If they had allowed Sylvanas to poison Garrosh's food when he was on trial WoD wouldn't have happen, We would not have another Gul'dan in our reality and Varyan would still be alive... Conclusion: Anduin caused his own father's death
Varian stopped Thrall from ending it even before the trial...Varian caused his own death D: BUT Garrosh didn't need to die if Thrall never made him warchief so Thrall did it BUT there would be no Thrall if Jaina just let her father crush the Horde so...Jaina? BUT there would be no Horde if Medivh didn't open the dark portal, Aegwynn wasn't so selfish, the high elves never trained the humans in the way of magic, the night elves never kicked the high born out for using magic, Azshara never tried to summon the Legion and the titans never found the planet! ... I should go to bed...
*Maiev Shadowsong*: Strange... these are Orcish runes! They were written by Gul'dan when he first opened this tomb twenty years ago. *Naisha*: What do they say? *Maiev Shadowsong*: "Gul'dan wuz 'ere." But seriously, I hope Gul'dan will eventually be the one to finally kill Sargeras and become the greatest anti-hero ever.
Hey Nobble, thanks for video. I was wondering if you would do a quick video about the diffrent races and their origin? You almost already did with orcs and draenei.
Humans Gnomes Dwarves > Curse of flesh Orcs and Draenei > different world Night Elves and Blood Elves originated from Trolls Taurens > Descendants from the Yaungol Goblins > Transformed from small creatures to Goblins by consuming kaja'mite Worgens> Humans with the Worgen curse Undead > Humans that were revived by either the Lich King and then broke his hold over them Or Sylvanas Pandas>Native to Azeroth
Really appreciate the effort put into your videos. Not only the knowledge, but also the tireless capturing and editing of footage, is what sets these videos apart. Thanks!
Ty for this video . Just going through this for the very first time (Belf mlae Arcane Mage) , and it's amazing . Enjoyed Pandaria greatly , and enjoying Warlords just as much. Cannot wait till I go through Legion. This story & characters are so cool , so much fun . Thanks for all the Lore help you have given me over the past 6 months. You helped me ''Catch Up' and learn WoW Lore at a rapid pace. Continue the amazing work. :-) TSS
So, ive been playing wow since 05 off and on, and barely understood the lore,you have cleared the air, and i thanks you!I feel blizz should hire you to do videos/streams explaining the lore.You do an excellent job man .Cannot wait for the new video!This and the last videos were one of the coolest ,and you can actually see the world we play in merge into/from the titans/old god world, or vis versa.
Found your channel today while playing. Thanks so much for putting together all this content! I love this universe and you do a great job condencing it. Keep it up!
I look forward to your videos more than anyone elses on youtube, to be honest. Good, honest content in a very entertaining format. Thanks for what you do!
Lovely as always, I've never played past the trial of WoW but these videos have me so invested in the lore I'm considering preordering Legion for the boost
Thats just Grom. Even in our timeline he was never really punished. Hell he is even praised as one of the biggest heroes of the horde despite being a hugh egoistic dick and selling his and the souls of thousands of orcs into slavery.
Bindair Dundat Our Grom was maybe even worse than alt. Grom. He murdered countless drenai, drunk the demon blood without hesitation, murdered even more draenei. Only for his own amusement and to become stronger. hell he even killed other orcs. Azeroth can be happy that Grom had to stay on draenor until the second war.
seeing this Grom, I remember just how well the one in the movie was made, althought he didn't speak a single word(which I loved because he wasn't really important or was in draenor in the original story) His hair looks awesome
In the comic con footage back in 2015, Grom actually have scene with Orgrim and they both talk about nature of the Fel. However Legendary fuck the movie up so bad that it never made into theatrical cut.
you know that there will be a director's cut version which is 45 mins longer. Maybe the scene will be there. An almost 3 hrs movie for "a start" isnt a good idea.
+Nicolas Cage Yeah like how Lord of the Ring originally was 3 hours? Short movie done nothing more than hurt the film. Especially in a universe which rich lore like this need to be long. It took Lord of the Ring 10 minutes to established the universe better than this movie could in 2 hours. And no there will not be director cut because this movie didn't do well enough. Seriously the scene in the comic con footage was so much better than the one in the movie. Here an example Here is Gul'dan before going to Azeroth at comic con: Death, life, Death, Life, Can't you heard it? The beat of the thousand hearts, a thousand souls for thousand warriors. Living souls are the key to this portal. I need prisoners not corpses. Empty their villages and towns bring me fuel for the fel and make room for the Horde Here is Gul'dan literally in the final cut; I need souls so go get it. Like what the actual fuck Who the fuck thing that the dialogue at Comic Con was some how not good enough at the final cuts? Seriously fuck the people who edits this movie.
15:55 Gul'Dan: "Hmm, i'm on a secret mission to resurrect an ancient demon, better leave runes cataloging my every action in case somebody comes by and I'm not there to explain it to them in person."
That wasn't Gul'dan's mission though. They never got to that stage because Gul'dan stole the knowledge of the Tomb and attempted to steal it's power of his own volition. KJ was going to tell him the rest of the plan once the invasion was a success but Gul'dan got paranoid that they'd been abandoned and attempted to simply TAKE his reward from Medivh's mind and later seize the power he'd learned about from it). WoD Gul'dan on the other hand was brought here for that explicit purpose (even if KJ laments the whole time that boundless ambition and backstabbing the crap out of them aside, original Gul'dan was in every way a far superior Gul'dan to the one from WoD, since he was entirely self made as well as being a master of manipulating people. As opposed to WoD Gul'dan whose own people betrayed him every step of the way because he's a talentless hack whose simply been given a bigger stick to swing around and had to handed power and have his hand held pretty much every step of the way to achieve anything.
7:40 - I love the sideways ship going to the Broken Isles. Moreso, Gul'dan facing the wrong way xD This guy does an awesome work with these lore compilations.
