Can you actually win the wrong way in football?
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Negative tactics, parking the bus, running the game down - genuine ways of playing football, or personal opinion?
Certain managers will be synonymous with “negative football”, but is it fair to use that term?
Jon Mackenzie writes, Henry Cooke.
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#Mourinho #Tactics - กีฬา
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Our mistake: 2014-15 for Jose Mourinho's last domestic league title.
you need to pin this comment
Go make a video on that season pls if you want an apology
could you make the video on how genius Mourinho was to be able to win the 2010 UCL, he broke the dominance era of the greatest squad of all time, the 2009-2011 Barcelona. where they have Xavi + Iniesta (2 Euros + WC) + Messi (7 times Baloon Dór), and Mou defeated them with a freakin Inter Milan.
You good time to fix it, videos only been up for 30 min
Another important thing to mention, for the second half of that season Mourinho's Chelsea more often than not played negatively after a superb first half of the Season. Ever since Kane led a 5-3 win against Chelsea at White Hart Lane, in big games Chelsea would employ a DM in the form of Kurt Zouma and would rely on basically Hazard or Set Pieces to get a results to mixed effectiveness. It was enough in the end for Mourinho's Chelsea but it does demonstrate that would be the last real success of 'negative' football. There is Diego Simeoni's 2020-21 La LIga win as well to reference but that is as much Athletico Madrid's quality as Barcelona and Real Madrid's lack of quality.
Mourinho won the PL with Chelsea in 2014-15, so technically that’s his last League title
Paused the video to comment this, glad it's already been done
Me too bro 🤣🤣🤣
A rare TIFO mistake, well I never
And Chelsea played so fun football that season. Hazard, Fabregas, and Costa was unstoppable
Even Tifo doesnt respect Chelsea
This man didn't lose a single home league game between March 2002 and April 2011. That's 9 years and 150 games.
This is wrong.
@@sidneyabeljumbo2364 this is accurate
How?
@@foa0695 by not conceding more goals than the opposition
Sunderland still haven't been presented with our 'Beating Jose at SB' Cup yet
i dont want to live in a world where only high press and tiki taka exist tbh. tactical diversity is what makes the game interesting
Europa league semi final second leg 28% possession 1 shot 0 on target 0.04 XG.
@@Dand40 chad mourinho cup masterclass
Tactics like mourinho's below in lower tier of a competition such as UCEL, there are no space for that kind of tactics in top level competition
@@aminfronteroand yet he wins them without using top tier teams
@@Deathmare235 Even moyes won UCEL with west ham. I guess mourinho's not that good now
Correction on Mourinho's name, Tifo. Jose himself told the reporters that his name pronounced with a hard J because he's Portuguese not Spanish. It's Jose like in [Diogo] Jota. We dont say Diogo Hota.
I don’t know why he’s pronounced it like that, Jose has been pretty clear on his name since 2004
People usually do the same with Gabriel Jesus. Their normal pronounciation is closer to the correct, but they insist on using the spanish pronounciation
As a portuguese person i'm fine with it. Just as if you hear me speak english my pronunciation won't be perfect.
Then again other portuguese people will get very offended by the "hosé" pronunciation so this is just my personal opinion.
@UC2evxxtCrzLzrSLFXRb0tbQ The problem is that their normal pronounciation is actually more correct than this "hispanic" one
@@nunofoo8620 the problem is Jose himself clarified about this thing multiple times. Doesn't matter your opinion or even as fellow Portuguese, you are not him
Of all Jose images to draw, they picked this one. Brilliant
Mourinho’s last league title was in 14/15
A W is a W at the end of the day, regardless of tactics. Not every team has the luxury of possessing an abundance of forward thinking attacking players, therefore you have to make the best out of what you have. Jose Mourinho won leagues, and the Champions League with Inter this way, Antonio Conte has won leagues this way, and Simeone has won Spanish Leagues and got to latter stages of Champions League several times. The 'negative' tactics do work.
Mourinho done it with Porto aswell , even crazier
It's not negative at all though.It's just the negative mindset of audience towards this style.
spurs literally park the bus against likes of nottingham forest lol
@@tomyyy5155 what's the score? 2-0 win 👍
@@mxsthxted i'm reacting to the "not every team has luxury of playing attacking football" how much spurs spend to play probably worst football in PL this season so far? they got the points, fair play to them, but probably not one spurs fan can say they enjoy watching this.
"negative tactics" will always be there imo. its like the dark arts. even at the top level you have to have some aspect of it to win a game. and a fierce mid block can often be very hard to coach. and i for one appreciate a good defensive block from a team. imagine all 11 player doing their duties properly and each and every one is in sync with the other. thats amazing.
