What the hell... The comment section on this video is seriously glitched, at least on my end. I keep trying to copy and paste what Tod said via email and pin it but it disappears every time. And Tod's comments are invisible to me, so I wonder if there are others I can't see either. There was one comment of his that I was able to find, so I asked him to edit it so I can pin it. Immediately after he edited it, gone. Can't see it anymore. Has anyone encountered a weird glitch like that before? [Update] Since this post is still here I tried once again to post what Tod said about the crossbows. And guess what? It immediately disappeared. There must be some broken algorithm that picks up something in his message that causes it to delete it. Makes zero sense, there is nothing "bad" in there. Ok, so I'll sum it up in my own words: Tod pointed out the age of the crossbow (around 4 years by now) and thinks that the trigger is worn and needs to be re-built. It's a simple trigger system that needs to hold a very high load, and the main difference is that medieval objects require much more maintenance than we're used to from modern materials. Changes in moisture in the wood can affect the seating of the parts and cause problems. Tod offered to repair the crossbow if I sent it back to him. He also thinks that the goat's foot crossbow has dropped in power as well, and the string needs replacing or tightening. In other words, he has been quick to respond and offer fixing the issue, which I appreciate. There, hopefully that works now.
Hey Skall love this channel, I was wondering if you could do videos on what it would be like for soldiers on the battefield and just how dangerous is was. Also maybe talk about injuries you could recieve on the battlefield?
Hi Skallagrim, I finished my documentary about the Chinese Crossbow (single shot ones 400lbs@30" for example) th-cam.com/video/k4iqUmVvmT8/w-d-xo.html hoping this video will spark interesting about building this crossbow
This is kind of like the [old gun] v. AR15 discussion. Some people will say "well, its not fair because the AR15 uses 30 round magazines, has better sights, can take an optic and night-vision equipment, has provisions for mounting all kinds of accessories like grips and bi-pods, can easily take flashlights..." Yeah, kind of the point. The modern thing is better. The old thing is cool, and in it's time it was hot shit, but time has moved on. Should we forget about the old? Never. But should we pretend that it's still the best thing? No.
Exactly. You don't shoot 14th century crossbows because they're the epitome of crossbow design, but because it's pretty cool to experience history that way. Is the Hawken rifle a good hunting rifle?. Yep, especially in the 1840's. Can it compete with a modern generic .308 hunting rifle? Of course not, but it's still cool as all hell though.
Skall: “I wouldn’t want to shoot this in the rain” Genoese crossbowmen who were defeated by the English longbow-men because of the rain: *sadness noises*
the fucking french thought it would be a good idea to send the crossbowmen without their shields and heavy crossbows coming in the carriages, just *THE THINGS* that make crossbowmen effective
@@austinhoward6557 Less- there are no tightly-fitted moving parts inside of the stock that can jam up of the wood swells when wet. A long bow is just a wooden stick & string after all...
Austin Howard It actually wasn’t the soaked bowstrings that stopped them. The english took the string off their bow to stop it getting wet, but crossbow strings were made of leather, and therefore were waterproof. What caused them to lose was the mud- it stopped them being able to use the foot stirrup to reload quickly, which ended up having the English fire three times faster than they could
Austin Howard Not really,there’s not much to mess with. Rain and wind would make shorting accurately harder,but since accuracy wasn’t a concern anyway...
Nice! For future reference, it does have "iron sights". If you remove the red dot, the red V on the rear and the three dots on the bridge at the front are the iron sights :)
@@yungsouichi2317 Skall made a video on it I think about 3 months back, but it does come with one but it was VERY poorly built. Skall has put a Holosun red dot on it, they are about $130 USD but that is still like $150 cheaper than a proper name brand.
I was about to say the same thing! Also I terms of weakness that seems on par with what Tod has found in terms of power for a crossbow like that, about 54 joules (said 95 originally) if I remember correctly, which is less than a 22lr.
Medieval crossbows needed heavy bolts to get the best out of the mechanically inefficient design of medieval crossbows. Modern bolts work well with modern crossbows because there is a far more efficient longer power stroke, lighter bow limbs & lighter/thinner string. It's a bit like saying because race horses go fast with light jockeys, the way to make cart horses fast would be light jockies.
Those historically incorrect solid metal roller nuts certainly don't help either. There is a significant proportion of energy released while the string is clearing itself from the lock -up to 30%-40% with those short power-strokes. As the outer rim of the nut moves with same speed or faster than the bolt, 10-20% of stored energy is easily lost there. That is why they were made out of light weight exotic materials like antler or ivory back in the day. And it certainly does not help that these modern replicas categorically have considerably thinner limbs than the historical examples. This is an understandable safety measure for warranty and liability reasons, but it also means that the shot only has about third the energy and half the potential arrow speed available.
@@sharpestbulb I'm guessing "not much". The low launch velocity of a traditional bow would be useless with a light bolt. Modern bolts are light so as to take advantage of the higher velocities achievable with compound bows/pulleys.
@@jorgejohnson875 tbh currently every ranged unit is very strong, partially due to them being accurate and unlike warband they learned to lead thier targets but also because tier 1 units don't have any, even shitty makeshift, shields
Long-term product reviews are so underrepresented, thanks Skall. The true quality/characteristics of a product only tells after a certain amount of time, espcecially when it has moving parts like the crossbow.
@@Batmack Trying to, my workplace has been shut down since mid February, the mercenary career is now more appealing than ever (thanks for the concern, mate!)
@@brainyskeletonofdoom7824 quite a sensible change in any career path. I would discourage working for the French, they are nice and pay well, but they are a bit unreasonable when it comes to pulling out of disadvantageous tactical situations and may end up slaying you for percieved cowardice.
The couch arrived in two boxes four days early, which was great because we'd just moved into a new house and needed places to sit. My son and I put it together pretty quickly th-cam.com/users/postUgkxitRzxya-XugamYgLwa_2G1gxPg4MCJHa . Another reviewer suggested inserting the seat into the side and I'm glad they did as the instructions weren't clear on that matter. It's incredibly light and slides easily across the wood floor, making it easy to move. It's firm, but comfortable. It will even be great to nap on. I got the gray, which definitely has strong blue undertones, but I'm okay with that.
Awesome video Skall! The modern crossbows are definetly better in most ways but the historical ones are way cooler and fun. Also I'm still sometimes not getting notified of your videos even though I have your notifications turned on. Just wanted to let you know. I always check in though.