Nobbel just to be clear. Wrath ions vision with the whole "pooh we have fallen, we must rebuild the final Titan! So not forget" was about sargeras killing the pantheon, and the souls of the pantheon now being inside the Titan keepers, who then forgot about it. And now they have to awaken the Titan soul inside Azeroth. So I want a video about exactly what happened to the Titans
+Nobbel87 hm, yeah ok thanks but it doesn't really touch on the fact that the Titans are supposedly "dead", as described in the tragedy of Ra-den. Also I'd like to hear your thoughts on magni now speaking for the Titan inside Azeroth
It's a bit of a long story so have several videos cover the events with the titans (Ordering of azeroth, titan keepers part 1 & 2). I talk about Magni in this one and will in a future video th-cam.com/video/VcpNAy6Dld0/w-d-xo.html
+Nobbel87 I do appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions :P I just don't remember you ever talking about what wrathion actually saw in his vision during the Legendary cape quest
Bah, Vol'jin ain't dead. He's just hiding...again...cause Dark Spear never die. Except Sen'jin...but he sucked, I mean who dies to A murloc besides scrubs.
I was playing TFT again last week, and noticed how the statues in the Tomb transform from Highborne to Naga statues since Gul'Dan's visit. Never had noticed that before. (in the video, at 18:00)
i recently swam across the sea from Suramar to the isle where Tomb or Sargy is and I did notice a large bridge broken off that connected suramar and the tomb, as well as the remains of that magic barrier right down the middle. So I wondered if the Tomb was just a building within Suramar. Thankfully I found this video, by pure coincidence, and got my answer. :D
From Draenor? There are two possibilities: 1) khadgar just transported small groups of us back to Azeroth using magic, 2) they used the reconstructed dark portal made by gul Dan on Draenor and changed its destination to Azeroth after we killed Archi. Both would explain the several months that we were stuck on Draenor after killing Archimonde, lol.
Moving between alternate Draenor and our Azeroth has never been easier. Remember when you claimed your garrison, Gazlowe and others just came through a random mage portal?
At 12:31, why did you use that map of pre-sundering Kalimdor? We have an official map of pre-sundering Kalimdor from Chronicle Vol.1, several, in fact.
Around year 923 BDP she became the guardian. 823 BDP she fought with sargeras. 45 BDP they talk about her meeting with Nielas Aran so she was around 875
when alternate archimonde was dying he was like "shit i better blame this on someone else even though this was clearly my fault. i'll banish gul'dan and make it look like he fucked up somehow"
Thaldranath is the name of the island of the broken shore.The zone Thaldranath was just gonna be an additional zone south of the broken shore and when it got scrapped, they gave the name to the original broken shore island
They didn't scrapped it, they replaced with something better. If you guys would listen instead of being reactionary cry babies, misinformation wouldnt be spread around so easily.
@Nobbel: If you look at the map with the Broken Shore and Thal'Dranath from GamesCom 2015, you can see that the Broken Shore is the missing chunck of Thal'Dranath's northern shores. During Ion's interview with Josh for the Dev Q&A, Ion mentions they removed Thal'Dranath since it'd just be "another elven zone". In the audio drama, Kil'jaeden says the Tomb of Sargeras rests upon the isle of Thal'Dranath and that Gul'dan raised it: '-YOU RAISED AN ISLAND, THAL'DRANATH, FROM THE WATERS.- "At your command?" Gul'dan asked. -YOU ARE NOT HERE TO ASK QUESTIONS. YOU ARE HERE TO VISIT THAT ISLAND AGAIN. IT IS A LONG WALK. MOVE.-' This basically confirms it. But looking at the map, you can see that the Broken Shore's southern shore fits perfectly with Tal'Dranath's (old Broken Isles map) northern shores. - vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/wowwiki/images/f/f1/WorldMap-BrokenIsles-Build20740.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20151202192332
he was on alt draenor watching it all unfold. he was at admiral taylor's garrison before the necromancer took it and at kadgar's tower at the end of the ring questline but he bugged out when he sees the player.
+gzerox2 well Blizzard is certainly keeping his whereabouts a secrets. I just hope it's because they are saving hin for something great, not because he is forgotten :P He was in the beta in highmountains, BUT they removed him again, so we can only wait. Unless you gave heard something more/else
Well at that point she had not gone completely insane and since he is not really related to her Illidan obsession there is no reason for her to really hate him.
Amazing as always Nobbel, with Legion coming don't you think that its time to do Malfurion's lore? For all us old timers in Warcraft when we hear Legion we remember Malfurion raising treants and Tyrande raining stars in that amazing last chapter holding our ground against Archimonde's assaults....good times.
Khadgar notices the runes in the tomb and came to the conclusion that it's an guardians work in the audio book (part 2, 2 mins in). Was he misstaken? Or did Aegwynn tamper with the runes as she was under Sargeras influence?
I found one thing from audio drama pretty funny. Kil'jaeden says in it that it was his plan to get the horde to weaken azeroth. But gul'dan was never contacted by him after extermination of draenei. If kil'jaeden just made a quick call and told something to gul'dan i think the horde could very well win.
Warcraft's story seems to have many tomes of trying to change the past, to undo the worst events. Wrathion tries to change the present by bringing other realities to fight the Legion, but by doing so he opened the gates for conflict and for enemies that should never have gotten in. Garrosh tried to learn from the mistakes of the horde. Gul'Dan did learn from the mistakes of his other self, now we must pay for that.
Hey Nobbel, in the latest questline we meet a a bunch of mages in Dalaran and Jaina buggers off. Can we please have a short video on who those other mages were?
Can you clear up the difference between Suramar and Zin Azshari? They were both supposed to be elven capitals on the shore of the well of eternity, but a lot of sources seem to confuse them. Which city was Azshara's palace in during the war of the ancients? how did Suramar survive the sundering, and why was the tomb of sargaras sunk to the bottom of the sea when the original temple of elune was said to be in suramar?
Did the legion plan on open the portal to alternate draenor? to get them a second guldan to break open the tomb? Some kind of master plan. If they couldn't get the other guldan, who would have been the alternative to start of the invasion?
I have one question in the raid where we kill archemond was that alternat timeline archemond or is it our timeline one. Basicly the underlining question is. Is there only one burning legion that is laying siege to multiple timelines or are there multiple legions. Both have there advantages and disadvantages of course.
Yay, I guessed right XD Damn, I can't wait for the next part. Do you think you would ever do a cover on the pre patch story? By that, I mostly mean the Broken Shore scenario, and what happened there.
