Thanks for a good review. I’ll probably keep my pledge as these guys are super responsive to feedback and the game seems to have developed a lot since the prototype, but I’m still glad to watch a review without KS-tinted glasses
Stone Sword Games were just asked about this review on the Kickstarter so, seeing as I am tentatively backing because of KoAs previews in the first place, I thought I’d post their response. From Stone Sword Games: “I haven't seen the review yet but I'm concerned he got a very early prototype and hasn't seen 90% of the game- don't know why he's done a review when the prototype has no; - Signature Cards - Jade Cards - Pre-set decks beyond the mechanical tutorial deck - Focus system - Weapon specific cards I will be posting Gameplay Updates tonight so stay tuned for those! I think we dispel the idea of taking a 3 month old prototype copy as a review copy :)”
@@yview7315 Hi Yview there are a ton of shared cards, shared card lists before the game and a focus system that makes sure there is card transparency- I don't know why my gameplay email to him was ignored.
With that in mind... it would be a nice thing to bring an update demo with those element. As an independant reviewer KOA is well known and respect from gamer (ps I backed the game AND also am a fan of KoA). He could make an update review and this would help your campaign and maybe help prove the point about an early prototype... sad but usually core mechanic and feel aren't the things that change a lot during development...
I think some of the complaints were addressed in final version. For instance, every character has 2 default cards that never leave their hand and can be used every turn (I believe 1 attack and 1 defense). These are their “core” cards that define the character and ensure you’re never without attack/defense options. This review is probably obsolete
Seems I need to pin a post here to clarify a few things as there's a lot of mud being thrown: I was asked if I wanted a copy of the game by SSG. I said yes and said it would be used for an "unboxing/review" so they sent this. I received no email from them and they sent this copy to be reviewed by me and new it was to be reviewed. I mention a stain on the rulebook, that's from the Hungry Gamer. Seems he really was hungry :) The only reason it's age is brought up now is because it was a negative review. Had it been positive, it'd be listed with all the other videos listed under their "Review" header that they are happy to share. Not every game is meant for every person, and that's okay, this one was a miss for me. But please refrain from assuming ill will or misconduct on my part just because I didn't like the game. Stone Sword Games has done a great job with their campaign and I'm sure will make many people happy with their game. I just won't be one of them is all, and again, that's okay. Have a great weekend rockstars!
" I received no email from them"- I'm sorry but this isn't the case from our end at least, it is in my sent folder unless it got lost. Every other previewer/ reviewer has received an email detailing information about the asymmetrical samurai cards and what we are planning to do with the game. You also backed the campaign very early so would have seen this info on the KS page itself. The last reviewer who sent this onto you received the same email and picked up that Samurai were completely different after adding in the Signature Ability Cards. I completely agree to everyone's right to an opinion but you were provided with information that has been missed off the review- and also information that as a backer you must have seen on the KS campaign page. Please come and have a game with Paul and I next week on Tabletop Simulator and you'll see how different the game is from the 3 months old prototype you received. I am sure that even if you end up not liking it, you'll appreciate the changes we have made to the version you received.
I will also say obviously, come and play it again on TTS with Paul and I (James) and if you still dislike it, please leave this video up or dump on the new version - but whether it's a lost email or a missed email- this video doesn't reflect the game hundreds of people have been testing and working on and that does them a disservice.
Reviewers can only discuss copies that are provided to them. All reviewers say that this is a prototype...subject to change. Ultimately though they have to discuss what they like or dislike about the copy of the game in front of them. He didn't dump on the game. He was honest about how he felt the game played at based on the copy he was provided. He even said just because it wasn't for him it doesn't mean others wouldn't enjoy. I'm sure your final version of the game will be much better upon release but I'd rather People be honest about how they feel about a game....which is what he does.
@@stoneswordgames Don't know what to say, I searched my email and nothing. Perhaps it was deleted in error without reading? Honestly can't say except I didn't see it. That being said I did refer to KS things. I referred to Terrain and said that'll be great to add. I referred to the added status effect card and said that'll be welcome as well. I also mentioned the 72 other cards and even gave an example of one of the green cards so I referred to that as well - though it lead me to discuss symbol usage versus words in card games. Let's not pretend that I didn't put a lot of time and effort into this review before sharing my thoughts, because it's not the case at all. :)
@@TheKingofAverage I think the review is on point. What you shown here is what all the other videos are also showing. This is the game that was in this box, like it or not.
This perfectly illustrates a current problem in the industry; it has felt like many publishers are trying to rush their games to Kickstarter while there is still too much development yet to do. Preview copies should be pretty darn close to what they believe the final product will be. At the same time publishers need to be ready to change the game when reviewer and backer feedback shows it's necessary. KOA reviewed what he was given, What else should anyone expect? This is far better than all the hyped preview "reviews" that say how great a game is that ends up not being good.
This is also why I subscribe to KOA even though our taste in boardgames seems wildly different. His honest discussions about what's going on in the industry are worth subscribing for.
Aye a lot of development has apparently happened in the 3 months prior to launch, which is fine. But I only review what they send for me to review. Can't be tracking their week-to-week development updates and certainly can't review it. By the time I got enough game time in with it more development would have changed :) It's no biggie though, happy to share with you guys :)
@@TheKingofAverage No sweat - I view some of their own test-games. The problems you pointed out persist. I have withdrawn my pledge because of that. A 'skilled' warrior not being able to block because i have no block in my hand is a bad design. But I might be able to swallow it if it was a 'Drunken Master' theme or something similar.
I think symbols are just an elegant way to replace text on a card. Symbols are used a lot in other boardgames and it works quite well. So why not in a card game. And to be fair, there are cards in Senjutsu with text on them. Just look at Gameplay Update #1 and #2. If you take the time to explain the symbols, and in Senjutsu you will manage that quickly, a beginner should get a good understanding of what his cards are doing. And if your opponent has a question, he may ask, what does the XY Symbol mean, without showing his card. In Magic or Android Netrunner, where there is a lot of text on the cards, there is always a lot of reading when playing the first time. And that causes more or less downtime. I am really excited for this game. I have a strong thematic feeling of a fight, where the stronger / smarter warrior survives. Your movement and positioning matters a lot, your speed and range matters. You dance around your opponent, you cautiously prepare for a big swing with your Katana, but the opponent just turns away, steps on your weak side and stabs you. You get a bleeding wound and from now on have to discard the top ability card at the start of each round. I really like Unmatched and Senjutsu is better in a couple of ways. Deck Construction adds great variability. KoA had just an early version of the base game. But there are a lot more warriors with different signature cards on the way. The hex field battle map, where positioning and orientation of your character matter! You can react to a degree when revealing your cards, which is a big plus for me. KoA said there is nothing exciting, that the fighters feel the same. Have you seen the card "Flaming Phoenix Arc" from Update #13? You can instantly kill your opponent if you do it right. That's awesome and brings a level of tension to the game. When I see my opponent begins stacking focus tokens, I expect the Flaming Phoenix Arc. But maybe he is bluffing this round, causing me to spend my defense cards, forcing me to change the kamae back to shinto, weakening my defense. Just to unleash the killing blow at the perfect moment.
I think it's telling that he complained about the lack of combos, when this is designed to be a high-tension, crushing mistake game. This isn't King of Fighters, this is Samurai Shodown. When he talks about a card being 'wasted' if you attack and the opponent moves out if the way... yes. That's the whole point.
I appreciate your candor regarding your experience with this prototype, and I think you bring up some very good points. That being said, I could see house-ruling this game quite a bit to fix many of the issues you've raised. The advantages of having a small-scale skirmish/arena-style game that plays in 15-30 minutes is hard to pass up, and the price is really good for what you're getting with all the SGs. Personally, I've house ruled the heck out of a few games which were super-popular with the masses but I just couldn't play with our group; the house rules usually help to fix the minor problems with the game to make it more pleasing to our tastes. For example, instead of just drawing up to 5 cards, maybe draw up to your hand-limit + one additional for each of your enemies on the battlefield, then return extra cards down to your hand-size back to the draw deck, and then shuffle it. Then take the rest of your turn as normal. Additionally, to help alleviate the issue of not having the ability to move or attack whenever you want... another house rule could be, if you want to do a thing and you don't have the right cards in your hand, you could play any card + shuffle a stun card into your draw deck (for a future stun effect, not immediate) -- doing this could allow you to automatically take any two basic actions back-to-back (move, rotate, attack for 1 wound). So you could double move in any direction, rotate once or twice in a direction, and/or issue a single, front-facing, attack for 1 wound at an initiative of 5, for example. Of course, I haven't play-tested this, so I don't know how it might fix or break the game, but it's a simple work-around for the issue you brought up. Someone in the KS's comments section also recently brought up the concept of fatigue in the game, balancing more aggressive characters like the Warrior or Ronin against the measured thoughtful play-style of the Master or Student. Aggressive characters would gain more fatigue but could deal more wounds if they land a blow, while more meditative characters could divert, dodge, or block without gaining as much fatigue. These more in depth ideas around strategy seem to be the direction the game is currently taking, so I'm generally hopeful that the game develops quite a bit before it reaches it's final state prior to publishing. It also sounds like the people at Stone Sword Games are claiming they've updated many of the rules since the prototype and many new, unique, style-based cards have been added to the core game for each character. It makes me feel like maybe this game is still worth checking out, but it may end up being I get it, play it, don't like it, and sell it on some digital board game marketplace or other... Just my thoughts. In any case, thank you for sharing your opinion and getting a conversation going, KoA!
I have done the same with some games but my question with those games (that I have to house rule to really enjoy) is how good is the actual game? If I have to basically become part of the design crew I think that it wasn't done well. That said I sometimes consider backing things that have minis or other elements that I think I could use with other games or DND campaigns I am looking to run even if the game doesn't seem the best. If it is a good value that is, and I don't see a better option.
@@TabletopTussle I guess a follow-up point is to say, the game is still in development. The game appears to have changed and improved based on the typical game development process. As the Kickstarter proceeds, I'm keeping an eye on how the comments section reflects further changes by the design team. Many Kickstarters do this, the have a solid game design (yet not perfected) when the KS goes live. Then they build the final product with input and feedback from the community who have invested in the product. From what I've seen in the KS comments on this particular campaign, including my own comment and responses to it, this campaign appears to be following a similar path. So I'm hopeful that the game isn't a lost cause altogether.
@@johnfoughty8501 sounds great! I know that a lot of change can happen I just happen to be a, self recognized, pessimist about co.pa ies changing things because of the community, at least changing it well. I did really like the interaction on a few campaigns I have been a part of though. So if they change some things for the better it could be really enjoyable for a lot of people, and isn't that what really matters anyway? 😁
Game creators are putting out gameplay videos this evening which would be good for anyone to check out how the game has progressed since this prototype. Reserve final judgement for the final product :)
Great review! I had concerns about the levels of randomness. I can understand defense cards being played in anticipation of an incoming attack, but maybe defense cards should be played from the hand for a more skillful feel.
This is why I really appreciate your reviews. Brutally honest and no sugarcoating. You can’t really create any strategy here, and “hoping for the best” is just the worst in any skirmish game. EDIT: Someone has commented about your review on the campaign and Stone Sword Games seem to be caught off guard with your review. They have added Signature Ability cards to differentiate each samurai but still, punching the air is very uncharacteristic for a samurai.
There's no punching the air, this prototype copy is 3 months old and the email containing all the details about Signature Cards, the cool stuff we have for making Samurai asymmetrical and explaining the whole focus system hasn't been covered at all in this review- I don't know what to do but I'm really upset. This video gives the wrong impression and runs counter to all the over videos we've had from content creators.
@@stoneswordgames fair enough. Then there’s still a lot to see in this game that people, especially backers, have to see. As long as these new mechanics are not post-campaign promises, people should still be excited for your game.
@@FallenRaven What's awful though for me and my hardworking co-designer is that this is a review, of a 3 month old prototype, with old rules and doesn't mention anything from the email I sent to either the KoA or the content creator who passed it on! I agree completely Rowen that there's a lot to see an that mechanics need to be shown off before funding.