That is amazing and doesn't happen. There is a reason why positive teams keep winning titles and defensive teams just put some pressure on. Also, the dark arts hurt the team that uses them the most. It means they are good at not playing, the players don't improve and the team does not get better at playing the game. They cheat their way into results but here's the thing about cheating... It depends on the ref.
People remember the winners. The winners are recorded in the history books. Their play style won't be recorded.
Dark arts or not, it's just a win at all costs attitude. Fans on the winning side celebrate it, fans on the losing side complain about it. I know which side I rather be on.
@@ThatGuy-tx4vm really? So how did city Liverpool barca Bayern and juve win almost all the titled in last 15 years? They did the MOST cheating by far. In player recruitment, referee and FA harassment, bribery, accounting scams, and of course tactical fouling twice as more than any other clubs in their leagues, time wasting, set piece holding, you name it. They are filthy clubs with no soul and they will all be insolvent before they win much more.
Last time I Checked , Germany and Spain were the last teams to win a major honor, playing so called "positive, front-foot or modern football" . Most recently France, Italy and Portugal won playing on the counter, which implies absorbing pressure most of the time. Also Real Madrid have done this best , winning multiple UCL trophies. Man City for example, I believe they dominate in England because everyone dreams and tries playing like them whilst possessing lesser squads. If teams played to their strengths , it would be a different story. For instance City came from behind on Some three games to win because opposition could not close them down...
@@ahb0102 City dominate because teams sit back and counter. They’re too scared to press city
The problem with Diego's Athletico is not their negativity, it is the fact that, as we saw when they played Man City, they are better and more deadly when they take initiative, and they totally have the players to do so. They totally bossed the return fixture in last year's Champions League, but it was already too late by then..
Exactly. There's nothing wrong with a low block - if you're playing against a much stronger side, you absolutely should play in a way that gives you a chance to win. What bothers people is when:
- you have the players to play much more effective and enjoyable football
- when you still don't get results, despite using these tactics (Cruyff once said that Mourinho is the type of manager that is only loved as long as he gets results, and that's 100% true)
They can only keep that intensity up for so long. The way they played over the 2 legs gave them the best chance of winning the tie
I don't agree... last year they won against Porto away in the UCL group stage and went past it because they played a low cohesive block, wasted time and attacked even less than usual. At home, they tied the game because they tried to be a little bit more positive and have initiative. Teams and managers play as they want and know how to with, of course, dangers. Mourinho's Roma just got killed by Udinese 4-0, and they are miles better
Keeping such an intensity for 180 minutes against a side with much superior players would be impossible, which is why Atlético played that way for only 45 minutes. city wouldn't even allow Atlético to take such an initiative if they weren't already ahead
@@manbeinganatletifanishard.8625 Not really "much superior players", though. I don't know why so many Atletico fans have such an inferiority complex. Swap the coaches, Guardiola to Atletico and Simeone to City, and people would see Atletico as the favourites.
Fun Fact: if Roma wouldn't lose 4-0 to Udinese, this video might not've exist
no it existed, they just needed to wait for a Roma loss to publish it
How do you do a study about mourinho tactics and completely forget his second spell at chelsea where he won 4 titles including the Premier League 💀💀💀
Plot twist: They didn't do any study
Wasn't the last league title Mourinho won the one in 14/15 with Chelsea? Also Mourinho won the league with Madrid in 11/12, in 12/13 he went trophyless and got fired.
Still got them to 3 back to back UCL semi finals and I think broke the record for most goals scored in one la liga season. That was probably the most dangerous counter attacking team Europe will ever see. Mourinho's career was something special❤️
@@LilmeMusic that mourinho's real madrid was something🤌
@@LilmeMusic I appreciate what he did in Madrid, and his antics were certainly interesting to watch, but what Zidane and Ancelloti both did with very similar squads was much more impressive. I much prefer Mourinho back in his Porto and Inter days.
@@onetruecaesar99 none if their success would have happened if it wasn't for mourinho building the team in the first place
Agenda against Chelsea
Mou won the 2010 UCL with a treble, and it's special one, because he won it against the domination of the strongest squad of all time, The "Tiki Taka" Barca, with the combination of Xavi + Iniesta + Messi, a number 1,2,3 Baloon do'r, and Iniesta+Xavi them self won WC, and 2 Euro's back to back, no one notice this, but the fact that Mou won it with a freakin Inter Milan is miracle, Mou is indeed the special one.