Skall, when you change aim high or low, you also change the direction the point travels, it is ideal to be perpendicular and hence misjudging the fall can mean the negative effect on penetration is increased even more due to inefficient energy transfer to the target.
It's supposedly from when the first percussion cap revolvers were in use. They're surprisingly easy to misfire, to the point that most people carried them on an empty chamber.
Should do a video like this one but focusing on the maintenance different for a medieval crossbowman vs bowman vs earliest arquebusiers. Alot of media doesn't appropriately show all the work you had to do (and still do) to maintain weapons in the old times.
The light crossbow and its arrow drop when compared to the modern one remind me when I played Battlefield 4 and was out snipping snippets with a Mares Leg 40x Zoom at 1500m+
Wow this is super helpful for balancing the range of crossbows in my game. Having only used modern ones I thought they always had a high velocity. Good to know!
You are absolutely correct about medieval crossbow failures. But, put yourself in a time period before the first printing press was invented. Crossbow usage was as regular as with anything else in the medieval period. Not only the well-to-do but, the middle class (if there was ever such a class in feudalism) had the means and access to the practice, fabrication, and maintenance of crossbows. As previously mentioned, crossbows were a way of life. It was second nature to shoot and to repair crossbows because, at the time, there was nothing else to do or to shoot with (maybe the occasional RPG rolled in).
I love my bent stick longbow. It's fun and challenging and when I get a good group, it makes me very happy. If it's about putting food on the table, give me as modern as you got...
Wouldn't have thought of a lot of medieval crossbow issues, hmm. I always assumed they hit harder than bows without needing as much strength, but never thought of their own issues. Between modern bowguns and compound bows, a bit of engineering and modern materials do make archery accessible in an age of hunting with guns.
Given what Tod's mentioned about crossbows, it sounds like the nut needs replacing. He's mentioned that the metal sear present in crossbow nuts make it stronger, but also makes it wear faster. Wouldn't surprise me if that's the problem, especially given how high the draw weight of that beast is.
With the medieval crossbow you can use the thumb of your trigger hand as a rearshight. In combination with markings on the stock for different distances
It'd be interesting to see the relationship of draw weight vs powerstroke by comparing different designs. Ancient East Asian crossbows had a different design of lower draw weight but much longer powerstroke. The average Qin-Han era infantry crossbow had a 6 stone (387lbs) draw weight with an 18-20 inch powerstroke. Crossbows ranged from 1 stone to 10+ stones (the lightest ones were for training while the heaviest ones were for large mechanically aided versions used as field artillery). The Qin-Han era crossbowman would draw the crossbow in a sitting position where they would use their leg, torso, and arm muscles all at once to draw the string. I've read that the crossbowmen might even had laid on their backs for the heavier crossbows so they didn't have to deal with the weight of their torsos when drawing the crossbow. The Han Dynasty had an excellent training program where they would physically condition and train the new recruits for 1 year before sending them into combat, so even skinny city folks who don't do manual labor would have sufficient time to beef up and become strong enough to repeatedly draw heavy crossbows.
@@kovona True. However, a composite recurve design can help keep it smaller compared to a non-recurve design. It will still wider than shorter powerstrike designs, but could be kept small enough to use in tight spaces. eg. Some recreations of Scythian recurve bows are ~3.5 feet in length when strung and have a ~26 inch draw. Increasing the draw weight would only require increasing the thickness of the bow prod without having to increase the length (or width if oriented horizontally).
You probably won't see this considering the glitch in the matrix with the comments section and the fact that you lead a busy life and probably won't care, but a gaming TH-camr ESO started a playthrough on the new Mount and Blade game Bannerlord and his character bares quite a resemblance to you minus the hair and beard models. Just thought that you would find that tidbit of information fun. I love your vids man. 💯
A word on the arrow Backstop net - you got to have it free swinging like a curtain. The net has to grab around arrow and head before the arrow and pierce thru, that what stopping them.
one thing to keep in mind, is that while crossbow had problems, so did bows. I read an old historical document on bows and archery, and the author went in great details about bow exploding.
Draw weight is not the only measurement for power because the kinetic energy of a projectile is roughly equal to the work a bow/crossbow does which is equal to the force applied multiplied by the distance that they apply this force to the projectile. Not to mention poor materials for the string means that towards the end of the force-applying distance, the force is substantially lower than the maximum draw weight that was measured.
Dude, when are you and Jorge Sprave going to do a collab?! I would love to see the two of you traipsing around the woods messing with different projectile weaponry!
That design is not cold steel's. It was engineered by Jorge Sprave from the slingshot channel. He has a bunch of videos on how he made it. Go check it out.
This video isn't an accurate representation of the performance of decent-quality medieval military crossbows. The best ones still small enough to conveniently use managed the same velocity as the Cheap Shot but with as much kinetic energy as any mass-produced modern crossbow. & the larger ones that needed to be shot from a support were more even powerful.
@@b.h.abbott-motley2427 Any evidence for that? No one I know of has established that. The steel bow, properly heat treated, pretty much is what it is. And given the use of modern materials and heat treat, our steel bows today are certainly as good as theirs and likely better. That's just physics. The question, then, is about efficiency. We have surviving originals, so we know the geometry and release mechanisms. There is no magical medieval bow that suddenly doubles the amount of delivered energy.
@@mpsmith47304 There's lots of evidence from period sources as well as a limited amount from modern reconstructions. See Andreas Bichler's 1,200lb horn crossbow replica for the best performance to date form a reconstructed crossbow small enough to conveniently use. It managed approximately 145 foot-lbs at 230 fps. & various museums contain larger horn crossbows from the 15th century. The crossbow shot in this video resembles those found from mid-16th-century Spanish shipwrecks in the Americas. The crossbow had almost entirely left European battlefields by that time. The purpose of those crossbows is unclear; they may have been for hunting, military use on a budget, only for defending fortifications or the ship, or some combination of these. & the original may have performed better, especially been this one, which was in a state of disrepair. In terms of physics, lots of factors affect initial kinetic energy. With bows, high-end performance bows shoot much better than cheap ones. As with warbows, I suspect military crossbows that rely on strength to span had higher draw weights than most people can manage. This includes goat's-foot-lever crossbows such as the one here. We know from *El Victorial* & other sources that spanning a crossbow from the belt was a feat of strength that knights & other soldiers competed in.
obviously not, or it wouldn't have been used by every country in Europe and the Mediterranean to some extent (yes even the Arab states and English used the crossbow), and it wouldn't have been the preferred weapon of elite mercenaries. the Italians, polish, Hungarian and certain musilim states loved the crossbow so much it replaced all infantry and even light cavalry (primary) weapons in their armies untill gunpowder weapons became common. it sucks compared to now, but compared to contemporary stuff it was golden.