@@stoneswordgames You don’t need to be upset. When you send a prototype,you need to send something that will be close to the final game gameplay wise. Why this prototype was send in this stage,i have no idea. It’s your own fault in my opinion. You should take the feedback and make a better game instead of being upset….Just my opinion.
@@stoneswordgames Why is this game more strategic than just playing a random card? Even the AI just play random cards and the only difference in the result is if they are far or near you. That speaks a lot about what the gameplay is.
We are going to be playing King on TTS soon! Now if he doesn't like it the second time, and you value his advice I will digitally shake your hand and wish you the best. If you would like to play me yourself as a viewer, please ping me a message! I'm ready *air punches*
Hi. Good and mature approach here. Thanks and I'm looking forward to see that battle. KoA knows that his core viewers are usually mature enough to realize the context of a review, make an opinion for themselves and not just adopt his. Of course he has influence, like: thanks to him, I hit the "remind me" button on your campaign, which then lead to hitting the pledge one because it indeed looked nice. Now again thanks to him, I get to have an oriented yet honest opinion I value and I relate to, plus I get to see how you will deal with it. Can't speak for KoA, but I think that he would be truly delighted to make a new video starting with: "What's up Rockstars ? It's not that I was wrong (he's the king after all ^^), but SSG has proven a solid progress since the first prototype, the samurai sobbered up! I dig the changes very much and I had a lot more fun with this new version! Here's why...". Will it be enough for him ? for me ? That's the question but not necessarily calling the same answer, and 20 days to go. Enjoy.
I come here for honest and genuine reviews/previews and once again thank you for delivering. I agree if this was a positive "Preview or Review" then nothing would be said at all. Thank you King!
It’s totally fair for his impression to be negative, but this really should be called a preview, not a review. To review a game, one probably needs to try it with something close to the final rule set, and should probably have at least 50% of the components. Here, it’s a “review” of a game the public will never see. Outdated rules and none of the important components, whether it be terrain or the asymmetric cards that makes everyone unique.
@@TheKingofAverage I completely agree. They shouldn’t be calling hungry gamers piece a review when it’s clearly a preview for an unreleased and unfinished product. I think this should extend to the whole industry, including quackalope and boardgameco, where there are also often “reviewing” games that won’t release for a couple years
Lol, 1/2 way through I saw the title of the video!! Watching two earlier play throughs shared and was wondering if this was the case. Thanks for the confirmation.
whew! Finally some non-diluded criticism. I was starting to feel like the "feel good and be nice to everyone" vibe was catching up to the King... good to be reminded it just ain't so!
I agree I'd like more differences between the characters, but I guess I'll have to disagree with everything else as I actually like the game. :D But it might be just me and my playing group. We were definitely considering each card we played, which made the game feel very strategic as we tried to deduct what the other player would do while considering our future moves (also it made the game way longer). Note that I also felt happy on turns where I managed to avoid a hit or managed to successfully block thanks to my choices. I'm not a player who needs to get a hit every other turn in order to feel satisfied, but I can see other type of players liking more frequent action. And while it's possible to get a bad hand, that's just something I've seen in every card game I've played and I like the little randomness it adds to the game. I also like the minimalistic design on the cards, feeds even more to the Japanese feel of the game. On top of that I appreciate that they made their research, talking to professionals in order to make the game as authentic-feeling as possible.
Thank you Sini, this hits the nail on the head for me- you've given the game time and learnt the combos and the tactics and you've only got a TTS demo to play on- which is half the game and probably more than half of the final mechanics! I don't understand why this video is a review :(
Happy to hear the game is a hit for you Sini :) As always, I only speak for myself - I'm sure plenty of people will enjoy the game just as I said in my summary - just wasn't for me :) @SSG It's a review because I played the game, each mode at various player counts and provide my opinion on what was provided. I am sorry this was not a hit for me, just didn't end up being one I enjoyed but of course that's okay! Not every game can be for every person. You've done incredibly well on the campaign, have had an outstanding success and made a ton of people happy with wonderful community communication. Hearing something that you made is not enjoyed by someone can be hard, I totally get that, but do try to realize I'm only 1 person among many and not focus too terribly much on the negative :) - Have a great weekend!
@@TheKingofAverage Hi King, what I don't get is that none of the info passed to HG before you or sent in an email made it into the video, so it gives the impression you are playing a finished game when you've got a tech demo/ proof of concept. Why don't you come onto Tabletop Sim with us next week and play the most recent version of the game? (Stuff like having food on the prototype passed from the Hungry Gamer implies that maybe you didn't know it wasn't sent directly by us- we obviously sent out a clean copy of the rules we had at the time months ago.)
I like the welcoming & constructive part here and would of course also welcome an post-impression opinion of KoA after he played an "updated" version - to be honest :-)
Appreciate the review! I also got the sense that the game was super random after learning the rules and watching a play through. But with over 8K backers I had to wonder if I was missing something. I know this can be solo'd, so maybe that's the crowd that the game is targeting.
Same, no clue what they can do to salvage the gameplay, but right now it is pure random, you can almost play the cards eyes closed like the AI as the only factor is if you are far or close, which is the only thing the AI takes into account to change their move.
Having just received my pledge a week ago, I have played four solo games and I have to say I completely disagree with almost everything here so far. I love the game. I understand why it might not be for everybody, but it feels like you definitely didn't have the full game here somehow. If this is what SSG sent you, then that's on them, I suppose. But the final product has been a blast so far. I backed at the base game and one character expansion pack, and I have now ordered the other four character packs (I got the Ninja for free). Some of the things you described, such as two players blocking and that just doesn't seem thematic just doesn't play out in my mind the way you're describing. If two players play a block, that to me is that moment in a fight where you are in a defensive stance and ready for a strike, but it just doesn't happen to come now. Nothing wrong with that. And there are plenty of times when someone might move as a cut is happening and the cut goes through the air. That's good defensive maneuvering because it's safer to dodge a strike then try to block it. Anyway, this is essentially Bushido blade the board game, and that is 100% a good thing for me. I love it. 🙂
I got the game after watching StoneSword channel's Senjutsu Battle reports, which convinced me that the gameplay isn't random at all. After a couple of duels played with different characters I can confirm. This game is a mix of Yu-Gi-Oh! and chess. Of course every card game has luck in it, you never know the next card you gonna draw. You can't and don't have to predict the exact card the opponent might play. However, if you have a good knowledge of the cards in the game, it is feasible to identify couple of possible options the opponent may choose from, given the situation, positioning of miniatures and character playstyle. This is definitely enough to make every turn of yours count and do some insane moves and satisfying hits. What I think for people judging the game to be clanky and random (I might sound aggressive, I don't intend to) is that they either lack the IQ for this game or they lack patience to learn how the cards work in this game. Probably the second is more true. This game is totally worth it, trust me, but it is demanding to master it.
Thanks for the honest review. I backed it (to guarantee the early bird) but was unsure about how it actually played as it looked random. Gameplay of selecting cards and trying to guess what your opponent might do reminded me of Colt Express (which would be fine if it was meant to be a light game where you laughed about your poor choices). I will be dropping my pledge.
My dear King... this is ecactly the reason why i support your channel. Thx for the Preview. This time you safed me a lot of money... money i can continue to contribute to the Kingdom (at least some of it🙂).
Heh, I think normally I cause you guys to spend more, so nice if every so often it's savings :D either way happy the video helped you, always happy to have ya around with us!
I wonder that why this game is so Hype. I have seen a lot of play through and end with yawning. Because most of them waste time with swinging in the air :D. However, I’m day one backer and still be there because of that Akita dog! Hope the final version goes better!
I hope they do the right move; lot more testing and reconsider some of their core gameplay element so that the combat feels better and less random and/or only about guessing which of their 40 cards the other player is throwing on the table. A few months delay won't hurt them, and I do believe the base of the idea is solid enough to become great with enough work.
I am glad you did this review I thought I was missing something because a bunch of people are starting to back it. It said it has reached over 11,000% of the funding goal but then I saw they set the goal at something like $7,500 or something really low. The game and presentation seems a little off to me. Thanks again for your great reviews, I always appreciate them!
Thank you for the critical but honest review. I am still unsure because I felt the same way in my tests. Yes, the team behind the game is awesome and I have a fear that the game will get more and more mechanics, but that doesn't have to be better. Still a bit of a wait and see, but just have to say: it's no bargain either....
I've played this on TTS and have pretty much the same thoughts, I like the idea of a samurai game because of the setting, and its not bad, but its just not for myself, not when I have super fantasy brawl, a better arena combat game with less randomisation, and better combat I feel.
This was exactly what I was thinking. I have both Unmatched and SFB and so far the gameplay of both just looks better than Senjutsu's gameplay. I hope more reviews will come because I love this genre.
After I went through the rulebook and watched two gameplay videos my verdict was: wow, this seems like just a fancy rock-paper-scissors. Looks like I'm not the only one with this (early) perception.
@@TheKingofAverage Right, usually is quite the opposite. I buy games after watching your review :) Speaking of which, I'm pondering about taking Mythic Battles: Pantheon instead of MB: Ragnarok in PM. Any thoughts on that? Are they that similar, that I can choose based on theme? Or perhaps one is better than the other, or (I can hear my wallet crying) they are different enough to warrant buying both?
Hey Kevin, please come and check out the Gameplay Updates first- they contain information that was shared with King and the reviewer before him but haven't made it into the final video :/
It's crazy that people are so easily swayed by other's I haven't watched the video yet as i'm on a train and i'm waiting until I can test on TTS to make up my mind fully. KoA average only speaks for himself, he has likes and dislikes like everyone does. You could be missing out on a great thing because of a stranger's opinion....silly.
@@stoneswordgames I like what I saw in the Gameplay Update #10 and I'm looking forward to the next one. I am all in for the game and going to try it as soon as possible on tts.
I'm out also, nothing interesting here under the shinny hood. Maybe future gameplay video will change my mind, but I doubt it, the latest update they made is not understanding the legit issues raised in this review.
Great video King. Thank you for your perspective and hard work on providing this review. I know it can be hard to take criticism as a creator, and it seems that the developer is frustrated or feels it unfair that your review didn’t involve xy or z element which is in the current iteration / on the KS, however you reviewed what you had. That is all which could ever be reasonably expected. Based on the comments I saw in the KS comments section, the devs should be thankful if you agree to play them tomorrow. There was a lot of disrespect going on there and I wouldn’t blame you if you chose not to participate. Best wishes to all who want the game and for success to all. Cheers!
I feel like Blue Max does this mechanic really well. You're in a plane that has roughly a dozen different maneuvers and very specific weapon usage. You can plan out your maneuvers to predict enemy maneuvers, and some of those maneuvers require that you took a specific action the previous turn. In this way it is much less likely that the dogfight turns into back to back to back turns being wasted, and the theme makes sense because you're playing more of a cat and mouse game. The only randomness is in attack damage, but it very seldom dictates or outweighs strategy. I hope this game can fix the game mechanics to be more strategic. If players could lay down two cards instead and make a base attack/block/move option (like Gloomhaven has the basic attack or move) I think it would even be a step in the right direction.
… so hard to create a skirmish game (even with a bunch or ranged characters, spread-out objectives, behind enemy-lines deployment, etc) that doesn’t become a pile of troops battling it out in the middle. I remember Steam Forged games saying that during a Guild Ball interview.
agree with this. we play Arkham Horror LCG with 15 card Investigator decks and the worst (-7, -5 etc Chaos Tokens omitted) and it has made the game so much 'better' for us.
There are things like smoke bombs and caltrops in this game (ninja). All of the characters have their own unique cards which can be added to their decks. There are going to be multiple maps like bridge fights and fighting along the shoreline or in burning villages. A lot of the new characters depend on whether you decide to pledge for addons, but a lot of extra stuff has been added even for the basic pledge like new locations, new game modes and even physical terrain like trees, boulders or burning carts and row boats. I'm not saying that this review is right or wrong, but he has definitely not done his research (as he states near the start of the video) and this is the bare bones of the final product. You kind of need to have a good look at the campaign page on kickstarter to get the full scope.