I don’t think winning UCL with *that* Inter is any kind of miracle. Just take a look at that players:
Julio Cesar, Toldo, Maicon, Lucio, Samuel, Chivu, Cordoba, Santon, Materazzi, Zanetti, Motta, Muntari, Stankovic, Cambiasso, Sneijder, Quaresma, Pandev, Milito, Eto’o, Balotelli, (Mancini, Suazo and Vieira left during the winter transfer window)
It’s basically a dream-team.
@@andjelkozlotvor this team very strong on defensive and have good offensive fullbacks
@@andjelkozlotvor just take a look at them right after Mourinho left, same team, different pilot. and since you have time to google inter why don't you do the same and see the Barca squad, they won every tournament available for 3 years, the only trophy they failed to win has one same reason. Jose Mourinho.
@@TheDarkKnightRacist You're missing the point, bro. The matter is a little more complex. Of course Mourinho is one of the greatest. We can love him or love to hate him, but he made some great achievements. I just wanna say that he beat one of the strongest squads ever with one of the strongest squad ever. It's all about the details, you know.
Most of Mourinho's players were at the end of their careers (most of them were 30+, some of them 35, 36 or even 37!), but excellent players and what's the most important - they were hungry for the biggest success. However, Mou was the missing link and they won the famous treble. But what happened after that...
After that there was material fatigue, the players were exhausted, both physically and mentally (which is normal, considering all the circumstances). Many of them also played at the WC right after that, which made them even more exhausted. This caused a large number of injuries during the entire following season. Also, some players left, not many, but their replacements were not so good, and they changed the coach in the middle of that season. In spite of everything, that squad managed to beat Bayern once again, and guess what... without Mourinho! The same mighty Bayern who played in the UCL final for the next two seasons! The talent was doubtless as well as the exhaustion of Inter's players which could be best seen in the match against Tottenham, when they took a 4:0 lead and almost lost that lead at the end. The match ended 4:3. It was obvious that this team was finished (some would say Mourinho accelerated that process, some would say it's a Gareth Bale, and some other say both, however, it was a natural process...) and they've just couldn't repeat the previous success. Even Mourinho himself would not repeat the same success.
@@andjelkozlotvor you are missing a job, and i won't even bother to read whatever you wrote there mate, just want to reply to tell you that.
I actually really love a good defensive display. No better feeling than watching a team completely shut down the attack and creativity of world class footballers.
The mentality aspect is greatest in defense, where football IQ and brains can take advantage over talent and skill. Strong defensive mentality is underrated IMO, not always pretty but requires a tremendous amount of focus and skill in itself as well
Facts I have the same opinion. Strong Defensive mentality is underrated fr.
In efootball or fifa, I always set my team up in a 5 back, just defending compact and hitting on counter. Works like a charm most of the times and let's just say I got a few passionate messages from then 😂
@@mxsthxtedyou're a bus parking loser then
Over the years i've watched football with a more critical eye for tactics, I've started to appreciate the "negative" game as much, if not more than more attractive football, like the Arsenal team of the early noughties..
One of the best games of Champions League football I watched was the Inter Milan of Jose, holding off wave after wave of Barcelona attacks in the second leg of that semi final..
Jose said afterwards, to paraphrase "we didn't park the bus.... we parked a plane in front of the goal".
Completely subjective, I enjoy Spurs' explosive counter attacking play
Not surprising he got the Mourinho league title stat wrong. Man calls him "Hosé" instead of José despite him having an infamous rant about it early in his career
What man?
@@tremensdelirious His name name is Portuguese not Spanish.
@@yannick245 it’s not that important. I have a name that people always get wrong. Doesn’t bother me as people can make mistakes
@@tremensdelirious Me neither. It's Mourinho's problem.
Uncharacteristic of tifo to make such a poorly researched video:
- It's not hosay, it's Jose. He has mentioned that several times throughout his career.
- Jose won a league title with Chelsea in 14-15
Gabriel Haysus, Diogo Hota... the list goes on. It's baffling to me how people paid to commentate and produce worldwide football content haven't cottoned on that Portuguese and Spanish sounds are different.
Isn't it Yosé, or like a faint j? Pretty sure the English sound of j is exclusive to English.
@@shambhav9534 Portuguese is a hard J. Joe-say. Spanish is soft, ho-say.
English are known for mispronouncing names
Saying it's Jose not hosay is gotta be one of the dumbest ways I've seen that explained 😂😂
Hate him or not, he’s the first ever manager to have won the Champions League, Europa League and the Conference League.
Conference league isn't something to brag about, he has so many other noteworthy accomplishments. Not saying that was nothing.
@@rc.... even if it's the conference league, there's always something special about being the inaugural champions of a tournament.
@@rc.... try to win it with AS Roma, even Klopp failed to win the UEL, when Mou won it just a few years later.
