Cheap vs Expensive Hunting Rifles: Ya don't always get what ya pay for!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 มิ.ย. 2024
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0:00 Introduction
0:19 O ESTABLISHED TITLES
2:40 accuracy
5:14 stock quality
7:46 creature comforts
9:57 trigger quality
11:48 metals - กีฬา
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Ohh sweet!!! I am dying to see that 7mm PRC working and performing!!
you do realize left handed people exist right sling if sling stud were all on the side it puts the bolt straight in to your back!!!!
@@Perry2186 most put the QD inserts on both sides so you can sling it to whichever works for you.
I have a Ruger American predator and have never gotten very good groups with it and i even put a Vortex Strike Eagle on it but still no good... Any tips
Backfire: could you do a review on the Norma Bondstrike Extreme 6,5 Creedmoor 143gr and seeking ph2 havoc rifle?
I’m 60 years old, been hunting since I was a young teenager. Also been a firearms instructor since 1985, a lot of things in this video you mentioned are going to be very valuable to a lot of people, nice 👍👍
I am a year or 2 older and my 12 gauge Ted Williams shot gun works just fine. paid 129 bucks for it. Thank you.
@@wellgreatengineeringltd3884 probably has been gathering dust old timer.
my primary deer rifle cost $99.00 when I bought it about 35 years ago. An H&R Handi rifle in 30-30 Win. COUNTLESS deer have fallen to it in the Ga. woods . I put a TASCO 3x9 x30 scope on it , zeroed it to hit 1 inch high at 100 yards and to this day I have never had to zero it again.. I load 150 grain Nosler Ballistic tips to just under 2000 fps and it puts the first 5 into a group of less than an inch at 100 yards. the open slightly as the barrel warms..
This load give a complete pass through on anything I will be shooting with it. I have H&K ,, Winchester , Mauser,, Steyr, Remington,, SIG,, Carl Gustov and various other makes and calibers but this is my hunting rifle and I will not change.
It is Light ,plenty powerful and extremely accurate. I carry a Glock 27 as my Coyote gun . I see them while hunting and a.40 S&W round is cheaper than my loads in 30-30 . I would hunt anything in the US lower 40 with this setup except Elk and Grizz.
BUT I do have an H&R Shikari in 45-70 for big stuff.😁..
I see come of these videos of people shooting animals ay 700+ yards. Well I say that is NOT hunting..that is shooting. There is nothing Fair Chase about anything over 100 yards or so.
I do not condemn them on their methods, but it is just not Hunting. And those guys use some freakin high dollar gear.
They just need to work on their stalking skills and save a lot of money by getting close to their game.. Even at 57 years old
I can still stalk to within 50 yards of a Whitetail.
The world is poorer since H&R's demise. The Handy Rifle and the Topper shotguns were utilitarian & inexpensive.
I bought a Howa rifle for $350 in 2019 and it’s a great rifle, it was more but went on sale. It still works great,
I still rock the same Howa 1500 in .30-06 I bought in 2011 for like $330 and she still shoots lights-out.
Love my Howa. Definitely an undervalued rifle in the US at least.
There is certainly a lot more in a rifle than meets the eye. Reliability is often over-looked. Too much emphasis is placed in precision. The average shooter could win most any PRS match if they could maintain 1-1.25 MOA in all positions. Few shots on game take sub-MOA shooting. But it’s the focus of many.
I’ll take an MOA gun with consistent groups and consistent cold-bore over a half minute gun that always throws a flyer cold-bore before it settles in.
Many times, it is the reliability, consistency, and ease of use that make or break a hunt.
@@TrolloTV it’s a system; impossible to be isolated.
@@graynotescartridgebox you think shooters who take PRS matches seriously are average? Let alone a rifle shooting 1.25 MOA at best would take the win?
Man lemme tell ya, I have been shooting competition for a couple of years in F-Class and PRS and my rifles consistently shoot 1/4 MOA or better and there are still PRS stages that I can't clear due to the positional instability. If you were to take a 1.25 MOA rifle to a PRS match, getting top 80 would be a chore. Those guys aren't average shooters, they are far above average shooters. A pro actually tested this theory and came to a match with a hunting rifle that shot sub-MOA. He usually placed top 5, but he barely made the top 60 that day.
There is a reason PRS Setup's can cost upwards of 10,000$ not just accuracy but positional stability and balance are the biggest factors.
@@OneSvT I didn’t say say they take 1.25 MOA rifles. I said if THEY maintain 1.25 MOA. It’s a system between shooter, rifle, and ammunition. They cannot be separated.
The shooter is the limiting factor.
The titles thing is a scam I'm sorry to say mate, the Scottish parliament is on record as explicitly not recognising people with just land as Lords. This service is the equivalent of those 'Name a Star' scams where it's just recorded on a piece of paper somewhere but nobody actually recognises it or calls it that.
About time someone sees it as it is
It’s legit enough for the type of bozo that wants to call himself a lord
@@Notjay95 fr, only people that are dumb would actually spend money on those
@@Notjay95…on his “douche-dating site” 😂
How much did it cost you? 🤔 😝
Great video. Your perspectives from the low end to the hi end were right on right on target. As for the Ruger American Ranch... I just mounted a 3X9X40 scope w/ 1 inch tube and used low rings. No issues with cheek or and sight picture. Thanks for posting your video.