Why did i not see this review on bgg? needs to be there mate! thanks for an honest review.. hate that review/previews often dosnt seem quite transparent enough anymore, thats why we come to you
Honestly don't have to worry cause my friend is getting it, so I will play it regardless, and I don't have to pay for it lol. I did give my friend your concerns with the randomness, and for him that is very in much with the theme, according to him in a real samurai duel it was random because they would always analyze what their opponents moves were going to be, which would lead to situations were someone would attack and another guy would move away and you would hit a tree, or an instance were both guys would block an attack that wasn't going to happen.
To be fair all positive reviews posted on the ks page are also old prototype,but for some reason if the review is negative then it’s not a valid review…Lol
Just to add (as someone who’s video is on the KS), the individual videos (Mine, Hungry Gamer’s etc.) are Previews and NOT Reviews. There is a definite difference in that a Preview is not representative of the finished game.
Not Bored Gaming I think that’s why this video is becoming so divisive, that distinction is important. Though it doesn’t help the matter that SSG headed the video section of the KS Review rather than Preview as well.
This review is why I'm a Patreon. It's honest and it shows both good points and bad. This game really intrigued me as I love the feudal Japanese themed games. After this review I feel it might be missing the mark, as too how strategic you can be. I hope the developer can still fix some of the issues, because the good points highlighted are great.
Just wanted to say I appreciate you! Exactly why I'm able to make videos like this. IMO a critical look at a KS game is a great tool should they chose to use it :)
Hi. Just wondering what are your opinions on games such as battlecon, exceed, combo fighter? I do realise you might not habe played them. If you habe what did you like about them compaired to this? Thanks
Many game makers do this so they can trouble shoot problems that people have with the game before final release. We don't know how long KOA has had this prototype copy of the game it could have been a few weeks or a few months. Also I don't think it is fair to do a review of a prototype of a game as the final product could be different and fix most of his problems. Specifically I think most of his problems could be fixed by making cards have 2 options on them which seems doable . In addition the criticism of lack of customization is unwarranted because he doesn't have all the cards yet. Also use of symbols as a negative is just nitpicking.
If it is 'not fair to review a prototype', the positive reviews from the KS page, made on the same prototype, should be removed and are not legit as well.
Just coming back to this (I saw it early on but didn't comment at the time) to say thank you for this review. I don't agree with your conclusions here, but I had to do a lot of digging to find some of the information that swayed me, and some of it didn't exist at the time you got your prototype. Watching your video helped me to decide to back the game, and I've since increased my pledge right up to the deluxe all-in level. When your negative review explains the game well enough for someone with different tastes to be sold on the game you're saying is bad, you've done your job right!
So happy to hear you took in all the info to make a well informed decision of what is right for you! I appreciate the feedback and happy that my video was helpful in that process :)
@@TheKingofAverage Hey, I know it's old news now, but you've covered a lot of similar stories and it might be worth giving this game anotehr look. Not because of good reasons, unfortunately (even though the game is fun). Their handling of the KS communication post-funding was *horrific* and in some cases, questionable in its legality. Most KS projects accept either "it's a platform for pre-ordering the game" and give backers the respect due to a customer, while getting the money owed by one, or take the stance of "it's a platform for investing in a project" and give you the rights of an investor while holding you to the responsibilities of one. Some do a blurred line between the two, but the scummy ones try and go "if you're saying we owe you something as a customer, you're an investor, but as soon as you ask for what an investor has a right to, you'lre a customer instead, so we don't have to give you anything (even if you can justify it under either one)" and that's the approach SSG has taken toward things. During the campaign, there's evidence that they knew before the KS mandated refund cutoff date, but "forgot" to mention until a year later, that they had changed plans on one of the stretch goals and the game which was advertised to get a linen finish didn't. During the campaign, they also drastically changed the scope and content of several other elements of the game, notably the "narratively-driven" campaign which ended up being a linear string of missions with the player only making a few limited card picks along the road, the second narrative campaign which turned into a handful of one-off scenarios instead of being another campaign, and the promised 3 books of campaign and scenario content which ended up being repackaged into 2. When backers pointed out (rightfully) that the content which had sold them on the game was no longer present, they just answered with "too bad, refund window expired" and tried to act like KS was somehow at fault and "not allowing" them to refund past that point, instead of acknowledging that they can absolutely refund the backer and the majority of successful KS projects have done so. There are several examples of the creators having been contacted by customers and shipping companies during a messy issue with delivering the product, and after more than 2 weeks of people telling them about a problem, they claimed to have "only just" been informed in spite of there already having been documented evidence proving that to be a lie. They promised repeatedly during the campaign and shortly after it, that the game would be in the hands of backers before it went to retail, but in literally every single region on the planet, the game was available locally at retail (often in physical stores, but always at least from a local online retailer) before it was available to backers in that region, and in many cases, before *ANY* backers had received their copies, with most waiting multiple *MONTHS* past the date the game went to retail before seeing their pledges. There are still pledges waiting for their copies of the game to be shipped, and a lot of the reasons why just weren't communicated in an even remotely competent manner to backers. It's an absolutely atrocious mess, and a lot of the problems were out of their hands, but the *COMMUNICATION* about those problems was entirely on them, and they failed abysmally at it. And all through it, they keep assuring everyone that *THEY DID NOTHING WRONG* and have tried gaslighting backers over the problem instead of accepting blame on numerous occasions. And all this is coming from someone who has my copy of the game, enjoys the game very much, and is still happy I backed it. Even though I'm glad I got this game, I expect them to take *MAJOR* steps to improve before I'll consider touching any of their projects in future. There are a lot of people much more upset at them than I am, and a lot of those *WITHOUT* good reason, jumping on the hate train the same way they jumped on the hype train. The information I've shared is stuff you can see at least some evidence for in the kS comments, on BGG, and other publicly-visible spaces. Some backers (and other angry people) have been throwing out accusations beyond the ones which can actually be demonstrated, claiming everything the company has done was fraudulent. There was an incident where a major disaster hit a port the game was scheduled to ship from, and it took them a month to tell us that their timeline had been affected by it. There were people who claimed (falsely) that they'd specificlaly confirmed the game to still be on track after being informed it was being delayed, which there's no evidence of (only a failure to communicate that it had been, when they knew there was a delay but not the exact details of how much of a delay it would turn into). The fact that they only admitted there was a delay after being angrily confronted about the lack of news didn't help the situation. But there are a few other situations where people have tried to call SSG out for crimes or failings that weren't even legit, alongside all the valid problems, and I think it's important to keep in mind that it's not *QUITE* as terrible as some people are trying to make it sound. Only almost...
I watched one play through of this game and I had many of the exact thoughts that you do. Pretty much every aspect of the game seemed so random especially the triangle indicating direction of each figure. Thanks for your thoughts, I will stick with Unmatched for my 2 player skirmish games.
Thank you. Was watching this campaign and a bit upset I missed the 48hour early bird thing. Never noticed the randomness in the system. Thank you for pointing that out. Was hoping this would be a game I could pull out on a lonely afternoon and play solo a bit, being as the "AI" is completely random as well, I might very well just pass. Not completely decided yet, but it's nice to hear an honest review.
So I backed this for the early bird because like you I thought it looked interesting. Now, it looks like exploding kittens with samurai. Also, I looked at the comments on the kickstarter, and the creator seems confused as to why you reviewed this... Now I'm confused as to why he would send a prototype he didn't want reviewed to a person who does reviews... Either way, I really appreciate the honest reviews as always! I will hang in a little bit longer to see if they can prove there is more to this game than just randomness.
Worth noting that this isn’t a prototype as much as a demo, or a proof of concept. The vast majority of the content isn’t there. And I’m not sure it would make sense to release a “review” of a game that isn’t finished and won’t even release for probably 18 months. Voidfall for example, has already undergone massive systemic changes versus what was seen during the Kickstarter. Think of how out of date a “review” would be for that game, given that it’s not even finished internally, let alone what content creators got their hands on.
@@shanerion The issue with this game is that even if you add hundred of cards, the gameplay loop is still absolutely horrific, bland, simple, luck based.
This is why Im subscribed to your channel. I backed the early bird just in case, but your review/impressions made me cancel my pledge. Its just not for me. I`ll save that money for harakiri and sankokushin instead for my Japan-fix in boardgames.
Thank you Micheal for your preview, I’m very similar to you in that I’m not one to enjoy a game that wins by chance, hence why I’m not a fan of Monopoly or Risk. Saved me money. :)
Hi was so hypped by this "little fast" game, with a theme i enjoy so much, but after this review i will just stick to my good (not too) old Aristeia ! About the lack of deck control, Maybe it could be a nice idea, to sort the cards in 2, 3 seperate decks (Attack - Defense - Utility (move etc..) and you just chose in wich pile you draw ! So you get a better chance having something you actually needs ! but i dont know if the game make that possible :)
I actually played the game with the designer after this review and lost to him but just barely. It actually reinforced my opinion that it's fairly low on real strategy and more who best guesses better. I tend to keep company drama out of reviews though if I can help it. Sucks though how the campaign has turned out as of late.
@@TheKingofAverage Thank you for the response. That makes a lot of sense. I would hope reviews don't have company drama in them which is why I enjoy your channel!
This review , I love. Because I liked everything you liked and liked everything you didn't lol. For me I can see the thematic. I understand it as samurai fighting. I do hope it never has anything like Magic in it. Thank you for your honesty because I like the game more for it.
That's awesome to hear! Glad you used the video as just another data point to determine what's right for you :)
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You are the King! I hope they have or will adress your legitimate concerns and views on the game. I was also hyped for the game - minimal time and table footprint is very attractive. Very much looking forward to your comment on the demo on Monday, if I understood the plan right. I also hope for respectful comments from Stone Sword Games. Keeping my early bird. For now... Edit: Found KoA updated impression after demo game. Summary: Better but not good for KoA.
Thank you so much for this review. You saved me some money. You also helped me understand that this game will never be the game I was hoping it would be, no matter how many layers of nuance are stacked on top of this base mechanic. The creators seem like genuinely passionate, nice guys, but I don’t think there’s any way this game would hold my interest. Boy is it gorgeous, though.
Such a good review and exactly what I thought of the game when I saw the Kickstarter. Thanks for verifying what I was concerned about. What's a better version of a game similar to this?
I've heard BattleCON is very much like this and people speak very well of it. It uses standees on a 2D battle mat but has beautiful artwork and is the same sort of "know your opponent" card counting slight programming experience. Since I've not played I can't comment on how often you end up like I do in Senjutsu with not being able to block for instance. I imagine the more straightforward map style helps a bit with this.
I’ve overtime cooled on skirmish games. I find many of them tooo restrictive. Often I have a cool idea but the cards won’t allow it. So left doing something dumb. I was never planning to back this. Honest reviews are great. There is too much hype everywhere. Does eveyone like every movie? Just because a movie cost 100m should we just give good reviews since we feel bad for them? Anyway… Keep it up.
Thanks for the awesome review! Pretty lame you are getting some flak for sharing your thoughts. No game out there will please everyone, sitting at over $800k with 20 days to go, it seems silly to give you trouble at all for posting your honest opinion. The game is doing just fine financially.
The randomness, not knowing initiative, card flip simultaneously part is an instant no for me. I own Gloomhaven and quit playing it because of that. I wish I had known, because I would have never bought it. Thank you for the review, brother. I WILL be skipping this game.
Hi Kent, you do get to know the initiative though- 25-40 of the cards you have, the opponent can also choose from and the Signature Cards (unique to the Samurai) use a Focus system to make sure there's a good level of card transparency.
@@stoneswordgames, I’m not trying to come down so hard on the game. I wrote my first response on my 10 minute break at work. So, I was in a hurry. From what the King described about the initiative and attacking nothing because your initiative was lower than your opponents is just reminded me of the main reason I quit playing Gloomhaven. We all hate missing our attacks in games. I’d just rather miss it because of a dice roll instead of a card flip. At least when I miss with a dice roll I’m precisely where I wanted to be. I honestly wish you the very best and I’m happy your game will be a reality. Cheers, mate.
