomotives, ships and generators all over the world. Dual-fuel natural gas versions are available and it even meets the EPA's Tier-IV emissions standards with exhaust aftertreatment, though the railroads are avoiding these systems like the plague and as a result very few new EMD locomotives have been built for North American use since Tier-IV came into effect (rebuilds are grandfathered in, and there are thousands of older EMDs still running in daily service in North America alone).
EMD is now phasing out the 710 two-stroke in favor of the new 1010 four-stroke (a rework of the so-called H-engine developed for the failed SD80MAC and SD90MAC) and introducing it for the SD70ACe and other SD70 variants .
I recall training films on the two-stroke design that referred to “Gray Marine “ design….at the time I was a student in the Marine Corps tracked vehicle mechanics course…the films were B/W and produced by the US Navy…..
My father worked on Detroits for thirty eight years. I have had the privilege of working on them for forty eight years now. The red and yellow arrows circling logo represents Detroit diesel and Allison transmission merging into one corporation. Great video ! 👍🏻
when i was in the army as a mechanic i worked on so many 8v92 engines i couldnt even count. they are badass engines and generally were very reliable. made a shit ton of power at 1200 rpm im pretty sure the torque at that rpm was 1400 lb-ft
Love the Detroit diesel worked on them in the coast guard. They are the engines in the USCG's 47 Motor Life Boats. The ones that go out into surf and can flip over, reright themselves and keep going. Great video cant wait till the next one
I like the foresight of the designers to allow for the inline engines to be assembled either way and rotation making exhaust positioning in tight spots like boats easier. Love the screaming GMs.❤
Very informative. Ive always loved 2 stroke diesels, cuz thru the 70s, my dad drove a huge off-road KW log truck, with a 12v-71! I loved the sound and still do.
Fun fact the 671 can be configured to rotate clockwise or counter clockwise. The cam can be put in eather side of the block with the balance shaft on the other. The crankshaft can go in the block with the damper and fly wheel on either end. The blower only goes on one side but the block can be turned around to fit your needs. The head can go on either direction. The exhaust manifold can be on the same side as the blower or on the other side. Early models had 2 valves per cylinder later models had 4 all valves are exhaust no intake valves air enters the cylinders through ports in lower part at the bottom of the piston stroke. The designation 71 stands for the cubic inches per cylinder as does the series 53 , 110 and others.
I started in Detroit Diesel's as an 18 yr old kid in Texas in 1976. Built hundreds of them. Nice video, thanks. The 92 series tried to be fuel efficient with their Fuel Squeezer series in the early 80's. We had to take a 425 hp 8V92TA and derate it on the dyno to 280 hp by adjusting bellville washers in the governor. This was done during the in service inspection before delivery
There has been a huge resurgence in popularity for the DD 60 series engines. My buddy just got his CDL, and he says a lotta guys are scrapping their new emissions trucks for restore8d classics with Pre emissions engines. Some of the most common truck engines out there are DD 60 series, DD15, Big Cam8 Cummins engines and Cat 3408. I even hear the occasional 2 stroke. They're not very common, but there are a few out there.
I became a fan of Detroit Diesel at my first job, working in a pleasure boat marina. I particularly liked the sound made by twin 871s as they went past in Chris Craft Constellations.
I started as a Detroit Diesel engine technician at a Freightliner dealership fresh out of vo-tech in 1992. Back then most of the engines we worked on were the series 71, series 92 (started seeing less and less 2 strokes around this time) The series 60 which was king at the time (due to their fully electronic engines and reliability) The series 60 was hands down my favorite to overhaul. It was a very mechanic friendly engine and I enjoyed working on them. Now thanks to the good old EPA most of what we see are DD13’s, 15’s and 16’s with a few ISX and X-15 Cummins. Once you work on the DD series enough day after day, they’re a pretty good engine to overhaul if it’s in a bigger chassis.the biggest problems we see outta the DD’s are failed injectors (sometimes all 6 at the same time), missfires due to not keeping up on valve adjustments, electrical issues, broken rollers and piston and liner failures
loved the picture of the old trailways gold eagle...rode on a lot of those old busses with my pop, he was a continental trailways driver for 22 years.....
I'm in Neah Bay, WA, the NW tip of the continental US. older fishing boats out here still have Detroits, mostly 4-71s. I have found a discarded 3-71 and 4-71 at the dump, snatched the blowers, and sold them to hot rodders. The 3-71 is a viable blower for a Ford flathead, with modifications.
I just dropped new injector cups into a DD15, resealed the heat exchanger, ran a regen and bam No codes and runs really nice. Set of cab mounts. That's when I finally noticed the clutch pedal feel? A quick inspection and yea, now the trans. is on the floor? That escalated quickly.
The engine runs a 'Blower' not a 'supercharger', easily confused but the 2/ is blown, this is more definition than mechanical though. The early marine 6/71 were known as 'Grey' in some parts of the world. The unmistakable growl of the 2/ is renown and the 8/71 is my favourite. The 8/53 was the lemon engine for some reason. Good presentation of the Detroit history, thanks.
Fun fact of the 2 cycle Detroit Engine is it is possible to run them backwards. I did it when i was learning to drive a 6v92 and did not get my foot on the clutch fast enough when stopping on a hill with 40k load of grain in the trailer. Surprisingly my Dad (my Trainer) was very calm while i was freaking out watching exhaust smoke coming out the intake on a mid 70s cab over Freightliner.
I used to deliver to a Detroit dealer in MN every day back in the 90s. One morning I swung around the back of the building and heard what I thought was a runaway locomotive on a nearby track. As I slowed to back into the loading dock, everything in my cab started to rattle and I could no longer hear my radio. I t was disorienting to say the least. I was backing my semi past the cooling tower and exhaust port as they were dyno testing a 16v149 they had just finished building for one of the mines. The earth shook, there was no way to communicate other than hand signals anywhere in the building and I was certain that building was coming down. Honestly, I had goosebumps. It was amazing.
You should do a series on just the large stationary and marine engines. They were the ultimate example of engines by modular expansion. I ran a boat with twin 16V-149’s that smoked and slobbered oil all over everything but started in a flash and would run hooked up on the dash without complaining. One of them drank 20 gal of oil a day out of a 44 gal pan. The engine changed its own oil every other day but never complained and kept on going.
I think you missed a few series : 51 series, a valveless two stroke predecessor to the 53, it was economical but very sensitive to exhaust back pressure and sooted up its exhaust ports very easily, leading to performance loss. 53 series was available in 2,3,4,v6 and v8, and a few v12s too. There was the 92 series, a bored out 71 in V6, v8, v12, v16 configuration, and the mighty 149 series. 149 were officially available in v12, v16, and v20 configuration, though I believe there was a prototype 8v149 at one point.
In marine use I have seen two inline 6 cylinders drive into a gear box with one output shaft. ? ? Could use one engine or two engines to drive the prop shaft?
@@albundy8052 I remember reading an article on the double six, but I can't seem to find that article now. IIRC it was 2 6-71s joined by a common gearbox, invented as a way to get more power before Detroit came out with the 12v71.