@@b.h.abbott-motley2427 And have about 1/5 the rate of shot of a modern crossbow. It takes at least half a minute to load a bolt with a Windlass. I looked up a horn crossbow out of curiosity and found this. th-cam.com/video/AA5M0QKXtWU/w-d-xo.html It shoots 315 ft-lbs of Kinetic Energy, which is powerful, but looks too bulky to be used for anything other than defending.
If I had to guess (mind you I'm no historian or craftsman) I'd suspect that the mechanism that's holding the nut in place against the bowstring has become weaker thus is engages and holds against pushing on it by hand but is too weaker to keep the bow "loaded". To fix it after disassembly might be as simple as replacing the faulty spring or much, much worse depending on the exact mechanism.
I have seen a version of the crossbow in the museum of one of the Loire castles (either Angers or Amboise, don't remember) that was nearly as tall as the armor it was displayed next to. If elephants were flying animals, this crossbow looked like it would be the perfect tool to hunt them
It could be that there is a bit of metal worn from the nock on that broken crossbow. Where the trigger engages the nock. Could happen over time when it's not straight horizontally or if it doesn't spin freely. Or if there's metal worn off of the trigger itself.. I would have someone remove that rivet pin so you can see what's going on. It might either need a new trigger or nock. It would be one of the downsides of a crossbow vs a bow for a soldier in history. While neither would be able to get repairs on the fly in battle, it would be easier to patch up a bow then to disassemble a crossbow between battles. It's also feasible to simply fashion a makeshift bow if a regiment of soldiers is traveling through woodlands. Something that can't really be done with a crossbow
Every time I've seen a goat's foot lever being used, the thing that comes to mind is: why doesn't the user have a leash on it to hang it on their shoulder, so they don't need to look for a place to set it down?
sounds to me as if the sear has burred on the big crossbow. or its got some play in its pivot point. I have every confidence that tod will sort him out with a fix. a friend of my old boss has one of tod's crossbows and sent it back for servicing some time back. when I got to have a look at it when it came back it look like it was new.
somewhat pointless. In war, the goal is to make sure the guy in front of you cant kill you or your friends. Using posion is kinda redundant cuz a solid enough hit to make the poison effective would also be enough to put down your opponent anyways
Would have been very interesting also a comparison with the earlier crossbows, which the charge was manual and the bow was in wood. Technically, in this video the medieval crossbow is an arbalest.
Would be interesting to see a comparison between the fly times of the modern and medieval projectile. Looks like the modern crossbow has more draw and I asume that a modern bolt (or would you call that an arrow?) is lighter. This would result in a flatter trejectory i think and that is of course a benefit.
At 4 minutes: "Sometimes the wood swells up" I think this is just modern design trying to "improve" the old. Lemme give you an example. So in Finland we have something of a sauna culture, and long before we could afford metal or other fancy things to the point we'd (gasp) make a bucket out of it for *water*, we used wood. Wood buckets. Okay, not nearly as exciting as I thought but there is an interesting thing: None of these buckets are actually water proof. There are massive gaps between the wood pieces. You fill this bucket up with water, it will retain 0% of the contents. So clearly the bucket is bad! Right? Nope. What you're SUPPOSED TO DO is stick this bucket into the water and hold it down with something (a rock perhaps) and while you're working the sauna up (takes 30-40 minutes) the wood will absorb water and the gaps disappear. You have a long-term usable water container, hooray! Enter modern wood bucket things that chip after a few months or a year depending on how much you use them, because modern industrial design has to be perfect. I think (though don't know) the same is true of these modern replicas. They look at the metal bit and the wood and think "huh there shouldn't be a gap there, clearly the wood is damaged or aged, that's okay I'll just make everything nice and snug, make it look pretty" And then you go out for a few hours or leave the crossbow out for that time, decide to go shooting and it stops working because of course it will, because the original was designed the be able to absorb the humidity. The same is most likely true of many modern replica longbows. And even if you make the replica "correctly" and to the right measurements, you're still hosed when it comes to materials. Modern materials are "clean" and "efficient" and "pure" which is all well and good, but the same thing that caused a spike in colon cancer (pure white flour) is probably to blame for a lot of problems we might see in replica creations.
The saddle (the bit the nut fits in to) has to fit the nut fairly closely, or the nut doesn't turn cleanly. But Skall has a "munitions grade" bow with a plain wooden saddle. Better bows have the saddle lined with horn or bone (or even steel) to avoid that problem. I think this is just an artifact of a "cheaper" bow.
It's too bad you couldn't get the heavier crossbow to work. I would really have loved to see, and hear, that thing fire (and also see the resulting connection to the target). Nice video.
I think the main reason the medieval crossbow loses speed vs the modern one outside of the projectiles used are the actual materials both crossbows are made of. The medieval crossbow, with it's wooden and steel components is quite heavy but despite that, is unable to efficiently keep the energy for the shot inside the string as it is allowed to dissipate through the entire weapon when fired, actually rendering it's actual energy output weaker than normal expectancy. And yes, energy dissipation is a thing, as we are talking about kinetic energy here and that concept applies to any form of energy. In the modern crossbow however, the materials do a better job at blocking as much kinetic energy inside the string as possible, allowing for an overall more powerful shot. Of course, even in modern ones, energy dissipation is still a thing, but reduced to quite a small number.
Maybe the heavier one has a slightly worn sear surface? I know you said you haven't shot it much, but that is the first thing that comes to mind. Another possibility I think is that the pin that is holding the sear is flexing in its hole while under pressure. /shrug
1 view, 3 comments and 10 likes, hmmmmmm something isn’t right Btw I love your videos, you are so cool and you know so much about weaponry and stuff like that
Keep in mind that on the battlefield you're dealing with a mass of men horizontally, but not vertically. If you aim for an infantryman in the center of the line you can probably miss by 10-15 meters (that's 35ish-50isg ft) and be fine, but if you're a meter high you better hope their formation has a bunch of ranks, and if you're a meter low you just hit the dirt. It's artillery finding the range.
