Meh, you could give trains away free, you still wouldn't get many people interested. Scary fact for train nerds, not everyone does, wants to, or has to like trains 😂 it's okay to not you can't get kids interested just by having them cheap.
Well, now they have Battery-O!! Now even cheaper crap from China! The mid-grade (Railking Imperial like) LC+ 2.0 stuff is so overpriced, you just as well buy legacy. This market segment is slowly diminishing from the lineup and we are now left with cheap crap that's still expensive for what you get and really nice stuff that is just plain unaffordable...
I love your honesty RJ. It’s about time some of these people start telling Lionel. They need to reduce their prices and make stuff that kids can actually afford. And I too think the new Lionel catalog was completely overrated and blown out of the water.
All you guys hit it right on the head!!! Now Lionel is starting to ruin the LionChief line of trains by making them more scale like. Thanks for sharing this RJ.!!!! MPC Matt.
@@MatthewJoseph-td5qcI don’t mind making the LionChief line more scale-like. I don’t like the fact that the prices are going up because of it. LionChief was supposed to be affordable. You can get older TMCC or even Legacy engines for the retail price of LionChief sets now
Lionel is out of control, I am retired now no way I am I paying these prices on new trains! I found some great deals on the used train market and I will stick to that.
Let’s face it: Lionel’s target market is dying off and they’re flailing. The ridiculous Vision Line stuff with prices in the stratosphere, the silly fantasy paint schemes on premium models, the plastic entry level battery trains, and the super overpriced traditional sets are all signs of a company that has lost its way. I think Lionel needs to simplify.
It's sad because I do want to get the 675 'Prairie Freight' set. Say what you will about LionChief, but I like how they brought back their postwar K4 engine in a regular train set and not some expensive legacy locomotive for like, $900.
Thanks for the shout out.... 600 bucks for 2 passenger cars? You gotta be f&%king kidding me! Gotta be honest, first time I have ever heard you speak critical about Lionel, good job!
My wallet loves it too. I might even get the Cab 3 with all the money I can't spend. If the industry is this bad, I need to get the last generation operating system.
Lionel's prices are beyond justifiable and their quality control is absurd. The fact that there are those out there who try to justify this is beyind ridiculous.
People with more money than you or I justify ridiculous prices all the time. Lionel trains are in the same "pointless purchasing" catagory as other luxuries, they are merely following the trend and the money which is after all what company do. The more pointless and silly the thing is, the more the price. The more caché the name has, the more silly the price. This is why "stink of dave" perfume will sell for $2 while Chanel, a name the public know, can sell for more as the public and particularly the well to do would rather have a great name on or about their things than buy smell of dave even if it smells better, is less harmful to you or the environment and so on... price point dictates to some degree who a product will appeal to so the price can be set needlessly high as they are appealing to well, not you or me, they are seeking to appeal and sell to rich people that can buy a bunch of it and show their rich friends who buy a bunch of it as they tend to buy more product and at higher price. Welcome to the capitalist dream. The dream that built america 🇺🇸 You think money bags folk are going to care if you can get model trains or not? They don't even care if you live or die or get healthcare 😅 maybe you need a luige but for model train companies
This kind of stuff makes me glad that I stick to HO/OO scale, possible switching to N in the future. Really is a shame that an anniversary this huge is treated like this. Amazing job as always, and keep being awesome! :D
Just for context: $500 today is equivalent to approximately $30-$35 in the 1930s. I took a quick glance at Lionel’s 1930 catalog and saw many steam/passenger sets with a price tag of $38-$50. Yup, model trains have always tended to be a rich man’s toy with pricing that stings and makes the wallet scream. 😉 I share your frustration!
Rich man's toy? Well certainly some articles in Lionel's product line in 1939 fit into that category. For example the Standard Gauge "Blue Comet" set retailed for $75, but with that same $75 you could get a Winchester 30-30 rifle AND a Colt .38 revolver and have $5 change coming. However, Lionel also offered starter sets in O Gauge for $19.95. Not super-cheap but not heart-stoppingly expensive either.
As for affordably you do not have to go back that far to see it could be done. When Lionel was owned by MPC they made some really cheep plastic starter sets. I bought several for gifts to get children interested in O gage trains and I never paid more than $19.95 at a major toy store for them. Yes they were cheaply made and had no extras like smoke or whistles but they did run ok and if the kids broke them it was no big loss. However it did get them interested in trains and I am sure some of them stayed with the hobby and upgraded to more expensive items as they got older. I do not see many families wanting to invest the money Lionel now wants for a basic starter set.
That's just Lionel being overpriced. Marx always had much better prices. You could get an entire Marx railroad for the cost of one singular Lionel set.
@@alexanderinsignares8784 It's been said and with quite a bit of veracity that: "Joshua Lionel Cowan made electric trains desireable. Louis Marx made them affordable!"
@@johnchambers8528 I ran into one of those cheap MPC sets last year and had to look twice to see that it was Lionel! A fellow club member gave it to me (soembody gave it to him) with a "I don't need it, see if you can do something with it" statement. The engine was a bit beat up but with some patience and epoxy I got it put back together again. I made sure the transformer was still working, cleaned up the cars and the track and sold it at a club show for $30. The folks came back the next day looking for some more tubular track, they were having so much fun with it! So sure, that cheap Lionel set still did what it was meant to do, get people interested!
Can’t help but agree with every point you’ve made RJ! I love the PRR turbines, but you’d never see me pay over $600 for an engine, especially $2,000+ for something I can find with similar features on eBay for half the cost. Another reason I love to buy second hand stuff! That and all electronics in these trains only scare me more because all it takes is a short or bad derailment and there goes your $2,000 engine 🙄… I love postwar and MPC Lionel, but I’m much less inclined to purchase anything from today’s Lionel because of those prices.
I just got randomly recommended your video, and I'm glad to see the hobby still has some popularity. I used to very active with model railroading back in the 70s, but with HO scale. I can't believe these Lionel prices... Even then they were over-priced, but 500 bucks for a few starter cars and a basic engine sounds way out of reach for most people these days.
For sure was watching Eric's Trains video and he was still gunna order some of their over priced stuff it's how many year old tooling and made their money 1,000 times over and selling their old tooling again but claim it's new like Eric said it says it on very page in the catalog but it isn't new it's old tooling old trains with new paint job that's the only thing that's new is the paint oh and 2nd thing that's not new is trying 2 rape it's customers on these outrages prices holy crap
I have always loved N scale but my eyes and my coordination make it difficult to manage. Time is not improving those qualities so I guess that I am stuck with O.
The month and a half, leading up to Weaver's closing, I stopped by a half dozens of times shopping. On one such occasion, Lionel was there. I talked to the two fellows from Lionel. I have since been informed that they are no longer with Lionel. This begs the question, did cooperate get rid of competent people? I am retired now 10 years. My expendable income for stuff hasn't changed. With these crazy and ever increasing prices, I asked my wife, who buys this stuff? It's like Gibson guitars, same thing. Fortunately, I loaded up on MTH Milwaukee Road engines, rolling stock, and passenger cars when prices were reasonable, and I could afford to buy a lot. Here's a flashback, Premier diesels were $329, and Railking scale was around $200. And that's for proto 2.0 engines. Well, if you made it this far, thanks for reading this.