Thank you for the thorough detailed explanations! Makes it make a lot of sense.
I really enjoy the side mounted flush cups on a rifle stock, to me it makes the rifle a lot easier to carry. I have a Howa and a Tikka, the howa has cost me almost as much as the Tikka because of the upgrades to the stock and the trigger. I get half moa accuracy out of both with handloads.
Definitely a lot of food for thought for anyone looking to pick up that next hunting rifle. Great stuff as always 👍
I really appreciate your insight on these different classes of guns. I do hunt the back country but I do prefer a little heavier rifle. I have shot the light rifles and with the calibers I shoot they just are not something I want to shoot. Mid tier is really where it's at for me. I don't have the patience to deal with issues of any kind so I ruled out the high end guns as well as the low end. I want a rock solid dependable system. The weight, look, price, and even trigger are all secondary to rock solid dependability.
My brother from another mother :)
You said it best.
That's exactly what I want.
Greetings from Greenland.
This is a wonderful review! Spot ON! Thank you for making this video. ❤
Great points mentioned here. I look at a rifle as a tool and you must have the proper tool for the task at hand. I hunt anything from varmints to deer sized game and hunt from tree stands, ground blinds, ladder stands ect. I have a "tool" I use in each situation and most rifles I have are budget priced but i do have some wallet bruisers also. All rifles have their good and bad aspects but most modern rifles either mass produced or hand built in a custom shop have their targeted buyers. I agree with channel owner that a medium priced rifle will serve you better than a entry price level rifle as the fit and finish is better. I have noticed most budget brand rifle makers are slowly designing these rifles with some creature comfort items. If a budget priced rifle is all you can afford, by all means do a little research and get what will be the best all around caliber to handle the task. The old tried and true .243 Winchester is an excellent choice for varmint up to whitetail size game. It's nice to have expensive rifles but it is not necessary and by all means not required. I have found that an expensive rifle and optics give you more confidence on a hunt but I have killed more game with big box store rifles. Just my 2 cents worth.
The last budget rifle vid and review of the CVA cascade helped me purchase my Weatherby Vangaurd and CVA Cascade. I still can’t believe the CVA value vs. other brands for features.
Best channel of info and backfire website i prooved alot of people wrong on which caliber beats which in flat shooting
Hey Jim, Weatherby just announced today, the .338 RPM in the back country Ti, with an 18” barrel. Weighs 5lbs. Seems like something you’d be into. Pricey, but basically the perfect back country rifle.
You will also have more customer service calls and warranty repairs on the high end, because people who pay premium prices are less likely to work around any imperfections. When you pay for top shelf you expect higher attention to detail.
“Don’t drop guns” words to live by
When it comes to cheap rifles I love my marlin xl7, my favorite rifle is my model 70 with a high gloss stock. Beautiful look and a classic gun.
I use a savage axis 2 6.5 creedmore very accurate and reliable plus pretty cheap
Cheaper rifles tend to use an older style stock, back when iron sights were more common. That's why you have issues getting a good cheek weld on cheaper rifles. The idea was to get your eye in line with a sight that is maybe half an inch above the top of the barrel.
Now, the vast majority of bolt action rifles don't even come with iron sights or even a way to easily add them, yet they still use the old style of stock. Most don't even come with a rail to mount a scope on. Once you've added a scope base, rings and a scope, you have a sight that is likely an inch higher than what iron sights would have been.
Personally, I don't like stocks that don't have tool-less adjustable LOP and cheek piece.
If you have one of these cheap stocks and you can't afford to buy a better one, you can always build up the cheek piece with some craft foam and slick-backed tape. It looks ugly as hell, but it works.
Great advice. Going to you on a rifle with a great stock that fits you well you'll never compromise again.
The problem too with the rifle shown is the 20 MOA flat base rail sitting on top. A typical 2 piece weaver mount more commonly found on rifles offers a lower scope mount thus eliminating this issue entirely. It's partly why on many Mossbergs like the one displayed they ditched the one piece rail and went back to a 2 piece mount.
I have a gun that has ability to have both scope and a stock on, my Remmington (forgot number) Varmint Hunter 243. The gun was made for hunting varmints and coyote/deer where the last two need a scope but some other larger varmint/small game they need sights like fox, badger and others. I do want to remove the sight since I have a not great Nikon one for anyone with glasses on even though it was supposed to be okay for that. At a place I can hunt now, I can use my Youth Remington 870 with wood stock as the deer come that close.
You can also make your own kydex adjustable cheek riser for cheap, or even buy a nice one for under $50.
I wish these cheap rifle manufacturers would modernize their stock shapes, they’d be so much better. But that would cut into sales of their premium rifles so I think it won’t be changing any time soon.
But some company like savage could absolutely destroy the competition in budget rifles if they made the cheek piece higher and flattened the fore end, and added these quick sling attachments on the side. It cost virtually nothing and it’d be and excellent gun.
" and the award for the most random commercial plug goes to.."