And first managerial casualty of the Super League
@@modusoperandikm Super League never came to fruition did it?
IMO the best league title won by mourinho was Real Madrid 2011/12. That season was prime Ozil and Ronaldo combination and both the players were in their prime.
120 goals scored, wasn't it? A La Liga record that will take some beating.
Next video: Diego Simeone and the Dark Arts of football.
Klopp doesn't even manage in la liga or else he'll go mad 🤣🤣I mean honestly, teams in the prem leave much larger space (even conte's Tottenham) even when defending deep, you'll never see this much space given in la liga. Which is why even less technical players can get away with it cuz they're given much more space to operate in when they have the ball
Exactly my thoughts lol
Yes so many laliga teams park the bus
Laliga only have two big clubs rest others are just filling the numbers
Is that relate to Arsenal loss against Manchester United?
Because when Rashford scored his second goal,he get really so much space between Arsenal defender.
Bruh, klopp would die if he face cadiz at home
While I do love the amount of content Tifo puts out, I feel as if tifo is running out of topics to make videos about. And the videos they do make aren’t as in-depth as they used to be. This could have been a breakdown of parking the bus or high presses. Or maybe even what happens when two sides play negative football
correction: Mourinho did win a league title with Chelsea in 2014/15
"The tactic isn't negative. It's your attitude about the tactic that is negative."
The problem with using Mourinho as the poster boy for negative tactics is that you stir away from context concerning his past teams:
At United he had a poor squad so his solution was negative and counter attack
At spurs he had a poor backline and injury prone midfield
At Roma a poor backline and midfield that needs reinforcement if you watch serie A
So the question is are managers like Mourinho and Conte negative or adaptable?
If he is negative then Klopp comes out as hypocrite as he had no choice but to play cautious when his team were injury struck back in 20/21
Well said. Even Erik ten Hag is playing uncharacteristically on the break for his standards. That's just what he has to do to make the team win. Man Utd play better that way, so he adapted.
Maybe this is an unpopular opinion but I genuinely couldn't care less how my team plays as long as they win. I'm down to watch them park the bus every game, if that means they win I'll still be more than satisfied.
With every passing video and podcast, it becomes more obvious how important Alex Stewart’s influence was in making Tifo unique. His statistical and formational input provided a balance to the subjective editorials of Seb, and a quantifiable foundation on which to base the otherwise suppositional observations of the game’s trends.
Did they change him , cause I noticed his voice is different
@@kanuemma9387 this video is Seb, Alex left a couple months ago.
From this comment, it appears that you have attained a rather serious command of the English language.
This is not a sarcastic comment. I mean it.
@@christianindividual4550 having good command on english is not a big deal. People make it a big deal. Have command on better and more tough languages then it'd consider someone great.
Could not agree more. Also the proliferation of clickbait titles and content. I have been a sub since before the association with the Athletic and the content they provide has been more generic as time goes on.
Although not entirely related to the premise of this video, it's quite the irony how Klopp has in the past actually had the perfect squad to play the kind of reactive football Jose loves.
-an elite GK and CBs that dominate aerially (Alisson, VVD, Matip )
-pacy forwards to hit teams on the break (Mane, Salah)
-another forward that always tracks back and does his defensive duties (Firmino)
-midfielders that offer energy, discipline and covering (Hendo, Fabinho, Wijnaldum)
As an added bonus, you even have an elite passer in Alexander -Arnold who could pick out runners in behind. Plus playing deeper would mean Trent doesn't get caught out of position high up the pitch as much.
Mourinho plays negatively in cup ties, but his teams have played ambitious attacking football in league games and he's employed a lot of pressing. His RM team set La Liga goal scoring records.
Mourinho will blast Trent for his defence
@@jdc6354 he wouldn't because trent makes up for it in attack
You make a good point. In this squad, you have disciplined players. Players that have that hunger to win. Players that run every inch. If mourinho would manage this team, I’m sure he could make them play a similar style like that Madrid from 11-12 season.
@@dftknight nah not really. Mourinho’s Madrid tactic was heavily rely on fast counter attacking football. In order to make it effective is to sit deeper while defending and let the opposition have the possession. That’s why you don’t see Madrid control the possession against any decent team during Mourinho’s tenure
And the reason they scored many goals are because Madrid’s attacking forces are so clinical. You can look up on TH-cam. More than 80% of Mourinho’s Madrid goals came from counter attack. Hence, Mourinho’s Madrid earned the name “team with the fastest counter attack in the world”
If parking the bus is negative.... Then so is keeping meaningless possession, that tiki taka stuff
It's just a corny way of gatekeeping football. There is no right way of playing the game.