It's 1991 Again......right before 1992-93 when MTH changed the 3-rail world with their SCALE Dash8-40CW locomotives. Unfortunately, this time - there will be no MTH to challenge Lionel and since Lionel has No competition this is what you get. All of the ADDICTS need to stop buying junk and hold out for a change. The second hand market looks better than ever!
Everyone just needs to speak with their pocketbook. If they can get people to pay the high prices then they will. Its unfortunate they couldn't pull off something better after 125 years. Thanks for the video!
A very good overview, RJ. I think that you are spot-on, here, with how Lionel is honoring their 125th anniversary. Lionel used to have history and it was promoted. MPC and Richard Kughn's LTI really capitalized upon Lionel's history and put out some real nice trains. To this ownership, history is just an afterthought, as Lionel is basically just one little cog in their corporate portfolio. They really dropped the ball here, which is too bad. The 125th anniversary is just another year for them so instead of a big celebration of Lionel's history, they just did nothing, except offer a few things at awfully high prices. I guess that they thought that they could rest on their laurels, instead of doing the Lionel heritage proud. Oh, well, it is what it is, I guess. I'll stick with my post-war trains. An excellent video, as always.
I think Lionel should go back to the drawing board. They should look back at their early to mid-2000s catalog. More grounded and realistic train sets with rugged locomotives and real railroad names instead of relying on fantasy, licensed products, and wacky paint schemes.
They had competition from MTH then. MTH cleaned house with their offerings of: SD45, FP45, C30-7, GP9, GP20, GP30, GP40, SD9, SD40-2, SD45T-2, SD50, SD60, SD60M, SD70M, SD90Mac, Dash8, Dash9, AC6000 etc and Lionel was releasing Daylight cab forwards!!!
This is the first review that I've seen after flipping through the catalog myself, and I just want to say that I appreciate how blunt and honest you were. My sentiments exactly. I was expecting something Grand and I couldn't have been more disappointed. I think if I get anything it would be the ADM tank cars because I have a collection of them. One again, spot on review ✊️
Fair call in my book, the prices are just getting ridiculous, which is a shame as there are a few thing in the catalog I did like, such as the Lionel Kiddie City piggyback, the Speedy Delivery Parcels car, and the Butterbeer tanker. For what I would spend on just one of those cars, I could have several RMT scale cars or a whole brace of Menards semi scale ones. Don't even get me started on the loco and set prices. Very happy to have found a Williams 746 J for $150 used instead. Think that'll be my main anniversary year purchase as it's a replica of the postwar original.
I can't get over the incorrect truck placement on those. 3rd Rail Sunset is your only hope. Of course the MTH SD45T-2 tunnel motor is accurate....but Rio Grande didn't have those.
Scream it to the heavens! Decided to switch over to HO 2 catalogs ago. I’m not paying Lionel’s ridiculous prices. They’re going to destroy the O scale following.
I’m not one to complain about catalogs/new product announcements from any of the big 3 manufacturers, but this one is beyond awful. A volume 1 “Big Book” combined with the 125th and this is the best they came up with? And the fact they started working on this catalog before last years V1/Big Book was released makes this even more embarrassing lmfao. Only 3 legacy steamers (what a joke), no legacy diesel switcher, and again seeing locomotives that have been cataloged way too many times in recent years are my biggest gripes. Should’ve had something exciting with new tooling or more locomotives that haven’t been cataloged within the last 5 years at the very least. There were such high hopes for this catalog because of the great options that were on the table. Lionel dropped the ball, bad.
Excellent review R.J. Been saying this about Lionel for 5 years. I’m an S Scale American Flyer Person myself. Thank goodness for American Models who produce Great quality S Scale models! Thanks for your thoughts on this catalog.
You got a lot of positive reactions and support on this one. Lionel has gone back to its roots and is making products for people who are well off in their finances. They have a name.
I completely agree with you on the commodore Vanderbilt comments, I’m happy to see the commodore back too, but I feel like they should have done more to make it VL otherwise it’s basically a glorified legacy engine with a Visionline price.
I kept telling everyone this catalog was garbage. MTH just announced a run of Premier USRA Pacific's in other news in a bunch of different road names and variations. Thanks for sharing!
@KatyPacific382 , yes, they just announced them earlier this afternoon. They are making NYC, Erie, Rutland, SP, DL&W, R&N, NYC fantasy, etc. I'm getting the Erie version. That one will feature an Elesco feedwater heater, too.
Amen man. These manufacturers are pricing out most people who wanna get into the hobby. Mario’s trains has the vision line Hudson for 1525 which is still absolutely insanity. But it was the cheapest place I could find one for preorder. Mth needs to bring back starter sets. They offered so much more in sound and smoke and overall quality in their sets.
@@rj.trains agreed I recently purchased the Lionel LionChief New York Central train set and it has the 280 which is the old MTH tooling and it’s a completely different locomotive. They stripped it down. The sounds are awful. The smoke is pitiful compared to what you would get in a 280 MTH train set and honestly it only cost 50 or $60 more for the MTH train set then it did for the Lionel set, and I would much rather have the MTH set.
I really don't understand why they went so hard on the most expensive stuff this year. One thing I really liked in last year's catalog was that for the Polar Express anniversary they had both Vision/Legacy Berkshires and updated Lionchief Berkshires which were much more affordable. They really shot themselves in the foot by not doing something similar with the Commodore Hudsons and *especially* the S2 turbine. The Commodores and turbines were icons of O gauge in the pre and post war eras respectively, basically everyone who's into Lionel wants one of them, but almost nobody can actually afford (or fit on their layout) these Vision line models, especially if they're planning on buying anything else this year. The "prewar inspired" Hudson set also felt particularly egregious when last year we got multiple throwback themed sets that were in the Lionchief range and were fairly well received because they were decent value for money. While more of a personal preference thing I also was disappointed by them not doing more Atlantics since those were another era defining locomotive.
Well RJ, it strikes me all Lionel's current offerings are going to do is increase the interest in good used Post-Wars, MPC, and LTI Lionel products! $2,000 for a toy? No thanks! $2,000 for "gee-whiz" electronics I'll NEVER use? I don't think so! I'll keep doing what I'm doing, buying used and repainting. (And after this video nobody's going to accuse you of being a shill for Lionel ever again! 🤣) Good video as usual RJ! It's always enjoyable spending time with you! And have fun at the Amherst show! That's one I'm never likely to go to, just a little too far away.
MTH is really the only way to go at this rate. Lionel is more of a money-grubbing company than ever, and that shows in this disappointment of a catalogue. but yeah, Lionel has lost the crown, and MTH has a chance to pick it up
Thankfully the catalog is free. These prices are horrific. $50 for a disconnect caboose, $189 for disconnect Halloween set. $1800 for a locomotive, $3500 for the 20th Century Set, Over $1000 for 4 passenger cars. I'll look elsewhere.