Here's a dosey of a question.. So we as the Warcraft heroes managed to help kill Archimonde twice now. But are the two Archimondes the same from our time line? Or is the Archimonde in alternate Draenor an alternate time line Legion? Another question I'd like to ask, the Legion that is now Invading our time line Azeroth, are they aware of the second Archimonde's death? Does this mean we may face two Kiljaedens? Or somehow the Legion is not affected by alternate time lines? Sorry if my question my be confusing.. But I worry that somehow there's an alternate Azeroth, and that Azeroth's Sargeras Avatar hasn't been defeated. Seriously the involvement of alternate time lines really messes up the realities. If there are alternate Draenors, surely there are alternate Azeroths, and even more surely there are alternate Legions.
The Legion exists outside the influence of time as we experience it, as Prince Malchezaar states,; 'all realities, all dimensions are open to me'. When demons are killed, they are not completely dead, they just return to the Void, from where they can regain their energy and start again. So, to your question, We have killed Archimonde twice, that is the same Archimonde who was just summoned to a different reality at a different time. I think it is actually quite likely we will see KJ again, whether e fight him as a boss I don't know but he will likely show up to play a part in Legion somewhere. The Legion is almost certainly aware of what happened on Draenor as it plays a big part in them actually getting to Azeroth, through Gul'dan. As I see it, there is infinitely many Azeroth's, infinitely many Draenor's, but only one Burning Legion.
Nobbel it's possible that both Legion and audio drama are correct aka the Broken Shore (aka where the Tomb of Sargeras is) is the broken remains of the north coast of Tal'Danath that broke off after the 3 times major geological changes happened there due to magic (when Gul'dan raised the tomb, then Illidan tried to bury the watchers and now what ever Gul'dan did to open the portal)
Actually, from what I've read, the island the Tomb sits upon is now called Thal'dranath, at least as it's original name, before being called the Broken Shore.
I think the Legion is going to try and use Illidan's body as a vessel for Sargeras. There are numerous hints of that in the Demon Hunter starting experience.
Is there a list of all demons who show up at the pre event at the Tomb of Sargeras? I mean before the cutscene with Varian plays. I saw some demons like Tichondrius and the allmighty JARAXXUS
Hiya Nobbel two questions I was wondering if you (or anyone) might know the answer to. 1. In the DH starting zone, Maiev seems surprised that Guldan has gained access to the vault and that someone betrayed her, yet she mentions to Kadgar about Cordana in the Tomb of Sargeras. Do you think this another retcon like they did with island as you mentioned in this video? 2. The Guldan cinematic where he finds Illidan and use fel sparks on him doesn't happen as it does according to the DH starting zone as well, he almost seem to stumble upon him in the cinematic. Was that just meant to be a cool omfg moment cinematic or another retcon thing?
the tomb of sargeras is that dranath now btw, it's not suramar, they make that distinction in the audio drama if you were listening plus other TH-camrs talking about lore and that dranath being scrapped have made this distinction as well
I'm really upset he left out the major part in a short story that came out after War crimes. where it explains how Garrosh convinced Grom to not listen to Gul'dan. The scene where Garrosh takes Grom to the Throne of the Elements and shows him the future and Grom sees where his people become conquerors and take not only Draenor but invade Azeroth. Grom is amazed how his people are conquerors but sees that they had to sacrifice everything for it. Slowly watching the Horde rise up then start to die out in Outlands. And that is how Garrosh convinced him to be against him and that is why Grom stops before drinking and asks that very specific question. So when Gul'dan says everything that is all he needs to hear to stop. It's like a very important part of lore that makes the trailer so much better. Its called Hellscream by Robert Brooks if anyone wants to read it.
So, in sending Garrosh into anew time line, Wrathion gave the Legion the second chance to use Gul'Dan and brought about the very doom he sought to prevent? Classic.
I think during the wrathion campaing in pandaria, Wrathion mentions one of his duties is to see the chain of events actually take place. He is to make sure what is "destined' to happen, actually happens. He is not really there to "stop" things from happening, just make sure it does happen.
got to ask is there any moments in WOD where someone meets them self I have only played as alliance so don't know if there is on horde but it would be weird as hell
If i were Grommash at the end of the Archimonde fight, i wouldn't have yelled "Draenor, is...FREE", i would've yelled... "Draenor...is...STILL 10$ A MONTH!"
Even though Thrall cheated. Not sure how the past war chief. The founder of the new horde. Can't follow honorable rules of mok'gorah or whatever it's called.
What kind of demon was it (our timeline) Gul'dan and his cronies encountered in the tomb anyway? I'm pretty sure we've never seen any demon that fit its description. edit: Talking about the demons described in the books (Tides of Darkness and Beyond the Dark Portal), by the way. (19:12 That was a very nice touch, by the way)
BC - "You are not prepared!" Wrath of the Lich King - "Frostmourne Hungers.." Cataclysm - ? Mists of Pandaria - ? Walords of Draenor - "Times change." Legion - "No! It's a trap! The light... will... AAAAAHHHHRH! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHG! UUUUUWAAAAAAAAHGHGURHHHHHHHHH!"
The best bit of WoW Lore is how they re-write it every few years so you never have to worry about what is what because it will all be back to front in a few years time. At the moment Sargeras is a villain of sorts, which is weird because in a few years he will be redeemed and you will be able to roll "Fallen Titan" as a class. My Goblin Fallen Titan is gonna be OP :p (I'm mocking the shit storywriting of the last few years)
maybe not. if he is made into a demon, which as a leader of the burning legion would be, he will be linked to the twisted nether. so he may pull a kael and come back
wh4t illidan did using the skull of guldan. also the demon hunter we play as has a "demon soul" like illidan, so we can get back in our bodies. also so did the eradar. mortals can, they are just not in most cases. in the audio book kil'jaden says that the legion "offers fool trinkets and small gifts" but for gul'dan they offered much more.
Every race in the legion were mortal before they became demons, just look at Archimonde who was just as mortal as Velen but now can slowly be reformed in the Twisting Nether as it was said this was the same Archimonde that we defeated at Hyjal in WC3.
All right Nobbel, got a lore-linguistic question for you. If the runes displayed in the tomb are Orcish runes, like Maiev says, how is it that she is able to read them? The orcs hadn't been on Azeroth for very long at the point in time when Gul'dan came to the tomb, and they'd only been in the Eastern Kingdoms, i.e. nowhere near the Night Elves. So how is it that Maiev knows the language Gul'dan is writing in? What is also interesting is that Naisha seemingly *cannot* read them, as she asks Maiev what they say. So it seems Maiev possess the knowledge of Orcish runes but her Watchers don't.