@@albundy8052 I've also seen what was basically a king size outboard motor with (I think) a 6 71, but I didn't get close so it could even have been a 110. There were a pair mounted on a barge .
They had inline 6-71 in the old greyhound buses, and boats also used them, because the 2-stroke had more power. scavenging air and exhaust, in one stroke. so cool.
One characteristic of a in-line 671 Detroit was it’s balance shaft. Detroit diesels had a smooth power curve from idle to 2100 RPM. Early Cummins engines were like a rock crusher at idle. This smooth power curve made the 2 cycle popular in boats and buses.
I loved the sound of the old Detroit Diesel 2 stroke engines!! They came in 53, 71, 92 and 129 configurations. To me, the best sounding one was the 671. Especially if it had a turbo.
I went on the fire dept 1969 all of our units were gasoline 1971 we got a Engine with a 671 Detroit as a MPO (driver) we had to get the confidence that it wasn’t going to blow up it screamed so much between shifts it ran for approximately seven years never failed us never broke down it would pump for days never failed great engine it did leak oil a whole lot we got to love it and great faith our lives depends on that engine pumping water as I said it never failed .
These Detroit Diesels seem to get everywhere. We had a V6 at the college I attended in the UK in the 80’s. It was usually sat on a dyno in the workshop of the college. When this thing started up, with its roots supercharger, everyone nearby stopped what they were doing. From memory, the supercharger was the nosiest aspect of it
I really love Detroit diesels I love that sound when you hear a screaming Jimmy coming down the road with a heavy load getting ready to pull into the yard
Hey, great video. I’m a diesel tech that used to work Detroit diesel. Spot on video, I just would have included the silver 92 in the video as it was a legendary Detroit Diesel engine.
One minor correction: it was the 4-71 and 6-71 that ended up on hot rods. There is no Detroit 8-71 inline, only the 8V-71 V-8. All 8-71 blowers on street cars are aftermarket. The 8V-71 blower is very rarely used on cars.
Too bad Oldsmobile Diesel(1978-1985) didn't use help/advice from Detroit Diesel when making their own in-house 4.3 V6, 4.3 V8, and 5.7 V8 diesels. R.E. Olds(died in 1950), the founder of Oldsmobile, loved diesel engines and thought they was the future for all cars and he even patented some diesel designs. Great video.
The Olds diesel conversion wasn't the first one gm screwed up. Anybody remember the Turoflo? I think they originally did it to have a diesel to put in a bunch of surplus PT boats that they had that hadn't gotten engines put in before the end of the war.
Kettering actually created the oldsmobile 303 v8. I actually love my 350dx diesel. 27-33mpg in a 2 ton brick and it is still very reliable after about 40 years.
@@workingcountry1776 thank you.. yes, I have 4 olds diesel cars and they have all been reliable.. all 4 have had at least one IP rebuild and a few fuel pumps and AC leaks... other than that, all original including the headgaskets...
@@workingcountry1776 you are the second person I've ever heard use the words 350 diesel and dependable in the same sentence. And the first changed head bolts every 20 to 25,000 miles. A friend of mine bought a 1980 pick up with it in it and the service manager told him if he came in with even a shovel in the bed it would void the warranty. He sold it the next week.
I got my 2 cent's in. I've got 2 4.3 v6 Oldsmobile diesels and they have been so reliable. Absolutely love driving them, the sound, power and fuel mileage is just fantastic. I wished GM would have kept building them, by the time they stopped they had all the issues worked out
Should I mention the fuel pincher? The 8.2L four stroke v8 was offered in both turbo and non turbo variants. Not a power house by any measure but they get the job done and really good mpg. They came in medium duty trucks and were also used in marine applications. The 8.2 suffered from head gasket failure because the top of the cylinders walls were basically free standing and would "move" causing head gaskets to wear prematurely. Also the 6.2/6.5 are based on Oldsmobile v8 gas engines and were never considered a Detroit Diesel engine, until the internet decided that they would call them that to make them sound like something better than the total bagless boat anchor that they were/are.
I hate to be this way, but you're completely misinformed. You can find dealer brochures from 1982 with Detroit Diesel advertising the 6.2 V8. They share nothing in common with the DIESEL Olds v8 besides the lifters and the DB-2 injection pump. I've had these motors torn down to the block. It is absolutely a MYTH that the 6.2/6.5 platform was a gas motor with diesel heads. That's not how that works. In fact, the Olds Diesel was not the same block as the gas variant. It used simular tooling patterns like the headbolts for cost. I wish you people would do some research beforehand, especially since you got the info correct on the 8.2 fuel pincher. You were this close to greatness
@@detroitdiesel-vu3ig Win some lose some. I appreciate your clarification. My background is medium/ heavy duty but I have owned a 6.2 in a half ton Chevy. HATED it. Sold the truck to a fellow that swapped in an Oldsmobile gas job, bolted right into there same transmission and all. I now have a 7.3l powerstroke (259,613.3mi) and it will probably last me for the rest of it. Take care.
Im very proud of my years spent driving the last peterbilt "according to the peterbilt registry" to be built by peterbilt from the factory with a 12.7 series 60 detroit. Its still being used as a yard truck but sadly cant be registerd in CA anymore due to emissions regulations.
@@dirkhamilton2709 no truck over 10 years old can be used commercially in commifornia. Because building new trucks is greener than slightly more pollution of older trucks exhaust emissions
If you've ever been to the port of Los Angeles/Long Beach it becomes VERY clear why California has these regulations you can barely breathe over there...
I used to haul heavy (132,000 lbs) north of Superior with a (if I remember correctly) 370hp /400 hp (on the cruise) 12 L Series 60. Little engine wasn't the fastest up the hill but made it to the top
Cleveland Engine merged into Electro Motive Division, but that didn’t leave DD as the only engine building division. EMD has been building diesel engines since the conception of the two stroke designs of the 1930s. EMD builds diesels for locomotives, marine, and stationary applications. I’m a railroader and had a consist of all EMD two strokes just a few days ago.
You left out an interesting detail. Greyhound needed more power than a 6-71. For a time, 2 4-71 engine's feeding a common transmission were used on buses. When the 8v-71's came out, I believe they were mostly retrofitted with them for simplicity. The thing about 2 cycle engines is that they sounded like they were screaming at 2100rpm due to firing every cycle.
My family have been using a series 71 since 1960 in our sawmill. We still got it and she still runs. My favorite saying is Detroits just turn fuel into noise
If I could get an alarm clock with the sound of a screaming jimmy, I would play it as I went to sleep, and to wake me up in the morning. I love that sound more than Edith Piaf singing laVie en Rose.
A very interesting and well produced video, You never mentioned the oil & gas industry world wide who used the 8V71 engines in there pumping and general service company equipment , Cheers Dave
I worked at The GEYSERS in Sonoma County after the tour in the Marines; 1968. Ran the air service diesels for the geothermal drilling rig, Both 6-71 and V8-71. The diesels were excellent. The compressors... not so much!