I think it would be really cool to do a comparison between medieval crossbows vs longbows as to which is better at different ranges. I know in Dungeons and Dragons, they typically make crossbows a better weapon from farther out, but it appears as though the opposite would actually be true, at least as far as medieval ones go. Modern equivalents might be more skewed towards crossbows, but medieval I'd think a regular bow would win out, no?
You look like you should be hunting vampires and you'd be totally kicking ass doing it too. Really good job with comparing the modern do the medieval crossbows.
If you think about it, it's all just one equation. A crossbow with a high draw weight will throw a bolt at incredibly high speeds, but the bolt is being accelerated for a shorter amount of time, and thus over a shorter distance. A Longbow with a high Draw Weight will throw a larger arrow at a slower speed, but the arrow is being accelerated for a longer amount of time, and over a longer distance. The Longbow and the Crossbow can deliver the same transfer of force, just in a different way.
Have you ever tried a shepherd's sling? It would be interesting to see a video from you to talk or even try out them. I made one out of paracord (there's a bunch of videos about how to make one on youtube) and trained with it to be quite accurate. It's a cheap and interesting weapon.
Have you considered getting a version of that red dot with a bullet drop compensator? Also if you get a higher mount for the reddot you'll be able to shoot farther without having to compensate at the cost of having to aim high at close range too.
Its first time when i'm complaining - but for good comparison - similar bolts (ot at least weight) should be used ;) Medieval ones have (it looks like) heavy iron point while modern one have something like regular shield point... im quite noob with crossbows but for bows it makes "twice" the difference ;)
Is it possible that the issue with the windlass crossbow is that the sear or the latch are worn out? you might check the rolling nut part, but not the trigger side without disassembling it. Look at the bright side, if that happened to a machine gun, it would shoot on its own.
What the hell... The comment section on this video is seriously glitched, at least on my end. I keep trying to copy and paste what Tod said via email and pin it but it disappears every time. And Tod's comments are invisible to me, so I wonder if there are others I can't see either. There was one comment of his that I was able to find, so I asked him to edit it so I can pin it. Immediately after he edited it, gone. Can't see it anymore. Has anyone encountered a weird glitch like that before?
[Update] Since this post is still here I tried once again to post what Tod said about the crossbows. And guess what? It immediately disappeared. There must be some broken algorithm that picks up something in his message that causes it to delete it. Makes zero sense, there is nothing "bad" in there.
Ok, so I'll sum it up in my own words: Tod pointed out the age of the crossbow (around 4 years by now) and thinks that the trigger is worn and needs to be re-built. It's a simple trigger system that needs to hold a very high load, and the main difference is that medieval objects require much more maintenance than we're used to from modern materials. Changes in moisture in the wood can affect the seating of the parts and cause problems. Tod offered to repair the crossbow if I sent it back to him. He also thinks that the goat's foot crossbow has dropped in power as well, and the string needs replacing or tightening. In other words, he has been quick to respond and offer fixing the issue, which I appreciate.
There, hopefully that works now.
Nah Fxck tod
2:41 “Grind the heads of the rivets off...”
RCMP: **HEAVY BREATHING**
Hey Skall love this channel, I was wondering if you could do videos on what it would be like for soldiers on the battefield and just how dangerous is was. Also maybe talk about injuries you could recieve on the battlefield?
Hi Skallagrim, I finished my documentary about the Chinese Crossbow (single shot ones 400lbs@30" for example)
th-cam.com/video/k4iqUmVvmT8/w-d-xo.html
hoping this video will spark interesting about building this crossbow
On a cursory look I can't see any Tod's comment. YT comment section is broken for a long time, it seems.
This is kind of like the [old gun] v. AR15 discussion.
Some people will say "well, its not fair because the AR15 uses 30 round magazines, has better sights, can take an optic and night-vision equipment, has provisions for mounting all kinds of accessories like grips and bi-pods, can easily take flashlights..."
Yeah, kind of the point. The modern thing is better. The old thing is cool, and in it's time it was hot shit, but time has moved on. Should we forget about the old? Never. But should we pretend that it's still the best thing? No.
The next iteration isn't always better though. Don't get me wrong, totally improved bows over time. We hit the wall with planes though.
Exactly. You don't shoot 14th century crossbows because they're the epitome of crossbow design, but because it's pretty cool to experience history that way.
Is the Hawken rifle a good hunting rifle?. Yep, especially in the 1840's. Can it compete with a modern generic .308 hunting rifle? Of course not, but it's still cool as all hell though.
“30 round magazine”
California: “wait that’s illegal”
I wonder how the damage compares when you have on one side a 6mm projectile at 800m/s and on the other a 20mm piece at 200m/s...
@@squeethesane No we haven't. We're just waiting for power sources to update. We'll have them flying cars eventually.
"When the wood swells so much, that the nut cant move freely"
Context
Oh wait... wrong channel
haha
Phrasing
Edgar BM penetration!!
I was just about to post when I saw ur comment lmao
Skall: “I wouldn’t want to shoot this in the rain” Genoese crossbowmen who were defeated by the English longbow-men because of the rain: *sadness noises*
the fucking french thought it would be a good idea to send the crossbowmen without their shields and heavy crossbows coming in the carriages, just *THE THINGS* that make crossbowmen effective
Wouldn't the rain mess with the longbows too? Or does it just mess with them less?
@@austinhoward6557 Less- there are no tightly-fitted moving parts inside of the stock that can jam up of the wood swells when wet. A long bow is just a wooden stick & string after all...
Austin Howard It actually wasn’t the soaked bowstrings that stopped them. The english took the string off their bow to stop it getting wet, but crossbow strings were made of leather, and therefore were waterproof. What caused them to lose was the mud- it stopped them being able to use the foot stirrup to reload quickly, which ended up having the English fire three times faster than they could
Austin Howard Not really,there’s not much to mess with. Rain and wind would make shorting accurately harder,but since accuracy wasn’t a concern anyway...
I heard they're reforming the Dawnguard. Vampire hunters, or something.
the skyrim references on medieval related videos are just pure gold
*completely different voice* “Citizen”
at an old fort near Riften…
Nice! For future reference, it does have "iron sights". If you remove the red dot, the red V on the rear and the three dots on the bridge at the front are the iron sights :)
Is the red dot included with the crossbow? If so, what brand is it?