Hey Nobbel! Love the work you do, but there is one thing that raises my concern about Jaina Proudmoore. It’s a character I’ve been sympathizing with for many years, but now I feel Blizzard are doing their best to turn her into the next Garrosh Hellscream. I find it odd that a character that’s always been so resoluble should be blinded by hatred when the faith of Azeroth is at stake. What do you think?
Couple questions: 1: Is Miev storing Illidan's body in the place where he found the skull of Guldan and the eye of Sargeras? 2: If the tomb was a sunken highborne city from the WOTA and Miev is from that time (fighting in it as well wouldn't she recognize the architecture of the tomb as night elven)? 3: Why didn't the demons attack Miev when she went through the tomb? 4: Didn't Illidan go to the tomb find the skull of Guldan, and claim the eye to go use to sink northrend? I just thought you'd give a more comprehensive history of the tomb i think you could have had more than 8 minutes of lore to talk about, the tomb has been explored few times.
Thing is I never understood. Thrall was about to kill Garrosh in SoO, wrynn didn't let him. but what other punishment than death did he had coming? Lifetime?
+Gentle Cactus So we kill every raid boss but we decided to imprison Garrosh? I've read the book and all just trying to wrap my head around the extremely bad writing and how they forced WoD
Nope, everyone knew it was death. Every leader knew it, he himself did, too. It was just a matter of honor for the pandaren and maybe they could understand his actions that way (I.e. Garrosh got possessed and that's why he committed all these crimes). Highly unlikely that he got out of it, but it was just some sort of formal manner. :P
That comment wasn't there when I wrote mine, had the video a while opened in my browser already. :P Nontheless, I wouldn't call it bad writing, but it's a bit forced, yeah. It might be a bad excuse (hence, forced), but to me it sounds reasonable that the Pandaren do not like to just kill him, they want a fair trial or atleast some sort of reasoning why he did what he did. (After all, he just invaded Pandaria, stole stuff and killed stuff.. - short version atleast)
spoiler sargeras sword is the strongest weapon in the universe, it's also alive. when sargeras became evil it sundered itself into two pieces. I bet money it reforged will be the weapon to kill him.
Does the announcement of karazhan as another revamped dungeon mean Khadgar's "attempts" to reconstruct the tower's defenses failed? I can only assume yes is the answer. But then, we also left khadgar alone inside the tower...
![The Legion is coming! [Lore]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/eBAWHGtenUA/mqdefault.jpg)
![The Legion is coming! [Lore]](/img/tr.png)
![The Story of Odyn & Helya (Trial of Valor) [Lore]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/lJv8-tQf_B8/mqdefault.jpg)
![Lord Illidan Knows The Way [Lore]](/img/n.gif)
If they had allowed Sylvanas to poison Garrosh's food when he was on trial WoD wouldn't have happen, We would not have another Gul'dan in our reality and Varyan would still be alive... Conclusion: Anduin caused his own father's death
Varian stopped Thrall from ending it even before the trial...Varian caused his own death D: BUT Garrosh didn't need to die if Thrall never made him warchief so Thrall did it BUT there would be no Thrall if Jaina just let her father crush the Horde so...Jaina? BUT there would be no Horde if Medivh didn't open the dark portal, Aegwynn wasn't so selfish, the high elves never trained the humans in the way of magic, the night elves never kicked the high born out for using magic, Azshara never tried to summon the Legion and the titans never found the planet! ... I should go to bed...
Nobbel87 Why are you always right? Why are you so perfect Nobbel sempai?
Go back far enough, it all goes back to the Night Elves..Stupid night elves.
***** fucking dark trolls
I say we just blame Azshara, she seems like a good target.
*Maiev Shadowsong*: Strange... these are Orcish runes! They were written by Gul'dan when he first opened this tomb twenty years ago.
*Naisha*: What do they say?
*Maiev Shadowsong*: "Gul'dan wuz 'ere."
But seriously, I hope Gul'dan will eventually be the one to finally kill Sargeras and become the greatest anti-hero ever.
Im asking myself how she was able to read them.
Exactly I don't think maiev had orcish language lessons
Kill sargeras really? it's a fucking titan, empowered by void and fel magic. he wyped out the entire titanic pantheon.
He's a villain not an anti hero. Illidan is more of an anti-hero.
Void =|= Fel. Sargeras tries to defeat the void by destroying everything they corrupt or try to corrupt.
That "times change" line will always be one of my favourites!
Beats the hell out of "life is a prison"
If u watch Nixxiom, then watch "How to: Mage"
Hey Nobble, thanks for video.
I was wondering if you would do a quick video about the diffrent races and their origin? You almost already did with orcs and draenei.
+1 (million)
Humans Gnomes Dwarves > Curse of flesh
Orcs and Draenei > different world
Night Elves and Blood Elves originated from Trolls
Taurens > Descendants from the Yaungol
Goblins > Transformed from small creatures to Goblins by consuming kaja'mite
Worgens> Humans with the Worgen curse
Undead > Humans that were revived by either the Lich King and then broke his hold over them Or Sylvanas
Pandas>Native to Azeroth
Mads Kofod you can talk way more about it like one sentence
More quotes from Kil'jaeden are always welcomed! Thanks you for putting part of the audio drama with these images Nobbel! :D
Really appreciate the effort put into your videos.
Not only the knowledge, but also the tireless capturing and editing of footage, is what sets these videos apart.
Thanks!
Ty for this video . Just going through this for the very first time (Belf mlae Arcane Mage) , and it's amazing . Enjoyed Pandaria greatly , and enjoying Warlords just as much. Cannot wait till I go through Legion. This story & characters are so cool , so much fun . Thanks for all the Lore help you have given me over the past 6 months. You helped me ''Catch Up' and learn WoW Lore at a rapid pace. Continue the amazing work. :-) TSS
subtitles say "Guuuuulll'Daniiieel"
And now they say
"Damn that line is so cool, here catch daddy, gorehowl"
i hate it
So, ive been playing wow since 05 off and on, and barely understood the lore,you have cleared the air, and i thanks you!I feel blizz should hire you to do videos/streams explaining the lore.You do an excellent job man .Cannot wait for the new video!This and the last videos were one of the coolest ,and you can actually see the world we play in merge into/from the titans/old god world, or vis versa.
Can not get enough of these videos lately - Although I am confused over bits of the time line I am loving them - Great work
Found your channel today while playing. Thanks so much for putting together all this content! I love this universe and you do a great job condencing it. Keep it up!