I have too many model trains just like the next guy, but purchasing Lionel for me has departed for the past handful of years. I’m sticking with building and upgrading my HO and G collections. I enjoy the new Commodore Vanderbilt sets but it’s about 3.5k out of my range. I don’t understand $100 for a Star Wars boxcar or $150 for a plastic train set. For me, Lionel has always been about having fun running trains as opposed to rivet counting etc. but for a 1.4k model of a Daylight Turbine… ! Thank you for the honest review of the catalog and hopefully I didn’t sound too harsh. I’m grateful for the O gauge TH-camrs that can afford and post so I can still see them😋
Seeing alot of the other comments, I can tell people are getting fed up with Lionel. The catalog wasn’t the worst but of course the high prices still suck. And there was nothing really new except the 700es and the S2 Turbines which we haven’t seen in a while. I accept your opinion on the catalog RJ. Great video!
As an old school model railroader (76 years old ) a trend that seems to be only in O scale Model railroaders and that trend is or seems to be collecting trains based on their future price increase (investment value ) and trying to collect everything that comes out.. As a HO model railroader ,who is new to O scale third rail model railroading , is seems as if the HO model railroader is more into enjoying the hobby and not collecting everything that comes out . I feel that Lionel along with along certain TH-cam influence-rs propagate this attitude . When I got back into model railroading and into O third rail ,I was going to model the 1950's era with first generation diesels and my two primary railroads would be ,the New York Central and the Pennsylvania Railroad . By doing this ,it eliminated any second ,third ,fourth or any other generations of diesel locomotives ,along with any and all "fantasy paint schemes ". This also makes it easy on my wallet ,since I am not purchasing everything that is put out by O gauge manufacturers I feel that most of the TH-cam O gauge channels are sometimes too focus on the gadgets ,such as crew talk that one would not actually hear when a train is passing you in real life . Another good example is,a number of TH-cam channels/ influences reviewed Lionel O gauge 1938 Twenty Century streamline passenger cars from the 2023 catalog . Not one of them discussed the Pullman type of car.that the cars represented nor if the cars are actually prototypical . Not all of the sleeping cars /Pullman cars ,are prototypical to the 1938 consist .
I was so hoping this catalog would be disappointing, and I'm glad it was so. I still am waiting for nearly 40 other pre-order items, so my wallet needed a break. Not one single Soo Line item, and the only real interest I have are in the track cleaners. I just wonder how well they work, if at all. I think the Area 51 Track Cleaning car would be fun to have on the layout while also having a way to clean the track.
Lionel is like Nike......you're paying for the name. You can double up on MTH or Atlas rolling stock for the price of 1 Lionel rolling stock. it's sad.
I think Lionel is backing themselves into a corner in terms of pricing. I like a lot of the stuff in this catalog but what’s really driving me away is the pricing. The Alco FA’s are still over a grand with the discounted price. The Commodore Vanderbilts are vision line yet they don’t have any visible bells, not sure how that swinging bell feature will work? This may end up being another catalog that I don’t order from and I think I’m okay with that. Buying from the second hand market is cheaper
Great video, yeah, the prices are out of control! I remember 10 years ago a Legacy engine was around 1000.00. Putting Vision Line on something and bumping up the price 500.00 seems to be the new thing. I think they have pushed it too far. Luckily, we have tons of older stuff on the secondary market. How come MTH can keep prices down, but Lionel can't. I splurged on the Vision Line Triplex because Mr. Muffins made an Army version. It's been at Lionel now for 2 months still not fixed. So, I am with you on the prices. The Commodore Vanderbilt is nice but it's not worth 1800.00 for just the engine. Thanks for a being real in the video!
Well young man you hit the nail on the head. Lionel has lost there way and I can say that after 40 years of collecting toy trains. Lionel thinks they can just raise there prices time and time again. Well we will see how this fairs the quality is not what it once was. I won’t ever go into the paint issues and color correctness. If this catalog reflects the best they can do for 125 years in business that is sad.
At this point I just ignore the prices unless it's something I'd genuinely throw money at and enjoy having - I like the concepts behind most of the commemorative stuff, but for those prices you can forget I even own a bit of O gauge. 1200 bucks for the singular conventional train set in current year? Buying the postwar equivalents of the stuff in that set should save you at least 700 bucks. By comparison, the 2007 remake of the #2269W set has more cars, more features overall, and (adjusting the MSRP for inflation) is priced at a hundred less than this offering (and can be found for less secondhand)... It's safe to say I'm sticking with my scale for anything new being offered this year 💀
RJ, your video is well done. I voiced my exact opinion directly. to Lionel at train fest? In Milwaukee? Where they were charging an exorbitant amount of money for a box car to receive a free lionel bag, which was embarrassing. So I will not be buying anything from this new catalog. seems to me, the theme was expensive, New york Central, so much for making some of the stuff that all of us train collectors have been looking for for many years. Lionel, thank you for pricing meny of us or our next generation out of the train collecting hobby. For cheap china profits. That will ultimately be your demise.
while i personally love colorful fantasy paint schemes, i still hate that they keep focusing more on vision line and then just not delivering new innovative features. i feel like at this point there should be more competition and LC+2 engines should have whistle steam. that's how every other tech market develops - cool features come to the mid tier models, high end models get new features.
The only fantasy scheme I don't like is the C&O scheme. It makes the engine look like a Creamsicle, and I DON'T like Creamsicles! Every time I got one when I was a kid it melted all over me before I could finish it! A Popsicle or a Fudgesicle? Another matter entirely!
I agree with a lot of your points about this catalog, and it's probably a sign of things to come moving forward. I was never a super Lionel guy either (MTH4life). O scale has already priced me out - which is why I moved over to HO - actually doing European HO now and I love it. Only thing I will get is the Star Wars Empire set. I have been waiting for an O scale Star Wars set for almost 30 plus years. It might end up being the last thing I purchase in an orange box, but only time will tell.
Who the Hell is out of their mind enough to spend $2,000+ on a steam locomotive that isn't ever authentically or accurate decorated? I thought $1,000+ for the JLC Big Boy and Allegheny was outrageous back in 2005, and I was still in grade school at that time and I couldn't even afford the O-27 4-4-2s at that time. At least the JLC Big Boy and Allegheny were accurate detailed and decorated. Lionel: In an endless loop of re-releasing the same gosh-damned things over and over again since 2010, with only the tiniest upgrades-, but hey! We've got that fancy new tooling from the 2000s that we bought from the MTH consignment auction. Just wait 'til 2027, where we'll offer a Bonhommie, Hattisburg, & Southern USRA 2-8-8-2, a Braswell Sand & Gravel Company 2-10-4 that totally isn't a Santa Fe 5011 class, and a Columbus & Greenville Railroad 2-8-4 that totally isn't the Pittsburgh & Lake Erie A-2 (people actually at Lionel: wait. . .what's a Pittsburgh & Lake Erie A-2?)
I have a neat idea. You should try and keep an eye out for a vintage O gauge Japanese train set. They are pretty rare, but would make a neat addition to your collection in my opinion.
Every Christmas dad and I would hit the train store for my main Christmas gift. It had a Palmore motor with traction tires. Cost about $80.00 and got a matching caboose so tick it up. Given inflation the cost of the one engine now is $362.48. That is only one item and not a set with track and transformer. 😆
I feel like Lionel is going to discontinue (if they haven't already) the ready to play range in favour of battery O which I think is a good decision. The best option is to include a new cheap fastrack (metal rails) kind of like 0-27 tubular track. Also great choice with the Thomas boxcar!