Did you see the blocking cards, for example initiative 7/2, where you can decide when both cards are revealed, which ini you have? And there are instant cards, the one's with the lightning symbol, that you can also play, over your revealed card. That way you can react, to the card your opponent revealed. I don't like Gloomhaven, too. :-)
How man. I really wanted to love this game. I really need a good solo narrative skirmish game... any alternatives ? @KoA: I love your honesty, but did you read the mail about the improvements they made ? Do you think it could help the strategy ?
I recieved no email, searched under the company name, the devs personal name and the game name and nothing. Unfortunate, but at the same time I can only review what I play. I did make comments about terrain, the green cards and the 72 personal cards - however that just lead me to talk about the symbols vs text on cards.
Fair review but something seems off? Other gameplay never have samurai just both blocking at the same time or hitting air. Everything had intention and never the level of 3 Stooges described in this video. I know SSG has commented throughout the video saying the prototype used is the wrong one? Could be why certain things just did not click?
It's the same copy at Hungry Gamer's - literally from him. A popular review on BGG is titled after attacking air and HG spoke about it feeling like a knife fight in a phone booth, not too far off of my drunk samurai comment. I just played the updated version, and it's certainly better. I still attacked the air and still ended up with a hand that allowed no way of attacking or defending, but it as better. Not a game for me but I'm sure plenty will love it. Gotta be the kind of person to count cards to really do well in it and I suck at that :)
@@TheKingofAverage Ah, shame to hear that. Well when all is said and done you gave it a fair chance. Differing opinions are good. Especially given the current shipping issues and ever rising costs of games on KS. Appreciate the feedback and direct comment amigo.
Initially backed this KS, but due to the high price and its just a random-ish skirmish, I pulled out. But love its theme, miniatures and aesthetics. Biggest factor though is the release month is same as Marvel United X-Men next year! lol. Can't focus on both big games.
I tried judging which games to back partially on their delivery dates. As you mentioned, I did not want two big games (or really two of any game) coming in the same month. Then the Illuminati unleashed Covid on the world, and suddenly the projected delivery dates for games is no longer related to reality. For a while I was pretty sure this was a deliberate conspiracy against me. But then everyone around me started whispering that I was paranoid, so I realised it must have been an evil government program to destroy the game industry as a whole, and not just me personally.
To be honest I have to say that I like the idea of the 'randomness' If you have ever fought people there are times where you don't think quickly enough or of the right move. Sometimes your move misses because they just did something. Yeah, sorry but I think it's a positive.
My god, this is the most hilarious game review that I have ever seen. You can say that you didn´t like it, but maybe the intention is to create this Monthy Phyton bar fight that has no sense at all. Just laughing so hard at your "not stories". It feels a bit like playing an online video game with a very high pin, you need to guess the future.
Hahaha perfect! I should have said it just reminded me of playing on those Russian CS:Source servers...from America back in the day to get my point across better :D
The opinions of someone who didn't enjoy it is welcome to counter the hype. It sounds like SSG have emailed you some additional info but that's them to get their stakeholder management right (i.e. if they sent you a proof of concept, they should have really pre-briefed you). However it this is deffo not a final version and so i do think you should tag that it is a prototype (or demonstrator) review - neither the title, description or opening remarks makes mention of this clear. just as we like your honest reviews, i do think you should be 'honest' about the version you are reviewing.
@@cymraegddraig I've watched the video all the way through.The word prototype is not used in the videos TH-cam page title or description, and KoA does not verbally use the word in the chapter segmented 'Intro' (unless I've misheard); it is only written as the very final bullet of the second page of KoAs disclaimer. There is plenty more KoA can easily do, particularly when he is giving the game a hard time. I welcome these hard reviews (although I do believe KoA needs to be more succinct when delivering negative points), KS games aren't cheap and the onus should be 100% on the creators to deliver a value offering to backers. Partially off of KoAs prior comments and because of the early bird, I've backed in case this project is one of those 'hidden gems' but i'm not worried about it and want these non-FOMO, down-to-earth reviews but I do expect (particularly when its a hard nosed review) the context of the product (in this case a prototype (if that)) to be transparent, especially as KoA requests Patreon financial support - if you ask for coin you have to take the responsibility that comes with it.
I list it in the giant disclaimer right after my hello intro segment as well as during the final pros and cons and it's a review for an unreleased product. At some point I have to assume viewers can both watch the video and realize how early copies of unreleased product are....well early copies. I've done a ton of reviews. This sort of pendantic focus on wording is only brought up when I'm negative. Not once ever has someone fussed so much when the review is positive. Ever. I understand not agreeing with me, that's totally fine. But let's not pretend to hold some ideal differently just to try and say in this one case I didn't do my due diligence.
Thank you for your honesty (as always!). And you’re right about how this kind of review is in the best interest of both the consumer AND the game designer. I mean, I know it’s not easy to hear on their part but that’s ultimately how you can learn and come back even better. Thanks for not compromising!
It's not fun and it makes people dislike me, but it's worth it and happy to always let you guys know what I really think about stuff :) In the end my video isn't for a company, it's for you!
I was wondering about the hype around this game myself. Doesn't seem to be doing more - or less - than other card-based skirmish games. Perhaps it's the feudal Japan theme.
Theme helps, but also it does honestly play differently than many. It's super heavy into card counting, and has a programming element to it as well as you are trying to guess where the state of the game will be when it's your turn. I don't like it, but that's just my preference. For many, this is a niche that's largely untouched I think.
Looking at the gameplay in the kickstarter, I'm going all in on this game. It has clearly moved past this prototype version and the gameplay I've seen looks great. I've not seen a skirmish board game that flows like this before and is far more about manoeuvring than just smashing into each other. A damn shame to see such a cool game condemned by outdated rules
Maybe this could have been a good deckbuilding game, with a basic starting deck that guarantees a variety of block, movement and attack in your initial hand, and a market to build the deck with special moves' cards bought with "qi" points or something like that. As it is, it focuses more on deckbuilding before playing, and not my kind of thing
Domo arigato! I was excpecting Senjutsu would manage to capture the art of ancient samurai warfare in some way. It seems this game is only a nice piece of Japanese lookin art. 🧐Will save my money now and wait for the development of the game.
This is so disappointing. As a solo gamer, I had high hopes. Feudal Japan is my theme. It’s close to my heart. Unfortunately, there are no dungeon crawlers/skirmish games set here (other than SoB: Forbidden Fortress, which I own, and Yokai Quest..). High hopes for Harakiri!!
@@TheKingofAverage Highly recommend it, but try to play with a 4th edition set if you can as the cards and rules are much more clear (and balanced). They just updated the game to the final version (v4) recently and literally reprinted every single character card (I think about 85 old characters needed to be totally reprinted). Sent updated cards to all the backers of the recent KS free of charge which was pretty nuts.
I was really excited for Fractals blind tactic play in combat. Watching the plays on this was a big turn off. Seemed way to random rather than tactical. Easy pass.
I pinned a comment on it. Have no such email. Searched under the dev's personal name, their company name and the game name and have nothing turn up so that's unfortunate. Of course this is the same copy Hungry Gamer got and his review is posted on the page so the only reason this is being called out for giving opinions on an old copy is because it was negative - which isn't fair. I did my job, same as him, we just had different takes on it is all :) And I did mention the green cards, the cards specific to them, but because they are just the same symbols grouped differently there's no real depth there I feel, which is what lead me to talk about the symbols vs words in a card game. I mentioned terrain as well and the new status effect, both in a positive light. People just focus on the negative usually as human beings so it's forgotten :)
@@TheKingofAverage Thank you for addressing it! This again shows your integrity in being an unbiased reviewer. Really appreciate the effort and work you put into all your videos. Keep on being a class act. 👍
Oh man this is interesting, I didn’t pledge this game because of the graphics, there is no interesting graphics, but you also point other gameplay issue… I love twisted fable and looks this one is really faraway from it
I adore Twisted Fables as well. For my tastes at least, that's the better pick though if you are looking for a free-for-all then TF doesn't really provide that well.
@@TheKingofAverage True also TF is not for everyone but the art is sublime and even my wife enjoy it... In any case there are too many games on this period thanks to help us to make a choice (Hopefully a good one)
Fair enough as review goes, unfortunately the game is now in a much more advanced state & beyond the simplistic analysis offered here. Randomness has been significantly addressed, and with additional character types them is evoked much more strongly that the prototype reviewed. So thanks for the review but I think you've pulled the hot trigger too soon on this one.
I've played the latest on TTS and it did not change my view of things at all. Ended up unable to block or move faster than a 3 at one point so just stood there with my back to them with nothing to do but take a hit. The entire game I only got a few block cards. I'm sure plenty of people will love it, it's very card counting focused with some programming built into it which many enjoy, but to say randomness is gone is not something I experienced. I was still left unable to do basic things thanks to bad draws. If it had changed my mind I'd 100% have made an updated video on it.
Thanks again for the honest review. This game is a pass for me. I will spend my gaming time playing proven games like Ignite and Summoner wars 2nd edition instead. Too many games, and not enough time to play them all anyways.
Check out Bushido by GCT studious, it's this theme but with superior gameplay, better miniatures and you don't have to wait 2 years for it to arrive on your door step.
And... this is why I'm here, an honest review, it's why you're still the King!
Happy to provide :)
@@TheKingofAverage Yes, candid opinions are super important, thank you for sharing.
Thanks for a good review. I’ll probably keep my pledge as these guys are super responsive to feedback and the game seems to have developed a lot since the prototype, but I’m still glad to watch a review without KS-tinted glasses
Stone Sword Games were just asked about this review on the Kickstarter so, seeing as I am tentatively backing because of KoAs previews in the first place, I thought I’d post their response.
From Stone Sword Games:
“I haven't seen the review yet but I'm concerned he got a very early prototype and hasn't seen 90% of the game- don't know why he's done a review when the prototype has no;
- Signature Cards
- Jade Cards
- Pre-set decks beyond the mechanical tutorial deck
- Focus system
- Weapon specific cards
I will be posting Gameplay Updates tonight so stay tuned for those! I think we dispel the idea of taking a 3 month old prototype copy as a review copy :)”
Yes, it would be good if the review included all these elements too, and not only the very basic prototype.
@@sharond5854 Having more cards doesn't change the review at all. The gameplay loop is still absolutely random.
@@yview7315 Hi Yview there are a ton of shared cards, shared card lists before the game and a focus system that makes sure there is card transparency- I don't know why my gameplay email to him was ignored.
With that in mind... it would be a nice thing to bring an update demo with those element. As an independant reviewer KOA is well known and respect from gamer (ps I backed the game AND also am a fan of KoA). He could make an update review and this would help your campaign and maybe help prove the point about an early prototype... sad but usually core mechanic and feel aren't the things that change a lot during development...
Seriously? Maybe they shouldn't send out super incomplete prototypes then?
I think some of the complaints were addressed in final version. For instance, every character has 2 default cards that never leave their hand and can be used every turn (I believe 1 attack and 1 defense). These are their “core” cards that define the character and ensure you’re never without attack/defense options. This review is probably obsolete
Seems I need to pin a post here to clarify a few things as there's a lot of mud being thrown: I was asked if I wanted a copy of the game by SSG. I said yes and said it would be used for an "unboxing/review" so they sent this. I received no email from them and they sent this copy to be reviewed by me and new it was to be reviewed.
I mention a stain on the rulebook, that's from the Hungry Gamer. Seems he really was hungry :)
The only reason it's age is brought up now is because it was a negative review. Had it been positive, it'd be listed with all the other videos listed under their "Review" header that they are happy to share. Not every game is meant for every person, and that's okay, this one was a miss for me. But please refrain from assuming ill will or misconduct on my part just because I didn't like the game. Stone Sword Games has done a great job with their campaign and I'm sure will make many people happy with their game. I just won't be one of them is all, and again, that's okay.
Have a great weekend rockstars!
" I received no email from them"- I'm sorry but this isn't the case from our end at least, it is in my sent folder unless it got lost. Every other previewer/ reviewer has received an email detailing information about the asymmetrical samurai cards and what we are planning to do with the game. You also backed the campaign very early so would have seen this info on the KS page itself. The last reviewer who sent this onto you received the same email and picked up that Samurai were completely different after adding in the Signature Ability Cards.