I love how your dog is just longingly looking outside, ignoring you and the video camera. He just wants to go outside in the wind. Either that, or he is just watching to see if a cow or house fly by. Lol....love the video and the comparisons. I have many of the same rifles you review, and I find that many of your findings are accurate with my rifles of the same manufacturer. Thanks for what you do. Any chance you could do a video comparing some ground blinds for rifle hunting?
Those sling studs are traditionally placed there for a reason. Your gonna have a pack on your back, not a rifle. You sling the rifle over your shoulder. Its also there so you can take a more accurate shot using a sling wrap hold.
Exactly.
Yeah, I can't think of a reason I'd have my rifle on my back. Pain to get it ready in time when I need it. Off the shoulder it's pretty fast.
Only rifle I ever had fall off my shoulder was one that had QD sling attachments. The top QD let go, for whatever reason, and the rifle dropped on a big flat rock muzzle down. 😫
I’m a huge fan of sling studs for hunting rifles.
Y’all have helped me a lot with what I’ve been looking for for the my rifle and cartridge to deer hunt with and possibly elk hunt with in the future. Thank you guys for the informational videos.
What did you end up getting? Me and my brother want to get into hunting.
@@brockn5554 I got a Howa 1500 in 308 Winchester. I love it.
I totally agree!! What you said is exactly what I have found. I guess that's why 80% of my rifles fall into that mid level rifle. A hunting rifle.. one of my favorites is the Franchi rifle by Benelli. Great feeling and 3/4 moa. Great butt pad. Cerocoted ... threaded..ect...
Really good advice and review. Best advice is don't drop guns I agree. Love to see a bit of a review on the euro straight pulls like the Blaser, New Beretta BRX1, Vs the Savage? Also the Benelli Lupo? How does that compare? Pricey guns but some pretty good quality.
Spot on. If you are into guns and handle a lot of them, you will know immediately when you pick up a quality built rifle. That said, you can have problems with them too like he indicated. The bedding is very important with rifles for consistent accuracy which is also something to consider. Materials are important. I don't mess with really cheap rifles because I use my equipment hard and why trust a 5,000. hunt on a cheap built rifle.
Great video. 🎥🎬 Thanks Jim.
Thank you Jim. I have recently become interested in the CVA Cascade. Your review played a big part in that along with shooting More deer with a CVA Muzzleloader than any other gun. Please begin adding it to your lineups if possible, just to help us see how it compares. It’s kind of weird since price wise it hits right between the low and medium rifles.
He reviewed it already, great value. 👍
I have a CVA Cascade in 65 creedmoor that I wasn't planning on buying but my brother talked me into it and I am super glad and happy that I did you won't be disappointed
The CVA Cascade is hands down the best budget rifle out there. For the price range, you can’t beat it. I went into Sportsman’s Warehouse with a $1,200 budget on a rifle only, and walked out with a $600 rifle with a fantastic scope to go along with my new CVA. It’s been a tack driver and the action only gets better the more you shoot it. It compares with the $1,000 rifles all day long.
@jimedick9496 did you get a cva in a 308? I'm in same boat. I don't wanna spend 1200 $ for rifle only. What are your top 3 rifles? I'm from PA
I hunt with a sub-$400 Remington 783 in .270 that's topped off with a $200 Leupold VX-2 scope and I never fail to fill my tags and almost always get heart shots. In fact, I've gone on to name my rifle "Formality" because it's just a matter of time before I drag something out of the woods and I've hunted in near 90 degree temps all the way down to sub-zero conditions, on sunny days, in the rain and under snow & ice storms.
Life is easy; Learn your weapon, buy from reputable manufacturers, use quality ammo, take care of your equipment and aim small. We're in the golden age of firearms manufacturing right now and the men who settled this country would kill for a $400 bolt action rifle that can be picked up at Walmart within minutes that we take for granted these days.
Golden age indeed... I often think about how people in the 1500-1700 would view the quality of our modern day firearms AND how many we can afford to buy.
Not all 783s are the same the heavy barrel threaded with tac bolt handle ones were 400 plus a couple years ago. Basically sub $600.
I got an old Remington 7mm 770 after I returned from Iraq... all I wanted was a rifle to deer hunt with. I tried about three different brands and found what it liked and it has been one of my favorites!
@@tommybrannon As long as the deer don't get back up and say that it doesn't count because it's not a $2000 rifle, who cares, right?
Hitting them right with a $400 rifle is just as good as hitting them right with a $2000 rifle.
Exactly, I know several hunters that use the old Winchester 70 and kill animals year after year, is this model considered a cheap, medium, high?
Best bolt gun out of the box is a Tikka hands down. Very reasonably priced and the accuracy and butter bolt can’t be beat.
Ruger American v2 😎
I have to say, the savage axis heavy barrel model in 6.5creemoor is one that is great for accuracy, didn’t rust once (it was a rode hard and put away wet kind of rifle), and I only had three complaints for a under 400 dollar under 1/4 moa gun. The stock is horrible, flexible as hell. It has kind of a weak extractor, but I could use that to my advantage not having to search for brass. And finally, the trigger plain sucked, at just over 4 pounds adjusted all the way down. I took the accutrigger blade out, and got the trigger to just under 3 pounds and it took out all the creep. Also the accutrigger blade being in made the trigger lock up just cycling the bolt. It’s at its new home with a very good friend who needed a new hunting rifle. That rifle with a Timney trigger and a Boyd’s varmint stock would have been badass.