@@yungsouichi2317 Skall made a video on it I think about 3 months back, but it does come with one but it was VERY poorly built. Skall has put a Holosun red dot on it, they are about $130 USD but that is still like $150 cheaper than a proper name brand.
@@chuggon7595 eh, I could always just switch out my Crimson Trace from my AR to this I guess
Why not contact Tod about the crossbow failure? If I recall, that's his product. Pretty sure he'd try to help you.
Scrolled down to see if someone else already posted. Yep!
Send Tod some love, peeps.
I was about to say the same thing!
Also I terms of weakness that seems on par with what Tod has found in terms of power for a crossbow like that, about 54 joules (said 95 originally) if I remember correctly, which is less than a 22lr.
bikerdude923 no no no no, about 55 joules
@@bikerdude923 Yeah, though it's important to remember that kinetic energy is only one aspect of the game.
@@bikerdude923 It was 110 joules.
th-cam.com/video/kHnZo6ELEV0/w-d-xo.html
*”Hahahahahaha”*
”You hear that?”
*”Hohohoho”*
”What was that?”
*”Let me SHOW you it’s FEATURES”*
the traditional arrows probably weigh a good bit more than modern arrows that's probably another area where you lose alot of speed on the shot
Medieval crossbows needed heavy bolts to get the best out of the mechanically inefficient design of medieval crossbows. Modern bolts work well with modern crossbows because there is a far more efficient longer power stroke, lighter bow limbs & lighter/thinner string. It's a bit like saying because race horses go fast with light jockeys, the way to make cart horses fast would be light jockies.
@@2bingtim well the heavier bolts would pierce leather armor better I'd imagine
Those historically incorrect solid metal roller nuts certainly don't help either.
There is a significant proportion of energy released while the string is clearing itself from the lock -up to 30%-40% with those short power-strokes.
As the outer rim of the nut moves with same speed or faster than the bolt, 10-20% of stored energy is easily lost there. That is why they were made out of light weight exotic materials like antler or ivory back in the day.
And it certainly does not help that these modern replicas categorically have considerably thinner limbs than the historical examples. This is an understandable safety measure for warranty and liability reasons, but it also means that the shot only has about third the energy and half the potential arrow speed available.
it would be nice to see a modern bolt in the traditional bow, just to see what happens
@@sharpestbulb I'm guessing "not much". The low launch velocity of a traditional bow would be useless with a light bolt. Modern bolts are light so as to take advantage of the higher velocities achievable with compound bows/pulleys.
We are at 40 meters.
Skall: points directly up at the sky.
Alright then, how can I get my Rhodok Sharpshooters to be equipped with the Cold Steel Cheapshot?
Download Prophesy of Pendor. Join the Empire. Ave Victoria.
Rhodok sharpshooters are good, but all the cool kids nowdays roll with them V L A N D I A N S H A R P S H O O T E R S
@@m1sz3lpl24 I heard Imperial Sergeant Crossbowmen pack quite a punch as well.
@@jorgejohnson875 tbh currently every ranged unit is very strong, partially due to them being accurate and unlike warband they learned to lead thier targets but also because tier 1 units don't have any, even shitty makeshift, shields
If you want a more modern crossbow, you might as well go after modern firearms xD
With the glasses and the coat it kinda makes you look like "Professor Skall" :D
Class is in session bitches
Or a student at Columbine
Van helsing's nordic cousin
(Are there any vampire like creatures in scandi mythos?)
@@DH-xw6jp Draugr seem to be a mix between vampire and zombie o believe.
@@TheEchoreader zompires or vambies?
Shooting crossbows at a target, missing and hitting a workshop door, is this joerg sprave Canadian dub
This is why I prefer to use Pommels instead
Duchi just let the joke die at this point.
@@joseanponce4603 its not a woosh get out of here stinky redditor
Josean Ponce r/iusereddit
space_powder i dont even use reddit
As much as you might want them to, the pommel jokes of Skallagrim will never die.
Long-term product reviews are so underrepresented, thanks Skall.
The true quality/characteristics of a product only tells after a certain amount of time, espcecially when it has moving parts like the crossbow.
This dudes looking like he’s about to join the dawngaurd
I'm thinking of joining myself :D
jack belmont “mind if I join you on the way there?” Or however it goes.
" "My pa's axe"? Stendarr preserves us."
Alvian Ekka I’m more of a “Nerevar guide me!” :)
He needs those Dwarven upgrades ASAP.
I'm Genoese and i'm weirdly fascinated by this video
Stay safe from the plague buddy
@@Batmack Trying to, my workplace has been shut down since mid February, the mercenary career is now more appealing than ever
(thanks for the concern, mate!)
@@brainyskeletonofdoom7824 quite a sensible change in any career path. I would discourage working for the French, they are nice and pay well, but they are a bit unreasonable when it comes to pulling out of disadvantageous tactical situations and may end up slaying you for percieved cowardice.
@@Batmack Your mother was a hamster, and your father smelt of elderberries!
@@sheev15yearsago81 Hey, watch your mouth when you talk about my hamster mum.
Skallagrim: Crossbows!!
Everone else: Skallchion?!?!
*sigh* I still don't have it.
The couch arrived in two boxes four days early, which was great because we'd just moved into a new house and needed places to sit. My son and I put it together pretty quickly th-cam.com/users/postUgkxitRzxya-XugamYgLwa_2G1gxPg4MCJHa . Another reviewer suggested inserting the seat into the side and I'm glad they did as the instructions weren't clear on that matter. It's incredibly light and slides easily across the wood floor, making it easy to move. It's firm, but comfortable. It will even be great to nap on. I got the gray, which definitely has strong blue undertones, but I'm okay with that.
Awesome video Skall! The modern crossbows are definetly better in most ways but the historical ones are way cooler and fun. Also I'm still sometimes not getting notified of your videos even though I have your notifications turned on. Just wanted to let you know. I always check in though.
I've watched this before but enjoyed watching it again. Like you I'm into crossbows and find them fascinating 👍🏻😏
Skall, when you change aim high or low, you also change the direction the point travels, it is ideal to be perpendicular and hence misjudging the fall can mean the negative effect on penetration is increased even more due to inefficient energy transfer to the target.
Yep, and unfortunately that's unavoidable with a light medieval crossbow beyond a certain distance.