I completely agree to everyone's right to an opinion but you were provided with information that has been missed off the review- and also information that as a backer you must have seen on the KS campaign page. Please come and have a game with Paul and I next week on Tabletop Simulator and you'll see how different the game is from the 3 months old prototype you received. I am sure that even if you end up not liking it, you'll appreciate the changes we have made to the version you received.
I will also say obviously, come and play it again on TTS with Paul and I (James) and if you still dislike it, please leave this video up or dump on the new version - but whether it's a lost email or a missed email- this video doesn't reflect the game hundreds of people have been testing and working on and that does them a disservice.
Reviewers can only discuss copies that are provided to them. All reviewers say that this is a prototype...subject to change. Ultimately though they have to discuss what they like or dislike about the copy of the game in front of them.
He didn't dump on the game. He was honest about how he felt the game played at based on the copy he was provided. He even said just because it wasn't for him it doesn't mean others wouldn't enjoy.
I'm sure your final version of the game will be much better upon release but I'd rather People be honest about how they feel about a game....which is what he does.
@@stoneswordgames Don't know what to say, I searched my email and nothing. Perhaps it was deleted in error without reading? Honestly can't say except I didn't see it. That being said I did refer to KS things. I referred to Terrain and said that'll be great to add. I referred to the added status effect card and said that'll be welcome as well. I also mentioned the 72 other cards and even gave an example of one of the green cards so I referred to that as well - though it lead me to discuss symbol usage versus words in card games.
Let's not pretend that I didn't put a lot of time and effort into this review before sharing my thoughts, because it's not the case at all. :)
@@TheKingofAverage I think the review is on point. What you shown here is what all the other videos are also showing. This is the game that was in this box, like it or not.
This perfectly illustrates a current problem in the industry; it has felt like many publishers are trying to rush their games to Kickstarter while there is still too much development yet to do. Preview copies should be pretty darn close to what they believe the final product will be. At the same time publishers need to be ready to change the game when reviewer and backer feedback shows it's necessary.
KOA reviewed what he was given, What else should anyone expect? This is far better than all the hyped preview "reviews" that say how great a game is that ends up not being good.
This is also why I subscribe to KOA even though our taste in boardgames seems wildly different. His honest discussions about what's going on in the industry are worth subscribing for.
Aye a lot of development has apparently happened in the 3 months prior to launch, which is fine. But I only review what they send for me to review. Can't be tracking their week-to-week development updates and certainly can't review it. By the time I got enough game time in with it more development would have changed :)
It's no biggie though, happy to share with you guys :)
@@TheKingofAverage No sweat - I view some of their own test-games. The problems you pointed out persist. I have withdrawn my pledge because of that. A 'skilled' warrior not being able to block because i have no block in my hand is a bad design. But I might be able to swallow it if it was a 'Drunken Master' theme or something similar.
Already in with deluxe, one addon and Sundrop. Maybe all in we'll see. But i was hyped from the start. Thanks for reviewing!
hope you love it! :)
I had the same feeling when I watch the game, not my kind of game sadly, do like the setting. As always, thanks for the honesty
I think symbols are just an elegant way to replace text on a card. Symbols are used a lot in other boardgames and it works quite well. So why not in a card game. And to be fair, there are cards in Senjutsu with text on them. Just look at Gameplay Update #1 and #2.
If you take the time to explain the symbols, and in Senjutsu you will manage that quickly, a beginner should get a good understanding of what his cards are doing.
And if your opponent has a question, he may ask, what does the XY Symbol mean, without showing his card. In Magic or Android Netrunner, where there is a lot of text on the cards, there is always a lot of reading when playing the first time. And that causes more or less downtime.
I am really excited for this game. I have a strong thematic feeling of a fight, where the stronger / smarter warrior survives. Your movement and positioning matters a lot, your speed and range matters. You dance around your opponent, you cautiously prepare for a big swing with your Katana, but the opponent just turns away, steps on your weak side and stabs you. You get a bleeding wound and from now on have to discard the top ability card at the start of each round.
I really like Unmatched and Senjutsu is better in a couple of ways. Deck Construction adds great variability. KoA had just an early version of the base game. But there are a lot more warriors with different signature cards on the way.
The hex field battle map, where positioning and orientation of your character matter!
You can react to a degree when revealing your cards, which is a big plus for me.
KoA said there is nothing exciting, that the fighters feel the same. Have you seen the card "Flaming Phoenix Arc" from Update #13? You can instantly kill your opponent if you do it right. That's awesome and brings a level of tension to the game. When I see my opponent begins stacking focus tokens, I expect the Flaming Phoenix Arc. But maybe he is bluffing this round, causing me to spend my defense cards, forcing me to change the kamae back to shinto, weakening my defense. Just to unleash the killing blow at the perfect moment.
I think it's telling that he complained about the lack of combos, when this is designed to be a high-tension, crushing mistake game. This isn't King of Fighters, this is Samurai Shodown.
When he talks about a card being 'wasted' if you attack and the opponent moves out if the way... yes. That's the whole point.
I appreciate your candor regarding your experience with this prototype, and I think you bring up some very good points. That being said, I could see house-ruling this game quite a bit to fix many of the issues you've raised. The advantages of having a small-scale skirmish/arena-style game that plays in 15-30 minutes is hard to pass up, and the price is really good for what you're getting with all the SGs. Personally, I've house ruled the heck out of a few games which were super-popular with the masses but I just couldn't play with our group; the house rules usually help to fix the minor problems with the game to make it more pleasing to our tastes.
For example, instead of just drawing up to 5 cards, maybe draw up to your hand-limit + one additional for each of your enemies on the battlefield, then return extra cards down to your hand-size back to the draw deck, and then shuffle it. Then take the rest of your turn as normal.
Additionally, to help alleviate the issue of not having the ability to move or attack whenever you want... another house rule could be, if you want to do a thing and you don't have the right cards in your hand, you could play any card + shuffle a stun card into your draw deck (for a future stun effect, not immediate) -- doing this could allow you to automatically take any two basic actions back-to-back (move, rotate, attack for 1 wound). So you could double move in any direction, rotate once or twice in a direction, and/or issue a single, front-facing, attack for 1 wound at an initiative of 5, for example. Of course, I haven't play-tested this, so I don't know how it might fix or break the game, but it's a simple work-around for the issue you brought up.
Someone in the KS's comments section also recently brought up the concept of fatigue in the game, balancing more aggressive characters like the Warrior or Ronin against the measured thoughtful play-style of the Master or Student. Aggressive characters would gain more fatigue but could deal more wounds if they land a blow, while more meditative characters could divert, dodge, or block without gaining as much fatigue. These more in depth ideas around strategy seem to be the direction the game is currently taking, so I'm generally hopeful that the game develops quite a bit before it reaches it's final state prior to publishing.
It also sounds like the people at Stone Sword Games are claiming they've updated many of the rules since the prototype and many new, unique, style-based cards have been added to the core game for each character. It makes me feel like maybe this game is still worth checking out, but it may end up being I get it, play it, don't like it, and sell it on some digital board game marketplace or other...
Just my thoughts. In any case, thank you for sharing your opinion and getting a conversation going, KoA!
I have done the same with some games but my question with those games (that I have to house rule to really enjoy) is how good is the actual game? If I have to basically become part of the design crew I think that it wasn't done well. That said I sometimes consider backing things that have minis or other elements that I think I could use with other games or DND campaigns I am looking to run even if the game doesn't seem the best. If it is a good value that is, and I don't see a better option.
@@TabletopTussle I guess a follow-up point is to say, the game is still in development. The game appears to have changed and improved based on the typical game development process. As the Kickstarter proceeds, I'm keeping an eye on how the comments section reflects further changes by the design team. Many Kickstarters do this, the have a solid game design (yet not perfected) when the KS goes live. Then they build the final product with input and feedback from the community who have invested in the product. From what I've seen in the KS comments on this particular campaign, including my own comment and responses to it, this campaign appears to be following a similar path. So I'm hopeful that the game isn't a lost cause altogether.
@@johnfoughty8501 sounds great! I know that a lot of change can happen I just happen to be a, self recognized, pessimist about co.pa ies changing things because of the community, at least changing it well.
I did really like the interaction on a few campaigns I have been a part of though. So if they change some things for the better it could be really enjoyable for a lot of people, and isn't that what really matters anyway? 😁
Game creators are putting out gameplay videos this evening which would be good for anyone to check out how the game has progressed since this prototype. Reserve final judgement for the final product :)
Exactly!!
Someone identified it as rock paper scissors when Kickstarter was being funded and I stayed away.....
Great review! I had concerns about the levels of randomness. I can understand defense cards being played in anticipation of an incoming attack, but maybe defense cards should be played from the hand for a more skillful feel.
What other games would your recommend if you were thinking about backing this for solo play?
This is why I really appreciate your reviews. Brutally honest and no sugarcoating.
You can’t really create any strategy here, and “hoping for the best” is just the worst in any skirmish game.
EDIT: Someone has commented about your review on the campaign and Stone Sword Games seem to be caught off guard with your review. They have added Signature Ability cards to differentiate each samurai but still, punching the air is very uncharacteristic for a samurai.
There's no punching the air, this prototype copy is 3 months old and the email containing all the details about Signature Cards, the cool stuff we have for making Samurai asymmetrical and explaining the whole focus system hasn't been covered at all in this review- I don't know what to do but I'm really upset. This video gives the wrong impression and runs counter to all the over videos we've had from content creators.
@@stoneswordgames fair enough. Then there’s still a lot to see in this game that people, especially backers, have to see. As long as these new mechanics are not post-campaign promises, people should still be excited for your game.
@@FallenRaven What's awful though for me and my hardworking co-designer is that this is a review, of a 3 month old prototype, with old rules and doesn't mention anything from the email I sent to either the KoA or the content creator who passed it on!
I agree completely Rowen that there's a lot to see an that mechanics need to be shown off before funding.
@@stoneswordgames You don’t need to be upset. When you send a prototype,you need to send something that will be close to the final game gameplay wise. Why this prototype was send in this stage,i have no idea. It’s your own fault in my opinion. You should take the feedback and make a better game instead of being upset….Just my opinion.
@@stoneswordgames Why is this game more strategic than just playing a random card? Even the AI just play random cards and the only difference in the result is if they are far or near you. That speaks a lot about what the gameplay is.
We are going to be playing King on TTS soon! Now if he doesn't like it the second time, and you value his advice I will digitally shake your hand and wish you the best. If you would like to play me yourself as a viewer, please ping me a message! I'm ready *air punches*
Hi. Good and mature approach here. Thanks and I'm looking forward to see that battle. KoA knows that his core viewers are usually mature enough to realize the context of a review, make an opinion for themselves and not just adopt his. Of course he has influence, like: thanks to him, I hit the "remind me" button on your campaign, which then lead to hitting the pledge one because it indeed looked nice. Now again thanks to him, I get to have an oriented yet honest opinion I value and I relate to, plus I get to see how you will deal with it. Can't speak for KoA, but I think that he would be truly delighted to make a new video starting with: "What's up Rockstars ? It's not that I was wrong (he's the king after all ^^), but SSG has proven a solid progress since the first prototype, the samurai sobbered up! I dig the changes very much and I had a lot more fun with this new version! Here's why...". Will it be enough for him ? for me ? That's the question but not necessarily calling the same answer, and 20 days to go. Enjoy.
Good review for this early prototype. I hope the finished game will heal some of the mentioned problems. Which I think is already on the way
Hope so too! :)
I come here for honest and genuine reviews/previews and once again thank you for delivering. I agree if this was a positive "Preview or Review" then nothing would be said at all. Thank you King!
It’s totally fair for his impression to be negative, but this really should be called a preview, not a review. To review a game, one probably needs to try it with something close to the final rule set, and should probably have at least 50% of the components. Here, it’s a “review” of a game the public will never see. Outdated rules and none of the important components, whether it be terrain or the asymmetric cards that makes everyone unique.