Now I have a weatherby TRR in 6.5 creedmoor, it has a fiberglass stock, and it is way better out the box, and I got it for under 600 bucks new.
For the barrel rust. I put the lightest goat of grease or oil on the outside of the barrel. It’s saved my shotgun in the salt marshes duck hunting and in the rainy deer and pig hunts.
I’ve been banging on about this for ages, and it just gets proven or confirmed time and time again. Too many people think that if they buy a mega-dollar rifle, they wil just go out and shoot little groups with consummate ease all day long. It’s the same with trapshooting: buy the most expensive gun you can, and all the accessories, and you will be a winner: what a load of rubbish. Some if the best shots I’ve seen or shot with had shotguns you could buy easily with a week’s pay, and they shot rings around a lot of blokes with shotguns that cost the GDP of a small country. Learn to shoot first, then worry about the rest later. Good vid Mate; lots of common sense there. Cheers from Down Under.
I bought my first deer rifle, a Savage "package gun" in 30-06 caliber, 30 plus years ago, for around $329. Still using it and it still drives tacks.
My 1sy was a savage 3006 it was 199 bucks in 1987
Same. Savage 111 long action in .30-06. bought it used and been shooting it since 2004. Still my favorite hunting rifle. Even stretched it's legs out to 1100 yards. All I did was glass bed the action and barrel lug and put it on a choate precision stock. Put a Leupold mark 4 on it and I love it
For the money it is hard to beat a savage
It drives tacks..but...Can it drive a clutch?
Same, seems to do just fine on the deer I’ve shot.
Thank you for today's content.
I am looking forward to 7 mm PRC! Would you mind comparing it with 7 mm SAUM?
Stoked to learn more about the 7mm prc
I’ve got a savage axis xp2 that has never failed and drives absolute tacks and I don’t have any issues with the rust or anything at all, now I did notice that the trigger was a bit heavy but I took it out, changed the springs polished everything and then added a Nikon scope and it shoots better than most people’s rifles I’ve seen..
I would like to see a comprehensive list of rifles in the three categories and how you rate each one.
How true. Don't always get better with more cost and some less cost are better than "high end".
Love the content. Keep it coming. 👌
I would love to see a video about buying an older rifle just for the action and building what you want!
Great video so much knowledge thank you
TC Compass II .308 Win. Guaranteed 1 MOA accuracy on the first three shots. Fresh out of the box after bore sighting - 1/2 MOA at a 100 yard outdoor range measuring 1/2 inch with my tape measure. And it averages 1/2 MOA with the right ammo (Federal Fusion 165 gr.)
Guaranteed trigger (non adjustable) 3 to 4 pounds. Mine is 2 lbs 7.7 ounces. And a company that rhymes with N Barbo makes a spring kit to go lower, if desired.
I paid $400 + free shipping + $35 transfer fee. Cheap and accurate with guarantees.
In addition, not only was my Compass II cheap and the factory trigger is light but still useful for hunting (I could change to M Carbo kit if I wanted a 1 lb pull), I put mine in an Oryx chassis. I like chassis systems. I do have a slip on recoil pad that aids the original and non-giving pad. And a muzzle brake, and going no bigger than .5 MOA. The factory synthetic stock was good with the included metal pillar bedding.
Chassis and other metal pillar bedding will always be superior. Where I am drawing exception is around 07:42 ish. Where the Oryx chassis can make it seem like you are a better shooter than you are. Let me borrow your own experience with the Mossberg Patriot as a fine example of stock making all the difference, regardless of what kind of shooter that you are. You were getting spreads of 4 to 5 MOA. I know Mossberg does not have an accuracy guarantee. I have three of their pieces, including a Patriot. I did not have accuracy that bad but it could be better and is now for good for 1 MOA in the MDT LSS Gen 2 chassis. For one thing, in the chassis, you can tighten down to the 50 or 60 in-lbs torque on the action screws.
You cannot do that with the Mossberg synthetic stock. First, the plastic mag well is used as a spacer. Another moving part causes more problems.
Second, it is all plastic, no metal pillars, so your screws are grinding against plastic.
Third and most importantly, the rear action screw guide in the stock has a gap. I thought I had broken it while torquing down. I did crack the mag well. But, it turns out, the stock is made that way and I do not know why. All I know is you can never tighten down the rear of the action as you should be able to do so. This will allow the rear of the action to move, using the front action screw as a fulcrum. I think that is what the problem is with your Patriot. They may have taken the barrel and action out and placed in a frame and tested at 1 MOA or less. Then, put it back in the same cheap stock and you get the same performance. On the wood stocks, that is also going to be a problem. Since I put mine in a chassis, it is consistently no more than 1 MOA, even after 60 rounds with no rest other than the time it takes to reload the magazine.
TLDR, changing to a chassis like the Oryx makes the rifle as shootable as it should be, regardless of the experience of the shooter.
I can attest to a lot of this. I recently upgraded from a 1st Gen Savage Axis to a Weatherby Vanguard, and the differences are night and day.