I look forward to your videos more than anyone elses on youtube, to be honest. Good, honest content in a very entertaining format. Thanks for what you do!
Lovely as always, I've never played past the trial of WoW but these videos have me so invested in the lore I'm considering preordering Legion for the boost
still mad about Grom getting away scott free for all the shit he pulled.
technically you could say our universe grom paid for it.
Thats just Grom. Even in our timeline he was never really punished. Hell he is even praised as one of the biggest heroes of the horde despite being a hugh egoistic dick and selling his and the souls of thousands of orcs into slavery.
What Grom? Our Grom died killing Mannoroth. No other Grom existed. Only the one. WoD was just a fever dream of Thrall.
Bindair Dundat
Our Grom was maybe even worse than alt. Grom. He murdered countless drenai, drunk the demon blood without hesitation, murdered even more draenei. Only for his own amusement and to become stronger. hell he even killed other orcs.
Azeroth can be happy that Grom had to stay on draenor until the second war.
18Krieger I don't know what your talking about. What alt Grom? There was only ever one Grom Hellscream, and he's been dead for 10+ years now.
seeing this Grom, I remember just how well the one in the movie was made, althought he didn't speak a single word(which I loved because he wasn't really important or was in draenor in the original story) His hair looks awesome
In the comic con footage back in 2015, Grom actually have scene with Orgrim and they both talk about nature of the Fel. However Legendary fuck the movie up so bad that it never made into theatrical cut.
Grom was made for shampoo advertising.
you know that there will be a director's cut version which is 45 mins longer. Maybe the scene will be there. An almost 3 hrs movie for "a start" isnt a good idea.
+Nicolas Cage Yeah like how Lord of the Ring originally was 3 hours? Short movie done nothing more than hurt the film. Especially in a universe which rich lore like this need to be long. It took Lord of the Ring 10 minutes to established the universe better than this movie could in 2 hours. And no there will not be director cut because this movie didn't do well enough.
Seriously the scene in the comic con footage was so much better than the one in the movie. Here an example
Here is Gul'dan before going to Azeroth at comic con:
Death, life, Death, Life, Can't you heard it? The beat of the thousand hearts, a thousand souls for thousand warriors. Living souls are the key to this portal. I need prisoners not corpses. Empty their villages and towns bring me fuel for the fel and make room for the Horde
Here is Gul'dan literally in the final cut; I need souls so go get it. Like what the actual fuck
Who the fuck thing that the dialogue at Comic Con was some how not good enough at the final cuts? Seriously fuck the people who edits this movie.
There will be no directors cut.
15:55
Gul'Dan: "Hmm, i'm on a secret mission to resurrect an ancient demon, better leave runes cataloging my every action in case somebody comes by and I'm not there to explain it to them in person."
That wasn't Gul'dan's mission though. They never got to that stage because Gul'dan stole the knowledge of the Tomb and attempted to steal it's power of his own volition. KJ was going to tell him the rest of the plan once the invasion was a success but Gul'dan got paranoid that they'd been abandoned and attempted to simply TAKE his reward from Medivh's mind and later seize the power he'd learned about from it).
WoD Gul'dan on the other hand was brought here for that explicit purpose (even if KJ laments the whole time that boundless ambition and backstabbing the crap out of them aside, original Gul'dan was in every way a far superior Gul'dan to the one from WoD, since he was entirely self made as well as being a master of manipulating people.
As opposed to WoD Gul'dan whose own people betrayed him every step of the way because he's a talentless hack whose simply been given a bigger stick to swing around and had to handed power and have his hand held pretty much every step of the way to achieve anything.
ZanathKariashi They're exactly the same. Events would have been identical to ours if Grom drank the blood.
Do you know how much I love ya Nobbel?Thanks for all you do! I appreaciate your work so much!
7:40 - I love the sideways ship going to the Broken Isles. Moreso, Gul'dan facing the wrong way xD
This guy does an awesome work with these lore compilations.
amazing video! thank you so much for doing these good sum-ups of the story!! please keep it up!
So the guldan in the alternate universe never was nerzhul's apprentice and betrayed him for the legion? HIs story starts at the harbinger video?
Bingo
how is guldan aware of the 1st guldan, and whats up with nerzhul ?
I imagine the legion filled him in.
Yea it would make sense to explain everything about the alternate universe stuff.
In the audiodrama the narrator said that he managed to *extract* some information out of the *alliance and horde captives*.
Just wanted to say that I really like the closed captions in your videos :)
I love that you are doing lore on places as well as people. Would love to see a lore on Goldshire video :D
Loved the machinima bits in this, well done Nobbel!
"If you ever need us, we will be here" As much as we all may want to forget WoD, I am curious as hell to see how/if Ion uses this in he future!
Please release part 2. Really helped me understand. Thanks Nobbel87 !
Been waiting for this :D. Amazing vid and explaining as always
Popcorn and a new nobbel video, what better combinationcan there be
your mom and new nobbel video
+nicosi2010 Highly uncalled for.
True tho
Nobbel just to be clear. Wrath ions vision with the whole "pooh we have fallen, we must rebuild the final Titan! So not forget" was about sargeras killing the pantheon, and the souls of the pantheon now being inside the Titan keepers, who then forgot about it. And now they have to awaken the Titan soul inside Azeroth. So I want a video about exactly what happened to the Titans
th-cam.com/video/MpxyRu1qx4U/w-d-xo.html
+Nobbel87 hm, yeah ok thanks but it doesn't really touch on the fact that the Titans are supposedly "dead", as described in the tragedy of Ra-den. Also I'd like to hear your thoughts on magni now speaking for the Titan inside Azeroth
It's a bit of a long story so have several videos cover the events with the titans (Ordering of azeroth, titan keepers part 1 & 2). I talk about Magni in this one and will in a future video th-cam.com/video/VcpNAy6Dld0/w-d-xo.html
+Nobbel87 I do appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions :P I just don't remember you ever talking about what wrathion actually saw in his vision during the Legendary cape quest
Bah, Vol'jin ain't dead. He's just hiding...again...cause Dark Spear never die. Except Sen'jin...but he sucked, I mean who dies to A murloc besides scrubs.
I was playing TFT again last week, and noticed how the statues in the Tomb transform from Highborne to Naga statues since Gul'Dan's visit.