Then they should remove Hungry Gamer's video of the same exact copy under their own header titled "Reviews" ;)
@@TheKingofAverage I completely agree. They shouldn’t be calling hungry gamers piece a review when it’s clearly a preview for an unreleased and unfinished product. I think this should extend to the whole industry, including quackalope and boardgameco, where there are also often “reviewing” games that won’t release for a couple years
Lol, 1/2 way through I saw the title of the video!! Watching two earlier play throughs shared and was wondering if this was the case. Thanks for the confirmation.
whew! Finally some non-diluded criticism. I was starting to feel like the "feel good and be nice to everyone" vibe was catching up to the King... good to be reminded it just ain't so!
I agree I'd like more differences between the characters, but I guess I'll have to disagree with everything else as I actually like the game. :D But it might be just me and my playing group. We were definitely considering each card we played, which made the game feel very strategic as we tried to deduct what the other player would do while considering our future moves (also it made the game way longer). Note that I also felt happy on turns where I managed to avoid a hit or managed to successfully block thanks to my choices. I'm not a player who needs to get a hit every other turn in order to feel satisfied, but I can see other type of players liking more frequent action. And while it's possible to get a bad hand, that's just something I've seen in every card game I've played and I like the little randomness it adds to the game. I also like the minimalistic design on the cards, feeds even more to the Japanese feel of the game. On top of that I appreciate that they made their research, talking to professionals in order to make the game as authentic-feeling as possible.
Thank you Sini, this hits the nail on the head for me- you've given the game time and learnt the combos and the tactics and you've only got a TTS demo to play on- which is half the game and probably more than half of the final mechanics! I don't understand why this video is a review :(
Happy to hear the game is a hit for you Sini :) As always, I only speak for myself - I'm sure plenty of people will enjoy the game just as I said in my summary - just wasn't for me :)
@SSG It's a review because I played the game, each mode at various player counts and provide my opinion on what was provided. I am sorry this was not a hit for me, just didn't end up being one I enjoyed but of course that's okay! Not every game can be for every person. You've done incredibly well on the campaign, have had an outstanding success and made a ton of people happy with wonderful community communication. Hearing something that you made is not enjoyed by someone can be hard, I totally get that, but do try to realize I'm only 1 person among many and not focus too terribly much on the negative :) - Have a great weekend!
@@TheKingofAverage Hi King, what I don't get is that none of the info passed to HG before you or sent in an email made it into the video, so it gives the impression you are playing a finished game when you've got a tech demo/ proof of concept. Why don't you come onto Tabletop Sim with us next week and play the most recent version of the game?
(Stuff like having food on the prototype passed from the Hungry Gamer implies that maybe you didn't know it wasn't sent directly by us- we obviously sent out a clean copy of the rules we had at the time months ago.)
I like the welcoming & constructive part here and would of course also welcome an post-impression opinion of KoA after he played an "updated" version - to be honest :-)
@@stevie3156 Hey Stevie, that's a great idea, King is sending over some times to me and Paul and we are gonna show him one hell of a good product.
Appreciate the review! I also got the sense that the game was super random after learning the rules and watching a play through. But with over 8K backers I had to wonder if I was missing something. I know this can be solo'd, so maybe that's the crowd that the game is targeting.
Same, no clue what they can do to salvage the gameplay, but right now it is pure random, you can almost play the cards eyes closed like the AI as the only factor is if you are far or close, which is the only thing the AI takes into account to change their move.
Yeah solo was the worst, it really is just whatever card is on top :(
Having just received my pledge a week ago, I have played four solo games and I have to say I completely disagree with almost everything here so far. I love the game. I understand why it might not be for everybody, but it feels like you definitely didn't have the full game here somehow. If this is what SSG sent you, then that's on them, I suppose. But the final product has been a blast so far. I backed at the base game and one character expansion pack, and I have now ordered the other four character packs (I got the Ninja for free). Some of the things you described, such as two players blocking and that just doesn't seem thematic just doesn't play out in my mind the way you're describing. If two players play a block, that to me is that moment in a fight where you are in a defensive stance and ready for a strike, but it just doesn't happen to come now. Nothing wrong with that. And there are plenty of times when someone might move as a cut is happening and the cut goes through the air. That's good defensive maneuvering because it's safer to dodge a strike then try to block it.
Anyway, this is essentially Bushido blade the board game, and that is 100% a good thing for me. I love it. 🙂
I got the game after watching StoneSword channel's Senjutsu Battle reports, which convinced me that the gameplay isn't random at all. After a couple of duels played with different characters I can confirm.
This game is a mix of Yu-Gi-Oh! and chess. Of course every card game has luck in it, you never know the next card you gonna draw. You can't and don't have to predict the exact card the opponent might play. However, if you have a good knowledge of the cards in the game, it is feasible to identify couple of possible options the opponent may choose from, given the situation, positioning of miniatures and character playstyle. This is definitely enough to make every turn of yours count and do some insane moves and satisfying hits.
What I think for people judging the game to be clanky and random (I might sound aggressive, I don't intend to) is that they either lack the IQ for this game or they lack patience to learn how the cards work in this game. Probably the second is more true.
This game is totally worth it, trust me, but it is demanding to master it.
Thanks for the honest review. I backed it (to guarantee the early bird) but was unsure about how it actually played as it looked random. Gameplay of selecting cards and trying to guess what your opponent might do reminded me of Colt Express (which would be fine if it was meant to be a light game where you laughed about your poor choices). I will be dropping my pledge.
My dear King... this is ecactly the reason why i support your channel. Thx for the Preview. This time you safed me a lot of money... money i can continue to contribute to the Kingdom (at least some of it🙂).
Heh, I think normally I cause you guys to spend more, so nice if every so often it's savings :D either way happy the video helped you, always happy to have ya around with us!
@@TheKingofAverage definitivly - this time it Was a safing 🙂. I fear Harakiri will be no safing 😉!?!
Looks like I'll be sticking to Unmatched and Super Fantasy Brawl for the time being.
I wonder that why this game is so Hype. I have seen a lot of play through and end with yawning.
Because most of them waste time with swinging in the air :D.
However, I’m day one backer and still be there because of that Akita dog!
Hope the final version goes better!
I hope they do the right move; lot more testing and reconsider some of their core gameplay element so that the combat feels better and less random and/or only about guessing which of their 40 cards the other player is throwing on the table. A few months delay won't hurt them, and I do believe the base of the idea is solid enough to become great with enough work.
I am glad you did this review I thought I was missing something because a bunch of people are starting to back it. It said it has reached over 11,000% of the funding goal but then I saw they set the goal at something like $7,500 or something really low. The game and presentation seems a little off to me. Thanks again for your great reviews, I always appreciate them!
Thank you for the critical but honest review. I am still unsure because I felt the same way in my tests.
Yes, the team behind the game is awesome and I have a fear that the game will get more and more mechanics, but that doesn't have to be better.
Still a bit of a wait and see, but just have to say: it's no bargain either....
Thanks for this review, it really helps to get your pro's and con's of this. I was fairly excited about this one.
I've played this on TTS and have pretty much the same thoughts, I like the idea of a samurai game because of the setting, and its not bad, but its just not for myself, not when I have super fantasy brawl, a better arena combat game with less randomisation, and better combat I feel.
This was exactly what I was thinking. I have both Unmatched and SFB and so far the gameplay of both just looks better than Senjutsu's gameplay. I hope more reviews will come because I love this genre.
After I went through the rulebook and watched two gameplay videos my verdict was: wow, this seems like just a fancy rock-paper-scissors. Looks like I'm not the only one with this (early) perception.
RPS is not random tho
Thanks, you just haved saved me over 50GBP. It's a shame it is so random. Thanks!
It's not every day I save you money haha
@@TheKingofAverage Right, usually is quite the opposite. I buy games after watching your review :)
Speaking of which, I'm pondering about taking Mythic Battles: Pantheon instead of MB: Ragnarok in PM.
Any thoughts on that? Are they that similar, that I can choose based on theme? Or perhaps one is better than the other, or (I can hear my wallet crying) they are different enough to warrant buying both?
I backed this in the 1st 5 mins of the campaign, looked really good to me. After seeing the review I think I will reconsider my pledge
Hey Kevin, please come and check out the Gameplay Updates first- they contain information that was shared with King and the reviewer before him but haven't made it into the final video :/
It's crazy that people are so easily swayed by other's I haven't watched the video yet as i'm on a train and i'm waiting until I can test on TTS to make up my mind fully. KoA average only speaks for himself, he has likes and dislikes like everyone does. You could be missing out on a great thing because of a stranger's opinion....silly.
@@CrownofRa Stranger's I personally trust 🎩 but I surely will check the gameplay video's before keeping/dropping my pledge.
@@stoneswordgames I like what I saw in the Gameplay Update #10 and I'm looking forward to the next one.
I am all in for the game and going to try it as soon as possible on tts.
I'm out also, nothing interesting here under the shinny hood. Maybe future gameplay video will change my mind, but I doubt it, the latest update they made is not understanding the legit issues raised in this review.
Great video King. Thank you for your perspective and hard work on providing this review. I know it can be hard to take criticism as a creator, and it seems that the developer is frustrated or feels it unfair that your review didn’t involve xy or z element which is in the current iteration / on the KS, however you reviewed what you had. That is all which could ever be reasonably expected. Based on the comments I saw in the KS comments section, the devs should be thankful if you agree to play them tomorrow. There was a lot of disrespect going on there and I wouldn’t blame you if you chose not to participate. Best wishes to all who want the game and for success to all. Cheers!
Holyshit man, I was on the fence about backing out....this definitely confirmed it for me. Thanks!
Happy to help! :)
Appreciate the honesty. Wish more channels actually have reviews like these rather than sales pitches.
Happy to let you know my thoughts :)
I feel like Blue Max does this mechanic really well. You're in a plane that has roughly a dozen different maneuvers and very specific weapon usage. You can plan out your maneuvers to predict enemy maneuvers, and some of those maneuvers require that you took a specific action the previous turn. In this way it is much less likely that the dogfight turns into back to back to back turns being wasted, and the theme makes sense because you're playing more of a cat and mouse game. The only randomness is in attack damage, but it very seldom dictates or outweighs strategy. I hope this game can fix the game mechanics to be more strategic. If players could lay down two cards instead and make a base attack/block/move option (like Gloomhaven has the basic attack or move) I think it would even be a step in the right direction.
… so hard to create a skirmish game (even with a bunch or ranged characters, spread-out objectives, behind enemy-lines deployment, etc) that doesn’t become a pile of troops battling it out in the middle.
I remember Steam Forged games saying that during a Guild Ball interview.
it's not a skirmish imho, arena, but not skirmish
Try Reload. Great game that sees the figures moving all over the map.
Thanks for the video. It helped me make the decision not to back this one. Hard to decide these days with so many games coming out.
I feel the decks should be smaller. Maybe at a size of 20 and allow to reshuffle it once before applying the wounds.
agree with this. we play Arkham Horror LCG with 15 card Investigator decks and the worst (-7, -5 etc Chaos Tokens omitted) and it has made the game so much 'better' for us.
This is why I will always comeback to watch your reviews, your honesty is unmatched.
There are things like smoke bombs and caltrops in this game (ninja).
All of the characters have their own unique cards which can be added to their decks. There are going to be multiple maps like bridge fights and fighting along the shoreline or in burning villages. A lot of the new characters depend on whether you decide to pledge for addons, but a lot of extra stuff has been added even for the basic pledge like new locations, new game modes and even physical terrain like trees, boulders or burning carts and row boats. I'm not saying that this review is right or wrong, but he has definitely not done his research (as he states near the start of the video) and this is the bare bones of the final product.
You kind of need to have a good look at the campaign page on kickstarter to get the full scope.
Why did i not see this review on bgg? needs to be there mate!
thanks for an honest review.. hate that review/previews often dosnt seem quite transparent enough anymore, thats why we come to you
Honestly don't have to worry cause my friend is getting it, so I will play it regardless, and I don't have to pay for it lol. I did give my friend your concerns with the randomness, and for him that is very in much with the theme, according to him in a real samurai duel it was random because they would always analyze what their opponents moves were going to be, which would lead to situations were someone would attack and another guy would move away and you would hit a tree, or an instance were both guys would block an attack that wasn't going to happen.