The amount of videos I've seen who still praise Lionel for everything they put out, you've really broken the mould for me. It's great to see someone actually looking at their stuff with a realistic outlook. Maybe it's time to make the jump to British O gauge? 😂
I'd have to look to see if they're still being imported but ETS (made in the Czech Republic) was producing an interesting assortment of American, British, and European-profile tinplate trains a few years back. Conventional-control only they were pretty reasonable compared to the high-end products around today.
@PhilBender612 Actually it's called loyalty. When Lionel shut down the Chesterfield plant,they put 350 UAW workers out of jobs.I am a retired 32 year UAW member.
Wow, just checked the new catalog out and I can’t believe how much trash is in there plus how much the prices have got up. I’m actually fine buying 10 years old trains of eBay Yeash!!!
Only offering 3 legacy steak engines is insane. What they actually are doesnt make it much better. I know some people love the fantasy schemes, but its becoming obvious that their go-to strategy now is to offer a few engines but just go wild on paint scheme variations.
@rj.trains a group of people at Lionel really thought: "You know what will sell? A Pennsylvania S2 with 25 year old tooling, but in a silver and blaze orange CO paint scheme."
Hit the train shows and keep your eyes open and your fingers crossed. There ARE original Pre-War Lionel "Red Comet" sets out there and if there's wear on them they're going for a LOT less than the high-tech new articles. Hey, I think even the ones in really good condition are STILL cheaper than what's in that 2025 catalog! So if you like the "Red Comet" go for the real thing if you can and "Party like it's 1939!"
I really like the Vision Hudson Prewar set, but I could buy an original 763e and those cars for less. There's a lot of neat stuff in this catalog, but I'll probably just keep an eye out for that Prairie LionChief pax set once it comes down $200 or so. Nice video!
I won't say your take on the current Lionel catalogue is 'brutal', but it is honest in your reaction to the current pricing habits of Lionel. It's become a never ending chase for the big bucks, but with a great loss of quality in the product and the delivery. It's a shame that a company that brags about it's excellence due to its historic connection to electric toy trains seems to base it's quality claim on some past triumphs which is largely absent in today's products. You've shown great restraint, RJ, in your patient reviews over the years, but there's a breaking point when you've had enough. Good for you. Hold their feet to the fire!
When I was a kid growing up in the 50s and 60s. The car is most admired where the Cadillac and Lincoln Continental. Everybody dreamed of owning one of those vehicles. Unfortunately, not many people could afford them, especially if you were a family man. I feel Lionel Company is following the same path. Nothing in this catalog is for me.
Seriously - enjoy Amherst! It's an awesome show. Get there early, bring a few bucks to pay for the parking lot when you get there. Expect long waits to get in to the fairgrounds and halls. Have to sit this year out, first one I've missed in a while! Hope to be back next year!
Yes Sir, I was big on Lionel in 2017 to 2020. The prices kept jumping and they were repeats from several years ago. The quality also dropped, I noticed. The "hot box refers" are junk. I purchased 2 of them, which I regret. What's with Lionel making all these weird trains now, which most model railroaders would never buy
I’m very glad I’m not the only one completely blown away by how poor this catalog is. I’m relatively new to o scale with two elementary school kids. Even if there was anything in this catalog I truly cared about.”, there’s no way if he able to afford it. I’m a Southern Railway guy. Unless I missed something else, the hoppers were the only thing I saw for Southern. I preordered an ABA consist of M.T.H. F7’s due around May for right around 1000. I really want to like Lionel due to the history and them being based an hour and a half away from me.
LIONEL's ridiculous prices are doing 2 things: preventing kids from joining the hobby, and driving more people to buy Menards.
Absolutely right, hell I can barely afford start now with my kids
Don’t forget RMT. RMT just released a bunch of affordable scale rolling stock. Eric’s Trains did a review of them and they look rather nice.
Meh, you could give trains away free, you still wouldn't get many people interested.
Scary fact for train nerds, not everyone does, wants to, or has to like trains 😂 it's okay to not you can't get kids interested just by having them cheap.
Well, now they have Battery-O!! Now even cheaper crap from China! The mid-grade (Railking Imperial like) LC+ 2.0 stuff is so overpriced, you just as well buy legacy. This market segment is slowly diminishing from the lineup and we are now left with cheap crap that's still expensive for what you get and really nice stuff that is just plain unaffordable...
Nailed it! Quality has gone down while pricing has gone up and up.
Yup!
I love your honesty RJ. It’s about time some of these people start telling Lionel. They need to reduce their prices and make stuff that kids can actually afford. And I too think the new Lionel catalog was completely overrated and blown out of the water.
Thanks! I’d rather spend my money on MTH and Atlas where I get more bang for my buck
I stopped buying new Lionel, $100 plus rolling stock, $600 lion chief, $1500 plus legacy locomotives I just can no longer afford it.
All you guys hit it right on the head!!! Now Lionel is starting to ruin the LionChief line of trains by making them more scale like. Thanks for sharing this RJ.!!!! MPC Matt.
Price and space wise is why I went to HO. But o scale will always hold a place in my heart.
@@MatthewJoseph-td5qcI don’t mind making the LionChief line more scale-like. I don’t like the fact that the prices are going up because of it. LionChief was supposed to be affordable. You can get older TMCC or even Legacy engines for the retail price of LionChief sets now
New feature: Smoke from the engineer’s cigar.
Lionel is out of control, I am retired now no way I am I paying these prices on new trains! I found some great deals on the used train market and I will stick to that.
Very true.
This is the only video you need to watch about Vol 1. Period... Cheers RJ!
Thank you!
I hear the pain in your voice, bless your soul. Thank you for dumping your stress for our entertainment. The UK boxcar is icing on the cake.
I almost broke when I got to that boxcar
Let’s face it: Lionel’s target market is dying off and they’re flailing. The ridiculous Vision Line stuff with prices in the stratosphere, the silly fantasy paint schemes on premium models, the plastic entry level battery trains, and the super overpriced traditional sets are all signs of a company that has lost its way. I think Lionel needs to simplify.
It's sad because I do want to get the 675 'Prairie Freight' set. Say what you will about LionChief, but I like how they brought back their postwar K4 engine in a regular train set and not some expensive legacy locomotive for like, $900.
You think rich people are dying off? They really aren't 😂
If only! What a socialist dream
Thanks for the shout out.... 600 bucks for 2 passenger cars? You gotta be f&%king kidding me! Gotta be honest, first time I have ever heard you speak critical about Lionel, good job!
Haha you’re welcome. I guess I’m more of a realist, I will compliment Lionel when they do good and criticize something I don’t like
Piko G gauge is cheaper.
was honestly hoping for something better being 125 , but my wallet absolutely loves this catalog . Love the video
Me too couldn't I could not have said it better. Right on.
My wallet loves it too. I might even get the Cab 3 with all the money I can't spend. If the industry is this bad, I need to get the last generation operating system.
Lionel's prices are beyond justifiable and their quality control is absurd. The fact that there are those out there who try to justify this is beyind ridiculous.
Agreed!