So you just upgraded to a Howa 1500. It's the same gun.
@@codym2903 same action. Weatherby makes their own stocks and barrels for it.
Yeah there’s a lot more to a gun than just if it can shoot accurately.
I will admit I loved modifying my axis on a budget to get it shooting really well, but at the end of the day a nicer rifle will work better in every way and cost less.
For me though, a trigger kit, sanding some material from the fore end, bolt lift kit, cheap cheek riser, polishing up the action, made the rifle an excellent shooter. Still suffered from a flexible stock, bad magazine, and small missing features but to upgrade those would just be stupid when I could get a tikka for the price of the axis + mods. Fun project though and surprisingly excellent results. Majority of the mods to make it a great gun are free or cheap.
@@Chevsilverado I tried a new trigger, and a new, pillar bedded stock. First shot with a cold barrel was accurate, but after that it was all over the place. I think the barrel just did not like being warm, at all. You'd have to let it sit for at least 15 minutes between shots to get better than a 3" group out of it.
Bought a $500 Savage 111 trophy hunter in .270 win. Tagged my first bear at 120 yards. At the range it'll do 1inch groups all day with Core lokt 150gr. Also likes the Non-typical cartridges.
Another thing to note about triggers:
You can get a lot of trigger kits for cheap triggers that come with springs to bring the pull all the way down to around 2 pounds. Even on rifles that have like 5-6lb trigger pulls from the factory.
Great, HOWEVER, the overall design and tolerances of the trigger can make it impossible to actually make the trigger pull that light without being dangerous. Trying to bring a savage axis trigger down to 2 lb can absolutely cause the rifle to fire if it’s dropped even from a small height. Some of them are adequately safe with a light trigger if the tolerance gods favour you, but don’t go thinking you can modify a stock trigger to make it super light, and at least drop check the rifle rigorously before you go hunting.
I’ve modified a handful of cheap triggers in the past and they all have to be above 3lb to ensure they don’t go off with a drop or with slamming the bolt handle down. Still a really good trigger weight, but it’s something to keep in mind.
I'm shooting a Savage Axis (Gen 1) 6.5 Creedmoor no Accu-trigger that I bought for $300.00 after rebate, with a Nikon Buck Master II BDC reticle, and a Harris Bi-Pod. With Hornady Match 140 grain Sub 1 MOA at 100 yards, Sub 1.5 inch at 200 yards, and Sub 2.5 inch MOA at 300 yards. It's not always the rifle, its the setup, ability to dial in your optic, breathing & trigger pull, and matching the best ammo for your barrel length and distance of shooting. I seen great shooters out shoot amateur shooters on a cheap rifle while the amateurs have 1000s into the rifle and optics...Master your trade and you don't need a "Gucci" gun....
My early years hunting was with an old 30-30. I bought my first "all-around" hunting rifle in 1995...a Ruger M77 MARK II with a Burris 3x9 Fullfield scope. I often wonder if I should maybe upgrade, but it knocks anything over in Texas like a ton of bricks, and has hit what I aimed at...so I still have the old set-up.
I’ve been hunting with a Ruger American Ranch in 7.62x39 for the last two years. Took my 1st deer with it last November. With cheap steel cases soft point it shoots 1-1.25moa at 100 yards. With quality hunting soft point it will shots .75 moa at 100. It’s light weight and easy to maneuver around the thick woods if NEPA. I also have the American Predator in .308 and that’s equally as accurate but not as handy. I’m disabled so the lightest weight package is what I need and why I went with a 16” rifle.
I agree. I've had the compact 5.56 and the predator .308 for over 10 years. . Both ate sub moa guns and under$500. My only regret is that they are the flush mags. I like the updated version with the better mags but oh well.
@@1drunkdog For the 223/5.56 I believe you can call Ruger and get the conversion insert so you can run standard AR mags. It's not listed under their part section, you have to call. I know Magpul was working on something for the ,308 as well or you can put that in one of their stocks.
@@zachaddington5264 The 700 has been a corner stone for American bolt actions for decades. There make an excellent base to build on for precision and long range shooters for years. More recently Remington had several years of poor manufacturing and QC so they have fallen out of favor. I wouldn’t hesitate using it purchasing one.
@@zachaddington5264 In that price range there are a lot of good choices. I would do a good about of research on the quality of current product 700’s before I drop that. When Remington was under the freedom group they had several recalls in their 700’s as well as accuracy issues with their barrels. That was around 2008-2015 if I’m remembering correctly. I’d definitely look into Tilka.
confidence in a rifle . cheap or expensive is the biggest key no questioned asked. i have shot peoples rifles i could not shoot for nothing and they shoot it great. confidence is key.
I Have been using a Ruger American with a Boyd stock for white tail 6.5 cm and have taken a deer @ 275 walking without taking a step... adjusted trigger to 2lbs with some gunsmith help. Just bought a Sig Cross been testing scopes..I was seeing a difference in chambering my hand loads as I test some that would chamber in the Ruger but not the Sig was confused on why and you have educated me thnaks
I’ve been hunting with a Ruger American Ranch in 7.62x39 for the last two years. Took my 1st deer with it last November. With cheap steel cases soft point it shoots 1-1.25moa at 100 yards. With quality hunting soft point it will shots .75-1 moa at 100. It’s light weight and easy to maneuver around the thick woods of NEPA. I also have the American Predator in .308 and that’s equally as accurate but not as handy. I’m disabled so the lightest weight package is what I need and why I went with a 16” rifle.