not only jose, simeone, allegri, conte and some other managers use this style, there are different variations but the principle is same, sit deep and hit on the counter
People need to accept that "negative" tactics, as they're defined here, are an objective reality of football and defense. No team can guarantee possession and the onus is on the offense to break down a defense. The highest profile games, as in the champions league, will highlight the disparity between teams and be reflected in the possession numbers and the pressure to win is going to force teams to do what's necessary, even if it's not artful in some people's eyes. Even as weaker teams improve and strong teams plateau and the gap in quality closes, there's no reason not to park the bus if it effectively shuts down the opponents offensive production. If it works against anyone's system they should really just admit that their offense is too one dimensional and is too easy shut down and should innovate opposed to complain
I don't think this covers a lot of context though, with all due respect. The problem in using Jose is an example is a bit flawed and this topic probably needs at least 20-min video, since there are teams that fairly successful, even recently, by employing defensive tactics like Nuno's Wolves, Union Berlin, SC Freiburg, and even teams like Burnley. Atleti also enjoy success recently by winning 2021's La Liga.
Jose is a manager that needs high-profile players. His first Chelsea team probably cost as much as City back then. In United and Spurs he was given pebbles to go to war with. He went from having Terry to Bailly and Sanchez at the back. Jose's style needs good CBs and many of his players are liability defensively.
As a Spurs fan, i would say also his toxicity stinks up the dressing room, so the players may have underperformed because of that. I think this is why Conte is more successful than Jose. Conte basically speaks Eric Dier as one that 'could be the best in the world in his position' while Jose criticizes him as lacking confidence, obviously both are asking him to 'try harder' with different words.
So lot of factors could affect the team regardless of tactics.
Exactly mate
I agree that Atleti has been successful at employing these tactics at a top level, but I wouldn't describe Nuno's Wolves and Burnley as "top level sides". They did well in the most competitive league in the world, but what Tifo means is being successful in the CL, and fighting for league titles.
Mourinho's biggest problem currently is his man managing, imo, despite many people on the internet being sure that he is some sort of football god, who motivates everyone except lazy players. These people are probably not familiar with how toxic his Madrid side was from the beginning, and how toxic most of his teams were by the time he left them.
Facts. This video barley even touched the surface of defensive football.
@@onetruecaesar99 I would argue that his 'toxicity' is what made Madrid the mental monsters that broke prime Barca dominance and would later win 4 UCLs in 5 years without necessarily outclassing everyone in those victories. One can clearly see the difference in mentality at Madrid pre-Mourinho and post-Mourinho.
@@onetruecaesar99
Then i think Simeone's Atletico and Conte's Inter and Chelsea could be a good example. I would sneak Gareth SouthGOAT's England as well.
I agree with that Mourinho part. His failure is mostly on man-management. You could see how toxic he was when he visited that Zagreb dressing room and congratulated them.
I think people bought his image because of the classic 'underdog' story with Porto. That would sway a lot of bias. I mean, you could still find quite a lot who thinks Leicester's owner or Ranieri is like some kind of godsend.
I don't understand how you can watch games and listen to pundits for decades and still call him "Ho-say"
Hoe say Jose
Part of the beauty of football is how many different ways there are to approach such a simple game. Negative tactics are just one of many ways to play the game and cannot be left behind.
Mourinho once said, "To be champion when you are not the best team, you have to be more strategic than philosophical."
He won the Premier league title at Chelsea after Real Madrid, before going to Manchester United
The individual pressure on a manager to secure points/wins at any price and the collective pressure on football as a whole to deliver an exiting and watchable spectacle are sometimes at odds here and I find that interesting.
I hate how the use of counter attacking football has become a rod to beat teams and managers with. If it works it works. But the amount of use as a negative term eventually leads to all meaning of the terminology bleeding out and becoming more vague, to the point that now I think in most peoples minds "count attacking" means "any goal where one pass has put an attacker through 1 on 1 with the keeper is just counter attacking, regardless of how long the team has held the ball". Like United's win against Arsenal yesterday, fans are already saying United just scored on the counter, trying to beat Ten Hag with the same rod they've been using for years on Mourinho and Ole, even though the first goal came through sustained possession, the second through good pressing and the third came from playing out of a press.
The main objective of sport should be to win, doing that in an entertaining way is only a bonus
Also, it is Jose with the "juh" sound because its Portuguese, not Spanish.
I'm sorry but this is a stupid debate. Defense is half of the game, and if your greatest chance to win a game is to have a mid or low block and smash the opponent at the counter it's totally fine to do that even if some people are going to be salty about it. Managers don't get paid based on pretty play, they get paid based on results.