A modern crossbow in medieval times would be like a target tracing bullet in our time, OP as hell.
I still would like to see the lemon and pommel crossbow
Let this meme die
Let the pommel rest.
swliam.
Never
No, let's not. 'Tis a silly meme.
Do you think 'Shooting yourself in the foot' came from someone trying to reload a loaded crossbow?
It's supposedly from when the first percussion cap revolvers were in use. They're surprisingly easy to misfire, to the point that most people carried them on an empty chamber.
@@GallopingWalrus
Also why they say to only load 5 rounds instead of 6, or something like that
@@hanadashi3910 usually 4, they were mostly 5 shot revolvers.
@@GallopingWalrus oh yeah, I didn't think of 5 rounds revolvers, thanks
Should do a video like this one but focusing on the maintenance different for a medieval crossbowman vs bowman vs earliest arquebusiers. Alot of media doesn't appropriately show all the work you had to do (and still do) to maintain weapons in the old times.
The light crossbow and its arrow drop when compared to the modern one remind me when I played Battlefield 4 and was out snipping snippets with a Mares Leg 40x Zoom at 1500m+
Wow this is super helpful for balancing the range of crossbows in my game. Having only used modern ones I thought they always had a high velocity. Good to know!
You are absolutely correct about medieval crossbow failures. But, put yourself in a time period before the first printing press was invented. Crossbow usage was as regular as with anything else in the medieval period. Not only the well-to-do but, the middle class (if there was ever such a class in feudalism) had the means and access to the practice, fabrication, and maintenance of crossbows. As previously mentioned, crossbows were a way of life. It was second nature to shoot and to repair crossbows because, at the time, there was nothing else to do or to shoot with (maybe the occasional RPG rolled in).
Thanks for the great video, I like the comparison and it's interesting to see how the subtle differences make a huge impact.
I love my bent stick longbow. It's fun and challenging and when I get a good group, it makes me very happy.
If it's about putting food on the table, give me as modern as you got...
Great video, hope you and yours are well!
Wouldn't have thought of a lot of medieval crossbow issues, hmm. I always assumed they hit harder than bows without needing as much strength, but never thought of their own issues. Between modern bowguns and compound bows, a bit of engineering and modern materials do make archery accessible in an age of hunting with guns.
Given what Tod's mentioned about crossbows, it sounds like the nut needs replacing. He's mentioned that the metal sear present in crossbow nuts make it stronger, but also makes it wear faster. Wouldn't surprise me if that's the problem, especially given how high the draw weight of that beast is.
With the medieval crossbow you can use the thumb of your trigger hand as a rearshight.
In combination with markings on the stock for different distances
"Undesirable, but safe". That gave me a big laugh. My shed knows the feeling.
"There is something wrong with my crossbow´s trigger"
*Allied Crossbowmen sweats profusely*
It'd be interesting to see the relationship of draw weight vs powerstroke by comparing different designs. Ancient East Asian crossbows had a different design of lower draw weight but much longer powerstroke. The average Qin-Han era infantry crossbow had a 6 stone (387lbs) draw weight with an 18-20 inch powerstroke. Crossbows ranged from 1 stone to 10+ stones (the lightest ones were for training while the heaviest ones were for large mechanically aided versions used as field artillery). The Qin-Han era crossbowman would draw the crossbow in a sitting position where they would use their leg, torso, and arm muscles all at once to draw the string. I've read that the crossbowmen might even had laid on their backs for the heavier crossbows so they didn't have to deal with the weight of their torsos when drawing the crossbow. The Han Dynasty had an excellent training program where they would physically condition and train the new recruits for 1 year before sending them into combat, so even skinny city folks who don't do manual labor would have sufficient time to beef up and become strong enough to repeatedly draw heavy crossbows.
Longer powerstroke usually spells out to wider bows, so as a whole these crossbows were less compact and more unwieldy in tight spaces.
@@kovona True. However, a composite recurve design can help keep it smaller compared to a non-recurve design. It will still wider than shorter powerstrike designs, but could be kept small enough to use in tight spaces. eg. Some recreations of Scythian recurve bows are ~3.5 feet in length when strung and have a ~26 inch draw. Increasing the draw weight would only require increasing the thickness of the bow prod without having to increase the length (or width if oriented horizontally).
You probably won't see this considering the glitch in the matrix with the comments section and the fact that you lead a busy life and probably won't care, but a gaming TH-camr ESO started a playthrough on the new Mount and Blade game Bannerlord and his character bares quite a resemblance to you minus the hair and beard models.
Just thought that you would find that tidbit of information fun. I love your vids man. 💯
A word on the arrow Backstop net - you got to have it free swinging like a curtain. The net has to grab around arrow and head before the arrow and pierce thru, that what stopping them.
0:38 that looks like way more damage than the 1d8 for light crossbow!
Right? :D
(Though being chopped by a battleaxe is the same range... :P)
Considering a dagger does a d4, a d8 for this seems pretty high.
one thing to keep in mind, is that while crossbow had problems, so did bows. I read an old historical document on bows and archery, and the author went in great details about bow exploding.
Skall's beard gives me Varg Vikernes vibes, in its length :p
Draw weight is not the only measurement for power because the kinetic energy of a projectile is roughly equal to the work a bow/crossbow does which is equal to the force applied multiplied by the distance that they apply this force to the projectile. Not to mention poor materials for the string means that towards the end of the force-applying distance, the force is substantially lower than the maximum draw weight that was measured.
Dude, when are you and Jorge Sprave going to do a collab?! I would love to see the two of you traipsing around the woods messing with different projectile weaponry!
6:42 when the dungeon master tells you he won the fight, but you are not allowed to check his roll...
Well you could clearly hear the bolt striking the target, but also ROCKS FALL YOU DIE!
@@Slash-XVI Omg, I loved you in Death Note!
That design is not cold steel's. It was engineered by Jorge Sprave from the slingshot channel. He has a bunch of videos on how he made it. Go check it out.
Joreg didn't design the crossbow. Only the magazine and helped perfect it.
@@sebastianriz4703 cold steel still wasn't the original designer. And he didn't work with cold steel.
Yeah, that's the cobra mechanism, I'm pretty sure.
That is actually a medieval design from Löffelholz manuscript.
Also known as "Leonardo daVincis fast loading crossbow"
Jörg Sprave effin' rulez dude
I'm going to be honest being a crossbowmen in the midieval times must've really sucked.