People with more money than you or I justify ridiculous prices all the time. Lionel trains are in the same "pointless purchasing" catagory as other luxuries, they are merely following the trend and the money which is after all what company do.
The more pointless and silly the thing is, the more the price. The more caché the name has, the more silly the price. This is why "stink of dave" perfume will sell for $2 while Chanel, a name the public know, can sell for more as the public and particularly the well to do would rather have a great name on or about their things than buy smell of dave even if it smells better, is less harmful to you or the environment and so on... price point dictates to some degree who a product will appeal to so the price can be set needlessly high as they are appealing to well, not you or me, they are seeking to appeal and sell to rich people that can buy a bunch of it and show their rich friends who buy a bunch of it as they tend to buy more product and at higher price.
Welcome to the capitalist dream. The dream that built america 🇺🇸
You think money bags folk are going to care if you can get model trains or not? They don't even care if you live or die or get healthcare 😅 maybe you need a luige but for model train companies
This kind of stuff makes me glad that I stick to HO/OO scale, possible switching to N in the future. Really is a shame that an anniversary this huge is treated like this.
Amazing job as always, and keep being awesome! :D
Thanks!
You are 100% right their prices are crazy I think MTH is more of in line with reality and quality great review RJ 👍🚂😃
MTH blinked when Mike Wolf retired and Lionel got the green light to begin their much desired price hikes. MTH held them down.
Just for context: $500 today is equivalent to approximately $30-$35 in the 1930s. I took a quick glance at Lionel’s 1930 catalog and saw many steam/passenger sets with a price tag of $38-$50. Yup, model trains have always tended to be a rich man’s toy with pricing that stings and makes the wallet scream. 😉 I share your frustration!
Rich man's toy? Well certainly some articles in Lionel's product line in 1939 fit into that category. For example the Standard Gauge "Blue Comet" set retailed for $75, but with that same $75 you could get a Winchester 30-30 rifle AND a Colt .38 revolver and have $5 change coming.
However, Lionel also offered starter sets in O Gauge for $19.95. Not super-cheap but not heart-stoppingly expensive either.
As for affordably you do not have to go back that far to see it could be done. When Lionel was owned by MPC they made some really cheep plastic starter sets. I bought several for gifts to get children interested in O gage trains and I never paid more than $19.95 at a major toy store for them. Yes they were cheaply made and had no extras like smoke or whistles but they did run ok and if the kids broke them it was no big loss. However it did get them interested in trains and I am sure some of them stayed with the hobby and upgraded to more expensive items as they got older. I do not see many families wanting to invest the money Lionel now wants for a basic starter set.
That's just Lionel being overpriced. Marx always had much better prices. You could get an entire Marx railroad for the cost of one singular Lionel set.
@@alexanderinsignares8784 It's been said and with quite a bit of veracity that:
"Joshua Lionel Cowan made electric trains desireable. Louis Marx made them affordable!"
@@johnchambers8528 I ran into one of those cheap MPC sets last year and had to look twice to see that it was Lionel! A fellow club member gave it to me (soembody gave it to him) with a "I don't need it, see if you can do something with it" statement. The engine was a bit beat up but with some patience and epoxy I got it put back together again. I made sure the transformer was still working, cleaned up the cars and the track and sold it at a club show for $30. The folks came back the next day looking for some more tubular track, they were having so much fun with it!
So sure, that cheap Lionel set still did what it was meant to do, get people interested!
Can’t help but agree with every point you’ve made RJ! I love the PRR turbines, but you’d never see me pay over $600 for an engine, especially $2,000+ for something I can find with similar features on eBay for half the cost. Another reason I love to buy second hand stuff! That and all electronics in these trains only scare me more because all it takes is a short or bad derailment and there goes your $2,000 engine 🙄… I love postwar and MPC Lionel, but I’m much less inclined to purchase anything from today’s Lionel because of those prices.
Postwar sets look really cool, but I might as well buy the originals for around half the price.
Haha yes exactly
You dropped this king 👑
I just got randomly recommended your video, and I'm glad to see the hobby still has some popularity. I used to very active with model railroading back in the 70s, but with HO scale. I can't believe these Lionel prices... Even then they were over-priced, but 500 bucks for a few starter cars and a basic engine sounds way out of reach for most people these days.
I completely agree. I think Lionel just jumped the shark.
Almost all model trains are vastly overpriced, it's why I buy second hand
You and the Country Bunker trains are the only truth speaking train guys left on TH-cam.
For sure was watching Eric's Trains video and he was still gunna order some of their over priced stuff it's how many year old tooling and made their money 1,000 times over and selling their old tooling again but claim it's new like Eric said it says it on very page in the catalog but it isn't new it's old tooling old trains with new paint job that's the only thing that's new is the paint oh and 2nd thing that's not new is trying 2 rape it's customers on these outrages prices holy crap
I switched to N scale 40 years ago and haven't looked back I saw Lionel pricing it's self out of business.
God bless I dont think I could work with a scale that small
I have always loved N scale but my eyes and my coordination make it difficult to manage. Time is not improving those qualities so I guess that I am stuck with O.
We need more people like RJ telling the truth about stuff like this
Man you can feel the passion in this one. All of it I stand with you on, Great points,
Thanks for the shout out bro!
Thanks and thanks for supplying the photos
The month and a half, leading up to Weaver's closing, I stopped by a half dozens of times shopping. On one such occasion, Lionel was there. I talked to the two fellows from Lionel. I have since been informed that they are no longer with Lionel. This begs the question, did cooperate get rid of competent people?
I am retired now 10 years. My expendable income for stuff hasn't changed. With these crazy and ever increasing prices, I asked my wife, who buys this stuff? It's like Gibson guitars, same thing. Fortunately, I loaded up on MTH Milwaukee Road engines, rolling stock, and passenger cars when prices were reasonable, and I could afford to buy a lot. Here's a flashback, Premier diesels were $329, and Railking scale was around $200. And that's for proto 2.0 engines. Well, if you made it this far, thanks for reading this.
It's 1991 Again......right before 1992-93 when MTH changed the 3-rail world with their SCALE Dash8-40CW locomotives. Unfortunately, this time - there will be no MTH to challenge Lionel and since Lionel has No competition this is what you get.
All of the ADDICTS need to stop buying junk and hold out for a change. The second hand market looks better than ever!
Nothing but problems with the old MTH batteries.⚠️
Everyone just needs to speak with their pocketbook. If they can get people to pay the high prices then they will. Its unfortunate they couldn't pull off something better after 125 years. Thanks for the video!
A very good overview, RJ. I think that you are spot-on, here, with how Lionel is honoring their 125th anniversary. Lionel used to have history and it was promoted. MPC and Richard Kughn's LTI really capitalized upon Lionel's history and put out some real nice trains. To this ownership, history is just an afterthought, as Lionel is basically just one little cog in their corporate portfolio. They really dropped the ball here, which is too bad. The 125th anniversary is just another year for them so instead of a big celebration of Lionel's history, they just did nothing, except offer a few things at awfully high prices. I guess that they thought that they could rest on their laurels, instead of doing the Lionel heritage proud. Oh, well, it is what it is, I guess. I'll stick with my post-war trains. An excellent video, as always.