Mourinho is really underrated in England.Goated manager fr.🔥
No he isn't. He started with Porto but it was with Chelsea that he became the Special One so no, he is not really underrated in England or anywhere!
@Red eyed Wolf lol bs. He didn't fail at Real Madrid lmao, he would've won UCL had Ramos, Kaka and Ronaldo not miss penalty, and he won La Liga agains the greatest team of all time.
The other narrator>
Yes, Seb needs language therapy
Juventus 1-0 Chelsea where Juventus scored early and just sat back for the rest of the game was a brilliant example of how negative tactics can be just as high level. Id argue that to constantly win in a negative way requires more skill than constantly winning positively
The only negative tactics is winning on the desk rather than the field, as Guardiola's Barcelona did
What is called "negative" and "positive" tactics could easily be relabeled "defensive" and "offensive", respectively. Defensive tactics certainly have a place in football and can be great against some teams even if it's boring to watch.
Mourinho didn't win all his titels with negative football. With Chelsea, Real and Inter he had two dominant teams that always played forward and scored record number of goals.
It would make more sense to replace the term "negative football" with reactive Football
with it's opposite simply being Pro-Active Football
With Pro Active Football aiming to basically Win faster than your Opponent, Creating Chances by actively building Play
And Reactive Football then being defending and byding your time until the opportunity strikes
Neither Tactic is inherently bad, one might counter with the simple truthful statement that to win you need to score goals, but at the same time you need to keep your goal tally higher than your opponents and some teams, through schedule load, training, offensive talent, etc. just aren't as keen on just going Pro Active
As in any Reactive situations though you are betting on your opposition to make mistakes that you can exploit, which at the Top Tier of Play gets rarer and rarer
Mourinho is counter defensive by denying the opponet to play, athletico is ultradefensive then dont allow midfileders to leave the CBs and use the wingbacks to wip in crosses from the side,thats why they have tall strikers who can jump
sometimes a good defence is more impressive than a good attack
especially then said defence is put up against said attack. There needs to be diversity in tactics.
The single biggest reason "negative" tactics don't work in modern football is the crop of players that is available, against what was available in the past. Clubs can certainly play any kind of football with the right players and it will be successful. But for that you may have to sacrifice players that are more talented for the ones who fit in the system well enough. See how may attacking mids have Madrid given up on through the tenures of last 4 managers, Isco, Asensio, Odegaard and James. All managers preferred the system over quality of individuals and the results show for it. This is a tested and tried approach to win trophies on the other hand though there is an "excellence" approach where you are always looking to improve, experiment and invest like Pep's City. What they do is sign a quality player and mold their system to accommodate. This approach is all about optimizing for quality on all areas of pitch rather than following a set approach and playing only the players good for that role. All clubs that now struggle with keeping up with their identity like Atleti are facing a dilemma, do we sign quality? or do we sign the better fit? That confusion shows in results. Thomas Lemar is never an Atleti player by a million miles, but there he is. Simeone struggles to find complete midfielders like Tiago and Gabi who can press, pass horizontally and vertically, make runs, shoot and dribble. Modern players are more specialised. Thus the dilemma. But there is hope for such systems in certain parts of the footballing world that scouts are just discovering fully. There are players with most extraordinary set of attributes the kind of attributes we wouldn't expect a European or South American player to have together. Like physicality, acceleration and a good touch. This combination was tough to imagine in 10 years that have passed but here is Haaland tearing apart all stereotypes. Workrate and tackling with creativity. There have not been many players with this kind of set. But in past there were like Simeone himself played as a no 10 in a copa america when maradona was injured, this shows just how complete of football players these guys were and how the modern generation just lost the plot being complete footballers. Some areas in scouting world would be key in providing the "negative" systems with the necessary fuel they need to survive and keep winning. x.
I think an element of the “negative” here is that “negative” tactics require the opponent to come to you to work. Two teams who both play negative tactics really isn’t what we watch football for. As a Man Utd fan, that was painfully the case in so many games in recent seasons, where the opponent would sit deep as an underdog, but Man Utd also work best when counterattacking, so it just became a hilariously boring affair. It’s like being “fashionably late” - it only works if everyone else is on time.
It's actually interesting to see what happens when both teams who play this style how will they score and win. It's subjective you might not like it. But i atleast appreciate it.
You didn't find too many supporters of Jose's style while he was at United even though he's been their most successful manager since Ferguson, that should probably answer that question!
Yes, the emphasis from fans on how the goals are scored ("Gerd Muller was 'just' a poacher, he's not actually a good footballer" as an example opinion I've heard) seems to dominate the conversation regardless of context. Every Manchester United win in the past few years that has come through counter-attacking (Ole-ball) has come with demands from fans that "We don't want to play this way." It's pathetic.