One of the reasons it went to Daimler from penske is because Rodger had shares in the Detroit engines , Freightliner trucks and trucklite . The government stepped in and was saying he was becoming a monopoly , because he ran mostly, Freightliner trucks, with detroit series 60 motors and had his own lights it. Also owns imperial supply company , supplying his own shops and paying himself.
There were other markets that Detroit dominated that you didn't mention. In the marine industry they had 90% of engine penetration of sales on engines above 400 BHP for some time. Almost every city bus had Detroit engines for decades. The industrial market was dominated by the S71 because of it's versatility (1, 2, 3, 4, and 6 cylinder configurations). No mention of the 8.2L medium truck engine, 92 series or the large 149 series made in 8V, 12V, 16V and 20V configurations. Today Detroit Diesel is just a brand of Daimler corp. The DD series of engines were developed by Daimler with just a little influence from DDC engineering. The Detroit Diesel transmissions and axles are just rebadged Daimler products.
you're just flat wrong. there's many components that are shared with Daimler Trucks Europe but DDC engineering does massive amounts of work to design these engines specifically for north america.
I didn't hear any mention of Gray Marine or really anything about GMC Diesel. I worked on US Navy river boats (WW2 vintage) that had 6-71's with Gray Marine and /or GMC Diesel labels on the rocker arm covers and other parts. Any parts we replaced came out of Detroit boxes. I loved working on those engines
I love the video! Especially because I work for a Detroit diesel distributor, I think you should touch on the mbe engines and the current off highway MTU engines that originated from Detroit.
The 92 series was missing. I already talked to Demand Detroit, they told me that the sale of 46.7% of the shares to Crysler was a shot in its own foot. Unfortunately. DETROIT DIESEL 2 STROKE IN THE VEIN!!!!!
Yellow Coach built 1,256 units of model 743 (Silversides) produced between 1937 and 1939 for Greyhound. GM became majority owner in 1925 and total owner in 1943.
Detroit Diesel engine's fame exploded with a 2-stroke model that could be assembled with its injecting pump on one side or the other, along with the inherited ability of the 2-stroke engines to rotate in either direction. They were fabulous for marine use. Especially for fast boats. Bundled in pairs counter rotating engines saved the gyroscopic effect and them being possible to be assembled on one side or the other the "mechanics" always was installed to the inner side of the ship, making it much accessible for troubleshooting.
One point that is missed here is that because they were two cycle engines they were usually smaller and lighter than the same power output four cycle engines which is why they were so popular in areas where unit size was an issue. This is why they were found in most post war buses.
You forgot to mention the 92 series of Detroit 2 strokes. Those engines had water circulating around the cylinder sleeves, where the 71 series cylinder sleeves transferred the heat to the block for cooling. The 92 series engines were all V configurations. Series 60 was the first Semi truck engine to be fully electronically controlled.
Left out the 92 series, and the silver series within each group. And there was a series 50 before the 60 when they went 4stroke the 53 series had so many combinations 2cyl 3 4 6 v6 v8 Swap the camshaft and the 2stroke engines can run backwards. Really awesome content but you vs an go on for hours how much they accomplished and what they were used in.
The Continental Trailways NEW Silver Eagle coach in the photo was originally built with Cummins NRTO inline 6 engines. Continental really liked the power of these engines but they were very thirsty and very noisy, which passengers hated. 85 of these were built but the last ones were shipped from the factory of La Brugeoise et Nivelles in Belgium without engines. As the DD 8V-71's finally arrived, they were installed into the NEW Silver Eagles at the Houston shops of Continental and the older coaches were also changed to the new 8-V 71 engines. All of Continental's rigid buses built earlier by Setra in Germany also got the 8-V 71 to replace the earlier M A N engines originally in these buses. Greyhound did not get any new buses with the 8-V 71 until it's first orders of GMC PD 4106 and MCI MC-5 in the mid-60's. Greyhound's PD 4501 Scenicruiser fleet had it's twin 4-71 engines replaced with a single 8-V 71 engines starting in 1961. GM did this to itself, an unforced error. All they had to do was cast up some new engine blocks and design some gaskets as all the internals were identical to those in the 6-71 engines. And long haul truckers hated the two stroke engines because they used more fuel than the four stroke engines.
Pretty well done, but you missed two things: 1.) the Series 92 engines which basically replaced the 110 as their big engines and became quite popular and well respected. Still being raced today. 2.) Buss's - 8V92's powered more buss's than you can shake a stick at. At one time almost all highway and muni buss's had Detroits. Many went 1M miles 😀
The blower is more accurately called a scavenging pump, not a super charger. It doesn't add boost because it's blowing straight through the exhaust valves. If I recall correctly, the exhaust closes slightly before the intake, but it doesn't push much boost from that, especially if another cylinder in the engine is scavenging at that time.
From the 53s 71s stepped up to the 92 and even 129s the 71 was 71 cubic inches per cylinder.. and 92 was 92 cubic inches per cylinder and yes thats is where the supercharger got its name from as 4/71 was on the 4 cylinder 71 2 strokes and the 6/71 was on the 6 cylinder 8/71 on the 8 cylinder all the way up to 24/71 which I'm pretty sure was just 2 12/71s I'm.not 100% on that so yea forgive If I'm wrong and also they have supercharged and turbo 2 stroke 6v 8v 16v 92s my old boy has been managing a detroit branch here in Australia for the past 10yrs absolute beautiful company 💪🏻
One minor correction: 5:00 The sun is powered by nuclear fusion. Little Boy and Fat Man were both fission devices. Thermonuclear bombs are orders of magnitude more powerful. (See Castle Bravo). I very much enjoy your videos. 🙂
Neat little fact. the 71 series was made in 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 6v, 8v configurations. The 12v where two 6v's literally bolted together, just one technically spun backwards, same with the 16v, just two 8v's bolted together.
If you guys enjoyed the video, please SMASH THAT LIKE BUTTON. It helps the channel out a huge amount and helps TH-cam put the video in front of more people. Thanks for watching 😬
My buddy is the guy who has the Midwest Mechanic channel
You forgot the 171 single cylinder Detroit of the early days. Other than that it was an excellent video
Why did Detroit get away from 2 strokes
@@trevoncowen9198 It was becoming apparent that their older designs were going to have trouble meeting tighter emissions standards, and they also tended to be harder on fuel than the competing 4-stroke engines. It turned out to be a good decision for them in the long run, and their 4-stroke Series 60 became a legend in its own right in the OTR world.
Despite oil leaks and maybe higher fuel consumption the Detroit Diesel 71 series was simple to maintain and would run with more wrong with it than any other engine I know of . It was easier to jury rig to get home in a pinch...less likely to leave you stranded. It's BIG cousin the EMD ,IMHO, the best designed engine for simplicity and maintenance of big engines ever. Blow a hole in a piston? Stick big screw driver under injector rocker, tie down to blow down valve to shut off fuel to that cylinder and run it home. 2 min jury rig. Most of the unit injectors have to all break down all at one time to stop engines and no glow plugs on GM 2 stroke engines pre electronics. My love for these engines is as a mechanic, tugboat engineer and captain for 35 years. New electronic engines are complicated, expensive, and will leave you stranded or run over by your own barge... DANGEROUS to your health. What good is fuel economy and green technology if YOU end up injured or dead because of it. Farmers are losing millions of dollars worth of crops because a sensor shuts down their tractors or combines and they can not diagnose or easily fix the problems without expensive tech reps arriving hours too late. I am an analog guy living in a digital world remembering how easy it was to keep your machines running. I prefer reliable and easy to fix over power and fuel economy.