This video isn't an accurate representation of the performance of decent-quality medieval military crossbows. The best ones still small enough to conveniently use managed the same velocity as the Cheap Shot but with as much kinetic energy as any mass-produced modern crossbow. & the larger ones that needed to be shot from a support were more even powerful.
@@b.h.abbott-motley2427 Any evidence for that? No one I know of has established that. The steel bow, properly heat treated, pretty much is what it is. And given the use of modern materials and heat treat, our steel bows today are certainly as good as theirs and likely better. That's just physics. The question, then, is about efficiency. We have surviving originals, so we know the geometry and release mechanisms. There is no magical medieval bow that suddenly doubles the amount of delivered energy.
@@mpsmith47304 There's lots of evidence from period sources as well as a limited amount from modern reconstructions. See Andreas Bichler's 1,200lb horn crossbow replica for the best performance to date form a reconstructed crossbow small enough to conveniently use. It managed approximately 145 foot-lbs at 230 fps. & various museums contain larger horn crossbows from the 15th century. The crossbow shot in this video resembles those found from mid-16th-century Spanish shipwrecks in the Americas. The crossbow had almost entirely left European battlefields by that time. The purpose of those crossbows is unclear; they may have been for hunting, military use on a budget, only for defending fortifications or the ship, or some combination of these. & the original may have performed better, especially been this one, which was in a state of disrepair.
In terms of physics, lots of factors affect initial kinetic energy. With bows, high-end performance bows shoot much better than cheap ones. As with warbows, I suspect military crossbows that rely on strength to span had higher draw weights than most people can manage. This includes goat's-foot-lever crossbows such as the one here. We know from *El Victorial* & other sources that spanning a crossbow from the belt was a feat of strength that knights & other soldiers competed in.
obviously not, or it wouldn't have been used by every country in Europe and the Mediterranean to some extent (yes even the Arab states and English used the crossbow), and it wouldn't have been the preferred weapon of elite mercenaries. the Italians, polish, Hungarian and certain musilim states loved the crossbow so much it replaced all infantry and even light cavalry (primary) weapons in their armies untill gunpowder weapons became common.
it sucks compared to now, but compared to contemporary stuff it was golden.
@@b.h.abbott-motley2427 And have about 1/5 the rate of shot of a modern crossbow. It takes at least half a minute to load a bolt with a Windlass.
I looked up a horn crossbow out of curiosity and found this.
th-cam.com/video/AA5M0QKXtWU/w-d-xo.html
It shoots 315 ft-lbs of Kinetic Energy, which is powerful, but looks too bulky to be used for anything other than defending.
If I had to guess (mind you I'm no historian or craftsman) I'd suspect that the mechanism that's holding the nut in place against the bowstring has become weaker thus is engages and holds against pushing on it by hand but is too weaker to keep the bow "loaded". To fix it after disassembly might be as simple as replacing the faulty spring or much, much worse depending on the exact mechanism.
I would send 900 lbs crossbow to tods workshop. I know, across the pond but... He knows his stuff.
I have seen a version of the crossbow in the museum of one of the Loire castles (either Angers or Amboise, don't remember) that was nearly as tall as the armor it was displayed next to.
If elephants were flying animals, this crossbow looked like it would be the perfect tool to hunt them
your "unconventional but still halfway accurate" way of measuring the crossbow's draw weight had me dead
You should sen one of your crossbows or bows to Joersparve & do a collab videos. Maybe like his new repeating crossbows or Instant legolas bows ideas.
It could be that there is a bit of metal worn from the nock on that broken crossbow. Where the trigger engages the nock. Could happen over time when it's not straight horizontally or if it doesn't spin freely. Or if there's metal worn off of the trigger itself.. I would have someone remove that rivet pin so you can see what's going on. It might either need a new trigger or nock. It would be one of the downsides of a crossbow vs a bow for a soldier in history. While neither would be able to get repairs on the fly in battle, it would be easier to patch up a bow then to disassemble a crossbow between battles. It's also feasible to simply fashion a makeshift bow if a regiment of soldiers is traveling through woodlands. Something that can't really be done with a crossbow
Every time I've seen a goat's foot lever being used, the thing that comes to mind is: why doesn't the user have a leash on it to hang it on their shoulder, so they don't need to look for a place to set it down?
There is actually a clip on them to allow them to hang from the belt.
sounds to me as if the sear has burred on the big crossbow. or its got some play in its pivot point. I have every confidence that tod will sort him out with a fix.
a friend of my old boss has one of tod's crossbows and sent it back for servicing some time back. when I got to have a look at it when it came back it look like it was new.
I am curious about poisons how often they used on medieval wepons.
Im not sure but I think human feces was often used to spread infection even from minor wounds
don't worry infection was a common death cause no poison needed.
somewhat pointless. In war, the goal is to make sure the guy in front of you cant kill you or your friends. Using posion is kinda redundant cuz a solid enough hit to make the poison effective would also be enough to put down your opponent anyways
Would have been very interesting also a comparison with the earlier crossbows, which the charge was manual and the bow was in wood. Technically, in this video the medieval crossbow is an arbalest.
Would be interesting to see a comparison between the fly times of the modern and medieval projectile. Looks like the modern crossbow has more draw and I asume that a modern bolt (or would you call that an arrow?) is lighter. This would result in a flatter trejectory i think and that is of course a benefit.
Red dot sight on medieval crossbow. I dare you
Or use guided bolts.
How would you even do that?
Skall has that NCR Veteran Ranger coat going on.
The sound of that modern crossbow is super satisfying.
I would argue you should be aiming with both eyes open regardless. Its a useful skill to be able to switch which eye you focus with when hunting
Hey, he's got that shirt on again! Love that shirt, wish I knew where I could get it
In all fairnes, medeivil bolts are way heavier too
Interesting topic. I like that kind of stuff.
Skall, you need to get your hand on of Joerg's improved magazine fed version of your modern light crossbow.
Should also point out the speed. The cheap shot gets that bolt down range 5x faster (ish)
At 4 minutes: "Sometimes the wood swells up" I think this is just modern design trying to "improve" the old. Lemme give you an example.
So in Finland we have something of a sauna culture, and long before we could afford metal or other fancy things to the point we'd (gasp) make a bucket out of it for *water*, we used wood. Wood buckets. Okay, not nearly as exciting as I thought but there is an interesting thing: None of these buckets are actually water proof. There are massive gaps between the wood pieces. You fill this bucket up with water, it will retain 0% of the contents.