To be fair all positive reviews posted on the ks page are also old prototype,but for some reason if the review is negative then it’s not a valid review…Lol
Just to add (as someone who’s video is on the KS), the individual videos (Mine, Hungry Gamer’s etc.) are Previews and NOT Reviews. There is a definite difference in that a Preview is not representative of the finished game.
Not Bored Gaming I think that’s why this video is becoming so divisive, that distinction is important. Though it doesn’t help the matter that SSG headed the video section of the KS Review rather than Preview as well.
This review is why I'm a Patreon. It's honest and it shows both good points and bad. This game really intrigued me as I love the feudal Japanese themed games. After this review I feel it might be missing the mark, as too how strategic you can be. I hope the developer can still fix some of the issues, because the good points highlighted are great.
Just wanted to say I appreciate you! Exactly why I'm able to make videos like this.
IMO a critical look at a KS game is a great tool should they chose to use it :)
Hi. Just wondering what are your opinions on games such as battlecon, exceed, combo fighter? I do realise you might not habe played them. If you habe what did you like about them compaired to this? Thanks
Many game makers do this so they can trouble shoot problems that people have with the game before final release. We don't know how long KOA has had this prototype copy of the game it could have been a few weeks or a few months. Also I don't think it is fair to do a review of a prototype of a game as the final product could be different and fix most of his problems. Specifically I think most of his problems could be fixed by making cards have 2 options on them which seems doable . In addition the criticism of lack of customization is unwarranted because he doesn't have all the cards yet.
Also use of symbols as a negative is just nitpicking.
If it is 'not fair to review a prototype', the positive reviews from the KS page, made on the same prototype, should be removed and are not legit as well.
I don't think the designers believe their game have issues. So they wont fix anything, what you see is what you get.
@@yview7315 not true at all- played King on Monday night as demonstrable proof we are working to continually update and improve the game 🙂
very helpful review, that will help me make a good decision for me :). thanks!
Just coming back to this (I saw it early on but didn't comment at the time) to say thank you for this review. I don't agree with your conclusions here, but I had to do a lot of digging to find some of the information that swayed me, and some of it didn't exist at the time you got your prototype. Watching your video helped me to decide to back the game, and I've since increased my pledge right up to the deluxe all-in level. When your negative review explains the game well enough for someone with different tastes to be sold on the game you're saying is bad, you've done your job right!
So happy to hear you took in all the info to make a well informed decision of what is right for you! I appreciate the feedback and happy that my video was helpful in that process :)
@@TheKingofAverage Hey, I know it's old news now, but you've covered a lot of similar stories and it might be worth giving this game anotehr look. Not because of good reasons, unfortunately (even though the game is fun). Their handling of the KS communication post-funding was *horrific* and in some cases, questionable in its legality. Most KS projects accept either "it's a platform for pre-ordering the game" and give backers the respect due to a customer, while getting the money owed by one, or take the stance of "it's a platform for investing in a project" and give you the rights of an investor while holding you to the responsibilities of one. Some do a blurred line between the two, but the scummy ones try and go "if you're saying we owe you something as a customer, you're an investor, but as soon as you ask for what an investor has a right to, you'lre a customer instead, so we don't have to give you anything (even if you can justify it under either one)" and that's the approach SSG has taken toward things.
During the campaign, there's evidence that they knew before the KS mandated refund cutoff date, but "forgot" to mention until a year later, that they had changed plans on one of the stretch goals and the game which was advertised to get a linen finish didn't. During the campaign, they also drastically changed the scope and content of several other elements of the game, notably the "narratively-driven" campaign which ended up being a linear string of missions with the player only making a few limited card picks along the road, the second narrative campaign which turned into a handful of one-off scenarios instead of being another campaign, and the promised 3 books of campaign and scenario content which ended up being repackaged into 2. When backers pointed out (rightfully) that the content which had sold them on the game was no longer present, they just answered with "too bad, refund window expired" and tried to act like KS was somehow at fault and "not allowing" them to refund past that point, instead of acknowledging that they can absolutely refund the backer and the majority of successful KS projects have done so. There are several examples of the creators having been contacted by customers and shipping companies during a messy issue with delivering the product, and after more than 2 weeks of people telling them about a problem, they claimed to have "only just" been informed in spite of there already having been documented evidence proving that to be a lie.
They promised repeatedly during the campaign and shortly after it, that the game would be in the hands of backers before it went to retail, but in literally every single region on the planet, the game was available locally at retail (often in physical stores, but always at least from a local online retailer) before it was available to backers in that region, and in many cases, before *ANY* backers had received their copies, with most waiting multiple *MONTHS* past the date the game went to retail before seeing their pledges. There are still pledges waiting for their copies of the game to be shipped, and a lot of the reasons why just weren't communicated in an even remotely competent manner to backers. It's an absolutely atrocious mess, and a lot of the problems were out of their hands, but the *COMMUNICATION* about those problems was entirely on them, and they failed abysmally at it. And all through it, they keep assuring everyone that *THEY DID NOTHING WRONG* and have tried gaslighting backers over the problem instead of accepting blame on numerous occasions.
And all this is coming from someone who has my copy of the game, enjoys the game very much, and is still happy I backed it. Even though I'm glad I got this game, I expect them to take *MAJOR* steps to improve before I'll consider touching any of their projects in future. There are a lot of people much more upset at them than I am, and a lot of those *WITHOUT* good reason, jumping on the hate train the same way they jumped on the hype train. The information I've shared is stuff you can see at least some evidence for in the kS comments, on BGG, and other publicly-visible spaces. Some backers (and other angry people) have been throwing out accusations beyond the ones which can actually be demonstrated, claiming everything the company has done was fraudulent. There was an incident where a major disaster hit a port the game was scheduled to ship from, and it took them a month to tell us that their timeline had been affected by it. There were people who claimed (falsely) that they'd specificlaly confirmed the game to still be on track after being informed it was being delayed, which there's no evidence of (only a failure to communicate that it had been, when they knew there was a delay but not the exact details of how much of a delay it would turn into). The fact that they only admitted there was a delay after being angrily confronted about the lack of news didn't help the situation. But there are a few other situations where people have tried to call SSG out for crimes or failings that weren't even legit, alongside all the valid problems, and I think it's important to keep in mind that it's not *QUITE* as terrible as some people are trying to make it sound. Only almost...
I watched one play through of this game and I had many of the exact thoughts that you do. Pretty much every aspect of the game seemed so random especially the triangle indicating direction of each figure. Thanks for your thoughts, I will stick with Unmatched for my 2 player skirmish games.
I've heard good things about Unmatched. Seems if you have and enjoy that then this is a bit of a hard sell.
Thank you. Was watching this campaign and a bit upset I missed the 48hour early bird thing. Never noticed the randomness in the system. Thank you for pointing that out. Was hoping this would be a game I could pull out on a lonely afternoon and play solo a bit, being as the "AI" is completely random as well, I might very well just pass. Not completely decided yet, but it's nice to hear an honest review.
It's because there isn't a huge amount of randomness- come play me or a member of the community on TTS and we will hopefully change your mind!
So I backed this for the early bird because like you I thought it looked interesting. Now, it looks like exploding kittens with samurai. Also, I looked at the comments on the kickstarter, and the creator seems confused as to why you reviewed this...
Now I'm confused as to why he would send a prototype he didn't want reviewed to a person who does reviews...
Either way, I really appreciate the honest reviews as always! I will hang in a little bit longer to see if they can prove there is more to this game than just randomness.
Worth noting that this isn’t a prototype as much as a demo, or a proof of concept. The vast majority of the content isn’t there. And I’m not sure it would make sense to release a “review” of a game that isn’t finished and won’t even release for probably 18 months. Voidfall for example, has already undergone massive systemic changes versus what was seen during the Kickstarter. Think of how out of date a “review” would be for that game, given that it’s not even finished internally, let alone what content creators got their hands on.
@@shanerion The issue with this game is that even if you add hundred of cards, the gameplay loop is still absolutely horrific, bland, simple, luck based.
Ok so had my eye on this not giving up on it but that randomness needs fixing. Good review dude fair and honest with what you have received 👍
This is why Im subscribed to your channel. I backed the early bird just in case, but your review/impressions made me cancel my pledge. Its just not for me. I`ll save that money for harakiri and sankokushin instead for my Japan-fix in boardgames.
Thank you Micheal for your preview, I’m very similar to you in that I’m not one to enjoy a game that wins by chance, hence why I’m not a fan of Monopoly or Risk. Saved me money. :)
Hi was so hypped by this "little fast" game, with a theme i enjoy so much, but after this review i will just stick to my good (not too) old Aristeia !
About the lack of deck control, Maybe it could be a nice idea, to sort the cards in 2, 3 seperate decks (Attack - Defense - Utility (move etc..) and you just chose in wich pile you draw ! So you get a better chance having something you actually needs !
but i dont know if the game make that possible :)
might be interested if I didn't have Super Fantasy Brawl, but i'll keep that one over backing this
Does this still hold up in your opinion because the company post campaign has been pretty awful at communicating?
I actually played the game with the designer after this review and lost to him but just barely. It actually reinforced my opinion that it's fairly low on real strategy and more who best guesses better.
I tend to keep company drama out of reviews though if I can help it. Sucks though how the campaign has turned out as of late.
@@TheKingofAverage Thank you for the response. That makes a lot of sense. I would hope reviews don't have company drama in them which is why I enjoy your channel!
@@GarrettSeney happy to help :) I hope this finally delivers soon regardless!
This review , I love. Because I liked everything you liked and liked everything you didn't lol. For me I can see the thematic. I understand it as samurai fighting. I do hope it never has anything like Magic in it. Thank you for your honesty because I like the game more for it.
That's awesome to hear! Glad you used the video as just another data point to determine what's right for you :)
You are the King! I hope they have or will adress your legitimate concerns and views on the game. I was also hyped for the game - minimal time and table footprint is very attractive.
Very much looking forward to your comment on the demo on Monday, if I understood the plan right. I also hope for respectful comments from Stone Sword Games.
Keeping my early bird. For now...
Edit: Found KoA updated impression after demo game. Summary: Better but not good for KoA.
Agree, my first thought was: stone paper scissors in fancy
Hah! Yeah I can see that.
Thank you so much for this review. You saved me some money. You also helped
me understand that this game will never be the game I was hoping it would be, no matter how many layers of nuance are stacked on top of this base mechanic. The creators seem like genuinely passionate, nice guys, but I don’t think there’s any way this game would hold my interest. Boy is it gorgeous, though.
Such a good review and exactly what I thought of the game when I saw the Kickstarter. Thanks for verifying what I was concerned about. What's a better version of a game similar to this?
I've heard BattleCON is very much like this and people speak very well of it. It uses standees on a 2D battle mat but has beautiful artwork and is the same sort of "know your opponent" card counting slight programming experience. Since I've not played I can't comment on how often you end up like I do in Senjutsu with not being able to block for instance. I imagine the more straightforward map style helps a bit with this.
I’ve overtime cooled on skirmish games. I find many of them tooo restrictive. Often I have a cool idea but the cards won’t allow it. So left doing something dumb. I was never planning to back this. Honest reviews are great. There is too much hype everywhere. Does eveyone like every movie? Just because a movie cost 100m should we just give good reviews since we feel bad for them? Anyway… Keep it up.
not all are restrictive some are super tacrically and strategically deep and have near infinite replayability.
Thanks for the awesome review! Pretty lame you are getting some flak for sharing your thoughts. No game out there will please everyone, sitting at over $800k with 20 days to go, it seems silly to give you trouble at all for posting your honest opinion. The game is doing just fine financially.
Hardly any impact too since it's late. They've gone up in finding and backers. Ah well, can't please everyone :) glad you liked the video dude!
“He attacked air..” LOL! This is why I love these reviews. Cheers!
Happy to have ya here :)
Ty! Canceling my pledge you the best the game seemed alot better on paper
The randomness, not knowing initiative, card flip simultaneously part is an instant no for me. I own Gloomhaven and quit playing it because of that. I wish I had known, because I would have never bought it. Thank you for the review, brother. I WILL be skipping this game.
Hi Kent, you do get to know the initiative though- 25-40 of the cards you have, the opponent can also choose from and the Signature Cards (unique to the Samurai) use a Focus system to make sure there's a good level of card transparency.