Everyone made fun of the leaking 2 cycles. Until the first V6 Fuel Squeezer became popular. Drivers and owners loved them. Mechanics just prayed the started never died. They put those engine in short nose trucks and the starter was basically in the frame rail. I changed two in my life. Not fun.
Yep :-)
Markanneprice knows what he's talking about - all he wrote - absolute truth
Well said
Exactly what he said. When you think a Detroit is absolutely worn out, buy a case of ether and run it another year
I've been running marine Detroits for over 60 years. Mostly 71 series. 53's in Vietnam. Until 1980's, most ships had Detroit generators. The 2 cycle, mechanically injected diesel is the most reliable engine on the ocean. No injector pump, no electronics, no computer, and no f'ing sensors. They don't burn as clean, and the mileage isn't as good as newer electronic engines, but they keep running, an important attribute on the ocean. You don't need thousands of dollars worth of test equipment to keep them running or a room full of electronic spares to get home. On the ocean you don't just pull over when your engine fails. There's lots of horror stories about electronically controlled marine diesels. I also ran Winton and Cleveland diesels. I have a Ford powerstroke pu. You change sensors like fuses. If I was a young man, I'd put in a Detroit.
I agree we had logging equipment best diesel ever built
Would love to hear some stories
@@asphalt_matt A few years ago a fisherman friend was 100+ miles at sea. A circuit board partially failed and his main engine wouldn't run faster than idle. It took a day to come in and he still had to be towed into port because he couldn't overcome the tide. Plus he lost fishing days. Now he carries $2Gs in electronic spares.
In Vietnam I was running a Mike boat with twin 671s. An anti tank round came thru the side, and all the way thru one block. It still ran, poorly. Nobody had time to see what was wrong, so I ran it for another 1/2 hour, dodging while it was spitting oil and coolant. It would only turn about 1000 rpm. But it turned.
I'm retired and live on a former USCG 83' patrol boat with twin 671s. I rebuilt them 12 years ago for their first time. They were made in 1947. I suppose they'll be running past 100 years old for some new owner long after I'm dead.
Outstanding story thanks for sharing. Detroit diesel is an amazing engine builder.
The only special tools for aDetroit I ever used was those little things you set the injector with.
And nothing makes as much noise as a runaway Detroit. 😂
As a 29 year employee of Detroit Diesel and now a lead trainer in the machining division, we may add this to our yearly training program as a history lesson for new employees. Great Job!
I left DDA back in 1984. I helped design & develop the Series 60 cylinder heads. Fun times.
Awesome! Whats your salary??
I was a transit bus mechanic for 38 years, built and worked on many DD’s 453s, 671s, 6V71s, 8V71s and 6V92s. The later versions also being turbocharged. Interesting to note the series number on these early DDs represented the number of cubic inches per cylinder. And if the idler gear was moved from one side of the gear train to the other side (a provision for this was designed into the block) and a different rotation starter was installed, the crankshaft would run clockwise or counterclockwise depending on the application. Sure liked working on them. Later years the four stroke series 50 ( a 4 cylinder version of the series 60, DD couldn’t call it a series 40 because that name was used by international) became a popular transit bus engine. Built a lot of Allison transmissions also.
The reversible rotation was good in use in boats. I took a “river queen” tourist boat ride in Ft. Lauderdale. It had the unmistakable scream of twin 71 series.
I have twin 12V71 TTI in my boat
That is interesting. Glad you posted the details. tHanks
@@woodboat3G I’m going to guess you have a very oily engine room then.
@@yolo_burrito no. Super clean
Great Job! As a third generation Detroit Diesel employee who gives plant tours, you did a great job with this video. My Grandfather hired in here in 1956 and my family has been here ever since.
Thoroughly enjoyed my two assembly line tours I had back in 98-99 when the 2 strokes were all condensed into one line in late 99.
Got to see a 20v-149 block being put together with the big alignment bar.
Shed a few tears as that was late August 99 and the 2 stroke line was to be shut down around 2000.
Glad I got to see all that history before it was gone.
Good video. The two stroke families and their many variants established DD as a leading engine producer. A few points I would give greater emphasis:
DD's position as the go to source for both urban bus and highway coach applications was its stronghold for decades. When GM chose to exi Bus and Coach production, that in-family connection to a key customer was lost.
Two cycle engines are inherently smooth having twice as many power pulses per rev as four cycle engines. BUT... Two cycles have terrible emissions characteristics, which brought about the end for that engine class for on highway vehicles.
Penske wasn't just a business partner and co-owner. He was a saviour. DD was a disorganized mess and hemorrhaging cash after the decline of the two cycle cash cow products. He got the opperations back on track, and had the right connections to broker DD's new identity as an integral part of Daimler and its North American truck brand, Freightliner.
Did you start during GM ownership? My family also had many GM employees.
How can I get a tour
All the Series 71 Engines have a blower, but it doesn't really supercharge them as it is basically 1 psi above atmospheric pressure. Even the turbo versions retained the blower as it was essential for bringing in fresh air before the turbo spooled up. Non turbo 71 series are still considered naturally aspirated...I have one of these in a 1966 GM Coach
Very true. If you want to produce a good amount of boost with the blower alone you have to change the cam or at least its timing to get the exhaust valves shut before the piston covers the inlet ports so some air can pressurize in the cylinder before the piston travels up. There are a few Whipple charged 2 stokes out there making good boost and some pretty wicked sounds!
@@geoffmooregm you'd have to change the gear that does the blower you overdrive it, which is apparently a custom machine job...or at a second border with belt drive. It's been done...but adding a turbo is so much easier
@@natesprojects1982 Yes agreed. The turbo is probably more efficient too.
I belive its referred to as an air scavanger.
@@rodfrost5051 it is a scavenger, but the Detroit Diesel service manual calls it a blower, because it was originally develops to blow air into industrial furnaces.
As a young mechanic, I worked on many Detroits from 3-53 to the 8V-92, and most everything between. There were many other diesels that I worked on like Cummins, Cats, and Buda, but Detroit was by far the most common of the time. I still have some of my Detroit tools that I haven't used in thirty years. Just can't bear to get rid of them.
If you ever want to part with them let me know I could use them have a pair of 8v71s from 1974 still alive and kicking on a Bertram 46.6MY
Also the two strokes were a very complex design for their time. You could have the same block and have it run in either rotation. The inline’s could have the blower, exhaust on either side. The heads could be flipped end for end. Basically it could fit just about any application an engineer could come up with. Overall a very cool idea
dang. that's impressive engineering, enables engines to be fitted in all kinds of locations otherwise requiring custom design and fitup.