Well done as always!
You get what you pay for(mostly), but if we are talking about something purely for hunting there is a point I’d say around 1k-1.5k that you will begin to see diminishing returns really fast. However that applies to the determined hunter, the casual go out and hunt 5-10 days a year guy will see diminished returns after 500-600 pre optic.
Always has great info and not pushing super expensive gear
I learnt so much from your vids. Thank you so much.
Over the years I have owned and still own many rifles. I still own multiple M70 Super Grades, Browning Gold Medallions and White Gold Medallions, etc. Admittedly, I’m traditional and I still like hunting rifles with wooden furniture. With that said, on opening morning of rifle season the last three years I took my Tikka T3x Roughtech with me. Is it an heirloom? Nope. It just shoots better than any rifle I’ve ever owned.
Well done I learned a lot. Thanks
Man I have the opportunity to own really hi end rifles custom built to my desired, when I was single,but I tell you what (tikka rifles are hard to beat) they shoot so well and is my rifle to go any were now,for the fraction of the cost.
I know you don't apparently like them, but the TC Compass is one low end that I'm really enjoying, minus the stock. So I bought the 7mm Rem. Mag and an extra magazine. I put a 6-24x44 Konus Pro Mildot scope on it and a Boyd's Featherweight thumbhole stock on it with a nice sling and a $20 compensator which is nice and thin. I have sub $600 bucks into this thing and it shoots lights out. Never failed to chamber a round and never failed to feed. The 5r rifling and the 1moa guarantee along with a lifetime warranty, really makes me think you have under estimated this rifle FOR those who need to keep costs down. It comes with a threaded barrel and is slightly shorter at 22". I'm buying my first suppressor this fall and will be using the same one for suppressed subsonic .308, full power .308 and 7mm magnum full power loads. So it's really nice to have the threaded barrel also at this price point. I will say that I purchased the stock at the same time as I ordered the rifle, because I hate all synthetic stocks for the most part and really cannot stand chassis stocks. This one from Boyd's is a really nice feel and finish for sub-$200.
Yeah, I've got one in 204 Ruger I bought for sub $300 and it is my go-to varmint gun. I put a cheap Boyds stock on it and put a spring kit in the trigger and it shoots .60" to .75" groups all day with several different bullets.
@@locomike102 I threw together some 243 rounds for mine using the cheap speer 100 gr. bullets , 47,5 grs. 4831 done a 3 shot just under .40 I done the spring kit , thinking of doing a Boyds Stock this under $300 gun matches of outshoots all my other guns , my Weatherby's being the worst on all counts . this was a slightly better than average for it, but shoots about anything good , Also it's Winchester style safety is one of the best , the one on my Xbolt being my favorite ,
Sitting on the couch and randomly thought "I wonder what that one guy from Income School is up to". I really enjoyed seeing the success of this channel. Congrats.
I literally can't agree with the first statement more! Cheap rifles have problems and lots of them, but so do the fancy ones I know from experience, then you got x bolts and 700s and model 70s etc thats middle guns u can run 100 years and shoot killer out of the box that's problem free. I 10000% back that
If you get the chance, buy a Blaser R93 or R8. You can change caliber within seconds. The scope is mounted directly on the barrel, so it is no receiver on the gun. Straight pull action with LOADS of calibers, you can use the same bolthead for dozens of calibers. Mini, Standard & Magnum.
4/5 guys (hunters) own one where I live. I just held one yesterday and no matter how much hype they have, or how much I want to convince myself they're great, they just don't feel right... Idk, may be just me. Most guys do love them.
I think what you’re getting at here and in many of your videos, but having trouble saying it, is at what point on these rifles are we seeing the diminishing returns in accuracy, features, quality, etc for the dollars spent. And how good of a value each price point of rifle is.
You certainly make the points about value for each rifle. Personally I think the greatest value lies in the $700-2000 range for a bolt action rifle, with the intent to use it as a hunting rifle but still be able to have some fun at the range with it.
10 yrs ago I bought the Mossberg 4X4 24" in .270 win for $298. With my best reloads it is a .75 moa rifle. Not as accurate as many others but good enough for any hunting. Rifle is 6.5lbs. 5 round detachable magazine. Trigger is a decent 2lbs but at 2 lbs I have a light primer strike every 40-50rds or so (Bosnian hard primers). Stock feels cheap.
All in all I say 4/5 stars compared to all other rifles. For the money 5/5 stars. I've killed many hogs with it and several whitetail deer. It has probably been on 80-100 hunts in It's life. Still holding up great. Bluing is okay
Oh yeah, the recoil is really bad
Thanks, Good information.
Stay awesome!!! Keep making great content!!!
Would you guys be interested in a review of the Franchi Momentum? You’re the #1 channel I trust for reviews! Would love to see an honest pro and con from you guys!