@@stoneswordgames, I’m not trying to come down so hard on the game. I wrote my first response on my 10 minute break at work. So, I was in a hurry. From what the King described about the initiative and attacking nothing because your initiative was lower than your opponents is just reminded me of the main reason I quit playing Gloomhaven. We all hate missing our attacks in games. I’d just rather miss it because of a dice roll instead of a card flip. At least when I miss with a dice roll I’m precisely where I wanted to be. I honestly wish you the very best and I’m happy your game will be a reality. Cheers, mate.
Did you see the blocking cards, for example initiative 7/2, where you can decide when both cards are revealed, which ini you have?
And there are instant cards, the one's with the lightning symbol, that you can also play, over your revealed card. That way you can react, to the card your opponent revealed. I don't like Gloomhaven, too. :-)
I will check it out thoroughly on Kickstarter. It’s no problem. Again I am happy for your game becoming a reality. Take care.
How man. I really wanted to love this game. I really need a good solo narrative skirmish game... any alternatives ? @KoA: I love your honesty, but did you read the mail about the improvements they made ? Do you think it could help the strategy ?
I recieved no email, searched under the company name, the devs personal name and the game name and nothing. Unfortunate, but at the same time I can only review what I play. I did make comments about terrain, the green cards and the 72 personal cards - however that just lead me to talk about the symbols vs text on cards.
Fair review but something seems off? Other gameplay never have samurai just both blocking at the same time or hitting air. Everything had intention and never the level of 3 Stooges described in this video.
I know SSG has commented throughout the video saying the prototype used is the wrong one? Could be why certain things just did not click?
It's the same copy at Hungry Gamer's - literally from him. A popular review on BGG is titled after attacking air and HG spoke about it feeling like a knife fight in a phone booth, not too far off of my drunk samurai comment.
I just played the updated version, and it's certainly better. I still attacked the air and still ended up with a hand that allowed no way of attacking or defending, but it as better. Not a game for me but I'm sure plenty will love it. Gotta be the kind of person to count cards to really do well in it and I suck at that :)
@@TheKingofAverage Ah, shame to hear that. Well when all is said and done you gave it a fair chance. Differing opinions are good. Especially given the current shipping issues and ever rising costs of games on KS.
Appreciate the feedback and direct comment amigo.
and if i like the total random of the game? like a card showdown! 3 2 1 who have the highter card wins or do the right movement win
If you like it then that's awesome! It just a personal opinion, not God judging the game :)
Initially backed this KS, but due to the high price and its just a random-ish skirmish, I pulled out. But love its theme, miniatures and aesthetics.
Biggest factor though is the release month is same as Marvel United X-Men next year! lol. Can't focus on both big games.
I tried judging which games to back partially on their delivery dates. As you mentioned, I did not want two big games (or really two of any game) coming in the same month. Then the Illuminati unleashed Covid on the world, and suddenly the projected delivery dates for games is no longer related to reality.
For a while I was pretty sure this was a deliberate conspiracy against me. But then everyone around me started whispering that I was paranoid, so I realised it must have been an evil government program to destroy the game industry as a whole, and not just me personally.
To be honest I have to say that I like the idea of the 'randomness' If you have ever fought people there are times where you don't think quickly enough or of the right move. Sometimes your move misses because they just did something. Yeah, sorry but I think it's a positive.
My god, this is the most hilarious game review that I have ever seen. You can say that you didn´t like it, but maybe the intention is to create this Monthy Phyton bar fight that has no sense at all.
Just laughing so hard at your "not stories".
It feels a bit like playing an online video game with a very high pin, you need to guess the future.
Hahaha perfect! I should have said it just reminded me of playing on those Russian CS:Source servers...from America back in the day to get my point across better :D
The opinions of someone who didn't enjoy it is welcome to counter the hype. It sounds like SSG have emailed you some additional info but that's them to get their stakeholder management right (i.e. if they sent you a proof of concept, they should have really pre-briefed you).
However it this is deffo not a final version and so i do think you should tag that it is a prototype (or demonstrator) review - neither the title, description or opening remarks makes mention of this clear. just as we like your honest reviews, i do think you should be 'honest' about the version you are reviewing.
If you watched the video he does say its a prototype and also states it at the end again. Not much more he can do
@@cymraegddraig I've watched the video all the way through.The word prototype is not used in the videos TH-cam page title or description, and KoA does not verbally use the word in the chapter segmented 'Intro' (unless I've misheard); it is only written as the very final bullet of the second page of KoAs disclaimer. There is plenty more KoA can easily do, particularly when he is giving the game a hard time.
I welcome these hard reviews (although I do believe KoA needs to be more succinct when delivering negative points), KS games aren't cheap and the onus should be 100% on the creators to deliver a value offering to backers.
Partially off of KoAs prior comments and because of the early bird, I've backed in case this project is one of those 'hidden gems' but i'm not worried about it and want these non-FOMO, down-to-earth reviews but I do expect (particularly when its a hard nosed review) the context of the product (in this case a prototype (if that)) to be transparent, especially as KoA requests Patreon financial support - if you ask for coin you have to take the responsibility that comes with it.
@@rodneyaudley2980 He deffo does say its a prototype...
@@buddhawasright in the first 1minute and 8 seconds where is the word prototype used?
I list it in the giant disclaimer right after my hello intro segment as well as during the final pros and cons and it's a review for an unreleased product. At some point I have to assume viewers can both watch the video and realize how early copies of unreleased product are....well early copies.
I've done a ton of reviews. This sort of pendantic focus on wording is only brought up when I'm negative. Not once ever has someone fussed so much when the review is positive. Ever. I understand not agreeing with me, that's totally fine. But let's not pretend to hold some ideal differently just to try and say in this one case I didn't do my due diligence.
Thank you for your honesty (as always!). And you’re right about how this kind of review is in the best interest of both the consumer AND the game designer. I mean, I know it’s not easy to hear on their part but that’s ultimately how you can learn and come back even better. Thanks for not compromising!
It's not fun and it makes people dislike me, but it's worth it and happy to always let you guys know what I really think about stuff :) In the end my video isn't for a company, it's for you!
My network sucks. Constantly buffering, rare clear pictures. So frustrating but as always thanks for the BS free review.
I was wondering about the hype around this game myself. Doesn't seem to be doing more - or less - than other card-based skirmish games. Perhaps it's the feudal Japan theme.
Yeah...samurai themes are almost a guaranteed sale booster.
Theme helps, but also it does honestly play differently than many. It's super heavy into card counting, and has a programming element to it as well as you are trying to guess where the state of the game will be when it's your turn.
I don't like it, but that's just my preference. For many, this is a niche that's largely untouched I think.
Looking at the gameplay in the kickstarter, I'm going all in on this game. It has clearly moved past this prototype version and the gameplay I've seen looks great. I've not seen a skirmish board game that flows like this before and is far more about manoeuvring than just smashing into each other. A damn shame to see such a cool game condemned by outdated rules
Outdated rules and a fraction of the components. RIP
So I see Marvel t shirt... Are we going to see Marvel Crisis Protocol at some point?
I guess.. Even a dice roll you always i one chance in 6 to defend.
What would you recommend over this? 😊 Really appreciate your honest review - it's very hard to do that! Well done 👍🏻
Same question... what are your top skirmish games?
Mythic Battles
For mostly card based with miniatures for positioning? Twisted Fables easily.
Bushido by GCT studious.
Maybe this could have been a good deckbuilding game, with a basic starting deck that guarantees a variety of block, movement and attack in your initial hand, and a market to build the deck with special moves' cards bought with "qi" points or something like that. As it is, it focuses more on deckbuilding before playing, and not my kind of thing
Domo arigato! I was excpecting Senjutsu would manage to capture the art of ancient samurai warfare in some way. It seems this game is only a nice piece of Japanese lookin art. 🧐Will save my money now and wait for the development of the game.
This is so disappointing.
As a solo gamer, I had high hopes. Feudal Japan is my theme. It’s close to my heart. Unfortunately, there are no dungeon crawlers/skirmish games set here (other than SoB: Forbidden Fortress, which I own, and Yokai Quest..).
High hopes for Harakiri!!
Okko Chronicles
Bushido by GCT studious is the game you are looking for my friend, no solo mode though.
@@alexpartenopei1021 I’ve heard from owners the solo play is long and tedious.
Thanks for saving me $200!
You are very welcome :) Not everyday I get you guys to save any money, normally the other way around lol :)
Great review. Will stick to BattleCON for excellent 1v1 duals =P
I've heard good things about BattleCON, need to look into i tmore.
@@TheKingofAverage Highly recommend it, but try to play with a 4th edition set if you can as the cards and rules are much more clear (and balanced). They just updated the game to the final version (v4) recently and literally reprinted every single character card (I think about 85 old characters needed to be totally reprinted). Sent updated cards to all the backers of the recent KS free of charge which was pretty nuts.
I was really excited for Fractals blind tactic play in combat. Watching the plays on this was a big turn off. Seemed way to random rather than tactical. Easy pass.
The huge difference is that in Fractal you always know what cards your opponent has in hand and vice versa. Thats where the bluffing comes from.
Always coming in hard with an honest opinion. That is why I love this channel!
EDIT: Saw the pinned post.
I pinned a comment on it. Have no such email. Searched under the dev's personal name, their company name and the game name and have nothing turn up so that's unfortunate. Of course this is the same copy Hungry Gamer got and his review is posted on the page so the only reason this is being called out for giving opinions on an old copy is because it was negative - which isn't fair. I did my job, same as him, we just had different takes on it is all :)
And I did mention the green cards, the cards specific to them, but because they are just the same symbols grouped differently there's no real depth there I feel, which is what lead me to talk about the symbols vs words in a card game. I mentioned terrain as well and the new status effect, both in a positive light. People just focus on the negative usually as human beings so it's forgotten :)
@@TheKingofAverage Thank you for addressing it! This again shows your integrity in being an unbiased reviewer. Really appreciate the effort and work you put into all your videos. Keep on being a class act. 👍
No worries, you know I'm always happy to chat :) have a good weekend dude!
Thanks for your honest review! I’m actually relieved when I see negative reviews for a cool looking game as it means I’m not missing out on much 😅
Great review! I was 80% out already, but now I am 100% convinced that I can pass on this one :-)
Oh man this is interesting, I didn’t pledge this game because of the graphics, there is no interesting graphics, but you also point other gameplay issue… I love twisted fable and looks this one is really faraway from it
I adore Twisted Fables as well. For my tastes at least, that's the better pick though if you are looking for a free-for-all then TF doesn't really provide that well.
@@TheKingofAverage True also TF is not for everyone but the art is sublime and even my wife enjoy it... In any case there are too many games on this period thanks to help us to make a choice (Hopefully a good one)
Fair enough as review goes, unfortunately the game is now in a much more advanced state & beyond the simplistic analysis offered here. Randomness has been significantly addressed, and with additional character types them is evoked much more strongly that the prototype reviewed. So thanks for the review but I think you've pulled the hot trigger too soon on this one.
I've played the latest on TTS and it did not change my view of things at all. Ended up unable to block or move faster than a 3 at one point so just stood there with my back to them with nothing to do but take a hit. The entire game I only got a few block cards.
I'm sure plenty of people will love it, it's very card counting focused with some programming built into it which many enjoy, but to say randomness is gone is not something I experienced. I was still left unable to do basic things thanks to bad draws.
If it had changed my mind I'd 100% have made an updated video on it.
This reminds me mechanic from Cactus Town, which I've backed. I'm getting worried CT will be as random and chaotic as this one :/
Thanks again for the honest review. This game is a pass for me. I will spend my gaming time playing proven games like Ignite and Summoner wars 2nd edition instead. Too many games, and not enough time to play them all anyways.
That last part I totally feel. :D
Check out Bushido by GCT studious, it's this theme but with superior gameplay, better miniatures and you don't have to wait 2 years for it to arrive on your door step.
This game isn't worth the price. Screw the hype
Appreciate the honest review and criticisms of the game, too many kickstarter shills/FOMO enablers on youtube nowadays.
You're quite welcome! Seems according to some every month there's a new best game ever :D