Yeah I have a 72 Detroit 3-53 and it’s made so you can put everyone on either side so that it can fit for your truck and I just rebuilt that engine recently cause I’m restoring a 84 f150 lifted so that I can have a cool car but there really easy to work on and there gear driven so like
Not a complex design, just well engineered.
@@rossthorne6873 mhm there really easy to design and work on
@@randomgamer6255
YES on my (353) on my 78 Backhoe. When I look at my Engine set up. So many ways it could be mounted. My Humble opinion is that's why the Military Loved it. Plus they could part out a damaged one. Put good parts back in another engine fast. Such universal mounting.
The research required to make a video like this just massive, thank you for your time, I enjoyed it
Glad you enjoyed it!
As I have pointed out in some of your other videos, I am a fleet mechanic for a public utility in California. While now have nothing but Fords and Navistar in the fleet, we did have “old yellow” that was the last of the trucks we had that was painted yellow before the company started painting them white. Old Yellow had an 8V92 Jimmy, and somehow stayed in the fleet long after the other yellow trucks had been retired. It is also the first and only engine that ever ran away on me. It was a sight to behold. Although it didn’t grenade, it came close. It was the first time I had adjusted the rack on it; needless to say, I did it wrong. As it started running away on me, I did everything I could to smother it before stuffing work uniforms into the intake which finally choked it. The engine survived and continued running like a clock after I correctly adjusted the rack a second time. The company finally retired old Yellow in 2001. I still miss that old Jimmy
Great story. That must have been a loud race against the clock
M look
Had a 76 Crown Coach School bus that ran away once. The driver pushed the button to close the intake ( manually reset on motor 6-71 T ) so the motor was flooded with fuel. As the motor earmed the fuel vaporized and the motor ran away somewhat. The cooling fan sounded like a helicopter taking off and the motor screamed until I ran out of the shop to the parking aera and hit the dampner door. Shut down quickly. Let it cool and restarted it. No damages and continued to run like a clock. Real fine motor.......
Despite being the most famous, as you mentioned Detroit was the last of GM's three diesel divisions, coming after Winton/Cleveland and Electro-Motive. I'm a railroader so I'm most familiar with the three series of EMD engines, the 567, 645 and 710. The 567 is exactly twice the bore and twice the stroke of a 71, and was designed at the same time by the same GM engineering team. The main differences from Detroits are that EMDs have fabricated (welded) blocks, and individual cylinders (power assemblies) can be removed and replaced fairly easily. Also, turbocharged EMDs do not have roots blowers, instead the turbo has a clutch and receives an assist from the engine geartrain when idling or at lower speeds. The clutch disengages once there is enough exhaust pressure for the turbo to start freewheeling. EMD has used this turbo design since the late 1950s, and it might be the earliest example of what we now call twincharging.
EMDs are all 45 degree V engines, with power outputs ranging from the 600 HP roots-blown 6-567 all the way up to the 5500 HP turbocharged 20-710. The 567 is a legend in the railroad world, as it more than anything else is what killed the steam locomotive in North America.
EMD is now owned by Caterpillar and the 710 engine is still in new production today. It gained electronic injection and controls in the mid-1990s (the computer in our locomotives is called the EMDEC, their version of DDEC), and can be found in locomotives, ships and generators all over the world. Dual-fuel natural gas versions are available and it even meets the EPA's Tier-IV emissions standards with exhaust aftertreatment, though the railroads are avoiding these systems like the plague and as a result very few new EMD locomotives have been built for North American use since Tier-IV came into effect (rebuilds are grandfathered in, and there are thousands of older EMDs still running in daily service in North America alone).
Interesting info, cheers for posting👍
Excellent comment. Thank you for stepping in with that one
EMD is now phasing out the 710 two-stroke in favor of the new 1010 four-stroke (a rework of the so-called H-engine developed for the failed SD80MAC and SD90MAC) and introducing it for the SD70ACe and other SD70 variants .
I recall training films on the two-stroke design that referred to “Gray Marine “ design….at the time I was a student in the Marine Corps tracked vehicle mechanics course…the films were B/W and produced by the US Navy…..
Sorry….date was 1958…
My father worked on Detroits for thirty eight years. I have had the privilege of working on them for forty eight years now. The red and yellow arrows circling logo represents Detroit diesel and Allison transmission merging into one corporation. Great video ! 👍🏻
when i was in the army as a mechanic i worked on so many 8v92 engines i couldnt even count. they are badass engines and generally were very reliable. made a shit ton of power at 1200 rpm im pretty sure the torque at that rpm was 1400 lb-ft
Same here! But the gearing they had behind em oh man! The old Detroits pulled better then the cat engines do
Literally just watched this while working at detroit diesel. Great job.
My tank in vietnam had a 6V-53 detroit, water cooled in a M113A2 APC. This was good for 50 MPH DOWN HILL.4 TH DIV. 1969.
Love the Detroit diesel worked on them in the coast guard. They are the engines in the USCG's 47 Motor Life Boats. The ones that go out into surf and can flip over, reright themselves and keep going. Great video cant wait till the next one
in the army the 8v92's were used in a lot of vehicles
I like the foresight of the designers to allow for the inline engines to be assembled either way and rotation making exhaust positioning in tight spots like boats easier. Love the screaming GMs.❤
2 stroke Detroits are the best engines ever made.
The Screamin' Jimmy's are just tanks.Indestructible workhorses and a perfect tool to wake up your neighbors in the morning.
Very informative. Ive always loved 2 stroke diesels, cuz thru the 70s, my dad drove a huge off-road KW log truck, with a 12v-71! I loved the sound and still do.
Fun fact the 671 can be configured to rotate clockwise or counter clockwise. The cam can be put in eather side of the block with the balance shaft on the other. The crankshaft can go in the block with the damper and fly wheel on either end. The blower only goes on one side but the block can be turned around to fit your needs. The head can go on either direction. The exhaust manifold can be on the same side as the blower or on the other side. Early models had 2 valves per cylinder later models had 4 all valves are exhaust no intake valves air enters the cylinders through ports in lower part at the bottom of the piston stroke. The designation 71 stands for the cubic inches per cylinder as does the series 53 , 110 and others.
÷
I started in Detroit Diesel's as an 18 yr old kid in Texas in 1976. Built hundreds of them. Nice video, thanks. The 92 series tried to be fuel efficient with their Fuel Squeezer series in the early 80's. We had to take a 425 hp 8V92TA and derate it on the dyno to 280 hp by adjusting bellville washers in the governor. This was done during the in service inspection before delivery
Great video. Being a retired diesel technician, I Kind'd miss the series 60. Good engine.
I still have one and intend to keep it for as long as possible.
There has been a huge resurgence in popularity for the DD 60 series engines. My buddy just got his CDL, and he says a lotta guys are scrapping their new emissions trucks for restore8d classics with Pre emissions engines. Some of the most common truck engines out there are DD 60 series, DD15, Big Cam8 Cummins engines and Cat 3408. I even hear the occasional 2 stroke. They're not very common, but there are a few out there.
@@Detroit6V92TA the DD15 is a modern offering, post Mercedes-Benz ownership. It’s not really held in the same regard as an old Series 60.