I see a lot of demand for used train engines and cars.
I think Lionel should go back to the drawing board. They should look back at their early to mid-2000s catalog. More grounded and realistic train sets with rugged locomotives and real railroad names instead of relying on fantasy, licensed products, and wacky paint schemes.
They had competition from MTH then. MTH cleaned house with their offerings of: SD45, FP45, C30-7, GP9, GP20, GP30, GP40, SD9, SD40-2, SD45T-2, SD50, SD60, SD60M, SD70M, SD90Mac, Dash8, Dash9, AC6000 etc and Lionel was releasing Daylight cab forwards!!!
Nicely done! The F19 seems like even a more amazing value considering these crazy prices.
It was, and that was a miracle it was that cheap. Picked up two of them.
This is the first review that I've seen after flipping through the catalog myself, and I just want to say that I appreciate how blunt and honest you were. My sentiments exactly. I was expecting something Grand and I couldn't have been more disappointed. I think if I get anything it would be the ADM tank cars because I have a collection of them. One again, spot on review ✊️
Thank you!
Fair call in my book, the prices are just getting ridiculous, which is a shame as there are a few thing in the catalog I did like, such as the Lionel Kiddie City piggyback, the Speedy Delivery Parcels car, and the Butterbeer tanker.
For what I would spend on just one of those cars, I could have several RMT scale cars or a whole brace of Menards semi scale ones.
Don't even get me started on the loco and set prices. Very happy to have found a Williams 746 J for $150 used instead. Think that'll be my main anniversary year purchase as it's a replica of the postwar original.
I thought about ordering one of the rio grande tunnel motors but you can still find the ones from 2022 at most stores for $500 or less.
It’s just insane, the stuff is still sitting on shelves and they are making to again
I can't get over the incorrect truck placement on those. 3rd Rail Sunset is your only hope. Of course the MTH SD45T-2 tunnel motor is accurate....but Rio Grande didn't have those.
1699 for that tiny ass heisler is outrageous
Insanity
Scream it to the heavens! Decided to switch over to HO 2 catalogs ago. I’m not paying Lionel’s ridiculous prices. They’re going to destroy the O scale following.
Wish I had less O Scale stuff or I would also switch, oh well
I’m not one to complain about catalogs/new product announcements from any of the big 3 manufacturers, but this one is beyond awful. A volume 1 “Big Book” combined with the 125th and this is the best they came up with? And the fact they started working on this catalog before last years V1/Big Book was released makes this even more embarrassing lmfao. Only 3 legacy steamers (what a joke), no legacy diesel switcher, and again seeing locomotives that have been cataloged way too many times in recent years are my biggest gripes. Should’ve had something exciting with new tooling or more locomotives that haven’t been cataloged within the last 5 years at the very least. There were such high hopes for this catalog because of the great options that were on the table. Lionel dropped the ball, bad.
Excellent review R.J. Been saying this about Lionel for 5 years. I’m an S Scale American Flyer Person myself. Thank goodness for American Models who produce Great quality S Scale models! Thanks for your thoughts on this catalog.
Feel bad for you not much new s scale but tons out there on the secondary market
You got a lot of positive reactions and support on this one.
Lionel has gone back to its roots and is making products for people who are well off in their finances. They have a name.
I completely agree with you on the commodore Vanderbilt comments, I’m happy to see the commodore back too, but I feel like they should have done more to make it VL otherwise it’s basically a glorified legacy engine with a Visionline price.
Even after seeing the catalog, it’s literally a legacy engine in a black box
Without even looking at prices, there’s nothing that interests me in entire catalog. Add in prices, and zero chance I will buy anything.
Agreed!
I kept telling everyone this catalog was garbage. MTH just announced a run of Premier USRA Pacific's in other news in a bunch of different road names and variations. Thanks for sharing!
Yep and I will be ordering one of those haha
MTH?
Usra pacifics?
*I'm gonna have to check that out immediately!* 😮
@KatyPacific382 , yes, they just announced them earlier this afternoon. They are making NYC, Erie, Rutland, SP, DL&W, R&N, NYC fantasy, etc. I'm getting the Erie version. That one will feature an Elesco feedwater heater, too.
Lionel may be adding a little greed to its price rises .
How much money do you want to spend on a pile of plastic and wires that goes in a circle?
It's the price nobody can't afford these things
Sad part Lionel doesn't care
Thanks for posting this video. You might inspire more people to speak up.
Thanks for watching
Amen man. These manufacturers are pricing out most people who wanna get into the hobby. Mario’s trains has the vision line Hudson for 1525 which is still absolutely insanity. But it was the cheapest place I could find one for preorder. Mth needs to bring back starter sets. They offered so much more in sound and smoke and overall quality in their sets.
they did but they are so much more complex and can't compete with Lionel's affordability
@@rj.trains agreed I recently purchased the Lionel LionChief New York Central train set and it has the 280 which is the old MTH tooling and it’s a completely different locomotive. They stripped it down. The sounds are awful. The smoke is pitiful compared to what you would get in a 280 MTH train set and honestly it only cost 50 or $60 more for the MTH train set then it did for the Lionel set, and I would much rather have the MTH set.
I really don't understand why they went so hard on the most expensive stuff this year. One thing I really liked in last year's catalog was that for the Polar Express anniversary they had both Vision/Legacy Berkshires and updated Lionchief Berkshires which were much more affordable. They really shot themselves in the foot by not doing something similar with the Commodore Hudsons and *especially* the S2 turbine. The Commodores and turbines were icons of O gauge in the pre and post war eras respectively, basically everyone who's into Lionel wants one of them, but almost nobody can actually afford (or fit on their layout) these Vision line models, especially if they're planning on buying anything else this year. The "prewar inspired" Hudson set also felt particularly egregious when last year we got multiple throwback themed sets that were in the Lionchief range and were fairly well received because they were decent value for money. While more of a personal preference thing I also was disappointed by them not doing more Atlantics since those were another era defining locomotive.
Yea I grew up with a lot of starter sets that came with the 4-4-2 locomotives. They are doing a scale version but blah
Well RJ, it strikes me all Lionel's current offerings are going to do is increase the interest in good used Post-Wars, MPC, and LTI Lionel products! $2,000 for a toy? No thanks! $2,000 for "gee-whiz" electronics I'll NEVER use? I don't think so!
I'll keep doing what I'm doing, buying used and repainting.
(And after this video nobody's going to accuse you of being a shill for Lionel ever again! 🤣)
Good video as usual RJ! It's always enjoyable spending time with you!
And have fun at the Amherst show! That's one I'm never likely to go to, just a little too far away.
Yes nobody better call me a shill again haha. Thanks for watching Wayne!
@@rj.trains You're welcome!
MTH is really the only way to go at this rate. Lionel is more of a money-grubbing company than ever, and that shows in this disappointment of a catalogue.
but yeah, Lionel has lost the crown, and MTH has a chance to pick it up
I did enjoy your comments r.j.
You said exactly what you feel..your choice of thomas boxcar makes perfect sense.
Thank you!
Thankfully the catalog is free. These prices are horrific. $50 for a disconnect caboose, $189 for disconnect Halloween set. $1800 for a locomotive, $3500 for the 20th Century Set, Over $1000 for 4 passenger cars. I'll look elsewhere.