Never had noticed that before. (in the video, at 18:00)
i recently swam across the sea from Suramar to the isle where Tomb or Sargy is and I did notice a large bridge broken off that connected suramar and the tomb, as well as the remains of that magic barrier right down the middle. So I wondered if the Tomb was just a building within Suramar.
Thankfully I found this video, by pure coincidence, and got my answer. :D
Do they ever tell us what portal we used to go back to our Azeroth?
From Draenor? There are two possibilities: 1) khadgar just transported small groups of us back to Azeroth using magic, 2) they used the reconstructed dark portal made by gul Dan on Draenor and changed its destination to Azeroth after we killed Archi. Both would explain the several months that we were stuck on Draenor after killing Archimonde, lol.
"several months stuck on Draenor"
too many months
Too many
You also got the portal to SW in the everbloom dungeon
Moving between alternate Draenor and our Azeroth has never been easier. Remember when you claimed your garrison, Gazlowe and others just came through a random mage portal?
Gul'dan: I am darkness incarnate. It cannot end like this. That's cool because killing mythic Gul'dan you get the title Darkness Incarnate
I'm pretty sure that's not a coincidence bro ;-)
Meustice u datamining shit? that's a cool title
Meustice the title is actually Vengeance Incarnate ^^
The CC is extremely funny, should open CC and watch again
Your videos are really amazing, much better than watching a movie :) Great job!
At 12:31, why did you use that map of pre-sundering Kalimdor? We have an official map of pre-sundering Kalimdor from Chronicle Vol.1, several, in fact.
Awesome vids that have brought me a new understanding of Warcraft.
Nobbel i have watched you forever man great work keep it up :D
I have to admit, I came to this video expecting a lore video about the building itself not the audio drama. Still enjoy it though!
823 years before the dark portal?!So how old Aeqwynn was when she had Medivh?
Around year 923 BDP she became the guardian. 823 BDP she fought with sargeras. 45 BDP they talk about her meeting with Nielas Aran so she was around 875
By the Light! a great lorewalker shared his wisdom with me.Thank you ^^
holy crud they make these characters old
Am I the onlyone who loves listening to Nobbels lore vidoe before going to sleep, I mean it's so calming and interesting at the same time!
when alternate archimonde was dying he was like "shit i better blame this on someone else even though this was clearly my fault. i'll banish gul'dan and make it look like he fucked up somehow"
Exploding Crow There is only one Legion. The Archimonde who died was the only one.
because guldan did fuck up? they made a "pact"
Whoever wrote those subtitles deserves an award and a beer.
Thank you very much for this video, excellent one!
Thaldranath is the name of the island of the broken shore.The zone Thaldranath was just gonna be an additional zone south of the broken shore and when it got scrapped, they gave the name to the original broken shore island
Where/when did they make that change?
They didn't scrapped it, they replaced with something better. If you guys would listen instead of being reactionary cry babies, misinformation wouldnt be spread around so easily.
+Nobbel87 in the audio drama that came out not so long ago
+Wow Jedi content has been scrapped since vanilla, I've put 100 hours into the beta, this is the best expansion since wrath.
@Nobbel: If you look at the map with the Broken Shore and Thal'Dranath from GamesCom 2015, you can see that the Broken Shore is the missing chunck of Thal'Dranath's northern shores. During Ion's interview with Josh for the Dev Q&A, Ion mentions they removed Thal'Dranath since it'd just be "another elven zone". In the audio drama, Kil'jaeden says the Tomb of Sargeras rests upon the isle of Thal'Dranath and that Gul'dan raised it:
'-YOU RAISED AN ISLAND, THAL'DRANATH, FROM THE WATERS.-
"At your command?" Gul'dan asked.
-YOU ARE NOT HERE TO ASK QUESTIONS. YOU ARE HERE TO VISIT THAT ISLAND AGAIN. IT IS A LONG WALK. MOVE.-'
This basically confirms it. But looking at the map, you can see that the Broken Shore's southern shore fits perfectly with Tal'Dranath's (old Broken Isles map) northern shores.
- vignette4.wikia.nocookie.net/wowwiki/images/f/f1/WorldMap-BrokenIsles-Build20740.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20151202192332
you Uploaded this the very minute monday hit... impressive.
AND WHAT IN THE DREAD BECAME OF WRATHION?
Maiev was actually quite symphatic when she learned of Gul'dans story
Not to spoil anything, but we will be seeing him
he was on alt draenor watching it all unfold. he was at admiral taylor's garrison before the necromancer took it and at kadgar's tower at the end of the ring questline but he bugged out when he sees the player.
+gzerox2 well Blizzard is certainly keeping his whereabouts a secrets. I just hope it's because they are saving hin for something great, not because he is forgotten :P He was in the beta in highmountains, BUT they removed him again, so we can only wait. Unless you gave heard something more/else
Well at that point she had not gone completely insane and since he is not really related to her Illidan obsession there is no reason for her to really hate him.
I'm guessing he's gonna be like Medivh was in Warcraft 3, he just randomly meets us to speed things along and make us fight the legion together
What is the easiest way to get these in podcast form so I can listen to them at work?
Amazing as always Nobbel, with Legion coming don't you think that its time to do Malfurion's lore? For all us old timers in Warcraft when we hear Legion we remember Malfurion raising treants and Tyrande raining stars in that amazing last chapter holding our ground against Archimonde's assaults....good times.
Closed captions is a way to get visual access to auditory information. Please keep the captions accurate and indicative of exactly what is being said.
I've been waiting for this! Finally! :D
good episode bro #1 fan in texas...cant wait for the next episode!
Yes! A very relevant episode! Thanks nobbel!
Khadgar notices the runes in the tomb and came to the conclusion that it's an guardians work in the audio book (part 2, 2 mins in). Was he misstaken? Or did Aegwynn tamper with the runes as she was under Sargeras influence?
I found one thing from audio drama pretty funny. Kil'jaeden says in it that it was his plan to get the horde to weaken azeroth. But gul'dan was never contacted by him after extermination of draenei. If kil'jaeden just made a quick call and told something to gul'dan i think the horde could very well win.
1:39 w/ subtitles
Gul'Daniel :p
thats not funny :d
Warcraft's story seems to have many tomes of trying to change the past, to undo the worst events. Wrathion tries to change the present by bringing other realities to fight the Legion, but by doing so he opened the gates for conflict and for enemies that should never have gotten in. Garrosh tried to learn from the mistakes of the horde. Gul'Dan did learn from the mistakes of his other self, now we must pay for that.