My 8yr old shot a 2.5 inch group @350 yd with his .243 bergara b14 hunter and winchester factory loads. My t3x with factory eldx loads in 6.5cm shot a little under 1.5 inch @350. I don't think I'll ever be able to justify spending more than I have on those 2 rifles
I love my Thompson Center Venture compact in 7 mm 08 1/2-in groups with my reloads and 1-in groups with Factory
I like my Weatherby Vanguard (Howa). Around $600 plus glass and shoots pretty darn good.
This is going to be a good one
Thank you for showing that a systematic process with optimized criterion and thoughtful consideration is certainly more reasonable and effective than the ye old statement, "It was good enough for my pappy and my grand pappy." Principles stay timeless, whereas techniques and technologies change over time. Thanks for the video.
I wondered why the tx200 was sitting there. And yes they have a lovely deep lustre bluing.
7mm PRC!!!! Definitely need to do another 7mm comparison. I’m curious how it’ll stack up to the 7 mag and the 7 saum.
@@Blueberryheadbandd just curious to see where it fits in its performance. Want to have a lighter mountain rifle built probably gonna go with a 7 saum but the PRC sounds interesting lol
Best inexpensive rifle brand I have ever used? Savage. Crazy accurate with handloads, OK with store bought. My most accurate rifle? A custom built Vz24 action chambered in 6.5x55. That gun has a 24" barrel, shoots .5" at 100yds all day, sits in Byoyds stock, nothing fancy, and has a Timney trigger. Did it myself so all in cost? Maybe $800 a decade ago? Has an old Leupold 3-9x40 Rifleman scope. Just a nuts and bolts basic all weather, all terrain, hunting rifle.
Also Weatherby Vanguard
Love my QD flush cups on my Bergara BXR; similar to my AR.
love your videos very awesome. I do have a question though you help up a black camouflage rifle with a vortex scope and suppressor I gotta what kind of gun is that??? Thing looks so cool
I’d love to hear your thoughts on the Sako S20. I recently purchased one chambered in .308 and I’ve been very pleased with it! My wife though? Not so much due to the price tag 😂
I've been wanting to order an S20 for over a year. Tikka roughtech is also a consideration. Would love to hear anything you care to share regarding the s20 .308. sounds like your pleased with it!!
It's been shown that most out of the box entry level bolt actions with good ammo and a good person behind the gun they can shoot 1 MOA out of the box. Mid tier guns you start seeing some accuracy guarantees, with most higher end rifles they usually have them. It's all a matter of the application though in the end.
For example, your point about sling studs.. If you're like me, I don't really bench rest shoot hardly ever. I may do it once in a while if sighting a rifle in at say 200 yards or beyond but I generally free hand prone or free hand crouch when doing this because it's how I actually shoot in the field. I target shoot quite often but I do so in a manner I will practically be using the rifle. I've never had the sling stud problem you mentioned become a problem even when bench shooting. But more importantly, how one carries a rifle when slung can determine comfort. I generally do what is known as African carry and I find it works well with none of the negatives mentioned here.
Not to say that QD mounts aren't smarter or easier to place and remove, but things like a picatinny rail start adding extra weight and cost out of the box. Now, if I'm looking more for a bench rifle or general precision rifle these are features I'd rather have, but in a hunting rifle most of those things are of no use to me or serve very little practical use. I can't say I wouldn't object to a small rail space up front for something like a varmint or predator light when coyote or hog hunting but outside of those specific niches within hunting I wouldn't be using it much myself. Not to say the next man won't so I appreciate the option and idea but I also know most hunters aren't going to care or want it.
Stock quality definitely is something you see get better along typically with triggers in the higher tiers. Especially in stocks that claim to be free floated, I've seen several guns that you can just bare slip paper through and that's cutting it a little close, but on the more expensive rifles it's usually a lot more noticeable on the space one has between the barrel and stock. Triggers though can be debated to an extent as unless you're buying a rifle out of the box with a tuned trigger or the manufacturer sells it with some aftermarket trigger that's proven to be better than most stock triggers, these days you can get an adjustable factory trigger on nearly every entry level rifle save for the Savage Axis(not Axis 2). And nearly all of them have the same level of adjustments for weight ranges. Even the mid tier guns from the same companies tend to offer those same triggers in their guns. However, I have seen enough rifles in the higher tier range that come with triggers much smoother than what you find out of the box fully adjusted to the lightest settings on those entry level guns.
So no, you don't always get what you pay for. But it also depends on what you were expecting in the first place. Savage is a great example of a brand where you see the quality change as you go higher up the price scale. Axis 1 rifles have no adjustable triggers, horrible actions, and cheap scopes. Decent enough as a whole to go hunting but better exists even in their respective price tags. For a bit more, the Axis 2 is the same rifle with a slightly better scope and adjustable trigger, but all other issues remain. Then you get to the 10/110 family of rifles. They resolve most of the Axis problems like the bolt by polishing it, they give spacer sets to increase length of pull if needed, they come with better optics(usually a Vortex), the stocks are definitely better quality and the free floating space between the barrel and stock is better than the previous two. This trend tends to go on with them up to a certain point in their rifle line but it's as I said a good example of where your dollar is going. Plenty of other rifles out there, you don't usually see where your money is going and it gets harder to tell if something is worth the cost or not. At least in the low to mid tier there's usually a noticeable quality difference one can physically see and feel.