So clearly the bucket is bad! Right?
Nope. What you're SUPPOSED TO DO is stick this bucket into the water and hold it down with something (a rock perhaps) and while you're working the sauna up (takes 30-40 minutes) the wood will absorb water and the gaps disappear. You have a long-term usable water container, hooray!
Enter modern wood bucket things that chip after a few months or a year depending on how much you use them, because modern industrial design has to be perfect.
I think (though don't know) the same is true of these modern replicas. They look at the metal bit and the wood and think "huh there shouldn't be a gap there, clearly the wood is damaged or aged, that's okay I'll just make everything nice and snug, make it look pretty" And then you go out for a few hours or leave the crossbow out for that time, decide to go shooting and it stops working because of course it will, because the original was designed the be able to absorb the humidity. The same is most likely true of many modern replica longbows.
And even if you make the replica "correctly" and to the right measurements, you're still hosed when it comes to materials. Modern materials are "clean" and "efficient" and "pure" which is all well and good, but the same thing that caused a spike in colon cancer (pure white flour) is probably to blame for a lot of problems we might see in replica creations.
The saddle (the bit the nut fits in to) has to fit the nut fairly closely, or the nut doesn't turn cleanly. But Skall has a "munitions grade" bow with a plain wooden saddle. Better bows have the saddle lined with horn or bone (or even steel) to avoid that problem. I think this is just an artifact of a "cheaper" bow.
@@mpsmith47304 Bone and horn is a good point.
It's too bad you couldn't get the heavier crossbow to work. I would really have loved to see, and hear, that thing fire (and also see the resulting connection to the target). Nice video.
I hope one day they make it with a magazine, like on the slingshot channel
Just as I'm working on building my own 100 lbs crossbow. The perfect video for a break :D
5:29 have you seen that squirrel ?
Have you?
The one with the bolt through its neck?
I only entered to comment section to leave that comment, but... Good on you. Also the squirell returns at 6:40
Hi there. The sound your crossbow makes is magnificent. Is it okay if I use a the sound in a game?
I think the main reason the medieval crossbow loses speed vs the modern one outside of the projectiles used are the actual materials both crossbows are made of.
The medieval crossbow, with it's wooden and steel components is quite heavy but despite that, is unable to efficiently keep the energy for the shot inside the string as it is allowed to dissipate through the entire weapon when fired, actually rendering it's actual energy output weaker than normal expectancy.
And yes, energy dissipation is a thing, as we are talking about kinetic energy here and that concept applies to any form of energy. In the modern crossbow however, the materials do a better job at blocking as much kinetic energy inside the string as possible, allowing for an overall more powerful shot.
Of course, even in modern ones, energy dissipation is still a thing, but reduced to quite a small number.
Using collimator for aiming you are supposed to keep both eyes open ;D
I feel like that stray bolt is the first of many that will hit the wall 😁 Hope you're doing well, Skal
Maybe the heavier one has a slightly worn sear surface? I know you said you haven't shot it much, but that is the first thing that comes to mind. Another possibility I think is that the pin that is holding the sear is flexing in its hole while under pressure. /shrug
I'd like to see part 2 of this
1 view, 3 comments and 10 likes, hmmmmmm something isn’t right
Btw I love your videos, you are so cool and you know so much about weaponry and stuff like that
Keep in mind that on the battlefield you're dealing with a mass of men horizontally, but not vertically. If you aim for an infantryman in the center of the line you can probably miss by 10-15 meters (that's 35ish-50isg ft) and be fine, but if you're a meter high you better hope their formation has a bunch of ranks, and if you're a meter low you just hit the dirt. It's artillery finding the range.
I saw a Sasquatch, 5:29, left of shot in background
I think it would be really cool to do a comparison between medieval crossbows vs longbows as to which is better at different ranges. I know in Dungeons and Dragons, they typically make crossbows a better weapon from farther out, but it appears as though the opposite would actually be true, at least as far as medieval ones go. Modern equivalents might be more skewed towards crossbows, but medieval I'd think a regular bow would win out, no?
Should try out a Han crossbow I you can. The thing is thousands of years old but closer to a modern crossbow in design and how it works
You look like you should be hunting vampires and you'd be totally kicking ass doing it too. Really good job with comparing the modern do the medieval crossbows.
Skall looking more n more like a nuclear wastelander in each video, I'm digging it
If you think about it, it's all just one equation.
A crossbow with a high draw weight will throw a bolt at incredibly high speeds, but the bolt is being accelerated for a shorter amount of time, and thus over a shorter distance.
A Longbow with a high Draw Weight will throw a larger arrow at a slower speed, but the arrow is being accelerated for a longer amount of time, and over a longer distance.
The Longbow and the Crossbow can deliver the same transfer of force, just in a different way.
Have you ever tried a shepherd's sling? It would be interesting to see a video from you to talk or even try out them. I made one out of paracord (there's a bunch of videos about how to make one on youtube) and trained with it to be quite accurate. It's a cheap and interesting weapon.
Have you considered getting a version of that red dot with a bullet drop compensator? Also if you get a higher mount for the reddot you'll be able to shoot farther without having to compensate at the cost of having to aim high at close range too.
Wtf? I just now got a bell notification for this xD
Amazing video
🍻🍻
Show us the beast modern crossbow!!!!
You should make a belt strap or some such for that loading lever :P
you should try the most powerful crossbow Scorpyd Aculeus long power strokes make high velocity.
I would like to see a video about sword staff
Its first time when i'm complaining - but for good comparison - similar bolts (ot at least weight) should be used ;)
Medieval ones have (it looks like) heavy iron point while modern one have something like regular shield point... im quite noob with crossbows but for bows it makes "twice" the difference ;)
Moral of the story: Everything gets improved with time.
Tell that to milk.....
Jens Fällman -Cereal when no milk cereal when haves milk-
Counter Point: The Elder Scrolls
Is it possible that the issue with the windlass crossbow is that the sear or the latch are worn out? you might check the rolling nut part, but not the trigger side without disassembling it. Look at the bright side, if that happened to a machine gun, it would shoot on its own.
hmmm what if you hear joerg in the distance saying "Let me show you its features!"
you have made me want a cross bow
Yeah, that ColdSteel thing seems to be nice.