Hey Nobbel, in the latest questline we meet a a bunch of mages in Dalaran and Jaina buggers off. Can we please have a short video on who those other mages were?
Can you clear up the difference between Suramar and Zin Azshari? They were both supposed to be elven capitals on the shore of the well of eternity, but a lot of sources seem to confuse them. Which city was Azshara's palace in during the war of the ancients? how did Suramar survive the sundering, and why was the tomb of sargaras sunk to the bottom of the sea when the original temple of elune was said to be in suramar?
Did the legion plan on open the portal to alternate draenor? to get them a second guldan to break open the tomb? Some kind of master plan. If they couldn't get the other guldan, who would have been the alternative to start of the invasion?
I have one question in the raid where we kill archemond was that alternat timeline archemond or is it our timeline one. Basicly the underlining question is. Is there only one burning legion that is laying siege to multiple timelines or are there multiple legions. Both have there advantages and disadvantages of course.
Yay, I guessed right XD Damn, I can't wait for the next part. Do you think you would ever do a cover on the pre patch story? By that, I mostly mean the Broken Shore scenario, and what happened there.
Great as always nobbel!
Here's a dosey of a question.. So we as the Warcraft heroes managed to help kill Archimonde twice now. But are the two Archimondes the same from our time line? Or is the Archimonde in alternate Draenor an alternate time line Legion?
Another question I'd like to ask, the Legion that is now Invading our time line Azeroth, are they aware of the second Archimonde's death? Does this mean we may face two Kiljaedens? Or somehow the Legion is not affected by alternate time lines?
Sorry if my question my be confusing.. But I worry that somehow there's an alternate Azeroth, and that Azeroth's Sargeras Avatar hasn't been defeated.
Seriously the involvement of alternate time lines really messes up the realities. If there are alternate Draenors, surely there are alternate Azeroths, and even more surely there are alternate Legions.
The Legion exists outside the influence of time as we experience it, as Prince Malchezaar states,; 'all realities, all dimensions are open to me'. When demons are killed, they are not completely dead, they just return to the Void, from where they can regain their energy and start again.
So, to your question, We have killed Archimonde twice, that is the same Archimonde who was just summoned to a different reality at a different time. I think it is actually quite likely we will see KJ again, whether e fight him as a boss I don't know but he will likely show up to play a part in Legion somewhere. The Legion is almost certainly aware of what happened on Draenor as it plays a big part in them actually getting to Azeroth, through Gul'dan.
As I see it, there is infinitely many Azeroth's, infinitely many Draenor's, but only one Burning Legion.
i wonder how malfurion will react to his brothers ressurection
Nobbel it's possible that both Legion and audio drama are correct aka the Broken Shore (aka where the Tomb of Sargeras is) is the broken remains of the north coast of Tal'Danath that broke off after the 3 times major geological changes happened there due to magic (when Gul'dan raised the tomb, then Illidan tried to bury the watchers and now what ever Gul'dan did to open the portal)
In the cinematic after archimonde's defeat was Gul'Dan acting what do you think? @Nobbel87
Gul' Dan: This was not our destiny!
Garrosh: Times change
Subtitle: DAMN THAT LINE IS SO COOL, HERE CATCH DADDY, GOREHOWL
Dem captions tell a wonderful story on their own I swear.
7:10 but we won't ask for your help, i mean it's not like we are facing the entire legion now is it.....
Actually, from what I've read, the island the Tomb sits upon is now called Thal'dranath, at least as it's original name, before being called the Broken Shore.
I really hope AU Draenor makes good on its word and helps us after we liberated them. Haven't seen anything on this so far from the Alpha/Beta.
I think the Legion is going to try and use Illidan's body as a vessel for Sargeras. There are numerous hints of that in the Demon Hunter starting experience.
Is there a list of all demons who show up at the pre event at the Tomb of Sargeras? I mean before the cutscene with Varian plays. I saw some demons like Tichondrius and the allmighty JARAXXUS
Hiya Nobbel two questions I was wondering if you (or anyone) might know the answer to.
1. In the DH starting zone, Maiev seems surprised that Guldan has gained access to the vault and that someone betrayed her, yet she mentions to Kadgar about Cordana in the Tomb of Sargeras. Do you think this another retcon like they did with island as you mentioned in this video?
2. The Guldan cinematic where he finds Illidan and use fel sparks on him doesn't happen as it does according to the DH starting zone as well, he almost seem to stumble upon him in the cinematic. Was that just meant to be a cool omfg moment cinematic or another retcon thing?
Whoa, when I was this early we still thought WoD would be a good expansion >.>
"Gul'Daniel"
them subtitles are on point nobbel!
the tomb of sargeras is that dranath now btw, it's not suramar, they make that distinction in the audio drama if you were listening plus other TH-camrs talking about lore and that dranath being scrapped have made this distinction as well
you said 2 years ago that you are gonna make sooner or later video about Thura ? Id rly love to see lore video about him.
I'm really upset he left out the major part in a short story that came out after War crimes. where it explains how Garrosh convinced Grom to not listen to Gul'dan. The scene where Garrosh takes Grom to the Throne of the Elements and shows him the future and Grom sees where his people become conquerors and take not only Draenor but invade Azeroth. Grom is amazed how his people are conquerors but sees that they had to sacrifice everything for it. Slowly watching the Horde rise up then start to die out in Outlands. And that is how Garrosh convinced him to be against him and that is why Grom stops before drinking and asks that very specific question. So when Gul'dan says everything that is all he needs to hear to stop. It's like a very important part of lore that makes the trailer so much better. Its called Hellscream by Robert Brooks if anyone wants to read it.
"Gul'daaaainel" I love you Nobbel.
So, in sending Garrosh into anew time line, Wrathion gave the Legion the second chance to use Gul'Dan and brought about the very doom he sought to prevent? Classic.
I think during the wrathion campaing in pandaria, Wrathion mentions one of his duties is to see the chain of events actually take place. He is to make sure what is "destined' to happen, actually happens. He is not really there to "stop" things from happening, just make sure it does happen.
I hope you never get bored with wow lore lol
question... the Gul Dan from the alt time line summons Archimonde of the alt time line right. so how does he know Sargeras from original timeline
got to ask is there any moments in WOD where someone meets them self I have only played as alliance so don't know if there is on horde but it would be weird as hell
If i were Grommash at the end of the Archimonde fight, i wouldn't have yelled "Draenor, is...FREE", i would've yelled...