OMG I can't wait for the 7mm prc build !!! Where are you getting your brass ??????????????? That's gonna be my next rifle !!
What is your 2022 updated hunting rifles for deer and elk and such and what round for those guns.
So would you say that for the CF barrels, if you were worried about potential delamination (dethreading?), that you could correct this by cerakoteing it?
Unless you like the look of the CF barrel that is?
Would there be application problems with this?
I have no idea if that would be possible and whether the pros would outweigh the cons?
Bear in mind I don't know much about the finer points of larger calibre hunting. I'm British, have done a little hunting (mainly 22LR and 17hmr).
Largest calibre I've shot is 270win from a Sauer with semi-floating barrel, expanding ammunition and a 4-12x56 illuminated ret mil-dot swarovski glass scope at 500m. Best grouping for me was 2rds in the bull and the third with a 9/10 clip (standard A4 sized 10 ring target). Best takedown was an 8pt Muntjac buck at 350m, heartshot, with 1rd.
I'd absolutely love to be able to shoot at a mile, bucket list stuff!
I find your ammunition comparison on more expensive rifles being ammo fussy quite interesting. I've found in the past when I was air rifle hunting - some air rifles are relentlessly pellet fussy. They'd either love and favour the heavy pellets of certain overall shapes and would shoot with same hole accuracy without fail, time after time. Or, they'd just be wildly inaccurate with lighter grain pellets so much that you'd end up putting a hole in the moon and never get a shot on target.
Your videos really fascinate me and I learn more and more every time I watch them. 👍🏻
Thanks for the great content.
(any constructive feedback from either yourself or seasoned shooters in the community would be very enlightening)
I would love to see a review of the winchester model 70 and Ruger hawkeyen
Nice video, very well done. I would like more like these. I have heard from others that well made $900 rifles are as accurate as $2000 rifles, and at some point the gains over price are minimal.
My cousins Savage Axis, with CHEEP CHINESE scope CAN, shoot as well as my vintage rem 700 with a high end leupold. But, the Remington has a nasty trigger. Though my ruger #1 does shoot better. (OH, all 3 are 22-250).
I built a $3k 1,000 yard bench gun and a put down .70 moa @100. Got a cheap savage axis with heavy barrel and bushnell 4x12x40 and never go over .250 @100 with cheap factory ammo 🤷♂️
@@Countryassjim 😆 ain't that some shit
Cheaper rifles are cheaper for a reason. You can customize them to your needs without breaking the bank. Example would be the Ruger American Predator, add a cheek riser, a good scope and and fill the inside of the handguard area with epoxy and it becomes super accurate.
Well don video and I agree with most of what you have said.
Dollar for Dollar the best of the best low to medium priced rifles is undoubtedly the Weatherby Vanguard 2.
The are drop dead accurate, Howa action, and top notch blueing.
From a fantastic comb stock ( not free floated) to the best safety around they rock.
They also scope exactly like REM 700.
I own a number of them and IMO best rifle for the money period.
The also guarantee 1 MOA or less with any quality ammo.
Simply put BEST BANG FOR THE BUCK.
THANKS FOR THE GREAT VIDEO.
Great rifle I bought one in 7/08 for my son about 15 years ago for 225 he has taken about 3 deer a year with it so yes it has paid for it self
That 7mm PRC is going to be awesome!!
Adjustable stock, and trigger is always a plus
Thanks for the information great video can you do some reviews on shotguns coming from Ontario Canada
For decades good shooters have used, without issue, traditional sling stud posts. Proper stock hold and placement on the rest can be done easily.
Thanks!
Every bolt gun will get a scope. Why don't all manufacturers make the stock design so customers get a good cheek weld? It doesn't cost anything. Same thing with a flat bottom on the fore end.
I like the flush cups better too, .Browning used to have flush Pachmyr swivels on them, can't buy those anymore though.
The rifle stock you showed in this video was great, regarding the one with the QD flush cups and the picatinny rail. What brand was that? Thanks for these great videos. Don
Does this mean we should start calling you Lord Harmer? Great video!
Seeing all those rifles laid out on your table in the first moments of the video reminds us of a seized evidence table on some CBC liberal hit piece!
MOSSBERG PATRIOT… 308 I bought one 3 years ago. After many hours of research thru videos,comments on those videos and 308 load data I’ve finally been able to duplicate a couple very good loads and groupings for this 300$ gun. If interested i would be happy to provide you directly with the load data. There were three things i did that were “bolt on” if you will. First i noticed how light the barrel is and with this probably extreme “whip”.. for this i slipped on an X ring ,Limb saver dampener.. Second i notice in all the videos show extreme muzzle jump ,3-4” upward. i guess due to the light weight barrel. For this i installed a Witt machine clamp on muzzle break. Reduced jump and recoil nicely.
Next i checked my action screws. The front was 24 “ pounds, the rear was 21” pounds. I torqued them both to 31#. Too much and you’ll crack the mag well. Now load development.. I wont share here. !5 loads and my best group was .657”. Duplicated. Several around 1.2” -1.4”.
Very positive learned something