I love ours. It's a 12.7L in a 94 KW T-800 we use to pull a 900 bu 32' farm hopper. Gobs of power, and a dream to drive.
I am fourteen years old and these videos
Help me so much!!! Thanks
I became a fan of Detroit Diesel at my first job, working in a pleasure boat marina. I particularly liked the sound made by twin 871s as they went past in Chris Craft Constellations.
I started as a Detroit Diesel engine technician at a Freightliner dealership fresh out of vo-tech in 1992. Back then most of the engines we worked on were the series 71, series 92 (started seeing less and less 2 strokes around this time) The series 60 which was king at the time (due to their fully electronic engines and reliability) The series 60 was hands down my favorite to overhaul. It was a very mechanic friendly engine and I enjoyed working on them. Now thanks to the good old EPA most of what we see are DD13’s, 15’s and 16’s with a few ISX and X-15 Cummins. Once you work on the DD series enough day after day, they’re a pretty good engine to overhaul if it’s in a bigger chassis.the biggest problems we see outta the DD’s are failed injectors (sometimes all 6 at the same time), missfires due to not keeping up on valve adjustments, electrical issues, broken rollers and piston and liner failures
loved the picture of the old trailways gold eagle...rode on a lot of those old busses with my pop, he was a continental trailways driver for 22 years.....
Now this is a great video. I've been with Detroit Diesel for 24 years and I love my job! Thanks for sharing.
Skipped over my favorite generation the 92 series. I run a 8v92TA in my Peterbilt and love it
I'm in Neah Bay, WA, the NW tip of the continental US. older fishing boats out here still have Detroits, mostly 4-71s. I have found a discarded 3-71 and 4-71 at the dump, snatched the blowers, and sold them to hot rodders. The 3-71 is a viable blower for a Ford flathead, with modifications.
I just dropped new injector cups into a DD15, resealed the heat exchanger, ran a regen and bam No codes and runs really nice. Set of cab mounts. That's when I finally noticed the clutch pedal feel? A quick inspection and yea, now the trans. is on the floor? That escalated quickly.
It’s amazing how many of the 71 are still in use in small fishing industry boats.
I’m standing inside Detroit diesel right now!
The engine runs a 'Blower' not a 'supercharger', easily confused but the 2/ is blown, this is more definition than mechanical though. The early marine 6/71 were known as 'Grey' in some parts of the world. The unmistakable growl of the 2/ is renown and the 8/71 is my favourite. The 8/53 was the lemon engine for some reason. Good presentation of the Detroit history, thanks.
Fun fact of the 2 cycle Detroit Engine is it is possible to run them backwards. I did it when i was learning to drive a 6v92 and did not get my foot on the clutch fast enough when stopping on a hill with 40k load of grain in the trailer. Surprisingly my Dad (my Trainer) was very calm while i was freaking out watching exhaust smoke coming out the intake on a mid 70s cab over Freightliner.
You forgot about the series 92 in series 149 and what became of their two-stroke lineup and how MTU builds them now
I used to deliver to a Detroit dealer in MN every day back in the 90s. One morning I swung around the back of the building and heard what I thought was a runaway locomotive on a nearby track. As I slowed to back into the loading dock, everything in my cab started to rattle and I could no longer hear my radio. I t was disorienting to say the least. I was backing my semi past the cooling tower and exhaust port as they were dyno testing a 16v149 they had just finished building for one of the mines. The earth shook, there was no way to communicate other than hand signals anywhere in the building and I was certain that building was coming down. Honestly, I had goosebumps. It was amazing.
You should do a series on just the large stationary and marine engines. They were the ultimate example of engines by modular expansion. I ran a boat with twin 16V-149’s that smoked and slobbered oil all over everything but started in a flash and would run hooked up on the dash without complaining. One of them drank 20 gal of oil a day out of a 44 gal pan. The engine changed its own oil every other day but never complained and kept on going.
I served on a USN Harbor Tug YTB774 which had 3 6-71s. Two for generators and 1 for firefighting pump.
Nissans 2 Stroke diesel and the ud trucks would be cool to know about
He sees how well his diesel videos are doing and keeps making them, but by no means am i complaining lmao i love these
I think you missed a few series : 51 series, a valveless two stroke predecessor to the 53, it was economical but very sensitive to exhaust back pressure and sooted up its exhaust ports very easily, leading to performance loss. 53 series was available in 2,3,4,v6 and v8, and a few v12s too. There was the 92 series, a bored out 71 in V6, v8, v12, v16 configuration, and the mighty 149 series. 149 were officially available in v12, v16, and v20 configuration, though I believe there was a prototype 8v149 at one point.
You could get 1-53 in a gen set too. A friend had one in his converted 1911 LA harbor tug with a 6-71 for propulsion.
In marine use
I have seen two inline 6 cylinders drive into a gear box with one output shaft.
? ? Could use one engine or two engines to drive the prop shaft?
@@albundy8052 I remember reading an article on the double six, but I can't seem to find that article now. IIRC it was 2 6-71s joined by a common gearbox, invented as a way to get more power before Detroit came out with the 12v71.
@@albundy8052 found a TH-cam video th-cam.com/video/adEy5j4XiJk/w-d-xo.html
@@albundy8052 I've also seen what was basically a king size outboard motor with (I think) a 6 71, but I didn't get close so it could even have been a 110. There were a pair mounted on a barge .
8V71T on M110.M109 SPH and 6V53T on M113 being lots of memory to me when serving in Taiwan military. Long life Detroit Diesel.
They had inline 6-71 in the old greyhound buses, and boats also used them, because the 2-stroke had more power. scavenging air and exhaust, in one stroke. so cool.
One characteristic of a in-line 671 Detroit was it’s balance shaft. Detroit diesels had a smooth power curve from idle to 2100 RPM. Early Cummins engines were like a rock crusher at idle. This smooth power curve made the 2 cycle popular in boats and buses.
I loved the sound of the old Detroit Diesel 2 stroke engines!! They came in 53, 71, 92 and 129 configurations. To me, the best sounding one was the 671. Especially if it had a turbo.
I’ve got two of them sitting in my shop if you really want to just listen. Make you a great deal. The oil leaks are free!
"... if there's no oil under 'em, there's no oil in 'em..."
149 series
@@Tchristman100 thank you. I knew I might've had that number wrong. Lol
aka the screamin mee mees .... or the road oilers due to thier habit of leaking oil.
Also famous for super low idle oil press 5 to 10 psi
Awesome video man. 👍🏾 I work at Detroit Diesel and that is a pretty good summary of our history.
I went on the fire dept 1969 all of our units were gasoline 1971 we got a Engine with a 671 Detroit as a MPO (driver) we had to get the confidence that it wasn’t going to blow up it screamed so much between shifts it ran for approximately seven years never failed us never broke down it would pump for days never failed great engine it did leak oil a whole lot we got to love it and great faith our lives depends on that engine pumping water as I said it never failed .
These Detroit Diesels seem to get everywhere. We had a V6 at the college I attended in the UK in the 80’s. It was usually sat on a dyno in the workshop of the college. When this thing started up, with its roots supercharger, everyone nearby stopped what they were doing. From memory, the supercharger was the nosiest aspect of it
I've got a skidder with a 353 and grader with a 671 ...they're both heroine addicts but I love them .