"Draenor...is...STILL 10$ A MONTH!"
So what happened to garrosh? where did he go?
We brought him to justice aka Thrall called down some lightning and gave him the chair.
+Nobbel87 Oh my god how did I forget that. Thanks for the reply nobbel, just made my day. Keep up the great work :D
Thrall cheated
Thrall killed Garrosh in Mak'Gora - an orcish duel to the death.
Even though Thrall cheated. Not sure how the past war chief. The founder of the new horde. Can't follow honorable rules of mok'gorah or whatever it's called.
What kind of demon was it (our timeline) Gul'dan and his cronies encountered in the tomb anyway? I'm pretty sure we've never seen any demon that fit its description.
edit: Talking about the demons described in the books (Tides of Darkness and Beyond the Dark Portal), by the way.
(19:12 That was a very nice touch, by the way)
I think It's Doomlord? Or it mightve been the shadow of... Sargeras O_O?
Gentle Cactus
It wasn't.
DUN DUN DUUUUUUUN
I'm pretty sure the Chronicles vol. 2 was released AFTER this video
But chronicles confirms that AU Gul'Dan and regular Gul'Dan share the same story
BC - "You are not prepared!"
Wrath of the Lich King - "Frostmourne Hungers.."
Cataclysm - ?
Mists of Pandaria - ?
Walords of Draenor - "Times change."
Legion - "No! It's a trap! The light... will... AAAAAHHHHRH! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHG! UUUUUWAAAAAAAAHGHGURHHHHHHHHH!"
The best bit of WoW Lore is how they re-write it every few years so you never have to worry about what is what because it will all be back to front in a few years time.
At the moment Sargeras is a villain of sorts, which is weird because in a few years he will be redeemed and you will be able to roll "Fallen Titan" as a class. My Goblin Fallen Titan is gonna be OP :p
(I'm mocking the shit storywriting of the last few years)
Honestly this gul dan will fial as well his fate was sealed the moment was made a raid boss. rip alt gul dan
maybe not. if he is made into a demon, which as a leader of the burning legion would be, he will be linked to the twisted nether. so he may pull a kael and come back
+ceiferthegamer as far as I know, a mortal cannot become a full demon. Kael did not become a demon, he was just resurrected using fel energy
wh4t
illidan did using the skull of guldan. also the demon hunter we play as has a "demon soul" like illidan, so we can get back in our bodies. also so did the eradar. mortals can, they are just not in most cases. in the audio book kil'jaden says that the legion "offers fool trinkets and small gifts" but for gul'dan they offered much more.
Every race in the legion were mortal before they became demons, just look at Archimonde who was just as mortal as Velen but now can slowly be reformed in the Twisting Nether as it was said this was the same Archimonde that we defeated at Hyjal in WC3.
Rukifellth The Shadow
not every race. the pitlords, the dreadlords, and a few others where demons. but many may many become demons.
All right Nobbel, got a lore-linguistic question for you. If the runes displayed in the tomb are Orcish runes, like Maiev says, how is it that she is able to read them? The orcs hadn't been on Azeroth for very long at the point in time when Gul'dan came to the tomb, and they'd only been in the Eastern Kingdoms, i.e. nowhere near the Night Elves. So how is it that Maiev knows the language Gul'dan is writing in?
What is also interesting is that Naisha seemingly *cannot* read them, as she asks Maiev what they say. So it seems Maiev possess the knowledge of Orcish runes but her Watchers don't.
Hey Nobbel! Love the work you do, but there is one thing that raises my concern about Jaina Proudmoore. It’s a character I’ve been sympathizing with for many years, but now I feel Blizzard are doing their best to turn her into the next Garrosh Hellscream. I find it odd that a character that’s always been so resoluble should be blinded by hatred when the faith of Azeroth is at stake. What do you think?
Couple questions:
1: Is Miev storing Illidan's body in the place where he found the skull of Guldan and the eye of Sargeras?
2: If the tomb was a sunken highborne city from the WOTA and Miev is from that time (fighting in it as well wouldn't she recognize the architecture of the tomb as night elven)?
3: Why didn't the demons attack Miev when she went through the tomb?
4: Didn't Illidan go to the tomb find the skull of Guldan, and claim the eye to go use to sink northrend?
I just thought you'd give a more comprehensive history of the tomb i think you could have had more than 8 minutes of lore to talk about, the tomb has been explored few times.
eye of saegaras was destroyed by mal furion
I have a question. If the fel causes stuff to go bright green why are guldans eyes red
Thing is I never understood. Thrall was about to kill Garrosh in SoO, wrynn didn't let him. but what other punishment than death did he had coming? Lifetime?
Yeah jailtime most likely
+Gentle Cactus So we kill every raid boss but we decided to imprison Garrosh? I've read the book and all just trying to wrap my head around the extremely bad writing and how they forced WoD
Nope, everyone knew it was death.
Every leader knew it, he himself did, too.
It was just a matter of honor for the pandaren and maybe they could understand his actions that way (I.e. Garrosh got possessed and that's why he committed all these crimes).
Highly unlikely that he got out of it, but it was just some sort of formal manner. :P
+VijoPlays Then as I said before it's just forced and therfore bad writing
That comment wasn't there when I wrote mine, had the video a while opened in my browser already. :P
Nontheless, I wouldn't call it bad writing, but it's a bit forced, yeah.
It might be a bad excuse (hence, forced), but to me it sounds reasonable that the Pandaren do not like to just kill him, they want a fair trial or atleast some sort of reasoning why he did what he did. (After all, he just invaded Pandaria, stole stuff and killed stuff.. - short version atleast)
hey, i only played the warcraft 3 campaign, both frozen throne and reign of chaos, can you tell me the story of it so far?? i am intrigue of the story
8:30 Maienv: "Uuugh, stop botheriiing me .."
spoiler sargeras sword is the strongest weapon in the universe, it's also alive. when sargeras became evil it sundered itself into two pieces. I bet money it reforged will be the weapon to kill him.
I'm from thr future and have a message for you: You are wrong.
Does the announcement of karazhan as another revamped dungeon mean Khadgar's "attempts" to reconstruct the tower's defenses failed? I can only assume yes is the answer. But then, we also left khadgar alone inside the tower...