And considering just how much football teams are having to play now if they want to be truly successful, it's simply not reasonable to expect the kind of 'press press press' game people want for 90 minutes per match for 65 matches.
Atletico madrid won the la liga 1 season ago. Milan and inter dominate serie A more than Juventus. Mourinho plays positive football at Roma. Football style is essentially an optimization to suit the strengths and weaknesses of the players at hand along with the opposition to be faced. The only teams that don't play "negative" football are the ones that are highly privileged to have the best players at every position. Negative football is how teams like lyon, tottenham and monaco beat man city- negative football makes underdog stories possible. Negative footbal is a great thing, if it is a thing at all.
Jose's reputation is not deserved. The first time around his Chelsea were scoring goals for fun, and when he played Ferguson and won in the Champions League final United were playing a low block. He has not had the best teams to manage for a long time and the games that he has managed force a more negative approach. Not every single time but most of the times.
No one called Guardiola's Barcelona tactic of boring the other team to death "negative". No one called Brian Clough's counter-attacking Forest team "negative". No one said Ali's win over Foreman was "negative boxing".
I fully agree that weaker teams don't need to sit deep against stronger sides. Because especially man city and liverpool know how to possess the ball and create chances. So the best thing is to keep them away from the goal by applying a aggressive or controlled mid-block pressure
Free flowing defensive tactics are the next wave. Teams should use different tactics throughout the game to keep the opponent off balance. If I were a manager I would set up different time scales every match. For example high press for the first 10 minutes, go into a low block the next 15 minutes, then finish the rest of the half in a mid block. Then come out of in the 2nd half in a low block, then high press for 5 minutes, go back into a low block for 10 minutes then alternate between a mid block and high press the rest of the 2nd half. Do something different every minute of every game in attack and defense. The players need to be intelligent jacks of all trades for it to work. Taking another page out of Cruyff's total football.
i suppose the problem with "negative football" is when teams adopt it as their playstyle throughout their season, rather than for difficult fixtures were it would be advantageous to change tactics, jose mourinho's style became the defining playstyle rather than a one of basis,
To give some more context to it
Counter- attacking football is also an extended version of these negative tactics provided that the team parking the bus has a clinical/clutch attack with pace, decent finishing etc.
And this approach is often used in the finals where not conceding a goal is more important than scoring one that's why finals often tend to be low- scoring when both teams are equal on paper!
eg Real vs Liverpool UCL final 2022
The "I feel so save was." Was so sweet it made me smile
Mou is different as he counters more than most teams, unlike atleti who will park the bus with nobody up front. Even at madrid he "parked the bus" but got them to score 121 goals.
So 121 goals and 100+ points is negative? Still a European record. Respect, man, respect 🤫
It is also Jo Say, not Ho Say Mourinho
There nothing more unattractive in football, than grown men getting upset at being tactically beaten.
It's kind of amazing that journalists who do so much research still don't know how to pronounce Jose Mourinho's first name.
The metal gear solid 4 reference, "old snake" Mourinho at 2:18 probably went over people's heads. Nice one haha
I have a lot to say on this topic, spurred from internal reflections but in summary for me;
"if it's not counter-attacking football, it's negative football"
No one wins a big title without scoring goals. There are world class attackers, midfielders.... and defenders. There are multiple ways to approach the objective of scoring more goals than the opposition, or achieving a specific bigger target in the case of league fixtures.
"Negative" tactics are still trying to win a game, a title, or achieving a specific objective. Running around without the ball in a high press is as much negative as sitting deeper without the ball. As long as there are no underachievements, there is no such thing as negative tactics.
Tifo is a Mou hater!
Put some respect on the greatest tactician of the past 20yrs
Totally true.
It’s difficult to say Mourinho is behind, look at the teams he has coached - Ronaldo/Ozil to Rashford/Martial for example. Give him his players and he’ll deliver.
Reality is re Klopp, his team are a defensive side, they just defend higher up the pitch…. But most of Liverpool’s goals come not from elegant flowing football with graceful and artistic playmakers, but through pouncing on the opposition when they have the ball and having predatory attackers…
They aren’t a total footballing side so he should get off his high horse.
Wait who the heck is this guy??? The outro made me comfortable again
Great video ! love the way it was done and the narration was crisp
Completely left out of perspective: Back in the years Mourinho coached top top tier teams. Now he is coaching 2nd row teams for quite a while. That's just a challenge on a different level to win domestic or even international Top tiltles with the likes of Chelsea & ManU (washed up), Tottenham and AS Rome.
And imagine even with the washed up Chelsea he brought them back into success and won 14/15 the Prem League.