Yeah it's outrageous!
I was considering making a video but now I don't need to - you took the words out of my mouth. Very well said review.
You can pre-order a great MTH Premier engine for less than a LionChief set which is crazy 😅
True!
The Great Lionel Letdown 2025! Great spin on a catalog review! I always appreciate an honest opinion!
I rather have some of your Pecos River rolling stock
I can't wait to hear Zac's comments
@williamkolina3988 Yup! Joker gonna be way honest!
Thanks!
I have too many model trains just like the next guy, but purchasing Lionel for me has departed for the past handful of years. I’m sticking with building and upgrading my HO and G collections. I enjoy the new Commodore Vanderbilt sets but it’s about 3.5k out of my range. I don’t understand $100 for a Star Wars boxcar or $150 for a plastic train set. For me, Lionel has always been about having fun running trains as opposed to rivet counting etc. but for a 1.4k model of a Daylight Turbine… ! Thank you for the honest review of the catalog and hopefully I didn’t sound too harsh. I’m grateful for the O gauge TH-camrs that can afford and post so I can still see them😋
Seeing alot of the other comments, I can tell people are getting fed up with Lionel. The catalog wasn’t the worst but of course the high prices still suck. And there was nothing really new except the 700es and the S2 Turbines which we haven’t seen in a while. I accept your opinion on the catalog RJ. Great video!
Thanks for the info. That's too bad the prices are so high.
As an old school model railroader (76 years old ) a trend that seems to be only in O scale Model railroaders and that trend is or seems to be collecting trains based on their future price increase (investment value ) and trying to collect everything that comes out..
As a HO model railroader ,who is new to O scale third rail model railroading , is seems as if the HO model railroader is more into enjoying the hobby and not collecting everything that comes out .
I feel that Lionel along with along certain TH-cam influence-rs propagate this attitude .
When I got back into model railroading and into O third rail ,I was going to model the 1950's era with first generation diesels and my two primary railroads would be ,the New York Central and the Pennsylvania Railroad .
By doing this ,it eliminated any second ,third ,fourth or any other generations of diesel locomotives ,along with any and all "fantasy paint schemes ".
This also makes it easy on my wallet ,since I am not purchasing everything that is put out by O gauge manufacturers
I feel that most of the TH-cam O gauge channels are sometimes too focus on the gadgets ,such as crew talk that one would not actually hear when a train is passing you in real life .
Another good example is,a number of TH-cam channels/ influences reviewed Lionel O gauge 1938 Twenty Century streamline passenger cars from the 2023 catalog .
Not one of them discussed the Pullman type of car.that the cars represented nor if the cars are actually prototypical .
Not all of the sleeping cars /Pullman cars ,are prototypical to the 1938 consist .
I was so hoping this catalog would be disappointing, and I'm glad it was so. I still am waiting for nearly 40 other pre-order items, so my wallet needed a break. Not one single Soo Line item, and the only real interest I have are in the track cleaners. I just wonder how well they work, if at all. I think the Area 51 Track Cleaning car would be fun to have on the layout while also having a way to clean the track.
Lionel is like Nike......you're paying for the name. You can double up on MTH or Atlas rolling stock for the price of 1 Lionel rolling stock. it's sad.
Funny thing is I refuse to buy nike too haha
I remember MTH would charge about $1000 for an engine and an extra $100 would get you the passenger car set - what ever happened to those days ?
Those days are long gone
I think Lionel is backing themselves into a corner in terms of pricing. I like a lot of the stuff in this catalog but what’s really driving me away is the pricing. The Alco FA’s are still over a grand with the discounted price. The Commodore Vanderbilts are vision line yet they don’t have any visible bells, not sure how that swinging bell feature will work? This may end up being another catalog that I don’t order from and I think I’m okay with that. Buying from the second hand market is cheaper
Great video, yeah, the prices are out of control! I remember 10 years ago a Legacy engine was around 1000.00. Putting Vision Line on something and bumping up the price 500.00 seems to be the new thing. I think they have pushed it too far. Luckily, we have tons of older stuff on the secondary market. How come MTH can keep prices down, but Lionel can't. I splurged on the Vision Line Triplex because Mr. Muffins made an Army version. It's been at Lionel now for 2 months still not fixed. So, I am with you on the prices. The Commodore Vanderbilt is nice but it's not worth 1800.00 for just the engine. Thanks for a being real in the video!
Well young man you hit the nail on the head. Lionel has lost there way and I can say that after 40 years of collecting toy trains. Lionel thinks they can just raise there prices time and time again. Well we will see how this fairs the quality is not what it once was. I won’t ever go into the paint issues and color correctness. If this catalog reflects the best they can do for 125 years in business that is sad.
Lionel certainly ain't what it used to be
Lionel 125th anniversary. They just marked everything up 125%
At this point I just ignore the prices unless it's something I'd genuinely throw money at and enjoy having - I like the concepts behind most of the commemorative stuff, but for those prices you can forget I even own a bit of O gauge. 1200 bucks for the singular conventional train set in current year? Buying the postwar equivalents of the stuff in that set should save you at least 700 bucks. By comparison, the 2007 remake of the #2269W set has more cars, more features overall, and (adjusting the MSRP for inflation) is priced at a hundred less than this offering (and can be found for less secondhand)... It's safe to say I'm sticking with my scale for anything new being offered this year 💀
RJ, your video is well done. I voiced my exact opinion directly. to Lionel at train fest? In Milwaukee? Where they were charging an exorbitant amount of money for a box car to receive a free lionel bag, which was embarrassing. So I will not be buying anything from this new catalog. seems to me, the theme was expensive, New york Central, so much for making some of the stuff that all of us train collectors have been looking for for many years. Lionel, thank you for pricing meny of us or our next generation out of the train collecting hobby. For cheap china profits. That will ultimately be your demise.
while i personally love colorful fantasy paint schemes, i still hate that they keep focusing more on vision line and then just not delivering new innovative features. i feel like at this point there should be more competition and LC+2 engines should have whistle steam. that's how every other tech market develops - cool features come to the mid tier models, high end models get new features.
The only fantasy scheme I don't like is the C&O scheme. It makes the engine look like a Creamsicle, and I DON'T like Creamsicles! Every time I got one when I was a kid it melted all over me before I could finish it!
A Popsicle or a Fudgesicle? Another matter entirely!
I agree with a lot of your points about this catalog, and it's probably a sign of things to come moving forward. I was never a super Lionel guy either (MTH4life). O scale has already priced me out - which is why I moved over to HO - actually doing European HO now and I love it. Only thing I will get is the Star Wars Empire set. I have been waiting for an O scale Star Wars set for almost 30 plus years. It might end up being the last thing I purchase in an orange box, but only time will tell.
I know you, you will end up with one
I’m a huge fan of big steam engines.
Didn’t see not a one ☹️
More money saved for when you find one!
Who the Hell is out of their mind enough to spend $2,000+ on a steam locomotive that isn't ever authentically or accurate decorated? I thought $1,000+ for the JLC Big Boy and Allegheny was outrageous back in 2005, and I was still in grade school at that time and I couldn't even afford the O-27 4-4-2s at that time. At least the JLC Big Boy and Allegheny were accurate detailed and decorated.