I really love Detroit diesels I love that sound when you hear a screaming Jimmy coming down the road with a heavy load getting ready to pull into the yard
Good Job on the Video Yung Man I am a Retired Diesel Mechanic and I say you did a good job on this Video. 👍
Hey, great video. I’m a diesel tech that used to work Detroit diesel. Spot on video, I just would have included the silver 92 in the video as it was a legendary Detroit Diesel engine.
One minor correction: it was the 4-71 and 6-71 that ended up on hot rods. There is no Detroit 8-71 inline, only the 8V-71 V-8. All 8-71 blowers on street cars are aftermarket. The 8V-71 blower is very rarely used on cars.
I know where 2 street vehicles with Detroit blowers on them are. He is a diesel mechanic at work and play
Too bad Oldsmobile Diesel(1978-1985) didn't use help/advice from Detroit Diesel when making their own in-house 4.3 V6, 4.3 V8, and 5.7 V8 diesels. R.E. Olds(died in 1950), the founder of Oldsmobile, loved diesel engines and thought they was the future for all cars and he even patented some diesel designs.
Great video.
The Olds diesel conversion wasn't the first one gm screwed up. Anybody remember the Turoflo? I think they originally did it to have a diesel to put in a bunch of surplus PT boats that they had that hadn't gotten engines put in before the end of the war.
Kettering actually created the oldsmobile 303 v8.
I actually love my 350dx diesel. 27-33mpg in a 2 ton brick and it is still very reliable after about 40 years.
@@workingcountry1776 thank you.. yes, I have 4 olds diesel cars and they have all been reliable.. all 4 have had at least one IP rebuild and a few fuel pumps and AC leaks... other than that, all original including the headgaskets...
@@workingcountry1776 you are the second person I've ever heard use the words 350 diesel and dependable in the same sentence. And the first changed head bolts every 20 to 25,000 miles.
A friend of mine bought a 1980 pick up with it in it and the service manager told him if he came in with even a shovel in the bed it would void the warranty. He sold it the next week.
I got my 2 cent's in. I've got 2 4.3 v6 Oldsmobile diesels and they have been so reliable. Absolutely love driving them, the sound, power and fuel mileage is just fantastic. I wished GM would have kept building them, by the time they stopped they had all the issues worked out
Should I mention the fuel pincher? The 8.2L four stroke v8 was offered in both turbo and non turbo variants. Not a power house by any measure but they get the job done and really good mpg. They came in medium duty trucks and were also used in marine applications. The 8.2 suffered from head gasket failure because the top of the cylinders walls were basically free standing and would "move" causing head gaskets to wear prematurely. Also the 6.2/6.5 are based on Oldsmobile v8 gas engines and were never considered a Detroit Diesel engine, until the internet decided that they would call them that to make them sound like something better than the total bagless boat anchor that they were/are.
I hate to be this way, but you're completely misinformed. You can find dealer brochures from 1982 with Detroit Diesel advertising the 6.2 V8. They share nothing in common with the DIESEL Olds v8 besides the lifters and the DB-2 injection pump. I've had these motors torn down to the block. It is absolutely a MYTH that the 6.2/6.5 platform was a gas motor with diesel heads. That's not how that works. In fact, the Olds Diesel was not the same block as the gas variant. It used simular tooling patterns like the headbolts for cost. I wish you people would do some research beforehand, especially since you got the info correct on the 8.2 fuel pincher. You were this close to greatness
@@detroitdiesel-vu3ig Win some lose some. I appreciate your clarification. My background is medium/ heavy duty but I have owned a 6.2 in a half ton Chevy. HATED it. Sold the truck to a fellow that swapped in an Oldsmobile gas job, bolted right into there same transmission and all. I now have a 7.3l powerstroke (259,613.3mi) and it will probably last me for the rest of it.
Take care.
Im very proud of my years spent driving the last peterbilt "according to the peterbilt registry" to be built by peterbilt from the factory with a 12.7 series 60 detroit. Its still being used as a yard truck but sadly cant be registerd in CA anymore due to emissions regulations.
Leave who tf dose business in California
Wouldn’t the older models be grandfathered in?
@@dirkhamilton2709 no truck over 10 years old can be used commercially in commifornia. Because building new trucks is greener than slightly more pollution of older trucks exhaust emissions
Cali sucks.
If you've ever been to the port of Los Angeles/Long Beach it becomes VERY clear why California has these regulations you can barely breathe over there...
The Marine division for the two-stroke engines is now owned by MTU and still produces parts and blocks for marine applications.
I used to haul heavy (132,000 lbs) north of Superior with a (if I remember correctly) 370hp /400 hp (on the cruise) 12 L Series 60. Little engine wasn't the fastest up the hill but made it to the top
Cleveland Engine merged into Electro Motive Division, but that didn’t leave DD as the only engine building division. EMD has been building diesel engines since the conception of the two stroke designs of the 1930s. EMD builds diesels for locomotives, marine, and stationary applications. I’m a railroader and had a consist of all EMD two strokes just a few days ago.
Great video. I've got one minor correction: the tractor company was Allis-Chalmers, not Chambers.
yeah I noticed that too
You left out an interesting detail. Greyhound needed more power than a 6-71. For a time, 2 4-71 engine's feeding a common transmission were used on buses. When the 8v-71's came out, I believe they were mostly retrofitted with them for simplicity. The thing about 2 cycle engines is that they sounded like they were screaming at 2100rpm due to firing every cycle.
Forgot about the 92 series in the 70 ' !! 12V53 very rare for the army !
My family have been using a series 71 since 1960 in our sawmill. We still got it and she still runs. My favorite saying is Detroits just turn fuel into noise
If I could get an alarm clock with the sound of a screaming jimmy, I would play it as I went to sleep, and to wake me up in the morning. I love that sound more than Edith Piaf singing laVie en Rose.
A very interesting and well produced video, You never mentioned the oil & gas industry world wide who used the 8V71 engines in there pumping and general service company equipment , Cheers Dave
I worked at The GEYSERS in Sonoma County after the tour in the Marines; 1968. Ran the air service diesels for the geothermal drilling rig, Both 6-71 and V8-71.
The diesels were excellent. The compressors... not so much!
Series 60 is greatest of all time!
One of the reasons it went to Daimler from penske is because Rodger had shares in the Detroit engines , Freightliner trucks and trucklite . The government stepped in and was saying he was becoming a monopoly , because he ran mostly, Freightliner trucks, with detroit series 60 motors and had his own lights it. Also owns imperial supply company , supplying his own shops and paying himself.
There were other markets that Detroit dominated that you didn't mention. In the marine industry they had 90% of engine penetration of sales on engines above 400 BHP for some time. Almost every city bus had Detroit engines for decades. The industrial market was dominated by the S71 because of it's versatility (1, 2, 3, 4, and 6 cylinder configurations). No mention of the 8.2L medium truck engine, 92 series or the large 149 series made in 8V, 12V, 16V and 20V configurations.