Negative tactics in one word : France
A high class team of Afrikan players sitting deep and focusing on counter attacks by relying on the referee not to award fouls, penalties against them and diving at every opportunity.
Inaccurate analysis. Yes Mou block others but he also maximise his teams’ strengths to win. Which means by logic the other manager is unable to negate Jose’s attacking football. By definition, to win you must score more goals than the opponent. And be it Guardiola or other managers, they could not outsmart Mou. What football analysts are confused about and conflating is two things about Mou’s persona and his football tactics.
What's interesting is the very very best teams have always been able to play all styles of football and win. Real Madrid have been the absolute best at playing with such a wide variety of styles.
Not me playing Fifa with the fullbacks and 2 CDMs on stay back while attacking
“You still have to score goals” as if Mous Real Madrid didn’t set the record for most goals
Doesn’t he insist his name is pronounced “joe-say”? If yes, shouldn’t this video be taken down and redubbed?
Pointless debate. The reward (points in leagues, progression in cups) is based on winning not on style. If a team feels being defensive or boring gives them the reward then they are going to do it.
Also, I feel this matters more for neutrals than actual supporters of those clubs. A team that plays negative football is one I probably won't bother watching the highlights of but if I support that team then I'll happily accept it if it meant we won a league/cup. When Leicester won the league playing counter attacking football against 'better' sides I didn't hear any Leicester fans complaining they didn't look like a Guadiola team!
Besides, I think football is better when there is a variety of styles, including negative ones. It keeps it interesting and intriguing.
The only thing 'negative' in football is losing.
Tifo said a thing wrong at 2:32 Mourihno's last league title came at Chelsea in 2014-15.
it's like tifo produce this video without doing some homework .
I find Mourinho, Conte, and Simeone’s tactics much more effective in knockout competitions than in a 38-game league season
That intro drum beat sounds oddly familiar. Almost like a slightly muted version of an oft memed intro to another genre of audio visual media.
This video had so many factual errors...
The fact Mourinho actually coined the phrase 'Parking the bus' - when complaining about Ramos' Spurs side who went to Stamford Bridge who explicitly went there to eek out a 0-0 draw - is pretty ironic
If you watched that game spura were literally just putting bodies inside the penalty area the whole game. Thats the real park the bus. The so-called football experts like fans and journalists misused that term, or rather they exaggerate it to mean any defensive football. Which is sad
@@KarabauPlay 100% agree. I remember that game and it was quite different to low block/counter attack that people call ‘park the bus’ now.
Defensive football is real football. Sitting deep and defending is what makes football beautiful.
The misconception is that Conte, Simeone and Mourinho all have low possession over their career's, but some seasons (only stats i could find) show them all over 50%. It is just over 50 but you would think it would be 40% the way people talk about their 'style'. Possession stats only do not work in final 7 games of CL and cup finals where winners of possession do not necessarily win the game. that is only 8-9 games a season, so you could say Conte, Simeone and Mourinho are all successful because they have more possession for 95% of their games, and in the 5% their choice not to have the ball works in their favour. If possession wins 95% of games then why are we so obsessed with styles? The rules of the game and stats should dictate how we play, not our tastes and whims.
Also this video is wrong, you said the last league Jose won was with Real Madrid in 2012. It was actually 2015 with Chelsea..
There’s no such thing as negative tactics. Mourinho and Pep are two sides of the same coin - both want to control the game using different approaches. One does it with possession, the other does it with a solid midblock.
First of All, It's José not Hosé.
He had corrected that for us in All or Nothing series.
As a HNK Hajduk Split fan, i want them to play more defensely againts dinamo Zagreb and Osijek because of dinamos squad quality roosters and Osijeks defense tactics, while againts other 7 teams in the league play an attacking football
Hearing about Mourinho is all well and good, but what I really want to know is if the narrator’s gates are good
Simeone's Atletico won Liga in 2020-2021 playing defensively. Real Madrid won the Champions playing counter attack.
So, it is not exactly outated...
Its not outdated, but it only works against strong attacking teams. Against weaker teams, its usually a bad strategy
@@KarabauPlay That's been the case throughout the games history for decades.
I don't like that football "elitist" point of view. mourinho's trophy winning chelsea and real madrid sides were great at scoring goals. the problem is from a young age, players and fans are told that football has to be a certain way in order to be "positive" or "attractive". imo the media and especially tv broadcasting is at fault here. if pundits/commentators more often praised good defensive play and explained why it's important, more kids would grow up with an appreciation of not only strikers. football is a game of many aspects and there is beauty in all of them.
I personally find as much hype in a great save or a perfect tackle as in a goal or a skill.