Lionel: In an endless loop of re-releasing the same gosh-damned things over and over again since 2010, with only the tiniest upgrades-, but hey! We've got that fancy new tooling from the 2000s that we bought from the MTH consignment auction. Just wait 'til 2027, where we'll offer a Bonhommie, Hattisburg, & Southern USRA 2-8-8-2, a Braswell Sand & Gravel Company 2-10-4 that totally isn't a Santa Fe 5011 class, and a Columbus & Greenville Railroad 2-8-4 that totally isn't the Pittsburgh & Lake Erie A-2 (people actually at Lionel: wait. . .what's a Pittsburgh & Lake Erie A-2?)
ADDICTS
Lionel hasn’t been for kids for a long time.
Never will be again
I have a neat idea. You should try and keep an eye out for a vintage O gauge Japanese train set. They are pretty rare, but would make a neat addition to your collection in my opinion.
It would! But the downside is you'd have to find an O Scale Godzilla to eat it!
@@wayneantoniazzi2706 lol that would be terrifying. XD
Slightly off topic, but who makes those mid century style passenger train artwork prints on the wall behind you in the intro?
Those were made by Amtrak
Been years since I purchased anything out of the catalogs , Lionel sucks whether it’s paint or QC issues
I really wish MTH made catalogs. As fas as i know, they don't
they dont but they announce a new product every week
@ I didn’t know they announced one every week? I’m going to check it out today.
Every Christmas dad and I would hit the train store for my main Christmas gift. It had a Palmore motor with traction tires. Cost about $80.00 and got a matching caboose so tick it up. Given inflation the cost of the one engine now is $362.48. That is only one item and not a set with track and transformer. 😆
I rely on your expertise on these items...and you are a wonderful source of data
I’m glad you find my videos helpful!
I feel like Lionel is going to discontinue (if they haven't already) the ready to play range in favour of battery O which I think is a good decision. The best option is to include a new cheap fastrack (metal rails) kind of like 0-27 tubular track.
Also great choice with the Thomas boxcar!
Awesome review and spot on! , can’t believe that’s what they came up with for such a big deal. Love the channel 🤘
Thanks!
LIONEL has forgotten that the average young person, the future of the hobby, has been completely priced out of the LIONEL world.
Lionel is marketing themselves to the ultra wealthy, always have, just more pronounced now
The amount of videos I've seen who still praise Lionel for everything they put out, you've really broken the mould for me. It's great to see someone actually looking at their stuff with a realistic outlook. Maybe it's time to make the jump to British O gauge? 😂
Day by day I inch closer to jumping head first into British O Gauge haha
I'd have to look to see if they're still being imported but ETS (made in the Czech Republic) was producing an interesting assortment of American, British, and European-profile tinplate trains a few years back. Conventional-control only they were pretty reasonable compared to the high-end products around today.
RJ, right on! Lionel's pricing is way out of line!
Thanks!
I gave up on Lionel in 2001 when they shut down US production. I only buy used MPC/LTI.
🤣😂🤣🤣i bet you still watch an old tv with tubes too! its called technology, it gets better and better.
@PhilBender612 Actually it's called loyalty. When Lionel shut down the Chesterfield plant,they put 350 UAW workers out of jobs.I am a retired 32 year UAW member.
Wow, just checked the new catalog out and I can’t believe how much trash is in there plus how much the prices have got up. I’m actually fine buying 10 years old trains of eBay Yeash!!!
I'm so glad you made this video. Lionel has gotten so bad.
Thank You.
Only offering 3 legacy steak engines is insane. What they actually are doesnt make it much better. I know some people love the fantasy schemes, but its becoming obvious that their go-to strategy now is to offer a few engines but just go wild on paint scheme variations.
Why make new engines when we can make the same ones in colorful paint schemes!
@rj.trains a group of people at Lionel really thought: "You know what will sell? A Pennsylvania S2 with 25 year old tooling, but in a silver and blaze orange CO paint scheme."
I am so excited about the 'red comet', I always wanted the 1937 version and too bad the 2025 version is a vision line and out of my range.
maybe one day you will be able to find it at a good price haha
Hit the train shows and keep your eyes open and your fingers crossed. There ARE original Pre-War Lionel "Red Comet" sets out there and if there's wear on them they're going for a LOT less than the high-tech new articles.
Hey, I think even the ones in really good condition are STILL cheaper than what's in that 2025 catalog!
So if you like the "Red Comet" go for the real thing if you can and "Party like it's 1939!"
@@wayneantoniazzi2706 haha you’re right! Going to party like it’s 1939 and get that original red comet!
@@zavala90011 That's the spirit! Best of luck to you!
By the way, I bought a Pre-War 259e set just because it looks so cool and I love it!
Excellent Video. Down to earth nothing barred. Honest and enlightening.
I really like the Vision Hudson Prewar set, but I could buy an original 763e and those cars for less. There's a lot of neat stuff in this catalog, but I'll probably just keep an eye out for that Prairie LionChief pax set once it comes down $200 or so. Nice video!
I won't say your take on the current Lionel catalogue is 'brutal', but it is honest in your reaction to the current pricing habits of Lionel. It's become a never ending chase for the big bucks, but with a great loss of quality in the product and the delivery. It's a shame that a company that brags about it's excellence due to its historic connection to electric toy trains seems to base it's quality claim on some past triumphs which is largely absent in today's products. You've shown great restraint, RJ, in your patient reviews over the years, but there's a breaking point when you've had enough. Good for you. Hold their feet to the fire!
It’s a real shame how the quality has slipped, I’m glad you understand where I’m coming from.
Amen! Great video! 🥃🍻
When I was a kid growing up in the 50s and 60s. The car is most admired where the Cadillac and Lincoln Continental. Everybody dreamed of owning one of those vehicles. Unfortunately, not many people could afford them, especially if you were a family man. I feel Lionel Company is following the same path. Nothing in this catalog is for me.
I am also disappointed in this catalog. There’s nothing in it that needs to be part of my roster.
Agreed
Seriously - enjoy Amherst! It's an awesome show. Get there early, bring a few bucks to pay for the parking lot when you get there. Expect long waits to get in to the fairgrounds and halls. Have to sit this year out, first one I've missed in a while! Hope to be back next year!
Definitely agree with you, probably won’t be getting anything from this catalog if I do it would be the cp FA set
Yes Sir, I was big on Lionel in 2017 to 2020. The prices kept jumping and they were repeats from several years ago. The quality also dropped, I noticed. The "hot box refers" are junk. I purchased 2 of them, which I regret. What's with Lionel making all these weird trains now, which most model railroaders would never buy
I’m very glad I’m not the only one completely blown away by how poor this catalog is. I’m relatively new to o scale with two elementary school kids. Even if there was anything in this catalog I truly cared about.”, there’s no way if he able to afford it. I’m a Southern Railway guy. Unless I missed something else, the hoppers were the only thing I saw for Southern. I preordered an ABA consist of M.T.H. F7’s due around May for right around 1000. I really want to like Lionel due to the history and them being based an hour and a half away from me.