Today Detroit Diesel is just a brand of Daimler corp. The DD series of engines were developed by Daimler with just a little influence from DDC engineering. The Detroit Diesel transmissions and axles are just rebadged Daimler products.
Jeff, the 8.2L had "a problem." If the late, but venerable Roy Law were still with us, he would identify "the little problem" for you in detail...
you're just flat wrong. there's many components that are shared with Daimler Trucks Europe but DDC engineering does massive amounts of work to design these engines specifically for north america.
I didn't hear any mention of Gray Marine or really anything about GMC Diesel. I worked on US Navy river boats (WW2 vintage) that had 6-71's with Gray Marine and /or GMC Diesel labels on the rocker arm covers and other parts. Any parts we replaced came out of Detroit boxes. I loved working on those engines
I run a Detroit 4-53T daily in my F350 and love it. Easy to work on and parts a cheap.:)
Worked with 53 & 71 Series generators & marine, simple & reliable, loved them. Later worked with the 16v92 marine it was a disaster.
I love the video! Especially because I work for a Detroit diesel distributor, I think you should touch on the mbe engines and the current off highway MTU engines that originated from Detroit.
Great reading the comments of people that worked on these. Very interesting history tHanks all
The 92 series was missing. I already talked to Demand Detroit, they told me that the sale of 46.7% of the shares to Crysler was a shot in its own foot. Unfortunately. DETROIT DIESEL 2 STROKE IN THE VEIN!!!!!
Yellow Coach built 1,256 units of model 743 (Silversides) produced between 1937 and 1939 for Greyhound. GM became majority owner in 1925 and total owner in 1943.
Detroit Diesel engine's fame exploded with a 2-stroke model that could be assembled with its injecting pump on one side or the other, along with the inherited ability of the 2-stroke engines to rotate in either direction.
They were fabulous for marine use. Especially for fast boats. Bundled in pairs counter rotating engines saved the gyroscopic effect and them being possible to be assembled on one side or the other the "mechanics" always was installed to the inner side of the ship, making it much accessible for troubleshooting.
One point that is missed here is that because they were two cycle engines they were usually smaller and lighter than the same power output four cycle engines which is why they were so popular in areas where unit size was an issue. This is why they were found in most post war buses.
The Detroit 8V71 is one of the most powerful engines I've worked on. That thing accelerates like a dirt bike.
Earlier today I was working on a Military Humvee with the 6.5 Detroit Diesel in my Autos class and it just so happens this video gets posted.
With all the train talk I had forgotten I was watching an automotive video channel!
You forgot to mention the 92 series of Detroit 2 strokes. Those engines had water circulating around the cylinder sleeves, where the 71 series cylinder sleeves transferred the heat to the block
for cooling. The 92 series engines were all V configurations.
Series 60 was the first Semi truck engine to be fully electronically controlled.
Back in the early 80 we had 12 V 149 ,2 stroke pump motors built be DETROIT, WE USED THEN IN THE ALBERTA OIL FIELDS
Missed the 92 series. 6V92 and 8V92 were very popular.
Left out the 92 series, and the silver series within each group. And there was a series 50 before the 60 when they went 4stroke the 53 series had so many combinations 2cyl 3 4 6 v6 v8
Swap the camshaft and the 2stroke engines can run backwards. Really awesome content but you vs an go on for hours how much they accomplished and what they were used in.
The Continental Trailways NEW Silver Eagle coach in the photo was originally built with Cummins NRTO inline 6 engines. Continental really liked the power of these engines but they were very thirsty and very noisy, which passengers hated. 85 of these were built but the last ones were shipped from the factory of La Brugeoise et Nivelles in Belgium without engines. As the DD 8V-71's finally arrived, they were installed into the NEW Silver Eagles at the Houston shops of Continental and the older coaches were
also changed to the new 8-V 71 engines. All of Continental's rigid buses built earlier by Setra in Germany also got the 8-V 71 to replace the earlier M A N engines
originally in these buses. Greyhound did not get any new buses with the 8-V 71 until it's first orders of GMC PD 4106 and MCI MC-5 in the mid-60's. Greyhound's
PD 4501 Scenicruiser fleet had it's twin 4-71 engines replaced with a single 8-V 71 engines starting in 1961.
GM did this to itself, an unforced error. All they had to do was cast up some new engine blocks and design some gaskets as all the internals were identical to those in the 6-71 engines.
And long haul truckers hated the two stroke engines because they used more fuel than the four stroke engines.
Pretty well done, but you missed two things: 1.) the Series 92 engines which basically replaced the 110 as their big engines and became quite popular and well respected. Still being raced today. 2.) Buss's - 8V92's powered more buss's than you can shake a stick at. At one time almost all highway and muni buss's had Detroits. Many went 1M miles 😀
A mention of the Detroit powered semi trucks on the Bonneville Salt Flats would have been fun to include.
Winton engines were used for the very first diesel electric locomotives. You can easily call them the parent company of the EMD/Detroit diesel.
The blower is more accurately called a scavenging pump, not a super charger. It doesn't add boost because it's blowing straight through the exhaust valves. If I recall correctly, the exhaust closes slightly before the intake, but it doesn't push much boost from that, especially if another cylinder in the engine is scavenging at that time.
From the 53s 71s stepped up to the 92 and even 129s the 71 was 71 cubic inches per cylinder.. and 92 was 92 cubic inches per cylinder and yes thats is where the supercharger got its name from as 4/71 was on the 4 cylinder 71 2 strokes and the 6/71 was on the 6 cylinder 8/71 on the 8 cylinder all the way up to 24/71 which I'm pretty sure was just 2 12/71s I'm.not 100% on that so yea forgive If I'm wrong and also they have supercharged and turbo 2 stroke 6v 8v 16v 92s my old boy has been managing a detroit branch here in Australia for the past 10yrs absolute beautiful company 💪🏻
Well done, a good history lesson in 12 minutes.
One minor correction: 5:00 The sun is powered by nuclear fusion. Little Boy and Fat Man were both fission devices. Thermonuclear bombs are orders of magnitude more powerful. (See Castle Bravo). I very much enjoy your videos. 🙂
the 8V71 is one of the most prolific engines next to caterpillar, MAN and Cummins
Neat little fact. the 71 series was made in 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, 6v, 8v configurations. The 12v where two 6v's literally bolted together, just one technically spun backwards, same with the 16v, just two 8v's bolted together.
My dad ran Detroit , irun Detroit... i love Detroit👏👏👏🙏🙏🙏
I have a DD 703TE2 3 cyl intercooler turbo 55kW in my Antonio Carraro vineyard tractor. 6000 hours and still working like new.
Thermo King refrigerator units at wide open throttle 40,000 hours Kubota diesel
this is on tractor, not refrigator 😂
I noticed that you didn’t mention the 92 series engine. My understanding is that the 92 was a 71 block reconfigured to a bigger wet sleeve.
I had a 6-53 once. Limited power and the nick name "leaktroit" fit well. But it was reliable.
You left out the 92 series the 149 series it’s Mtu line
But I still liked it. Good job.